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The Epstein Chronicles
The Bill Gates Epstein Related Congressional Transcripts (Part 1) (6/25/26)
00:16:28
The nearly six-hour congressional interview focused on why Bill Gates continued meeting with Jeffrey Epstein after Epstein's 2008 conviction, what Gates knew about Epstein's conduct, and whether Epstein attempted to gain leverage over him. Gates...
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I L D what's up everyone and welcome to another episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode we're going to pick up where we left off with the Bill Gates transcript from his meeting with Congress. Question we've already discussed Mr. Nikolic. Dr. Nikolic of course introduced you to Mr. Epstein. So in your words, can you characterize Dr. Nikolic relationship with Mr. Epstein or least your understanding of their relationship? Answer well, during the time I knew Epstein, I thought it was just he had met him before I had and he was kind of organizing the visits that took place. In looking at the email documents that came out in January, to my surprise, I now see that he had quite an extensive relationship with Mr. Epstein. So I was not aware of all of that during the time that that I met with Mr. Epstein in 2011-2014. Are you aware that Dr. Nikolic was ultimately named in one of Mr. Epstein's final will and testaments? I've seen that in the press. So you learned about that much later in the press. I hope it's an accurate thing. I was a press report that mentioned it. But you have no first hand knowledge of that? No question. Did that surprise you when you read it? Answer a lot. Question by Mr. Spector I'd like to enter into the Record Majority Exhibit 1, which is an email that Epstein sent to Dr. Nikolic on June 16, 2013. The Bates number on this document is EFTA00873874. And just for the record, all of the Bates numbers that begin with the FTA are are documents that the Department of Justice released pursuant to the Epstein Files Transparency Act. I'll give you a second to look at it, but I will note that I'll be reading much of or all of it into the record, so you don't need to read the entire thing. The first question is have you seen these emails before? Answer yeah, okay. I mean I may have seen these when they came out in January, but not before that. Question. So you don't recall ever seeing these emails prior to The Epstein Files Transparency act release by the doj. I did not in the first email. So the email at the bottom of the page, that's an email from Mr. Epstein. Context clues from the rest of the document indicate that that was sent to Boris Nikolic, but of course that is redacted on the document. He sent it to boris on Sunday, June 16 at 12:02. It reads to me and then it looks like a draft of a statement or an email that says, bill, I'm in tears as I write this. I have barely slept for three days. I'm devastated beyond words. I find myself losing my best friend and my career all in one day by no fault of my own. As your friend, I suggest you carefully reconsider your alternatives. If Melinda decides to file for a divorce, I will of course stand by you and help any way I can. I want to see you happy. Truly difficult choices, no matter what. As you know, I'm going in for delicate surgery on my eyes on Tuesday. This timing could not be worse. I will totally be out of it for a few days. I hope you're able to convince Melinda to allow me to continue doing my job, a job you described as I could not have done better. I hope to ask her face to face to change her mind. I have done nothing wrong. And the email continues. But just for the record, there in 2013, when this email was sent, were you and your wife Melinda considering divorce? Answer no question. Why would Mr. Epstein or Dr. Nikolic be under the impression that you were? Answer. Well, I never would have discussed anything relating to that subject with Mr. Epstein. I told Boris, Dr. Nicholas, sorry, that I shared the information about the two affairs and he may have thought, you know, that meant our marriage was at risk. It was certainly a deeply troubling thing for my wife. But at this time, there was not a discussion of a divorce question. It seems in this draft that's written from Dr. Nikolaj's perspective that he may have believed that Melinda was the one who wanted him to leave the job. And I think you characterized it earlier as kind of a back and forth discussion with your then wife. Was it Melinda's discussion to ask Dr. Nikolic to accelerate his departure, or was it a mutual decision between the two of you? It was a mutual decision. I agreed with Melinda that having him leave pretty soon was the best thing. And so that's what I did. And that was a quicker departure than would have happened otherwise. I'll continue reading the draft email. It continues. However, I recognize the fact that it might not be possible at this time, I also recognize that I will need a lawyer to review any agreement with we might enter into. But I don't trust any with such sensitive information. I've asked Jeffrey to oversee and negotiate for me and have given him power of attorney to act on my behalf. He also needed to be my health proxy during my operation. I have informed him of all the details surrounding our dilemma. I trust him 100%. My communication with him is privileged. No worry. He's agreed to act as my financial and legal