Emma Grede (best of)

Summary

the goop podcast
Episode: Emma Grede (Best Of)
Host: Gwyneth Paltrow
Guest: Emma Grede
Date: March 3, 2026

Episode Overview

This "Best Of" episode of the goop podcast features entrepreneur and cultural changemaker Emma Grede—co-founder of Skims, Good American, and Offseason—discussing her journey as a visionary leader, mother, and force in redefining fashion and inclusivity. Gwyneth and Emma dive into building purpose-driven businesses, leadership, family, mentorship, and what it means to operationalize conviction, gratitude, and creativity.

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Key Discussion Points

Emma Grede’s Career and Companies

[03:33–06:25]

• Emma currently leads as CEO of Good American, co-founded Skims with Kim Kardashian (serving as Chief Product Officer), and launched Offseason, a luxury sports merch line motivating women's sports culture.
  • “I'm a merchant at heart. I have a pretty good idea for what women want and how they want to feel. And I'm obsessed with pleasing customers.” —Emma, [05:15]
• She highlights focusing deeply on a few things she excels at, emphasizing building great teams for support.

Founding Story of Skims & Good American

[06:25–12:50]

• Skims started with Kim Kardashian’s vision for inclusive shapewear; Emma brought the concept to life, leveraging her operational expertise and a merchant's intuition.
  • “My job is to go, you know what, I think that everyone's gonna die for that one legged thing or not. ... So what I do really well is take the bets.” —Emma, [11:10]
• Key to success: anticipating trends, understanding nuanced fit and sizing (19 sizes at launch), and operationalizing customer feedback.

Taking Risks & Operationalizing Innovation

[12:50–17:14]

• Emma is an instinctual risk-taker, often trusting her gut on novel products (like the Skims nipple bra or Always Fits denim).
• She discusses the innovation behind Always Fits jeans—minimizing waste while maximizing fit inclusivity with just four size ranges.
  • “When you innovate and you really think about like, what's going to change the game, you start to get into these, like, really interesting positions where again, you're in uncharted territory and you have to use all of that gut instinct to figure something out because it's not being done before.” —Emma, [16:32]

Cross-Pollinating Expertise, Leverage, and Separating Teams

[17:25–19:29]

• Grede’s businesses are structurally separate, but she brings her learnings (especially around leverage and client relationships) forward into each new role.

Growing Up: Family & Grit

[22:34–30:11]

• Raised in East London by a single mother, eldest of four girls, Emma credits her resilience and confidence to her mother’s insistence that she was “not better than anybody else, but nor is anyone better than you.”
  • Notable quote: “I just was raised with this idea of, like, I'm totally good. I don't need to change anything about myself.” —Emma, [25:00]
• Reflections on never wanting children at first, then realizing maternal desires after marriage.

Cultivating Gratitude & Keeping a Journal

[32:00–36:08]

• Emma shares her lifelong gratitude practice, rooted in daily journaling since age 17 as a way to reframe her perspective and maintain her mental wellness.
  • “Writing things down was a way of me, like, just therapizing.” —Emma, [33:00]
• Gwyneth relates, expressing regret about stopping journaling after a personal invasion of privacy.

Leadership Philosophy & Requiring In-Person Work

[36:32–44:48]

• Emma courts controversy with her insistence on office presence, believing that workplace relationships and culture are irreplaceable:
  • “The single best things that I met all of my best friends that I go on a girls trip with every single year. I met them at work. ... This idea that somehow work is only a drag, it's only a negative ... on what planet?” —Emma, [37:02]
• She expects trust, accountability, and clarity; those who thrive are given autonomy.
• Emma prefers hiring people for attitude over experience, seeking flexibility and curiosity above rigid expertise.

