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- [00:03]
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- [00:39]
Zafia Zwieglinska
Hi, and welcome back to the Glossy podcast. I'm Zafia Zwieglinska, international reporter at Glossy and today I'm joined by Jill Manoff. And we're in London this week for Fashion Week, which is shaping up to be one of the busiest and most politically charged one in years. On the ground, there's a mix of excitement and tension. President Trump is visiting London at the same time and in Parliament, MPs are debating about fashion, how it should be talked about as both a cultural export and an industry of strategic value. You know Laura Weyer, who's the new BFC head, is shaking up London Fashion Week as well. She's made it free for designers to take part, doubled spending on bringing international buyers and media, and is also putting on more focus on education and scouting talent outside of London. Earlier this week, and I think last week as well, there was already some collaboration going on with Manchester Fashion Week, which is one of the cities further up north in the uk. Her goal is to make London a stronger global fashion capital, so both creative and commercially and breaking down some barriers and giving designers more support to grow, which have all been very big concerns for the bfc. So interested to see what that looks like. Like at the same time, the fight for VAT free shopping is still ongoing, frustrating luxury brands who say the UK is losing high spend tourists to Paris and Milan. This is a topic we've written about kind of extensively and it doesn't seem like the tax free shopping is coming back anytime soon. So, Gill, you know, I know you're not on the ground here in London, but excited to talk a little bit about London and its designers as well as some of the biggest awards like Burberry. Are you excited to see the designers this season?
- [02:20]
Jill Manoff
I mean, I'm definitely excited of the, the brands we've been talking about. Very excited. Obviously J.W. anderson and Erdem and Simone Rocha, we pronounce them differently, but yeah, I think I'm excited. I'm really like question mark, question mark, how the BFC is, how is able to pull that off? Are there some big name sponsors that are kind of underwriting all of this. How are they doing it without making designers pay and, and funding bringing all of these, this present? It's really a mystery. Do you know?
- [02:54]
Zafia Zwieglinska
Yeah, I mean, I think that there's been a lot more commercial partners this time around as well as a kind of lot of mass brands that are showing at London Fashion Week this season. Whether that's kind of fast fashion names like Zara's Tie Up With Harry Lambert, H and M is showing as well. I think there's been some others too. So I think there's definitely maybe some influx of cash coming in through that. And I'm assuming there's also kind of more long term partnerships with governing bodies which are fueling this financial support for Britain's designers.
- [03:27]
Jill Manoff
Nice. Hopefully it works out and we can learn something. We used to do that at St. Louis Fashion Week. Like, like come we're setting the stage for these emerging designers. But yes, it took us some hustling in terms of getting the, the sponsors on board and making, making a go of it. Ticket sales. Yeah, we had ticket sales, which is different than of course a Fashion Week fashion show, our Fashion Week week show.
- [03:51]
Zafia Zwieglinska
So anyway, yeah, I think there's also been a lot of publications involved this time around with hosting ticketed events. I know that. I think it's 180 strand and Perfect magazine have been doing some things and there's some other publications which are also involved. So my guess is that ticketed events, especially panels and kind of workshops are actually becoming a bit more of a bigger part of London Fashion Week this time around. And then we are going to be speaking to a number of designers or I am this time round as well. So the designers behind Rixo, Adeline, Leigh, Patrick McDowell and new gen's Gen Lee and the Ooze. And of course all eyes will be on Burberry, which is showing on Monday night. It's the anchor of the week, obviously the main and kind of only luxury brand on Britain's Fashion Week schedule. And it's also in the middle of one of the most kind of ambitious turnarounds in luxury right now. So, you know, any kind of early thoughts on Burberry before we kind of jump into what's been happening there and you know, how has been the turnaround under, under Joshua Schulman?