representative. He can trust him. He's dealt with very similar problems in the past. Obviously, he hasn't given me the details. I would greatly appreciate you and he talking directly. He does not know Larry and cannot be open with him. He doesn't like or trust PR people. This is a terrible circumstance in which we find ourselves. But I'm confident of our friendship and I know you know how devoted I am to you and I will say I asked you if you've seen these emails before the release, but I'll be more specific. Do you have any email or any other type of message that's similar to that draft I just read to you? Did you receive something like that in 2013? Never. Never anything close. So Dr. Nikolch and Mr. Epstein are communicating about something that they might send to you, but it sounds like they didn't. Is that right? I never received anything like that. Question in the second email in the middle that Dr. Nikolch writes back to Mr. Epstein at 12:12 on June 16, 2013, Dr. Nikolic seems to say, this is great. My only worry is whether I should send him now or tell him when I see him on Monday. He's still trying to make it work with Melinda. He's having next round of negotiation with her next weekend. If all fails, then it's a negotiation for a next step. If I send it right now, it reads that I accepted, it's all over. Finally. I can't put something such as divorce in an email. If she reads, she'll go the extra step to be as nasty as possible. Also, I think that my chances of convincing him to talk to you are higher if I do it in person and not over the email. So how about hold this? So how about you hold this for eight days? Thank you. B. It sounds like Mr. Nikolic agrees with the perspective denoted in in Mr. Epstein's draft and that he would be more interested, though, in having the conversation with you face to face. Did he have any sort of conversation with you face to face during this time? But I'VE never seen this email. So I mean, you can ask me questions, but I add no value. So I guess I'll be more specific. I understand you've testified that you've not seen the email. Did Dr. Nikolic approach you and communicate these same feelings in person? So not over email? No. Question in the draft email. Again, understanding that you have not seen it until much later. Dr. Nikolic is implying that he has entrusted Jeffrey Epstein with sensitive information, seemingly with relation to you, and that he has given Epstein power of attorney to act on his behalf, that he will be his financial and legal representative. So were you aware that Jeffrey Epstein was going to be acting as. As a legal or financial representative of Dr. Nikolch? Well, he wasn't a lawyer, so I'm not sure how a non lawyer becomes someone's legal representative. Eventually, Dr. Nikolic did communicate to me that he was involving Epstein in the discussion of Dr. Nikolch's exit. I forgot exactly, but he sent, he told me that he was involving Epstein. Question again. You didn't receive this email, but it seems that they're trying to get across to you is that while you're correct that Jeffrey Epstein was not in fact a lawyer, they are representing him to have some sort of privileged communication with Dr. Nikolitch, seemingly in a way that would make it seem like sensitive information. The sensitive information that Mr. Epstein knows about is privileged. Did you ever have a conversation like that with Dr. Nikolic? No. How could it be privileged? I'm just as confused as you are, but I guess what I'm asking is, did they represent to you that it could be privileged? I told you that in terms of awareness of the affairs that I had, there were no explicit reference to that, but there was some, what you could call veiled reference to it in the form of, hey, we should all want to be friends. It's only later when Epstein is talking about his reimbursements to a specific woman, that I was aware that I became fully aware of that. There was a point in the discussions with Boris where I, you know, I said I'm not going to be influenced by what you might or might not know or say. But again, this email is complete news to me. Okay, the top of the email, I won't read the entire one, but it seems to imply that you had already given Dr. Nikolitch some kind of offer, probably related to his departure. Had you already given Dr. Nikolitch some kind of exit package or. Or offer in June of 2013? Answer. Yeah, there was a prior agreement about he ended up making to investments on our mutual behalf. You know, I'd authorize him to make three, but he made two. So there was, you know, putting into writing how we would handle his payment for his share of those and then just the termination agreement. So that was all known before he engaged Epstein in the exit discussions. Okay, thank you. I will now enter into the Record Majority Exhibit 2, which is an email from Mr. Epstein to himself on July 18, 2013. This is Mark Bates, number EFTA01966988. And I'll note for the record that there are a few similar versions of these emails throughout the files. I think with things being forwarded along, I'll be referencing this version and, and asking you questions about it. Some of the other ones are just cut off. Answer. I don't know what you mean. Forward it along. Question. Within the Epstein files there are duplicates for various reasons. And I'm just referencing that. I'm using this particular EFTA number for the record. And