Company Culture & Operationalized Instinct

[43:29–45:49]

• Operationalizing excellence: processes are set for constant innovation, staying culturally relevant, and focusing on consumer obsession.
  • “You can operationalize excellence. Like being obsessed with something... how do you make sure that those [innovations] come in? They don't—they're not accidents.” —Emma, [45:02]

Offseason & Partnership with NFL

[45:49–49:33]

• Offseason, co-founded with Kristin Juszczyk, fills a gap for high-quality, fashionable, premium sports merch for women.
  • “The whole ... sports merch market, it's a bunch of horrible stuff ... there's nothing that feels remotely like, luxurious or premium. And so what we wanted to do was a premium experience.” —Emma, [46:12]
• The partnership with NFL leveraged personal connections and vision.

Leading Teams and Hiring

[50:31–55:42]

• Emma’s rules: articulate clear vision, avoid micromanaging, expect accountability, and be immediate (and kind) with feedback.
  • “The better the people are around me, the better I look.” —Emma, [54:00]
• She constantly meets potential talent, seeking “T-shaped” leaders with both depth and broad understanding.

Working with Her Husband

[56:17–58:32]

• She and her husband, Jens, separate personal/professional life; clear roles, mutual respect, and honesty ground their relationship.

15% Pledge for Racial Economic Equity

[58:35–63:06]

• Chairwoman Emma details the 15% Pledge (founded by Aurora James), a movement asking retailers to dedicate 15% of shelf space and spend to Black-owned businesses.
  • “We've created a $16 billion pipeline for black owned businesses. ... It's been amazing for these retailers that have got behind it.” —Emma, [60:35]
• The initiative’s positive impact on business and consumers, and its continued strength despite political and economic headwinds.

Emma’s New Podcast: Aspire

[63:06–66:12]

• Emma introduces her new podcast, “Aspire with Emma Grede,” aimed at scaling mentorship and transparency, especially around money, ambition, and practical wisdom for women.
  • “When you elegantly avoid the subject of money, the money has a way of elegantly avoiding you.” —Emma, [65:25]

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Notable Quotes (with Timestamps)

• “I now know that nobody changes until they change their energy. And when you change your energy, you change your life.” —Gwyneth, [01:18]
• “What I do is focus my energies around, what could that be? And so I feel like for the last eight years, the fixation has been on making people look and feel their best...” —Emma, [05:15]
• “You have to create the conditions for [innovation] to happen. ... It's part of our culture.” —Emma, [45:02]
• “I wake up every day and I have this beautiful pitch ceiling in my bedroom. And I'm like, this is insane… I do feel grateful all the time.” —Emma, [32:00]
• “I need people in the office. ... The best things...happened in those workplaces. ... This idea that somehow work is only a drag...on what planet people?” —Emma, [37:02]
• “I've really made it part of my mission to just get amazing people.” —Emma, [54:00]
• “We've created a $16 billion pipeline for black owned businesses... the pledge has been unbelievably successful.” —Emma, [60:35]
• “When you elegantly avoid the subject of money, the money has a way of elegantly avoiding you.” —Emma, [65:25]

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Rapid Fire Segment Highlights

[66:12–70:20]

• First thing you do when you wake up?
  Emma: “Say thank you for the ceiling.” [66:19]
• Always in your makeup bag?
  Emma: “Eyebrow pencil. Always.” [66:32]
• Favorite place to unwind?
  Emma: “In the front of my house on the beach in Malibu.” [66:40]
• Go-to meals: Anna Jack Thai in LA, Scott’s in London, Café Flore in Paris for the nostalgia. [66:52–67:27]
• Best campaign: Working with Gwyneth for Hugo Boss. [67:48]
• Which Shark to partner with?
  Emma: “Mark Cuban all day long.” [68:29]
• Biggest founder turn-on: “I want someone who is nuts about what they do...” [69:01]
• Being a mother: “I don't think I understood how maternal I am ... I'm extremely maternal as a person.” [70:00]

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Memorable Moments

• The laugh about one-legged shapewear and the process of trend-forecasting at Skims. [08:43]
• Emma’s pragmatic, refreshingly honest stance on in-person work, and discussion on modern work culture. [36:57]
• Stories about Emma’s gratitude practice and keeping a journal; Gwyneth’s diary-reader trauma. [34:00]
• Annecdotes about meeting her husband, working together, and navigating boundaries. [56:17]
• Emma’s “no shame” about money talk and aspirational transparency in her upcoming podcast. [65:25]

