Live Illustration (Course Closes Tonight!) No-fluff Q&A

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Good Ship Illustration Episode: Live Illustration (Course Closes Tonight!) No-fluff Q&A
Release Date: May 2, 2025
Hosts: Helen Stephens, Katie Chappell, and Tania Willis

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Introduction: Closing the Live Illustration Course

The episode kicks off with Katie announcing the imminent closure of their highly anticipated Live Illustration course. The hosts, Helen, Katie, and Tania, prepare to delve into a no-fluff Q&A session, addressing pressing questions from their community of illustrators and image-makers.

Katie [00:26]: "Today is a very exciting day because the doors to the live illustration course are closing tonight."

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Live Illustration Techniques: Hand vs. Digital

One of the primary discussions revolves around the effectiveness of live illustrating by hand compared to digital methods. Katie dispels the myth that digital illustration is the only viable option, sharing her experiences and tips for using traditional materials in professional settings.

Katie [00:51]: "Clients want real illustrations by a real illustrator in the room. Like they're dying for people to draw on boards or on paper on the wall."

She offers practical advice for mitigating risks when using traditional tools, such as using white sticky address labels to cover mistakes or sketching a plan beforehand to ensure smooth execution.

Katie [01:10]: "You can have white, like a white sticky address labels. You can take those with you and if you make a mistake, just pop a load of labels on it."

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Setting Up for Live Illustration Events

The hosts explore various setups for live illustration at events, whether in-person or virtual. They discuss using flip charts, large paper rolls, and camera setups to project illustrations onto screens discreetly during talks.

Tamara [02:20]: "Sometimes they'll set up boards for you to work on, or you use a roll of paper and just draw across and they're filming it as you work."

Katie emphasizes the flexibility of integrating live illustration seamlessly into events without disrupting the flow, ensuring that the illustrator's work enhances the overall experience.

Katie [03:04]: "During the talk or in the break times if they don't want to distract from what's going on."

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Katie's Journey into Live Illustration

Katie shares her personal journey into live illustration, highlighting her first job during her Master's program and her accidental TEDx Newcastle experience. Her story underscores the organic growth and passion-driven nature of pursuing live illustration.

Katie [03:57]: "I showed up with a board that I bought in the art shop and a bulldog clip and I just clipped pieces of paper to it. And I was just going from table to table and people were saying words and I was drawing them and they paid me in sandwiches for that. First ever job."

Her TEDx experience serves as a significant confidence booster, reinforcing her commitment to live illustration despite initial fears.

Katie [06:11]: "I went up like a 5 year old with my iPad. Hello, here's my iPad. And they like beamed up on the screen behind me."

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Overcoming Performance Anxiety

A substantial portion of the discussion focuses on handling the stress and anxiety associated with live illustration. Katie provides actionable strategies, such as writing down worst-case scenarios to rationalize fears and engaging in nervous system calming techniques.

Katie [07:05]: "I like writing down the worst case scenarios because if you're creative, you've got a really good imagination and you can think of all the worst case scenario things and you can write them all down."

The hosts agree that acceptance and self-confidence play crucial roles in mitigating performance-related fears.

Tamara [08:15]: "It sounds like the kind of chosen career of a thrill seeker. That's it, really."

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Preparing for Live Illustration: Tools and Checklists

Katie emphasizes the importance of thorough preparation, advocating for the use of checklists and forms to streamline the live illustration process. She shares insights into client communication, understanding event agendas, and the necessity of pre-event research to ensure successful outcomes.

Katie [12:00]: "Knowing the timings, what the name of each section is and who's speaking and what they're talking about."

The course offers comprehensive toolkits, including before and after event checklists, to help illustrators navigate the logistical aspects effectively.

Katie [20:06]: "There's a before the event checklist and an after the event checklist."

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Transitioning to Live Illustration

For illustrators considering a shift to live illustration, Katie advises taking the plunge and gradually integrating live illustration into their portfolios. She underscores the importance of showcasing live illustration skills on websites and being transparent about this specialization.

Katie [15:34]: "Just try it. You might hate it."

The transition involves highlighting live illustration projects and demonstrating versatility to attract potential clients.

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Managing Client Expectations and Deliverables

The hosts discuss the necessity of clear communication with clients regarding expectations, deliverables, and the scope of work. Katie recommends establishing upfront agreements on aspects like the number of illustrations, format, and post-event sharing to ensure alignment and satisfaction.

Katie [24:37]: "Ask the client beforehand. I'm like, do you want a one pager, so it's all on one landscape, a four, whatever, 16 by nine ratio thing."

This approach helps in managing workload and ensuring that the illustrator can meet the client's needs without overextending.

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Technology and Tools for Live Illustration

In addressing technical aspects, Katie shares practical tips for setting up cameras to film the drawing process. Whether using overhead cameras or laptops, she highlights the ease of capturing live illustrations for virtual events or post-event sharing.

Renee [27:06]: "I have one with a little tripod thing like you would set up for any kind of live drawing event."

Additionally, Katie reassures illustrators with dyslexia that modern technology, like spell-checkers on smartphones, can aid in managing spelling errors during live sessions.

Katie [21:19]: "I'll have a sneaky peek at my phone and do a little spell. Because nowadays with your phone you just type it in on anything and it'll be like, did you mean this?"

