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The Everyday Millionaire and Mindset Matters Podcast
TEDM – Chris Naugle – Be Your Own Bank (Episode 230)
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- [00:00]
Chris Nagle
Foreign.
- [00:05]
Patrick Francie
Welcome to the Everyday Millionaire podcast. My name is Patrick Francie and I am your host. And I want to begin by saying thank you for listening. On this show, I am having conversations with seemingly ordinary individuals who have achieved some amazing and extraordinary results in both their life and business. My intention is to inspire and help you learn and grow by having my guests share their journey of how they face and overcome their challenges, but also how they celebrate their. Their many wins. And now, let's get on with this show and have a conversation with today's guest. From snowboarder to money mogul, Chris Nagle has dedicated his life to being America's number one money mentor, with a core belief that success is built not by the resources you have, but by how resourceful you can be. His success and national acclaim have come in large part to what he's learned firsthand, from seeking a better way to wealth creation and preservation than he learned growing her up. Now, Chris has built and owned 19 companies with his businesses, being featured in Forbes, ABC House Hunters, his very own HGTV pilot in 2018, and he's currently founder of the Money School and money mentor for the money multiplier. His success also includes managing tens of millions of dollars in assets in the financial services and advisory industry, and in real estate transactions. As an innovator and a visionary in wealth building and real estate. Empowers entrepreneurs, business owners, and real estate investors with the knowledge of how money works. He is a nationally recognized speaker, an author, and a podcast host. He has spoken and taught over 10,000Americans, delivering the financial knowledge that fuels lasting freedom. Love this conversation with Chris today. So insightful. So much in here to learn, listen in, enjoy. Let's get this show started. Chris Nago, welcome to the Everyday Millionaire podcast. Thank you so much for joining me.
- [02:15]
Chris Nagle
Hey, it's an honor. Thanks for having me on.
- [02:17]
Patrick Francie
Now, Chris, the way I open all of my podcasts is that, you know, your bio is impressive and interesting and it really says a lot about you. But I find that there's no better question to open with then to get a feel for you is that if I run into you and I've never met you, we've only got two or three minutes and I say, hey, Chris, good to meet you. What do you do?
- [02:41]
Chris Nagle
Yeah, I show people how to take back control of their money by teaching them how to be the bank.
- [02:46]
Patrick Francie
By how to be the bank. Okay, well, that opens up the question. Well, tell me more. What does that look like?
- [02:52]
Chris Nagle
Well, it's. It's. It's just. It's very simple, actually. It's, it's privatized banking, been around for hundreds of years. I'm not the inventor of it. I just plugged into it a long time ago, started using it myself, and then just had the opportunity to go from a student to the teacher. But it's, it's easy. If you use banks, any bank in any country, you're not in control of your money. And people always find that strange. They're like, what do you mean I'm not in control? Well, you're not.
- [03:20]
Patrick Francie
It's not even your money.
- [03:21]
Chris Nagle
It's not your money. You, you don't, you don't even read the small print on the contract that you signed when you decided to open a bank account. You see, when you take money and you put it into a bank account, you aren't in control. And when people fight me on that, I say, okay, well, let me ask you a question. Did the bank call you and ask if they could lend your money out for that 1989 Honda Civic? They didn't, did they? No, they just freely lent your money out. And in lending your money out, what the bank did is they made a nice spread. Let's just assume the bank pays. You will go high 3% interest on your money for having it in a savings account. The bank then takes that money and those little cubicles that you see every time you walk into a branch, and they lend that money out at a nice margin of profit for themselves. And we call that a spread, call it 6%. So they're making that. It's not even their money, but you gave them control of your money when you made a deposit, and they are going to use your money to make money. And you know what, if you look at the stats and you look at a, there's a website, bowerfinancial.com that literally shows you that no matter what bank you look at, banks are making between 400 and 1300% more than we are making just by controlling your money. So if you, if you can wrap your head around that, and that should upset some of your audience, then let's just change the rules of the game. That's it. So what I teach people to do is to take that control back. Now, how do you do that? Well, first we can't deposit. We got to make one change, and that's where our money goes first. So in Canada and the U.S. this is a beautiful thing. We are the only countries in the world that have this opportunity to use this vehicle to create a private banking system. And that vehicle comes from a giant mutually owned life insurance company of all come of all places. And that machine, that thing is especially designed and I'm going to preface, specially designed and engineered whole life insurance policy. Now when you think about that, I hope every one of you are thinking that's the worst place you can put your money. Because you know when I was told this, I was a financial advisor of 14 years time when I heard about that and I'm like, you know what, I think I've heard enough. Because that's the worst place you could put your money. But you see what you're not understanding is you're not understanding why you would do that. So to be your own bank, the first thing is we got to do some comparisons. Most of us, we put money in a bank and we do it for several reasons. Number one, we want liquidity of our money, we want a return on our money and interest and we want the stability and the security and the guarantees that we get from putting money into a bank, FDIC here and in the States. But then you look at an insurance company and if you go back to the origins of who pioneered this back in the day it was the Rothschilds, the Rockefellers, the Morgan's and the Stanleys, and you know, you can look at all those professions but they were all at one way or another in banking. But back then banks weren't stable just and listen, like if you don't think bank, if you think banks are stable today, you're kidding yourself. I mean just not too long ago here in the States we had a bunch of banks go insolvent and it was just by a simple run on the banks. That can happen for any bank. And that happened back in those days. So those, those wealthy families had to find a different way to do banking. And that's where they landed. The most financially secure institutions in the world are, are and always have been life insurance companies because the way they operate. So when we talk about why a bank account versus a whole life, we got to look at the things. First off, the whole life's designed and engineered for banking. So it's not like a regular life insurance policy that life insurance companies in the policies pay you a guaranteed interest rate here and in Canada, no different. And they pay you dividends because they are mutually owned. So they pass the dividend on to their policyholders. So if you look at the interest and the dividends in the return, we're right now here in the states getting between five and a half and 6.4%. I don't know a single bank account, even in the high yield interest world that pays you anything like that. I mean, do you have any up in Canada?
- [07:10]
Patrick Francie
No. Nothing. Like nothing? No, not. Nope.
- [07:13]
Chris Nagle
So then you, you go to the next level and you say okay, well what else? Well, the whole life policy, because it's considered life insurance in here in the US is where we differ a little than Canada. But in the US we benefit because it's a tax free environment. Our tax code very much favors the life insurance industry. So therefore any growth inside of a whole life, you're going to get tax free growth. In Canada it's a little different, but still very favorable. So I would say it's tax advantaged, more so than tax free. And then you have liquidity. So that's the biggest thing. Most people like you don't have liquidity in a whole life. Ah. But you can. And it all comes if the policy is designed to benefit you and give you high cash value. So now you've got a higher interest rate in a tax free environment or tax advantaged environment, you have liquidity of your money or at least a high percentage of your money. It's protected against judgments and liens and that works both, you know, countries and then also you have a death benefit that protects your family. But here's the thing, and I'll never forget it, I was in Utah snowboarding and this is where I learned about it. It was a wealthy guy that lent me money on my real estate deals and I, I asked him, I just said, you know, how do you lend all this money? And he said, why lend from my private banking? To which he went through and explained all those things to me as to why he uses this and what it was. But here's where he really got me. And this will kind of sum up why this product is the sole product used for private banking. When you put money into a whole life policy and you need access to it. In this example, he would have taken money out to lend to me on a real estate deal. Right. It's something he knew, liked and understood. When he takes the money out of his policy, he's not using his money, he's actually taking a loan from the insurance company. But it's not a loan like a bank where you need all the approvals, it's your money. So you have, let's just say you had 100 grand in a whole life policies cash value, you could borrow up to a hundred thousand. So the insurance company literally will go into their general account and Take out any percentage up to the amount you have and lend it to you without any questions. And then here's the thing. What they're essentially doing is giving you part of your death benefit while you're living. They charge you interest for that, but it's simple interest and it's lower than any bank rate, any bank loan I've seen. So, like Today, it's like 525 here in the States. But here's the most magical thing he told me. And I couldn't wrap my head around this right in the beginning, so this might kind of be difficult for some of your audience to get the first time hearing it, but he said to me, he said, when I take the money out of the policy and I give it to you, you pay me interest on that money. Okay, call it 15%. I have to give the insurance company 5% of your 15. However, my money never left the account, and in that account it's earning five and a half, six percent, compounding interest. So now I'm literally making money twice on the same dollar. And then he then continued to say, I just take the interest you pay me, and instead of putting it in a traditional bank, I just put it back in my private bank, which repays the loan, increases my spread, and allows that access or allows me access to that money over and over. So I know that was a really long answer, but effectively you're creating a banking system to take back the banking functions in your life so you don't give up all the interest to the banks and, and allow them to win. You just change the rules of the game and you do the exact same thing they do using a different vehicle that you can control.
- [10:26]
Patrick Francie
Yeah, and there's other terms for this particular. We'll call it a strategy or a tactic with the insurance. Let's walk back a little bit in this. I love this conversation, Chris, especially when it comes to banking, given what's going on in the banking world these days. You know, the, you know, the. I don't think it's event. I think it's a given. It's an eventual. Will be some version of central bank, digital currencies or.
- [10:55]
Chris Nagle
Already happening.
- [10:56]
Patrick Francie
Yeah, it's already happening in Canada as well. Most people don't even realize that that's already, it's already there. All they got to do is whatever, you know, push sand or.
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Chris Nagle
Yeah, they just passed the genius act here in the States, which basically paves the way for stable coins to be a depository in banks, in traditional banks. So it's it's here.
- [11:15]
Patrick Francie
It's here today, and it's in Canada too. They just haven't pushed the button yet. So, you know, that's. And I think that, you know, we should all be really kind of clear on why do we want to get outside the banking system. You know, and of course, whether, I'm sure you, at some level, you are aware of what they called the Freedom Convoy and the truckers in Ottawa and, and literally they froze people's accounts, they took money out of people's accounts. Like it was that day. It was like we're doing this boom. Like just crazy. I mean, forget about even why they did it and all the stories behind it.
- [11:50]
Chris Nagle
Just because it happened in Canada doesn't mean it can't happen in the States. The same exact thing will happen here, trust me.
- [11:56]
Patrick Francie
Yeah, and we have to get that now that, you know, to some that are listening. Some individuals, you know, they have more faith in our governments, they have more faith in our banking system. And the reality of it is that it's just not the case. So some will think it's conspiracy or they'll have some story wrapped around it. This is unfolding. It's what's happening. It's really the, in the context of, you know, governments wanting control, you know, banking, bank, you know, central banks wanting control, all of the things that are happening. So this takes you outside the system. This is a strategy to do that. The question if, if somebody's listening to this and go, I really love this concept. And, and I've had guests on the show talk about it and I always like. Because each guest kind of gives it a little different perspective in terms of understanding, by the way. So you, that long answer that you said you had was really great from a foundational point of view, high level understanding it. So if somebody, you know, approaches Chris today and goes, tell me more. What, what do I need to know? What do I need to do? Can I, can I scratch a check for 100 grand and get it deposited tomorrow? Like, what's, what's the kind of the process for getting something like this underway?
