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- [00:02]
Gwyneth Paltrow
When I travel, I'm always curious about where people are staying, especially the places that feel like someone's actual home. Maybe there's fresh herbs in the kitchen or someone's favorite books on the shelf. That's the true essence of a lived in space. It made me realize so many of us already have those kinds of spaces. And even if you're not using yours for a few weeks, someone else might be dreaming of exactly that. You don't have to become a full time host to use Airbnb. Just a smart way to make the most of your space while you're off exploring. Maybe even finding something beautiful to bring back with you. Your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how much@airbnb.com host@goop, we talk a lot about healing, how we pursue it, how we hold space for it, and the people who make that possible. Our obs, our dentists, our acupuncturists, our estheticians. These are people we trust with our bodies, our stories, our care. So it matters what they wear while doing that work. That's why we've partnered with Figs. They make scrubs that feel as intentional as the people who wear them. Thoughtfully designed to support healthcare professionals while they support all of us. The fabrics are beautiful, lightweight, high performance and made to last. They come in elevated essentials like black and navy and limited edition colors that are playful, fresh and just really lovely to wear. And the fit? It's flattering, comfortable and made to feel good in. With back to school season upon us, it's the perfect time to stock up with some fresh outfits for the year. And Figs just dropped a brand new collection of limited edition styles and accessories. If you're in healthcare or shopping for someone who is, you can get 15% off your first order at wearfigs.com with the code FIGSRX. That's wherefigs.com code figsrx when you are.
- [02:13]
Alicia Keys
Pioneering anything or introducing new ideas to.
- [02:16]
Gwyneth Paltrow
The culture, you get criticized.
- [02:17]
Unknown
You do?
- [02:18]
Alicia Keys
Yeah, did you hear about that? I didn't find the one. I found someone I respected and we made it the one. In the sort of longing kind of view of love, people understand each other as if by magic. Nothing in itself is addictive on one hand. On the other hand, everything could be addictive if there's an emptiness in that person that needs to be filled. I now know that nobody changes until they change their energy. And when you change your energy, you change your life.
- [02:45]
Gwyneth Paltrow
Gwyneth I'm Gwyneth Paltrow this is the GOOP Podcast, bringing together thought leaders, culture changers, creatives, founders and CEOs, scientists, doctors, healers and seekers here to start conversations. Because simply asking questions and listening has the power to change the way we see the world. Here we go. This week, we're sharing a gem from the GOOP Podcast archives. My guest today is the extraordinary Alicia Keys. It's been way too long since I last saw her, and I was so glad to have a chance to catch up. Alicia agreed to be part of our virtual in GOOP Health Summit this year, which was focused on deepening the connection to our body. And I love talking to her about this. I also loved hearing more about her new line of body and skin products called Keys Soul Care. Her rituals, her creative process and. And her relationships. So let's get to our chat.
- [03:49]
Unknown
I've missed you so much. I haven't seen you in person in a few years. I was watching on TV the other day because I was watching Song Exploder, that show on Netflix.
- [03:58]
Alicia Keys
I love that show.
- [04:00]
Unknown
And I felt like I got a real visit with you. I felt like I was perched in the back of your studio. That song, Three Hour Drive.
- [04:08]
Alicia Keys
Oh, holy shit. No, that song is. Definitely has its own universe attached to it in this place. And I love that song so much. And the way that Song Exploder was able to capture it was just so exciting because, you know, you agree to do these things with people and you. You feel really excited about what it can be and you kind of, you know, you hope for the best and sometimes it comes out really great and sometimes not so great. But that one was so special. And the way that they were able to incorporate. It's a song with myself and Sampha, who's one of my favorite artists, who in this song is on my new album, Alicia. And the Three Hour Drive is so powerful because when we wrote it, you know, he. I just had my son, and he just was a son who lost his mother. So it was this very deep dynamic that we didn't even know we were creating. Exactly. And it showed that on the show. So thank you for talking about it because I love how they did that.
- [05:08]
Unknown
It was amazing to watch a song be constructed and then. And I love that. I love how they do that. And then at the end, they. When they played Song in entirety. But it was. And it was amazing to see how he was coming from this place of being, as you said, like he had just lost his mother. And then you're so maternal, you know, it's like you have this. These rays of sunshine coming out of you. And I really. I really felt that too. And when. So had you ever let anybody into the studio like that before?
- [05:40]
Alicia Keys
Well, the cool thing is, is I always record the sessions and I always make sure that every session has. We want to capture it because it's just a moment in time that will. That. You never know if it's going to just. You never know. It's just a special moment. It's magic. And so we always capture. We always capture each one. And so they actually use the footage that we already had so they didn't have to kind of be there. We were able to provide it. And then from that they were able.
- [06:11]
Unknown
Okay. Oh, I see. Oh, that's. That's why it was so, like, it was so intimate anyway.
- [06:17]
Alicia Keys
Yes, absolutely.
- [06:19]
Unknown
Was that in London that you recorded that song?
- [06:21]
Alicia Keys
Right, that was in London. I did a lot of work with Jimmy Napes in London. We wrote some great songs together. And. And so in one of those sessions, we happened to just kind of say, like, wouldn't Sampha be amazing if we could just all connect? Which, you know, sometimes it happens, sometimes it doesn't. And it so worked out that I couldn't even believe he came because I didn't even realize that he was experiencing this loss, this pain. And I put myself in his position. I don't. I don't know if I'd have gone anywhere ever, you know, but for him to see that potentially this was going to be some type of release, which hopefully it was, makes it even more beautiful. So that's how it all worked out. We were in London and it was just one of those things where everything aligns and.