- [04:59]
Jill Manoff
Well, just kind of a comment and then I wanted to ask you something about London Fashion Week before we jump into Burberry. Did you see when you mentioned that Trump was, was there and anyway, Melania's with him and guess what? She's wearing a Burberry trench. And so when I was preparing for this and I'm googling Burberry, the whole thing is like, Melania comes to the UK wearing Burberry, which is interesting, which will probably tie to our conversation about who the brand is appealing to now or kind of what they're known for and leaning into. But also, I wanted to ask you. I mean, you're closer to it. And for years, London Fashion Week was questionably a flyover event. Like people would. Some of the editors would go from New York immediately to Milan. Also, there was. I feel like this is less so today, but then again, there are fewer designers that kind of fit this vibe. It kind of ahead a lot of grit, a lot of edge. Like, it was very. Not street wear in, like, the. The athletic sense, but more like. Yeah, street, like the grunge. I don't think it has that vibe anymore. Like, is it known for, like, something like New York is becoming known for advanced contemporary and contemporary brands. But I don't know. What would you say is the niche that London Fashion Week is filling?
- [06:14]
Zafia Zwieglinska
Yeah, I mean, I still think that a lot of the emerging designers are coming out of London, especially around kind of more interesting concepts, whether that's, you know, Tolu Coca, with a focus on kind of more African fashion. I think that Johanna Parve has done some minimalist things on the Ukrainian side. I think that's been very successful. Paolo Carzana, who's been doing, you know, natural materials and a kind of bigger focus on sustainability and dyeing. Like, all of these things, I think, have a real niche in London that maybe they wouldn't have in other places. I know that, you know, de Pezza, for example, with the kind of water gowns, has been a big name on the London Fashion Week circuit for a while now, as well as, you know, the kind of bigger. Even bigger names, I think that have been showing up on. On kind of international spaces like Chipova Luana, who, you know, launched a fragrance this year and has been, you know, the. The main, I would say, export for London Fashion Week with all of the different awards that the duo has been winning. The kilt skirts have been kind of iconic, and it seems like there's a lot of that signature kind of style happening in London that maybe you wouldn't have in Paris, which I feel is always more kind of editorial, or in Milan, which is typically kind of more design focused, like, leaning more even into kind of interiors and architecture. I think London is still very much like the. The testing ground. The place for newer ideas and also a good stage for emerging designers who are showing up with something different and maybe slightly less commercial.
- [07:53]
Jill Manoff
Yes, that clicks for me, I would agree. Good point. Yeah.
- [07:59]
Zafia Zwieglinska
And you know, before we dive into Burberry, is there any other shows that you're watching?
- [08:04]
Jill Manoff
No, no, no. I'm just excited to see what comes out. Like you were saying, the younger designers, a lot of on this list I actually had not heard of before, so it'll be interesting. And I am seeing some folks who had formerly shown in the States who are in London and I don't know if they were temporarily there like this brand new by Noor. I. I know they've been in New York before. Mark Fast will be amazing. Rixo, you've. We've talked to them a lot and it's interesting that they're showing again as a, an established brand, not necessarily young, not necessarily. I don't know, how would you describe them? Elevated high street? Advanced Contemporary.
- [08:42]
Zafia Zwieglinska
Definitely advanced Contemporary. They've been doing a lot of things in kind of women's wear and vintage. I would compare them to something on the US side like Reformation, for example, just with more vintage prints. I actually spoke to them today and they had some great insights on how different the US customer is in terms of what they want from that visual language from the brand. So I'll be interested to dig into that a little bit later this week so you can find more of our London Fashion Week coverage at Aussie Co. And now we're going to take a short break and then when we get back, Jill and I will be talking about one iconic London Fashion Week brand, Burberry, who I shown on Monday and the brand's changes over the last couple of years and where it goes from here under new leadership.