- [13:05]
Chris Nagle
Yeah. So, I mean, there's different paths. I mean, you, you, if you're going to use this. And it does go by many names back in the day, privatized banking is the most common, uniformly recognized name for this. But, you know, our Nelson Nash pioneered this for the, I guess, middle class in the masses. And that's called the infinite banking concepts. A lot of people know it by that. And then you know, my brand, be your own Banker. We're the largest in the, in the US for what we do. So a lot of people know this as BYOB or Be youe Own Banker. So people ask me like, well, how, what would be the next step? I always tell them, well, first off, you literally heard a two minute long explanation. Let's get you the fundamentals. Let's teach you the fundamentals. And I've got a 90 minute video that walks you through start to finish. And it walks through two different case studies. One showing you how to use your own banking system to get all the money back for every single car you'll ever buy, drive and own. And then another one, which is a major problem in either one of our countries is debt. Let me show you how we help the chiropractor get rid of $478,000 of debt in six and a half years without working harder, longer, or taking on any risk. So that's your fundamental starting place because we could sit here and go through it. But you know what, let's have you watch a 90 minute video first. And I preface 90 minutes. And some people are like, oh, that's too long, I don't have that much time. Great, then you can't change your financial future, period, End of story. So we make them watch that and then they book a call. Now on that call, it's pretty interesting. That call is not a sales call. We, we do not sell here, okay? What we do is we walk through the needs and goals of the client. What is it that we're trying to accomplish? Path debt, you know, finance, real estate, private lending, whatever it is. And once we figure that out, what we do is we mathematically because everything to me, and I'm, I'm a little different than a lot of the other people. To me this isn't conceptual anymore. It is a mathematical equation. And we've created software called the Vault that literally mathematically solves every scenario and does two, sometimes three comparisons. Like let's say you want to buy a piece of real estate that you're going to rent out. Great. Here's one way to buy it. We could buy it with a bank loan. You could buy it with cash option two. Or you could put the money into a specially designed whole life and then buy it, you know, that way using your own banking system. And we will mathematically show you the outcome. We'll show you the economic benefit. And listen, if the policy, if the, the infinite banking concept isn't mathematically the right choice, then we will tell you, don't use this for that, because it no longer has to be an opinion. It's just let the math do the work. And that's how we do business. Every single scenario is that exact same thing they learn. They then do a call. In that call, we're going to find out what the needs are and what we want to do. And then either on that call or the second call, we are going to show you the mathematics using software and just a proprietary methodology we've come up with to literally do nothing else other than here's the math. Now the decision is yours. And when you show people that this is the possibility, this is the mathematical certainty by doing this, then the next question they're going to ask is, typically, well, how do I get started? Notice we never had to sell anything because all we did is we solved the problem. And you know, you're older than I am, but you know, 48 years on this, on this planet, I've learned some things and I've learned about giving and that's one of the most important things we can do. But I've also learned that the secret to life isn't about solving our, our problems, is about solving other people's problems. And I've just gotten super clear on that.
- [16:27]
Patrick Francie
So let me, you know, I'll go a little bit deeper. I want to pull on this thread a little bit, you know, and, and that is, we talk about, you know, being able to have access to capital, but we have to at some level, whatever we call it infinite banking or whatever term we use around it, you know, with this whole life concept, what if I'm just trying to get my money out of the bank? Here's the reason I asked the question what I'm seeing more and more. So I've been, you know, educating investors how to build real estate portfolios for 25 years. What I'm seeing now more and more and talking more and more to people, Chris, is that these are mature portfolios, these are individuals that are now older. They want to exit their real estate. They don't know how to do that without tax consequences. So I'm giving you a scenario. They're trying to mitigate tax consequences and, and, or how do we exit? You know, some of them have, you know, multi, multi million dollar portfolios, 50100 million dollar portfolios, for example, and they're going, how the hell do I get out of this? Now that I'm 70 years old or 65 years old or 75 years old, they're trying to get from underneath it and selling it. Doesn't seem like a, and especially in Canada doesn't seem like a great option. So we're seeing REITs move in private REITs coming in and they're doing share swaps and those kinds of things to take on your portfolio, give you some cash, give you some shares where you're not paying the tax on that at that time, you're kind of delaying it. But does infinite banking, I use that term because I'm only, because that's what I was familiar with. Can we use it as a part of an exit strategy in, in a real estate world or any world where we're trying to get rid of an, or get rid of, liquidate an asset.
- [18:18]
Chris Nagle
But you can, but you're not going to get around the tax hit which is the biggest problem with exiting a large portfolio that you know, you've had for 10, 20 years. You know, many of the, many folks feel trapped because if they sell it they're going to just have to pay so much in taxes. So those, those swaps, share swaps or you know, the in kind exchanges. But that, that's almost a dead end. Unless you're like moving into a different use case of real estate. Maybe that, that could work. We call them 1031 exchanges here. But using the policy for that type of an exit, it's not going to really give you any economic benefit because you're still going to have to pay the piper with the tax. You know, there's no way to get the money from the real estate into the policy without triggering tax band. So you know, for, for the way you ask that question, hopefully I'm giving you the, the straightforward answer is no, that would not benefit you one bit.
- [19:01]
Patrick Francie
Yeah, and I only thought there might be a workaround from attack.
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Chris Nagle
I only wish, I only wish it.
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Patrick Francie
Was into an insurance policy. That's what maybe now once it's in.
- [19:10]
Chris Nagle
The policy, it continues to grow tax free but, or tax advantage, you know, depending on what country we're talking about. But it's just not going to, it's not going to take this thing of that, that hit. And that's a major problem right now.
- [19:20]
Patrick Francie
Yeah, but okay, so if we're dealing with the reality of the taxes are what they are, I mean, let's just say that at some level, you know, if you want to get liquid, you're going to have to sell, you're going to have to, you know, scratch the check for the tax. So then you're going to take the spoils of whatever you sold. Then if you roll it into that policy, then you have access to that capital later on in a different way. So that there is right away, I.
- [19:47]
Chris Nagle
Mean right away immediate liquidity in the first 30 days. I mean, think of it like a bank account. When your check clears, you have access to the money. No different when you put money in a policy if it's designed. Right. And I didn't say this earlier, but let me just get this out. Like a lot of people won't know how to do the policy designs the way that they have to or won't want to. Like a lot of advisors will shun away from what we do because you're going to. In order for us to design them the way we do for high early cash value and liquidity like we're talking, it requires us to take a major, major cut in our commission to the tune of anywhere between 60 and the lowest to as much as 90% cut. So there's just not a lot of advisors that want to do that. But when I got into this, like I came from the financial advisory world and I just, I just understood that the thing with this business that I'm in is scale. You just have to scale. You have to, you have to build it for scale. So that's all I did. One other thing, back to the tax thing because you know, I being that I've gotten to this level of wealth, I've had to learn a lot about taxes. I've just in the past two years, you know, I had two seven figure tax bills that I had to pay the prior last two years. And when you start seeing that and you're kind of blindsided by that, and that would be the case for some real estate investors selling a property. They kind of get blindsided by the, the reality of the taxes they have to pay. And maybe they're ready for it, maybe they're not. A lot of them will just hold back money from the sale. Well, that wasn't my story. So I've been forced to really intentionally get myself in a place of knowledge when it comes to taxes and working with some really smart people from tax attorneys to my current CPA who's more of a tax planning cpa. And you know, one of the biggest things that I think a lot of people miss is remember back earlier I said one of the most important things I've learned is giving. So private foundations. Now I don't know what they call them in Canada, probably just foundations and using them as a tax deductible way to kind of do that. You can control the money in the foundation. Now you can't use it for self gain, but you know what, if you exit a large real estate portfolio and you got to pay a bunch of tax, but you don't want to just give the money to the government because hopefully most of your audience doesn't think that that's smart, that just, hey, the government's great. Let's just give them my money. They're going to do a great thing with it. I think we can all agree that's not the case. So let's just say we could keep more of that money and not and control it and do good in the world with it, with whatever we believe good is the private foundation really does it change the game for, I mean, it really changed our perspective. It changed how we look at everything. Like we put a lot like up to 50% of our income into our private foundation and then we do things like donate money for animal rescues and animal shelters and human trafficking causes that we believe in, in my daughter's school and building a building in our, my daughter's school. So think about all those things. Like we're personally involved with them. We, we literally feel like engage them and control them. Now are any of those going to benefit us financially? Not really, no. But you know what, we're just doing that. And that money that we're doing it with, here's the way you got to look at it. It wasn't our money. It wasn't, it was the government's money. We just got. We found a little loophole in the tax code that allowed us to then control our money. Even though we can't use it to go buy a Porsche or buy, you know, buy a bigger house, we get to control it and we get to do good with it. Instead of giving the government the money and letting them do bad with it, I think is probably the theme. So that was one of the most important things. Now there's a lot more to that. But just starting there, that, that I think can be a fundamental shift for a lot of people when they're exiting a large business or a large real estate portfolio. If they start looking at a private foundation being set up before the exit, it will give them an avenue to control the funds, get the tax deductions that they're looking for to offset that and still feel good about it and then go off and do really amazing things.
- [23:40]
Patrick Francie
So when we look at this, this concept and understanding that, you know, when I look at demographics, so you're young, you started your process much younger. Where Maybe at some point in your life you were just making a monthly contribution to, to this in terms of what you were putting in.
- [23:59]
Chris Nagle
Most of my policy premium deposits are monthly still because that's how my cash flow works.
- [24:04]
Patrick Francie
Got it. So is it a case of start early and that's the better way to go? The reason I asked the question is that we all are, or most are getting very clear on the wealth transfer that's taking place. You know, whether that be, you know, boomer parents passing on and, or boomer parents writing checks, you know, whatever the story is, there's wealth transfer that is happening. And if somebody, okay, we'll use myself as an example. Whatever. I mean, somebody my age, okay, so my parents pass, they scratch a check or their estate pays me whatever I'm left in that will, and we'll use a hundred grand just as a number. If I want to take that 100 grand now, I don't have to be in Canada. I don't have to pay tax on that now. I want to put that money away. I don't want to use it right away for whatever reason. And I don't want to put it in the bank because I don't feel that it's safe in the bank. I don't like the fact that, you know, I can't go withdraw 10 grand or 20 grand in a heartbeat anymore. You can't walk into a bank and say, give me 20 grand, cash doesn't happen anymore. And so I say, okay, well, I'm going to take that 100 grand. I don't want to put it in a bank. Is this a suitable perhaps avenue for.