- [07:04]
Unknown
Do you bring the kids with you? Like, how does that work? If you're going to record? How does that. How do you do that?
- [07:09]
Alicia Keys
I did have Genesis with me. I think he was pretty young at the time. So, you know, with your little babies, you. You try to keep them with you as much as possible. And. And so it's always. It's always interesting. I mean, sometimes it makes sense, sometimes it doesn't make sense. It kind of depends on what. What. How long it's going to be or. You know, sometimes it's harder for them. For me to drag them somewhere for three days.
- [07:34]
Unknown
What.
- [07:34]
Alicia Keys
I mean, that's sometimes worse. Sometimes it's just needed. So it kind of depends. And now that they're a little bit older, I can kind of gauge it depend on their schedule and also what they want or what they need. So it depends on that as well. So sometimes yes, sometimes no. In that case, I remember I brought Genesis because he was super young.
- [07:52]
Unknown
So funny. Because I really have genuine curiosity around how you do that, right? How you are with your kids and have all this amazing, like, outpouring of energy and care. And then also are this unbelievable artist. And. And it just occurred to me, like, I genuinely want to know this. And then I thought, like, I wonder if anyone's asking the men, you know, these questions, like, how did you know? Probably not.
- [08:24]
Alicia Keys
Well, you know, mamas are mamas. And that's just. That's just it. It just even. I mean, even I think the men in our lives will acknowledge that mamas are mamas. My husband said to me the other day, if. If I was doing this by myself, I would be. I know I wouldn't be able to do it. Like, I just know that I wouldn't be able to do it. And. And I. And I appreciated his honesty. But that's what I think. That's what we bring. And look, there's many men that do take care of their kids by themselves and the whole thing, and they organize it and they super figure it out. And I'm sure my husband would figure it out as well. But it's true that mamas are mamas, and we do kind of have this superpower of fig how to, like, create this. I don't know what we do, but we sure do figure it out, and I love us for that. You. I mean, I could ask you the same question, you know, what do you. What do you think your. Your secret is for being in with being able to manage as a business, as an artist, and as a mother? What's your secret? Do you think? It's.
- [09:27]
Unknown
It's weird. I feel like, energetically, I'm always with them. Like, they're always like, the biggest priority. And so even when I'm doing something else, I feel like, where are they? You know, or when. When they were little, like, is it bedtime? Are they in the bath? And I felt it was hard, you know, it was hard to. Especially being when I was doing anything really creative, because I feel like you're such a channel at that point. And it's really hard to kind of be tethered to the earth and be thinking about school schedules and making snacks. And so that was. That was. That was hard for me. And probably one of the reasons as well, why I leaned more into my business in the kind of 9 to 5 job, which I also really loved so much, and all of the challenges of that. But I found it particularly difficult to be inhabiting the artist and being a mother. Because in a way, when you're an artist, like, what it is to be an artist is to be. Is to have that abandoned.
- [10:28]
Alicia Keys
In a way, for me, I think that it's. Well, it's definitely a schedule. I'm really, really big on the schedule thing. It's the only way that I know how to make anything function. And that feels really good. I think that when I can create the space for whatever is needed, sometimes I need to create the space to actually be with them, because I'm noticing that there's things I just need to tune into them with, or there's times when I need to tune into myself because I'm noticing that there's things that I absolutely have to tune in about. And so I find that the schedule helps me to at least try to accomplish as much as I possibly can. So that would be my. That's my. That's my most, like, realistic thing. But I think that. I think also the creating space to dream and creating space to create amongst it is really, really important. And sometimes I think probably you can feel guilty because you do have to choose yourself, you know, and sometimes we're taught to feel guilty about choosing ourselves, which I'm personally really working hard to break, because I think that that's really silly and we should not feel that way. You know what I mean? And there's a balance, you know, of course, you only choose yourself. Then, of course something's off balance, but putting it into the mix is. Is important.
- [11:52]
Unknown
So when you're writing music, are you. Do you feel like you're sitting down to do it? Are you. Are you channeling something? Is something. Something coming through you? And how. Well, I guess I'll ask you that first.
- [12:06]
Alicia Keys
When. When I'm writing music, is something coming through me? Yes. But it depends, because sometimes it is so magical that I literally know for a fact that it's otherworldly. And it's like another.
- [12:23]
Unknown
It's.
- [12:23]
Alicia Keys
It's a gift, and it's completely coming out of the thin air, and it's magical alchemy. And I'm like. And I. And I feel so. I feel so, like, bowed down to this moment I'm witnessing and a part of. And then sometimes it's literally like I'm banging my head against the desk and. And I'm like, why don't I know how to do this? So it's just truly both ways. Sometimes it's so mundane and so, like, Mud that I just. I can't find the words. I can't figure out how to make it be. You know what I mean? And sometimes just this beautiful. The beautiful. The most magical thing I've ever experienced. So it really depends.
- [13:14]
Unknown
And does it come to you in chords and melodies and in words? How does it show up?
- [13:20]
Alicia Keys
It's so many different ways. And that's kind of the fun of it.
- [13:24]
Unknown
Is it a feeling?