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Useful Timestamps

• [03:45] — Emma summarizes current roles and companies
• [06:25] — Skims origin story
• [12:50] — On risk, instinct, and innovating in business
• [22:42] — Childhood, upbringing, and grit
• [32:00] — Gratitude and daily journaling
• [36:32] — Leadership philosophy and office culture
• [45:49] — Offseason and NFL partnership
• [50:31] — Hiring, leading teams, and giving feedback
• [58:35] — The 15% Pledge
• [63:06] — Introducing her new podcast
• [66:12] — Rapid fire Q&A

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The Episode’s Tone and Vibe

Grounded, humorous, incisive, open, and warm—this candid conversation is packed with real talk and wisdom for founders, leaders, and anyone interested in purpose-driven work, innovation, and living with intention. Emma is both practical and inspiring, making legendary success accessible through grit, gratitude, clear vision, and a willingness to do things differently.

Transcript

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

You know what I find myself doing more and more? Just sitting with things, not rushing to a conclusion. When I'm researching longevity protocols or trying to understand conflicting studies on hormone therapy, I need something that can go as deep as I want to go. That's why I've been using Clawd. Try Clawd for free at Clawd AI Goop and see why the world's best problem solvers choose Claude and as their thinking partner.

[Emma Grede]

It's time to rethink your screen time. The light your phone emits actually matters. The red light converter from bodyguards transforms blue light into red light, which is gentler on your eyes, more skin friendly and supportive of better sleep. Same phone, smarter light Shop the red light Converter now on goop.com when you are pioneering anything or introducing new ideas

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

to the culture, you get criticized. You do? Yeah. Did you hear about that?

[Emma Grede]

I didn't find the one.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I found someone I respected and we

[Emma Grede]

made it the one. In the sort of longing kind of view of love, people understand each other as if by magic. Nothing in itself is addictive on the one hand. On the other hand, everything could be addictive if there's an emptiness in that person that needs to be filled.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I now know that nobody changes until they change their energy. And when you change your energy, you change your life.

[Emma Grede]

Gwyneth.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I'm Gwyneth Paltrow. This is the Goop Podcast, bringing together thought leaders, culture changers, creatives, founders and CEOs, scientists, doctors, healers and seekers here to start conversations. Because simply asking questions and listening has the power to change the way we see the world. Here we go. This week, we're sharing a gem from the Goop Podcast archives. This week on the Goop Podcast, I'm sitting down with my girl crush, the insanely brilliant, very beautiful and endlessly inspiring Emma Greed. She is a mom of four, she's a powerhouse investor, and she is the force behind some of the most iconic brands shaping culture today. Skims, good, American and off season, just to name a few. Emma has helped build and scale companies that have redefined fashion inclusivity and what it means to lead with purpose. We talk about where she learned to lead with conviction and compassion, how she cultivates gratitude daily and her honest thoughts. On balance, she makes building empires look effortless. But it's her clarity, humor and heart that reveal what it really takes. I'm so happy to have you.

[Emma Grede]

I'm so happy to be here.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Podcast. Thank you so much. You know, you're like my girl crush, girl boss.

[Emma Grede]

Get out of it, you know, you are. There's a lot coming from you. You know you are. You have said it and I would. I'm happy you say it here live, because people don't believe it.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

It's really true. I really am in awe of you and what you've been able to build. And it's such an amazing for me, like inspirational model of a woman, a mother, a businesswoman. So I'm just thrilled that you're here and I get to ask you all about it.

[Emma Grede]

I love that. It's just, I mean, that's just so high. High praise indeed.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

So I'd love to start with kind of what you do to sort of set the scene. Like currently, what companies are you either running or chief creative thing. Give us the lay of the land.