- [25:20]
Chris Nagle
Me to use 100%? So that would be called a dump in premium deposit. So there's, when we build them, there's really two avenues that the money's going to go in. One is the traditional base of the whole life, which is like a normal whole life policy. And then the other is, is a special rider. And we don't need to get into the weeds about it. But that rider is like depositing money in a bank account. You're going to give it to the insurance company, they're going to put it in their general account. You're going to have access to usually about 96%. And again, that might be slightly different depending on carrier and, you know, country, but we'll call it 96 for this. You have access to 96% of that money immediately. Okay. That you put in. But that money now starts earning a guaranteed interest rate. And here's the difference. Like you know, some of you, you know, are probably thinking right now we're in a higher interest rate cycle. So you're like, hey, I'm getting 3, maybe 4% of my bank account. That's the day, you know, here in the States, Jerome Powell has already kind of said, you know, the Fed has said we're probably going to start lowering rates in September. So in September, you know, you're getting a pay cut, end of story. With the contract that you have with the insurance company, that guaranteed interest rate and let's call it 3%, that's a pretty standard number, is guaranteed for the rest of your life. It never changes. So that's already better. So like, when you think about the options, you got 100 grand from this estate, what am I going to do with it? Put it into a bank, a high yield savings, maybe a brokerage account. But that's a lot of risk. And you're just remember where we're at in the cycle of, of the markets today. I, I know a lot about that, but I don't want to go down that rabbit hole. You know, that's a dangerous play. You know, or maybe government bonds, you can look at all these things. But you know what, when you run the math again back to mathematics, putting the money in the policy is going to give you the same equivalent return, you know, after tax of say a government bond, okay. And that's probably the safest place you could put your money to keep liquidity and get a good return on it. So when you think about that, okay, if I can get the same return in both of these and I can have the same liquidity, actually maybe even more in the policy than a bond because you got to wait for maturities and things of that nature in some cases, but then you got a death benefit. So you're creating a legacy for your family to leave them in a better place and you're providing protection of that asset so it's not low hanging fruit if you get sued. So there's, there's a lot of reasons why this would make the most sense. Plus now let's just say somebody's like, yeah, but I'm not really okay just making, you know, 4, 5, 6% on my money, I want to make more. Great, put it into the policy immediately deploy that money into the investment that you know, like and understand. And now you're making money twice in the longer, the more time that goes by. So you'd mentioned start early, of course. I mean, we could say, you know, when's the best Time to plant a Trio. Oh, yeah, 20 years ago. But really the best time is now, you know, whether you're 68 or. Because, like, we have lots of clients in their, their mid, late 60s. When we get into the 70s, it gets, gets tough to make it. Pencil. Let's just call it that. But 60s, it's not a problem at all. And you're always going to be getting further ahead because, listen, like, the most important thing I think everybody's got to wrap their head around is, is who's going to be in control of their money. And that. That is a very big concern that everybody needs to start thinking about now that they're not. They're not. But then you heard about, you know, that stuff that happened that you mentioned with the truck. You know, the whole. The freedom convoy. Yeah, that. And we've had situations here. Listen, like here in the States, if you walk into a bank, let's say you got 100 grand in the bank, okay? You walk into that bank and you just want your 100 grand back because you're, you're going to go buy. You got a deal to buy a piece of real estate and you can close today.
- [28:46]
Patrick Francie
Not a chance.
- [28:47]
Chris Nagle
Not a chance in hell. You can't get that 100 grand. They're going to tell you, oh, well, I'm sorry, but we need a couple days notice and this and that, and you're going to have to fill this form out. They'll probably even ask you, well, what are you using the money for? It's like, is that any of your business? It's my money. It's not. That's the problem. It isn't your money anymore. That's why they're asking you that question. It's the bank's money that you gave to them, and they're controlling it.
- [29:10]
Patrick Francie
Yeah. You know, just to your point, and we go off on a tangent, but literally today I had to go to the bank, I had to do a. A bank draft. It was a quarter million bucks doing a bank draft. And the hoops I had to jump through. And then ultimately the question, what do you. What's this money for? I go, because I need to transfer it over to this person's account. Like, it was like, why would you even ask me that question?
- [29:40]
Chris Nagle
But we didn't. Folks, we didn't talk about this before we went live. Like, this is totally organic. And he's literally saying what I just said.
- [29:46]
Patrick Francie
Yeah, it's exactly what happened. And so. And that was on a large amount. So I go, okay, well, Maybe, like, I don't, I don't agree with any of it, by the way, but we're starting to hear more and more people walking in going, want, you know, five grand? And they're literally having like, somebody's filling out a form. Of course, the jokes are walking into the bank and going, well, what do you need this money for? And they're saying out for a sex change and, you know, penis enlargements. And they're being really sarcastic and doing. But the point of it, I mean, it's a valid point, like, why the hell it's my money, I put it in the bank, it's there. Why can't I get it? And the reality is they don't have a lot of cash on hand. And, and so 100 grand in cash is. Forget it. It's not going to happen.
- [30:26]
Chris Nagle
Not gonna happen. Not gonna happen.
- [30:28]
Patrick Francie
So. Interesting. And I, and I. The reason I'm curious about. I know listener listeners will be interested is again, within the wealth transfer, however that money's coming and people are struggling. Where do I put my money? You know? Okay, do I want to put it in equities? Gosh, that seems a little risky these days, especially right now. Yeah, exactly. So bitcoin. Maybe I should have some. Maybe precious metals. Well, that's pretty safe. You know, we look at what's going on with gold and silver right now, for example. I mean, those are all outside the system, so they do make sense. But there's, there's more inherent risk even in the precious metals. As much as, you know, gold and silver, gold particularly is considered money. The only true money, you know, party, you know, no counterparty risk, etc. You know, to me, this is a, a really viable, and not only a viable option, it is actually an option that really makes sense from a low risk but still reasonable return given what's going on in the world. That's kind of how I view it.
- [31:34]
Chris Nagle
Not even low risk. It's no risk. It's. It's truly like one of the last great guarantees, because it is. And insurance companies are one of the few financial institutions in the world that can provide that word, a guarantee. And actually that will fulfill on it because of how they operate. And, you know, here's another thing I love that you brought up, like bitcoin and all those other things, gold, silver. So let me pose a question. Like most people would be like, yeah, I would. I invest in all those different things. Okay, so what if we just. What if instead of investing in those. Okay. What we did first is we took that same dollar, we put that money into a policy immediately, in the first 30 days after your policy was issued. And granted, it's going to take, you know, 30 days or so to get through underwriting. So your policy is issued. Now that that money's in there, you immediately take that money out and you buy gold. You invest in bitcoin and all these things you know, like and understand. So now all we did, we interrupted, we just changed one thing and that was where the money went first, same dollars, and we redeployed them second. Now here's what happens, okay? And this is where you have to kind of understand you got to be patient. Wealth building is not a race. And people that are raising to wealth, we call them rich. And guess what? They are next, poor. So there's a big difference between rich and wealthy, okay? And any wealthy person could explain those key differences. But now you've got that money in this policy earning uninterrupted, compounding interest. Look up compound interest. Study what Albert Einstein said and you'd understand that it's one of the most powerful things and it will never stop compounding ever to the day you die. But now you've got money in the investments that you know that, that you liked, the gold, the silver, the bitcoin. But now your money is earning twice for you. Now there's a variable that we have to factor in and that is the cost of capital. So the insurance company does not let you borrow from their general account for free or let you borrow your death benefit for free. There is a cost. So we have to roll that cost in and say, okay, where does that pencil? Where does that, the math work? And usually it's year two or year three is where you're going to break even. So some people would say, well, that's stupid. Why would I do that if I, if I am upside down for three years? Well, if you were smart, you would understand that you had to give a little for three years, right, to make this make sense. But then for the rest of your life. So just do the math. How long do you think you're going to live? How many years is that for the rest of your life? There will not be a day or a year that goes by that you don't have more money than you did the day before, guaranteed inside the policy. So now all of a sudden, the policy starts compounding, growing and growing, growing. Now your investments in bitcoin or gold or silver is going to go up and down, but it's still growing too. So now you're making money twice, and that will continue. And now you've exceeded the cost of capital. Okay? But then if you sold gold and then you just take the money and put it back in the policy, well, that pays the loan back. So now you've zeroed out, but you're still so much further ahead because of that compounding. And the way I always explain this, and let me just go one layer deeper, because this is. This I think will make a lot of sense. And I think one of the things I do really well with this is you can get complicated with it in advance with it, but I'm very good at keeping it simple. So let's talk about something that almost every person on here either has or knows somebody that has, and that is debt. But let's go to credit card debt, because that's the most common. And here we got a major problem with credit card debt. So most, most credit cards that are out there today are north of 20%. So let's just. Let's call 20% the number. Now you got a Visa that you owe $5,000 to, and you're being charged 20% and you're giving them 200amonth. Okay? Just use those numbers. Okay, so you got a Visa $5,000 owed, 200amonth, you're giving them 20%. All right, so we got that. Now over on this side, in your bank account, let's just say that you've got $5,000. So today you could take the five grand from your bank account and you could pay that Visa card off and you could be done with it. To which most people would just rack the Visa back up because they're just not conditioned enough to know how. How to handle money. So let's just assume this. Let's say we took the money from the bank account, we ran it into a policy, okay? We structured it for this particular purpose to pay off debt. And then when the policy is issued, we take the five grand and we pay off Visa. Same thing we just were going to do with the bank account. And we run the math on both ways. We pay off Visa, but now we take the 200 that used to pay Visa in. In our bank account, we change the bill pay. Instead of saying Visa, it says your name. We'll just use Chris Noggle. Okay? So now bill pay every month pays Chris Naugle $200. And that Chris Noggle takes that $200 and puts it back into the policy and recycles and recaptures the same dollars. So let's just Talk about that. Think of a circle. Okay, in the beginning, we put five grand into a policy on the left side of the circle. We then took a loan from the policy and we move it around the top part of the circle and we put it in, we use it to pay off Visa. Now we've completed the top part, but we're going to close the circle. We're going to take $200 a month that we gave Visa dollar for dollar because you were used to paying them that. And we're going to pay that back to your, we're going to call it your private bank because you got to think like a bank. The policy. So now $200 a month hits the policy. Now every month when $200 hits that policy, you have $200 available the very next day, just like you would a bank account. You were recapturing and recycling 20% because you were giving away $200, which was 20%. You're now paying yourself $200. You're making 20%, but you took no risk to make 20%. Now here's the other thing that is happening behind the scenes that I didn't get into earlier. That $200 is reducing the $5,000 loan you took from the insurance company 100. Right? So if you understand math and you understand how this works and calculators do this, you are reducing the interest, you're paying the apr. So in your mind you're like, well, the insurance company's charging me 5%, so I'm giving them 5%. Wrong. After the course of one year of doing this, you're probably giving the insurance company something like 3.94%. And after two years of doing this, if it did, if you didn't pay the Visa off or the, the policy loan back, you're probably more like 2%. So you're, you're actually every single month reducing the amount of interest and increasing the spread. Because the other thing on the other side, that five grand it was in the policy never stopped earning. So next year it's earning interest and dividends on five grand, plus the interest from the prior year and compounding and going faster and faster. So one is going up, the other is going down. You lost no liquidity in this whole mix. Zero. You actually took back liquidity because the $200 you were given, Visa, you couldn't use that, but now you got access to it. So what I just showed you in that little circle thing was exactly what I teach every single day. But all you just did is you took back the banking function in your life. In doing so, you effectively sort of made 20%. We can't say you made 20%. You recaptured 20% is the legal way. And you recaptured the liquidity of that money while never losing the opportunity to earn on all $5,000 of that money. That is why the wealthiest families do this and have done this. And this is why, you know, we've had so much success, because it just logically makes sense and mathematically makes sense.