- [13:26]
Alicia Keys
Usually it's a feeling. I would say a feeling is definitely the common denominator. It's something that feels so strong and so clear and so something or so sad or so you know, are so exciting or whatever the case, it's some feeling. And then from that feeling it comes at some point it might not be at that same point, it might not be right. Then it might be a year later I'm like, finally I wrote that song that I knew was inside somewhere. You know, I find that creativity is so non linear, you know, it's just. It is when it's all working towards something, you just don't know when it's going to show up. And I think that there's actually something I love about the unknown with that. I don't want to know when it's going to happen. I don't want to know how it's going to happen either. Because I think that maybe somehow I would take it for granted. Maybe like if I could just sit down tomorrow and just be like, oh, here's the most amazing song I ever wrote today, right now. Boom. Yeah, I mean, I wouldn't turn it down. And I believe we do have that capacity. So I'm not saying we don't or nor that I don't. We do and I do. But I do find that there's something about the fact that it is a surprise that makes you love it and seek it and search for it and work for it too.
- [14:47]
Unknown
That's beautiful. Like just honoring the process, honoring the difficult part. That it's like a journey to get somewhere. And I think sometimes we get so stuck around outcomes and. And for those of us in the world who don't have a creative outlet. Right. I think that is applicable to everybody, even people who might not think of themselves as creative. That that openness and curiosity and tuned in ness or whatever is the start of something. And then to go through the process that can feel trying or when you know, it's. It's not necessarily easy, but outcomes that are beautiful come out of that. I don't know for me anyway, that like openness mixed with the mystery of. Or the difficult nature of how it's gonna end up.
- [15:46]
Alicia Keys
Yeah, I think maybe something that feels really relatable for all of us is that if we can just have the faith that it's going to come out, it's going to happen. When is it going to happen? Might not be able to say how it's going to happen. We can't exactly tell, but it is going to happen. And just by the nature of you continuing to work at it, try show up for it is going to happen. And I think that that really helps me through all the processes because it is, you know, there's, there's. It's this thing, right, which is just life.
- [16:23]
Unknown
So it's faith.
- [16:26]
Alicia Keys
I think so. I think it's. I think it's faith that it's going to happen for you ever. That thing is whatever that. If it's a little thing or a big thing, whatever that thing is, as long as you're going to show up for it and keep working at it and trying for it and thinking about it and working through it is going to show up for you. So I like thinking about it like that. It also is very helpful when you're feeling down.
- [16:54]
Unknown
It's true.
- [17:01]
Gwyneth Paltrow
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- [18:12]
Unknown
I'm always so fascinated by songwriters because it seems like the most powerful medium. And to be able to pull something down and have it come out, you know, through the body like that, that's your instrument. I just, I don't understand it. And I love music so much, but I just don't get it. And so I always am so Curious about how that process works and how something comes in and then it gets executed on paper or into a machine, like, it just blows me away.
- [18:46]
Alicia Keys
I feel that exact same way literally every time. And I'm grateful that I've been able to write many songs.
- [18:53]
Unknown
And I still feel that same way.
- [18:56]
Alicia Keys
I still feel in shock that it. That it comes out of nowhere. And then, you know, maybe it's just one piece of it. And then you go follow through with that piece a little bit more. And sometimes that thing you thought it was going to be is not even it anymore. And just that whole process, it's like clay. It's like, you know, it's just this malleable thing. So I agree. I'm in pure fascination of the process exactly the same way as you.
- [19:24]
Unknown
And then, you know, what's so great about you as an artist is like, I feel whatever that thing is, like, come out, and it's like an unretouched. It's like so beautiful and raw in its own way. I've never, you know, I don't know, maybe you do auto tune everything.
- [19:40]
Alicia Keys
No, I don't. And I work really hard to really, you know, just to be in that pure space. And I really love flaws. I really love mistakes. I think that mistakes are so beautiful. And when your voice, maybe it cracked or it didn't exactly hit the note precisely, but it was a little under or it slid under, and it's technically flat. But if it's with the right intention, you know, it does something to you. And something so beautiful about imperfection. And I think that's something that I've really, really learned a lot about, and I've really fought to keep at the forefront of not only my art, but as a woman, you know what I mean? And really just respect that. Imperfections are just so glorious. They're such beautiful parts of who we are, who we really are, and our humanness. And I think sometimes, especially in such a digital world where things can be actually corrected and fixed and changed and all the things, you know, you kind of forget because you're like, wait, am I supposed to be perfect? Because everything looks pretty damn perfect everywhere I look. You know, you forget. You sometimes have to remind yourself, like, actually there's something really cool about the imperfection. So I actually don't even like the word perfect. That's one of the words that I've excluded from my vocabulary. I don't like the word try, and I don't like the word perfect because I think that it's. I don't I don't think it's a real. It's an unreal word.
- [21:15]
Unknown
Do you think that what you like about mistakes is that, like, it forces you into vulnerability on some level?
- [21:22]
Alicia Keys
I actually think that it connects us a little bit more when we're able to share our mistakes or when you're able to hear something that's not exactly perfect. You might not even. I think a lot of times we're overjudging everything anyway. And a lot of times, what I might call a mistake to another person, they're like, huh? I don't know what you're talking about. You know, And I remember my. My. My. My piano teacher, she used to. As she was. I used to study classical music, and classical music is a big part of my background in my music. And when I was a kid, I don't know, seven or eight or whatever, I was learning these different classical pieces. When you mess up, you know, it's so precise, and you have to learn every note and. And everything. And. And when I would mess up, I'm like, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry. And I would fix it and mess up. I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. And she was like, never apologize. Never apologize. Just keep going. And it was really hard. Because I think that. My point is a lot of the times what we consider a mistake, so many people are not even thinking about it like that, you know, and we oftentimes, I think, just judge ourselves so much. And in this desire to be perfect, where, wherever that came from, if we do mess up, we think we have to apologize for it, and we don't. All we got to just keep going. And I really, really. I really, really like that reminder from the piano perspective.