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Specialization and Niching in Live Illustration

The conversation turns to the benefits of specialization within live illustration. Katie argues that focusing on specific industries or topics not only differentiates illustrators in a competitive market but also attracts clients seeking expertise in particular areas.

Katie [28:00]: "The more yourself you can be and the more excited you are about the work you're doing, the better."

Specialization allows illustrators to build a strong brand identity and cater to niche markets effectively, enhancing their professional appeal.

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Audience Q&A Highlights

Handling Dyslexia in Live Illustration

Gaynor, a listener, inquires about managing dyslexia during live illustration, specifically concerning spelling accuracy. Katie encourages the use of technology, such as smartphone spell-checkers, to alleviate this concern.

Gaynor [21:07]: "I have dyslexia, can be a live illustrator... my spelling's atrocious."

Katie [21:19]: "Use your phone because it's so portable and everyone's got it."

Live Illustration as a Side Gig

Pearl questions the feasibility of pursuing live illustration alongside a full-time job. Katie affirms its viability, suggesting manageable frequencies like one session per week, while acknowledging the intense nature of the work.

Pearl [22:02]: "Is it realistic to do live illustration as a side gig?"

Katie [22:09]: "Yeah, definitely. I think... One a week... cruising along."

Approaching Live Illustration Reflectively

Katja wonders if live illustration can be approached more reflectively, allowing time to process information post-event. Katie expresses a personal preference for on-the-spot drawing but acknowledges that some illustrators may prefer a more contemplative approach.

Katja [25:56]: "Are there ways to approach live illustration as a more reflective or semi live practice?"

Katie [26:14]: "I don't like the idea of that at all. But it could work if you're into that."

Camera Setup for Live Illustration

Visa asks for tips on setting up cameras to film the illustration process. Renee shares her practical setup using tripods and ceiling hooks, demonstrating the simplicity and effectiveness of various configurations.

Visa [26:57]: "How do you set up cameras for filming the drawing setup?"

Renee [27:06]: "I've got one with a little tripod thing... and a hook in the ceiling above my desk."

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Embracing Uniqueness and Authenticity

A recurring theme is the importance of maintaining one's unique voice and authenticity in live illustration. The hosts emphasize that personalization and specializing in areas that resonate personally not only enrich the illustrator's work but also attract clients aligned with their values.

Katie [28:00]: "Be yourself and show off who you actually are."

Tamara [32:12]: "Who are you? What do you really care about?... fly your freak flag."

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Conclusion: Enrolling in the Live Illustration Course

As the episode wraps up, Katie reiterates the value of their Live Illustration course, highlighting its structured support, lifetime access, and comprehensive coverage of essential topics. The hosts encourage listeners to seize the opportunity before the course price increases, ensuring they don’t miss out on valuable learning and community support.

Katie [32:44]: "The price is going up next time. And it's lifetime access... you might join now and ignore it until you're ready."

Renee [32:53]: "Lifetime access... you worry. It's all sorted."

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Key Takeaways

• Live Illustration Viability: Both traditional and digital methods are effective; choice depends on personal preference and client needs.
• Preparation is Crucial: Utilize checklists, understand event agendas, and communicate clearly with clients to ensure successful live illustration sessions.
• Overcoming Anxiety: Implement strategies like writing down worst-case scenarios and engaging in calming techniques to manage performance-related stress.
• Specialization Enhances Appeal: Focusing on specific industries or topics can differentiate illustrators and attract targeted clients.
• Embrace Authenticity: Maintaining a unique voice and aligning with personal values enhances both personal satisfaction and professional success.
• Course Enrollment: The Live Illustration course offers structured learning, live Q&A sessions, and lifetime access, making it a valuable resource for aspiring live illustrators.

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For more insights and to join the supportive community of illustrators, visit The Good Ship Illustration and consider enrolling in their Live Illustration course before the doors close.

Transcript

[Katie]

Welcome. Today is a very exciting day because the doors to the live illustration course are closing tonight. They'll be open for one week and we're going to do a live illustration themed call.

[Renee]

Brilliant. I've got lots of questions, Katie. People are dying to get on this course and we've got loads of questions.

[Katie]

Thank you.

[Renee]

So the first one is, do you think there are effective professional ways to live illustrate by hand, or does it always feel like a risky business?

[Katie]

This is a good thing to ask and people have been asking me this a lot because I think there's this assumption that you have to work digitally to be a live illustrator. And that is not the case in my experience anyway. Clients want real illustrations by a real illustrator in the room. Like they're dying for people to draw on boards or on paper on the wall. And I spend so much of my time convincing them, please let me draw on the iPad. It's gonna be so much better for you. But I think because people see me doing it digitally, they think that's the way forward. But. But yeah, if you can do it. I was going to say naturally, with traditional materials, lean into that. It's a total strength. Clients love it and it can be risky, but there's things you can do. For instance, I'll give you a good sneaky tip. You can have white, like a white sticky address labels. You can take those with you and if you make a mistake, just pop a load of labels on it. I like that. And then some people like to like sketch out a plan on the board or the roll of paper beforehand so you're not completely winging it. There's like, there is planning that goes into these things, I think more planning when it's traditional materials. So it's not really risky, but it's definitely professional and effective.

[Renee]

If you were going to draw live at an event, I suppose you could have a flip chart or you could have a paper piece of paper on a desk with a camera over it that's on a big screen or something.