[Emma Grede]

I know, it's really funny. I get asked that so much and I always feel, you know, people think I so many different things and I feel like I do like three things over and over and over again, which is quite interesting. But by way of background, so I am the founder of Good American, which is where I still play the role as the CEO eight years in which I love one of my favorite roles. I am the co founder alongside my husband Jens Greed and Kim Kardashian of Skims. But there I play the role of the chief product officer which is honestly like, if you could say, like, Emma, what's your dream role? Like, what are you the best at? What do you really love doing? That's it. Like chief product officer across the, you know, design and planning and merchandising, production. Like that's my comfort zone. That's where I excel and I love. I have a couple of other businesses that I have co founded, one called

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Offseason which is like all the rage.

[Emma Grede]

I'm so excited about that company because I'm so excited about women's sports. And I always feel like you can't, you can't make things successful. But you know, like when what's happening in the culture kind of collides with what you're doing, you know, you're really onto something. So I feel like, you know, the stars aligned and the timing was beautiful around that business. It's a luxury sports merch company that I did in partnership with this incredible woman, Kristine Juszczyk, and the NFL. So super excited about that. Then I'm an investor, of course. I have a pretty big investment portfolio which is fun.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

And a shark tanker.

[Emma Grede]

I'm a shark tanker. Three seasons in shark tanking over here and Dragons Denion, which is the British version of it. And I'm a mom, you know, I have four kids, so that is about as much time as any one person has. But I do think it's important because in my life, you know, I have obsessions. Like, I'm a person that gets, like, really into things, and I think what I do is the same thing over and over again. I'm a merchant at heart. I have a pretty good idea for what women want and how they want to feel. And I'm obsessed with pleasing customers. And so what I do is focus my energies around, what could that be? And so I feel like for the last eight years, the fixation has been on making people look and feel their best and doing that in a way that is, like, surprising and can just delight people. You a problem, I'm going to fix that problem. And then getting shit to people quickly, like, it's not that deep, you know, it's not that difficult. And so I feel like there is this idea of, like, oh, my God, she's doing everything. No, I do a couple of things really, really well. And then, you know, I hire amazing people to work around me and do all the shit I'm not so good at.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Wow. So will you tell me a little about the founding story of Skims? Because it's such an incredible company and so successful and so massive and so global, and I was so inspired and psyched for you guys when I saw the Nike thing. But of course, like any company, it started with an idea and a first set of products. So will you tell me a little bit about, like, the origin story of that company?

[Emma Grede]

Absolutely. Well, I think the first thing to say is it's. I always feel like a little bit of a cheat when I tell the origin story, because it was Kim's idea. You know, that's. I've been in business with the family for a few years at that point when we launched Skims. I have a company with Good American. Yeah, I started with Good American, and Chloe and I have a cleaning company with Chris. We make. Those are great, sustainable B corp. Lovely.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

You didn't even mention that business.

[Emma Grede]

I didn't. You know, there's too many. There's too many things to mention. But, you know, I have a great relationship there and one that's based on trust and a mutual understanding of what each brings to the table. And so Kim, who had wanted to start this company for a very long time that was originally really orientated around shapewear and underwear, we decided to partner on that And I feel really lucky because what I do is help bring a vision to life, and I'm pretty good at that. And I think that Kim is the best at the best kind of treble, aliased creative director. I mean, she does many things well, but what she's very clear is this is her vision, this is what she wanted to do. And so all I had to do was make the stuff, you know, and I've figured out a way to organize myself, to bring in the best possible people and to create products that people will really love. And so when you're working with someone who's so clear about what it is that they're trying to create, the job of a chief product officer becomes really simple. Then it's about making sure the range is, you know, a range that's going to work for a lot of women. That's the merchandising piece. Then you've got to plan it. That's the piece that's really saying, okay, how much of this are we going to buy? It turns out quite a lot. And then, you know, you've got this innovation piece. Because what Kim does, you know, she's a challenging creative director. She comes to the party and she's like, I want to make one legged shapewear. And you're like, okay, well, there's no benchmark for that. I can't go, let's see what everybody else does in the one legged shapewear department. That's not possible.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Because if one leg is coming out of.