- [22:46]
Unknown
Yeah. Sometimes when I catch myself beating myself up, you know, for millions of things that I do, right. I think, like, whose voice is that? Like, why. Why do I. Why do I have to drive myself so hard? Like, who. Who told me this about perfection? And it's tough. It's really hard, I think, especially in a capitalistic society and we live in a strong patriarchy. I wonder if, you know, that it just permeates no matter what. And I worry for my kids, you know, I worry, like, are they. Is that messaging just so strong that it's unavoidable?
- [23:26]
Alicia Keys
It's a tricky one because there's so many messages that we're getting that we're not knowing that we're receiving. Right. And that is so interesting. And it's. It's the conversations that I'll have with my kids about certain things like that sometimes it's really sticky and it's really tricky because you're trying to figure out how to explain it. But mostly I'm always talking about I, you know, I'll watch TV with them because I love to watch what they're watching because I just want to know, like, what are they getting? Like, what, what, why do they like it and what is it that they're getting and stuff like that. And a lot of the times I will find that there's a, you know, as we know now that we're older and aware and, you know, just can look at things with different perspective, that you can see these. These kind of stereotypes being perpetuated through our visuals, right, and our media and things like that. And, you know, so I will try to talk about it when I see it just because I feel like at least if they may get tipped to the fact that. That they are ingesting this, then maybe they can know, okay, I don't have to choose to look at it like that, or I don't have to. I can see it because I'm seeing it, but I'm seeing it eyes wide open. And I don't have to say that in order to be like a hero, I have to be a strong guy with muscles. You know, it's like, that's like, you know, it's some simple thing where we take away these messages or like this anime. I go crazy with the anime because I love anime too. But the way that they draw the women in anime, I want to choke myself. I'm like, guys, it's not realistic. Like, every woman is not shaped like that. And women's bodies are so beautiful. And I love every shape they come in. And I just want to see women in every shape. You know what I mean? And every version of us as women is beautiful, not just one shape. And so a lot of times I bring it up, I'm like, okay, but it's cool. And I love that. I love the show too. I'm like, vibing on the show. But it's like some of those things that start to. And now all of a sudden every guy is thinking that this is what a beautiful woman looks like. And it's because they're, you know, 10 years old watching an animal. You know what I mean? It's not so. It's so interesting. So are. Is it. Is the messaging so powerful that it kind of will overcome everyone? I think it's definitely going to permeate And I think it kind of creates things that we all have to figure out. Figure out how to work through. But I do think if you're talking about it and you're bringing it up and you're thinking about it and sharing just as a family, that it does help to at least, you know, create the conversation so people are not just blind, you know, blindly taking in whatever.
- [26:08]
Unknown
So, like, how. How would I do that? What's an example of something you might.
- [26:12]
Alicia Keys
Say, like, using the anime one as an example.
- [26:16]
Unknown
Yeah, my son is obsessed with anime, I would say.
- [26:21]
Alicia Keys
So. Do you notice that, like, every woman in anime has, like, extremely voluptuous breasts? Do you notice that? Because I was just watching and I just noticed. Are they always, like, bouncing? Do you notice this? And they'll be like, mom, like, ugh, okay. Kind of. They're bouncing. I'm like, and it's cool that they're bouncing because boobs are meant to bounce, and any size they are, it's beautiful. But you know that everybody is not like that, and that's okay, right? And of course, Mom, I know that. And it's fine. I'm like, okay, just checking. So. But then they'll be like, but look at this girl. See, she's like, really? You know, she kind of just has, like, on. On, you know, overalls, and she's, you know, she's kind of seems like, just. And I'm like, okay, I see a little diversity. Just know that the world is filled with many different people, and women are all kinds of shapes and all kinds of beautiful in all their ways. So they get it.
- [27:23]
Unknown
And even though might be an uncomfortable moment of conversation for them, I think that stuff really gets in there. I think when we point these things out, I think it stays with them and they're able to reevaluate, hopefully, what they're presented with and form their own ideas about beauty and themselves and everything. Totally, totally.
- [27:49]
Alicia Keys
And plus, when it's kind of fun and you can just be silly, like, everything doesn't have to be so serious either. It could kind of just be silly and funny, and I love doing that.
- [27:56]
Unknown
In a way, it sort of ties back to the thesis of your book in a way, right? Like having the strength of mind to speak your truth and to not censor yourself. And I think you get that way from observation. So, right.
- [28:12]
Alicia Keys
If we.
- [28:13]
Unknown
If we tell our kids early, it's okay to observe. It's okay to observ. Observe things about yourself, and then hopefully they'll grow up closer to those sets of truths. And then, you know, not have as difficult a time finding their truth. So I wanted to ask you about the book and how you came to, like, tell me about the impetus and how it. How it started and why you wanted to write it.
- [28:36]
Alicia Keys
Man, Writing More Myself was.
- [28:40]
Unknown
What a great title, by the way. Thanks.
- [28:43]
Alicia Keys
I love.
- [28:44]
Unknown
I love that title, More Myself. It's so. It's very inspiring.