[Katie]

Yeah. And even if you're just in the room as well, like as the Sims, where the event is happening, that works. Yeah, there's loads of good ways.

[Tamara]

So they'll. Sometimes they'll set up boards for you to work on, or you use a roll of paper and just draw across and like they're filming it as you work or you're filming.

[Katie]

Oh, they're not even filming it. You're just in the room listening to the speaker and people are like, wow, somebody's drawing what they're saying. And then at the end. So like sometimes they'll set you up beside the stage or like nearby at the back. So you're not just disrupting people, but.

[Renee]

They'Re not necessarily seeing you draw it live. But they come and have a look after at some events.

[Katie]

Yeah.

[Renee]

Okay.

[Katie]

And I much prefer working on the iPad for millions of reasons, but.

[Renee]

And then that's projected onto a screen during the talk.

[Katie]

During the talk or in the break times if they don't want to distract from what's going on. Or sometimes it's completely secret and then they'll just be sending that image to people afterwards as well.

[Tamara]

Oh, so it does. It might not happen simultaneously and visibly during a conference.

[Katie]

Yeah, so it is happening live, but nobody knows.

[Tamara]

So that's a lower stress factor.

[Katie]

Yeah, definitely.

[Renee]

Okay. Would you like another question?

[Katie]

Yeah, go for it.

[Renee]

So this is from Renee, who would like tips on getting the live illustration portfolio ready to convince that first client, please.

[Katie]

Oh, this is good. We are going to cover this in the course because I've got a whole bit talking about how to strategically build your portfolio, what to practice on, and overcoming that thing of. Just because it was a practice thing. It's still a portfolio piece. Just. Yeah, so we will cover that, I think. What was it? Getting convincing the first client. It does take practice. I think your first piece of work that you do probably won't be client persuading.

[Tamara]

Yeah.

[Renee]

Tell us how you got into it because that's a really good story.

[Katie]

So I. It was when I was doing my Masters because they let you get on with whatever you want and go down whatever rabbit hole. And I got really excited about war artists and like reportage, and I was like, oh, this looks so cool, like the on the spot thing. But I didn't really want to go to war zones. Like, I saw like, what George Butler was doing and I thought, that's so cool. And Nikki Groome did amazing reportage observational work in the Calais jungle when that was all happening. But I was like, that's really cool, but I don't want to do that exact thing. But then I discovered graphic recording and graphic facilitation, that sort of thing. And it originated in, like the 60s and 70s in San Francisco. And they used it for design thinking, like coming up with good ideas. And it wasn't just for artists. It was just for people that had something to communicate and they wanted to make it visual because they realized it helped people have loads of ideas and think better and faster. So I was like, I'M gonna try that out. And then just by chance, Edinburgh University, where I was studying, they put a call out, internal call out for. They were like, I can't remember what the word it is. We need visual notes for sustainability event. And I was like, me, I'll do it. And I had no idea what I was doing. I showed up with a board that I bought in the art shop and a bulldog clip and I just clipped pieces of paper to it. And I was just going from table to table and people were saying words and I was drawing them and they paid me in sandwiches for that. First ever job. But they also, there was a professional photographer there. And so I got photos from a website and I figured out, hey, this is really fun. I really like doing it. And I also loved that there was no. With a normal illustration project, there's like rounds of edits or like you do the roughs and then, oh my. I just really struggle so bad with all that. And there was none of that. So I was like, this is amazing. And just started there. And I feel like it's still really hard to find people who talk about how to do it. It's quite mysterious. And I suppose I also was like, I'm not telling people how to do this. It's really fun and I want to do it. I've got to a point where I'm like, literally there is plenty to go around. I'm not going to like.

[Renee]

You get far too many clients. Do you have them all to yourself?

[Katie]

Yes, I'm sharing now, being generous.

[Tamara]

But you did the TED Talk as well, didn't you? By accident?

[Katie]

Yeah.

[Tamara]

What was that kind of starting point?

[Katie]

Yeah, I went to TedX Newcastle. I can't remember if that was before or after. I think it might be after. And I took my iPad and while they were talking, I was drawing really badly. Like when I look back now, I'm like, oh God. But it was fine. And I was drawing what they were saying and I was tweeting it. So live tweeting the event. I wasn't being paid or anything. I was just doing it for fun. But then at the end they were like, Katie Chapel, please come on stage and show your.

[Tamara]

Oh my God.

[Katie]

So I went up like a 5 year old with my iPad. Hello, here's my iPad. And they like beamed up on the screen behind me. But that was. It was good confidence booster. And just to be like, this was really fun. And also I like had a great time and networked a bit. I don't know if I got Any work from that? But it was a good test and a good practice.

[Tamara]

Like being shoved off the diving board, isn't it, really? Oh, now I can dive.

[Katie]

I think that is scary, that sort of thing. But there's lots of things you can do to calm yourself down as well.

[Renee]

Like what?

[Katie]

So I really. There's loads of things, but I really like writing down the worst case scenarios because if you're creative, you've got a really good imagination and you can think of all the worst case scenario things and you can write them all down. But then when you read this, you, like, you realize you're not gonna die, hopefully.

[Renee]

No, the worst case probably never involves death.

[Katie]

The worst case is embarrassment or disappointing a client and you people will be fine.