- [38:32]
Patrick Francie
Well, I was going to say, I mean, at the end of the day, it's math. You know, that. You know why I love this kind of a conversation on the show is because, you know, people listening, if they just take some time to further educate themselves to understand the options, then they're not paying the 20% on a credit card, and that's interest only. And, you know, they're. They're just not getting ahead. I mean, literally, they're not getting ahead. So this is an opportunity and an option for people to literally negate that debt within the credit card and actually have some gains and start to get ahead. Because as you know, and we see it's happening, really, both Canada and the U.S. those credit card debts are going up. They're going up because people are struggling, but they're never, ever getting ahead. Even if they've got a second or third job, all the things that go on, they're just not getting ahead. And this gives them an opportunity and an option to actually get ahead. And I. That's why it's so important. So I really appreciate the explanation. That was great, by the way. Yeah.
- [39:36]
Chris Nagle
And I was just so passionate about, like, you know, there's a lot of things we teach, but, like, debt part is the biggest thing, because I used to be heavy in debt and I felt trapped. I felt like I was like part of this, like, you know, slavery thing where I just couldn't find a way out. And the way out was so simple, but I had to be shown it and then I had to actually do it. And in today's world, what we. We did is just created a software that is like an operating system for a computer. Right. Because, like, this is so new to some people to hear this. It's so simple because like, everybody, I'm sure listening to this just like you was like, yeah, actually that makes perfect sense, you know, but then in the application of it, what happens is because we're so ingrained in, in this conformity world we live in where we just do what other people do and we kind of just do what we're told, I don't know why, but I think it's conditioning, I truly do that when people learn about this in the beginning, they're really excited. It makes all the sense. They get it started, they start using it, but then all of a sudden something happens. They drift and then they forget about the recapturing, right? The 200 that they used to give Visa that they're now recapturing. They just start going out to eat or they go out and have a couple of drinks and, and that 200 like, ah, I'll eventually get back into my policy. I don't have to pay the policy loan back and you don't. The insurance company will never ask you for the, the five grand back. They don't care if you ever pay it because they're making 5% on that money or whatever the interest rate is. So for them, they don't care. And unlike a bank, they don't require, require you to repay the debt because remember I said all you're doing is borrowing your death benefit. And the insurance company is very smart. They know you're going to die and they know when you're going to die. So all they do is they just say, okay, no problem. We're literally just going to collect that $5,000 that we loaned you from our general account the day you die. We're just going to take it off of your death benefit and we're made whole. But we made 5% on that money the whole time. Like that's a huge win for the insurance company, but it's a huge loss for you. So we just, we said, because we've done this so thousands, about 8,000 clients in the U.S. alone. And we also have business in Canada, but we'll just talk us. And we saw so many people that were, were off to the best start and they started just drifting back and they started not being an honest banker and they started not repaying their policies. And we said there's something missing and all it was is they, they need just. We live in a world of GPSs. Okay, that's simply put your phone, your GP is your GPS, right? You can get anywhere you want in the world just by punching in a coordinate. And the GPS takes us there. Well, that's what we've come to, to be used to, right? So to think of banking like we're. Because all I'm doing is teaching all of you banking. That's all this is. This is literally banking 101. To get people to bank. All we had to do is create the GPS for banking. Turn left, turn right, stop. You know, do, do all these things and get them to the destination. And we literally created just this revolutionary software kind of by accident. And it's been a two year journey of creating tools that solve different things and saying, hey, we just need to make this work for everybody. And that's all we did. And then in doing that, what we found is kind of a mistake. We found out mathematics are very simple to understand in banking and we just showed that in the software. Like, here's the math, this is how much more money you get to keep. Here's how much money you were going to give away. Which way do you want to go? Follow the gps. So it's so simple. You know, I want to say one other thing too, because we had a really great conversation, you know, before about fasting, you know, your intermittent fasting in mind. And you told me some things I never knew, you know, about like stem cells and, and regenerative. Like we talk about Achilles tendons tearing and I'm an ex pro snowboarder Achilles, if you, if you tear that you're, you're in, your career was over. I saw this happen. But you were telling me an example of somebody that went on a, I believe a 70 fast, and it started healing itself. That's mindblowing. And some people, when they hear that right now they're thinking, oh, that's not true, but it actually is. So I, I want to parallel that. Okay. Fasting, it's hard in the beginning, isn't it? It sucks. You know, you get dizzy.
- [43:35]
Patrick Francie
Takes discipline.
- [43:36]
Chris Nagle
Oh my gosh, takes so much discipline. It takes fighting through that hunger, takes fighting through the mind, like telling you you're doing something wrong. But then all of a sudden, I don't know why or how, but all of a sudden it's like one day it just all of a sudden is easy and it just keeps getting easier. And then I almost find it hard to eat before noon. I don't know why, but my brain has now shifted. I want you to take that. Okay? And, and we know that the most of you listening know the, the benefits of fasting. Or at least if you did just did a Google search with AI today, you'd learn very quickly all the benefits of, of fasting. We know it's good. We also know it's hard. So with the infinite banking concept, this stuff we're talking about in the beginning, it's going to be like fasting, it's going to be hard. Your brain's Going to fight you. You're just going to have those. Those things that tell you this isn't right. This isn't right, but it is. And you know, Will. Will Rogers, love him or hate him, he said something that's profound, and he said the biggest problem with people is not what they don't know. He said, the biggest problem with people is what they think that they know. That just ain't so. That is, to be honest, the truest statement I've ever heard in my life. Because I think about that.
- [44:54]
Patrick Francie
It's a big statement. It's a true. Yeah, I mean, it's a famous quote, but it's. Yeah, that's just the truth.
- [45:00]
Chris Nagle
When I first heard about this as a financial advisor, 14 years, I was at top of my game, like, crushing it. And I heard about this, and the first thing I thought to myself is, no, no, this is scam. It doesn't work that way. There's no way, you know, because I'm an advisor, I know everything. But, you know, see, there we go. Will Rogers, right? The problem wasn't what I didn't know. It was what I thought I knew. It just wasn't so. And that's what stops people. That literally is what keeps people in line and keeps them poor or keeps them struggling or keeps them in financial slavery. Because literally, like, you could be, like, one step away from changing your entire financial future for. For not just you, but for your children as well. And it took changing one thing like that is a hard thing for most people to, like, comprehend in the beginning, but just like fasting, you just do it a little bit. You just get persistent and consistent. And then all of a sudden, you get to a point where you start looking at everybody else and you're like, are you an idiot? Like, how can you not understand this? Like, literally, you've gone so far down the rabbit hole now that you're just like, everybody else is an idiot, and this is the only way. Why can't they see it? That has been the hardest thing for me. And not just in. In what I teach and what I do, but, like, I can. I can help everybody. But I've had to come to the realization, and you, I'm sure, have had to do this in. In your profession. We have to come to the realization that we can only help those that want help.
- [46:27]
Patrick Francie
100%.
- [46:28]
Chris Nagle
Hard thing.
- [46:29]
Patrick Francie
Yeah, it is. You know, in. I often use the quote that we can't want something for you more than you want it for yourself. And that is the challenge, especially when we're built the way we're built where we want to be that contribution. We want to make a difference. We want to help people achieve those results. And it's like, okay, well, you know, I can't do it for you, you know, and you have to want it, and I can't want it more for you than you want it, so, you know, carry on, or. Yeah, it's.
- [46:57]
Chris Nagle
But it's hard, right? Like, knowing what. You know, like, let's say you were with somebody and they were in chronic pain and. And these things, and. And you know, that they could be healed by just. Let's just call it just fasting, like, for 72 hours. You know, that in 72 hours, the possibility of them not being in that much pain is. Is probably close to 100.
- [47:16]
Patrick Francie
Yeah.
- [47:17]
Chris Nagle
Then you know that they're not going to do it. Do you take the time to try to follow them around and convince them, or do you just move on to somebody that needs help and. And that. It's almost like a.
- [47:27]
Patrick Francie
And wants to be helped and is actually coachable?
- [47:29]
Chris Nagle
I have not yet come to grips with that. I just haven't and I don't know if I ever will. I. But it definitely. You talk about stress and how stress is really bad, and I will say, you know, that's probably one of my biggest stresses, because I have the answer. And I know how people can change their lives. The thing that keeps them stuck, the thing that get, you know, leads to more divorce than anything else. I know I can solve the problem, but yet can't because they don't want to change.
- [47:57]
Patrick Francie
They don't want. They want. They want their circumstances to change, but they don't want to change that.
- [48:02]
Chris Nagle
And they don't want to put any work into it.
- [48:04]
Patrick Francie
They don't want to put the effort in.
- [48:05]
Chris Nagle
I don't know how we arrived on that. Sorry, I went down that rabbit hole, but.
- [48:08]
Patrick Francie
No, it's a great rabbit hole. I love it. I love it. And all I did was ask you, what do you do, Chris? And so there we go. So it's awesome. I think it's brilliant. But I'm going to diverge because I want to go back to a couple things that you said, you know, and this comes back to, you know, you were a pro snowboarder. Tell me a little bit about that. Because, you know, this goes back to understanding and are you coachable? And anybody who's played sports of really any level, but certainly at a high level, a competitive level, pro level, you have to be very Coachable. You have to be willing to have somebody judge, assess, correct, do all the things and when you were on your, you know, take. So let's go back to a little bit of your. Your career as a pro snowboard. When did that start? How did that come to be? What was that all about?
- [48:56]
Chris Nagle
Yeah, so I went pro at 19 years old, and I was an AM before that. And it was. It was an interesting journey because I live in Buffalo, New York now. Some of you won't know where that is. I mean, we're almost Canadian here. So I will say that is a positive. I mean, I can be across the border in literally 50, 15 minutes in traffic.
- [49:15]
Patrick Francie
Yeah.
