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The Everyday Millionaire and Mindset Matters Podcast
TEDM – Barista to $140M: Keala Kanae on Identity, Values, and High Performance (Episode 237)
01:30:01
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- [00:00]
A
Foreign. Welcome to the Everyday Millionaire podcast. My name is Patrick Francie and I am your host. And I want to begin by saying thank you for listening. On this show I am having conversations with seemingly ordinary individuals who have achieved some amazing and extraordinary results in both their life and business. My intention is to inspire and help you learn and grow by having my guests share their journey of how they face and overcome their challenges, but also how they celebrate their their many wins. And now let's get on with this show and have a conversation with today's guest. My guest today, Keala Kinney is the transformation expert high performers call when mindset hacks and therapy fall short. A CEO of Inspirion, he helps ambitious entrepreneurs and professionals eliminate fear imposter syndrome and and self sabotage at the very root. He's not another coach preaching success. He built a $140 million company from scratch, scaled to $1 million a month in four months and walked away to pursue a deeper mission. Rewiring leaders to rise into who they were born to be. KL's proprietary integrative neural conditioning uses neuroscience, axiology and embodied learning to create full body breakthroug. His three day event genesis is the identity level reset high performers didn't even know they needed from barista to 140 million. The neuroscience of high performance identity Rewire your operating system the brain based path to success why you're still stuck even if you've tried it all Becoming unfuckable with and the new standard for entrepreneurs the hidden power of procrastination and what it's trying to teach you. We cover so much ground. An absolutely, absolutely fascinating conversation. Listen in. Enjoy. Kayala, can I. Welcome to the Everyday Millionaire podcast. Thanks for joining me.
- [02:15]
B
Hey brother, thank you so much for having me man. Appreciate you.
- [02:19]
A
So Kayla, you know I often open with a, you know, tell me what you do kind of, you know, if somebody walks up and says what do you do? And get an answer because bio is thorough as they can be, they're usually a little out of date, etc. Etc. But I'm going to do it a little different with you because one of the headlines within your kind of one sheet that you share with guys like me was barista to 140 million. I mean that's a pretty great opening right there. So let's unpack that a little bit but we'll get to what you do. But let's, you know, let's go with that. You know that's, that's pretty impressive. At least the headline is what Is it about.
- [03:00]
B
Yeah. So, I mean, a little over a decade ago, I was working for minimum wage in a coffee shop, you know, living in my mom's spare bedroom, 500 credit score, that whole thing. And it wasn't really for a lack of trying. I mean, I had tried like lots of different things over the years. I had started my first business 12 years prior to that. And then like, you know, most entrepreneurs, I. Failure after failure after failure after failure that went on for over a decade. And then I eventually, you know, kind of found what we'll likely end up talking about here. But ultimately, I mean, I found personal development. Right. There was this moment I came home from a barbecue one night with some friends of mine, and sitting on my bed at this time, I was living with my. I was living with some roommates. And sitting on my bed was a stack of photographs. And so I'm walking up to the bed and like, where did that come from? As I walk into the bed, I pick up the stack of photographs and every photo was ripped in half. So I'm like sifting through this, these photos, like, what the heck is happening here? You know? And at the bottom of it was a note. And the note said, picture me out of your life. And that was how my girlfriend of four and a half years dumped me. And fast forward, like two weeks later. I had moved out with other house, the roommates, because I couldn't afford the rent, to be honest. I was back living with my mom. I had assumed that her and I would eventually get back together, but she's not answering any of my calls, text messages, nothing. And there's this moment where I'm pacing up and down the hallway in my mom's little like, thousand square foot apartment, and I have this like life changing realization. Like in. At the time, I was taking inventory of all the things that were going, quote, unquote, wrong in my life, like every area of my life where I was failing. And I had this realization in which I realized, like, I'm the only thing that all these things have in common, you know, and so the question became like, well, what if it's me?
- [04:59]
A
Oh, hence, hence the quote, no matter where you go, there you are. Okay, go ahead.
- [05:04]
B
Exactly. And so, you know, that was kind of a tough pill to swallow at first, was like, oh man, like it, it's me. But at the same time, I realized in that moment, like, wait, if me though, I can do something about me, you know, I can't change my upbringing, the economy, the politicians, the, you know, my co Workers, my boss, and all these different things. But I could do something about me. And that set me down the road to personal development. And once I got a taste of it, when I. When I talk about personal development, I'm really talking about self mastery. But once I got a taste of that, I became fascinated with like human behavior, psychology, neurology, axiology, teleology. I mean, you know, fields of philosophy and all these things. And that really opened a doorway in my mind. And in 2012, I had a breakthrough as a result, and my little affiliate marketing business, that had struggled for two years and had gone nowhere, suddenly takes off. I make, you know, I quit my job in the coffee shop, I make a million dollars as an affiliate marketer that eventually organically turned into people asking me to teach them or what I was doing. So I was dropping like Facebook ad courses and copywriting courses and little one off things here and there. And that just kind of organically spawned into a coaching business. And this is before, like everybody and their brother and their dog and their neighbor was a coach, you know, like, this is long before it was like super popular. And yes, that turned into a coaching business. We, I scaled that from zero to 20 million in its first year. We went from zero to a million a month in four months. You know, we went through some challenges with a business. It's obviously had its ebbs and flows. And then, you know, we crossed over 140 million in sales before I exited that business last year. And I pivoted to what's really, I mean, my first love, my first passion, which is, you know, the conversation we'll end up having today about, you know, human behavior and psychology and the things that, like what it really takes in terms of mindset to create success. And so that's what we do now. We work with entrepreneurs and high performers who are looking for that neck to unlock that next threshold of performance.
- [07:19]
A
So interesting. You know, we have fork in the road moments in life. You know, you are still, in my world, young. How old were you back when your girlfriend gave, you know, kicked you to the curb?
- [07:30]
B
I would have been doing some math in my head, so I would have been 26 at the time.
- [07:37]
A
Yeah. So kind of a blessing as all as these things often are, you know, when these things happen, the fork in the roads, it could have been the victim in your life. You chose through some way. Now this is what's interesting. She was quite creative in how she broke up with me, by the way. That's kind of. Wow. Okay. I'd not heard One of those before. But I thought, geez, that's pretty creative. But, you know, you're 26 years old. You, in that moment, kind of take and realize that, you know, at some level, you're responsible for what's happening in your life. You kind of decide in that moment to own it some way. Was there. Was there something in behind the Scenes? You know, like, I often share the story, you know, when I first met my wolf 35 years ago, and I used to go, as, you know, I was being a certain way. I was known as being a little curtain, abrupt and aggressive, blah, blah, blah. And she would once said to me, you know, she'd often say to me, why do you do that? Like, why do you respond that way? Why do you do that? And I'd go, it's just the way I am. And one day, she, in her most profound way, looked at me and said. When I responded to one of her questions with, it's just the way I am, she actually just looked at me and said, you know, it's a choice, right? And I kind of went, what? What do you mean, what? It had never occurred to me, this is just the way I am. So that was the beginning of my journey. That was one of my many forks on the road in my life. But in that moment, I went, oh, what a novel concept. So for you to have that realization, was there kind of a pre. Kind of outline that got you there? Was there a path that you'd already started on? Or where do you think that kind of thought came from?
- [09:23]
B
Yeah, you know, that's a really insightful question that you would ask that. And when I look back, maybe about three or four weeks prior to that, a friend of mine had introduced me to. I was. I was visiting. I was hanging out at his place, and he put on the movie the Secret. And, like, not to be as. You know, how much more cliche of a personal development thing can you have? But I ended up watching the Secret with him, and that was like, the first time that I. Anybody had said any of those things to me. You know, that, like, our thinking creates our reality and yada, yada and all these things. And I think that was probably, like, the perfect precursor, Though I couldn't really understand it or comprehend it at the time. I thought it was interesting, but I also thought to some degree it was, you know, a fantasy. But I think it was a great precursor for the setup that was about to take place about a month later, you know, when she left. And just to set the record straight, her and I are still together. We've been together 20 years now. So we did actually end up, you know, finding our way back to each other.
- [10:22]
A
A real love story. Beautiful. It is interesting in those times, though, right? Is the threads that we choose to pull on. You know, yours was the secret. Watch the secret. You know, what the bleep do we know Joe Dispenza. Back in the day, I mean, there was a but to your point, you know, I don't know that there's more of it today probably, but when you think about the Tony Robbins, the Joe Dispenza, Wayne Dyer was a big deal back in those days and, you know, really profound guys in terms of that. I think today it's just we feel like we're inundated because it's so much more available given technology and the platforms that we use. I don't know if that's true or not, but I hear what you're saying in terms of there's a lot of those individuals out there, but your languaging is really unique in some of the things that you talk about. The languag that you use are these programs that you expanded on. You got an initial idea from the Secret or whatever it might be, and you went, oh, okay, let's talk about operating system and what our operating system can really be and. And how do we shift our thoughts around our operating system? I'm just giving you an example. So because you've got some very unique languaging that you use, give me some insights into some of it and how it evolved for you.
