The Lost Histories of Black Inventors

Summary

The Friend Zone Podcast — “The Lost Histories of Black Inventors”

Hosts: Dustin Ross, Hey Fran Hey (Francesca/Fran), Asante
Date: February 26, 2026
Episode Theme: Preserving and honoring the overlooked contributions of Black inventors, creators, and community leaders, while confronting the historical and ongoing systemic barriers that have suppressed, stolen, or erased Black innovation.

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Episode Overview

This Black History Month special unpacks the repeating pattern of Black brilliance and invention being erased, exploited, or sidelined in America. From Mr. Walter Johnson (“Mr. Tenderness”)’s viral barbecue saga to the erased story behind Jack Daniel’s whiskey, and powerful women researchers restoring forgotten histories, the hosts dig into both the past and present, highlighting why archiving and protecting our own stories is critical for Black progress.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Addressing Recent Incidents of Racism & Accountability

[01:47–16:07]

• Dustin addresses two incidents:

  • John Davidson at the BAFTAs:

    • Tourette syndrome activist screamed a racist slur live. While outraged, Dustin describes how a Black girl with Tourettes on TikTok helped him understand the involuntary nature (“it’s not necessarily what they’re thinking…” – Fran, [03:32]), shifting some anger toward the BAFTA producers who allowed the slur to reach the broadcast.
    • “They knew what they were doing…There are people that are responsible for that moment making it to air, just like Fran said. Those are the racists that deserve all of our vitriol.” — Dustin [05:56]

  • Allison Friedman, Hunter College:

    • Caught on a Zoom call making blatantly racist comments about Black students.
    • The crew stresses the dangerous impact of racists in educational positions and the lack of meaningful vetting for educators.
    • “All we can do is do what we can…Call those numbers, email those people, bring it to her. Because we ain’t having that on our watch.” — Dustin [12:25]

  • Fran’s reflection: Racism is so deeply systemic that “this is exactly who [institutions] want.” [13:42]

---

Black Business of the Week: Ruby Love

[16:16–20:47]

• Fran spotlights Black-owned period apparel brand Ruby Love, designed by Crystal Etienne for Black women and praised by Fran’s Black gynecologist.
• Key Point: The importance of service providers and creators who really “get” Black women’s needs.

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Audience Recap and Community Connections

[21:25–44:34]

• The hosts share heartfelt comments sparked by past episodes, especially memories about childhood commutes, archiving family stories, and Black experiences in New York City.
• Beautiful and emotional moments arise, such as a listener preserving voicemails from a deceased parent or the discovery that Dustin’s uncle created a family’s cherished heirloom portrait.
• Quote: “That’s the magic. That’s the shit that made me believe in God for real.” — Dustin [42:02]

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News & Culture: Rock & Roll Hall of Fame Nominations

[44:34–49:13]

• The crew reacts to this year’s nominees, with special focus on Black artists who should be inducted (Mariah Carey, Lauryn Hill, Wu-Tang, Sade, Luther Vandross, New Edition).
• “Mariah deserves this. Her third time being nominated. So, we gotta push her through. We gotta vote for Mariah, y’all.” — Dustin [48:24]

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Main Topic: The Lost Histories of Black Inventors

[55:55–1:26:49]

The Saga of Mr. Tenderness & Black Innovation Being Stolen

[55:55–67:17]

• Fran introduces Walter Johnson (“Mr. Tenderness”), an older Black man whose viral videos built the reputation of Destination Smokehouse, only for the white owner to fire him and trademark “Tenderness” without credit.

  • Keith Lee’s experience: When he tried to tip Johnson, the white owner refused and blocked access.
  • Eventually, rapper Cartel Bo from Houston steps in, offering to open a NEW restaurant for Walter Johnson.

• Hosts connect this to a “familiar pattern” of Black creations being monetized/exploited by others but not shared or credited, referencing:

  The Jack Daniel's/Uncle Nearest Story

  [67:37–81:53]

  • Enslaved Black man Nathan "Nearest" Green developed whiskey-making techniques; Jack Daniel built a world-famous brand from it, gave no credit or partnership, and the wealth never flowed to Green’s family for generations.

  • Only recently, through research by Fawn Weaver and collaboration with Nearest’s descendants, has the real story been told, reparative action taken, and a Black-owned "Uncle Nearest" whiskey brand launched.

  • “Is that enough?” Fran asks, as the gesture, while positive, doesn’t truly restore what was lost [72:34–73:09].

  • Hosts reflect how narrative “friendships” are used to gloss over exploitation:

  • “If it was a friendship, this would not have gone unnoticed for over a century.” – Fran [81:19]

---

The Law and History: Why So Many Black Inventions Are “Lost”

[84:18–112:42]

• The Patent System as a Tool of Exclusion

  • Black people, especially those enslaved, were categorically excluded from patent laws, so inventions and labor were routinely stolen or exploited.
  • E.g., The Dred Scott decision made it explicit that Black inventors had “no standing”; slaveholders tried (sometimes failed) to patent their creations.
  • Confederate states even attempted to formalize slaveholder “ownership” of Black inventions.
  • Example of Benjamin Montgomery inventing the steamboat propeller, only recognized much later.

• Research on Segregation, Violence, and Innovation:

  • Economist Lisa D. Cook proved how violence from the Plessy v. Ferguson era and events like the Tulsa massacre correlated with steep drops in Black patenting — a legacy that persists today [104:11–107:29].

  • Quote: “Violence limits innovation, and in turn, economic activity for us and our families.” — Fran, quoting Lisa D. Cook [108:46]

• Systemic Effects:

  • Even after slavery, Jim Crow laws and exclusion from spaces like libraries and patent attorneys compounded barriers—“There wasn’t a Black patent attorney until the 1970s!” – Fran [105:09]
  • The importance of not just “fixing the laws,” but changing the workplaces, environments, and networks where innovation happens.

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On Black Archiving and Ownership

[111:52–117:15]

• The Smithsonian and Lemelson Center are working to repair the erasure by holding events and supporting research on the “hidden histories” of Black invention—but still must contend with political forces and institutional bias.
• Dustin: “We need a secondary, reliable, secure method of archiving history and content and protecting it so that… it is not at risk of erasure.” [112:42]
• The future: Collective economics, self-run archiving, and children’s literature (“What Color is My World?” by Kareem Abdul Jabbar) as tools for restoring and protecting Black legacy.

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Where Cultural Innovations Get Overlooked

[117:15–121:44]

• Many Black inventions are not seen as “deserving” of patents because they’re rooted in culture or survival rather than profit (e.g., Grandmaster Flash turning turntables into an instrument).
• There’s a call for the patent office to recognize and protect cultural innovation and impact, not just “machines for commerce.”

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On Black stories being erased and reclaimed:
  • “That was the draw. You should have given him equity in the business. You should have made him a partner… Now that [his story] is out, we’re not gonna support [Destination Smokehouse] the same.” — Dustin ([64:47]–[65:51])
• On atonement and history:
  • “When you’re in a position of atonement, you have to atone for something you did. We don’t need anything missed, no details, none of that.” — Dustin [80:28]
• On patterns of exploitation:
  • “Ain’t it something for this parallel to be from an enslaved Black man… and then we’re talking about 2026? That to me was the part that I was like, I need to sit with this for a second.” — Fran [83:17]
• On archiving and legacy:
  • “The show reconnected you with a childhood acquaintance who was long separated from you… This is the magic. That’s the shit that made me believe in God for real.” — Dustin [42:02]

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Notable Timestamps

• 01:47 — Discussion of BAFTA incident and production accountability
• 06:55 — Hunter College’s Allison Friedman incident
• 16:16 — Highlight: Ruby Love Black-owned period products
• 43:54 — Recapping community comments on Black history, archiving
• 44:34 — Rock & Roll Hall of Fame Black nominees
• 55:55 — Main Topic starts: Mr. Tenderness’ story
• 67:37 — The Uncle Nearest / Jack Daniel’s whiskey history
• 81:53 — Parallels between past & present exploitation
• 84:18 — Patent system history and Black exclusion
• 95:13 — Systemic roots of exploitation, need for partnership in wealth-building
• 104:11 — Lisa D. Cook: How violence, segregation cut off Black innovation
• 112:42 — Archiving and the dangers of institutional erasure
• 117:15 — The Lemelson Center and spaces for Black inventors
• 120:07 — The need to patent/protect cultural innovation
• 121:44 — Children’s literature: Kareem Abdul Jabbar’s book
• 122:53 — Final reflections: resilience, community self-reliance

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“This Week in Wellness”

[129:07–133:41]

• Fran spotlights Chloe Foster, a young Black innovator with a patent-pending hair product (“Lengthen Lock” by Moonlit Ringlets) that stretches curls without heat.
• A real-world example of Black woman-driven innovation for the community.

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“Music Man” & TV Segments

[133:49–165:52]

• Asante recaps musical milestones from Mary J. Blige’s My Life to Frank Ocean’s Blonde and elevates new artists.
• Dustin offers reality-TV updates, housewives news, and reminders of the power of creating and sustaining Black-owned media platforms.

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Conclusion

[122:19–126:49...] The episode closes by circling back to the core lesson: even when institutions, laws, and power structures exclude, exploit, or marginalize Black inventors and culture shapers, the community innovates, archives, and collectively lifts each other up.

“As creatives and innovators continue to be unheralded, we have to take it upon ourselves to document it, to circulate it... feed it to the younger children so that they don’t get stifled or limited... whether the law recognizes us or not.” – Fran [122:19]

Solidarity, collective economics, and self-archiving are perpetual forms of mental wealth and mental hygiene — a recurring theme that powers The Friend Zone’s vision for Black history and the future.

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Additional Resources from the Episode

• Uncle Nearest Whiskey: uncle nearest.com
• Moonlit Ringlets (Lengthen Lock): moonlitringlets.com
• Ruby Love: rubylove.com
• Kareem Abdul Jabbar’s children’s book: “What Color is My World: The Lost History of African-American Inventors”
• Lemelson Center (Smithsonian): invention.si.edu

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Bottom Line

If you missed this episode, you missed a passionate, research-rich exploration of how Black creativity endures and why safeguarding our stories, honoring our inventors, and liberating our history from other people’s hands is essential, not optional.

Transcript

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[Dustin Ross]

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[Asante]

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[Dustin Ross]

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[Asante]

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[Dustin Ross]

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[Francesca (Fran)]

terms

[Dustin Ross]

welcome to the Friends.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Every time I'm in the zone.

[Asante]

My name is Dustin.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I'm Francesca, also known as K Friend.

[Asante]

Hey, my name is Asante.

[Dustin Ross]

This is the friend zone.

[Asante]

Let's start the show.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Behavior. You're dirty. You're dirty. Everybody was right about you. You're a piece of I see you.

[Dustin Ross]

I want you to know that I

[Francesca (Fran)]

want you to know that you know

[Dustin Ross]

I was going to change up. We had spoke. We had spoken previously Spoke we had spoken previously about changing the intro for the show. But things keep happening in the world that bring me right back to where we. Right back to where we started from, okay? That's where we at with it. This week we got two people who need to be addressed. Now, the first person that I'm gonna address, okay, Is John Davidson, okay? John Davidson is a Tourette syndrome activist who shouted nigger, okay? At the BAFTA Awards during Delroy Lindo and Michael B. Jordan presenting on stage, okay? So that happened. Me, personally, I was very upset. And I didn't give a fuck about him having no Tourette's because I understood that he was expressing his thoughts. And so I was highly offended by that shit. I'm still mad, okay? But the one thing that helped me tone it down two dials, right? Cause the anger is still on seven. It was at a nine, okay? Only reason it was at ten was. Cause I was still here and I wasn't over there where the baftas was looking for that motherfucker. But I was at nine. I came down to a seven when I saw a young black girl who actually has Tourette's syndrome, made a TikTok video like, hey, y', all, I know how this looks. I have slurs that are ticks, too. And we have no control over this. Completely involuntary, you know, I was gonna

[Francesca (Fran)]

say it's not necessarily what they're thinking. It's almost like the worst thing they could possibly say in a moment is exactly what gets pushed out of them. And it sucks for them.

[Dustin Ross]

And that is giving me. That's holding me back. I just put it like that. That's holding me back. Because at the end of the day, I'm not no ableist. I'm not a person who engages in ableism in no way, shape or form. And sometimes you have to think with logic instead of your feelings. You know what I'm saying? And so I felt like it was only right. Cause I know the people that listen to this show was probably just as offended as I was. And I just wanted to put that out there so that people have that information the same way I got that information. And y' all can do with it what y' all want. I'm not telling nobody how to feel. But factually, that helped me kind of curb a little bit of my anger. So for now, I'm not going to forgive him, per se. I'm not going to excuse nothing, you know what I'm saying? But I am going to move on. Because there is a possibility that that was not a feeling or expression that he wanted to make. And I am mature enough to understand that from a factual, scientific perspective. I get it. And that's all it takes for me to stand down.

[Francesca (Fran)]

But most of our anger should be directed to the BAFTA production team.

[Dustin Ross]

The production team brought it to us anyway.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah. As you're hearing more about how their production works, that they have delays like most shows. Right. And for this reason. And they were able, from my understanding, to execute the delay for a Palestine support speech that they edited down. But then somehow the producers claim that they missed. They missed this one, which I don't know how because I know there was an uproar while it was happening. There was people talking about it. I saw that even I believe it was Warner Bros. Reached out and told them, make sure that this is edited out before it goes live. So.

[Dustin Ross]

And it wasn't because nigger means the same thing over there that it means over here. And so they. The. The powers that be. We're going to take John Davidson out of it.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Exactly.

[Dustin Ross]

The people who are responsible for the moment itself, making it to air and affecting all of us, offending all of us. Okay.

[Asante]

And.

[Dustin Ross]

And they knew what they were doing because they knew that the focus would go from them, would never even land on them. The focus would be on the person that said it. They knew that he. He is, like I said, he campaigns for Tourette Syndrome. So people understand that that is something that he manages and deals with. And so they knew that they had that layer and there's an evil type of racism that would take advantage of that, that will manipulate that vulnerability that we all should be sensitive to. And they would allow the blame to be placed on him. There are people that are responsible for that moment making it to air, just like Fran said. And those are the racists that deserve all of our vitriol, all of our angst, you know, all of the Umbridge that we take with this whole moment. That's who deserve it. And that's where it goes. So y'. All. And you can shove that BAFTA up your ass. Whoever the was responsible for that making it to air. You bloke. I know a few UK insults too.

[Asante]

You know what I'm saying?

[Dustin Ross]

I know a few. So, you know, let's go there. But now it's another heifer named Allison Friedman, okay? She is a Hunter College professor here in New York City, and she was recently on a zoom call where she thought that her mic was off. And she said that black people are so dumb that they don't even realize that they're in a bad. That the school that they're going to is bad. She said that black people could be trained to walk out. If you train them to walk out the back door, that's where they're going to go, out the back door. They're so dumb. That's what she said about black people. You could see the reactions of the other Zoom Call participants in real time as her mic was going, wow. And one of the participants said, hey, we can. What you're saying is totally hearable. Please stop. We can hear what you're saying. And people are literally. Their mouths were open, their hands are on the sides of their faces like they were shocked. It was a Zoom call that they were having in preparation for something else, you know what I'm saying?

[Asante]

So it was like a staff meeting. That's even worse. She did in front of her peers.

[Dustin Ross]

So she. She is. Hold on, let me pull. Let me pull.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Not Hunter Collins.

[Dustin Ross]

That's her.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Oh, no, she's young.

[Dustin Ross]

It was during a meeting. That's her.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I thought maybe this was some old crabby, you know, but no, they're too

[Dustin Ross]

dumb to know they're in a bad school. That's what Allison Friedman thinks about our black asses.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Interesting.

[Dustin Ross]

A teacher. I've been telling y' all for years on this show that we need federally regulated vetting and a very deeper dive into who are the people that are responsible for educating us, educating our children and making decisions. This is it right in front of our face right now.

[Francesca (Fran)]

That's scary. This is someone grading the papers of

[Dustin Ross]

black students, a college professor. There's a willingness that adult learners have, right, that for you to manipulate that and kind of, you know, pounce on that. That vulnerability and that. That trust that students have with their instructors. And you, you were manipulating that and bastardizing it by being. Being installed in that type of position and saying that shit. Now, I could really get down on this whole, you know what I'm saying, with her.

[Asante]

She.

[Dustin Ross]

She literally looks like Winter Olympics right now, you know what I'm saying? She look like she over there in the sled, you know what I'm saying? She look like one of them. Ain't seen a lot of sun in the summertime, only winter sun, Skin white, you know what I'm saying? In color. I could really get down on her, you know what I'm saying? But I'm not even going to with her. What's the Aerosmith nigga's name?

[Francesca (Fran)]

Steven Tyler.