- [49:16]
Chris Nagle
Just right across the bridge and I'm there. But being in Buffalo, we don't really have mountains, you know, so when I got the idea to be that I wanted to be a pro snowboarder, I watched a VHS tape. Craig Kelly was the pro that I watched. And. And I just was so caught up in this. This thing. It was so news back in the 80s. And, you know, I was a skateboard kid, and I saw this and I'm like, I have to have that. And I. I've always been a visionary. I've always been a dreamer. And from that moment, I. I did nothing but draw it out. You know, I knew nothing about vision boards. I was just a kid. Vision boards and everything. But here's how it all began. I got a snowboard. One Christmas, my mom bought me a used board because we didn't have any money. So she got me this board. And I remember I couldn't afford. And my family couldn't afford to go to the resorts because even, even back then, you know, which if I told you what tickets were, probably 20 bucks or 30 bucks, for sure, 200 today. So, you know, it's all relative. But, you know, we couldn't afford to go to the resort. So how was I going to be a pro snowboarder if I can't go to the resort to practice? Well, I had to get creative, and here's how I did it. So by my school, there was this country club, and it was called the Lockport Country Club. And it was built in a ravine. And I. We people go there and sled. But in sledding, I was like, I could snowboard down this hill, but it's not real long. And I. I kind of learned how to snowboard and get, you know, the edge control on that hill. But I. I learned something else is to be a pro, I had to learn how to jump well, on that hill. Now, the sliders used it for jumps, but they would build, like, kind of a little jump out of a sand trap going down the hill. And what was neat about it and what I took recognition of is, you know, these sliders would come down, they'd hit this jump, they'd err on their sled, and then they'd still land on a downward slope, which was just like everything I see in the videos. So I'm like, okay, I'm gonna go off over onto the side where the sliders aren't. I'm gonna build a jump out of this sand trap, and I'm just gonna keep hiking the hill and doing this. And I did, and it was perfect. So what I would do is I would go to school and I would fasten. I would basically think about snowboarding all day and draw the pictures of everything, and I'd make lists. Like, you know, some people would make a list for whatever they did, but I would make a list of all the tricks I wanted to learn. Mom would drop me off at the country club right after school, and I knew I had an hour and a half to two hours before it got dark and before I heard that dreaded Hong Kong that my mom was there. Hurry your butt up. So I would get there, and, you know, I'd either have to rebuild my jump or build a new one. I'd rush through that, and I'd start running up the hill and just hitting it. And I. And I had it in my mind of exactly what I wanted to look like. So I would just tweak little things all these times, and I would. Sometimes I would just work on one trick that day. And I just kept doing this over and over and over again. I was all by myself. Some of my friends started joining me. We started kind of pushing each other, but that is how I did it. Now, there was another pivotal point. I then was, at 16, I had a car, and I could go to the resort and I could afford because I had a job. But I didn't, at that point, believe that it was possible to go pro, even though that was what I wanted. You know, I lived in Buffalo, and I had enough people telling me to conform to what they thought, and that was, you can't go pro living here. You'd have to move. And I didn't want to move. I. I liked where I was, and I was an only child, and my mom loved having me there. So one day, I had heard about these two guys, Blair and Shane. They were huge burden riders. I saw them in the videos and I had heard rumors that they were from this area not far from where I lived called Orchard Park. They were New York Buffalo guys, and they were coming back to Buffalo for this new snowboard park, that kissing bridge built. And they were going to be riding and filming and it was, it was kind of in the paper. So I took school off that day. I was there and I was like following them or down the hill. I kind of felt weird because I was like, you know, totally stalking these two guys. Well, Blair literally stopped me when we're at the bottom of the hill and he said, hey, I see you're following us. Do you want to ride with us? It was the greatest thing ever. But the long story or the finish up of this story is that one moment opened up a whole new universe in my mind. And it said it is possible because these guys did it, which means I can do it. And then from there, that wasn't a barrier in my mind. It wasn't a wall in my mind saying, this can't happen because of where you live. They did it. And, and then I, I go back and I think of the movie Rad, which was completely influential in my life. And I don't know if you know what that movie was. Was a BMX movie back in 86. It movie changed my life because of the sheer persistence that Crew Jones, the main actor, had to. To win. And then there was another movie called Rudy and Rudy, everybody told me couldn't do it. Everybody except football, wasn't it?
- [53:52]
Patrick Francie
I think football player.
- [53:54]
Chris Nagle
And I've actually met Rudy. I had Rudy come speak at my event. But amazing human being. But in that movie, you. You find out he had one person that believed him and it was the janitor. And sometimes in life, all you need is one person to believe in you. Even if the whole world is against you. The whole world says you can't do it Takes one. And that was, that was how I did it. And that was like that whole early years that paved the way for everything else in my life, to be honest with you.
- [54:24]
Patrick Francie
You're raised. You. If I heard you, you said you were raised single mom.
- [54:28]
Chris Nagle
Yes, well, I had. My dad is still alive today. My dad when I was growing up was an alcoholic. And mom and dad divorced. And my mom got the house in the divorce. And I live in pretty much was raised by her. I mean, I still saw my dad a lot. My dad is a good guy, you know, just. It was just. Yeah, you. You can figure the rest out, but you Know, my mom raised me. She. She was my everything, my unconditional one. And my mom believed in me. And I didn't get into this part, but when I was 16, I started a clothing line in my mom's basement because I. I needed freedom of time. So I couldn't work at the rest. I worked at a restaurant. But then they kept wanting me to work weekends. And I'm like, I got a snowboard. Like, so. So I quit. And I had this idea that I'd been thinking about, about printing shirts with my art teacher, Mr. Mahalski, and then selling the shirts out of my backpack to be able to make money so I could go snowboard. And I told my mom. She was fully supportive. But a year after that, when I was selling my store, my clothing to a bunch of different stores, I had this experience at this one shop where the guy that owned the shop bought my clothes. And then he said, hey, do you want to go ride? This is at noon. It was like 11 o' clock or so in the morning. And I'm looking around, I knew the shop was open till 5 or 6. And I'm like, well, who's going to come in? He's the only one here. So I asked him, I just said to him, I said, so do you have someone coming in? I mean, how are we going to go ride? Or when do you want to go ride? He said, no, I own the shop. I'll just close it. We'll go snowboard. Come on. And like at that point, I'm like, oh my God, you can just close the doors. And it just changed me. And I'm like, okay, that's what I need. I need my own shop. So I. I spent almost the better part of a year from 16 to 17, writing business plans. I mean, think about it, like outside of Byron, you know, you just, if any of you follow, anything with Trump is doing, but Byron, literally, I guess all summer long, wrote business plans. And he's, I think 16. So I wrote business plans at 16 years old for Fat Man Board Shops. This the store that I was going to open. And I got turned down by everybody. My whole family said it was stupid. My dad said, get a job at the factory because you're never going to do make it with this. But my saw me, you know, trying really hard. And we got an opportunity with one bank. They were going to give me a loan, but they needed collateral. I didn't even know what collateral was. And when he told me, I'm like, well, I got a KX125. A really sick baseball and football card collection and, like, a couple BMX bikes.
- [56:46]
Patrick Francie
How.
- [56:47]
Chris Nagle
What do you say? They're like, no, we're thinking more like real estate. 17 years old, I didn't have real estate, but my mom had the house. She got in the divorce. And just to kind of let everybody know, people ask me all the time, how come you're still in Buffalo? Because I could have went anywhere in the world. And I said, because my mom, you know, like, I owe it to my mom because she put her house, our house, and she always called it our house on the line as collateral for that loan for me to open Fat Man Board shops in November of 1994. So I owed it to her. And I've remained in Buffalo against my own will issue sometimes, because sometimes you just, you know, you just got to do for others. And she did for me.
- [57:27]
Patrick Francie
You know, it's interesting that your thought process back then was you needed more time to snowboard. So there's a couple things that come out of that. You know, the mental state, which is, you know, we often ask the question or we hear the question, what's your why? You know, and. And, you know, why do we want to invest in real estate? Or why do we want to do this, that or the next thing. What's your why? Yours was, I want to snowboard, I want to be. I want to go pro. That's a pretty big why you. It's interesting, though, that you said you needed more time. You were trying to do something that freed up and gave you more time. Which did that translate at the time to money, or was it really you looking at, I need to figure out, Yes, I need to figure out how to pay for my snowboarding, but I need more time.
- [58:13]
Chris Nagle
You know, at that stage in my life, I didn't open a business because I thought I was going to be wealthy doing it. I literally just needed to make enough money to be able to pay for gas in my car, pay for my insurance. We didn't have cell phones back then and be able to ride and get a season pass at the resort. So my financial needs were pretty minimal. And I just wasn't motivated by money at that present point. I was motivated by becoming a pro snowboarder. And I didn't even want to become a pro snowboarder because they got paid a lot of money. I wanted to become a pro snowboarder because that was just the most ultimate thing anyone could do to me. You know, others would be like, really? To me, that was like There was nothing greater. And when you think about it, like everything we do in life, you might say you're doing it to make more money. I will tell you, being somebody that is, has gotten to a very significant, you know, level of wealth, I will tell you, money has an incredible declining value. The return on. How do you say this? The, the diminishing value of money. Most won't understand this until they have money. And I don't know where that level is. Is it 2 million, 3 million? I really don't know. But at a certain point, money, again, isn't as important. It's, it's what you do with it. It's, it's. Money becomes a tool, like a shovel in the garage. You just want to get good at using the tool, but you want to get good at using the tool. For reasons that, when I was in my 20s or 30s, would have made no sense. I actually would have said, you're an idiot. You know, like, you want the cars and all that stuff, but when you have the cars and you have all these things, like, money just takes on a different form. So take that back to when I was a kid. Money was just a tool, truly, just like it is today. To me, back then, it was a tool. It was a tool that allowed me to fulfill my dream. That was it. The clothing line, the shop, like, all of those things. Like, I did them to make money, but I did them because they were in line with who I wanted to be in my worthy idea. I was trying to fulfill on. And that was it. And yes, and then it became more about money later. And, you know, then when you go through a recession or two and you don't have any money again, you're like, well, it's all about money. But anyway, that's for another day.
- [60:21]
Patrick Francie
Yeah, it's interesting what I. So when you look at your kind of desire, you're wanting to be a snowboarder. I'm just curious, you know, did you have a desire to compete? Did you have a desire to be at the top of some podium? I'm, I'm wondering, you know, or was it just the thrill and the excitement.
- [60:38]
Chris Nagle
Of snowboarding and it was definitely competing in those early years. Yeah, I just loved it. I thrived on it. I, I, I. There's just something special. You get to a contest and, you know, there's all these people, and, you know, you're kind of looking at them and sizing them up and be like, can I beat them? Are they better? And are they not? And then you start Riding, you're watching everybody and it becomes a whole, like, game. Really. You're watching them and you're like, ah, no competition. Oh, that guy's really good. Okay, what tricks are, is he doing? And you try to, you know, you're planning on all this behind the scenes, and then, you know, you get your two or three runs and, and you, you've literally got almost a plan. It's like the art of war. Like, you in, in the practice moments, which maybe it's an hour, you build this whole war chest of tricks, which is your, your arsenal that you're going to use to win the game. And that's, that was the biggest thrill. And then after that, it just, it's probably a little ego thing. You know, when you start winning, people start recognizing you. And then, you know, when you go am like, you start getting stuff for free and then you want to really start promoting the brand. So it becomes about, like, marketing and you learn that. And then after that you go pro and then you're getting a paycheck. But more specifically, it's not even about the paycheck because even when I was pro, I still didn't really care too much about money. Like, I had a nice car, I had an Audi back then, which, you know, snowboarding allowed, but I, I could travel anywhere in the world on somebody else's dime. And when they called and said, hey, we want you for a photo shoot out in Colorado, or we want you for photo shoot up in, you know, bald face bc, you just go, not a, not a care in the world. You just, your bags are actually packed and you just go, there's nothing better than that.
- [62:18]
Patrick Francie
And doing what you love to do.
- [62:19]
Chris Nagle
And doing exactly what you love. It didn't matter what hotel I stayed at. Like today I'm like, oh, you know, where are we going to stay? We stayed at Ritz. You know, like, things are different. But back then it was like, whose floor am I sleeping on? I wonder if I could sleep on his floor. You know, you would literally get in your car and you drive all night long to Vermont to compete the next day, not knowing where you're going to stay, not knowing how you're, where you're going to eat, not knowing anything. He just figured it out. And that was the coolest part about the whole thing.
- [62:46]
Patrick Francie
So I often ask the question, you know, of guests, you know, was it nature or nurture? Because you not only were competitive in the snowball world, snowboard world, you. There's an entrepreneurial side of you. I mean, at some point, you went entrepreneurial, down that path because you wanted that time. You're trying to figure out how to have the time to snowboard and pay for it. And so you go on an entrepreneurial journey. But. And, you know, does it sound like your dad was entrepreneurial? Was your mom entrepreneurial?