[Renee]

We've all survived that.

[Katie]

We've all survived that. Exactly. But there's lots of others. There's like nervous system, calming things you can do and.

[Tamara]

Do you put these in the course?

[Katie]

I put them in the course. You've got like a whole toolkit.

[Tamara]

Brilliant.

[Katie]

Because there's lots. I think when, especially when you're doing this sort of work, you can get really stuck in your brain and you just feel like a brain with a hand. So when you get back in touch with your actual human body, especially because it's quite physical, especially if it's in person, like you need to talk to your body again and it. You don't want it to let you down, like by shaking or being sweaty and things.

[Tamara]

It sounds like the kind of chosen career of a thrill seeker. That's it, really. I'm gonna do this in three hours and I'm gonna be live. I'll jump on stage. Hello, ladies and gentlemen. I'm here. Where I was sort of like, oh, could I just stay here for four weeks working on this illustration quietly alone?

[Katie]

Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I wonder if the adrenaline thing, like, I feel like I maybe broke my adrenaline in lockdown because I got so busy doing online events and I just stopped getting nervous because I was always. And then I just. I don't care anymore.

[Tamara]

Yeah. You get to that stage of exposing yourself as an illustrator with work where you think, I did my best. No one's going to laugh at me. That's what I can do. And I'm not going to worry about it. But in early days, in years one or two, you're like, oh, this is so awful. It's like dropping my knickers in public. Yeah. All those different things. But you do get to a point where you're just immune to it. Don't you think that's as good as I can do. I am what I am.

[Renee]

Same for us recording this podcast. Yeah.

[Tamara]

Yeah.

[Renee]

At first it was so hard, wasn't it? We'd have to prepare.

[Katie]

So hard. So scary.

[Renee]

It was scary. And would be embarrassed afterwards in case we'd said something and we hadn't edited it out. And it's just exposure therapy, isn't it? Yeah.

[Tamara]

Now it's so nice to get to a place where you think, I can't be anything else. I am just this. And I think whether it's work or podcasting or anything, accepting yourself. So like you say you're doing those drawings live illustration. People probably think they're brilliant and you've just drawn something. Oh, that's the worst face I've ever drawn. Nobody notices, do they? But you tell yourself these things all the time. Everyone's going to point at one bit of my drawing and say, that's really bad. They don't, they don't.

[Katie]

They don't care. They're just like, wow, you did it live.

[Renee]

Well, they're the center of their own world as well. They're probably worrying about their own things so they're not gonna focus too much.

[Katie]

And that's so true. You're there to make them look good.

[Renee]

Yeah.

[Katie]

And that's a big thing. Like they're just gonna get a pat on the back from their team and their boss. Like, you were so cool to hire that illustrator. They don't really care about you. And that really helps to calm me down as well because, like, it's nothing to do with me.

[Tamara]

Can I ask a question before I forget? I'm worried that I hold these questions. I have to butt in because I will forget them with my lazy. I do. I always think it's like playing without sheet music. Can you have reference when you're working? Have you found a way when you suddenly have to come up with something? Like, I can't think of a factory. How it. I can't think of what something looks like. Do you get to find reference in Lifetime?

[Katie]

You do. Yeah. So I think probably the purists out there would be like, no, you must just know things and draw them. But you've always got your phone in your pocket, haven't you? And there's so much. There's so many times, even at an in person event where they can see me, I'll just whip my phone out to either check a spelling because that's a big one. People have been really worried about, like People with dyslexia and things. There are. There's no rules. You can check spellings. It's totally allowed. And check reference. And sometimes even just looking at emojis for a little bit of. What does that look like again? Oh, yeah. And the other one, shaking hands always comes out and I always. I can draw it. Once I see, I'm like, oh, yeah, that's where the fingers go. But doing it from memory, it's like AI hand with six fingers on the. All in the wrong place. And. Yeah, yeah, you're allowed to check for reference and some. I interviewed Dario Paniagua yesterday, who's like the king of metaphors, and I was amazed at how much preparation he does. It was like opening a secret box for me. I was like, you're allowed to do that much preparation? Because I just show up and I'm like, let's try. Whereas he is really methodical and well planned out and thinks about it a lot.

[Renee]

I imagine if you're the king of metaphors. Metaphors. You need a lot of time to think about those metaphors.

[Katie]

Yeah, exactly. Otherwise you just do a lot of cliches.

[Tamara]

He must have a box of metaphors ready to roll when the moment arrives.

[Katie]

He was like, each event deserves new metaphors. He's a bit of a purist about the metaphors.

[Tamara]

I was like, whoa, a fresh metaphor for every event.

[Katie]

Yeah. And he's got methods for creating the metaphors which he shares in the course, which is really interesting. But, yeah, you get fresh metaphor for every.

[Renee]

It just shows, doesn't it, how different everybody's brain is. And there's a space for that kind of illustrator everywhere, really, is the idea of thinking of metaphors. Fresh ones, Everyday life.

[Tamara]

Yeah, because that's the other thing I'm thinking. If you're working with a business or an area of business that you don't know anything about and you don't know what they're going to say. I was like, do they brief you beforehand and say, here are three. Three or four key things we're going to discuss. Some of the elements of our business are this. So that you can kind of Jen up beforehand. Do you get an outline?