[Emma Grede]

Yeah, if you've got like a little slit in your gown or whatever it is. But, you know, that's what Kim's all about. She is creating solutions for herself. And therefore, you know, who else might need that?

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Right?

[Emma Grede]

And so my job is really to make sure that we can make that. We can make it really well. We can make it fit. We can make it fit an enormous, you know, group of women. And that we can price it correctly and get it out in the market and deliver it on time.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

It's incredible. I mean, it's really like when you think about, you know, starting with one piece of shapewear, and I'm sure you guys were testing out fabrics and shapes and, and sewing things, and now to think about, like the juggernaut that it is now, I mean, what that, like to be a founder and have such quick, massive success because some business are like a more slow growing thing. Right. And then that business is just like stunning how big it is.

[Emma Grede]

You're right. And I think the, the precursor with Good American was really important because when you make product in such a large size intensive way, you really need to understand how it works at all ends of the side spectrum. So for me, when I'm going out and looking for people to work in the. It's not like any other clothing business where you're trying to, you know, service eight or nine sizes. We make 19 sizes in our range. And so you really need to have people that have done that, that have lived in both plus size land and what we call missy in fashion and can understand the technical specifications of doing all of that really, really well. Right.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Because I imagine it's not just sizing up, right?

[Emma Grede]

No, no, there's totally different patterns and often in our garments we have two or three different patterns for like one single garment. So the complexity get. The cost gets ever higher. So you've really gotta understand what you're solving for. And I know that it seems like everything happened very quickly and overnight, but there's a lot of planning that goes into these businesses. And part of my job as a merchant and as a planner and doing the role of chief product officer is to be a bit of a gambler. Like my job is to go, you know what, I think that everyone's gonna die for that one legged thing or not. Right. I feel like this is just here as a flash in the pan and it's gonna, you know, create scarcity and it's gonna be a moment in press, but it's. And so what I do really well is take the bets. You know, it's like my, I have to go, like, where do we think this actually lands? And what is the, what is the life cycle of this product? And how do we, how do we keep this thing in stock? Which you could say I've done to varying degrees of success, quite honestly, because it was crazy in the beginning. But, but that's my job really to, to have a sense of how trends are happening and how you connect trends. And it's interesting because I sit across so many businesses, you start to. All of these become a muscle, right? So in good American, let's take denim for example. Denim Trends last for 10 years. But as you see, you know, it's like as people are wearing skinny and then graduating into straight and then the, you know, the, the fits become more baggy. My job is to connect that and say, well, if the fit is becoming more baggy and that's where the trend is at, what's going to happen on the top? Well, the top's going to end up as a baby. Tee. And so should I be selling hundreds of thousands of units of baby tees over here? And so really my, my role is to connect what's happening in trend and to make those hopefully ahead or right on time with the curve.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

And how far ahead are you sort of trend forecasting?

[Emma Grede]

Oh my goodness. I mean, too far ahead if you ask me. Yeah, because, you know, the typical calendar is around a year, depending on the fabrication and the classification of like the category that you're working in. But it's, it's pretty far out, so

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

you've got to be even begin to understand like what a trend will be a year out.

[Emma Grede]

Well, you ought to make the trends, you know, and I feel like that's what we've done really well. Like we create, you know, there was no market for certain products. Like, how are you going to predict a nipple bra? Like, you can't, you know, it didn't, it wasn't there before. And so you got to create the trends and be ahead of it.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

You know what I find myself doing more and more, just sitting with things, not rushing to a conclusion. When I'm researching longevity protocols or trying to understand conflicting studies on hormone therapy, I need something that can go as deep as I want to go. That's why I've been using Claude. Claude doesn't just hand me a tidy answer and move on. It works through the complexity with me. If I'm reading a 200 page research paper, Claude can analyze the whole thing and help me understand what the data actually says, not what someone wants it to say. And I trust what I'm getting. Clawd is built to be balanced, not to feed you whatever keeps you engaged. No algorithmic agenda, just thinking. Try Clawd for free at Claude AI Goop and see why the world's best problem solvers choose Claude as their thinking partner. So talk to me about your appetite for inventory risk.