- [11:42]
B
Yeah, I mean, the curriculum that we offer is really an amalgamation of lots of different modalities or things that I learned over the years. I mean, like I said when I fell in love with this stuff, that was 2010. So that's 15 years ago. So for the past 15 years, as much as I've studied marketing and sales and business, I've also been studying psychology, neurology, axiology, teleology, philosophy, epistemology. And so it's really an amalgamation of several things. The one thing that we focus on heavily, that I think is a distinction from what most is what's most commonly available out there, is that we're heavily experiential. So the brain is an adaptation tool. So, you know, it adapts to survive. And so when we're talking about changing our results, what we're doing, which is the output, then what we're really talking about is changing the input. And so if we're talking about changing results, we're talking then all by default, we're talking about changing behavior. If we're talking about changing behavior, we're talking about changing our thinking. And if we're talking about changing thinking, we're ultimately talking about changing the brain and experiential. When we, when we go through experiences in life, it is the fastest way in which we create neuroplasticity and remyelination of the brain's neural pathways. And so in all of our classes, you know, so we have an online class, it's like an introductory class, it's three days long. But you're playing games, you're interacting with groups. Like there is no lecture at any of our programs. There's no lecture, there's a facilitator. And there they might tee up concepts or ideas or exercises. But all of what you're going to learn is learned through your own visceral experience of the concept that we're sharing with you in the room. And so what happens is the brain operating as an adaptation tool. It's taking in all the information and it's rapidly rewiring to adapt to the environment under which it is subject to at the time. And so that's kind of a. Yeah, from a big picture perspective, that's one of the major differentiators.
- [14:05]
A
So are you primarily. I don't want to say that. I don't want to word it that way. You do both virtual and in person kind of programs, events, if you will, where you're having people work through these exercises. I mean, that is ultimately it, you know, and when we push ourselves to get out of the comfort zones, whatever that comfort we live in, or whatever belief we have, what we can or can't do, then that gets tested, you get stretched. And what, what is the, what's the term? A brain once or a mind once stretched, can't go back to what it was or something along that line. So that's kind of, overall, that's what you're really doing. You're helping people rewire those neural pathways to expand on the way they think and how they view the world. Correct. So there's a couple things around it there. You know, one of the common phrases, and we use it, I use it myself, is, you know, how do we become the best version of our. You know, so when you look at your clients and potential clients, people want change, they want change in their life. But it's the old case of, you know, I want to stay the same, but I want things outside of me to change, you know, so it's like, I want change, but I don't really want to change. So what do you think is a tipping point for people in hearing your message? Or what is it that people are looking for when they finally come across you?
- [15:27]
B
Hmm, It's a great question. The center point of our curriculum revolves around a concept taken from axiology, which is the science of values. And more specifically, we refer to it as meta values. So when I'm talking about meta values, just as a clear. As a distinction, oftentimes people hear the word values and they think that they. They know what their values are. Like, they might say, you know, it's faith, family, fitness, fun, integrity, justice, loyalty, whatever. Most of that is just aspirational slogan. When I'm talking about meta values, what I'm sharing is that this is the unconscious hidden driver that is governing all of our action and inaction. It is quietly driving all of our choices. And most specifically, it dictates how we invest our resources. And our resources being primarily time, energy, and money. And so wherever we invest our time, energy, and money will become our destiny. It really cannot be any other way. Right. And so when I say those things, I think like, the big. I'm probably going to say some things that might challenge some people, but lack of discipline doesn't exist. Every human being is disciplined. Procrastination is not a problem, it's a solution. You know, shiny object syndrome is a myth. It comes from, you know, not fulfilling your meta values. I say all that because when you're talking about, you know, somebody says that they want to change their life or they want their life to be different, but then they're not willing to change. The thing that we first look at is what are the values that are already driving this person? Because most often what we're doing when we say, like, I want my life to be a certain way is we're trying to pursue who we think that we ought to be, should be, supposed to be, need to be, have to be in order to be loved, worthy, accepted, enlightened, or whatever it is. Right. I mean, from the time that we're. That we can speak and understand language, we are told who we ought to be, supposed to be, should be, have to be by institutions, teachers, preachers, you know, mother, father, brother, sister, family, all of these outside culture, the media. And so what we're working towards in our curriculum is really getting back to our authentic self. And that word gets thrown around a lot. I get it. We define authenticity as congruency with values. So being congruent with your with your.
- [18:12]
A
Meta values, that's also integrity.
- [18:15]
B
Well, everybody, yes, everybody is, everybody is in integrity with their values at all times. It's just that if they're not, if they don't know what their values are, then they will feel like they're out of integrity. So if you take, I kind of give these like classic examples, like big picture examples, because this is like the easiest for people to comprehend. If I take a mom who wakes up in the morning and the first thing that she thinks about is her children, her children's education, her children's after school programs, you know, her, their, their, their health, their well being and all these sorts of things. And it feels like her whole life revolves around the children. We can logically deduce that she has a high value on raising that family. If we talk about an entrepreneur who wakes up in the morning and the first thing that, you know, he thinks about is the business, the business, businesses, obligations, the people in the business, projects in the business, yada, yada, yada, and that's what consumes his time, energy and money throughout the day. We can, we can deduce that he has a high value on that business. Now that mom, if she sets a goal of starting a business, it's no surprise then that, you know, it's been 10 years, she's hopped from thing to thing to thing to thing. You know, she's had multiple uplines, started different ventures, you know, nothing's worked out. She doesn't, you know, she hasn't stayed the course long enough to see it come to fruition. For that entrepreneur, it's no surprise if he says that he wants to go to the gym, wants to get in shape. But he's been saying that for five years. He keeps joining and dropping out, joining and dropping out, hiring a trainer and, and then giving up. Because, so if you look at, if you look from the outside looking in, you might say, well, she lacks discipline on her business, or he lacks discipline about going to the, going to the gym. But it can't be a lack of discipline because if, if she remembers her children's soccer games without it even being on the calendar, she can tell you what's going on in their life a month from now without looking at anything on her phone, right? So she doesn't need anybody to wake her up in the morning, hold her accountable to taking care of those children. That entrepreneur is disciplined about his business, just not about the gym. So when we are acting in coherence with our meta values, we have diligence, fortitude, follow through, you know, clarity, certainty, poise, precision, productivity, discipline, and all of that is really a derivative of inspiration, which means, you know, from the spirit within. So in other words, it's like what we're called to do with our life. When we lack inspiration, we resort to its cheap knockoff motivation. And motivation is an external force to hold us accountable to do the thing. And so that's when we look for an accountability partner. We look for, you know, cheap dopamine. And the reason that we're doing those things is because we're trying to fight off the symptoms of a lack of inspiration or the symptoms of being incongruent with our meta values. And those symptoms are commonly procrastination, hesitation, frustration, self sabotage, imposter syndrome, and on and on the list goes the things that tend to distract us from our goals and dreams. So nothing is missing, right? In a human being, nothing is missing. This is law of conservation. We've all heard law of conservation. Everything in the universe is made up of energy. Energy can't be created, destroyed, it only transforms. At a macro level, that's true throughout the universe. At a micro level, that's true in a human being. In other words, everything that can exist in a human being does exist in a human being. There's 4,600, you know, characteristics and traits in the Oxford dictionary, roughly, and every human being has all of them. We're all honest and dishonest, kind of cruel, peaceful, wrathful, positive and negative, happy and sad, and on and on the list goes. So there is nothing missing. And most often what happens in the world of personal development, which is why I say, like, we're not really personal development, we're more self mastery. Because the term personal development comes from the root word Persona, which is a mask. And most personal development is essentially nothing more than taking off one mask and putting on another. And so most of what's out there in the world of personal development is looking for something that I'm missing to help me fix what is broken in some way, shape or form. That's the messaging. And our take is like, no, nothing's missing. There is something that's driving you. And your incongruence with that driver is what's creating the symptoms that you perceive are keeping you from getting what you want. And when we can lock in, like when that mom is an example, when she can align that business with her children, or when that entrepreneur aligns going to the gym with his performance as a CEO game on, the same tenacity and discipline they use to fulfill Their values they'll use to achieve those goals. But as long as there's that incongruence between those goals and their values, they're going to continue to face symptoms, which is the mind's way of trying to bring us back to purpose.