while you're reviewing it, we've had more members and staff join. Can they please identify themselves for the record? Mr. Garcia. Robert Garcia, ranking member. Representative Garcia. Congressman Raja Krishnamoorthy from Illinois. Question, Mr. Gates, have you seen this email before? Answer, no. I mean, I would have seen it when it was released in January as part of the Epstein files, but prior to that, no. Question. So this appears to be a draft email or statement that Epstein may have written. He at least sent it to himself. From the perspective of Dr. Nikolic, is that fair? I add no value to that. Well, we can agree that this is not the perspective of Jeffrey Epstein. It's clearly written from the perspective of somebody else. Is that fair? Are you asking me to speculate on that? So I'll read from the record. Then it is again sent Thursday, July 18, 2013 at 12:39, from Jeffrey Epstein to himself. However, the email reads, quote, I have decided to resign my position effective immediately with BG3 and Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation. I have not come to this decision quickly or without great deal of thought. During the past few weeks, I've been caught up in a severe marital dispute between Melinda and Bill. I'll stop reading there for a second. But given majority Exhibit 1, which, which we were just discussing, and the fact that Mr. Epstein and Dr. Nikolic were clearly discussing a marital dispute of some kind between you and Melinda, is it fair to say that this email that was intended to have been sent by Dr. Nikol. I don't know. It was never sent by Dr. Nikolic. That's all I can bring to this. Sure I can. Continue reading I have the greatest respect for my friend of seven years and and I wish them both well in my role as his right hand. I've been asked on multiple occasions and in hindsight, wrongly acquiesced into participating in things that have ranged from the morally inappropriate to the ethically unsound, and had been repeatedly asked to do other things that get near and potentially over the line into the illegal. Though it was kindly suggested that I make a transition to a new position after my six years of service and and that Bill would, in his own words, give me a generous package, I feel it would be dishonest to myself and my future. From helping Bill to get drugs in order to deal with consequences of sex with Russian girls, to facilitating his illicit trysts with married women, to being asked to provide Adderall for bridge tournaments, I feel I owe it to my friends and future colleagues to admit a moral failure to ask forgiveness and to move on with life. So again, I understand you did not receive this email, so I'll just begin to discuss the facts in that email. I've already asked you this. I asked you if you had considered a divorce with Melinda in 2013. I'll ask it a different way. Were you having a marital dispute of some kind with your wife, Melinda French Gates? Answer well, certainly the fact that I told Melinda during this time frame about the two affairs, that was very distressing to her. But at the same time there was no explicit mention of getting divorced. It may have occurred to Melinda at that point, but it was not a subject of discussion. Question but you were having a marital dispute at the time. Is that fair? I wouldn't call it a marital dispute. You could say that it was a marital crisis because she became aware of bad behavior on my part. Question sure. Was this dispute that is referenced in this email? Or how about this the discussion you had with Melinda at the time about your infidelity. Were those ultimately relevant to your divorce in 2021? Answer you would have to ask her, but I imagine that they were question how did Dr. Nicolic know of your marital of your dispute with Melinda? Answer I never discussed the topic with him. I did tell him she was aware of the affairs and that I shared with her that there were also other affairs. Question when did you tell Melinda about the affairs? Answer that would have been in the spring of 2013. Question and when did you tell Dr. Nikolic that you told Melinda about the affairs? Answer around the same time. Question Shortly thereafter. Answer Right and you know, that was part of my telling him that his employment was not going to continue. QUESTION so it's possible then that Dr. Nikolic, while you didn't tell him that you were, that you didn't say you were considering a divorce, as you said you weren't, but it's possible that Dr. Nikolage read into what you were telling him to believe that Melinda was the reason he was being let go and that he needed to fix things with you. Is that fair? Answer well, it's not clear to me that Dr. Nikolic ever saw the emails. But, you know, Dr. Nikolic may have inferred from the fact that I said that I, you know, discuss the affairs he may have speculated about what was doing in terms of my marriage. QUESTION do you have any other suggestion of how Jeffrey Epstein would know about your affairs or other details in this email except through Dr. Nikolic? I believe he found out about the two affairs through Dr. Nikolic. Mr. Moran. And just to be clear, you asked about other details? Gates. Yeah, I'm not commenting on that. Alright, folks, we're gonna wrap up right here. And in the next episode dealing with the topic, we're gonna pick up where we left off. All the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box.