- [28:48]
Alicia Keys
Thank you. Thank you. And I think it's just something we're becoming every day. You know, every day you're becoming a little bit more yourself and more myself. And it's definitely. It's a journey, and it's a process, and it takes a while. It really does. It takes time. And that's what I realized. The reason why we even talked about writing it was because I felt like I came to a place where I was really able to express the ways that I felt. Like I was overcome. And we all become overcome with these norms, these societal norms that are, like, forced upon us to our. We've been talking about this, and it's like, we don't even know that we're taking it in or ingesting it or realizing that we're subscribing to it or whatever the case is. And that's basically what happened to me as well, until I finally woke up one day and, you know, wanted to take my son to school, and I, you know, just wanted to put on my sweats and my hat and, you know, everything that every mom takes and puts brings their kids to school, because it's like, whatever. You're dropping them off. And I was, like, freaking out, and I was like, do I. You know, I don't have any makeup on, and I don't have. My hair is not fixed, and my clothes. I look kind of. And I found myself freaking out, and I was like, who the hell are you?
- [30:06]
Unknown
Wow.
- [30:06]
Alicia Keys
Who the hell are you? Like, what is the matter with you? What's going on? And I didn't even think of myself as that person. I thought of myself as extremely kind of open and feminist and strong and all the things. And I just started to realize more and more that in a lot of ways, I was choosing how I wanted to be based on how I thought others wanted to see me. And I think that that is. Or expected to see me or whatever. That's something that we all go through. Like, we're all trying to actually figure out who we are versus who our parents told us to be, who we think we have to be for our jobs, who we think are, you know, our Lovers are going to like us as who our best friends prefer us as. I mean, how many times will your best friend be like, you know, just the dress, Alicia. I just. And I finally been like, shut up. Quiet. I didn't ask you to tell me about my dress. I just. I like my dress. I picked my dress. I chose it. I like it. If I asked you, do you like my dress? Then you can offer your opinion to me. But I don't need everyone's opinion about everything. And I get it that most people just want to share their opinion because they think it's helping you, but sometimes you just need to have your own opinion, and people just need to kind of give you some space. And so all of that made me realize that there's just so much to learn and so much to grow from. And there was so much that I also needed to choose for myself. And so I started to go more on that journey of figuring out who, exactly how I could become more myself. And that's what the book is about. Some of those jewels about how I kind of found my way there. But every day is still, you know, still figuring out and still getting tested where I'm like, oh, go back to what I know I've already grown from. Or I could make a new choice. You know, it's constant. It really is constant.
- [32:10]
Unknown
Yeah. Till the day we die, I think.
- [32:14]
Alicia Keys
So.
- [32:20]
Unknown
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- [33:24]
What are some of the tools that you implement to continue to be more yourself? How do you do that? What's the practice?
- [33:33]
Alicia Keys
Well, I think definitely something that's been big for me is meditation. I started meditating when my second son was born. And it really. I mean, you know, I've been creating music and in this particular industry since I was 18 years old. So, you know, since quite a young mind, I have been trying to find my way through and make sure that I've been who I really am and all those things. And so meditation, I think, really taught me how to connect with my own thoughts, because how do you think your own thoughts? The media is over here telling you this, friends over here telling you that, you know, you've taken all these ideals and your parents leave you with all of this baggage, and everyone just, you know, they base. Everyone just basically dumps all their truths on, you know, if it's yours or not or theirs or fake or what's happening. Right. So the meditation definitely zooms me into my own thoughts.
- [34:34]
Unknown
What kind of meditation do you do?
- [34:36]
Alicia Keys
I actually do a meditation called Kundalini. It's a lot of mantra, and so it's kind of song, you know, words. And then it's also what they call kriyas, which is kind of like these different positions with your fingers that you'll kind of repeat while you say whatever you. So there's something about the movement and the words and maybe a little melody that I really like, and it just kind of gets in and you feel really good. So there's different versions of it, obviously, but that's what I like about it. But even just sitting quietly and breathing. That's why recently I did a meditation on a divine Feminine with Deepak Chopra. And just like. Even just that, like, thinking about these different thoughts and just quietly reflecting is so powerful, too. I think silence is very, very, very powerful. That's one tool. That's one tool. And then another tool that I've. That I would say is my best tool is. Is that gut check, you know, is. It's like, basically, I speak about it in the book, and it's. And it's something that Oprah shared with me, and she said that, you know what a resounding yes feels like. And I was like, oh, yeah, I do kind of know what a resounding yes feels. When it's like, emphatically yes and there's not a doubt in your mind, then it's yes. And when it's kind of like, then there's no and I really. And it's like, kind of that simple. And it's. It's difficult to feel brave enough to say no and to trust yourself enough to say no, because it's not resonating with You. That's the hard part. But you do know what. What a yes feels like you do, and that helps me a lot because sometimes I do need that. Just that simple. Check in.
- [36:25]
Unknown
Yes. It's funny, I feel like, in a way, quarantine really helped me with that practice because I'm a pleaser in general, and I always. I don't ever want to disappoint anybody, and I want to show up for everybody. And it was so amazing not, like, not to have to say no and just get to be with myself and my people. And so I think that hopefully fortified me a little bit more in terms of how I'll look at going back into the world and waiting for that resounding yes. But I still feel tripped up by it, you know, I still feel like obligation trumps a lot of that for me.