- [23:33]
A
Right.
- [23:34]
B
Because if I were to take that, if I were to give that mom $100 million business but take her kids away, she would feel like life is purposeless. If I gave that entrepreneur six pack abs but took his business away, he would feel like life is purposeless. But so often we tend to beat ourselves up and put ourselves down and judge ourselves and undermine ourselves in comparison to what we're not, rather than loving ourselves for who we are. And so all of the greatness that we're seeking to capture is already inside of us. Our mission at our company is to help you tap into it, not find it.
- [24:09]
A
Yeah, it's interesting, there's a quote, I don't know what it is. It's like the prison that we all live in is the prison of our mind where we think something's wrong with our life and we all live into. Many live into that. You know, values is such an important conversation. You know, you phrase made of values. I've used the term core values. Years ago, like 20 years ago when we worked, I worked pretty, my wife and I worked quite extensively with Dr. John Demartini who's really big into universal law and values, et cetera. And it was over the years as we've worked with people, I'm sure you've come across this as well is when you ask them, you know, what do you think you're. Or you know, what are your top five, what are your five highest values? They often don't know. They go to moral values. And this is kind of part of the learning process. When you go down this path of self mastery is understanding what your values are and are they your values or are they somebody else's values? Are you living your parents values? Often, which is often the case is where you're living somebody else's values. But it's such an important conversation to understand and, and you know, you, you put a couple of really great points in there of identifying what your values are. We have used over the years a little different example which is what do you spend your money on? What do you surround yourself with, what do you talk about, what do you think about which is in align with what you're really saying is, is your, your surroundings and your thought processes don't lie. You know, like right now you know, when I look at my. What my highest values have been over the years, you know, if you see my office, you know, I've got my mission control, which is all my stuff out in front of me. I'm in and out. My office is a secondary building to my home. And, you know, my. My gym is literally, you know, 10 steps away. You know, my office is in behind this. It's like everything that I value is important to me. Health being one of the really high things on my list is that's where I spend my time, my money, my focus. It's what I do. It's part of my. My overarching game. You know, being a podcast host and creator, part of my game. It's what I. And so therefore, I'm set up to do it, and I love to do it. So it's understanding what is even below that. So I spent a little bit of extra time on it, only because you did a brilliant job of describing it. But I can't. You know, I think you'd be the same as. You can't really articulate enough how important values are to living and achieving the life that you say you dream of or that you would like to. To be part of. I think that's it. So I don't know if you want to add to that or not, but I want to hit on that point.
- [26:43]
B
No, I absolutely agree, man. I absolutely agree. John was one of my, you know, probably one of the more influential people whose work I've studied over the years. And I. And some of the most brilliant work that I've come across. I mean, a mind well ahead of his time, for sure. And I 1000% agree with you. I cannot articulate enough to someone outside of our ethos how critically important it is to understanding the values that are driving all of your actions and inactions, decisions and behaviors. Once you unlock that, that is the key. That's the holy grail. That's the breakthrough in 2012 that I had. And that's after two years of studying tons of personal development stuff. I mean, I did tons of seminars, read lots of book. Like, I went down the rabbit hole. But in 2012, when I unlocked that one piece, that's like when life clicked. And when it. That's when seven months, once I cracked that code about. Of my values and I realized what was actually happening, what happened was I started. I started tying my business goals to my values. I did that over the course of a trip to San Diego. I did. You know, I came up with like, a Hundred and some odd benefits to my values. On the flight to San Diego, which I was broke on that flight, I mean, I borrowed 50 bucks from my mom so I'd have food, food to eat when I went. And then on the way back, I came up with another 100, just shy of 100 more. And then I eventually opened up an app on my phone, Evernote on my phone, and I kept, and I just kept adding to this list and I came up with over a thousand. And over the next seven months, I watched my life just change tremendously. And within seven months, I, that job had my first five figure month. And you know, my life just kind of skyrocketed. And it wasn't without its pains and challenges and its frustrations and these sorts of things. But when I cracked that, that opened the floodgates, you know, And I see it over and over and over and over and over again with our, with our clientele. It's like once we can really hammer down what's unconsciously driving your behaviors, you'll see that one. Nothing's wrong with you. You don't lack discipline. Your brain is just a purpose seeking organ and it's trying to keep you on purpose. And once you can align that with the things that you say that you want most in life, game on. So, you know, I, I can appreciate that because of some of the work that you've studied in the past, you can understand just how critical, like what I'm sharing is where I think I auto goes over people's heads.
- [29:28]
A
Yeah, it is, but it's so critical. But I want to go back to kind of what I was, you know, what is the gap? So you're, you know, you're in the world, you do the work, you understand, and you've got methodology, you've studied it, you've got a team of people. But when you look at your even, let's just look at your message in your marketing. What is the problem that you're solving that is attracting people to say, I want to do this work, you know, what, what is it? The. Like, so if somebody's listening to this and go, no, my shit's together, I got this figured out. Or somebody's got I hate my life. Like, where is the, where's the gap or the problem that you're solving that you were able to create this cool business model and, you know, scale it the way you have?
- [30:14]
B
Yeah, I mean, the primary gap, you know, for most of our customers end up coming to us for one of two reasons. One, they're not getting what they want.
- [30:24]
A
Right.
- [30:24]
B
Period. So they're, you know, typically they've done quite a bit of personal development work. Typically they've done like, you know, the big seminars, the popular names and gurus, but for whatever reason, they're still coming up against procrastination, hesitation, frustration, self sabotage, imposter syndrome, something along those lines. And they're wondering like, well, what's the next threshold? Where's the next breakthrough? Where, you know, where do I unlock my next level of performance? The other type of customer that tends to find their way to us is the one who did all the things that they thought that they were supposed to do. And they actually, you know, they accomplished the goal and they found it empty. And then they wonder, well, if it was, if it's not this, then what is it? And I, you know, thankfully, I've been kind of on both ends of that spectrum. I was the person who was originally like, frustrated and burnt out and, you know, stuck and turned that around and climbed the highest heights. And I've also been in a place where, you know, success, quote, unquote, got the best of me. And I found myself, you know, on the outside looking in, looking successful, but internally feeling quite empty and realizing, oh my, oh my God, I like, I betrayed myself, you know, and so it's usually one of those two that find their way to us, if that makes sense.
- [31:44]
A
Yeah, yeah. 100. So it. I love the conversation. I mean, this is kind of, you know, part of the work that I've done for many years. You know, at this phase of my life, you know, I look over the past 40 years of being in business and the work that we've done and the people we've worked with, you know, as a, you know, as an educator, speaker, all the things I've done in my life, you know, often I end up with business clients that, you know, come to me for some, some form of business coaching. They're bumping up against whatever they're bumping up against. And I would say that probably 90% of the time is it's never about the operations of the business. There's always a few things in there, the how tos, but most, if you've scaled the business, if you've done, if you have some reasonable success in your business, and aside from how do I scale or maybe that, but even that, it always comes back to who you're being in the context of the CEO or the business owner that you are, what is the work that you, you are the center of your univers and whatever. And I use this, and I'm sure you've used the same kind of term as well, is your life's a reflection of who you're being, the decisions you're making, the decisions you're not making, you know, all decisions. But the point is, is your life's a reflection of just who you're being? So if you want to change what's happening in your life, if you want to change what's happening in your business, go stand in front of a mirror and start to unpack who the hell you're being in the context of what you're doing. I think about it, you know, from a perspective of, you know, let's take somebody like yourself. You know, you start out barista, you have a fork in the road moment. Like, where did you get the scope in your brain to say, oh, a million bucks a month? Like, was that totally by accident? Was it a goal out there? Like, so you understand, like, there's. Yeah. If you understand the question, what's your. I don't know. How do you respond to that vague question?