[Dustin Ross]

With her Steven Tyler looking ass. Don't do him not even gonna do that. Okay. Cause I've been crying since I heard you, bitch. You know what I'm saying? And I really could get down on her. But I would rather use this just to make our audience aware, you know what I'm saying? This is what the fuck is going on. This is what. What is happening in real time. We in a space and a time where racists who have always felt like this and will always continue to feel like this, but they have been emboldened, okay? And they have been incentivized and legitimized by the current political regime. They feel their chests are full right now, and they feel proudly racist. And this is the kind of shit you up against. Don't trust no damn body. Don't trust nobody. And check it every. All we can do, y', all, okay? Because this thing is systematic beyond words. All we can do is. Is do what we can, quite literally. You around a hole like this, you see her get caught up. You take that up however you feel like you can. Whether that means going to a board with. That means making phone calls until the person is removed. If she's in front of your face, slap her. Slap her. If she's in front of your face talking this shit. Yep. It's on a zoom call. And they have the square that people assume to be her speaking out of.

[Francesca (Fran)]

You did say that. Blurred people's faces. Oof.

[Dustin Ross]

They have her square. Blurred, but blurred. But as you can see. Here she go. Here she go. Cause this. My screen ain't blurred.

[Francesca (Fran)]

They gonna have her square blurred in the face.

[Dustin Ross]

Here she go, right? Take a good look. Take a look at her now. Look at her. That's her.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yikes. College professor.

[Asante]

Tsk, tsk, tsk.

[Dustin Ross]

And her name is spelled Alison. A L L Y S O N. Freedman. F R I E D M A N. Once again, she is a college professor. CUNY at Hunter College here in New York City.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Because, you know, CUNY has such a high population of black and brown students.

[Asante]

Such a diverse.

[Francesca (Fran)]

That part is what's scary to me.

[Asante]

Yep.

[Dustin Ross]

Allison Friedman. A L, L Y S O N. Friedman. Cuny. C U N Y. Hunter College.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Make the phone call if she was your professor. Go get your transcript revised.

[Asante]

Demand it.

[Dustin Ross]

Go talk to someone. Demand it. Um, heckle her. Cause I believe the ho's still working. And to me, you know, free speech heckler. You see her in that hallway. Heckler. Because the kids are all right. And then them college students that feel that fire and that spirit in them that the young Americans have that are on the right side, the correct side of this. They're gonna bring it to her door, quite literally. I'm not encouraging nobody to hurt that woman. But people need to make the power, the powers that be, the people that employ her and the people that thus, thusly empower, they need to be made aware how we feel about what the fuck this holding said about black people. Once again. So you, you know, black people being so dumb that we don't even realize that the school we're attending is bad. And also we're so dumb that if you train us to go out the back door, we will. Like we did back in the 60s. That's what this whole said. Get down on her, call that. Call them numbers. Allison Friedman, CUNY Hunter College. Call them numbers, email those people, bring it to her. Because we ain't having that on our watch. Straight up. And with that being said, welcome to the Friends on your weekly look into all things mental health, mental wellness and mental hygiene. Because who in the hell wants a racist ass college professor? I know I don't.

[Asante]

And I know you don't.

[Francesca (Fran)]

The sad part is you talked about her being about these types of professors needing to be vetted, but how if the system is racist, that's. This is exactly who they want.

[Asante]

Yeah, right.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Ain't no vetting.

[Dustin Ross]

If I was president. If I was president, whoever is responsible for executing that type of change, we need a. We need reform to the way that our educators are chosen, to their pay, their compensation, all that shit needs to be reformed. And to me, a job that's that important. You should have to really go through some rigorous, rigorous training, teachings, sensitivity trainings. And your level of education to be an instructor should be high. Higher to me than what it currently is. And there needs to be fitness tests for these people to see if they're fit for that job. I don't know what that looks like, but somebody has the job of determining what that looks like and making sure that it is a process, it's a due process. And so that's the kind of reform we need. And if you vote for me in District 32, I will definitely be. That's what I'll be on right now.

[Francesca (Fran)]

If I was a politics platform, education,

[Dustin Ross]

I'll be running on education reform for real. I would. Because teachers need to make more money. They need to make a lot more money. Okay. And they need. There needs to be a, a more thorough process to a person being allowed to do that job. That's what I think.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And the administrations too. Because my mom was a phenomenal teacher. And a lot of why she didn't keep going past retirement was that the administration wanted to bring in all these young white girls, you know, especially into the inner cities, and really had no respect for the older, elder black teachers, you know, and really we're trying to push them out. There's so much reform that needs to be done on every level of school.

[Dustin Ross]

Alison Friedman. Y' all so N. Friedman. Okay.

[Asante]

For the rest of Black History month, well into women's history, let them know how you feel.

[Dustin Ross]

Let them know how you feel. Let them and her know how you feel. That's what we can do. So let's do that. Hey, friend. Hey, Sante. How y' all doing today?

[Francesca (Fran)]

Doing good, Doing good.

[Dustin Ross]

That's good, that's good. Alison Friedman. No, I'm just playing.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And on the flip side of that, let's highlight a black business of the week. So I had a doctor's appointment this past week and my doctor was actually talking to me. We were talking about like menstrual cycles. And she asked me if I had been using any of the new technology that's available to us, especially with like leak proof underwear that women are wearing to not have to deal with pads or cups or tampons or any of the things. I told her that I still felt a little uncomfortable. Like I had tried it, but I think I hadn't fully wrapped my brain around the thought of just putting on underwear and just bleeding into it. Tmi. But we're all adults.

[Asante]

Yeah.

[Francesca (Fran)]

But she told me about a black owned company called Ruby Love that was founded.

[Asante]

I like that name.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Right?

[Asante]

I love it already.

[Dustin Ross]

I think I call mine Ruby, if I had one.

[Francesca (Fran)]

You know what it's called? Ruby Love. It was founded by black women. Founded by Crystal Etienne in 2015. It was formerly known as Panty Proposed, but she changed it.

[Dustin Ross]

Makes sense.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I think that was great. And it's an apparel company rooted in the belief that periods should never stop women from doing, being and going.

[Dustin Ross]

I agree.

[Francesca (Fran)]

She developed a smart, intuitive, patent pending technology that offers maximum absorption and protection against leaks and stains. And as a result, Ruby loves period clothing. Delivers peace of mind and complete discretion. So period days can be like every other day. And I love it because it's not just underwear. She has like PJs, pants, loungewear, just really comprehensive list of products that a woman can use during her cycle. And the best part, which is what sold me when my doctor brought it up, she said, and the panties fit our butts. Listen, it's something that is just so simple but so, so important.

[Dustin Ross]

Shout out to your doctor for even talking to you about this. That's. That's. That means you have a good doctor.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah, she's great. And things aren't, you know, things aren't usually designed with our bodies and minds. We deal with that when we try on jeans, dresses, all of the things. So it's nice when a black woman does design with our bodies in mind. So something to check out. Ruby Love. That's R U B Y L O V E dot com. I'm actually going to order some.

[Dustin Ross]

Let us know.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah, I'm gonna let you guys know how I feel. You know, like I said, I'm right. I'm old.

[Asante]

About your Ruby Loves girl.

[Dustin Ross]

And if she want to make some Rudy gloves, you know what I'm saying? I might take some, you know.

[Asante]

Okay.

[Francesca (Fran)]

You know, I feel old school. I'm still. I'm still wrapping my. My mind around the new ways to do this thing.

[Dustin Ross]

But you've been doing it a certain way all your life, though. You know what I mean?

[Francesca (Fran)]

You know, it's just certain things. But this is. I love this and I want to support. And I think the fact that my doctor, of all people would suggest this, you know, like, clearly she's not going to put me onto some bullshit. And she said her and her daughters all wear it, so. Check it out, actually.

[Dustin Ross]

I see now, I wonder what the note was, friend. When they was designed, you know, they said they designed the panties for black women.

[Asante]

You know what I'm saying?

[Dustin Ross]

So I just wonder what.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Make it a little white.

[Dustin Ross]

Pull that hip down. Pull the hip down. Okay, There you go. Now we're gonna add a half an inch to that side of the pattern. There you go. See that?

[Asante]

And make sure there's some elastic here. We need that stretch.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I'm seeing now, too. I'm on the site. It says use code hello, 10 for 10 off your order. So they're currently having a. Actually, I see something down here that says get 30 off. Oh. When you sign up with your email. Okay. So some offers for Y' all on rubylove.com and thank you to my doctor for putting me on. I actually, I was really happy to have found a black gynecologist in Oregon that felt like a needle in a haystack. You hear me? So for us to be able to have. You know what I'm saying, For us to be able to have these types of conversations, for me just really solidified the importance, right, of having Black service providers. Because who else could have put that on my awareness, you know what I mean? On my radar. So you would have been offended if

[Dustin Ross]

your doctor was white and asked you some like that? Well, did you try the ones for the blacks?

[Francesca (Fran)]

Could you imagine your butts so fast? Ruby Love. Let's jump into our recap segment. Last week's episode titled Hugging a Barnacle. Thank you so much, Dustin Ross. It was a shoot this episode. No hot button, no segments, just whatever wanted to come up. Those of you listening had a lot to say. Who stood out to you? Asante.

[Asante]

Shout out to everybody in the Spotify streets. First comment I want to share is from W E W N T 8387.

[Dustin Ross]

I thought you said Du Bois

[Asante]

the first time.

[Dustin Ross]

When I read it from W.E.B. du Bois, I was going to be

[Asante]

like, well, it's really not right now.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Wow, classic. I like that from the Vault.

[Asante]

It's real nowhere.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Imagine meeting a kid named Web. You be like, all right now, don't

[Asante]

get nobody no ideas now. That kid gonna grow manic. But I heard him a friend zone. And that's why I have my name. Anyway, this comment reads, I'm stuck in Puerto Vallarta and so thankful for y' all getting me through this and helping me laugh.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Oh, no, wait a minute. They're stuck in Puerto Vallarta with all this cartel.

[Asante]

Like, I can't believe you are listening to us while you are going through that. So I don't want to say, you're welcome, but thank you for listening to us because that's crazy.

[Dustin Ross]

Baby, I don't want to talk too much, right?

[Francesca (Fran)]

Like let us know you made it home, please.

[Asante]

Yes.

[Dustin Ross]

I don't want to say too much, right? But I know somebody that's got a business over in pvr. Baby, they paid. They dropped that bag so quick and got protected.

[Asante]

Okay, when I tell you they business

[Dustin Ross]

still standing, okay, that's all I' ma say. Because I was concerned when I heard the news. You know what I'm saying?

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah.

[Dustin Ross]

So I reached out. They like, I'm chilling on my balcony.

[Francesca (Fran)]

You know what?

[Dustin Ross]

They moved over there to open a business and it's thriving and I'm sure

[Asante]

it's in the area.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah, yeah, let me shut up.

[Asante]

Next comment I want to share is from BA Style Girl. It says Danny Evans of America's Next Top Model is doing well. She has a hat slash accessories brand called Monroe nyc and she currently has a collab with J. Crew.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Fire.

[Asante]

Yeah, it's good to know that the some of the top model girls out there doing well. Speaking of top model just she was

[Dustin Ross]

one of the ones that was still pretty in that doll.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah. When she came up on the screen I know all of us was like

[Dustin Ross]

she was one of the ones that was. Was still pretty.

[Asante]

Last comment I would like to share is from pre this comment

[Dustin Ross]

who is

[Asante]

ugly T friends laugh when she saw it was Rita Ora had me down too. Was tickled. That lady's reach is insane cuz how that happened exactly. I would like to add to that comment it was not only friend who was down last week because I was just as down if not more when I witnessed that. Which is why we could not share it with you. And I'm so glad that you got to see that because I could not believe it with my own eyes. And I was like I don't remember this. And so I needed.

[Francesca (Fran)]

No, go ahead, go ahead for the truth.

[Asante]

I just needed someone else to confirm it. I had another friend that says that they kind of think they remembered that and I was like maybe that is how she came on the scene that I've been ignoring her from. I don't know like because I don't really know her origins but what we want to say.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I was, I was saying one of our listeners I wish I had saved this said not too much Rita Ora seasons was good.

[Asante]

Okay.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Better than Tyra.

[Asante]

Really.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I'm not bringing your name so they

[Dustin Ross]

don't get you cuz they will get you for that.

[Asante]

Look whoever left that comment double back with what seasons and what episodes and what cycles you believe were better than Tyrus.

[Dustin Ross]

Oh, some real. We wouldn't know so we literally would

[Francesca (Fran)]

not know that far. And it might be.

[Asante]

That's. That's what I'm asking. Not for receipts but like I want to.

[Dustin Ross]

I want to know

[Francesca (Fran)]

listener made fun of me because okay, I have to defend myself here. Okay friend, you said I held my phone up like lala. I don't know what that means but I feel like it was Shade when

[Dustin Ross]

she was at the game.

[Asante]

You remember?

[Francesca (Fran)]

I just knew it was Shade.

[Dustin Ross]

They said that's how she be holding the phone up to mellow when her son wanted to talk to him. His son on the phone. That's what they said.

[Asante]

It was me not remembering and then Dustin instantly remembering brought you back to the life.

[Francesca (Fran)]

They said it's Fran holding up her phone. Any more comments?

[Asante]

No friend. What did you find out? Denim Streets girl.

[Francesca (Fran)]

So Taylor said in the phone back

[Asante]

no, I'm just kidding. I'm Sorry.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Taylor said, in the wise words of Crystal, what is a Rita aura?

[Dustin Ross]

Wow. Shout out to Crystal because she said that for real.

[Asante]

She did.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Carly S. Says, Morgan Wallen, Melanie Martinez, and Christina Grimmie. Oh, I remember Christina Grimmie. That was the artist that got killed at her meet and greet. Damn that, like, years ago. She said, those are the biggest names that came from the Voice, but none of them actually won their season. And Benson Boone also came from a recent season, American Idol, but he dropped out early. It's like not winning is better for their careers from these competition shows. Great.

[Dustin Ross]

I like Vincent Boone.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I remember them sparkly blue bodies.

[Dustin Ross]

He was in them. He wears britches. He wears britches. He impressed me performing. Remember, he was jumping off them pianos and was it the stage or the VMAs? I think it was.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I remember I was impressed.

[Asante]

He had a little live run.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah.

[Francesca (Fran)]

So he's from American Idol.

[Asante]

I had no idea. Look, I think I heard that, but I remember that being a theme. Even back back in the good seasons, right. There were people that didn't win that were still getting work. Like, even Reuben stuttered, won his season. But Clay Aiken, I think, was, like, doing more than he was at the time. And I was like, why y' all

[Dustin Ross]

doing this to the. So, yeah, there's always been a Clay Aiken. When he sang Bridge Over Trouble, Water that moved.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Really? When you're weary.

[Dustin Ross]

And no, I did. I loved me some Clay Aiken. Couldn't nobody say he did Solitaire.

[Asante]

I'll never forget that.

[Dustin Ross]

Oh, my God. And remember when they finally got his haircut right and put them highlights in, they made. They, like, glammed him up. He didn't. He still looked like.

[Asante]

I was like, okay, good a nerd.

[Dustin Ross]

But he was like, you know what I'm saying?

[Asante]

Was still.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah, he. He wore Bridge Over Trouble Water. He wore a couple songs out, but Bridge Over Trouble Water was the one.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Okay, well, I need to revisit and

[Dustin Ross]

Sugar Pie Honey Bunch, because he tore that up, too.

[Asante]

Yeah.

[Francesca (Fran)]

What a choice. A Letters says there's another documentary about America's model, Avi Letters. Oh, that is coming out on e. News on March 11th. And Janice Dickinson is in that one and a bunch of other girls. I think they didn't want to do the Netflix one because they said that Ty was going to be a part of that one. I actually did see, y' all remember. Oh, my God. Was her name Jaslyn? She was like the Latin.

[Dustin Ross]

She was pretty.

[Francesca (Fran)]

That one. Remember? I totally forgot about it. She popped up on my Tik Tok feed, giving her, you know, thoughts on the show. And I was like, oh, first of

[Dustin Ross]

all, she was dope as hell.

[Francesca (Fran)]

She looks the same. And she's was talking about the new doc that's coming out because she's actually in it. And then I saw some clips from it, which. Which crazy because Janice is in it. At least the clip I saw where she. Oh, yeah, Tyra. Talking about Tyra being the villain. And in my mind, I'm like, now, ma'. Am.

[Dustin Ross]

Right. Coming from the.

[Francesca (Fran)]

We're not gonna do that.

[Dustin Ross]

Claudia Jordan is in that documentary too. Shout out to Claudia Jordan because she's gonna be discussing her time on the Price Is Right in that documentary. So they're focusing on a couple different shows.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Gotcha.

[Dustin Ross]

And it is going to be a shocking expose.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I will say this. I have been watching the clips that have circulated online of the J's and Nigel Barker. Not so much Nigel, mainly Jay Manuel, to be honest. I just feel like they're leaning into this now in a way that's starting to come off really corny.

[Dustin Ross]

A lot of people feel like that because now it's.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Now it's feeling like you are trying to jump on the momentum that everyone's angry at Tyra. And now it's. It's just like I was talking to Ty about it. I was like, I almost wish they would just stop. They should have just left it at their thoughts in the dock.

[Asante]

Right?

[Francesca (Fran)]

Stop trying to turn this into maybe some propelment into whatever you're hoping. Yeah. Because it's just looking really strange.

[Asante]

That already looks bad for Tyranny.

[Francesca (Fran)]

It. And we all watched it and you guys were a part of it.

[Asante]

Right. Look, everyone was culpable, you know, and

[Francesca (Fran)]

Jade made a great point. I was on getting grown, by the way co hosting. No, you didn't.