[Renee]

Yeah.

[Katie]

And that's one of the things I learned the hard way, was that. So now I've got a checklist which, again, I've shared in the course, but there's a checklist of, like, stuff before and stuff after. Like, things you need to know to do a good job. Yeah. So I've got a form that I send clients and stuff. And also that was interesting speaking to other live illustrators and graphic recorders about what they ask the clients for. Because it is different. But yeah, knowing for me, like, the agenda is really important. Knowing the timings, what the name of each section is and who's speaking and what they're talking about. Because then I can look at that and I can be like, I have no idea what that is. So then I'll Google it. And if I'm still not sure, I can email the client or get on a call and be like, what is that, please? And then sometimes there'll be like some political thing about the company and they're like, whatever you don't draw. If somebody mentions Simon, don't draw him. And you'll be like, okay. And you'll not be told the story. Just like, I can't draw that thing.

[Tamara]

And yeah, oh, that's good if they give you guidelines. But like, when you go around to someone's mum's house and don't bring up the fact that I don't talk about the wall, don't say to my mom, she'll go nuts.

[Katie]

I remember I did a job for Apple once, Apple and ee, and they had a lawyer, and my. I had to do the illustration, send it to the lawyer, and they had to approve it before it was displayed at the event. And that was. And so I remember I drew like a hand holding a gift because they were being given. They're given an iPhone. Which I was like, wow, amazing. Go to this event, you get an iPhone. And I'd draw on a hand giving a gift. And they were like, no, that looks like bribery. Delete that bit. I was like, does it? Okay, yeah.

[Tamara]

Oh. It's the same as illustrating metaphors and concepts for the financial industry. If you do anything that looks vaguely like gambling. You read the article on funds.

[Renee]

It basically is.

[Tamara]

Yeah, it basically is gambling. So you come up with your concepts and they're all crossed out by the art director who says, no, afraid we can't do any of those because it looks like gambling.

[Renee]

Wow. Apple is so careful about their image as well, aren't they? Because I was listening to the rest. Is Entertainment Entertainment, a podcast I'm a bit obsessed with. And in there, they were talking about if a film wants to have Apple product. In the film, Apple will not let a baddie have an Apple phone. So in White Lotus, I was looking at who had what phones to try and get Samsung about what is going to go on. You can. You. Can I start watching it with different eyes now thinking, what kind of phone have they got? It's not an apple.

[Katie]

Right.

[Renee]

They're probably a baddie.

[Katie]

Does that mean wear goodies? Phew. Yeah. That was another thing. I wasn't allowed to draw an iPhone.

[Renee]

Wow.

[Katie]

On the whole job, even though it was about iPhones, which is very difficult. Which is why it was a present on the hand, because I can't draw that. You've been given a phone.

[Tamara]

So. Yeah, it was like, what, general symbol of a present?

[Katie]

Yeah. Just like a gift for you. No. Yeah. So sometimes there's really tricky things and you've got to stretch your brain to kind of get around weird rules.

[Tamara]

You'll be a shoe in for editorial now, Katie. Concept ready.

[Katie]

It's too hard.

[Renee]

Shall I read another question? We've been sent in.

[Katie]

Yeah, go for it.

[Renee]

This one's from Lizzie, who says, how do you make the transition from regular illustrator to live illustrator?

[Tamara]

Good one.

[Katie]

Just try it. You might hate it. Which is true. I think that's what is. How do you make the transition? Yeah. Try it. And if you enjoy it, start talking about it, saying that you do it. Show it on your website.

[Renee]

Just tell people. That's what you do.

[Katie]

Yeah.

[Renee]

Tell people some examples of what it might look like for your folio.

[Katie]

In the same way that. How would you become a farmer? Like, you'd just tell people you're a farmer, wouldn't you? Start dressing like a farmer.

[Renee]

Wellies.

[Tamara]

But say if you was an observational illustrator or an illustrator who hadn't dealt with concepts before, you'd really need to hone up your metaphor skills, wouldn't you?

[Renee]

Do you use metaphors a lot? Because as the metaphor king, what are you?

[Katie]

Yeah, So I. Before. So this Dariel Paniagua is really good at metaphors. And before. So I've worked with him. Like, I did his. He does, like an online training thing. I did that because I was just doing loads of cliches and loads of icons and I was getting a bit sick of myself and I was like, I don't want to draw the same things and different events. That's a bit naff. So that really. So really helped working with him, because you can do graphic recording and just do icons, but if you just do icons that they're all the same size and there's too much information on the page, you can't absorb it and it's not useful. So I think that's. There's not like a right way and a wrong way, but there's a way to make your work Useful.

[Renee]

Make it more exciting and make it more exciting.

[Katie]

Yeah. Then they've got metaphors or characters. It's just nicer to look at. And like when there's people pointing at stuff, you're like, oh, what are they pointing at? And you can guide the eyeball around the work. And having white space in helps guide people around. And also being really brave enough. I talk about this a lot, being brave enough to not draw everything because when you're panicking you're like, ah, I need to draw everything. Oh my God. And you feel like you've got to be an AI transcript robot and get it all down and write loads of words, but less is more. But it's really scary to do that because you're like, the client's relying on me.

[Tamara]

And yeah, the overcompensating, isn't it thinking, this is well paid, I must give them everything.