- [09:39]
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- [10:24]
Zafia Zwieglinska
But let's move on to Burberry. I know that it's such a spectacle. It's always a great location. The tent in the park has become kind of iconic by now, but it's also a great kind of entryway into the story of the brand and kind of what's been happening over the last three years. You know, there's been a lot of shifts and changes, and I'd love to kind of start off and kind of get into that history first, you know, so Cardo Tisci, who's led the brand until 2022, his kind of signatures were streetwear, gothic codes and that new Helvetica logo for Burberry. And prices climbed. I think the identity of Burberry was perhaps a little bit lost under then CEO Marco Gabet. And then Daniel Lee arrived in late 2022 from Bottega, you know, bringing kind of more bold color, oversized heritage. There was a lot of purples from what I remember, but the sales stagnated. I think a lot of that had to do with the price increases, the fact that, you know, the customers were maybe looking at alternative brands that had more accessible pricing, as well as, you know, some more signature pieces, which didn't quite land with maybe the core Burberry customer who was looking for trench coats and basics that exemplified British style. And that was under Jonathan Aykroyd, whose tenure as the CEO between 2022-2024 saw more elevation and even more price hikes. But by mid 2024, Burberry had already issued multiple profit warnings. I believe they were taken off the ftse. So the UK stock market, there was some issues happening with the brand and a lot of layoffs as well. So I think there was multiple signs that the brand was failing in terms of what it was doing, and it wasn't really a great time for it to continue. And then came Joshua Shulman, who stepped in as CEO in July 2024. And by November, he had unveiled the Burberry forward strategy and a reset kind of built on heritage and discipline. He was previously at Michael Kors and a Coach, and obviously both of those brand had been kind of emblematic to the accessories market in the US and that was something that Burberry was sorely kind of missing. It had focused a lot on trench coats in the past, but never truly on the accessory side, not since the kind of early heydays in 2010. So what did you think of that whole period? Because it did feel a little bit messy.
- [12:53]
Jill Manoff
It felt so messy, especially after a period of great stability and strength. We know that after 17 years. Christopher Bailey was with the company for 17 years as the creative director. They kind of expanded his role where he was also overseeing marketing. Basically creative of any kind. And it was so strong. They were. It was really leaning into kind of classic British, I don't know, themes. And everyone. I don't. I think I would have a hunch, like it's always been known for the trench. It's always been known for the checkered or plaid prints and scarves. But really along with the CEO at the time or his, I don't know, business partner, Angela Aarons, like, they really worked hand in hand to kind of accelerate growth. And it hit, I think that the company maybe reached 3 billion at that time. 3 billion in sales. And ever since, like it did have kind of ups and downs and it's kind of stagnated over the last couple of years. That like 4 billion is what I was reading. But Christopher Bailey, when he left, what a loss. Like, it was kind of like, what do we do now? 17 years is a long ass time for a creative director. And when you know your shopper is a luxury shopper and they become known for, I'm sure they connect the designer to the brand and they've come to love him, that's a hard leap. So I feel like the brand probably had the work cut out for it. And then to bring in a streetwear designer is maybe not the best bet. When everybody's so used to these, the classics, and knowing that you can buy into something and have it forever and maybe, you know, streetwear is a little more trend driven.
- [14:33]
Zafia Zwieglinska
Yeah, I think that's a really good point there around, you know, Burberry being focused on classics. You know, the whole business was built up as a kind of post war thing around trench coats. It's always been this kind of stalwart of British style. It put, you know, models and kind of campaigns like Eddie Campbell and Cara Delevingne on the map. I think that those have become such emblematic British models that they are now used by other British brands to almost kind of exemplify that Britishness. And so now under Joshua Schulman, the kind of focus seems like there's a little bit more of that classic idea and idea for Burberry being brought up back. So a refocus on trenches, on scarves, on weatherwear, which in the Rainy Isle is definitely something that is an feature. Wellies.
- [15:24]
Jill Manoff
I love their wellies.