- [33:41]
B
I think there's two, really. There's two things that you're saying in there. Number one is, you know, and I 100% agree with you, that our external world is a reflection to one degree or another of the identity that we're holding on to. And then the other part of your question is, like, where. Okay, so where did I come up with, like, let's get to a million a month? And they're. They're very closely related. Some. As I got. As I got deeper down the rabbit hole of, you know, self mastery, I realized when you start to study neuroscience, there is literally no difference between your brain and your reality. Like, they are literally the same thing. Consider this. I could. Nobody can describe, like, if the whole world were to turn off its eyes, nobody can describe what the world looks like. Because if we try to think about this, the reality is your eyes. You don't even see the world with your eyes. You see, light enters your eyeball, and it goes through your brain, and it gets processed and turned into an image. And it goes through your brain, through all of your emotions, your beliefs, your past experiences, and then it's formulated in. Into a picture that's projected on the backside of your retina, and that's what you see as reality. But there's birds that don't see color. And so when computer generate. When computers try to generate the image that a bird might see, it looks like a completely different reality. There's animals out there that only see with like essentially infrared light, almost like they only see the infrared spectrum. So the reality to them looks completely different. So there is to, to in some sense no such thing as an objective reality. All of our realities are subjective. So your brain is your reality. Now when, when we grab, when we grasp that, then what that means, then that whatever identity that I'm holding on to is what I project onto the world. There was a study done, I'm forgetting the doctor's name, but it was a study done on kittens. And they kept kittens in a box and turned out all the lights. And when the kittens, when they were exposed to light, there would be in some boxes there was horizontal lines and in some boxes there was vertical lines. And they raised these kittens and eventually when these kittens become adults and they let them out, like as they become adults and let them out of the box as they mature, the kittens that were raised along, around vertical lines could not see horizontal lines. Kittens raised around horizontal lines could not see vertical lines. So it made them really incapable of navigating the world around them. Which begs the question then, where in our life are we kittens? Where in our life did we were we indoctrinated to see the world a certain way? And therefore we cannot see it another way. We cannot see the vertical lines, you know, and so when we, when we really grasp that like our brain is our reality, then the question is like, well then how do I change my brain to change my reality? And part of changing the brain is then changing identity. It's the changing like this is not so who. Everything that I believe about who I am is something that was constructed at some point, right? So people tend to think, people tend to think that like changing who you are is difficult. So was becoming who you are, that was difficult as hell. You just accepted it, you know what I mean? So you. It's just. And it's become so normal that it feels easy. And so there's no difference between becoming who we are and changing who we are. Both are hard, right? It's just which hard are you willing to accept?
- [37:50]
A
Yeah, there's a, there's an aspect to that, and I totally agree with you. I don't think we're going to miss align on many things that we talk about in this particular conversation, but we start to understand that as you become who you are and it's unfolding naturally and that's the way it is. And then you wake up one day and you go, there's more to life than this. I'm capable of more. I can do something, I've got to change, change. And then people ultimately run up against the roadblock. My experience is that the fear of the judgment of friends appears, of family, of losing friends, losing family. And that is always, that's, you know, that's the difference of making a change like that. I'm going to be judged, people are going to laugh at me, they're going to tell me I'm a weirdo, whatever the story is. What'd you do, join a cult? All of a sudden you're into self mastery stuff like these are some of the stories that people tell themselves and that ultimately is. Gets in their way. It's interesting, the identity part of it. One of the hacks that I've used myself and that I share often is that, you know, when it comes to change and identity, pick one or two people that you admire and then look at the qualities of those people that you admire. You may know them, they could be dead, they could be alive, you know, you know, whatever it is, it's somebody you read a book about and you really admired that person. What are the qualities of the person? Write them down. And then that becomes your to do list. That's it, you know, it's a, it's a great entry point of. You want to benchmark. Oh, you admire that quality. And so I'll give you my own story really quickly, which is, you know, a couple years ago. So I've trained all my life, I've worked out, did all things. I've always, Health's always been one of my top kind of values. And I was, I turned 65 and I looked and I went, oh, I'd fallen off, we'd gone through the lockdowns and you know, COVID 19 was about the £19 I put on and all the shit that we go through, right. So I just had to put in a correction. But as I was going along, I went. One of the inspirations I had was rfk. You know, I looked at Kennedy and I went, there's a guy, he was three years older than me. I think he's 70 now, but he was whatever, 67, 68. Yeah, here's a guy, he's active, he's making a huge difference in the world. He trains, he works out, he's really health focused. And I go, there's some certain qualities about him that I really admire and I could adopt those qualities. And I looked at him and I went, oh, that's who I Want. That's my vision of myself physically, mentally, at 70 years old. Now it's all a story I'm telling myself. Ultimately, I don't know Kennedy. I mean, I see him, I've read about him, I look at some of his things that I see and I went, those are cool qualities. I could adopt those qualities. And so for me, it's always a benchmark of if I don't feel like working out or I'm gonna cheat or on my diet, whatever that might be, I go, what would Kennedy do? Right? And Kennedy would probably cheat sometimes. And you do all those things, but ultimately you get back on track. It's a. It's a kind of a North Star that we can link to. So this is a little bit of a hack around identity is if you're not sure, just pick a few qualities of people you admire. Any thoughts on that, that hack? No.
- [41:08]
B
I think that that's something very similar that I've done several times. You know, is I'll ask myself, especially when I'm going through some tough times, is I'll ask myself, like, fast forward into the future so I'm on the other side of whatever challenge that I'm facing now. What advice would I be giving myself today? So fast forward three years from now and I've overcome this thing, I've built this company, I've accomplished X goal. Now when I sit with that person for a moment, like, what is that person advising me to do today? It's like identity hacking. I started out, the very first version of that was as I was learning this stuff while I was still working in the coffee shop, I sat down and asked myself, okay, well, what would a six figure earner do? And it became like a very common question. I would ask myself, what would a six figure earner do? Like, as I would be faced with potentially buying a course or staying up late working or being invited to a conference, that felt like a stretch for me finding financially or whatever. But I asked myself, okay, well, what would a six figure earner do in this situation? And when I started acting like that person, I ended up getting that person's results. When I got that person's results, I asked myself, okay, what would a seven figure earner do? And when I started acting like that person, I ended up getting that person's results, you know, and so now, today, similar to what you're expressing, I just go, all right, so there's a version of me that's on the other side of this two years from now, three years from now, Five years from now. What's that. What's that version of me saying to the version of me today? What's their advice to me right now? And then I listen to that advice, you know, like, I do my best, and it's not always easy. It's not always. But the challenges are what make things worth it. You know what I mean? Getting to the top of Everest is amazing because most people can't do it, you know, because the climb would kill most folks. That's what makes it such a, like, worthwhile, you know, accomplishment. And so, you know, lean into those challenges to your point, whereas most folks want to, like, and here's the thing is, like, when going back to what we were saying about values, so often we want to avoid challenges. You know, like, we want to accomplish the thing. We want the benefit without the drawback, the goal without the sacrifice. But the reality is in the pursuit of our highest values or the pursuit of our meta values, and you know, that's not true. Like, if that mom would overcome any challenge to raise those children, the example that I was giving earlier, and that entrepreneur would. Would face any challenge to make, to bring to life the manifestation of his goals and dreams with his business. So when we find ourselves backing down from challenges, oftentimes, more often than not, it's a signal that we're pursuing something that is in contradiction with our values. And that's why, you know, we're. That's why the fear stops us. Because in the.
- [44:00]
A
In.
- [44:01]
B
In the pursuit of that which we value most, we become fearless. That mom would fight a lion to the death to save her children, right? That entrepreneur would fight, Would fight a lion till the death to save their business. Both would say that they're afraid of failure in one regard, but in the pursuit of making manifestation the thing that they find most inspiring in their life, they will face certain death to make it come true.
- [44:24]
A
Tell me about from a perspective, given the work that you do and your business model and how you drive revenue, you know, when you look at the money you make, the money you earn, you go. You get to a point where you go, okay, you're still young. You're, You're. You've accomplished a lot. I mean, I certainly don't know your net worth, but when you start talking these kinds of numbers, you've done very well in your life. What keeps you going? How much and how important? And I get. Dollars and cents are always important. But, you know, it's like the. A cliche question, you know, if you. Would you do what you do for free. What drives you? What literally gets you up in the morning? Is money still really high on your, one of your values, one of your, I think you use the term meta values. And I want to unpack that a little bit. But what, what drives you? Like, you've, you've, you've made the money, you've got it. You know, when's enough enough for you? Or what is the goal behind what drives you right now?
- [45:22]
B
I am so grateful that you asked that question. I've done quite a few podcasts and I don't remember ever being asked that question, actually. And you know what, here's what's beautiful about that. And so. And I'll unpack this with a bit of a story, please. In 2016, so I launched my coaching business. The previous company that we exited last year, I launched that in November of 2016, right after Thanksgiving. And we scaled it to a million a month in four months. So March of 2017 was our first million dollar month. And my, my, you know, my goal at the time was a million a month. A million a month. A million a month. Like I wanted to just get to a million a month for whatever reason. It was because, like, when I started learning about, like, well, I can just kind of create my reality, well, I was like, all right, well, let's go for a million a year. And then when I did a million in a year, I'm like, well, let's go for a million a month. You know, when I got to that million a month, though, something rather interesting happened. On the outside, it looked like I looked successful. And most of my people around me thought that I was successful on the inside. I was falling apart on the inside. I was waking up by April of 2017. My mornings started with a panic attack and a glass of whiskey. By 10am I was tanking a glass of whiskey so I could calm the nerves, get to my office work. If I buried myself in work, I didn't have time to have anxiety. And then as soon as I would unplug from work, I would have anxiety. Anxiety again. I thought that what I needed was a vacation. And so eventually I was able to take a vacation and I took three weeks in Hawaii. And when I got to Hawaii and I landed, you know, because Hawaii is where I'm from, it's where my family is. And so at the time we were living in Vegas. When I got to Hawaii and I landed, I thought that I would be free from that. And actually it got worse. Like that anxiety turned into thoughts of, of what turned into depression and thoughts of suicide.