[Asante]

Word.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I was co hosting on getting grown, by the way.

[Dustin Ross]

Shout out to you. Let's clap for that.

[Asante]

Go ahead.

[Dustin Ross]

Shout out to you.

[Asante]

Love you, Kia.

[Dustin Ross]

Love you, Kia.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Love sister.

[Dustin Ross]

Yes, we even love you. Jade

[Asante]

doesn't even love you. Trill.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Jade brought up great point that she feels that Tyra is the fall guy and there's bigger power players at play that for some reason got to kind of skate by on this entire. In this entire doc. And she's absolutely right.

[Asante]

Right.

[Dustin Ross]

I agree. And just on some black shit, Tyranny

[Francesca (Fran)]

is a villain, but also there are people above her that have continued this pattern on with all of the shows and all of the things as we're Seeing even with professors at university, it's a larger problem. So.

[Dustin Ross]

Yes, it is. Tyra, you didn't make it no better. Swaddled in that trench coat, smiling. And Jay met Mr. J. I want to have a conversation with you. One of the things I want to talk to you about is stop smiling when you talk about serious shit. Because that's why people take y' all full of shit like that. You see, friend was like. And it. James, not so much. Nigel J. Manuel. See, people wouldn't feel that way if you were just. You know what I'm saying?

[Francesca (Fran)]

They all need to zip it.

[Dustin Ross]

Say it one time in one big place. Y' all should have interviewed with Gayle King or went on ABC News and did one interview and gone about your

[Francesca (Fran)]

ass and let it go, right?

[Dustin Ross]

Because all of this other. And that's. I feel like y' all need to go on Zeus. Remember when they used to do the conversation on Zeus and having people come, they had beef and they would sit down and talk and try not to fist fight.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Rest in peace, Roland Ray.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah, right, man. God rest his soul.

[Francesca (Fran)]

But I just have to say that because it's been. I just feel like it's too much now. Like y' all said, how you feel about Tyra. Let's let whatever's supposed to happen happen with what's going on with this talk. But y', all, like, if we.

[Asante]

If we need y' all again, we will call y'.

[Dustin Ross]

All.

[Francesca (Fran)]

We know where to find you. You know what I'm saying? The episode the week prior was titled Leave a Voicemail, and that was produced by Asante. We continued our Black History Month celebrations. We explored who really preserves black history, what gets lost when stories aren't recorded, and how everyday people, not just institutions, keep our culture alive. And then we ended with a simple challenge to preserve one piece of personal history before it faded.

[Dustin Ross]

Pull up my tweets. Sorry.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Ahsante, who stood out to you in the comments for your episode?

[Asante]

As funny as there is, as funniest that it's. Justin, that's actually great, you know, but shout out to everybody in the comments. So many of you enjoyed the episode in the Spotify streets here. I want to comment. I want to shout out urgent.

[Dustin Ross]

J.

[Asante]

It's urgent. But with A. It's urgent. I mean, urgent. D, C, urgency. But it's like with a J in there. Okay. A lot of things happen there. Anyway. The comment reads. Their comment reads. Y' all are making me so nostalgic. I met my first friends in high school because we had the same commute in common. We were all riding from 6am from the Bronx to East Harlem. And I stayed in touch with my best friends from middle school because we both took the six. Six. Growing up in NYC is such a gift. You're exposed to so many different cultures and you first in your first taste of the world. I'm a surgeon New Yorker and feel so blessed to continue holding space here.

[Dustin Ross]

That's awesome.

[Francesca (Fran)]

That makes me so happy. You know, one of the girls from the train reached out. Yeah. I don't even understand how that made my heart explode. And she said that she's been following my work all these years, but just never reached out because she wasn't entirely sure I was gonna like, remember. And I'm like, what?

[Dustin Ross]

Oh my God, you're making me emotional, friend.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah, we were babies, but you don't forget people like that. You rode the train with every morning for like damn near what, three years probably because I don't think it was a full four. But I know, right to just.

[Dustin Ross]

My heart was like, y' all know how I am about stuff.

[Asante]

Sweet.

[Dustin Ross]

That. That's. That's the real right there. So that kind of stuff, friend.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And she has a family and to see kids and I just. It's just like so lovely. I. That's the New York experience that is just unmatched, you know?

[Dustin Ross]

Man, that's so cool. Like, that is just.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Especially when she was like, I'm so proud of you, you know, like when I think of us taking that damn train.

[Dustin Ross]

I'm so glad you talked about that.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Right. Such a wonderful experience. That really did it for me. I needed that. Such a reminder. And she.

[Dustin Ross]

I want to run around.

[Asante]

My.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Best part is how like beautiful she looks and she's doing well. And like that just really.

[Dustin Ross]

Hey, hey, train friend.

[Asante]

Shout out to. It's break to you as well. It's break to you. Well, just. It's break to you. Their comment reads, it's extremely important that we archive our music slash party experiences. You know, back to the conversation. And Dustin, you're offering, which is super important as well. Because friend, I really love that New York piece too. Like. Like, not even the part that Dustin's getting emotional about, but just like thinking about like. Like being a city kid. So that's why I had to read that comment. But like Dustin talking about the party scene. Back to this comment. This comment reads. When we catch documentaries, music and dance tells a big part of city's histories. Being from nyc, the documentation of our hip hop, punk Rock, jazz and disco scenes were critical to telling our story. NYC has changed a lot in the 2010s, 2020s. As businesses close, natives leave the city and people try to rewrite the truth, our stories are disappearing. Save pictures, write stories and share them them widely so we don't lose them. So, Dustin, you have to make sure you, you know, recreate these scenes Autumn, all of your experiences because you've seen and you've done so much. Last comment I want to share in the Spotify Streets comes from Sam with the butterfly emoji. Sam with the butterfly emojis comment reads. I've. I'm currently becoming my family's archivist. By documentary, by documenting, excuse me, the stories of the generations before me. It can sometimes be difficult when the older folks are private and don't want to share. But learning more about the people who came before my family. Okay, but learning about the people who came before me has been incredibly rewarding. As black and indigenous people, it's imperative we document our own history. That was super, super dope. There was one other comment. I couldn't find it. I scrolled past it, but they said that they, they gave their mom a book that said it's a cookbook and it's Nana's recipes and her mom is supposed to fill it out for her children. And I thought that was dope.

[Dustin Ross]

That's super dope.

[Asante]

I want to make sure I share that.

[Francesca (Fran)]

That's actually a really great gift. I did the same for my, my partner's older sister. The one I told you is a sheriff Asante in North Carolina. She is also a phenomenal. I'm talking about phenomenal chef, Mrs. E. And I got her one of those recipe books that has the slots in it so she can little tabs, you

[Dustin Ross]

know, you can write like so cool,

[Francesca (Fran)]

like dessert section, entrees, appetizers. And I think it's just a great gift to give to your friends that are the chef chefs.

[Asante]

Yeah.

[Francesca (Fran)]

So that they can take some time out over the years, write down their recipes and that's a great gift they can pass on to their family. So.

[Dustin Ross]

Absolutely.

[Francesca (Fran)]

That is, that is a great Mother's Day gift too.

[Asante]

I know it seems kind of like one of those, like, what am I supposed to do? But this is so like nostalgic and sentimental and special. I want to just read the comment. I'm gonna give you the ball, friend. It was from Mrs. E. Mrs. E said she loved the conversation. Last Christmas, I bought my mama wooden engraved cookbook, Nana's recipes to Write down all of her recipes for us to have forever. I reading her notes and sharing this cookbook with my children. So shout out to you Mrs. That was super, super dope when I read that.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I love that brand.

[Asante]

What did you find out there in those streets?

[Francesca (Fran)]

So Charlotte says a few years ago my dad passed away from cancer. He would randomly call and if I didn't answer, he would leave a voicemail singing, I just called to say I love you. I was so glad to have one of those voicemails saved. Subconsciously, I started saving voicemails from my mom. She unexpectedly passed a year after my dad and I have a years of voicemails from her and even a book she recorded herself reading from my unborn child. Those voicemails mean the world to me. And now my son gets to hear his grandma tell him she loves him and reading to him.

[Asante]

We love you, Charlotte. We love you.

[Dustin Ross]

Y' all trying to take me the out this week. I mean like, what the fuck?

[Francesca (Fran)]

This is the most beautiful thing I've ever heard. And we sending you so much love,

[Dustin Ross]

Charlotte, for losing experience. We love you and shout out you to your your baby for having that beautiful gift. God damn.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Leave a voicemail. What a great concept. What a great prompt. What a great conversation. Thank you for that. Asante. I saw a grandpa actually it was on TikTok. He read a gift that he gave to his grandkids. He read the entire Bible.

[Asante]

Oh, wow.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I'm like, how long did that take him?

[Dustin Ross]

And wow.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And recorded it and put it on thumb drop. Dustin, I will fight you. Put it on thumb drop and gave it to his grandkids. So they have his voice reading the Bible. I think that's amazing gift with plus

[Dustin Ross]

a trust though, you know what I'm saying? Like if you're gonna give me some papa.

[Asante]

That was it.

[Dustin Ross]

If you gonna give me something. No, no. You know what I'm saying?

[Francesca (Fran)]

I love it. I think it's beautiful.

[Dustin Ross]

It is.

[Asante]

It was a great episode, but mostly in part due to YouTube as well. Offering so so much and all of you out there listening, offering. So thank you all for enjoying it.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Comments? Hold on, I'm not done. Just B says I'm like Fran, with some of the things I have of my grandmother's. I have her Bible, a statue she always had on display in the living room, two of her skillets, and gold press on pinky nail. I was like, wait, what? That apparently was cool to wear in the 60s. They all hold so much value for me because my grandmother means so Much to me also. Here's the good one for you, Dustin. Dustin. My aunt has a portrait of my great grandmother that was drawn by your uncle. It's the only picture I've ever seen of her because she passed away when my grandmother was young. So thank you to your uncle Laverne, Rest in peace for immortalizing a piece of my family history that will hopefully be able to be passed down for years to come.

[Dustin Ross]

But, wow.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I'll tell you, y' all are.

[Dustin Ross]

This episode is called Sadness. Thank you. Wow, that's so dope. Shout out to you, lavarn. Shout out to your family. Shout out to everybody.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I have Greens.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah.

[Francesca (Fran)]

For him to create, literally, a family heirloom coming from your family, I thought that that was so.

[Dustin Ross]

That's super dope. And what a connection, man. That's why I love and am so grateful for this show, because just look in this one episode, right? This show reconnected you with a childhood acquaintance who was long separated from you. Right through the show this week, we find out that my uncle was responsible for something so meaningful to the person that listens to this show. And just making that connection, like, that's just. That's the magic. That's the shit that made me believe in God for real. So shout out to Yum. That's great.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Wait.

[Dustin Ross]

I'm about to turn back into the other Dustin and get up out of this armpit of emotions and feelings. And that's it. So let's go.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And then my last comment, Deja said, I so relate to you, friend. About taking the train to school. As a kid, my mom and I moved from Louisville, Kentucky, to Far Rockaway, Queens. That is a twist.

[Asante]

Culture shock.

[Francesca (Fran)]

What? When I was in middle school, it was such a culture shock. I bet, girl. And my mom was so worried about me taking the bus to school that she popped up to make sure I made it on my first day. When high school came, I chose a performing arts school two hours away in Harlem. Looking back, I can't believe I was able to do that so young, but it was so worth it because I was in school with all black and brown kids. I had to tell my mom recently that I'm so grateful for that part of my life. That wasn't something that would have been possible if we had stayed in Kentucky.

[Dustin Ross]

Shout out, man.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Beautiful coming of age.

[Dustin Ross]

I love New York City for that reason right there. And I've been out of school, and I love New York for the same exact reasons. You know what I'm saying? That is so that. That Shit is like living a television show to me. Even your. Your co transit partner reaching out back. You know what I'm saying? And now that's.

[Francesca (Fran)]

But even as an adult, it happens. How many times have you had a long train ride and ended up in conversation with someone and then y' all ended up. Does

[Dustin Ross]

I always stand up on the train for that reason? I look better standing up than I do sitting down. So I don't mind stuff.

[Asante]

You want to see?

[Dustin Ross]

Sure, go ahead, sit down. Have a seat. I stand because I know that I look better that way. You know what I'm saying?

[Francesca (Fran)]

And end up in full conversation for the rest of the ride. Or like connecting. That ends up being a fun. Like, you just never frontal. You just never know, you know? Yes, Dustin Ross. What you find in them Twitter streets.

[Dustin Ross]

I keep it brief. Okay. This is actually. Breaking news. I decided I'm gonna start doing it live. So shout out to Variety. Variety just tweeted that the Rock and Roll hall of fame has announced 17 nominees for his class of 2026. So these are the people that are eligible for induction into the Rock and Roll hall of Fame. That's a big deal for people that make music. Here's the list. The Black Crows, Jeff Buckley, Mariah Carey, Phil Collins. Y' all gotta vote. Y' all know how this works. So Phil Collins, Melissa Etheridge, Lauryn Hill. So y'.

[Asante]

All.

[Dustin Ross]

Y' all gotta vote for Lauren now because we need time to. You know, you gotta.

[Francesca (Fran)]

How many people can be chosen from this list? How does it work?

[Dustin Ross]

Let me see. I'm gonna look on the article and tell you quite shortly. But I know there's multiple, though, okay? Because it's different fields, but. So Lauryn Hill, Billy Idol, nxs. Who I love. Iron Maiden, Joy Division, New Order, New Edition, Oasis. I'm not rooting for Oasis.

[Francesca (Fran)]

But the music be music.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah, the music is. I mean, it's. That's why we mad, because we wanted to be able to still like them songs. But anyway.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Pink.

[Dustin Ross]

Oh, Shade. Shakira.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Wow, y'.

[Dustin Ross]

All. And this one to announce the next one I'mma. Okay, so Wuang Clan.

[Francesca (Fran)]

What?

[Dustin Ross]

And the next one I'm gonna pass over to share. Who's X? Sharon. Luther Vandross. Luther Vandross. So those are the people. Now I'm about to give you the

[Francesca (Fran)]

black people, Stephen Simmons. Cause you guys.

[Dustin Ross]

Right, right. Looking like Janice Dickinson. That's why y' all evil motherfuckers look alike. Now here's the black people, so we know who to vote for. Mariah Carey, Lauryn Hill, New Edition Sade, Luther Vandross, and the Wu Tang Clan. I don't think it's gonna be hard to remember those names.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Okay, and Pink's first album.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah, and Pink. Yep, and Pink's first album. That's right.

[Asante]

You know, a lot of tricks in there.

[Dustin Ross]

Honorable mention, right? Honorable mention.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Pink.

[Asante]

Yes, friend. You don't like pink? Circus pink.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah, but we talking about the black.

[Francesca (Fran)]

But I mean, the black one.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah, she was the first black.

[Asante]

Not black. Pink.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah, she was the first black pink. She was burgundy. So, yes, those are the people. Now, let me go to this Variety article and see if it identifies how many people people will be.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Hopefully is more than one in that category, because that would be tough to choose between all those greats. Wow.

[Dustin Ross]

Let me see. And this is Mariah Carey's third time being nominated. Does it say how many people that they're going to choose at the time for their inductees? No. So unfortunately, this article doesn't say, but we'll have to do our research, if you want to know. You can do your own research. Not you. I'm talking about the people listening.

[Francesca (Fran)]

So I was like.

[Dustin Ross]

I would never say that.

[Asante]

I would never do that.

[Dustin Ross]

That's why I was like. Let me clear that up, because I don't think that sounded right. That ain't my heart. Y' all know that. It's not my heart. So. Yes, but those are the people we gotta vote. Vote, vote, vote, vote. If we want the people that we want to get it, to get it. Salt and pepper. Got one. Mary J. Blige is in there. Missy Elliott is in there. There's a lot of people who are in there.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Mariah deserves this.

[Dustin Ross]

Her third time being nominated. So we gotta push her through. We gotta vote for Mariah, y'.

[Asante]

All.

[Dustin Ross]

Hopefully, the third time's the charm. So y' all know I'm obsessed with awards, awards season, all of that. I love it. I love keeping up with the stats and shit, you know, so I'm obsessed with, you know, finding out the odds. So I. I can't wait to see. See what happens.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I love that.

[Asante]

I'm surprised some of them people aren't already in there.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Like Sade. Right. Of all people. Thank you for that, though. Hopefully.

[Dustin Ross]

No problem.

[Francesca (Fran)]

More information.

[Dustin Ross]

Get stuff, period. Because her glam don't take a long time. That hairstylist do that bone snatch, and then the makeup artist put a red lip.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Relatable, relatable.

[Dustin Ross]

And is she in there? You know what I'm saying? So let her go. You know what I'm saying? Yeah.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Before we jump into this week's episode, does anyone have any announcements they'd like to share with the class?

[Dustin Ross]

Sante.

[Asante]

Thank you to everyone that has come to our wind down. If you've missed it, it will be re. What do we call the wind down? The recap. I always want to call it the recap. The replay. See, because it's a re and then

[Dustin Ross]

I replay, recap and lefties.