- [63:13]
Chris Nagle
No one in my family. No one.
- [63:15]
Patrick Francie
Yeah. So you. So literally, you came out of the shoot as a. At some point, an entrepreneurial spirit. Somewhere along the line, that's how you kind of just were.
- [63:26]
Chris Nagle
Yeah, I certainly knew nothing about being an entrepreneur. But I will say when I. When I came up with that idea for that clothing line, a very interesting thing happened that I could have never even dreamt up is when I made that shift that I was going to start this clothing line, I had to learn a new set of skills. And, you know, I had to learn bookkeeping. So conveniently, I was in high school. I mean, this. I was in high school at this time, folks. Like, I had a teacher, Mr. Crowley, who was the accounting teacher, right? Accounting 101 or whatever they called it. Like, that class all of a sudden took on a whole new shape. I was staying after, and he was showing me on the ledger books, you know, debits and credits and, you know, when. But we weren't just learning it, you see, I was literally taking real scenarios. Like, I was. I bought a dozen T shirts that I was going to print and like, he'd show me how to do debits and credits and how to do this. And eventually then, you know, software came out where you'd put it into the computer. But then I had a business law teacher. And, you know, business law wasn't just that boring class. I was. I was like the teacher's pet, front row, just soaking it all up and then applying it in the afternoon, in the evening when I went home. I did this all through my, you know, year 11 and year 12. Grade 11, grade 12. And then I went to school, to college, to a community college, nothing special. And I went to that college and I remember they make you take electives, right? Courses you have to take, like bowling. And I was so mad. I'm like, I want to take business math. I want to take economics. I want to take all these courses that all pertain to this business that I'm creating. But school wasn't school. It was literally like trade school. It was like I was in real time, learning and applying at the exact same moment. And I don't know if you say nurture or natural, I'm going To say more nurture. Because I worked really hard at this, but I loved every minute of it. Because when you're learning and applying at the same time, it's, it's not school, it's not a mundane thing. It's not like, oh, I got to get through this just to get to this. It's just the essence of the whole thing. And then you find teachers that then really see, you know, that you're onto something. And I had one. Mr. Nemi took me in his wing and brought me into the Small Business Development center and started showing me, like business plans and, you know, you just, on the flyers learning all this stuff, which as a, I don't know what, 15, 16, 17 year old, like the most. 16, 17 year olds, this would be the most boring torture they'd ever go through. But to me, this was the most fascinating, enlightening thing that I thought possible.
- [65:56]
Patrick Francie
Well, you were, you would have been like a, you know, you would have been a teacher's dream. I mean, the reality of what it is, is with teachers is they love to teach, is generally why they become teachers. The kind of, the kind of, the rose comes off it of their teaching career when they start to realize the students don't want to be there. You're a student who wanted to be there. You wanted to learn. And to your point, you were applying it. So it was for you, it was like this was a necessary part of your education to do and achieve the dream that you had. And often, of course, in not a criticism of kids, but you don't. Most kids don't have that kind of a drive or that kind of a dream and an achievable dream. And even though they don't see it, they believe they can achieve it. And you were taking, you know, you were taking that education and applying it. That's, that's kind of a cool difference that really separated you from, you know, probably 95% of the class that you were attending because you had something to do with it. You were actually, you know, how many kids go, why am I taking this course? Where am I ever going to use it? In your case, you're going, no, I'm taking this course and it's accounting and I'm using it tomorrow.
- [66:59]
Chris Nagle
And the craziest thing, like economics, right? I think that's that by most accounts, a student looks at economics as being like, this is going to be the worst class ever. I love it. And even to today, like, you know, I've gone through the whole Wall street thing. Sixteen years there but like, economics is one of my favorite things. I study economics like a nerd. I can't call myself an economist, but like, I think like an economist, I probably know more than most economists in terms of application of all these different economic factors that happen in the world and, you know, in the US and, and then come up with a narrative to basically predict what's, what's next, you know, to what we said earlier. Like, we're probably headed to a really serious recession, maybe even a depressionary period, but that's a little aggressive and, and then, you know, looking at all these things that are happening and saying, okay, with dollars, with, with, you know, currencies and the central banks, like when you start really thinking about where we're at today and in the States, we just got the Genius act, which paves the way for stable coins as a deposit instrument into banks. Banks aren't set up for that. Like, I'm just going to get you into my mind a little on how I think, because I, I am literally just a visionary. So when I think about things like that. All right, all right, Genius act comes out, paves the way for banks to make deposits for stable coins. But then you, you do some studies and this is economic white papers and things that banks can't physically set up. What's needed to take deposits of stable coins. Right, Is genius X says, this is that digital currency stuff. Love it or hate it, I'm just telling you. So how I look at that is I'm like, wait a second. So a bank has so much legacy software and so much legacy built into their operations that they literally can't adapt because they're just too big to move fast enough to adapt to this new thing that's just, that's rapidly changing with AI and quantum computing and blockchain. And in the future, well, let's just call it out as it is. So me, call me stupid, but listen, this is going to take you right back to like those early years. A lot of people called me stupid. How I look at it is I'm like, you know what? That's a really big opportunity. How about I just create the mechanism, the bank, the structure that allows a bank to just plug and play and now all of a sudden become a depository. And then you look at like the use case, I have like byob, my, my insurance business, banking, right, it's using insurance companies. But you can take a policy, you can move the cash value over to blockchain, you could fractionalize it, you could turn it into a Stable coin backed by the cash value life insurance. Now, this is going to get crazy here, but just stay with me. And then over here I got this other technology company, private Money Club, which is like a dating site for money. And then when you think from banking, okay, that's people that have money and people that need money for real estate and brings them together. That's just the product in banking that would be your loan product. And then I've got the software, the operating system. I'm like, all I literally need to do is put this together into a way that would allow a bank to take deposits of stable coins, which I'm probably 80% there already. Just get some coders, get some really smart people that understand blockchain and the crypto markets, and you bring them all into my infrastructure and you build it. And then what you've just built, folks, or what I'm. I'm just going to call the future, this is what I'm building today, will be something that every bank in the country will have to buy. So I'll have a bidding war of J.P. morgan and Wells Fargo and all these companies that have too much legacy to do what I'm doing, they will just say, we're going to buy you. And what for how much? Well, the deposit ticket that's been in my back pocket is for 350 million. And I'm probably thinking too small, but that's my number. And you know what? A lot of people are like, what would you do if you had $350 million? To be quite honest, if I had $350 million today, I'd probably give most all of it away. And people are like, that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Okay, then why is it that that's what Warren Buffett did? See, when you start to understand all of this stuff, you really start to understand that If I give 300 or $350 million away, because I mean, literally, like, do you need more than $50 million to live any life you want? No. So if you had 350 million, what are you going to do with it? Well, you're going to do good with it. You're going to give it away. You're going to put it into a foundation and charities and. And then from those charities, maybe you could draw 5% interest off of them or, you know, manage them or whatever. There's a lot of. But you give it all away. And then when that happens, the universe, as crazy as this sounds, but it's a law. The universe has to give it back to you. So then in various different ways, that money just has to come back to you. And then you got to figure it all out again. And you just keep doing it, you keep creating, you just keep fulfilling on this destiny. So I know that's really big thinking, but that's how I think today. But is it really how I think today or is it how I. How I've always thought? You said, you know, nature, I think. Nature or nurturing? I don't know. Both. Because that's just how I'm wired. That's just how I think.
- [71:48]
Patrick Francie
Okay, here's my observation, my observation of what you just said. So between us, we could call ourselves at best, armchair economists, but here's the observation, Chris, as you think through that, you look into the future and as you know, you're on YouTube, you know, I. I'm on YouTube and, or on my podcast, et cetera, all the things that we do. But there's a fundamental difference that you've done. You've. Lots of talking heads talk about, you know, the world's coming to an end, the economy's going to crash, and to whatever degree that you want to believe that or not believe it, but you have created a thesis. You've used critical thinking, first principles, whatever you might have used to say, okay, this is where I see things going, the possibilities and the probabilities. So you're weighing all those things you're going to. But here's the fundamental difference. You're not ranting about the world coming to an end. You're saying, this is where I think it's going. And then you created a solution. You created a solution to the impending problem. Like you, I agree 100% with you. And it's not a case of if, it's a case of when. And sadly, that is the one thing that we can't quite determine, which is, when will this really start? And we're in it. And that's the fundamental. People are waiting. They think they're going to wake up one day and there's going to be a switch flipped. That's just not how it's going to go. We're already in the process of the boiling frog, and it is happening whether. Whether we want to acknowledge it or not. And you can either, you know, and this is the problem with society in general, I think, is that most are naive and. Or TikTok and. Or don't know where or how to pay attention, and they don't know what to look for. So they are literally lining up because that's what banks or government or whatever the story is, they're just following whatever somebody's directing them. In your case, the observation is, I see this coming. I have the possibilities, the probabilities, the, the thesis. I have a solution and I got to share this with people. They got to see what's coming at them to protect their financial futures. So that's my observation of all of it. So I don't know if I've recapped that accurately or not.
- [74:03]
Chris Nagle
I think that's really good. And you know, sometimes I don't really think about what I'm thinking about. I just, I just enjoy it. I just, I love going after things that I can, problems I can solve. And you know, I think you said something else where a lot of people like, they think that there's just gonna be a switch and it's just all going to be over. And if that's what you believe, then that's what's going to happen. You know, our minds are pretty powerful things. Whatever your mind can believe and conceive and it can achieve. So if you believe that the world's going to end and it's all going to be misery and hell and all this good stuff, well, then that might very well be your reality. But it won't be mine.
- [74:38]
Patrick Francie
It won't be yours. Well, this goes back to. Okay, so I, you know, I, I don't even like to use the. I have a podcast called Mindset Matters, which I'm changing the name, but that's a different conversation. But there is a mindset. And, and it's such a, the, that term gets used so often, I think it's watered down. But, but when you look at how you evolved, number one, as a young man, as an entrepreneur, then as a professional athlete, even on Wall street, competitive world, you're out there. Are you pretty intentional about how you have evolved as a man and as a business person? You know, in terms of mindset, looking at your way of thinking, are you self reflective in that regard? Like, how do you approach the shift of mindset? Knowing that if you look at, you know, if you look at governments and we could, whatever government you want to look at, it's, it all seems like a show these days. Not that it's only gotten worse. It's not that it was better before maybe, or marginally, but how do you deal with your own kind of view of the world, if you will? Is that a, a practice? Is it a, is it a study, goes along with leadership even? Is that Something you study or, or do you really just rely on your own instincts and don't worry so much about that?