[Emma Grede]

When you're like taking my appetite or my board's appetite, mine's a little bit different. I think I'm a natural born risk taker. That's part of my personality and that's what makes me good, because I'm not so careful. And also I just try not to. You know, I have this thing that I'm really good at, listening to myself. And so while I can take stock of what's happening around me, I'm pretty good at growing, going away from the noise and going like, what do I think about this? Because there's so much opinion out there. Right. Like, and I'm pretty good at also Calling people up and getting opinion. But the first thing I do is I go, what do I think? What is my instinct? What is my gut telling me? And what do I believe to be true? And then I make decisions based on that. So that's, like, always my starting point. And I think that I'm pretty good at feeling things out without too much, you know, distraction.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

So, like, so take something risky. Now we're on the. We're on the nipple bra as our example. So that's a totally novel idea, right? Like, a lot of people want to cover their nipple through their shirt. And so now the idea. So, no, let's free the nipple. Let's make a nipple bra. So how do you know? Or how do you get comfortable? I don't know what the depth. Like, I can't even imagine for skims like that.

[Emma Grede]

It was deep.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Was it?

[Emma Grede]

It was deep.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

How many units did you buy of the nipple bra?

[Emma Grede]

I couldn't possibly tell you my trait secret set. No, but, you know, we're talking, like, we're making. We're making a lot. We're making, like, serious, like, thousands and thousands, tens of thousands, and sometimes hundreds of thousands. You know, when you put again, you know, nine different shades and things together. So we're making an enormous amount of units. But really, it's about, for us really understanding where, like, where is the appetite for something like that and how are you creating appetite for it, you know, because at the end of the day, again, it's about linking purchases. So if you're making a nipple bra, what am I really trying to sell here? I'm trying to sell baby teeth. I'm trying to make you bra and a baby tee and put the thing together and have the look. So, you know, again, it's always about these connections of what you're doing and then creating the appetite for it. And so I think that, you know, over and over again, if I think about Good American. When we started the Always Fits jeans, this was actually an initiative that was done around B Corp, right? We. We buy a lot of fabrics by virtue of making lots of pairs of jeans. There'll also be an element of waste. And if you make 19 sizes, how do you limit the waste? And so we were like, how do we make less sizes but still cover the full spectrum of the size range? And so Always Fits is like this fabric with 100% stretchability. And instead of making the 19 sizes, we make it in four sizes that fits everyone. So the same jean that fits you, that fits me, can fit your friend who's a size 10 and can fit your friend who's a size 8, for example. And you know, it's just one of these things where when you innovate and you really think about like, what's going to, what's going to change the game, you start to get into these, like, really interesting positions where again, you're in uncharted territory and you have to use all of that gut instinct to figure something out because it's not being done before. So all of the experience around me, you could have worked at wherever for 25 years, but you can't tell me how that thing's gonna perform. So then it becomes about something else. Like, what is the need, how do I feel about this and what is my instinct telling me?

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

It's really brave in a way, you know, to rethink, like how things have been done, rethink the fabrics. I mean, even just like limiting the size run to like a one size fits all, but across four sizes.

[Emma Grede]

Yes.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

So I thought it was interesting when you were talking, talking about the kind of tenure at Good American, sort of paving the way for how you approached the merchandise at Skims, right? Because it sounded like there were a lot of lessons there in terms of fit and fabrics. And I mean, it seems like a secret weapon that you are able to carry the knowledge from one of these businesses, like, and cross pollinate them across. But are they quite segregated in terms of operating teams and ideas and data? Like, are you sharing them across good amounts American and safely and.