- [47:18]
A
Wow.
- [47:18]
B
And there was this moment, you know, in Hawaii where I'm sitting on the edge of my bed, and I say to myself, and I'm thinking, like, it's not the money. You know, I placed all this value on, well, when I get to this number, and then I got there, and then it was like, okay, well, then when I get to this number and then I got there, and then I go, let's get to this number. And then I got there and I real. And I'm. What's happening is. What's unfolding for me is I'm realizing the thing that I said said was the thing was not the thing. You know, like, the. The goal was empty. And so I, you know, I went back to the. The stuff that we're talking about here. It went back to my values. And there's a couple of things that came to. To light. Number one is a lot of the anxiety and depression stemmed from I was acting outside of my values. I mean, I had a. I started my business because I loved marketing and sales. And then when my business took off, I did no marketing and sales. I was hiring, firing, training systems, operations, onboarding, legal contract. I was doing all this stuff that I was like, what the heck am I doing? And so, to a degree, I had hated my life. But also beneath that was this. When I grew up, does the domestic violence in my household? There was domestic violence in my neighborhood. In fact, I thought domestic violence was like a normal thing until I heard the term domestic violence. And that's when I realized they were like, oh, that's not like. Like, that's not a normal thing. And when I look back from the earliest memories I had, my parents fought about money. And so I perceived that if I made money, it would equate to safety. And when I finally had money, there was no extra sense of safety whatsoever. In fact, life felt to a degree, less safe because at least when I was broke, I knew who my real friends were. You know, when. When. When the money's piling up and you've got, you know, lights, camera, action, and you've got some degree of, like, almost fame and sensationality, it's very difficult to tell who's really actually on your side, you know? And so for me, life actually felt more dangerous. I began working through, okay, like, what is. What is it about this that is going to make this most meaningful? Like, what is. What is. What is here that I can do that I can pur. That, you know, like, because it's obviously not the money. The money's not driving me. And as I began to unravel that, and that's probably like a conversation that's probably outside of the scope of this podcast a little bit. But as I began to peel back the layers, what I realized is, like, that the core fundamental belief behind all of my decisions in my business, and this is our core belief in my company now. And it was my core belief in my previous company, and it stemmed from my greatest pain, because our message eventually becomes our message. So our core belief became, I believe that every human being has something remarkable to offer the world. And I found that because there was a time in my life when I didn't believe that about myself, and somebody believed it about me. And that message got to me, and to a degree, it saved me. And my business was an expression of that message. You know, I mean, I taught affiliate marketing and I taught digital marketing, not so much as a way to en. To make people rich, but as a way to enrich people. And that is like, when that clicked for me, that was like, that's what I want to spend the rest of my life doing. I want to spend the rest of my life inspiring the world to see. And this is our vision, our company vision. It became our vision statement. We inspire the world to see the infinite potential and expansive possibilities of the human soul. When that became my vision, I was still selling affiliate marketing training. And so I believe that my purpose is just to inspire, and I believe that my purpose and the best way to inspire others is to be the message. And so I'm constantly looking for that next threshold, that next, you know, challenge, that next accomplishment, the next level of, you know, performance, because that's the best way to deliver the message, is to live the message, you know, and that's what I find meaningful about it. And so the dollars that I earn are just points on the scoreboard. And it just so happens that the more points you put on the board, the more inspiring people find. You find watching you play the game, just like Kobe, LeBron and Jordan, you.
- [51:53]
A
Know, I love it. A great story, by the way. You know, it. It reminds me a little bit. You know, we sometimes step over or people step over way they were raised and they use it as. But rather than they use it as a blame and they take on this victim mentality. I share a story, and you may have heard it before, and I'll paraphrase most of it, but a journalist, I think he was, or a psychiatrist, whatever the story is, is that he had Come across two identical twins, and one of them was uber successful, amazing family, very, very accomplished as a lawyer, and very looked up in high esteem in his community. He looked at his twin brother, had been through three marriages, been charged with, you know, domestic violence and abuse, was an alcoholic. And he's looking at these two brothers. He's going, what the hell? Like, why are they so different? And he decided to do a little study, and he decided to interview them. And he interviews one of the brothers, and he first interviews the one brother, and he goes, goes, gosh. He says, you had a tough life. You know, three marriages, and you're alcoholic, and you've been charged with domestic abuse. And, like, what the hell's going on? And the guy goes, you know something? When I grew up, my dad beat my mother. He beat us as kids. He was a drunk and hated everything in life, and, you know, how else could I be? You know, it's what I. It's how I was raised. He goes, wow, that's a fascinating story. I can understand how you see that and how that is for you. He went to his twin brother, and he goes, wow. He says, you're really accomplished. Like, you're a lawyer. You're, like, really looked up to in the community. You're very successful, loving family, wonderful children, amazing relationship. Like, how did you get here? Like, what. What happened that you're here? And he says, well, you know, my dad was a drunk. He beat my mother. He. He beat us as kids. He was a drunk. And, you know, I look at that and I go, how could I ever want to be that? And he said, I just looked at that and went, I know what I don't want to be. And this is why I went on the path of who I am today. So, you know, it's an interesting. Always, perspective is reality, or our perspective is our perception. And so when you look at the difference in attitude around that, and these are all stories that come up and in this space of development and who we're being is. But they're also meaningful. It's a. It's a good invitation to look at life and what are you here for? I think everybody's purpose, ultimately, is to be a contribution, whatever that might be. You know, you've taken it and scaled it, and, you know, you really want to have an impact on the world. And, you know, if you did some of demartini's work, you know, he kind of puts it out there in one of his programs, and he has you answer the question, you know, what. What do You. What do you want people to be saying about you? What's your legacy? What do you want them to be saying about you in a hundred years, in a thousand years? Right. And it really expands your brain in terms of how to look at and view what you want to accomplish or who you want to be in the world. But it really is a decision. I want to go back on something that, you know, as you went through this process, when you went back home and kind of were going through these dark times, were you with your significant other at the time?
- [55:21]
B
Yeah, her and I are together.
- [55:23]
A
How impactful was it to have. Because just the story about her taking pictures, you know, tearing him in half, going, you know, here's life without me, you know, that's very astute. So when you think about that, how important is it to have somebody like that in your life? You know, obviously a cheerleader working through it. How. How did she manage to. To kind of keep a handle on you and support you through that time?
- [55:54]
B
It's only in recent years, I think, that I really realize that the person that we choose is our, like, significant other. The person that we choose to be. To ride shotgun with us on the, you know, journey of life is likely the most important choice we make in our life, you know, and, yeah, I mean, I cannot put into words. I cannot articulate what having her by my side during that time was like, because, you know, as I said at the time, it was very difficult for me to tell, like, who was real and who was fake and, you know, who actually had my back and, you know, these sorts of things. But there was. But that was never a question with her. I mean, there was a time that she slept with me in a car because that's all I had, you know, and we would just go park at the. You know, park at the. One of the beach parks in Hawaii, and that's where we would camp out for the evening. And so she loved me when I had nothing, you know, to have that, like, pillar alongside me just kind of, you know, it's not. She didn't have the answer. She didn't know what the solution was.
- [57:03]
A
She didn't.
- [57:04]
B
You know, even at the time, she didn't offer me tons of advice. I don't think that she knew what advice to offer because neither of us had been to that place before. But what she did. What she did ground me in is we're gonna make it through this. We're gonna figure it out, just like we've always figured it out, you know, And I think that level of companionship, you know, I think, I think that's, that's irreplaceable. Irreplaceable.