[Asante]

If you don't know any of what we're talking about anyway, you need to find out. Over on patreon.com the Prince on podcast, where you can find video of us doing this commercial. Free, if you want to see. But some of y' all enjoy the commercial, and I don't mind that because I enjoy me a commercial too, to do everything.

[Dustin Ross]

Ours is entertaining. We make it. We add entertainment value to our ads.

[Asante]

Yeah. But also, if you just want to see us, that is where you can see us. Patreon.com friendzone podcast. Podcast. We will we go live for you at the end of every month. We have comment. We have commentary. And during our shows where we watch a TV show or a movie and we read a book, I mean, we're expanding the conversations around all of the forms of media. And you should join us [e-mail] friends on podcast.

[Dustin Ross]

Okay, so, yeah. And you know what I'm saying. Thank you to everybody that bought a ticket to my comedy show because I'm officially sold out at capacity. You know what I'm saying?

[Asante]

Oh, my God.

[Francesca (Fran)]

There's a hummingbird that just tapped on the window right as you said it. I wish there was a way I could turn this camera. A whole hummingbird is tapping on my window as you're talking, but yay. I said wait, the hummingbird.

[Asante]

Yeah. Oh, my God.

[Dustin Ross]

That's a hummingbird with a shape. But yeah, I'm so happy.

[Francesca (Fran)]

So two fingers touching.

[Dustin Ross]

I guess I could announce here. You know what I'm saying? I'll give the Friend zone audience an exclusive. I'm very excited that we're gonna do a second show that same night.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Come on.

[Dustin Ross]

We're not announcing it until Friday, so this is a bit early information, but there has been a second show added and tickets gonna sell this Friday, so those will be available at DustinRoss Live.

[Asante]

Comrades. Dustin.

[Dustin Ross]

Dustin, New York, Stand up. I can't wait. I wrote a bunch of new shit. We gonna laugh. We gonna laugh. So I'm so happy and just. I'm so more than anything. I'm grateful because this is my second year doing stand up comedy. It's new for me and the audience trusting me and believing in me just from the shit they heard me talking here and on the other platforms. I'm grateful to occupy. Y' all bought tickets and that means a lot to me and so I don't ever want that message to be lost. Thank you from the bottom of my heart. That means a lot and I can't wait to deliver. So I'll see y' all on St Patrick's Day, March 17. City Winery, New York City. Baby, we on water. Y' all know the vibe, so pull up, have you a drink, some light bites, a little Nash, you know what I'm saying? And I get on stage, oh, I'm going to. I got some time. I said, I wrote something the other day. I was like, I can't say that. So, you know, for me, not for me to be like, I can't say that. Y' all see where I'm going with the whole set. So I'm just grateful. Thank you. And tickets gonna sell this Friday. Dustinrosslive.com that's all you need.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Amen. And as always, as always, the link will be below in the description box for easier access. That means that that's it for us. That's it for us. See you next week. Bye. Bye.

[Dustin Ross]

Like Natasha Morgan.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Put that in. That's it for this week's intro. Let's jump into the episode. I will see you too. Okay, bye. Welcome to the Friends Rocket Money is a personal finance app that helps find and cancel your unwanted subscriptions. It monitors your spending and helps lower your bills so you can grow your savings. They can help you track your subscriptions, and they have the ability to cancel within the app. With just a few taps, saving you time and avoiding extra charges, you can set budgets and goals, get personalized insights, regular reports, and even receive real time alerts for your large transactions as well as upcoming bills, refunds, low balances, you know, all of the things. You can also consolidate your checking, your savings, loans and investments all into a single dashboard. That way you have a clear view of your finances. I love that this is essentially a dashboard of everything that's coming in and going out. I think it's a great way to stay on top of your finances. A lot of times people can become avoidant or we just have a lot of things that we're juggling, so it can be hard to keep your mind on so many things. And I like that. Rocket Money has consolidated, all of it, just to make sure that you can see it and most importantly, stay on top of it. So let Rocket Money help you reach your financial goals faster and join Rocketmoney.com zone. That's Rocketmoney.com zone.

[Dustin Ross]

All right, look here. February is that stretch of the school year when routines are set, expectations are higher, and schoolwork starts to feel more demanding. I Excel helps kids stay confident and consistent as the semester picks up Speed. IXL is an award winning online learning program that helps kids truly understand what they're learning, whether they're building math confidence, strengthening reading and writing skills, or even reviewing science concepts. It covers math, it covers language arts, it covers science and social studies all the way from Pre K through 12th grade. And it does this with personalized interactive content that adapts to each and every kid's level and pace. IXL is used in 96 of the top 100 school districts in the U.S. it's an easy way to support learning as the school year moves into its most important stretch. You guys, you can make an impact on your child's learning and get IXL now. And the Friend Zone listeners can get an exclusive 20% off IXL membership when they sign up today at ixl.com friendzone visit ixl.com friendzone to get the most effective learning program out there at the best price.

[Francesca (Fran)]

We've all been there. You hold onto a coupon but forget about it and suddenly it's expired.

[Dustin Ross]

Expired in 2012.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Dang it. Fortunately, by switching to Geico, you could save about $900 on car insurance without ever touching a coupon.

[Dustin Ross]

It feels good to save big.

[Asante]

It feels good to geico.

[Francesca (Fran)]

So this week's episode is the last week of Black History Month. So we want to continue our black history conversations. This one, right? This one is inspired. This conversation is inspired by Mr. Tenderness, Mr. Walter Johnson. If you are unaware of who this this is, if you've been living under a rock. He is an elder that took social media by storm with his hilarious, charming, endearing videos over at Destination Smokehouse, right? Which is like a barbecue smokehouse restaurant in Marietta, California. And he would do this funny video where he would show how the meat was just falling off the bone. But he would like when they would fall off the bone, he would just stop talking to stand up and walk away. And it just became a thing. And he started calling it that's that tendonism. And it just took off. It took off. Now the lines have been wrapped around the block to get into this restaurant. They Even had a videography team, a production team came and did a whole spotlight on them that I actually watched on YouTube. A couple maybe last. Sometime last year, Keith Lee, who we know is very popular food influencer, even pop opt in to give his thoughts on the food. So this elder who then became known as Mr. Tenderness really just stole our hearts. He's just so, you know, he's so funny and just feels like someone we know. I think that's why everybody took to him. How did y' all feel about his personality when y' all started seeing those videos online? Line love.

[Asante]

When I first seen him, I enjoyed the content. I enjoyed the food. Looked good.

[Francesca (Fran)]

There you go, right? He.

[Asante]

He looked like he was cooking some good. And he. And. And before his reaction. So then when he added the reaction to it, it was like, oh, he can cook. And he got personality, appropriate personality because it was about the food. It wasn't like he was doing anything super extra gimmicky. It was just his reaction to how good his food was. It made me.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah, first of all, exactly. The nucleus of it was that goddamn meat falling off the bone. I wanted some, and I don't even fuck with barbecue like that, but I wanted some. And second of all, I also want to be an old black man. So seeing him do peak old black nigga shit makes me. It's aspirational, you know what I'm saying? I really am looking forward to making up words like tendonism and having people be enamored by my old nigga charm. So I was inspired by. By him. And I wish him well.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I do too. And I think that's why when we heard recently, as he put out a video, I think a couple weeks back, saying that he is no longer a part of Destination Smokehouse. And to make matters worse, the tenderness word was trademarked by the white owner of the restaurant.

[Asante]

Of course.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Of course. Right. And so he was asking for people to support him as he navigated. Navigates whatever is next. Right. And to come see him. And this is interesting because when Keith Lee stopped by the restaurant, things started kind of changing, right? The tide started changing on how people felt about this. Because initially the story, the way that it was presented to us was that this black elder took the white young owner under his wing. Initially it was like a coffee shop that the white man's family owned. And he took it over. Wasn't really familiar with coffee, wasn't really understanding how to make this like a lucrative company or business, I should say. And it was the elder who told him you need to start making some barbecue and put him on. On exactly how to do that. Hired a team of people that could help them get that off the ground. And, I mean, look what it became, right? So to hear that he was fired or. We don't even really know the details. We just know that he's no longer. Longer working at the smokehouse and that the word that we saw him come up with was trademarked. It's just all bad. And Keith, he had mentioned, number one, he mentioned that the. The meat didn't fall off the bone. So he was kind of disappointed, which was starting, you know, making a bunch of rumors about, like, wait a minute, what's really going on? And then Keith wanted to give Mr. Walter Johnson in $4,000, which is something that Keith tends to do, right? He tips the restaurant employees and owners, and as a way to support. And if I remember correctly, usually he gives them that tip as a way to pay the customers, right. That come to order food behind him. And it's just a really beautiful gesture. And they said no at him trying to give Mr. Walter the $4,000.

[Asante]

Yep.

[Dustin Ross]

How they gonna say no? And they ain't even in it.

[Francesca (Fran)]

That's.

[Dustin Ross]

I'm giving this money to him. You ain't got nothing to do with this.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And they would not let Keith Lee even meet him.

[Asante]

Did you see the. The interview or their response to, like, the whole.

[Francesca (Fran)]

He did. And it was strange because he barely was letting Mr. Walter talk.

[Asante]

Absolutely. It was weird. It was super weird.

[Dustin Ross]

So wait a minute.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Can you explain a little asante about the.

[Asante]

Okay, so real quick, just from what I saw, like, the way I'm piecing it together, right? So Keith Lee had went up to this restaurant, just as Fran said, was trying to tip the man. Apparently was turned away at the front door, was told, like, you know, he's unavailable, was given some excuses. Then I see the video of. I think I didn't know who I was watching. I just knew Mr. Tenonism was there, and I assumed it was the owner. So it was the person that you're talking about. So they were sitting together, the owner's talking about. Oh, we were recording for. We were doing a recording for a show, and he was unavailable. And I have no problems with Keith Lee wanting to do that. But what I do have problem with is him talking bad about the food. And I didn't watch the whole thing, but the temperature was uncomfortable for me because, like you said, Frank, he wasn't allowing the black man to talk. And I was like, Keith Lee was trying to pay him. Like, I'm trying to hear from him. And you up here talking like, I don't want to hear from you. And he looked.

[Francesca (Fran)]

He was visibly uncomfortable.

[Asante]

Yeah, it looked like something weird was going on. So that's why I'm not shocked to hear what you're saying today.

[Dustin Ross]

Question for y'. All. Cause I didn't see it. So I'm asking this Dustin from New York with a question. So was this post his release from employment at the restaurant or before they made the video?

[Asante]

Before.

[Dustin Ross]

One more thing. Keith Lee don't lie. We trust Keith Lee. He has not lied to us yet. So if that food wasn't good, that food wasn't good. Second of all, anybody else that I've seen where Keith Lee had a hiccup or a problem in his experience, they came back and they fixed it. They weren't defensive about it and taking issue with him having. Having a problem with whatever. They were humble. So I already don't like the owner of this restaurant. At this point in our conversation today. I just want to make that note

[Francesca (Fran)]

that's special because of him sitting next to this black elder talking about another young black man. And the elder is sitting there, not really having the space to share how he felt about it.

[Asante]

And then he's talking. He was talking about food. And then it's food. Food from apparently this black man that cooked it next to you being commented to your point friend about this. This black man who tried to tip

[Dustin Ross]

this other black man.

[Asante]

It was just so weird. It's like, why are you talking. Like, nothing about this makes any sense. And then it was so disgusting because Keith Lee, when I went back and I watched the review, I don't remember specifically what he said, but it's not even that he said that the food was bad. Like, he was just like. He was just like, it wasn't right. He said it just wasn't doing exactly what they said it would do in the video. But overall, he didn't say it was bad. He said, you know, deep decent. And I don't even think it was a bad decent. I think it was a more of a good decent. So I was like, okay. Like, I still wanted some after watching Keith Lee's review. But then when I heard he couldn't sit, man, I was like, that's funny. That's weird. So then when I saw this video of them having that sit down together, I'm like, what? Like, this is. This is bad. So let me hear you today say that they're not together no more. I'm not surprised that I'm actually glad that they're not. And of course, you know, I just want to be delusional. I wish that that white man would have. Would have just given him his. His. That trademark. Like, yo, you know what? What? Like, I. I can't do this, whatever this is. Or, you know, I know you can't be here, and I wish you well. Here's this. But I know that as soon as that started making money, I know as soon as he saw that, he went on ahead and included that in his bottom line. And he's like, all right, this is mine now. And I'm going to have to figure out a way to have somebody else come do this or whatever he's going to do, sir, it's going to flop. That's why you should have just gone ahead and given it to that black man.

[Francesca (Fran)]

It's not good energy at this point.

[Dustin Ross]

That's the point I was to going, he's doing better. He's not a smart businessman. Because the draw is that, man, if the man ain't at the restaurant, none of us that came to know of you and your business through the Internet and through that man, none of us have a reason to go to your restaurant anymore. We came to see him and see him talk about the meat. He's not there. Neither are us. We're not there. Neither are we. Second of all, the word tenderness being trademarked again. The success of that is contingent upon people wanting to fuck with it. Whatever you put that word on. Now that this story is out. And I'm so glad that we're talking about it. Cause now I'm aware. I didn't know. And our audience is aware. Right? We're not gonna support that same. We're not gonna support it. We don't even wanna fuck with it now. So good luck. You know what I'm saying? But you were literally. Because that was the draw. You should have given him equity in the business. You should have made him a partner. And you should have. Have brought him along. And whatever success came along with. With the attention that he brought to the damn restaurant.

[Asante]

Stupid.

[Dustin Ross]

Stupido.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And I saw there's a rapper. I'm not familiar with this rapper, but he does seem to have a following. His name is Cartel Bo. I don't know. He's out of Houston, Texas. Apparently he purchased a restaurant for Mr. Walter Johnson.

[Dustin Ross]

Good.

[Francesca (Fran)]

At first, I was trying to find. Right, let's clap for that. I was trying to find. Fine. Because I kept Hearing people saying that. So I was like, let me research this, because, you know, people say anything. And then I did see that that was tied to an interview on YouTube that Cartel Bo did with a YouTube channel by the name of Real Tune TV.

[Dustin Ross]

Okay.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And he was saying that he just feels like if we're watching this elder be disrespected like this with this racist trope that we've seen time after time, that's when those of us that have the disposable income have to step up for our community, man.

[Dustin Ross]

Yes, yes. Yes, brother.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah. And so I really hope that this follows through fully. I Hope, you know, Mr. Walter, because he even said that if M. Mr. Walter has to move to Texas, he'll, like, cover everything like that. It'll just be a smooth transition so that this elder can do what he has to do with the company that really he started to begin with. Right? It's not just the word tendonism. He's actually the one that taught the young man, man how to barbecue, brought on the team. He did everything, if you really think about it. So I really hope that this, you know, story comes to fruition. But it. It had me thinking, like, when I was listening to it and watching the elder, I was just like, man, this is not new, right? How many times have we heard this? Even the. The white man trademarking tinism didn't feel surprising. And it reminded me of a parallel to the case of.

[Dustin Ross]

Of Jack Daniels.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yep, Uncle Nearest. Right? And it's interesting because even with Uncle Nearest, there has been. The narrative has been changed, but we'll get into it, right? And this is for people that are unfamiliar the case. This is out of Lynchburg, Tennessee. The irony. Lynchburg, Tennessee. The story of Nathan Nearest Green. He was an enslaved black man who mentored toward Jack Daniel as a child, who then turned what he learned from Uncle Nearest into the Jack Daniel brand of whiskey, the most popular whiskey, right? He turned that into a company that has made so much money since, and Uncle Nearest never became a partner. He wasn't even credited in the history of it. He wasn't mentioned. He did give him employment retirement once savory was abolished. And apparently seven generations of Uncle Nearest family has worked at the Jack Daniels Distillery, but he was never made a partner. When the company was sold for $20 million in 1956, they did not get a cut from that sale. Now, the Jack Daniels family, obviously, with this whiskey company, has made a lot of money for many years off of Uncle Nearest recipe, essentially, or let me not say Recipe, let me say technique, because he's the one that taught Jack Daniels the technique. So the story goes that in the mid-1800s, uncle nearest slaveholders had hired him out to a local preacher named Dan Call. This kind of made me laugh too, that a local preacher was out here slanging,

[Dustin Ross]

right?

[Francesca (Fran)]

So he. He hires him out to a local preacher named Dan Carl. And Uncle Nearest, who had a reputation at the crime for being a highly skilled distiller, I'm talking about he was on some next level shit. He was hired out and he made whiskey for the preacher. And apparently he used this sugar maple charcoal filtering process that originated in West Africa. Okay? And this is according to voanews.com that's voiceofamericanews.com so Jack Daniel was actually a young boy who worked for the preacher. He worked for Dan Carl and he ended up working with Uncle Nearest. And Uncle Nearest taught the young boy the process, the distilling process using the sugar maple charcoal filtering. And he taught him how to get that smooth Tennessee, that Tennessee whiskey, that smooth taste.

[Dustin Ross]

He taught Jack that shit do be good. I ain't even going

[Francesca (Fran)]

to

[Dustin Ross]

that do be good for. But anyway, that ain't the point.