[Katie]

Yeah. But really they're paying because you have the creative brain to be selective and just pull out the really cool bits and make it look really exciting so.

[Tamara]

It communicates properly and it's not just a big old mess.

[Katie]

Yeah.

[Renee]

We've got an anonymous question. What happens if you go blank and can't think of a visual to describe what is said?

[Katie]

So firstly, you don't have to draw everything. So that's an important one. And sometimes it does happen. And if I always have, and I always recommend to have a piece of paper with you or a post it note so that you can scribble something down. Because if you're like, I do want to draw that but nothing's working in my brain right now, you've got it for later and you might get to the end of the job and be like, oh, it wasn't important actually, they talked about way more important stuff. But it's a bit like when you can't remember something and then you. The harder you try, the less you can remember. You've got to relax your brain a bit and just be like, that's fine. And it'll come back to you if it's really important.

[Renee]

So sometimes if you can't think and so you make a note when you're live illustrating is why would you add it in at the end? Are they using it for something after?

[Katie]

Yeah. So they'll usually. They'll share it with attendees usually and be like, here's what we talked about. If what you wrote down, you're like, oh, they do. That would be a really useful thing for them to remember that we talked about. You just add it in afterwards so that it's there. Yeah.

[Renee]

We have a question from Tasha who says how much, if any preparation can or should you do before a live illustration session?

[Katie]

Maybe this is so after my interview yesterday, I think maybe this is really personal. From Illustrator to Illustrator, I would say you need that checklist of like, you know, you need to know what logos they want on it, what's the title, what are the timings, blah, blah, blah, those essential things. And I am probably way too laid back now in my. Because I've broken whatever. I used to be really like crying and scared and shaking. Oh my God, I'm working in three weeks time. How am I gonna do this? I'd be really like over worried. But now I'm like, oh sugar, there's a job on. I forgot I'm working today and I'll be drawing the title like 10 minutes before. But then. Yeah, maybe it depends. Like if you're really nervous, planning and preparing can help calm you down. So probably when you start out you're going to plan way more and then as you get more comfortable with it and you trust yourself and you know you can do it, you'll be like 10 minutes and you'll be fine.

[Renee]

Yeah. The same with any job. I suppose that. Yeah, you definitely do need to prepare a lot when something's new, don't you? But once you get in the swing of it, you can, you've got all those things up your sleeve you can pull on.

[Katie]

Yeah, yeah.

[Tamara]

Do you not have a ready made checklist which seems a Katie kind of thing to do, like questions to ask your client before. But I presume that's in the course, isn't it?

[Katie]

Yeah, I've got a form that I send clients and there's a checklist in there. There's a before the event checklist and an after the event checklist.

[Tamara]

Yeah.

[Katie]

And then also when I work with other illustrators, I've got a checklist for them. So I'm like, make sure you charge your iPad, make sure you've got all the links, make sure you open Zoom or teams or whatever before the event, like way for so that there's no updates. Little things.

[Tamara]

Oh yeah, tech checklist. That would be really important. Once you. If you know you've got that done, that's half the.

[Katie]

Yeah. I feel like everything on that checklist has a story behind it. Like I was in a hotel once and there was a sign on the door saying do not boil soup in the kettle. And I'm like, there's a story there. Somebody's boiled soup in the kettle. So when I'm like, make sure your iPad is plugged in. That's because one day my iPad just died. And yeah, things that you want to avoid. I've done all the bad things so you don't have to.

[Renee]

And we've got a question from Gaynor who says I have dyslexia, can be a live illustrator. This is what I would worry about. My spelling's atrocious and trying to write things live, I would get in a panic and the spelling would be worse than ever.

[Katie]

Yeah, this is. I've had a lot of messages this week about that. People saying, spelling what? And maybe I'm not. I'm like, I'm biased cuz I was a total spelling nerd at school.

[Renee]

You are really good at spelling.

[Katie]

Love spelling. So I'll either just not write the word if I'm not sure or I'll have a sneaky peek at my phone and do a little spell. Because nowadays with your phone you just type it in on anything and it'll be like, did you mean this? And you're like, oh, yeah. So that's really helpful. The modern world, when we did maths at school and they were like, you're not gonna have a calculator in your pocket. Yes, you are. You're not gonna have a encyclopedia in your pocket that knows how to spell every single word. Yes, you are. Yeah. Don't be shy about using technology like your phone because it's so portable and everyone's got it. Yeah.

[Renee]

There's a question from Pearl. Good name. I love the name Pearl. Is it realistic to do live illustration as a side gig?

[Katie]

What do you mean by realistic? You can do it. Side gig. Yeah, definitely. I think.

[Tamara]

Because you would just do one a week, couldn't you?

[Katie]

Yeah, I'd say one a week. That's like full time to me. Yeah, One a week of my finest. Like cruising along.

[Tamara]

It's exhausting as well, isn't it? You've said before because of the adrenaline rush and it's quite intense on the spot. You couldn't be doing this every day for five days a week, could you?

[Katie]

No, not. It's not sustainable. I don't think to do it every day. And also when clients have edits, it starts to get tricky to keep up on things. Yeah, realistic. The one thing I would say, if it's a side gig, clients might be less likely to hire you because if they go on your website, it's people have got very strong bullshit detectors. And if they Go on your website and they're like, they're just trying this out. They'd have never done this before.