- [57:29]
A
I don't think there's anything better than being able to go on the journey of self discovery with your significant other, you know, where you're sharing in the journey together, figuring yourselves out, handling each other, holding up a mirror to each other, you know, doing all the things that we do. And I think it's, it's, you know, it's so, so great, you know, and when you're going through it sometimes. Yeah, it is. So. So my wife Stephanie is a mental and Olympic class, mental performance coach. She's about to go to her fourth Olympics in February, Winter Oly Olympics. And you know, and she sees couples that actually compete together, they're on the same team kind of thing, and then those that are part. And they're. But when you're training, when you're going to an Olympic, you know, if you're going to be an Olympic athlete, you're like, if you're hanging out with a partner, you're there, I mean, you're there with them more than you are your significant other. So it's, it really isn't a unique coaching perspective that, that she takes on. But I want to go back to, you know, just how important this is where values. I think that many marriages fail for a lot of reasons, but I think they fail at its base is a misalignment of misunderstanding values. Not understanding your values when you get married. The inability to have conversation and respect and say, you know something. There's no right values, there's no wrong values. Yours are yours, mine are mine. They don't align, they don't mesh. You know, this isn't going to work. I think you're cool. Well, I don't, you know, but let's not force the river, you know, and so that's, that's part of it. Or if you go on the journey together and, and then maybe it all works out. But without that at least understanding and of alignment of values, I think that breaks down a lot of marriages. Often that's part of it. I joke and I, I share this for the intention goes back to just with your. Is she your wife now?
- [59:23]
B
So fiance. Fiance.
- [59:26]
A
Okay.
- [59:27]
B
So we just got engaged like a couple years ago.
- [59:29]
A
Oh, cool. Congratulations. So, you know, when I, you know, Stephanie, when I first met, she would jokingly and lovingly, you know, talk about how I was her favorite Neanderthal. She was far more evolved than I was. Right. And I was still like, you know, wrong side of the tracks, blue collar, you know, all those kinds of things. And so I evolved. And then I once heard the quote that, that, you know, a diamond is just a chunk of coal put on under a great deal of pressure. And, you know, certainly in my case, I had a wife that put a lot of pressure on me. But in my understanding of the pressure that I was being put on, it was never. It was always about, you're better, you can do better, you can up your game, you can bust through this. It wasn't. It wasn't from a critical point of view. Do you understand what I'm saying? It was just. But putting on a pressure to step up. Up, like, quit making excuses, you know, quit being a victim. Like, step up, you know, pick up your game. Like, but not in those way, you know, not in those terms. But it was the. The concept of understanding that we can put pressure on each other to be the better version of ourselves, to go on and, you know, back to your original thought around self mastery, because that's what the game is in my world. That's the game game. So where do you think you go from here with what you've got going on in your business? And what do you see yourself and how do you see yourself kind of going forward on the journey that you're in, in business? Do you have, I want to make a difference to a million people's lives or 10 million people's lives? Are you kind of there? I love your mission, by the way. I think it's wonderful.
- [61:06]
B
I mean, I have to comment on what you're just saying about our significant other. Just in the sense that, like, you know, at the end of the day, we're all crazy, man. We just find. We just find somebody who matches our crazy. You know what I mean? Complimentary crazy. And to your point about values, I mean, you know, so her and I both, like, we have. We have our individual, you know, meta values, right? Like, and they're. They're not the same, they're not identical. And I think that's one of the fantasies that people have about relationships too, is that we're supposed to marry. You know, we're supposed to find somebody who is kind of like us. But in reality, we. There's a reason that we say opposites attract. We tend to marry somebody who's different than us in a complimentary way because they make our life more whole, you know, and her values fill in the gaps of my values. Like if, if I was alone and it Wasn't for her, like, I wouldn't have. I wouldn't build family and relationships. Like, that's really high on her values. And so the reason that we have great culture in the company or great, deep, lasting friendships that we have is because she'll cultivate those things. Because, me, I just want to wake up in the morning and get to work. But then together, collectively, we have our family values of the agreements by which we operate together, how we agree to show up and treat each other on the mission of life. And then I think, what greater form of love it? Like, I think we, you know, we, We.
- [62:41]
A
We.
- [62:42]
B
We're raised in this, especially in the world that we're in today, where it's like, there's like, if you love me, you'll never offend me. If you love me, you won't hurt my feelings. You know, if you love me, you'll accept me as I am.
- [62:55]
A
Yeah. Yeah.
- [62:55]
B
No, man. If I love you, then I'm gonna demand the most of you. If I love you, I demand the greatest out of you. If I love you, I'm gonna challenge what you believe is possible, you know, so that we can. So we can keep, you know, evolving through this life, not just devolving through this life. And so anyway, I guess, obviously, we could probably have a podcast episode on that, Patrick. But we could.
- [63:16]
A
They're fine.
- [63:18]
B
In regards to the business, you know, at this point, I mean, I sold my previous company. I really loved what we did. And the reality, though, is, like, all of the biggest success stories there that we ever created, all of them. During the. During the pandemic, my business partner and I were going, you know, business was weird. It was hard to kind of figure out. The marketplace was super noisy, ads would work, then not work. It was just a weird time. And so we were going through a lot of the data in the business. And one of the things that I found was that, like, every single success story that we had that made over a quarter million dollars doing what we were teaching them to do, which was ultimately affiliate marketing, every single one of those people did all of our mindset classes, too. And that was, like, this moment where I was like, I really think this. This is what I want to do. I really think, like, this is the thing that I really want to spend the rest of my life doing, you know, like. Because that's timeless. Like, no matter what happens to the human. Human beings, wherever we go in the universe, you know, if we become a galactic species, we're still going to take with us the Human dilemma. Who am I? Why am I here? What am I here to do? What's most meaningful for me? Why am I coming up short? You know, what my purpose in life? Like all of these questions that just kind of define our existence, you know, for what it's worth, I think, to a degree, with AI becoming what people, you know, presume that it may become, I think that that existential crisis becomes even greater, you know. You know, if it really does displace jobs, then what happens to our sense? Like you said. You said it, and I agree with you 100%. I think everybody's purpose to some degree or another is to be of contribution, right? Like maybe our purpose is. Differentiates in forms of what type of contribution. But we know that we're innately hardwired to contribute back to our species. That's why people who retire or have empty nest syndrome is because they feel like they're no longer a contribution to the species. And without that contribution, there becomes no sense of purpose, right? And so if we're displaced from jobs, if we're replaced by robots, if we're, you know, displaced by some software that can do most of our knowledge work in the world, what happens to our sense of meaning and purpose? Where then do we find our sense of contribution to the world? Nobody knows. I mean, the future is, you know, there's catastrophic futures depicted, there's, you know, utopian futures just depicted. The reality is it'll be somewhere in the middle, some. Somewhere that none of us can truly define. But my, My aim in turn, to answer your question in regards to the business is, have you ever read it's by Simon Sinek, Infinite Game?
- [66:05]
A
No, I've not. But I've seen the book, but I've not read it.
- [66:08]
B
Okay, so he actually pulled the concept from another author whose name I'm forgetting, that wrote a book somewhat related to game theory. But it's essentially that most people are in business to win or lose. But the businesses that stand the test of time are about something far greater than winning or losing. You know, they're about. They're on. They're on a. They have a vision, they have purpose, they have a mission that span that's spaceless and timeless. And so what is something. What is a vision so vast that you can invest the rest of your life doing it and know that it will never be accomplished? You know, so it's so vast, it's unaccomplishable, and it's so meaningful, though, that even though you know it can't be accomplished, you're still called to do it. And I would love to spend the rest of my life taking this con, this conversation that you and I are having now, into every household in every corner of the earth, in every language. Like, why is. Why does. Why is it not the case that every mother has the conversation with her teenage son or daughter saying, you know, if you're not happy with the way, that, you know, life looks, how are you the one that's creating it? And how do you create something different? Like, why isn't that conversation happening on every corner of the. In every corner of the earth?
- [67:39]
A
I hear you, brother.
- [67:41]
B
I'll spend my life doing that. And will there be lots of money to be made? I sure hope so, because it's going to take a lot of money to accomplish the mission. But, you know, that's. That's what I would want to have etched on my gravestone is that I spent my time inspiring the world to see the infinite potential and expansive possibilities of the human soul.