[Francesca (Fran)]

As Jack got a, you know, became of age and was making his money, he actually purchased the distillery from Dan Car and turned that into the Jack Daniels distillery that we know it to be today. So after emancipation, around 1863, Jack Daniels, like I said, he purchased the preacher's distillery and he hired Uncle Nearest to become. Become the first master distiller. So that's a story that we know now. Right. But at the time, he was never mentioned as being a part of the technique, the recipe or the history of

[Dustin Ross]

Jack Daniels just erased.

[Francesca (Fran)]

We came to know this because an entrepreneur and writer by the name of Fawn Weaver, she somehow became fascinated with the stories of like the lost histories, right. And inventions and creations of black enslaved people. So she found the story. I would love to know how. I tried to find some interviews, but this was just through her own research. She found the story of Uncle Nearest and his unheralded contribution to the world's most popular whiskey brand. After extensive research, she actually put it all together, went to the Jack Daniels brand and told them, hey, you guys need to revisit your history and how it's being documented. She did say she was. Was pleasantly surprised that the company was actually very accepting of the research.

[Dustin Ross]

Good.

[Francesca (Fran)]

The brand. Yep. The brand met with her. They updated their records to reflect her findings. They did their own research and they've since incorporated uncle Near's contributions to the official history of the brand. When you look up Jack Daniels, that's

[Dustin Ross]

the right thing to do.

[Asante]

Yeah.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Now here's my question to. To you, because that's royalties.

[Asante]

No, I'm just kidding.

[Francesca (Fran)]

No, my question to you is, is that enough?

[Dustin Ross]

No, no, there should be a. They should. They should find descendants of, of the nearest family, whoever the next of kin is that's still living or whatever, and they should figure out some sort of monetary compensation for them. They should.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And that's.

[Dustin Ross]

And give them a little bit of equity in the brand, you know what I'm saying? Give them 2, 3, 4%, you know what I'm saying?

[Asante]

Especially if they're profiting off of their. That story. Like, yes, they're updating their brand to reflect that family's story, but they still need to do something for that family other than being like, thanks for your family's hard work.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And in a way it's like, oh, yeah, now when you go to our website, your great, great, great, great grandpa's name is added. It's like, great, yes, because that should be recorded and archived. But is that enough? And far and Weaver actually took a million dollars dollars of her own money and she partnered up with uncle near's great great granddaughter by the name of Victoria Edie Butler, who was a master distiller. I think that's so cool. She, like, followed her grand. Her grandfather's footsteps and they came together to create uncle nearest premium whiskey, which till this day is now the fastest growing independent American whiskey brand in u. S. History.

[Dustin Ross]

Because how could you not want to drink some after hearing this story? I mean, you feel like just as a black person, you feel obligated to support this.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And I did feel that because I don't even drink whiskey. And I remember seeing a bottle of uncle nearest at a local store here during the holidays, and we bought it just off the strength, Just on the strength. And it's still sitting there. But I just needed to contribute in my own way, so. So the green family, like I said, did not benefit when the Daniels family sold the Jack Daniel distillery. They sold it to a company by the name of Brown Foreman for $20 million in 1956. I thought that was cheap, but then I had to think about inflation. So I did the conversion, and that would be equivalent to approximately $238.3 million now in 2026. Yeah, that still feels low though, don't it? Maybe. I just don't understand.

[Dustin Ross]

George Foreman got so much money he had them grills. He had all that other shit. At this point, his portfolio is, you know.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Now, Uncle Nearest Premium Whiskey has since partnered with Jack Daniels. Right. They launched a $5 million pledge. It's an initiative by the name of Nearest and Jack Advancement Initiative. And they're providing support, expertise, and resources to African American entrepreneurs and to entering the spirits industry.

[Dustin Ross]

I love that. This is what it looks like. So, yes, when we said it should be more, this is what it looks like, right? I love this. Yeah.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And when you mentioned about the descendants Fawn Weaver and. And his granddaughter, they actually have their own pledge through the Uncle Nearest Whiskey, where descendants of the Green family, their schooling gets paid for as long as they have a 3.0. Now above.

[Dustin Ross]

This is what it looks like, y'.

[Asante]

All.

[Dustin Ross]

This is what it looks like. We need to clap for these people.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Right? That was her personal contribution to the family, the Green family. For them not being acknowledged and going unheralded all of these years, I knew

[Dustin Ross]

she was a good person. That's why I didn't dig into any of that shit that happened recently when people thought she was being rude to that man. Did you see what that man, that she. So Fawn Weaver was out doing make and making an appearance on behalf of the Uncle Nearest Brand. Some guy came up to her that said that he went to her middle school with her or whatever. Random, right? And she was acting. Yeah. She was like, oh, you know, hey, now, look. She was like, now he gonna come up to me and say, you know, that he didn't meet from middle school. I don't know this man. They was like, laughing, whatever. But people really was on her ass about that. And people have this weird, nasty tendency to just be. They doing it to Jasmine Crockett right now. They did it to Kamala Harris when she was running for presidents to be the president. And now they're doing it to this Fawn Weaver lady. Mind you, Fawn Weaver, as you just brilliantly laid out for our audience, spearheaded an effort to bring some legitimacy, dignity, respect, and money to the Uncle Nearest Brand family members that exist to this day and to that legacy. And y' all tripping because you feel like she was rude to a nigga that walked up on her in the street. Cause now you're trying to say you don't even know. And y' all trying to say she thinks she all that. No, she is all that because she did all of that, okay? And this is why context and more information is necessary. We need to be informed people, and we need to make informed choices, okay? Because knowing all this, you look at that whole interaction with her and that other guy differently. She's fucking busy.

[Francesca (Fran)]

The article I read was titled enslaved black man created. Created. I love that they said that. Created world's most popular whiskey. Like I said, this was on VOANews.com written by Dora mccor. I love the. It ended with Dora McCoy saying, Because of fawn Weaver's tenacity, green story, although left untold for more than a century, will not be lost to history. But that's not the case with so many other stories of black achievement and contributions to the nation. Nation Voice of America, by the way, is the largest u. S. International broadcaster. They reach an estimated audience of 354 million people. So I love that this article says, enslaved black men created world's most popular whiskey. They didn't mince any words with the way that they laid out that article.

[Dustin Ross]

Only thing I meant is garlic honey. I'm gonna say it the way I want to say it. You know what I mean?

[Francesca (Fran)]

So that, you know, like I said, that was the parallel that I started thinking about, because I remember when I watched the doc initially with the. With Mr. Walter Johnson, the. The Mr. Tendonism Elder and the young white man, and it was a very similar story almost exactly. It's kind of trippy. It was the. He took me under his wing, taught me how to make this company lucrative, you know, didn't make him a partner, even though he gave me the game. But I hired him. He works here, you know, and y' all can come hang with him and take pictures. You know what I'm saying? And. And then under the guise of this is a wonderful friendship or family. And the funny thing is, when you go on, I believe the website is nearest green.com calm with the uncle nearest whiskey. There's a short film with Jeffrey Wright narrating, and he's telling the story right now that it's out there of uncle nearest. But one part that got me, though, was in the blurb under the video, if you go on the website, it says that this was a story based on an unlikely friendship. Like. And I don't know why that was, like, irking me, because it's the same narrative that. That's being spun from tenderness, right? And it's that same thing. And granted, you know, uncle nearest, we respect what it's become. We. But I still think that it's interesting how narratives still continue to be spun, because if this wasn't quote unquote, unlikely friendship, then a French A friend would have made sure that this person would not have gone unharmed.

[Dustin Ross]

And honestly, that's none of our business. We don't need to know whether the friendship was likely or unlikely. We just need to know that there was a goddamn friendship. So just eliminate it. You copywriters, the people that are responsible for this language eliminated, just put they was friends. And when you're in Jack Daniels, when you're in a position of atonement, right, you have to atone for something you did. Clear it all. We don't need no nothing missed, no details, none of that. And shit like the lang. The language that, the blurbs. The language that makes those blurbs is important. That's a data, that's a detail, that's a line item. Go through them blurbs.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah.

[Dustin Ross]

Better not be nothing in there we don't like. And if it is, God damn it, change it up. It's about black people. Change it. You know what I'm saying? So I'm with you, friend. It's not unlikely. Like it's friendship, but I wouldn't even

[Francesca (Fran)]

say friendship because we don't know that elder, that, that he started ment. You know what I'm saying? And then if it was a friendship, this would not have gone unnoticed for over a century. That's what I'm trying to say. And it's not like. And it's not like the Jack Daniels and his family didn't know because they kept his family working there for seven generations. So this is something that was known but not said. And I think that's a problem That's. Yeah, that's a problem having with this sort of Disney, you know, romanticizing of what really happened.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah, this rose colored lens.

[Francesca (Fran)]

That's what it feels like to me. And it's, it's very similar to how the white man was with Mr. Tenonism of this whole. This friendship, this unlikely American friendship. And it's exploitation.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah, 100% textbook exploitation.

[Asante]

It's literally the same exact thing. And it's like this man can be like, oh, you know, me and him are still good. You know, like, if any of his family want to come get a job here, they could. Like, it's going to be the same thing. Like, this is when you started this friend, I literally thought to myself, it's so good that she's doing this and that the Internet exists. So like, we don't look up one day and we see some white people be like, tenderness. Oh, off the bone. Like, you know, because like, probably will. Which, which. That's why when Dustin was like, bad business, I was like this, this white man is going to do this and it's going to suffer. It's going to become a joke and it's gonna. And people are gonna be. Some people are gonna be like, let B try and see if it is good once they be like, nah, it actually ain't even good. Like, the nigga is gone. So the food is going to be worse than what Keith, you reviewed it at. You know what I'm saying? If they put another black person up there, all I'll do is respect that black person and pass them by and maybe I'll look at them on their next project. I want money.

[Dustin Ross]

Ain't good money. All money ain't good money, first of all. And second of all, ain't no white people better not say tenderism around me. I'm gonna look at you like you said. If I see a white person saying

[Asante]

Tinder,

[Francesca (Fran)]

you said, but these. But ain't it something for this parallel to be from an enslaved black man? And then we're talking about 2026. Yeah. You know, that to me was the part that I was like, I need to sit with this for a second. And it also put me into a deeper rabbit hole, right? Because I was thinking of the lost histories. Like it was mentioned in the quote of African American inventors and creators and thought leaders and just people really pushing the culture and how they do go unheralded. And the ones that will never know about, the ones that we're just finding out about the way we are with this case. Because in this podcast, when we have black history, we tend to speak of the inventors that we know. Right. Like we will highlight George Washington Carver. Shout out to George Watson Carver. Y' all know that's the projects I came from. We him and his peanut butter. He ain't it funny how they name projects who comes up like, thank you.

[Dustin Ross]

Thanks.

[Francesca (Fran)]

He didn't invent peanut butter, but he did develop hundreds of use cases, hundreds of ways that it can be used. He was like an agricultural scientist and inventor. Madam C.J. walker, the first self made woman millionaire in America. She developed hair care and cosmetics for black women. What's funny? Isante.

[Asante]

I'm just thinking about Road to Parks and then this episode, episode of Chicago. I mean I'm Southside, but it's not relevant. Sorry, continue. Don't ask me.

[Dustin Ross]

And Madam C.J. walker was the first woman to call somebody nappy. Headed.

[Francesca (Fran)]

You know what her hair grows creams and pomades. Even up until recently when we just learned about Lonnie Johnson, right. The creator of the super Soaker. It's like we didn't know. I didn't grow up knowing that a black.

[Asante]

I didn't either, which is so cool.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And Lonnie Johnson is also a former NASA. Right? Lonnie, He's a former NASA engineer who currently has runs a lab that's developing clean energy solutions. So I mean, it's like brilliance, literal brilliance. Brilliance on so many levels. When I was doing my research, you know, about patents and creations and innovation. America has long been the land, as they say, of innovation. Innovation. The first American patent was actually in 1641. That's crazy to think about. So I went to see who. Who was that? Imagine being the first patent sign all

[Dustin Ross]

that paper by candlelight and quill.

[Francesca (Fran)]

His name was Samuel Winslow out of Massachusetts. This is a white man. And his first patent was a novel way of making salt. I found this through the Cambridge public library. They actually had the newspaper clip flipping, which is. I love the library.

[Dustin Ross]

He was cutting up dope.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And if you think about it, if that was 1641, that means that the history of patents in America was actually older than the U. S. Constitution.

[Dustin Ross]

Damn.

[Francesca (Fran)]

So there were no protections for it. Right. People was just out here slaying in patents. Apparently the colonies at the time, the colonies were the ones that were granted to you or not. Don't know how that worked. It wasn't until. So the constitution, right. Wasn't ratified until 1788 or 1787. So the members of the constitutional convention, they're the ones that came together to finally create the patent and copyright clause of the Constitution, right. So that. That says to promote the progress of science and useful arts by securing for limited times to authors and inventors the exclusive right to their respective writings and discoveries.

[Dustin Ross]

Patent pending. Hoe in other words.

[Francesca (Fran)]

So imagine this is exciting because now as an inventor, you can fight, you can submit, you can file it, you know, patent pending, hopefully patent passed. All the things you have protections now for your writings. However, the patent system did not apply to black people.

[Asante]

Black people knew that was coming.

[Dustin Ross]

We just had patent leather.

[Francesca (Fran)]

The black people born into slavery. Slaves, of course, were not considered American citizens. And the laws at the time prevented them from applying or even holding patents. And the case that really crystallized that into patent law was The Dred Scott versus Sanford case of 1857. In 1857, that case basically said that slaves lacked standing in court because they weren't citizens. So the patent office applied that supreme court notice to the patent law.

[Asante]

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[Francesca (Fran)]

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[Asante]

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[Francesca (Fran)]

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[Francesca (Fran)]

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[Dustin Ross]

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[Francesca (Fran)]

And think about it. Inventors were still inventing, coming up with all these creations, but had nowhere to file it, nowhere to protect it. And so what happened next?

[Dustin Ross]

They stole it.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yep. And mind you, this is the 17th and 18th centuries, right? You gotta think of how much economic growth was happening at the time, especially with the start of the Industrial Revolution. Do you guys watch the Gilded Age on hbo?

[Asante]

I was in my head the whole time you were there. I, like, I knew you were going to go there. I was like.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And I felt like, wow, I know some of this stuff from that show.

[Asante]

I literally just saw Audra sit down somewhere and I was like, here we go.

[Dustin Ross]

The importance of the arts. The importance of the arts. I heard Felicia Rashad was a raging. She was a lot to deal with on that show.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Fabulous job.

[Asante]

Honestly, I just don't watch because it's a period piece. But I will say because, you know, but you know, I'm fair from what I watched, it's a really, really good show because Christine Baranski's on there. First of all, Audrey and Christine Baranski, like, together again. I enjoyed them very, very much on the, the Good Fight. So watching them together on this, along with Felicia on there, great cast. And even like the upand cominging people are really, really good. I was like, damn, it's some good on here, but I just don't want to be here. So it's a great.

[Francesca (Fran)]

It's. Honestly, it's not for everybody. I get that everybody don't care about no dang history show, but the things that you learn, you know, like, I'm like, oh, I didn't know that. I didn't know that. And I always go and look it up because I know they can take poetic license, right? But it's pretty damn accurate, you know what I'm saying? Especially when you're learning about the Industrial Revolution. Like at the time they're creating bridges, cars, power plants, transcontinental railroads. Like, I mean, this shit was popping off at the time. And you know that black people had a lot to do with the creation,

[Dustin Ross]

those innovations, but they had no power.

[Asante]

Yep.

[Dustin Ross]

Meanwhile, they taught you that, taught you how to have power. Black people had a show called Power in Modern Times.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And it was a black man, even with the light bulb that he created a filament that actually made it run longer where we could have a light bulb. But he was not credited either.

[Dustin Ross]

Why do you think black people can dance? Naturally, we just got it, you know what I'm saying? When it comes to doing things and timing and shit like that, that's something that comes naturally to us. But I'm gonna watch the Gilded Age because history, it's worth it. It's so important. And if you're able to receive historical information as factual in a show like that, a scripted show that's entertaining as well, a high budget show, sign me up. That's very done. Well, this is so important because these. I can't wait to. Because when it comes to these patterns of revolution in the United States and world history and like that, these patterns repeat themselves. That's how people are able to. Hello. Thank you.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Okay, thank you.

[Dustin Ross]

So I'mma watch. I say that to say I'm gonna watch the Gilded Age.

[Asante]

You're gonna enjoy it. Not only because, like, it's an entertaining show in the sense of, like I was saying, I couldn't get into it because it's, you know, it's old school. But I say the performances are so good because the story is still so good. Like in the way that they deliver. Like, I can't remember any about the actual story, but that young black actress, whoever she is, I just remember watching her. First of all, I was just like, damn. Like, I could see. I was like, I don't know if she won awards or anything, but I was like, I could see this, like, doing really, really well. Like, I could understand that. But back to this conversation, this piece of like all of these things being rooted. You. This is like that root of racism that people talk about, right? Like the. The tenderness thing. Like, that's why I'm saying it's not enough to. Yes, sometimes people just want to get a check cut or whatever. But I'm like, he should have just gave him that trademark if he wants to, about business. But he's coming from that. That aspect of it that's rooted in racism. Like, oh, well, you know, black people ain't really have rights anyway, so I ain't really got to give him a.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Like, he sounds like his ancestors. Exactly. Slaveholder taking the patent. Because this person.