- [37:02]
Alicia Keys
And where do you think that comes from? Do you know? Can you reflect, like, even just in your upbringing or something? Was someone in your life very, very much like that, or can you kind of pinpoint where that comes from?
- [37:17]
Unknown
I think that there were. I was definitely raised with the idea of, like.
- [37:23]
Alicia Keys
Of being perfect.
- [37:24]
Unknown
Yeah.
- [37:25]
Alicia Keys
You know, being, you know, being helpful, being pleasing, being all of those things.
- [37:31]
Unknown
And, you know what's so funny about that, because it was a strong message I got, and I was so rebellious against it. But then when I got into my 20s, I fully accepted that kind of, like, perfectionism, you know, I want to do the right thing by everybody else and disappoint. What does Glennon Doyle say? Like, you have to disappoint everybody else in the world to avoid disappointing yourself. And I just didn't do that, you know?
- [37:59]
Alicia Keys
I know, and I think it's pretty classic for. Especially for women. I can only speak from a woman's perspective. Potentially this many, many men feel the same way. And I always. I'm always interested in asking them because I kind of want to know. You know, I'm raising sons, so I often think about, like, what, you know, how does. How does all this stuff land on young men and on boys? But I do think that, as a woman, I do think that's a classic way for us to feel, because women, we have been painted and encouraged to be very much in our servitude and very much as the ones that will. And we are providers, and we are completely nurturers, and we are naturally those things as well, so it's natural for us to do that. But I think also it's obviously imbalanced, and it kind of has always been Painted like, the woman's gonna serve and the woman's gonna cook, and the woman's gonna clean, and the woman's gonna, you know, make sure everyone's okay, and the woman's gonna do all the do's, and that's kind of what we see. And then the man's gonna be able to receive all of those things, and the children receive all the things. And so there's a little bit of. And it's kind of an unrealistic place we get ourselves into where we feel like, you know, we have to live up to that ideal. When I think there needs to be a little bit more sharing between everybody, you know, And I guess in some ways, if we don't create that expectation in our lives and in our families and things like that, then we will probably find ourselves being the one that's doing everything. So it's so interesting. Back to what you said about the pandemic and boundaries, I think that's what kind of came up the most, is like, what type of boundaries do we want to have for ourselves, for our families, for our work, for our special spaces, for everything? And it's kind of a great question.
- [39:59]
Unknown
Did you reassess, you know, how you want to. Did it. Was it illuminating for you in any way in terms of how. What you want to change going forward or.
- [40:07]
Alicia Keys
Yeah, I think it was illuminating for me. First, I'm like, wait, do I ever have to travel anywhere ever again? Never. Maybe I never have to travel anywhere ever again. Okay, so that's a little bit extreme, obviously. I'm actually looking forward to traveling. I'm looking forward to touring. We just announced my tour in 2022. I'm coming. Yes. It's going to be so good. So, of course I'm looking forward to. To these things. But I do think that it gave me an understanding that. And probably all of us an understanding that so much can be done without running at the speed of light. Like, we were all. So I definitely know that I was getting into a habit of moving and running just because I was used to moving and running. And so I think the stillness did get a chance to show me that, oh, you know, there's. There's still movement and stillness and there's still so much weight, so many ways that we're progressing and moving forward and doing things. And in fact, I think I've gotten more efficient and better. Better at it. But I did. I did assess that I do need to make sure that I'm creating space for myself for sure, because I'M also a lot like you are that probably many of us are that, like, really making. Carving out that time and that space for whatever it is, silence, whatever ritual it is for meditation, for playing piano, for creating, for dreaming, for sleeping. How about sleeping, guys?
- [41:47]
Unknown
Like, sleeping to big one.
- [41:49]
Alicia Keys
It showed me and reminded me that I really want that for myself, and I don't want to let go of that as things start to.
- [41:56]
Unknown
Right. It's almost like a reverence for your body, your mind, your spirit, and, like, protecting the sanctity of that. And it. And it's real. And as you say, like, we're not conditioned to do that as women. We're conditioned to just go and burn ourselves out. And this was a thing that I found so beautiful, too, when I was researching your. Your line of offerings.
- [42:22]
Alicia Keys
Thank you. Cheese.
- [42:26]
Unknown
He's soul care. That there's this kind of reverence for the body. And I read that you talked about, you know, the body is this vessel that we take for granted, and we don't really drop in and kind of take that time. And so how did. And of course, it's so perfect that you would create a business out of this because, like, you're such an embodied person. And so how did. How did it come about? Will you tell me about the business? It's so cool.
- [42:53]
Alicia Keys
Oh, thank you for asking. I love it so much. It is exactly about that, and it is called key soul care. And, you know, I knew that I wanted to create something specifically. I struggled a lot with my own personal challenges with skin. And, you know, I really had a difficult time with my skin ever since.
- [43:14]
Unknown
What you have, like, the perfect skin. Is it the. Is it the offerings?