- [75:55]
Chris Nagle
Yeah, I really don't. It's like, you know, I, I don't look at competition, you know, my competition or my competitors in the space. I just keep creating. I, I, it's just for me to sit here and say that, like I don't have bad days or like I don't get into those modes where I'm like negative thinking and thinking, oh my gosh, I can't believe this. Like, listen, our last election was enough to drive anyone mad. You know, watching the divide in the country is enough to drive anyone mad, get wrapped up in that. But I've gotten to a point now where I can, I can see almost like I can look down on myself. I can see myself doing that and I feel myself getting more and more negative. And when, when you're negative, you attract negativity. I all of a sudden start seeing things, like bad things just start happening more often and I start seeing more negative people and you know, I start just feeding it and, and then all of a sudden you flip. And I do this in weird ways. Like, like, you know, I get up early in the morning and I go for a run. But I don't just jog. Like, I run like I'll jog and then I'll run full out until it hurts, till literally I feel like my chest is going to blow up. And then I, then I just keep doing that over. But, and then like swimming is a big thing. Like I get up and it's cold here, folks. Right now it's, mornings are 50 degrees, the water temp is dropping rapidly. But I still, I ride my bike down to the lake 5:45 to 6:00am in the morning, okay, freezing cold. Then I run halfway around a lake to another, smaller lake behind. And I sit there on the, on the edge of the water and I sit there and think, this is going to suck, maybe I'm not going to jump. And I start shaking my head, shaking my hands, like doing everything. And then all of a sudden I just leap and I hit the water. And yeah, at first it's like, oh my gosh. Then all of a sudden you start swimming and it just gets normal. The reason I tell that story is that's just life, right? You gotta leap even when you know it's gonna suck. And when I'm in the water, it's just quiet, surreal and it sets me up for the entire day. So if that is how I start My morning, putting myself through literally, pain, cold, and all the things that come along with. And swimming is like. You know, some people like, oh, you must love to swim. And I hate it. It kind of sucks. Like, we swim the equivalent of like three football fields in a lake and. And it sucks.
- [78:12]
Patrick Francie
It just.
- [78:13]
Chris Nagle
I don't know how to say it. Like, it's pretty, you know, you look up at the sky. But the whole process of it. I'm just not in love with swimming. I just do it because it. When I get out of the water, no matter what's going to happen to me the rest of that day, I've already got the hard out of the way and I'm prepared for that. So I take that approach into everything. I take it into business. Business. And I fail all the time. I didn't get any of my failures, but I've almost gone bankrupt multiple times. I've been at the bottom. I've been so depressed that literally I didn't think I could get out of bed. I. I've. When the TV show didn't happen, I literally sincerely thought about jerking the wheel of my truck into a tree because, like, that was it. I burned the boats. Like, so please don't think that, like, I've lived this fairy tale, like, perfect world my whole life. Like, no, I've. I've been just like all of you. I've been through the trials and tribulations and the pain and the suffering and the, the, the bottom, if you will, or whatever you want to call it. But I've just learned. And it's really just wisdom, and it just takes time. I can't sit there and say that any of you could just snap your fingers. All of a sudden it's going to be better. It's not. You're going to have to go through the same things we have had to go through. But you just get to a certain point where you just kind of like a light switch, you just learn how to turn it on and turn it off. And as you practice that, it gets easier and easier. Back to the fasting. Like, everything done in repetition, consistently, persistently, just becomes the norm. So my norm is just to what most people would say, absolutely insane and crazy. That's just my norm. And I take every day, no matter where my level of success is, is the journey's just beginning. Every day, the journey's just beginning. And that's just how I do it.
- [79:47]
Patrick Francie
You know, and thanks for sharing that comment because, you know, it is. As much as, you know, listeners, myself, even as you said that. Oh, that's, that's really cool point. And you know, I know that with any business, and I've been in business with over 40 years and the ups, the downs, the stresses, the, you know, all the. That goes on with partners. I mean, it's, you know, it's like, okay, but we get through it. And, but to your point is that when you've achieved the kind of levels of success that you've achieved, you know, just financially but in your businesses and, and, you know, you're obviously, you got a level of intelligence and a way of understanding your own intelligence that you've turned into a very lucrative lifestyle and a fun lifestyle, I'm sure. But you do push yourself. There's a fundamental that you go back to, you know, do the hard things. And, and we. I know, like, I've trained for many, many years and only because I like my health and the physical fitness side of things. And my trainer, and he's been with me many years and he comes in two or three days a week and we train and, and he's used to my, you know, complaining and whining and we laugh about it all the time because he's. I've trained with him for many years back in the days where my body didn't hurt the way it hurts now at 67 years old. And I say to him, I go, this hurts. Like it hurts. It doesn't work this way anymore. It didn't used to hurt. What the hell's going on? But you do it anyways, because if you don't, it's only going to get worse. And so it isn't about. I don't have some aspirations of living longer, although, you know, I think I'll easily hit 100. It's a quality of life that I have while I am living. That's really what that's all about. But the point of where I'm trying to get to with all of this is we have to lean into these things. And there's one other concept that I think there's two things. There's two prisons that I think we all live in mentally generally. And that is, number one, there's something wrong with our life. And so we're constantly making what we've got going on in our life wrong. And I say we. I, I'm not in that phase of my life anymore, that' for sure. But I did go through those periods of time where you're striving, you're trying to. Because, okay, there's something wrong with My life? No, there's nothing wrong with your life. It's just your life. And if you want to improve on it, great. You don't have to make it wrong. It's the first kind of prison that we can get trapped in. I see people get trapped in. And the other one is, is that we're just into this whole conversation. And that is aside from death and taxes, the only thing that is certain is uncertainty. And we have to get okay with the fact that life is just uncertain, business is uncertain, relationships can be uncertain as much as we come to depend on them. What we can be certain about is the uncertainty of life. And I just want to leave that comment out there for you. And, and maybe you can pick up on it. And what's your thoughts on either of those?
- [82:43]
Chris Nagle
Kind of, there's not much I can say is you're absolutely correct. I mean, the uncertainty is the only certain. And you know, like throughout life, I mean, one of the things that, that I would tell your audience, you know, is the best investment you'll ever, ever make is yourself. Now I know that's cliche, you've heard that before. But if you, like today, like, listen, I can invest in lots of different things. You know what I do, I keep investing back in myself, back in my businesses, because I just feel comfortable. It's like I, I get a thrill out of it. I love it that some work, some don't, you know, you lose, you win, but at least I'm in control of it. And you know, I can invest in the stock market, which I did for many years, professionally traded options and futures and all that crazy stuff, you know, that you see, I did it all and now I have, I don't have a single penny in the stock market. And I tell all my folks, I'm like, I don't have a red cent, I have treasury bonds, but that's a short term play for me because of the interest rate cycle we're in. But like I, why would I have zero money in the stock market? The simple thing that I, I just can't control it and it just doesn't make logical sense to me anymore. And I don't need to try to go out there and get that thrill. I'm more comfortable just building slowly and steadily. So when you say the uncertainty, like, I totally agree, like every day's uncertain. You never know what you're going to get. And if you just embrace that and just accept that as the reality, your life is what it is and you're in the exact Place you're supposed to be. Get used to it.
- [84:10]
Patrick Francie
That's what it is. I love it.
- [84:11]
Chris Nagle
Gosh, there's no better way to say it.
- [84:14]
Patrick Francie
Well, no. And you, and you're very inspirational in your thought process. And, and so it really is, you know, when you and I want to, just as we start to wind down, I do want to ask a few questions, but one of the things I want to ask Chris is that you came from humble beginnings. You've done very well over the years, you know, in terms of finance and all the rest of it. I think you, you mentioned your. A daughter. I don't know if you've got more than just one.
- [84:38]
Chris Nagle
No, unfortunately, just one. We've tried, but just God gave us one.
- [84:42]
Patrick Francie
So when you think about your humble beginnings and now you know you've got wealth beyond anything you would have imagined probably back in those days, part of who this is. I'll share a quick story. So a guest that I had one, you know, very successful lawyer, big in real estate. And he was, his, his dad was a pastor, his mom was a stay at home mom. They had four kids. So imagine him living on a family, living on a pastor's salary, you know, it was pretty meager and humble, right? And so he built a lot of wealth. And I said to him, I said, so you've done all of this, Mark? What, why are you doing it? Why are you creating all of this wealth? Is this legacy for your children? And he looked at me and he said, why would I do that to my children? He said, I am who I am because of how I was raised, because we came from humble beginnings. Because that is what defined me. And I loved my life and my parents growing up, we didn't seem to be without. I wasn't never set up that way. I didn't have big expectations of grandeur. They put me through university, you know, I became a lawyer, I went into doing all the things. He's got a very successful firm, etc. But it was a really interesting comment and he was really like thrown off by the question goes, hold on here, just a minute, I'll feed them. I'll make sure they get the best education that they want to have. And he'd done some remarkable things. And then it's like, don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out. You're always welcome home. We'll always feed you all those things. But he goes, no, you're on your own. And it was an interesting thought process. So when you consider your Humble beginnings and where you are in your life and you have your daughter, what part of that do you think will impact her? You know, do you have, you look back as a parent, do you intentionally go, you know, some. She needs to figure this out on her own. We're not going to pick her up. I don't know how old she is. But you follow what I'm saying. That thought process, Chris, any, any comments on that?
- [86:48]
Chris Nagle
Well, I think, I think money does ruin children. I think, you know, if, if a child doesn't have to go out and, and go through the hard things and, and dream and really work hard toward the things, they just don't value things. It's like, listen, you know, if I gave you everything for free, you wouldn't value any of it, but if you paid for the stuff that you got, you would value it. Like, that's proven fact. So, like how I'm doing this. And listen, I don't have it right. And I have a wife too, who, you know, differs a little bit. But, you know, with everything that I teach, I do teach my daughter a lot about money, but I also teach her, her, you know, just how to control it, how to do good with it. She, we make her very involved with our charity and with, with our foundation and the giving that we do. That's a huge thing, is give, give, give. I've also taken extensive amounts of just thought and energy into how am I going to leave a legacy? And just so you all know, like, listen, you can look at legacy multiple different ways. I like the Bruce, Bruce Lee way. You know, you can either give your children all the things you didn't have or you can teach them all the things you never learned. I prefer the latter. So I've done a TedX talk.
- [87:52]
Patrick Francie
Okay.
- [87:53]
Chris Nagle
It was the hardest, hardest speech I've ever done. I speak nationally all the time. That was the hardest one I ever did. Not because it was a TEDx talk, but because it was a letter that I wrote to my daughter. And it was a letter that goes through the six laws of wealth in parables, telling real stories of my life and the failures and what I learned from them in a TEDx talk. And it's called Rethink Money, a letter to my daughter. I still can't listen to it without going into tears. I barely made it through it on stage without breaking into tears. That has led into. Now I got a children's book called the Companion. Cute darn book. It's just such an important lesson. It's kind of like the Giving Tree. It's very much like the giving tree, but kind of centralized more in the money. But you'd never. It's money, giving, love, all those different things. And then I've got a new book that, you know, the manuscript's done. We're, we're working through it, no rush to get this one out, but, but the working title is share, but it might be the key to it all. And it's literally a, almost a memoir of my life, but told in a third person. It's about a father who tells his daughter stories. It forward paces through her life. And it's just every one of these stories is just a hard time that somebody had gone through. And he tell, he tells the stories in a third person. You know, it's always somebody else. But every story is that father story. Every one of those stories is my story. Everything you've heard today on this, this podcast, like in this book, it goes through it. But the hardest part about this book, I couldn't even write it myself. I'm gonna get, you know, just shaky in this is, you know, I had to kill myself at the end. And I don't mean that in a morbid way, but we all die. And in this book I literally die. I go through the whole thing and, and we talk about all the stuff that I leave and how throughout my life, this, this father's life in the book, which is my, me and my daughter, you know, I'm giving her all these lessons and these lessons are told in parables and stories and every time she has a hard time, the father tells her a story that makes her feel better, makes her understand this. And every one of these stories is a preparation to prepare her so that when dad's gone, she can take over and do this. And in the book, she never really knows the amount of wealth. She knew dad was a business owner and had money and things, but she was never exposed to the money. She had to go through the struggles. And in there it talks about a lot of those struggles financially and how dad didn't just say, I'll write you a check, don't worry, but teaches her the lesson out of it. And at the end she finds out how much money dad actually had and, and how much wealth there was and, and he literally hands her the key and the keys in the book, the whole thing. That's why, you know, the key to it all hands her the key, you know, when he's gone. And a letter, and the letter is that TEDx story that the, it's the written version of the, the. That parables of it, it's so. God, it's so hard to talk about.