- [68:02]
A
Yeah. Love it. I've really spent most of my life, directly or indirectly, supporting people to have success in their life, whatever that success might be. Stephanie's the same way. She does it with athletes and business owners. I've done it with. With athletes and real estate investors and business owners. But what really drives the, you know, in behind it is the challenges of getting through to somebody, supporting them in being whatever best version of themselves they can be in that moment, or having the tools to, you know, go on the journey of self mastery knowing that it's a lifelong journey. I can, you know, at 67, I'm certainly thinking a lot different than I was at 27 or 47 or even 57. And I don't even think, you know, people talk about retirement, and I go, gosh, you know, some arbitrary 65 means you should retire. And I go, I love my life. I love doing what I'm doing. And, yeah, and financially, I don't have to worry too much. And my wife and I don't. We do what we do because we love to do it. We do it at a pace that works for us. Do we want to achieve more? 100%. But I look at this and go, I. I don't know, I'll do this till I'm 80, until people won't listen to me anymore because I'm too old or something. I don't know. But ultimately, that's what fires me up, and that's being the contribution that goes back to. It's more about how I can support others. It's more than it is. What I get out of that is the kick out of doing that and going awesome and. And supporting others. I. That's just kind of how I'm wired as well. And I don't ever see that coming to an end. Kind of along the lines that you're talking about. Yeah, it's a great way to be. And I. And I. And I really wish that for many people that they would get. You know, I often have talked to people over the years that hate their job, hate their life, and I'm going, man, stop it. Change it. You know, you don't have to keep doing it. So. But to your point, why doesn't everybody have these messages and why doesn't everybody get excited about this shit like we do? You know, I don't know the answer to that question, but when I was.
- [70:06]
B
Growing up, my mom was a housekeeper, and she ended up networking with some of the wealthiest people in Hawaii. I mean, highly influential, extremely wealthy people who lived in Hawaii. And one of the things I found interesting as a kid, and even she couldn't understand it at the time, is that some of these people, they'd be in their early 80s, some of them their late 80s, and they would still work, they would still go to their home office, they would still sit in front of the computer, they would still try to get work done, they'd still go, you know, to an office outside of their home and still, like, go visit the company that they ran or whatever it is. And the reality is, like, they didn't have to work. It was obviously no longer about the money because these people were, like, very wealthy. And my mom, you know, she would mention things about it. And I remember being a kid, and I would ask her, and I would say, like, mom, why do they work if they don't have to? I don't get it. She's like, oh, because, you know, they just don't have anything better to do with their life. That was her level of comprehension at the time. She was a housekeeper. I look at it now and I go like, oh, that's why they were so successful to begin with, because they were answering a calling. Answering a calling. You know, you and your wife, you're answering a calling. That's what you're expressing. In Inspirian, you know, we said, we define ourselves as a leadership training company, and we define leadership as every human being has a calling. Leaders have the courage to answer the call.
- [71:37]
A
Oh, great line. Love that quote.
- [71:40]
B
Yeah. So it's just that's. That's what. That's what leadership is to us is like just having the tenacity, the ferocity, the dedication, the commitment to answer the call. Because answering our calling is not always easy, obviously. Answer the call. Answering our call comes with judgment from friends, family, society, culture, media, you know, social media. Judgment of ourselves and who we think that we ought to be. But I think it's also the greatest. You know, if you wouldn't trade what you do for any amount of money in the world, then you're already successful regardless of the amount of money you have. You know, that's the. A real definition of success that, like, I can get behind. And that's just ultimately what you're expressing. You know, I feel the same way. It's like, why would I to want. Want to do? People say, oh, you got to be more balanced. You got to be more balanced. Like, why should I do more of the thing that you think that I should do and less of the thing that I love doing? Is that what you think balance is?
- [72:41]
A
You know, what the hell is balance? There's a. Yeah, I mean, fundamentally, I look at it and I, you know, there's a. There's. I don't know where the quote is. I don't know if it's Shakespeare or where the quote comes from, which is, know thyself, be true to thyself. And we start to learn about ourselves as we go through these processes and as we age and our values shift and change in terms of priorities and where they sit on the list and all the rest of it. And we go through that process and what I've discovered about myself, you know, you talk about Hawaii. We were. We were in Hawaii, and beautiful Four Seasons. We're hanging out, and I, you know, like, it was a vacation, and there was wedding that we went to and all the rest of it. And I, I. It's kind of a test for me. And I, I go like, we're a weekend, and we've hung out at the pool. We've ate, you know, too much and had good fun with friends. And, And I. And I said to Stephanie, I go, I'm done. Like, I love the island. I love what. I love this. This environment. It's really cool. But I am bored. Like, I'm bored. She'd go, well, why don't we go, like, scuba diving or something? Okay, okay, great. We can do that, you know, and then I'll be bored of that. Like, it's just not enough for me anymore. And I have to be active. I have to be Busy, you know, golfing does not light me up. Hanging out by a pool shuts me down. I mean, there's some things you can do for a couple of weeks. And it goes back to Michael Dell. He was talking to, and I remember this quote, and he was talking to a bunch of university students and one of the students says, you know, Mr. Dell, you know, you're worth billions or whatever it was at the time. You could be on your boat, you know, cruising around the ocean and da, da, da. And he goes, and he goes. So she goes, why do you keep working? And he goes, I can be on my boat fishing. And that'll last about a week. And it's fun. And then it's not fun anymore. He goes, you know how fun it is to run a billion dollar company. So you start to know yourself, right? But there's a lesson I learned and I share this with you just for what it's worth, you know, A friend of mine celebrating his 50th birthday and I was the old man at the table. There's a half a dozen of us breaking bread and having, sharing some stories. And somebody said, okay Patrick, like you're, you know, you're the old guy at the table here. What's your profound wisdom that you would share with a group of 50 ish year old men? I went for me, the goals that I had at 50 to accumulate stuff. I find myself at this point in my life going, why did I wait? Why did I spend time, money, energy, stress over acquiring stuff? Because at this point in my life, life, if I have to wash it, insure it, park it, look after it, like off, I'm done, like get rid of this, you know, so it's like even when I open, when I bought my Porsche, like it was like, okay, you know, it's like any new car you buy, you know, three weeks later you go, okay, why did I buy this? So that's kind of where I'm at in, in my own life. So I just share that for whatever reason. But anyways, that's kind of where it showed up for me.
- [75:48]
B
It's the anticipation is greater than the climax.
- [75:51]
A
Isn't it true? Right.
- [75:53]
B
No, I was just going to share. I let you know a couple of years ago we bought this, I'm on a ranch right now in Texas. And a couple of years ago we actually bought this property for the business that we have today because I mean, we did these the same thing while we had our other company. It's just that it was never the primary focus but anyway, so we buy this ranch and we use it for, like, the retreats and whatnot. And so a couple years ago, we buy it and we end up in Dallas. It's two hours east of Dallas. We end up in Dallas for a conference. And my fiance says to me, she's like, we should go stay out at the ranch. And then we lived in Vegas at the time, you know, I mean, the opulence of Las Vegas. I mean. And so she said, we should go stay out at the ranch. I said, why would we. Why. Why would we stay out there? There's nothing out there. I mean, there's a house. Obviously I'm in the house, but I mean, like, there's nothing out. I don't. I don't want to go stay out there. She's like, well, we should get familiar with the property so that we know how to. What, to build on it. And I was like, oh, why? That's why we hired, you know, architects and stuff. Like, there's engineers that are designing it. She's like, well, you know, babe, but, like, how are we going to know if that's really what we want if we don't go? And I was like, you know, of course. I'm like, adamantly like, no, I don't want to stay out there in the middle of nowhere. So, of course, though, she wins. And this is also a life lesson. But anyway, so we end up staying out at the ranch. This is last February, and we're out here for two weeks. And when it was time to leave, I didn't want to leave. And it was this. It was such the opposite of what I was, of the life that I lived in Vegas. You know, it was the life I lived in Vegas. I mean, at that point, like, I went back to Vegas and I felt like it was so artificial, you know, waking up out here in nature, hear birds singing, butterflies flying, green grass, you know, and back home, it was Lamborghinis and Rolls Royces and mansions and casinos and all that. And I got back there and I was like, this feels so artificial now. So eventually we sold the place in Vegas, or we're selling the place in Vegas and we moved here to the ranch full time. And I think that there's that sense of. Not that it's exactly what you're expressing, but I think there is this, like, sense over time. Like, once you've accumulated enough things, you realize, like, the things just don't matter. They don't matter.
- [78:11]
A
Your relationships will always be what matters. We. We don't Live on. We, we may call it the back 40, but it's, you know, we live on five beautiful acres in, you know, just 45 minutes east of Vancouver, Canada. And we just love our property. You know, we, we, we refer to it often as the compound. We're not leaving the compound. And if you don't have a, a gate to, or code to the gate, don't bother knocking. Like, we, we joke about that, but it's like we're, we're so kind of dialed into that lifestyle. So. Good for you. I, I love it. So you've been really generous with your time. I appreciate it. I'm going to start to wind down, but before I wind down, is there anything that I didn't ask you or that you really want to share with the audience that we may be more missed? We covered a lot of ground, but I mean, there's a lot of ground to cover in this conversation.