- [43:19]
Alicia Keys
I mean, now it's definitely really, really good and craz really is. You know, these offerings do help to create that. But the prior to that, I just. I had so much trouble. And it was like years and years and years. I was 30, 31, 32. I was breaking out, breaking out. I'm like, what is going on? I thought, you're supposed to be 18 and 19, and this is done. It's like it was never ending. But that led me to realize that there was a lot of stresses. There was a lot of toxicity. There's a lot of energies in my life, a lot of relationships that were just causing me a lot of stress. And because I tend to internalize and because I always know how to kind of present well on the outside, but on the inside, I might be like, it shows. It always shows. And so I had a dream that I would be able to create something that would help me, hopefully help other people who feel like me. And so that was kind of a dream that I didn't really understand how it would manifest. And as we started to talk more about it and as I started to recognize that I was finding solution to find a way to better skin that did allow me to just not have to cover up as much and all these things, I realized that we talk a lot about. A lot about skin care and hair care and air care and nail care and hair care. And all the care is we don't talk about soul care. And when it resonated, it was like, oh, my gosh, this is crazy, because that's what I'm learning is why I'm able to feel better while I'm able to physically look better is because I've learned how to really take care of me better. And so this idea of creating rituals for ourselves and just in little ways, it doesn't have to take a thousand years and be a trillion dollars. It could literally just be, you know, this. These five minutes that we have before bed and I'm going to, you know, that's why I put the mantras on the bottles. You know, it'll say, I'm free as the air, or it'll say, I am layered, complex and divine. That's what the exfoliator says. And it's just these thoughts that you're able to put into your head as you' doing what you normally do that allow you to feel a little bit closer to yourself, a little pay attention to yourself, you know, be right here in this moment. And so, you know, now we are just now launching the body care part of soul care, which I love because I think we have such complex relationship with our bodies. You know, we feel all kinds of ways. So much judgment, you know, so much that we hold. And how beautiful is it to, you know, as we're washing, which is a daily routine, but take turn a daily routine into a ritual. So as you're washing or we have this beautiful offering called the sacred body oil, which I love putting on right after the shower with it, it says, everything I do is an act of creation and man. I mean, just these little things which are big things and being able to think about them as you're going through your daily routines, turning them into rituals and thinking about yourself.
- [46:43]
Unknown
It really.
- [46:44]
Alicia Keys
To your. To what we said earlier, I want to take away that stigma that when you think about yourself, somehow you're selfish and you should feel guilty. You should not, you should make sure that you're fulfilled so that you can go out in the world and continue to fulfill others. You know, you can't feel anybody if you're empty. So that's definitely the vibe of, of key soul care. And I love it.
- [47:08]
Unknown
And I love the idea of sort of having that inspiration, you know, that's tactile and something that you know, has, has a scent and, and a texture and that you can get inspired about yourself from that, you know, while you're also getting inspired from other external things or feelings or relationships or whatever.
- [47:28]
Alicia Keys
That's exactly it. I love it. You get me you.
- [47:38]
Unknown
At Designer Shoe Warehouse we believe that shoes are an important part of, well.
- [47:43]
Alicia Keys
Everything from first steps to first dates, from all nighters to all time personal.
- [47:49]
Unknown
Bests, from building pillow forts to building.
- [47:52]
Alicia Keys
A life for all the big and small moments that make up your whole world. DSW is the there and we've got just the shoes. Find a shoe for every you from brands you love at brag worthy prices at your DSW store or DSW.com do.
- [48:11]
Unknown
You listen to other people's music? Yes.
- [48:16]
Alicia Keys
A lot?
- [48:16]
Unknown
All the time.
- [48:17]
Alicia Keys
Yeah. I mean, especially with my husband. My husband is literally the party. Like he is the party. If he's in the house, there's a party. If no one's here, it's still a party. He's amazing like that. I love that about him. It's so funny because when he wakes up like the house just starts blaring and blasting with music. And me, I'm all like extra quiet.
- [48:36]
Unknown
You're meditating and he's having a rager downstairs.
- [48:42]
Alicia Keys
It's literally like that. But because of that we also share a lot of music. So we listen to a ton of, a ton of everything. We're listening to classic music, we're listening to classical music, we're listening to reggae, we're listening to, we're listening to, you know, African music. We're listening to a lot of samba and Spanish. Incredible music we're listening to. So many different styles of music are floating through the house and I love it so much. You know what?
- [49:12]
Unknown
There's an app that I just found out about recently that you would love and you should. Maybe you guys already know it, but it's called radio with five O's.
- [49:21]
Alicia Keys
You know what? Do you know this? I had it for a second and then I didn't listen to it anymore. But when I did listen to it, it was amazing.
- [49:29]
Unknown
It's so cool. You can like press on the map, you know Morocco. And choose your decade. 1940s. And you can hear it's such good dinner party.
- [49:38]
Alicia Keys
All right, I'm doing that. I'm gonna do. I'm go back to. Is it like a little bird or something?
- [49:43]
Unknown
I don't think it's a bird, but it's. It's pretty cool.
- [49:47]
Alicia Keys
Maybe they changed it. Might have used to been a bird, maybe rebranded and.
- [49:51]
Unknown
Have you ever seen those guys on YouTube, those two? I think they're brothers or teenagers, and they listen to music for the first time, and they record themselves so good.
- [49:59]
Alicia Keys
They listen to Fallen, and they had me cry. Good. It was amazing.
- [50:09]
Unknown
So if you could give yourself the immense pleasure of hearing some of your favorite songs for the first time now. What. What would a couple of them be?
- [50:23]
Alicia Keys
My favorite songs ever. It would definitely be no Ordinary Love Sade, for sure. And that was going crazy. If I heard it for the first time, it would definitely be Adore by Prince for sure. The first time. Even. I just even remember the first time I heard it now. And I. And when I listen to it, I still feel like that. I feel. Wow. So that's for sure. And I would also.
- [50:53]
Unknown
Let's see if there's a third one.
- [50:55]
Alicia Keys
Feeling good. Nina Simone.