- [90:38]
Patrick Francie
But anyway, that's cool.
- [90:40]
Chris Nagle
That thing is very powerful. It's a tear jerker to say the least. But that, that is kind of just like I wanted to write a book that would, would not just help pave my daughter's life, but would someday be like a guide, a guiding, you know, light, a guiding path for her. And, and that's how I'm doing it. And, and I'm not getting it. All right. I'm not gonna lie, like, scared to death in a lot of things. Raising a daughter in today's world, you know, like with phones and, you know, it's like we're trying to control her screen time but still give her the freedom to make her own decisions. And gosh, I don't know. Every day's a new challenge.
- [91:12]
Patrick Francie
Every day it is. Isn't it great, sir, how old is your, how old is your daughter, by the way? Chris?
- [91:17]
Chris Nagle
Yeah, she's five. Super fun age. But I do agree with what you were talking about with that attorney. Like, like, why would I ruin her like that? Why would I do that? And that, that is the truth.
- [91:27]
Patrick Francie
I mean, we talked about it, right? You talked about doing the hard things. And, you know, you became pro as a snowboarder because of the hard things. You found the time. You created the time as a young man by doing hard things. We train and we lift weights or we run or whatever we do because that's what it takes. You have to get uncomfortable to achieve a next level of anything. That's just the reality of it. If you want to lift more weight, you gotta. It's uncomfortable and it can be a little scary, you know, can I pull this off? Can I do this? So that is part of life is understanding that we can get into the mentality. I wish it was easier, but if it was easier, you then be okay. Be okay with TikTok 9 to 5. Live your life, die maybe if that's what you want to be. I want to go back to you are a family or man of faith. Faith. Was that always that way or what? What that was. You were raised in that.
- [92:23]
Chris Nagle
This is a very. And I never get to talk about this in podcasts, you know, and you know, I grew up, my mom, you know, very faithful woman, very. But not church going, you know, I didn't grow up in a family that we went to church every single week. We didn't. But there was never a night we didn't pray. There was never a time we didn't thank God. There was never a time we didn't say we were grateful. Like, it was just how I was brought up. I was brought up, up watching my mom do this, watching my mom struggle and always say thank you and, and always being grateful for what we did have. And, and that's how I've gone. And my wife is Catholic and, you know, was a devout Catholic, brought up in a family that they went to church and they did all this. And my wife literally kind of pushes back sometime on church because of that. And I've seen that side where I wasn't, you know, the church going, but very faithful. And then my wife was like, like forced to go to church. And, you know, forced is the wrong word, but went to church. And now, and now she's like, I don't want to force Vivi to go to church. If Vivie wants to go to church, she can go to church. If she wants to go with me, when I do go, she can go with me. But it's just that freedom of choice. And it's kind of been cool to watch and there's been a lot happening with that. But I read a lot, you know, and like I say, invest in yourself. I've had mentors throughout my life and I read a lot of books, books, audiobooks mostly, because, you know, I just, I listen to them in the morning. But the books I read are, are sometimes interesting books, but a lot of them are faith based. I love Earl Nightingale. Listen to him every single day of my life. And, you know, he's a very faithful man. And, you know, a lot of those principles that you would get with Napoleon Hill or Earl Nightingale or any, anyone you follow, like, they're all faith based, whether you love it or not or whether you want to admit it or not, they really are. I mean, like the Sermon on the Mount, right? Like, seeking you shall find, asking you shall receive. Knock and the door shall be opened. Like, if kids were just taught that to not be scared to ask, not be scared to seek what they're looking for and not be scared to just knock, you know, on a, I don't want to say a door, but just knock and the door will be opened. Like, just to go out there and push the limits, to seek the things that you want. Like, I just think, I just feel like society would be different, but we are not taught that that just is not the way society works. I, I, and I don't know why I never, someday I'll get to ask the big guy, you know, hey, like, why was it this way? You know, and, and we'll get the answers. But listen, I, I don't judge people based on faith, lack, lack of faith. I think each person should just do what they want to do.
- [94:49]
Patrick Francie
And yeah, my wife Stephanie and I over the years and our daughter, etc, but you know, we're very much believers in higher power, which we will call God. But what I dropped over the years was many years ago was I could not buy into the religious aspect of it. So it's a little different for me in that I 100% have no question about a higher power that we will call God. But I can't go down the religious connotations that go along with some of that narrative. That's not to make it wrong, just to share with you where it kind of. Or share with the audience where I'm at in that. So prayer, whether it's prayer, meditation, whatever you want to call it, understanding that.
- [95:36]
Chris Nagle
I think meditation is far, far greater than prayer.
- [95:39]
Patrick Francie
Yeah, I always looked at meditation and I always looked at prayer as a different form of meditation because it's similar in that, that context. You really are connecting with a higher power. I find that with meditation, that's really what you're. I'm in my world, in my meditation. It's the opportunity for me to tap into universal consciousness, if you want to use that phrase. But it's along those lines. So yeah, that, that's just kind of my view of the world. So as we wind down and I want to say thank you. You've been really generous with your time, Chris, so I really do appreciate it. I know you're eastern time, so it is getting late at your end. You probably got to get home for dinner. So some rapid fire questions as we wind down and they're never quite so rapid fire, but let's go down the path anyways. You ready?
- [96:23]
Chris Nagle
I'm always ready.
- [96:24]
Patrick Francie
Dude, you're born ready. I know. Born ready. Okay, well, this is just a warm up. IPhone or Android?
- [96:31]
Chris Nagle
IPhone.
- [96:32]
Patrick Francie
Guaranteed. Yeah, for sure. Favorite movie if you have one.
- [96:37]
Chris Nagle
Rad.
- [96:38]
Patrick Francie
Oh, right. Rad. You mentioned that at the beginning of the show. Yeah. And do you have a favorite genre or song, band that you listen to in terms of music?
- [96:47]
Chris Nagle
The Beatles.
- [96:48]
Patrick Francie
The Beatles. Are you big. I'm a big Beatles fan. I love the Beatles. Yeah, yeah. They really set the benchmark. When you look at all of the books that you've read and you shared that you read or listen to a lot, was there a Book or is there a book that was pivotal? Maybe a fork in the road for you and. Or a book that you wrote. Just want, you want to tell the world. You got to read this book.
- [97:12]
Chris Nagle
Can't believe I'm gonna say this, but yeah, I was at a really hard point in my life and I read a Dr. Phil book. In the Dr. Phil book, talked about taking responsibility for your life because nobody else cares and owning your mistakes and owning your problems. And probably one of the most transformational books I ever read. And I was young man, this is right when I was just thinking about going into Wall street and yeah, face Dr. Phil.
- [97:43]
Patrick Francie
There's lots of books.
- [97:43]
Chris Nagle
I can't remember the name of the book, but it was a Dr. Phil book.
- [97:46]
Patrick Francie
That's all they need to know. But you know, along that same line, my favorite book.
- [97:50]
Chris Nagle
It was the most transformational book.
- [97:52]
Patrick Francie
Yeah, yeah. You know, interesting. You're one of the guests that didn't say rich dad, poor dad or what's the other popular one? I can't. You think and grow rich and so. But one of the more recent books I read four or five years ago that speaks to what you shared about Dr. Phil. The book you read was Jocko Wilnick. If you've ever read Extreme Ownership, I'm going to encourage you to read Extreme Ownership. So you know, Jocko is, I don't know. Okay. So he wrote it with his partner and I don't remember his name. So Jocko will. Nick was a, you know, whatever, four time Navy SEAL trainer, blah blah, blah. So he wrote the book, book Extreme Ownership and really what it is. And he, and he shares a lot of the story. Some people don't like the way the book was written because it's about what he was doing in Iran, Iraq, how he managed his, his troops and taking extreme ownership. So in other words, no excuses, zero excuses, nothing. There are no excuses and there is no victimness.
- [98:53]
Chris Nagle
I would love that book.
- [98:55]
Patrick Francie
You're gonna love that book.
- [98:56]
Chris Nagle
Download that book. For sure. I read a lot of books.
- [98:59]
Patrick Francie
My, my partner, one of my, I call him a partner. He's, he's a, was my, one of my senior execs within one of the businesses and he and I read that book and we like went holy shit. And like, and I mean we're, we're not victims in our life at any stretch. But when you take it and really absorb that book and the message that Jocko Wilnick was sharing and I recommend it all of the time, I had my whole team read that book. It Is it's pretty impactful when you start to see how we can sleep slip into being the victim to what's going on in our life and people. And he did this to me and she did that to me. Oh, my God.
- [99:36]
Chris Nagle
That's why I read that Dr. Phil book. The same reason I read that book, what you just described.
- [99:42]
Patrick Francie
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [99:43]
Chris Nagle
So boohoo me back then. Oh, wow.
- [99:46]
Patrick Francie
Well, Jocko might just open it up. That book may open up a whole new world for you of understanding. So it was very good. Good. Okay. So when you get to the gates, if there is a God, we'll all say there is a God. What do you hope God says when you get to the gates? Welcome, beautiful. Favorite swear word. I don't want to step over this one. My, my. It's so funny is that I'm from.
- [100:11]
Chris Nagle
New York and I have a license to swear. The word is my favorite swear word.
- [100:15]
Patrick Francie
There you go. I expected as much. But anyways, let's you just go. I go, I don't know if I should keep asking my guests these questions. Then I have listeners go, you know, my favorite question is, is when you say, what's your favorite swear word? Anyway, so I ask it. And Chris, final question. And again, thank you for your time today. What are you grateful for today?
- [100:36]
Chris Nagle
Everything. I'm grateful for being able to wake up every day.
- [100:41]
Patrick Francie
I'm always grateful for my guests. And like you, I am sometimes think and have so much gratitude for the life that we live, the health that we have, the family and the friends that we're surrounded by and the opportunity I have. I want to say thank you for joining me on the show today.
- [100:57]
Chris Nagle
This is beyond anything I could have expected.
- [100:59]
Patrick Francie
Thank you, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you for listening. If you found value in the podcast, please take the time to rate and review and share with others. Share with your your friends as it is my goal to always improve and to provide the highest value for you, the listener. If you have any comments, suggestions or questions you'd like answered, please email me@ceoraincanada.com that's ceorincanada.com I look forward to hearing from you. And until next time, Patrick, go.