[Tamara]

They're not a specialist.

[Katie]

Yeah. So there's that thing that might impact your actually getting hired for it if it's a side gig. But it's. It's doable. Yeah.

[Tamara]

What about getting to. I know we always say no to this, but because they're quite. People like specialists and they're slightly different. Would you have two websites, your graphic recording recording website and your illustration website?

[Katie]

It depends. I think if you've got a really good thing going with your existing illustration career, maybe it's worth having a separate website. Or just like having the Doorway method, where on the homepage it's like illustration or graphic recording, people can click what they want. But I saw there's an illustrator and she has like a really developed fine art practice and exhibits and galleries and does big solo shows. And she's got an agency for graphic recording. And they're completely separate because I found both. I was like, it's the same lady. This is amazing.

[Tamara]

But she'd kept them separate.

[Katie]

She kept them completely separate. Different brand names, different URLs. Yeah.

[Renee]

Because we usually say put everything together, don't we? But I think maybe this is an instance because graphic recording is such a. You're. You're really marketing it at businesses. They're not gonna really be interested what else you're doing and they want you to really know this. So I imagine in this circumstances, it's probably a good idea to have a separate website.

[Katie]

Yeah.

[Renee]

All the gate or the door at the beginning.

[Katie]

It's tricky as well because, like, you don't want to. If something's already working, don't just chuck it all in the bin. There's that thing, isn't there? In the hopes that this might work. So I think you want to keep both going.

[Renee]

Maybe you'd have both.

[Katie]

Yeah.

[Tamara]

Before I forget, I've got another question. Jump in the queue in front of all those nice people who've queued up and submitted. This is a bit of a vague question I'm imagining after three hours, do they expect loads of work where you draw, in a way. Do they expect 20 screens of. Or a whole Ikir roll of children's paper?

[Katie]

This is another thing you. Can I ask the client beforehand. I'm like, do you want a one pager, so it's all on one landscape, a four, whatever, 16 by nine ratio thing, or do you want an illustration per section? And then their expectations are managed you know what you're doing and it means you can plan in advance.

[Tamara]

So it's a bit like saying, what's the artwork size and how many spot illustrations are you going to give?

[Katie]

And it doesn't change the price or anything because it's still the same amount of time ticking. And obviously if you do a one pager, you can't include as much detail and stuff. You'll be much more restricted on what you record. Yeah, but it's easier for them to share at the end. Whereas if there's an illustration per section, it'll be more stuff to look at, but it won't because you've got to go really fast. You can't really draw loads and loads of things. Yeah.

[Renee]

I imagine making one page is just as much work as a few pages because there's the time thinking what's important to put in the one page, which is actually a lot of thinking time and preparation and organization.

[Katie]

You've got to do your artistic license thing and chop it all off.

[Renee]

We've got a question from Katja who says, are there ways to approach live illustration as a more reflective or semi live practice, allowing a bit more time to respond and process with less pressure to perform in real life?

[Katie]

Yeah, definitely. I think a lot of illustrators do that they'll go to. So for me, this sounds like my worst nightmare. I'm like, go to the event and then go home and do more work. But some illustrators will love that and they'll go to the event and harvest the information and then go home and draw it as a polished thing. I love that.

[Tamara]

I love that you say, no, make me do it on the spot with a gun to my head.

[Katie]

It's the only way I want to do it. If I'm crying and screaming and saying, I don't want to do it, because if you let me go home, I'll just have a nap and I won't do it. It's not gonna happen.

[Tamara]

Whereas I'd be like, yeah, okay, I'll just listen and do it all at home afterwards. That sounds like a dream to me. It's so interesting what different personalities prefer to do.

[Katie]

And then also in terms of time, you're half in your wage, your earnings, if you doing it at home, because you're doing the time at the event, which is exhausting in itself. And then you're going home and doing it. And also if you're at home, you're.

[Tamara]

Probably relaxed and slow and you're overthinking.

[Katie]

Yeah. And. Oh, yeah, just I don't like the idea of that at all. But it could work if you're into that.

[Tamara]

If that floats your boat.

[Renee]

And it's a question from a visa. A visa. Sorry if I've screwed up that name. How do you set up cameras for filming the drawing setup?

[Katie]

Oh, I just plug in my iPad. So I don't do cameras. But I've seen people do it like with a boom arm overhead camera thing. Drawing. You can see the drawing.

[Renee]

When I do school visits, virtual school visits. I have a camera that it's got. I've got one with a little tripod thing like you would set up for any kind of live drawing event. A little camera on a tripod that goes over my desk. But also I have a hook in the ceiling above my desk. And sometimes it's easier if I want the camera to be further away. I hook the wire up over the hook on the ceiling and it just dangles over my head.

[Katie]

Amazing.

[Renee]

Yeah, but it's easy, isn't it? Easy?

[Katie]

So it's high tech.

[Renee]

It's not high tech at all.

[Katie]

Should we do one more?

[Renee]

Okay. Is there any specialization within the field? Do illustrators tend to focus on specific topics or industries? Is that considered an advantage or does it not matter much?