- [15:26]
Zafia Zwieglinska
Yeah, very good wellies. And obviously the other thing is the pricing. So resetting the pricing into a kind of good, better and best tiers, which he's spoken about in the earnings, as well as a rollout of scarf bars across 200 stores. Because obviously the Burberry has a lot of different check patterns and this gives customers an option to personalise, which I think has been a big feature with other accessories, you know, and other brands. So that's been something that he's been pioneering. He's also cut 40 million pounds, I think around $50 million in costs and streamlining teams. And obviously the other thing is the campaigns, which I'd love to get into. I don't know if you had a chance to have a look at any of them since they came out last year, but would you say they exemplify Britishness to you?
- [16:13]
Jill Manoff
Well, there's been what I was reading, I did poke around their social channels. I do know that there's some kind of backlash against, like, Daniel Lee, because he stepped into this, like, I guess it kind of held on that you're the creative director of everything when you're a creative director. And Tisci had that and now Daniel Lee. And so there was talk about he was taking Daniel Lee was taking it into too much of like a niche British focus, where it was less kind of, I don't know, Democrat, not democratized, beloved across the board. So, ah, I, I, I know that their backlash is there. When I poked around, the Instagram felt right, the Tick Tock, I was impressed. Like they had a lot of creativity and interesting videos out there that were a little cheeky and fun. It felt right for Tick Tock. So I feel like marketing in general. Yes. The campaign specifically, you tell me. I can't think of one.
- [17:10]
Zafia Zwieglinska
Oh, well, okay. I'd love to get into these because I think there's so much fun stuff. And this all comes, you know, I think, as the brainchild of Jonathan Kyman, who was appointed as the chief marketing officer in September last year for the brand, and I think has been making some significant changes, along with some agency work there, to, I guess redefine what Burberry looks like for the modern age, but also keep it quite contemporary, quite fun and a little bit irreverent as well. You know, there's been some things with the knight popping up in a literal kind of Full Metal Armour suit, which I think has been so, so fun. But yeah, let's get into the campaigns because I think they've been super interesting. So the first campaign that came out in October 24th was it's always Burberry weather, which kind of focused on rainy wear, outerwear. There was some great shots of London and some models and campaigns there. And then there was a number of other campaigns that came out after that, which all kind of connected these very British themes like festivals back to the city with this bus, double decker red bus, obviously with musicians like Jimothee La Cost, TikTok's bus auntie, who's this woman who literally goes around and takes photos at bus stops in front of buses.
- [18:30]
Jill Manoff
I know who you meet. I didn't know her before.
- [18:34]
Zafia Zwieglinska
Yeah. So, I mean, TikTok stars are becoming a kind of regular feature there. And the campaign also introduced some new trench styles at the Fitzrovia as well as a new focus on some of those accessories that were featured in the festival campaign, which was focused around music culture. And that one featured Liam Gallagher with all of his children. Cara Delevingne, Alexa Chung, Goldie. Like all of those are kind of iconic figures tied to some of the festival culture that's quite unique to the UK with the wellies, the mud and Glastonbury, which I think is the most emblematic kind of British festival out there.
- [19:09]
Jill Manoff
Yes, that's so smart. I think this brand that's almost 170 years old, like every brand wants a story. They have this great rich history. Like leaning into those themes is so smart. At the same time, a lot of brands are doing a lot of innovative things and back in the day, I think you were already working at Glossy at the time. Like we would equate what, I don't know, kind of the brands were that are synonymous with like innovation or doing something forward. For a while there it was always like, like Rebecca Minkoff's always onto the next thing and like Coach right now is onto like Roblox and all these innovative, innovative newer platforms, younger platforms. We always. Burberry was in there. Like they were the first or one of the first to do see now Buy now, which is, you know, a business model, not necessarily marketing, but one of the first to do have a presence on Snapchat and all of these different. They were definitely forward moving and. And yeah, now I wouldn't peg them as that innovative.