[Emma Grede]

No, no, no. Our businesses are all completely separate and completely standalone. So different teams, different offices, different investor base. I guess the common denominator becomes like, sometimes Jens and myself, like, because we're in the businesses, but we play very, very different roles and we purposefully keep the companies very separate because they all do very different things. But when I think about what it is that I do, like, my entire life, my entire career has always been about leverage. You know, it's like I started my career in a place where, you know, I didn't have any particular skill. I was just someone who loved fashion and would come with like such enthusiasm that people would be like, well, she's a, you know, she's a girl with a lot of energy. She'll do anything to like be in the room. And that's. That was the truth. But I parlayed that into that enthusiasm and that kind of like love and passion for fashion into people noticing me, into clients then saying, yeah, you can come and work on this job. And when I First started the agency, those clients remembered me and so they would take my call and then those calls turn into business and those, you know, businesses turned into clients. And when I decided to start Good American, you know, I didn't know any VCs, I didn't know anyone with any money or an investor. I went to clients, you know, I was like, hey, don't you invest in businesses? You want to invest in my next thing. So I feel like I've just been the queen of leveraging wherever I am into the next thing. And so that's a constant theme in my life that I just like take whatever I've got and I springboard it to the next thing.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Amazing. And when you thought of the idea for Good American, did you take that to your partner or was it a co founded thing or how did that start?

[Emma Grede]

No, I had the idea and it really came from this. You know, I spent the first 10 years of my career like at the intersection of fashion and entertainment. So I would get really famous people like you and perhaps call them up and be like, hey, do you want to be in like a fragrance campaign for this brand? And more often than not they'd say, yeah. And so, you know, that was really where my business was. It was in this like brand partnership land. And I would put, you know, speak to agents and managers and publicists, they would give me their talent and I'd represent the brand and I'd do a deal. And I'm just, you know, like a contract negotiator, broker for want of a better word. And you know, I did that for a very, very long time. And honestly I got, I got bored and I got disheartened and I was like, what am I doing? I'm creating all of this value for people constantly. And all I would see is like my consultancy check and then they would take all the credit and you'd like onto the next one. So it was just kind of this like soul destroying job. And, and I think it kind of came to this time when talent had started doing equity partnerships with brands. And so I was, you know, as I was the go to girl, like you need a Hollywood star to be in this fragrance campaign. I need a Hollywood star to be the front of my startup. So I started doing those things. I was like, wow, we're going to give like Ashton Kutcher 10% of this fucking thing. And I get like, you know, 25 cents. I was like so mad about it. And I was like, I know what, I'll, I'll start one of these things myself. And it was that naive, so smart. But then I was like, okay, so, you know, you've got to take the things that, you know, I understand intrinsically how to market something. I understand, you know, the power of celebrity talent to accelerate an idea. But I knew that product was king. You have to make an amazing product. And at that time, Jens and Eric had started frame and that brand just went like. And I remember when they came to us, they, you know, at the time, Jens and Eric like pitched Natalie and I on some holidays. And Natalie at that point, you know, was like Mrs. Net a porter, you know, she was like the coolest, most amazing fashion thing. So if you picture a fashion idea and they were like, we're gonna start this company and we're gonna sell blue jeans. And we were like, great idea, guys. Let us know how that one goes. And of course, it was amazing. But in my head, I'd seen this company, this like, very simple idea that just like blew up. And it was about really great, really simple fitting jeans. And I was like, I'm gonna do really great, really simple, best fitting jeans, but for all women in all sizes. And so the idea was kind of there and it was formed off the basis of this success that they'd had. And I was like, I'm just gonna do it based off the knowledge that I have being on hundreds of campaigns where, you know, companies would put forward this idea of like, diversity. And yet, you know, I knew that these girls couldn't even do their jeans up. You know, they'd be cut down the back. So I was like, I'm just gonna make jeans that fit everyone. And the more people they fit, the more you're gonna sell, the more money you're gonna make. And I would like to say there was like some big insight, but it wasn't. It was like this. This is what I understand, this is what I think I can potentially do.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

That's amazing. Can you talk to me a little bit about going back just a little bit further? So you were raised in London, single mom.

[Emma Grede]

Single mom, eldest of four girls. Right?

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

And that's so nice. You repeated the four.