[Asante]

I mean, I paid for it, so it's mine. Like I did good business. He should have done good. Good business. Good business is you bought it because he was there. But now that he's gone, you separate yourself from like, tenderism isn't part of your restaurant's brand. Tenderism is part of that black man's brand that exists at your restaurant.

[Dustin Ross]

It could have been part of your brand had you done right. Good business. You partner with this man who has brought the product to you, you partner with him and y' all scale the fuck out that business together. We should all be eating at Tenderness and barbecue restaurants, period. The same way we go to Chili's or any other motherfucking chain. We should have that. And that is the view toward wealth and toward wealth building that that selfish ass motherfucking man, white man should have had. There's no reason that they should have ever separated is the point I'm trying to make. That they should have, they should have partnered and continued. But the reason that it appears that they discontinued is rooted in the systemic. The systemic racism that Asante is just referring to. The inherent racism that I was referring to and the racism that friend was inferring to. That's right.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Right.

[Dustin Ross]

Thank you. I was going to include you, darling. So I just. You know what I'm saying? That man was stupid. He was, he is stupid as fuck. And thank God that the real nigga in Houston rapper saw that opportunity to legitimize that, that, that man, Mr. Tendonism and offer him some sustainable income in the form of a brick and mortar restaurant. And we all need to be making trips to Houston when that opened up.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And what a perfect location.

[Dustin Ross]

Houston, Texas barbecue.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I wish the best for him. I also came across Shantavia Johnson, who is an associate vice president for academic partnerships and innovation at Clemson University.

[Asante]

Okay.

[Francesca (Fran)]

She wrote right. Big things. She wrote an article titled America always had black inventors even when the patent system explicitly excluded them. In the article she state and I found her article on the conversation.com she stated that slave owners often took credit for their slaves inventions. In one well documented case, a black inventor named Ned invented an effective and innovative cotton scraper. He actually invented the double plow and a scraper that efficiently cultivated both sides of a cotton row simultaneously. Game changer. As far as efficiency in agriculture. Game changer. Of course he couldn't file the patent right because of the laws at the time. But his slave master, Oscar Stewart attempted to patent the invention himself because he viewed it like this is my property. This person is my property. So that IP is also my property. But because he wasn't the actual inventor. I will say this with the patent office, they wasn't just handing it out. You had to sit there and break it down for them, like how you came up with this. And he wasn't able to do that. And so his application was rejected.

[Dustin Ross]

So there was prejudice and widgets because they was prejudice to white people too. Ain't nobody we don't like no motherfucking body.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Even though Oscar Stewart, the slaveholder wasn't able to file the patent, but he sure as hell sold it. He sold that cotton scraper any which way and ended up making a killing off of this. And Ned wasn't able to do the same at the time. She also mentions in the article Benjamin Montgomery Montgomery, excuse me, is another example. Born into slavery. He was born in 1819. He actually invented the steamboat propeller.

[Dustin Ross]

What?

[Asante]

Wow.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And he. That was designed for shallow waters in the 1850s. So at the time you think of steamboats, right, they delivered food and different necessities, but often in the shallow waters they would get stuck. And sometimes if they get noise, they got stuck. They'd be stuck for days, even, even weeks at the time. Think about it. This is food that we're talking about and necessities. So his invention was of high value because his patent, not his patent, but his invention allowed food to be transported more efficiently. Right. His patent was rejected and his owners once again tried to take credit, but they were rejected as well because they couldn't explain how they created. They were not the inventors. Luckily though, unlike like Ned, he was able. Benjamin was able to amass significant wealth after the Civil War ended. Right with this. And even his son, after his passing was able to purchase 800 acres of land with his dad's earnings. And he found the Mound Bayou in Mississippi.

[Dustin Ross]

Yes, Lord, let's clap for that. Now this some black history.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And at that, you know. So it's almost like Benjamin was able to build on what Ned before him wasn't able to do. You know, Patton was, was almost was stolen actually. Even though he didn't file it, the slaveholder made killing off of it. But this, luckily Benjamin was able to amass wealth for his family. The crazy.

[Dustin Ross]

Did she put any pictures. I didn't mean to interrupt, but did she put any pictures of like the receipt or the exit paperwork from the patent office when they would do deny the patents for the black people? Because I wonder what they put in the memo line for the reason denied. Is that what they said? Is that what the. I want to see?

[Francesca (Fran)]

Well, they probably didn't even have that conversation because the law was against it to begin with. So it's like you don't even get to come in the office.

[Dustin Ross]

We ain't doing no paperwork for you.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah, it's, you know, what it is is basically what they tell them. So upon further research, the slaveholder that tried to steal Benjamin Montgomery's steamboat propeller was named Joseph Davis. And I looked into it further and ended up, you know, you fall into all kinds of Wikipedia rabbit holes. His brother was named Jefferson Davis and he was actually the President of the Confederate States. Remember when they had broken off? So he, because of this situation, because he was so, so pissed that his brother wasn't able to file the patent for the steampunk propeller. He created a law in the Confederate States that basically formalized slaveholders ownership of their slaves inventions. And he was able to put that into law with the Confederate States that is called the Confederate Patent Act. So slavery was abolished in 1865. So I think people were like, okay, maybe things are going to change, right, because we weren't viewed as citizens, but if it's abolished now, maybe our rights will shift. And Africans. But African Americans unfortunately continued to be excluded even into the 20th century. The first black inventor to successfully get a patent was Thomas L. Jennings of New York. And that wasn't until 1821. But the laws kept changing, right? Citizen, not citizen, slave, not slave.

[Asante]

So it just was a collect sometimes,

[Francesca (Fran)]

you know what I mean? It's like it just wasn't, it wasn't in the cards for African Americans to have protections for their innovations. And that's what made a lot of people not even want to try, not even want to follow them. Right. I also fell into another rabbit hole where economist Lisa D. Cook, she's actually a professor at Michigan State University, professor of Economics and International relations. Shout out to all these AM black

[Dustin Ross]

women out there at that Big ten school. That's what's up.

[Francesca (Fran)]

She had a research paper I came across that showed how violence and segregation destroys African American innovation. She published research right, in 2014 that showed how segregation laws, lynchings and state supported violence suppressed African American invention during the 20th century. So that's crazy, right? Because you're coming out, out of the 19th century thinking okay, maybe things will change now, slavery is abolished, but they just found a new configuration for ways to exclude us. Her research found that the Plessy vs Ferguson case of 1896 where the Supreme Court decision legitimized anti black laws, right, being passed. That's Jim Crow laws. Separate but equal.

[Dustin Ross]

Learn your history.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Right. This basically ensured that a black inventor no longer had access to the library. So if a black inventor doesn't have access to the library, she explained that that's where patent registries and information is kept. That's where you found out about new inventions to make sure that you weren't, you know, stepping on anyone's toes. That's where inventors would gather. That's where the free flow of information.

[Asante]

Necessary. Yeah.

[Francesca (Fran)]

So it became a detriment to our communities because we didn't even have access to these spaces. There was no patent. And she also mentioned there were no patent attorneys that were black, that were African American.

[Dustin Ross]

Where was Phaedra?

[Francesca (Fran)]

But get this. Until 1970, when Maxine Shaw already. My mom was already like, here. You know what I mean?

[Dustin Ross]

Like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's very recent.

[Francesca (Fran)]

That is so recent.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah.

[Asante]

That's crazy.

[Francesca (Fran)]

There wasn't a Pat. An African American patent law attorney until the 1970s. Meaning in all that time, you really didn't even have access to someone who could file and protect your invention. Not someone you could trust. Mm. So the Plessy vs Ferguson case, obviously separate but equal, led to a huge drop in patenting by African Americans. And she says that we still haven't recovered.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah, I believe that 100%.

[Francesca (Fran)]

100% put us behind in comparison with the rate of our counterparts. Right. She also noticed the huge dip. So that was the dip she noticed in her research around 1899. But then there was another major dip she noticed around 1921. She was like, what was happening in that time? That made another dip for black creators and inventors. And that was the Tulsa massacre that happened in May and June of 1921, where, for those who are unfamiliar, a white mob attacked and destroyed a radio. Relatively wealthy African American neighborhood in Tulsa. In Tulsa, Oklahoma. So if you can imagine this mob, who she explained was actually deputized and armed by government officials. Sounds familiar. Sounds like something we're dealing with now. The attack also included aerial bombardment.

[Dustin Ross]

Damn.

[Francesca (Fran)]

So African Americans felt terrorized.

[Dustin Ross]

Think about what that means. Aerial bombardment. That means that from the sky, they were dropping shit on these people's homes and businesses.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Who's going to give them that type of access, the equipment to do that? The airspace.

[Dustin Ross]

Airspace.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Because you have to be given permission, right?

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah. So African Americans felt terrorized. She said they were failed by local, state, and federal government. The violence obviously suppressed patenting as amongst other things.

[Dustin Ross]

But yes, hell, yeah, it did.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Because who's thinking about this? And Right. When you're in survival. So she's basically explaining how violence has suppressed us in so many ways, especially as creatives and innovators in our con. And it's not that we weren't still creating and creating these kind of contributions. It's just that we weren't protected in being able to do so right as

[Dustin Ross]

we should have been. And that's why I have had to reframe violence and, you know, find it beautiful. Every Sunday, I, I watch Zeus Content. It's a black owned streaming app, and there's violence there to be enjoyed and consumed.

[Francesca (Fran)]

You know what she also goes on? She goes on to mention that as she kept trying to find these dips, right, in our patent laws and our creative contributions, they always aligned with something that was happening during the times. Right. Whether it was laws being passed, whether it was like the Tulsa massacre. But she also mentioned even race riots, lynchings, everything that they would do to put fear in our hearts. And she says those dips show that violence limits innovation and in turn, economic activity for us and our families.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah, I love data. I love database reasoning and conclusion.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And it had charts to show how she was like, viewing and the way she was able to go into like different directories to see the innovators of the time and see the dips. And when it came back and what was happening at the time, I'm like, wow, incredible work. If you want to hear more from Lisa D. Cook, I actually saw she had an interview with NPR. It came out on February 11th of 2000, 2019, and it's titled How Violence Limits Economic Activity.

[Dustin Ross]

I thought it meant permit refusal.

[Francesca (Fran)]

You know what?

[Asante]

Oh my.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Npr, in that interview, they asked her what does she think is holding back black entrepreneurship now though? And she said, I think that one of the big things that's holding back African American participation and women's participation is the workplace climate. There are three stages of innovation, education and training as an innovator. Right. You have to work in a lab, for example, and the third phase is commercialization of the innovation. But she says there's systemic racism, racism at every stage of that. Think of how what you have to be dealing with at the workplace to even get to that. She says we don't think enough about the conditions that inventors need to be productive in such that there can't even be a free flow of ideas. Right. She says, I think we put too much weight on the actual laws in place and not the environment in which they are operating. We have directed evidence through her research that the conditions in which one is operating can make a huge difference. And that's even a reminder of now. Right. With the amount of chaos that they are putting in the news. You go online, you go outside, you know, and it's like how are you supposed to operate? All of us are feeling like we are on edge and it's, it's like what did she call? Had been deputized by government officials. No different than now. None state created chaos.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah. This is man, the cycles, the way that these cycles repeat themselves.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Right. We're in 2026 and she's talking about

[Asante]

Mr. 1800 right now, 1700s.

[Francesca (Fran)]

It's just, it's like a never ending pattern. It reminds me we were reading Octavia Butler.

[Asante]

Yeah.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Remember she kept saying, oh people think I'm a seer or a psychic, but I just follow the patterns, the pattern.

[Dustin Ross]

That ain't how she said it though. She say, how did she say it, friend?

[Francesca (Fran)]

I'm not doing the do it Dustin.

[Asante]

How she said it.

[Dustin Ross]

Oh, they say I'm a seer, psychic. But I just really just analyze some patterns historically when you not analyze them patterns, you know what I'm saying A lot. Some panels type, you know what I'm saying?

[Francesca (Fran)]

I was seeing this. The Smithsonian has actually been doing a lot of work to try to repair this because you know, museums and archives, they have to be held accountable as well. They have been part of the whitewashing. They have not done their job well to bring out these histories at this point.

[Dustin Ross]

Because you do know like, like recently the Trump administration directed the Smithsonian to remove so much shit from those museums, specifically in the African American museum. And so that kind of federally regulated racist ass erasure makes it virtually impossible for the person that's curating those museums to literally do their job. Especially when your funding is being is dependent upon that.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dustin Ross]

It's fucked up. It's so unfair. And that's why archiving history however we can through conversations like this. Thank you friend. You know what I'm saying? Through shit like this critically important right now specifically. And even when, even when those things are reversed, we are now definitely aware of the vulnerabilities that still exist because the administration's change. So even though someone might allow it now, a racist ass motherfucker could weasel their way back in there and then do this reversal is this bastard is done. You know what I'm saying? So we need to have a second secondary, reliable, secure method of archiving history and content and protecting it so that it is not. That's Independent of the federal shit. So it's not at risk of erasure. That is something that needs to be a priority for us all. You know what I'm saying? Put your pictures on our drive.

[Francesca (Fran)]

It should be funded by some type of collective economics. That way that we can't be threatened, Right. If it's our own kind of tying into something. Asante's episode two weeks ago about how to be our own archivist and not having to lean on institutions necessarily.

[Dustin Ross]

But you see what Jocelyn Hernandez did, right? She just started a streaming network called why are you, why are you here? Tv. That's the name of her.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Are you being serious?

[Dustin Ross]

Oh, my mama.

[Asante]

I know that it's funny. Why are you here?

[Francesca (Fran)]

But you know what? Respect.

[Asante]

Respect.

[Dustin Ross]

And on the platform, she's interviewing herself, asking herself deeply personal questions and answering it. And so she has decided to put that. Which in her own ecosystem is of value, Right. Her story, she can find value in it and sell it to another network. Right. She decided to still continue her relationship with Zeus, doing a cabaret, but she also now has her own streaming platform where she owns the content in that way completely. And I also distributes the content independent of anybody else. So even though it's funny. It is. It's literally an example of what you just described when it comes to, like, having a separate way that's independent of a master system. You know what I'm saying?

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah.

[Asante]

Which is why.

[Francesca (Fran)]

To protect yourself, which is why this

[Asante]

show is so important. Right. Like, I feel like we all do a great job of trying to encourage black people to just expand. And that's why I always try to encourage, like, well, friend, you do too, Industrian. You definitely do. But, like, we try to encourage technology. The digital space has been so lucrative in so many different ways. And unfortunately, there's still, you know, ways to steal from people in those spaces. But so many people have been able to kind of break through in those spaces and create new opportunities for other people. So we have been able to establish certain little ecosystems in our own little way on these residual spaces. But it's unfortunate physically that we still have to struggle so hard on a regular basis. But thank God that you're doing this episode, friends. So people see that, like, this does still happen and not as, you know, it's not on. On as low of a scale as you would think. And all that research. Shout out to all the black women doing research. I know we shot a Kia out early, but Shout out to all the black women out there.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I kept falling into the Rabbit holes. And it kept landing me on. On a black woman that had a law review or research at Clemson. Like, I was like, this is so amazing. Thank God for the Internet while it's still available. Right. While we still have access to these trials. But I was saying that the Lemelson center for the Study of Invention and Innovation, this is at the Smithsonian. They actually host a lot of programming around the lost histories of African American inventors.

[Dustin Ross]

Wonderful.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah. It was founded in 1995. And the Lemelson center, from its beginnings, has had a particular focus on lesser known, hidden, and even erased histories of these inventors. They even create spaces, I saw, for black inventors, economists, policy study professionals to come together. And they. And they look at history and research and the patterns. Right. To try to understand. They use that, as I should say, as a way of identifying, identifying what is causing the inequality in the invention and innovation ecosystems. And then they come together. Power of the minds, Right. To try to bring about meaningful change of some sort.

[Dustin Ross]

Super dope. Super, super dope.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Shout out to the Lemelson center for creating those spaces. Right.

[Dustin Ross]

Because part of the Lemelson Center.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And that kind of reminds me of what Lisa was, Lisa D. Cook was saying about the detriment that. That not having access to the library where the free flow of ideas lived. And so the Lemelson center, you know, it kind of gave me chills. It was like, this is exactly it. They create a space for these minds to think, to come together, to gather under the Smithsonian. But unfortunately, like Dustin was saying, when the government starts involving themselves in those spaces once again, we see how they continue to try to exclude us from economic activity and innovation.

[Dustin Ross]

And this just happened. Thank God for these people who are trying and trying and making an effort to do this and protect these historical facts and this information that's so necessary, so helpful. So, yeah, shout out to them. And Lisa Cook, shout out to you.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Right. Shantania Johnson.

[Dustin Ross]

Yes.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And I read Eric Hintz. He's actually a historian that works at the Lemelson Center. He said often the traditional definition of invention is something like a machine, Right. That saves human labor or animal labor or does some task more efficiently. And he says that unfortunately, he feels that that actually keeps certain innovations by plat, by black people from being recognized by the patent system. He says the patent system is built on this model that basically assumes innovation is desirable only. Only when it's tied to commercial benefit. Capitalism. Right. It's like, can this make us money?