- [20:10]
Zafia Zwieglinska
Yeah, I think that first mover advantage was really important for them and I believe that they did get some awards for their tech side of things at the Fashion Awards in London. I think it was either last year or the year before that. So it's obviously something that has resonated, but maybe not something that really brought that much visibility to the brand as innovators, whether that's across marketing or visual language. I think that these campaigns which have definitely proven that a little bit more, have boosted their desirability I think it says that 11 points in Kantar surveys, which means that they have been more interesting to customers and perhaps even more relatable. And there's been some great results from the recent earnings in July to support this. The autumn 25 collection, which was the first fully conceived under Shulman's plan, is performing stronger than last year. Jackets like the Blackpool and Clapton selling well, and heritage codes like the Nightstand put back. And wholesale buyers are also saying that, you know, it's Burberry's strongest collection in three years, which is a big kind of sign and marker that the Burberry has reached, I guess, a turnaround point where even buyers are seeing the difference in the way that, you know, customers are reacting to those collections, too.
- [21:29]
Jill Manoff
Yes. I saw the same thing when reviewing their most recent collection for fall 2025. Great reviews on that collection for across the board. Really? And I don't know, I. Something about it, like, I hadn't looked at a Burberry Runway. Like, I know what's happening in the business, but, like, looking at it look by look, there's something to me, and that feels almost disconnected. And maybe that's where things went awry over the last couple of years. I was listening to a podcast where, in preparation for this, where somebody described it as, you know, they really want to be luxury, but they think of them as more like an elevated. A next level up from, like, a Lacoste or a next level up from some of these kind of more contemporary brands. As you have Schulman coming in. Coming in. He's from Coach. He's from Michael Kors. When I was going to look at the Runway imagery, what I was expecting, having come fresh off of New York Fashion Week, were kind of these young, cool models that, yeah, that just look like cool kids. And what. Who was on the Runway? I think you mentioned some of the names, but it was like Nate Naomi Campbell and Karen Elson and Edie Campbell. And it felt very, very elevated. The clothes looked elevated as they were styled. And they are pricey. $3,000. It's just, I. I don't know that maybe outside of the UK or I don't know that they're, I don't know, begging or deserving of such a high price point. I feel like I don't know that they need to become a coach for the uk. However, I do think feeling more accessible, I know that is actually a goal to bring more accessibility to the brand after it was too lofty in terms of the price points. When you look at their Homepage. They do bring it back to tradition. There's trench coats, there's plaid, plaid scarves, there's like a traditional polo shirt. But then there's also, they kind of threw it in there in the bottom right corner, a really fun, playful bag charm. It's still kind of spendy, it's $500, but very, very cute it seems. And I know also they brought their beauty brand back to the States in November. Beauty always kind of a gateway in to some of these higher priced brands. Very smart. But I don't know, it's like it is the only luxury brand going in the UK now or doing, you know, so elevated. But do you agree with me?
- [23:53]
Zafia Zwieglinska
Yeah, I think so. It's, it's kind of like it has this positioning, I would say between Coach and I would say between, I don't know, like a Gucci where I feel like because of the kind of practicality, the utilitarianism of the brand, it can't really push itself up that high without losing some of those core customers that expect more standardized product, more practical products. And it seems like analysts agree that the turnaround has been successful, successful, but there's also been some, some kind of shifts and, and tensions within that. I spoke to Lucas Olka, who's the, the kind of cheap fashion analyst from Bernstein, and here's what he says.
- [24:39]
Luca Kasolka
I think that the Burberry revival is quite promising. The idea of going back to the British roots of the brand seems a lot more relevant to consumers when we compare it to the most recent developments at bur, which were seen in the past as an attempt to mimic a shift to streetwear under Ricardo Tisci and maybe as an over ambitious attempt to move to the higher end under the most recent Jonathan Aykroyd stewardship. In fact, Burberry is quite unique in having a British background. And I think it has quite a strong appeal in several iconic products that can command quite a significant premium price. Of course, the trench coat, but parkas and scarves and the check pattern are all on that list. So going back to those and giving them new life, new interpretations seems to be the right thing to do. I think that if American preppy with Ralph Lauren is working, I don't know why British classic with Burberry wouldn't work. So we're positive about what is to come in the next few quarters as the new or suburbia tech structure.