- [79:03]
B
We'll see if we, you know, we'll see if in the short time that we have left, like, we can make this land. You'll for sure understand this because we've had similar teachers in the past. But, you know, from time to time I get, I've been asked like, you know, if there was like one thing, one lesson, one piece of advice, you know, that you could give. I'd say like the most, the most important lesson I've learned along the way, easily the thing that's most, most made a difference in my life, aside from our meta values, is that everything is love. And that's not the same as love is everything. But essentially what I mean is you mentioned it earlier, right, like that an upbringing can be your greatest curse or your greatest blessing. It's all perspective. And so everything in life, when we look at law of equanimity in physics, we can observe that in every closed system, there's ultimately a balance. You know, a good example is like the Black plague of the 14th century. I use this example a lot. John used to use this example. And it's just one that easy for people to comprehend. The Black plague of the 14th century took millions of lives. And what most people don't know is that during the AIDS epidemic of the 80s and 90s, it saved millions of lives because millions of people were immune to contracting the HIV virus due to genetic mutation that was passed down from their ancestors who survived the Black Plague. So something that took millions of lives, saved millions of lives. And so equanimity, balance essentially means that for that everything is both, you know, everything. So, you know, Was, was the Black Plague good or bad? Well, the reality is it was both. There was a benefit and a drawback, you know, and so everything has both a blessing and a curse. And the reason I say that is because I think one of the biggest human illusions or an illusion that we often chase is that we can, you know, if we're going to be happy, successful, worthy, loved, you know, enlightened, you know, then eventually we're going to be, you know, always kind, never cruel, always honest, never dishonest, always happy, never sad, you know, always peaceful, never wrathful. And the reality is like that we're going to be both our whole lives, right? And so when we accept that, when we accept that everything is both, that both sides are meaningful and important in life, we free ourselves from, you know, the prison of trying to live a one sided life. That's impossible. But we also free our lives from the illusion that anything that happens to us is not happening for us. When once I grasp that, like once I got that, that it made it so much more clear, man, we hear that said oftentimes, you know, people say, oh like, you know, life is happening for you, not to you. And then five minutes later life's not going in the way that they want and they're throwing a fit about it, you know, and I mean in, in religion they would call that faith. When you, when you really get that, I think like it becomes this powerful tool in the arsenal. Not to say that life is going to be, isn't, isn't going to be challenging, but that you can see that when the road, when it feels like the road is falling out from beneath you, it's really rising up to meet you. When it feels like everything is fall way, it's actually falling together, you know, and all of the challenges you're facing are forging you into the person capable of being the one who has the thing that you want to have in life. And when we can grasp that, you know, we embrace life's challenges and triumphs with equal indifference and then we become a master of our life rather than the masses in life.
- [82:35]
A
You've articulated all of that so, so well. You know, obviously you've coached it, taught it many times before, but being able to articulate it as well and as clear as you did, love it. I think if anybody's listening to this, listen to that again because you made some really, really great points in there. So as we wind down a little casual, have a little fun, kind of some rapid fire questions that are never quite rapid, we'll ask him anyways. You ready?
- [83:10]
B
Sure.
- [83:11]
A
Android or Apple?
- [83:13]
B
Apple.
- [83:14]
A
Favorite swear word?
- [83:16]
B
Fuck.
- [83:18]
A
Good. I'm glad that. I'm glad that you got one. I almost expected you to be, like, one of my guests. That goes. Yeah. You know, I don't really swear. No. Nothing? No.
- [83:26]
B
Come on, bro.
- [83:30]
A
I've had a few of those. I admire those people. Kind of from a distance, maybe a little. Little. I don't get it. But that's okay.
- [83:37]
B
Everybody custom, man. They either do it out louder in their head. That's the only thing. That's the only difference. Go ahead.
- [83:44]
A
Perhaps favorite genre of music. Band song. You've got a favorite of any of those, man?
- [83:52]
B
Since moving out here to the ranch. I gotta say that, like, country folk kind of mix seems to be getting a hold of me recently. That's what all my playlists are right now on Spotify.
- [84:02]
A
Beautiful. Now, Texas. Everything's big in Texas. How much land do you have? Do you have in Texas?
- [84:07]
B
322 acres. It's a lot.
- [84:10]
A
What is that, a half section somewhere in there?
- [84:12]
B
Yeah.
- [84:13]
A
Cool. Now, have you got cattle or anything on there? Have you got any animals, livestock? What are you doing with it all? Anything?
- [84:19]
B
No, not yet.
- [84:20]
A
I mean, we're.
- [84:21]
B
Right now we're working right. Right now we're working on. On building out the foundations for us to get, like, the retreat center built out here so we don't have to. So we don't have to keep renting. But livestock and horses and goats and all that stuff. It's definitely, you know, it's on the Roadmap.
- [84:35]
A
Beautiful. Love it. Favorite movie? Do you have one?
- [84:42]
B
Braveheart.
- [84:44]
A
That's a good movie. Yeah. Do you have a pivotal book? Now, you've read a lot, so this would probably be a tough question, but do you have a book that really kind of went, wow, how and change things for you, or one that you really believe that you often recommend?
- [85:03]
B
The classic that I say, like, impacted my life most. You probably won't find this surprising would be the breakthrough experience by Dr. Demartini. One that really shifted my thinking recently is 10x is easier than 2x.
- [85:21]
A
I've not read that, but I want to. Demartini. We did breakthrough a couple of times. We also did Prophecy and a couple of his other programs. It was. Was really great work. Enjoyed it a lot. So those are. I had done what was called Hoffman Process. I don't know if you've ever come across the Hoffman Institute. And. And so we had done Hoffman many years ago, like 20 years ago at least, and then started doing the Demartini work. And as powerful as Hoffman was, it was really great for kind of. Of busting through a bunch of stuff, you know, that the early kind of things that mess us up as kids and etc. If God exists, what do you want to hear God say when you get to the gates?
- [86:04]
B
Good job.
- [86:05]
A
Good job. Nice. I want to ask this because you probably have one, maybe you won't. You'll have a lot. Favorite quote.
- [86:14]
B
The master of life knows not the difference between his work or his play, his labor or his leisure, his mind or his body. He hardly knows which is which. James Mickner.
- [86:26]
A
Wow, that's good. I've not actually heard that quote before. Okay, final question. What are you grateful for today?
- [86:35]
B
Well, this podcast has been an inspiring conversation, so that's an easy one. You know, something that's. That's. That's close to our. To our heart. You know, I've been pretty open about the fact that, like, making this transition to this new business, it's been a major challenge, and I've got millions of dollars invested, and we're still trying to figure out what our customer acquisition strategies is going to be, what exactly our model is going to be, precisely what pricing is going to be, where we're going to find margin, and all these different things that happen in a business. And I was asked recently by a friend of mine how I feel about going through all of that. And as challenging as it's been over these last. Last almost 12 months now, I would also say, like, but I'm really grateful that I hope I never lose the courage to take that shot. Yeah. So I'm grateful for the courage to take the shot.
- [87:35]
A
As you were speaking before you used the word courage, I was going to point that out. That's courage. And by the way, you're singing to the choirs, we're launching new programs still, even in our life right now, and going, is this gonna work? Is anybody even gonna pay attention? It's like, okay, here we go. Let's give it a shot. Let's do it anyways and have some fun doing. It's coming from the right place, so let's just do it, figure it out. I'm always grateful for my guests. I'm particularly grateful today for this conversation. To have met you and know that there's other crazy people in the world out there that think alike. And as much as we are unique, there are others. Like attracts like. So no surprise that you showed up for the show, and I appreciate you and I appreciate all of your insights and what you shared today. So thank you very much.
- [88:29]
B
Thank you very much, Patrick. And before I go, you know, I'd love to, if it's okay, ask your audience to, you know, drop a review A like, you know, I've listened to when my team passes me podcast suggestions, I listen to a few episodes and like just make sure there's like congruence there, you know, and it's obvious one, that you've been dedicated to this for a long time and two, that you put a lot of heart into it, into your interviews, into your guests, into making a great show. And I think it might sometimes be for the user on the other end it's an hour, hour and a half interview but for you it's a day to day labor of love. And I think people might forget, forget how important those reviews and those comments are. And so you know, I'll be leaving, I'll be leaving a review for you as well and I would encourage your audience to do the same. And then other than that man, just thank you so much for the inspiring conversation.
- [89:26]
A
Thank you ladies and gentlemen, thank you for listening. If you found value in the podcast, please take the time to rate and review and share with others. Share with your friends as it is my goal to always improve and to provide the highest value for you, the listener. If you have any comments, suggestions or questions you'd like answered, please email me@ceoraincanada.com that's ceorincanada.com I look forward to hearing from you. And until next time, Patrick O.