[Dustin Ross]

Right.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Right. But he says, but what if it's an invention that's rooted in community survival or the needs of society, and it's somehow not worthy of protection. And we keep seeing that in law. He said that there are certain things that are patentable and certain things that are not. And that he thinks that that's a distinction that leaves a lot of people out ecosystem. I actually think an example that he used that I thought was so interesting, he said, look at DJ Grandmaster Flash with the birth of hip hop. He is the one that took the record turntable and turned it into an instrument by using it to scratch on records and using his fingers to manipulate the sounds right backwards, slow it down. The actual turntable are at the Smithsonian. So he was like, that is innovation and the cultural impact of what that did to music, music history, cultural innovation. But how would that be patented? Think about like, I was like, that is such a great example.

[Dustin Ross]

And that need. That means that there's a huge void that needs to be filled. There needs to be an official branch of the patenting or patenting office. Patent office, you know what I'm saying? That focuses on the.

[Francesca (Fran)]

That type of shit that focuses on culture.

[Dustin Ross]

Cultural.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Cultural innovation doesn't have to be capitalistic, right? I don't have to be so transactional. You make this thing, we get this thing. You know, it's like, what. How have you moved the culture forward with what you have created?

[Dustin Ross]

Historical relevance, cultural impact, cultural shift. Things are things that need to be qualified. You know what I'm saying?

[Francesca (Fran)]

Fabric of. He's the literal fabric of hip hop music and how hip hop has affected other genres. Right? So just music, really.

[Dustin Ross]

This is where you need to trace back. Starting from the front, who's responsible for that? Who's responsible for those sort of. Those sort of decisions being made? And this is when you need to notify your local lawmakers, your congressmen, your state reps, you know what I'm saying? Notify them that you want to see a change in that way because it needs be to. To be official. And this is also why you need to vote, because you need to be aware of who those people are, because you need to pick them. So it all goes back to exercising your right to vote. Just want to put that out there.

[Francesca (Fran)]

No, I think it's all. It all matters. And then lastly, I did see on this Lemelson center, they had an event celebrating Kareem Abdul Jabbar, who recently wrote a children's book titled what Color Is My Wife World?

[Dustin Ross]

The Lost History Is Too Long to Find My Glasses.

[Francesca (Fran)]

What Color is my World the Lost History of African American Inventors.

[Dustin Ross]

Oh, wow. Okay.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Right. I know. I love that. It's a book on unsung black inventors and innovators, and it has, like, these short, accessible biographies. And this is targeted to readers from the ages of 8 to 12.

[Dustin Ross]

Perfect. Now they gonna ban it, but perfect.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Right? But to me, that's a beautiful way. Way. Right. How do we archive these things?

[Dustin Ross]

Yep.

[Francesca (Fran)]

As. As creatives and innovators continue to be unheralded, we have to take it upon ourselves to document it, to circulate it. Right. To feed it to the younger children so that they don't get stifled, they don't feel limited in any way, so that we don't lean into these detrimental mental ways that the government is trying to exclude us. We just figure it out with our own communities. And I just felt like this is so interesting how Mr. Tenderness took me on this journey.

[Asante]

Yeah.

[Francesca (Fran)]

From the 18th, you know, the. The 1700s, 1800s, 1900s, even till today. How we just continue to see these patterns. But as always, we continue to create, we continue to innovate, whether the law recognizes us or not. We have contributed to the fabric of society. And unfortunately, we don't get to enjoy the economic activity of that. But if we keep doing things, like even Kareem Abdul Jabbar creating this book, the Smithsonian, highlighting it, you know, it's like we just have to keep trying.

[Dustin Ross]

I agree. And thank you, friend. Damn. Thank you.

[Asante]

Beautifully said.

[Dustin Ross]

That's all I got.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah. Thank you for inspiring me me to fall into these rabbit holes. And I pray that Bo Cartel or Cartel Bo the rapper from Houston, Texas. I really hope that they really do use this collective economics once again. Not leaning on anyone else coming together, putting our money, because guess what's going to happen. I know we're going to have that restaurant with lines outside the door leaning on ourselves, as it should be. Because what did Issa Rae say? We all we got.

[Dustin Ross]

We all we got. And I guarantee you, when Keith Lee go to that restauran, that fall off

[Francesca (Fran)]

the ball tip is going to be given where it goes, right where it belongs.

[Asante]

Amazing episode, friend. Like, I just think about, like, you know, the butterfly effect, which we touched on in culpability. Right, right. Like just the book. Kareem drops that book. People go research those inventors, they find that research that you spoke of today, somebody's inspired to either, you know, create something of their own or, you know, research themselves. Like, everyone just get. Has their own offering. And that's so beautifully like, you Always emphasize that in various ways. So it was done so amazingly today. Friend.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Thank you. I appreciate that. I felt like it. It was one of those things. So you ever have an episode where you feel like it's not even you anymore putting it together? I just felt this rush, rush of energy that was like. And I just write. And I kept finding Shantavia and then Lisa D. Cook, and it was all these researchers, and I was like, okay, okay. My brain was like, put it together.

[Asante]

It was finding you.

[Dustin Ross]

Would you work on a research project, friend?

[Francesca (Fran)]

Absolutely, Absolutely. I love research. I feel like it's something that excites me. That's what I was doing with. When I was working with npr, remember, with the Cleveland project. It was the research that was making me be like, oh, this is just so valuable and important. And like Octavia Butler said, seeing the patterns. Seeing the patterns so that we can. So we can try to learn from them and try to see what we can continue to do in the era of the pattern that we happen to live in. Right.

[Dustin Ross]

I hope somebody that's listening can provide you with a lucrative opportunity to experience that in a different way than you have previously. You know, people can see through the production of this episode, specifically that you know what you're doing. And you also know how to identify other good researchers, which means that you'll have good synergy with a team of established researchers or experienced researchers, I should say, in whatever project it is. So hopefully somebody provides you with a lucrative, lucrative, lucrative, lucrative opportunity to experience that. I think that'd be good for you.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Well, thank you for putting that into the Ethereum.

[Dustin Ross]

We got to do that.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah.

[Dustin Ross]

The show is powerful. It found your. Your train rider. So we got to say, like that uncle. Okay, my uncle.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Like, look at life.

[Dustin Ross]

But thank you. I said, hey, Laverne, who else did we want to speak to? Y'?

[Francesca (Fran)]

All?

[Dustin Ross]

Who else?

[Asante]

Not you pulled out the Ouija board at the end of the show.

[Dustin Ross]

Everybody. Laverne, tell everybody. And I. Octavia, tell them. We all. Y' all know who to tell. Y' all can read minds and shit like that up there, so, yeah, I

[Francesca (Fran)]

think that's a perfect way to close out the last episode of Black History Month. Now let's jump into this week's segments.

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[Asante]

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[Francesca (Fran)]

this Week in Wellness. So speaking of black creators and innovators and patents, there was a young lady by the name of Chloe Foster that was popping up my my TikTok every couple of months and I noticed that she was talking about this product that she created. And it's actually a patent pending program product shout out to her. Because she's a young girl, obviously in alignment with the episode we just had, I felt like it only made sense for us to discuss her as a segment. Right. She has a company called Moonlit Ringlets and it. The product itself is called the lengthen lock. Like I said, it's a patent pending mesh designed to help reduce shrinkage and lengthen curls and coils. So you can switch up your look without heat or without dents. And whether you want to elongate your curls, your coils, and create a layered look by using the lengthen lock or just on the bottom portion of your hair, whatever the look you're working on, it's a great way to prep your hair for stretched style. So if you're watching on Patreon, I actually have it. I finally just. I was like, you know what? I don't know if it works. I'm gonna support this young lady. I think it's amazing that she came up with a solution, came up with a product, got it manufactured, is selling it on TikTok, and the patent is pending. Like we said, we have to support collective economics. Right. So the way that this works is you see these hooks right here? So you wrap it. Let's say like if my hair was in a braid, I would like wrap it this way and then the mesh would elongate my hair without me having to put heat on it to get that stretched out.

[Dustin Ross]

Looks it into the form.

[Francesca (Fran)]

And so you do it. She said it's best when your hair is damp so it can dry in the mesh formation creates that stretch. But you also don't have dents because of the mesh being this long. Smart, right?

[Dustin Ross]

So smart. I bet you her hair. Cute as hell.

[Francesca (Fran)]

It is innovation.

[Asante]

Yeah.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Okay. And it has a wire at the top so that it can really like wrap around your hair properly. Has a wire at the bottom. She sells it in different lengths too, depending on your hair length. If you want to check it out too, because of course, we love hair products and tricks and, and you know, all these hacks. And so there's a lot of videos on YouTube. I actually look some up. There's some on TikTok of young girls that also ordered it, have tried it. And listen, everyone's saying that it works. I haven't tried it yet. But you'll be back, right? I will definitely let you guys know. People are showing it. They're showing how their hair look once it dried. And I see the difference, it absolutely

[Dustin Ross]

feels like it works.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Right. If you want.

[Dustin Ross]

Madam C.J. walker.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Okay. If you want to check her out, like I said, her name is is Chloe Foster. She goes by Chlo C H L O Foster 5. That's her tick tock. But then the, the businesses page is Moonlit Ringlets and that's on TikTok. That's also the website moonlit ringlets dot com. That's M O O n L I T R I n G L E-T S.com definitely support her. I think it's so cool. Yeah, I think it's. And I love that it's a product for us, right? And our hair, to keep our hair healthy. And it's based. It's based on a product she created because it was something she needed, right. And then she brought it to the community.

[Dustin Ross]

That's the best kind of shit.

[Francesca (Fran)]

That's how innovation is born. Right. It was something that was missing in the beauty industry and she put it together herself.

[Dustin Ross]

I'm thinking about parents and getting daughters ready for school in the morning and shit. With daughters that have, you know, big curly hair and shit, this can like make your mornings more efficient too. You know what I'm saying? And they hair every dope. This is just good.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Look at it. It's just so smart.

[Dustin Ross]

I got ideas.

[Asante]

I can see people wearing them out in public and putting like little charms in them and stuff and then like taking them out for another look later on at night. But you know that it could be a day look and a night look. I'm just telling you. I could see some things weird actually,

[Dustin Ross]

that would be nasty in a photo shoot if, like if you was doing a bodega shoot and you had like that with some metal clips and had that ponytail parted and slick down, put that around the ponytail like that. You could style that shit, you know,

[Francesca (Fran)]

we'll a way to style it. This is her, by the way, for those of you on Patreon.

[Dustin Ross]

Look at that hair. What I tell you. Yeah.

[Asante]

So

[Francesca (Fran)]

Chloe Foster, the lit ringlets and the product is called the Length in Lock. And that's it for the wellness segment

[Asante]

today this week in music. All right, we are back with another Music man segment. This one's going to be short and sweet as I'm going to go through just a few things that happened on this day and music. And then we're going to move on to our listens lately songs to play portion. I'm going to start this off with on this day in on February 25th for that date. Okay? It doesn't matter what day of the week. You listening to this today, okay? Just this day in history is what I produced results for. It was on this day, 1994, Mary J. Blige Is My Life was released.

[Francesca (Fran)]

He melted.

[Asante]

I was about to say I'm coming in heavy, but then I caught myself.

[Dustin Ross]

Her sophomore album.

[Asante]

I mean, everybody and their mama knows about my life, and I don't feel like there's anything that I can say about my life as I am the youngest of the bunch. And everybody listening even knows about my life.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Ooh, see what I see. La la la la la.

[Dustin Ross]

Shout out and rest in peace to Chucky Thompson and incredibly brilliantly gifted music producer responsible for a lot of that production work.

[Francesca (Fran)]

There's several hands of the time, right?

[Asante]

Yes.

[Dustin Ross]

The sound. This is a genre defining. You know how. One of the things. I don't want to jump on your toes, man.

[Asante]

No, this is literally why I just mentioned this.

[Dustin Ross]

That makes Mary J. Blige a very special artist is that she has multiple genre defining albums in her catalog of work. And the My Life album, which was her sophomore release, it was her second album. It impacted even harder than her introduction, which was. What's the 41 1, which was kind of genre defining. First motherfucker to really sing on hip hop beats and be presented to the masses like that. She did it again when it comes to sampling, soul sampling and all that shit, they did it again with the. The artistic vision that is super cohesive. When you. That's an album, you can just press play and let play.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah.

[Dustin Ross]

And it works. And so she has multiple, like, you know how Solange has, like a seat at the table. You know how E. Badu is another artist that has multiple mega impactful projects in her catalog that define, like, the sound. So Mary is just special like that. And this album, my God, this is a lot of people's favorite Mary album.

[Francesca (Fran)]

It's my favorite Mary album. It's the only one I really, really go back to regularly. Yeah.

[Dustin Ross]

I respect it. I ain't gonna press you to listen to nothing else. I hate when people do that to me. I'll take it. Yeah.

[Asante]

This is music history. That's why I'm. That's why I feel like this is an important segment that I need to retain monthly at some point, just retainer. And then I feel like Mary J. Blige, you know, like, again, nothing more that I can say. But for those of you that just see her today, I feel like there's a younger generation that just has known of her and they know that she's done things. Mary is the reason that girls like Keisha Cole and Summer Walker exist. You know? Know what I'm saying? Like that sound, that feel like those things that have happened, like, I'm going down anyway. Mary J. Blige, that was 1994.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Wow. 94, wow. Dang.

[Dustin Ross]

Wearing looks that you could still wear.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I was 12. Yeah, that is. That makes sense that I was. Cuz 12 year olds are just really starting to get into their music, what they like. Ooh.

[Dustin Ross]

Mary J. Blige was always so beautiful to me in a way that like, you know, I think I had a little nigga type crush on her, but I was gay, so it wasn't real. But she's always been beautiful and I love the fact that her beauty is recognized, you know what I'm saying? Like, Mary is her contribution to style. She was one of the first motherfuckers that really popularized like wearing Montclair jackets as like street fashion. She was one of the first ones. All of that.

[Francesca (Fran)]

The tails, the.

[Dustin Ross]

The. The intersection of street style with like high fashion brands that most people weren't even aware of. Mary and a lot of other people during that time, but specifically her, when it comes to style, she is an icon. She's a style icon. And that was at the peak of a lot of her influence. When it comes to like black women's hairstyles and wearing blonde hair and just all of that shit Mary was really in. They've been doing it forever, of course, but Mary J. Blige was influential to this, that generation.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Absolutely.

[Dustin Ross]

So shout out to Mary. You can never give her too much, you know what I'm saying? Because it's her reach and her impact as an artist and a cultural icon goes so far beyond just a song, you know what I'm saying? Mary's responsible for a lot of. So that's why I pick favorites like that. Like you can't talk like that about a new. You know what I'm saying? I pick favorites that you can sustain and I can win the argument, you know what I'm saying?

[Francesca (Fran)]

Stand the test of time.

[Dustin Ross]

Y pick, get it with the right team. That's all I got to say.

[Asante]

Well, shout out to Mary J. Blige and her offering to music other artists that I want to quickly shout out. Well, not maybe not so quickly, but. In 1999, the girl group TLC dropped fan mail. Fan mail gave us the hits. No Scrubs, as the conversation about Candy earlier almost came up. When we mentioned pink and candy.

[Dustin Ross]

Hey, pretty.

[Asante]

That whole era of TLC was very, like, Y2K futurism. It was a very. It was special for its time for that. But I feel like it aged even after that because it was like one of those standalone pieces. Like, it was a switch up for tlc, the way that they were looking, the way that they were seen. And also was very unfortunate because they experienced the loss of a member. But there were a lot of great moments from fan mail. Like. Like, I remember that video from Pretty. Just like, you can buy some hair

[Dustin Ross]

if it don't come grow.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah.

[Asante]

You can fix your note.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah, Beyonce, you can buy all the

[Asante]

makeup Matt can't make. Okay.

[Dustin Ross]

They talking about you can fix your nose. I love my Jackson 5 nostrils. I know she looked at T by like.

[Asante]

But I like that conversation in that video. Like that. Like, I remember that coming up on TRL and being like, this is kind of, like, catchy, but a little.

[Dustin Ross]

I recognize the value.

[Asante]

Yeah. You know, honestly, that was a really, really cool thing that people were that I wasn't catching into catching up to or thinking about as I was younger. So that was one of my earlier, like, memories of, like, seeing deeper things happening in certain songs. I'm sure I'd seen earlier examples, but I just remember that moment living with me for so long. And that girl on the operating table. And then she getting up and running out because I think she was about to get a boob job or something like that. And I was just like, oh, my God.

[Dustin Ross]

She saw Funk Master Flex on the screen. They showed the video, him getting lipo. That's why she got up and ran out.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Oh, my God.

[Asante]

Honorable mention in the year 2003. 50 Cent set it off within the club. I remember that just because I remember that beat being everywhere. I really just want to give that beat at the chance. I don't really remember the album, but.

[Dustin Ross]

Well, I do. And that's why I'm mad, because I can't even really stand no more, man. He just posted Tiny and Beyonce mama talking shit about them. Like, you literally never mind. Damn. I think I love the work that he's done in tv, and I think that he is a very talented television producer and creator, and I hate that. Cause he produces quality TV shows. Say what you want, but, like, power was great. And bmf. Fran. Fran love bmf. She has merch. That's not, you know. You know what it is, friend?