- [26:20]
Zafia Zwieglinska
And Luca had a little bit more to say about the Burberry forward pillars, whether that's pricing resets or the outlook cuts which have also been quite significant. With Burberry bringing back so much more of its kind of control over the brand and how it's being merchandised into D2C, I think that there's been some things around that pricing that have made analysts particularly wary about the brand. I wanted to. To bring in some of those comments in as well.
- [26:53]
Luca Kasolka
Consumers want is to see the brands they like do interesting things and come with what seems to be compelling products and styles. For sure. In the most recent few years in the post Covid boom, a lot of brands were just sort of minting money and increasing prices and not doing a lot to sort of excite consumers as they didn't have to because consumers were spending as if there was no tomorrow. Anyway, being on the front foot and coming up with new ideas is definitely the order of the day. If we look at the number of creative directors that have come will come to the catwalk this September and next October in Milan and Paris. So for sure, having a new vision and a new strategy is probably going to be also a good, good background for one of the most competent talents in the creative field, Daniel Lee, to shine and to be of service to the Burberry brand. Yeah.
- [28:03]
Zafia Zwieglinska
And I'm sure you're agreeing with that. I see you nodding, Jill. I know that that's, you know, something that has been a big kind of feature of Burberry is that so much of this, this turnaround plan and the creative direction is still focused around Daniel Lee. You know, what do you think he'll be able to bring to, considering we're talking in advance of, you know, the new collection on Monday.
- [28:26]
Jill Manoff
Yes. I was going to ask you on the same note. I, I'm kind of surprised. I am very surprised considering Schulman and his history. He's only been intact for less than a year and a half at, at Burberry. But then Daniel Lee, I was looking up his first collection February 2023, like, okay, we're two and a half years in. He's had a little bit of time. And considering that the impact, I mean, he's a controversial character, but the impact he made at Bottega with the bags and the shoes, like, definitely no Burberry product has come out as like this hero or this it item that I've seen in accessories. And we know accessories are such a driver of luxury, so leather goods in particular. So where's that?
- [29:08]
Zafia Zwieglinska
I don't.
- [29:08]
Jill Manoff
Hopefully we'll see. We see some of that.
- [29:11]
Zafia Zwieglinska
Yeah. So this is, I think, where the marketing and the products has not necessarily lined up, which I think is a bit of a point of lack because the brand and the execs did mention that the B clip, which is their new bag reorders and the new Highlands and the Cotswold bags are doing well for them. And even the shoes you mentioned the Burberry wellies, those are things that are doing well for the brand again. But I don't think it's something that is reaching the marketing necessarily. I know that I saw some influencers during Wimbledon carrying the B clip bag, but other than that, it has been surprisingly quiet on my feed. Typically when brands launch products, and especially kind of looking at the way that American brands launch products, you end up kind of having a whole feed covered with one particular bag or one particular accessory. And I don't think that that was the case with the B clip. And I'm wondering if the brand has invested as much marketing into that as they should have for it to have as much resonance. I guess considering how many different other players there are in the accessory space.
- [30:16]
Jill Manoff
Yes, maybe there could getting too many costs. Oh my God, those 1700 jobs. That's a lot. A lot of jobs. So I. Interesting. I'd be interested to know how they're treating marketing in terms of the spend Wild. I did see it. Speaking of like seeing Burberry on in the Wild, I same. I wasn't noticing a lot of Burberry bags during New York Fashion Week, but I did see, you know, people, it seems like people who are not like press but more so like maybe influencers or customers. I saw some. Some of the Burberry plaid print. Whether people are wearing it. Like I saw it in like a tight sheer shirt. I saw it in like a bucket hat. Definitely pops here and there. Yeah. So it had a presence for sure.
- [31:02]
Zafia Zwieglinska
Yeah, yeah. I think that there's more of those accessories that are doing well. And so much of that is going to also rely on wholesale, which has had a very kind of rocky past couple of months. I think that maybe that as well is is contributing to, I guess, the lack of visibility around Burberry's accessories. I think that Luca had some interesting things to say on this topic too, around wholesale and kind of the way that it's working for luxury brands right now. So I'd love to. To get his take on it here too.