- [50:59]
Unknown
Good one.
- [51:00]
Alicia Keys
Yeah.
- [51:00]
Unknown
That's a really good one.
- [51:02]
Alicia Keys
How about you? How about you?
- [51:04]
Unknown
Oh, God. I'll tell you the three Alicia Keys songs that I would like to hear right now for the first time ever. I like this definitely Three Hour Drive because it's my new favorite and I have it on repeat when I walk. And I'm really obsessed.
- [51:23]
Alicia Keys
Love.
- [51:24]
Unknown
I love Fallen because. And then my favorite, favorite, favorite Alicia Keys song, which is the quintessentially most profound breakup song of all time.
- [51:43]
Alicia Keys
Oh, my gosh. Tell me.
- [51:46]
Unknown
Try Sleeping with a Broken Heart.
- [51:48]
Alicia Keys
So good. I love that song. Oh, my God.
- [51:52]
Unknown
Best song. It's like one of my top five songs of my life, that song.
- [51:57]
Alicia Keys
Oh, my gosh. That's so. That's.
- [52:00]
Unknown
And you know what's so incredible about that song? One of the millions of things is that you. You sing it softly, and so there's like this surrender to the pain. And, like, you only sort of sing with your full voice, like, in the back, so there's this juxtaposition of, like, relenting to this pain and the softness and then, like. But in the back, there's, you know, this backbone. Oh, it's so good.
- [52:32]
Alicia Keys
Wow. Thank you. I love that song.
- [52:35]
Unknown
That's my favorite.
- [52:36]
Alicia Keys
That's definitely one of my favorites too. You. You okay? High Five.
- [52:41]
Unknown
I'm like, I never want to have another breakup again. Because the song.
- [52:48]
Alicia Keys
That's. That we got the one song and we got other ones.
- [52:54]
Unknown
I'm going to let you go in a second. But one thing that I really do want to know is because you guys have such a great relationship, you and Swiss. And I'm on my second marriage, which is such a blessing. Like, I can't even tell you how lucky I am to have found this man and get a second chance at it. And we love. We love Chris. Yes, of course.
- [53:23]
Alicia Keys
Of course. That's a beautiful thing.
- [53:25]
Unknown
You get bigger, right? The circle gets bigger.
- [53:29]
Alicia Keys
Yes.
- [53:30]
Unknown
But ideally, like, I would have liked to stay. You know, you want to be. It's like the thing of, like, oh, you're married to the father of your kids or the mother of your kids forever, and that's sort of the fairy tale. So how do you guys have a second marriage in your first marriage?
- [53:49]
Alicia Keys
That's what it looks. We have a second marriage in our first marriage. That's so amazing. You know, I love that so much. I think it brings us to what potentially is, like, kind of a theme of our conversation, which is, you know, we. There's all these stories that are told to us, you know, look, from the second we're born, and we have, like, this princess person here with the king and the queen and the mother and the father here and. Or this person here and the mother and the father and the doggie and the fence, and they have the sweet, wonderful life. And, you know, we're literally shown so many times from the very beginning that this. This is the family dynamic, and. And we then spend the rest of our lives chasing, you know, this story. It really is not the only way that families look. And I was raised by my mother. She was a single mother, actually. You know, she never really found another person who would compliment her in that way. And, and, and, and. And that's my whole world, whole universe. And I know for a fact that being raised by her made me really good, really good. And I. And I often think that if it went another way, I wonder what would. How would I have been or what I'd have had to overcome and things like that. So my point is, is that I think it's one of the things I love about us and our generation and where we are, is that we are really able to open this new idea about what family looks like, and also about evolution and moving forward and finding the way through to our happiness and our joy and the happiness and joys of our families. And to your point, it can keep getting bigger and more beautiful and more of a village of people that we can love together. And I think it's really powerful. It's really powerful. And it's really important to see that there's nothing to be ashamed of or feel badly about as you grow, as things evolve and as your family grows and evolves. And I think that that's. I love how we're just challenging the storybook and saying, here's the new story. All of us, you, me, so many families are saying, here's the new story, here's the new family, here's what the modern family looks like. And we're all flourishing and we're all doing great. You know what I mean? And it's really cool. So I'm so grateful for my relationship with my love Swizz. It's like, who, who knew? Who would have ever known? It's just like, what the hell? A lot of times we look at each other and we just celebrated our 10 year anniversary last year. We're going on like 11 this year. We're literally like, what? And what are you doing in my bed? Because I remember, like there was a time in my life where I could not stand him. I thought he was the most annoying. Like there was nothing in this planet that would feel like there was going to ever be a time where this beautiful life is what we would share together. And so let that be a lesson to all of us for judging books by the covers and for thinking we know what's supposed to happen to us. All we need to do is continue to walk forward in the best way we know how and give the best that we can and be good to ourselves in the process and make sure that the people we love, they have to treat us good too. And then just allow everything to unfold and man, you won't even know where it's going to take you. And I think that's what you're saying. And that's how I feel too.
- [57:49]
Unknown
That's so beautiful.
- [57:54]
Gwyneth Paltrow
Thanks for listening to my conversation with Alicia Keys. She always inspires me, but this time I especially enjoyed hearing about her approach to incorporating rituals and moments of stillness into our everyday routines. Thanks for tuning in. This has been a presentation of Kids Studios. I hope you'll listen, follow rate and review all of our episodes, which are available for free on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Odyssey, or wherever you get your podcasts.