[Francesca (Fran)]

Merch is crazy.

[Dustin Ross]

What did Karisa say? Where's my husband? Me Tw my.

[Asante]

The last. The last artist that I'm gonna mention for this, and then we can go on for the songs to play. So y' all go ahead and get y' all songs ready. Cuz I don't know how y' all gonna react to this last artist I'm gonna mention. In 2017, everybody was pretty much digital already. People do still release physical copies, but it's not as important to audiences and in mass as I feel like it used to be. But when Frank Ocean released a physical edition of Blonde, apparently fans went crazy. And that happened on February 25, 2017. People, they say that Blonde is one of the most influential R B albums of the 2010s. Just because of how he.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Damn. Really?

[Asante]

It has been said just because of the. The way that he played with music and R B and the way that he also played with those voice notes and things. Like, it was very unconventional.

[Dustin Ross]

It was good. Like, the way it was good front. It was good.

[Asante]

It was absolutely. But, like, the way that I think about ASAP Rocky right now, like, I feel like ASAP Rocky has always done that, what Frank Ocean did then. But ASAP Rocky was already still doing that himself in hip hop, you know, does that make sense? Like, I feel like they always had their own lane, they were doing their own thing. But like, Frank Ocean, he went from Channel Orange, where it was, like, very commercial and palatable, but still a little different and quirky and cool, to Blonde, which was just so fun, far from, you know, what we knew. But he still was giving us pieces of what we wanted, but it's like we had to work for it.

[Dustin Ross]

He literally. He literally had his back turned on the COVID So that's what his attitude was with the music.

[Francesca (Fran)]

My favorite Frank Ocean song actually comes from this album, the Siegfried.

[Dustin Ross]

That's my favorite.

[Francesca (Fran)]

My complete. Like, you know what's funny? It was my alarm for a while on my phone, because the intro, the way the music comes in, it's just, like, really soothing. I used to have that. My alarm.

[Dustin Ross]

What's the song that project called? Pink. Hold on.

[Asante]

Pink Matter.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Pink Matter.

[Dustin Ross]

That's my Pink Matter is my.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Wait, is Pink Matter on Blonde?

[Asante]

I thought that was on Channel Orange.

[Dustin Ross]

Oh, I thought that was on Blind. Hold on. My bad, y'. All. Pink and white. Pink and white.

[Asante]

Pink and white.

[Dustin Ross]

Pink and white.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yes.

[Dustin Ross]

Pink and white. Yes. I love that song.

[Francesca (Fran)]

So it is a good project, though. It really is. He hasn't really put. Put out.

[Dustin Ross]

No. Oh, I thought his back was turned. His head is down. His Back ain't turned on the COVID his head is down.

[Asante]

Maybe he got the physical. That's what's going on there.

[Dustin Ross]

I knew he was blocking something. Okay.

[Asante]

Oh, yeah, yeah. A lot of great moments here. Well, that's all the artists that I want to mention. A lot of great artists have done great things on this day, including scissor, Rihanna, and, you know, Maxwell, Jasmine Sutherland. A lot of great people doing great things on February 25th. But that's it for that portion. Now I want to know what you have been listening to lately as we move into that segment. Friend, what you been listening to, girl?

[Francesca (Fran)]

So I'm listening to Drive alone by Larry June Currency and the Alchemist.

[Dustin Ross]

Spiral staircases, baby.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Okay, and this is how it goes.

[Dustin Ross]

I spend a whole lot of time alone I spend money when I won't cause I work for it but it first start with a goal it's complicated but I still roll hate I can't respect it but I'm knowing that's just how it go I done multiply vintage gold quit meeting in the vintage rose I take notes I don't take nothing personal quit quick flight the end no just to with bro I'm so occupied money high overhead low old school engine powder coated so clean that you gotta notice I'm in a whole different time zone this art like Picasso this art like JB I'm in the drop with the AC 7 figure chase got me thinking like 80s sometimes come on.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Such a great record. I'm also listening to good flirts, baby. Keem Kendrick. Okay, let's hear it. You used to call me my phone on a Friday night it's been over twice it's been over we've been over yet you always called my phone on a Friday night it's been over twice it's been over we've been over don't you love a good flirt with a stranger? Don't you love letting out a good crowd? Baby Ain't coming home on a Friday night I'm all good My hips still whine don't you love a good flirt with a stranger? Don't you love letting out a cry? Ain't coming home on a Friday night I'm all good My hips feels almost like my safe haven but you ended up acting a baby belly together Even you always playing now you hating. Okay. And then the last wife. It is a good song is the scythe, which is Denzel Curry asap. Ferg and Tia Corinne. And this is how it goes. To act like you ain't hit now you better admit I did it one time I'mma do it again like 100% I'm a pimping out and I worry about what can that I'm in and I can't understand cuz I'm better than

[Pharmaceutical Announcer]

them and I wish a would but

[Francesca (Fran)]

they don't never say that cuz this could it's my list to pop some because it feel good I'm riding pretty with some bitties twerking in my hood.

[Asante]

You right I want to listen to

[Dustin Ross]

that with them emo kids under that bridge.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Those are my three for this week.

[Asante]

Dustin, what have you been listening to?

[Dustin Ross]

Okay, first off, I want to start off by playing this song from one brilliant lyricist to another. This song is by Young Miami. It's called News Flash.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Oh, my God.

[Dustin Ross]

And I just love the first line.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I come from food stamps sectioning weight from the lights going out to being super lit Went from sleeping on the couch to buying a new house Selling out the boutiques to buying them shits out Remember when they said I couldn't rap? Now I'm saying hoes watch a master out When I got the ppl on the house it was a rap Stop beating up don't make me relapse I am not one of them I'm a 96 little Kim make pay me like a pimp the court side on the bed is in the gym look up in the sky to run his mind on a blimp and to be honest I don't even want y' all too corny I might as well y' all if it's up, then it's up so if it's up then it's stuck to the point where I don't give a

[Dustin Ross]

major scare for Miami rapper Young Miami. The rapper Young Miami was shot at

[Asante]

while leaving a recording studio.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Rapper Young Miami.

[Dustin Ross]

The video shows the rapper Young Miami, whose real name is Ferisha Brownlee.

[Francesca (Fran)]

News flash, Miami Bennet.

[Dustin Ross]

Brilliant lyrics. I think she's next for a nomination for the Rock and Roll hall of Fame. What about you?

[Francesca (Fran)]

Right now?

[Dustin Ross]

Okay, so the next song I'm gonna play is by Cozy. He's actually. He was on another show. He used to go by Cozy with the curls.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Yeah.

[Dustin Ross]

So this is Cozy. He's gonna be on Bad Boys, Dominican Republic on Zeus coming soon. They filming in the Dominican Republic right now. Yeah. So this is Cozy. You can't talk.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Not my. Not my island. Got it.

[Dustin Ross]

Look, DK Talk.

[Asante]

Looking for you so I can drop

[Francesca (Fran)]

this D.

[Dustin Ross]

Let me know when you on your way.

[Francesca (Fran)]

You think they sent this stuff?

[Dustin Ross]

She had to approve it, don't you think? So that's cozy.

[Asante]

That's cozy.

[Dustin Ross]

And we're gonna keep it in New Orleans. This is. Oh, Michael J. Jazz bounce. Tell me what y' all think,

[Francesca (Fran)]

Sam.

[Dustin Ross]

So there's a whole. There's a whole genre called jazz bounce. They be having, like, these live showcases and shit, and the artists come in, like, ball gowns and ladies have gloves on, and they be singing on these jazz, like, bounce beats.

[Asante]

I like that.

[Dustin Ross]

It's really dope. So shout out to Michael cold jazz bounce. That's it for this week. Unless y' all want me to play one more.

[Asante]

Well, I know you have one, so if you would like to.

[Dustin Ross]

No, I don't. I'm just fine.

[Asante]

All right. The first artist I'm going to play, I believe her name is Reza. It's re with a little accent on top. Sa. This is from her project, scared to love. This song is called return to cinder. Here's how it goes.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Another heart from your favorite ho. Why do these boys always play on my phone? Who made these n wish I could return a c. Who do I call for this mix up ain't what I order now I'm on a border of crashing about how I feel please tell me this can't be really what I wanted was simple.

[Asante]

Yes, I like her voice and I like what she's doing with it on that track. Next artist I'm going to be playing is Brent f. With his project icon. This song is called pure fantasy. Here's how it goes.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Be whoever you want I'll be whoever I want with you

[Asante]

you let me

[Francesca (Fran)]

open, babe but you gotta trust me too trust me too

[Asante]

and the way

[Francesca (Fran)]

you walker down people always stop and stare I love when you come around I take you everywhere I want you in my world nothing about the way you make.

[Asante]

I really love his voice with that production. And you can tell he's been working. He's been growing. So appreciate that.

[Dustin Ross]

Super time.

[Asante]

The last. The last artist that I would like to play is Willow, back with the project. This song is called. This song is called ear to the cocoon. Here's how it goes.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Come on. Willow. Must be the devious scream worship his whisper through her luscious ache dreams of symphony we all soar on Goddess rain

[Asante]

woman

[Francesca (Fran)]

shadow me mother with your ear to the cocoon Sam. Jazz, Freddie mercury.

[Asante]

Hold on to willow. Some girls just do their damn thing and she's one of them. She gives. I remember her sound like paralleling what The Chloe and Halle were doing at the time, like, I felt like they could have been like a really great trio. Then once Chloe and Halle broke up, they started making music completely different. But Willow has stayed true to herself and she's evolved her sound. The project is called Black Petal Rock, I think. But that particular song was called Ear to the Cocoon. Go check it out. That's incredible because she's doing some.

[Dustin Ross]

I'm glad the trio didn't make it because they would have to put that disclaimer at the beginning of all the videos like this may 1st for guests that have seizures and shit, you know what I'm saying? Or whatever. Like the three of them.

[Francesca (Fran)]

I appreciate people that are willing to experiment with music. Yeah, it's always cool because you just never know what's gonna happen, especially young

[Dustin Ross]

people, you know what I'm saying? I love that you could talk all the shit you want about the way she was raised, but if that's the product that's coming out of her creative artistry and shit, they did something right because that's good shit. Real talk.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Like Lisa D. Cook said in the main show, the the space to free flow is what creates innovation.

[Dustin Ross]

So I better listen to Lisa Cook while she cook. What an appropriate name, right? Okay.

[Asante]

She be cooking for the Music man

[Dustin Ross]

segment this week in tv. I hate to make it all serious, but we just got breaking news for real. Shout out to Mary Cosby from the Real Housewives of so Salt Lake City. Her son, according to reports her son passed away.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Oh my goodness.

[Dustin Ross]

Yeah, it's really. Yeah, it's really sad to see. The neighborhood talk is reporting. According to tmz, police in Salt Lake City say that they responded Monday night to a call for a full arrest medical emergency involving a 23 year old male fire and paramedics were dispatched by, but he was pronounced dead. So yeah, we just want to send prayers. We want to send prayers to Mary and her sharing that story of her son and different challenges that they were facing in their relationship and him and his personal life. That vulnerability was really, really, really, really something that required a lot of bravery. It was raw and it made us all have a vested interest in his well being. And so we're really sad to hear that. And we just want to send prayers out to Mary Cosby and her family because I hate that. Keeping it in the Bravo verse. The trailer for the Real Housewives of Atlanta season 17 was dropped yesterday. All of the cast from last season is returning. So that would be Portia Williams, Shamia Morton Kelly. Kelly Farrell. Angela Oakley. Okay. Drew Sidora. Phaedra Parks. Then we have two more new housewives. The two new full time housewives are K. Michelle and Pinky Cole.

[Asante]

Pinky is a housewives casino.

[Dustin Ross]

Shout out to Pinky. She talking shit in the trailer. Everything like, Pinky is there. She is there and her presence is going to be felt. So shout out to Pinky Cole. I'm rooting for our girls. I'm rooting for my girl, Angela Oakley. I'm rooting for our girl, Pinky Cole. I'm rooting for everybody. I want the show to be a success and I'm. I want to see it thrive. So the trailer looks good. It premieres on Sunday, April 5. Interestingly, Bravo is also about to premiere a new franchise in the Real Housewives universe. The Real Housewives of Rhode Island. And they are going to premiere, right? They're gonna premiere right, friend? If they're gonna premiere on a different night. But then starting on Sunday, April 5th, they're gonna move to that 9 o' clock slot on Sunday nights. Now, typically, Bravo programming on Sunday nights is black. We get the Real Housewives of Potomac, the Real Housewives of Atlanta, Married to Medicine, three banner shows that typically air on Sunday night and occupy that space. So it'll be interesting to see how the Rhode island lad in that spot and get them some ratings. They're gonna watch. We're gonna watch. Because we'll be coming off of the Real Housewives of Atlanta and we're all gonna watch that.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Interesting, right?

[Dustin Ross]

And we're also. No, I don't know. I don't think so. Because they be wilding in the trailer talking about threesomes and.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Well, hey, yeah, I was gonna say.

[Dustin Ross]

Speaking of which, speaking of which, they. Those Mormons, the girl, the young ladies on the Secret lives of Mormon wives, they all got up upgraded to executive producers this season.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Wow.

[Dustin Ross]

I'm gonna tell you who, like whoever is responsible for their deals because they making cash money on this show. The show is performing well and now they're credited as executive producers. Learn from that. Because capitalize on your popularity, capitalize on the moment, but capitalize in a way that is sustainable and you capitalize in perpetuity. You know what I'm saying? Select the length of the life of it and. And thereafter you're reaping benefits from the work and your contribution. Just making sure that you're looking at things like that.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Absolutely.

[Dustin Ross]

Also, shout out to our Patreon guests. We love you. First of all, thank for the record for 2026. Let me say thank you, Patreon. We love you, Patreon. We love our gated community over there. Currently, we've been watching his and hers on Netflix. Asante has been facilitating a great lively of those episodes. Next up, we're gonna watch the burbs on Peacock. So it's the new series. Yeah. That Keke Palmer is starring in and leading on Peacock is breaking all kind of records over there.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Nice.

[Dustin Ross]

So why not put some more eyeballs on it? So I just wanted to give our audience a heads up that that's coming next. The Real Housewives of Potomac reunion continued this week with part two. In part two, Jazzy Harris came onto the scene. Her and Kiana went back and forth, and it was a classic good old housewives spat. I didn't recognize you on the train because you didn't look like you stole your hood, your boyfriend from his wife and you raising his kids with her. You know, you take that back. It was classic, like verbal sparring between housewives. It was great. So watch that. It sounded just like this piercing siren in the background. There also was an appearance by Monique Samuels. You know that she was on the show previously from seasons two through five. She made her return this season as a friend of the show. And there's a very interesting moment that the show ended with this episode. It was a cliffhanger moment where Monique presented some evidence that was not gonna be able to be aired on television, but it would implicate Stacey as having some sort of relationship with Monique's ex husband, Chris Samuels, that Stacy had previously been dishonest about. People are assuming that she. Streets are saying. The streets are saying. And it's rumored that it is one of Monique's children saying something about Ms. Stacy's daddy's friend or something like that, but they won't air it. Damn. So we gotta see what happens with that. Make sure you guys watch that. Also shout out to the one and only T.S. madison. Right. T.S. madison has an incredibly successful podcast on iHeart called the Outlaws Podcast, where she interviewed is interview based. And this week she had Candy Burris on there. And Candy shined just a little more light on her breakup with Todd than she had anywhere else. So make sure you go over there and watch that. Watch that interview and check out what TS Madison is doing over there with that. Make sure you tune in every Monday night. Myself, Carlos King, Claudia Jordan, and Blue Toluse will go live and discuss reality TV and all things related to that universe. And we have a really strong audience from there and I see a lot of from people who I don't read the comments while we on the show, but Claudia does. I don't never read them, to be honest with you. But Claudia be reading them. Yeah, y' all know me. I don't need no introduction and but Claudia reads them and she always says that people from the Friend Zone are always in the comments saying I'm here from the friend zone, whatever. So yeah, so I just want to show some love on here, you know what I'm saying to y' all for that and yeah, yeah. And that's it on TV this week that I'm gonna talk about damage.

[Francesca (Fran)]

That means that's it for us this week. We love you guys so much. Thanks for joining us, joining us for yet another week of the Friend Zone. We love you, we appreciate you and we'll catch you guys next week.

[Asante]

Every month is Black History Month, so stay black and protect your magic.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Bye.

[Dustin Ross]

I seen a woman doing sign language like gang signs.

[Francesca (Fran)]

You know what?

[Dustin Ross]

Oh, everything I seen it like earlier. For real.

[Pharmaceutical Announcer]

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[Medical Information Announcer]

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[Pharmaceutical Announcer]

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[Asante]

Adobe Acrobat Studio your new foundation use PDF spaces to generate a presentation. Grab your docs, your purple permits your moves AI levels up, your pitch gets it in a groove.

[Francesca (Fran)]

Choose a template with your timeless cool.

[Dustin Ross]

Come on now, let's flex those tools

[Asante]

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[Dustin Ross]

AI builds the deck so you can build that thing.

[Asante]

Do that, do that, do that with Acrobat.

[Dustin Ross]

Learn [e-mail] do that with Acrobat.