- [31:34]
Luca Kasolka
I think wholesale these days is maybe just an element of support with the difficulties that wholesale clients have faced throughout the world in Europe as well as in the US I think that brands should be working to Try and develop as their main distribution channel, direct retail. Direct retail gives you tighter grip on how you execute your marketing mix and importantly on how you control your pricing and price. Discipline, I think is one of the most important sports of perceived exclusivity. So Burberry comes from very significant discounting as it parted with the recent past and had to clear inventory. It would be very good if going forward it could achieve more retail space or higher retail space productivity and as a consequence less of a need to be exposed as much as before to wholesale.
- [32:51]
Jill Manoff
He's very wise. I agree. I did read that they are actively removing themselves from a lot of wholesale channels and focusing on their own stores. I know in the July, the earnings that came out in July, maybe for the first quarter there, there was a comment that actually the analysts were relieved and said it was a good sign that their same store sales were only down 6%. And you know, overall, year over year, year over year, revenue was only down 1%, which is like. It doesn't read as good, but considering the luxury landscape, pretty darn good. But the wholesale, the, the store sales feels interesting. I wonder how far it dipped before. It's wild. The numbers that were out there when they were have really struggling that down almost 80% between April 2023 and September 2024 in terms of the share price, which is interesting.
- [33:49]
Zafia Zwieglinska
Yeah, I think that was a really kind of big indicator and I think what what Luca said was that was most interesting was around this kind of higher retail space productivity, which means that you're essentially using that store space as effectively and as efficiently as possible. Which I think with Burberry, based on a number of visits I've made to the store when I have had the opportunity to purchase some of their items, it has been, I think, lacking in some of that. The store, for example, in Regent street is very big, but maybe not quite something that I would say is a productive sales channel. I think they're very focused on this kind of image that they're portraying of a very kind of exclusive brand. And so like the visuals of the brand, the interiors are stunning. But I'm not sure if maybe the customers who are coming in there are going to feel quite as welcome as, you know, if they'd be going to a slightly cheaper brand where the store associate side of things is more focused on them, just kind of getting to know the brand, getting to know the customer and maybe not focusing on that exclusivity quite as much. So I'm wondering if maybe with these scarf bars, but perhaps Maybe some other features too in the future. Burberry could bring in more of those kind of accessible luxury customers who have loved the brand for a very long time. We've talked about how this is a heritage brand and has so much history and kind of relationship with customers with UK culture. Those things are so important. And those stores, stores still seemed as, as kind of unproductive territory for me. And I think there's more that can be done there. I'm hoping that this collection is kind of mixed with, with what kind of is brought into those stores as well.
- [35:36]
Jill Manoff
Yes. Maybe they need to loosen up a bit. Do those scarf. Scarf bars have any or like anything in store? I feel like they need like, you don't, you don't have to do what everyone else is doing, but some sort of like, customization elements. I'm sure they maybe have like monogramming or something. But yes, yes, there's more. I feel like there's more they could do on that front. And also, you know, like we said, they're, they're social. Is beautiful social presence. But yeah, we're not really seeing. Which we don't in any brand really necessarily. Anyway, they could be a little more raw, a little less polished. Let's take it down a notch.
- [36:12]
Zafia Zwieglinska
Yeah, I think that would be really good. But I'm excited to see what's to come from the show. And thank you so much, Jill, for joining me to talk a little bit about Burberry and to Louis Kasolka for providing such great insights on the analyst side as well. We'll be watching London Fashion Week and covering it through our socials and articles. So please keep an eye out for that and really looking forward to the next couple of weeks of Fashion Month coverage from Glossy. And that's all the time that we have this week. Don't forget to give us a rating and a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you're listening to this, it really helps us out a lot. Thanks for listening.