[Katie]

So it. I would say it is an advantage and people do specialize and yeah, the more. It's like the freak flag, isn't it? The more yourself you can be and the more excited you are about the work you're doing, the better. So if you're really into a specific thing. So I spoke to somebody who really wanted to work in like heritage events and like for museums and stuff like that. And I'm like, that makes it so clear for heritage people that you are the illustrator for the job. Because if they're looking for an illustrator to illustrate their event and it's you versus Mr. Generic whoever, obviously you're going to get preferential things treatment. That's such a good question.

[Renee]

I'd never thought of that before.

[Katie]

Yeah.

[Renee]

Also you could choose what area you.

[Tamara]

Want to illustrate if you think from the client's point of view as well. You've been tasked with a job to find the best live illustrator for this project. And when you find that specialist, I have just done my job really well because I've got them the best person that exists. So as an argument for niching and being very freak flag, it totally wins, doesn't it? Because if you've got. If you're looking at everyone, the job could never end you. But it's three days trying to find the right live illustrator.

[Katie]

Yeah. And if your work all looks the same as other people's and you haven't got any specialism or any of you in there, any of your freak flag weirdness people, the clients are just going to go by price and they're going to look for the cheapest person and we don't want to be doing that.

[Tamara]

That is super interesting. Yeah.

[Katie]

So be yourself and show off who you actually are. And I think another thing to say in this course, it's not about here's how I do well, here's how I do live illustration. But it's not copy my work, it's how are you gonna do your work and make it look like your stuff within this framework of this is how to make it more useful and make the information more absorbable and how to select what to draw and what to leave out. So it's things to help you, but it is your work at the end of the day. Because I don't want to just.

[Renee]

We're always talking about that good ship, aren't we? About finding your own voice and being 100% you.

[Katie]

Yeah.

[Renee]

So this is runs right through the live illustration course too.

[Katie]

Yeah. I definitely do not want the course to be a Katie factor, to be just pumping out loads of Katies. Like horrible. Imagine terrible.

[Tamara]

What are the main businesses that use live illustration?

[Katie]

All of them. Like loads of healthcare companies, government people.

[Tamara]

Yeah.

[Katie]

Academia, education, like private and public brands, organizations and people selling stuff. It's usually like anybody who wants to say something. So that's all of them. So it's totally random because like sometimes I'll be like helping a university project. Talk about wrapping up a three year project. Or sometimes I'll be helping a drinks company convince people to drink a drink.

[Tamara]

Yeah.

[Katie]

So it's really just so wide ranging.

[Tamara]

Do you think you'll specialize eventually or do you love the world?

[Katie]

I've specialized a wee bit. Like I do say I really like sustainability and social justice, those kind of things.

[Tamara]

Yeah.

[Katie]

But then the nice thing that happens even when you niche and you say this is what I want to do, other people still come to work with you because they're like, oh, that's great, you know what you're doing and can you come and work for us, please? And then. And you can say no to people as well. I had that question. Can you. If you don't agree with the ethics or the values of a company, you could totally say no. Yeah, 100%.

[Tamara]

That feels good.

[Katie]

Yeah.

[Tamara]

You're not having my drawing because you don't treat the world properly.

[Katie]

Yeah, exactly. I'm really excited to interview Tamara Jade Katz because she is a graphic recorder and a facilitator who is really. She's got really strong values and ethics and talks about that in her work. About. I can't think of it now. But yeah, that's going to be. Because I wanted to show that you don't have to just abandon yourself and sell your soul and just do corporate things.

[Tamara]

Because you do a lot for social services and things like that, don't you? There's often kind of bodies like councils that are talking about ethical values within their councils or even companies as well, aren't they?

[Katie]

Yeah. Companies that are like looking after their staff and even like charities, non profits.

[Tamara]

Yeah.

[Katie]

There's lots of lovely things to work on. Yeah.

[Tamara]

It sounds so exciting. I'm thinking of changing my career.

[Katie]

Yeah. Join us.

[Renee]

I think a lot of people are specialized suddenly. I was seeing you, Tanya, doing lots of stuff for heritage or. Yeah, like activism, nature groups and activism. Yeah.

[Tamara]

That's what you. When we were talking about that one to one mentoring, that's what it all seems to come back to again is who are you? What do you really care about? And if you have this skill to draw, why would you draw any old thing when you could actually further a cause that you love? Or even. It's just kind of some weird subject that you're totally into. Why would you not want to keep drawing that and do something useful with what you do? So ultimately flying your freak flag.

[Katie]

Lovely to see you. If you do join, I will say the price is going up next time.

[Renee]

And it's lifetime access. So even if you're really busy now, the prices are going to go up next time. So you might join now and ignore it until. Until you're ready.

[Katie]

Yes. It's one of those things, that old.

[Tamara]

Trick that's so scary. It's a clever idea.

[Katie]

Yeah. You get. It's. It's dripped to you like one week at a time just so that it's not overwhelming. But there's nothing saying you must do a whole week and then be finished for the next week. It really is lifetime access and there's no panicking allowed.

[Tamara]

How many sessions are there?

[Katie]

There's. So it's a four week course and there's three live calls where you can submit your questions and get them answered and the calls. So those live calls are the only live bit and they are recorded. So if you're in a different time zone or you've got a busy life or whatever, then you worry. Yeah.

[Tamara]

Got it all sorted.

[Katie]

It's all sorted.

[Tamara]

Okay.

[Katie]

Thank you, Katie.

[Tamara]

Goodbye.

[Katie]

Thank.