[Emma Grede]

I did repeat the four. Although I have to say, you know, I sent on the family group chat

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

because when you were talking about springboarding from one thing to the next, it's like you really have this incredible it factor. Like, you are so magnetic, you're so brilliant, you're so articulate. And I think having that it factor, of course, is like key when you're. Especially when you're in a relationship business, and you're an agency work and a connector and all of those things. But there's also this incredible grit and perseverance and. Because, I mean, I can't imagine it's been easy at every turn, like, running all these businesses and starting all these businesses, right? And you just, like, get up and you do it, and you have really strong leadership values, which I also want to get into in a minute. But what happened at home? Like, how. How were you raised in order to be this person? And are your sisters as industrious as you are as well?

[Emma Grede]

They're industrious. You know, it's so interesting because. Because when you're a mom and you know this, you reflect so much on your upbringing. The good, the bad, and the ugly. And I had a wonderful family. You know, I come from a proper East London family where the family was everything. And when, you know, my mom had three kids under the age of five by the time she was 28. So that's a. I could never do that. That's the first thing to say. It was a pressure cooker. My dad left when we were all really young, and my mom was in a situation where she was. You know, I feel like we were all kind of forged in fire right there was. It was tough. We didn't have any money. She just had to leave and go and work. And I always laugh, like, our family dynamic is like, she's the dad, I'm the mom, and we had three kids together. And so you're the first. I'm the first. I'm the eldest, and I love my sisters. They are amazing. Like, we talk every single day, but it was definitely difficult. And I think my mom had a lot of pressure on her, and she did what was. You know, how she did what she could. And I think we were coming up in a time where it wasn't, like, about working on yourself and figuring out your demons. It was like, just get through the day, right? Get through the day, Feed these kids, keep the lights on. And she did what she knew how to do, which was to just graft. What she did was gave all of us, like, a real sense of self. She really taught me that. You know, I do say this all the time because it's one of the most fundamental parts of my upbringing. She was like, em, you are not better than anybody else, but nor is anyone better than you. And so when I got into, you know, what it was that I wanted to do when I started going out in the world and figuring that Out. I really believed that I was like, nobody's better than me. My mom told me that that must be absolutely true. And so it gave me this foundation to think that I could do anything. She was like, so long as you work really hard and you put everything in and you're yourself. And that was the thing that was always playing to me, like, don't change. I'm good enough. And so I just was raised with this ide of, like, I'm totally good. I don't need to change anything about myself. I am a smart girl, and I've got lots of skills, and I'm just gonna work my ass off. And so that was what was. That was what was in me.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

And did your dad play a role or did he really leave?

[Emma Grede]

No, not at all. He was out. I didn't meet my dad until much later in my life, and he is a part of my life now, but he wasn't a part of my childhood. And, you know, there's so many things. I honestly don't think I had daddy issues. You know, I'm so lucky. I've never had a bad boyfriend. I have such a. I just. That wasn't the same for all of my sisters. They'll tell you that another time. But I had very, like. I think I had a very high idea of myself, and I've got a good radar. So I just was really lucky. I found, like, a lot of different boyfriends, but one after the other after the other was really good. Always, like, just really nice men around me. And I married incredibly well. I've just made those good decisions, you know?

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

So you don't think that it caused you. I'm sure it caused some kind of trauma, but probably not.

[Emma Grede]

Yeah, I had other trauma. You know, I. I don't think that the father thing was so traumatic for me. I think that being the eldest and being a carer for kids when you are very young does a lot of things to a people, right to a person. And, you know, I know that I have, you know, that. That inner child part of me that's hard to access. You know, I'm not a good player. I'm not good at being like, you know, it's just. That's just not me. I've always been a serious girl. That's just who I am. I very difficult to be playful and silly, and that side of me is difficult to access because that's not what I know.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I think when you say that, it feels like, you know, that requires, like, a vulnerability. And I think if you're doing and you're protecting your sisters and you're in doing mode and you have to have control of the house because you're sort of in charge of everybody. It must be hard to let go of that control 100%.

[Emma Grede]

And I am, you know, someone who has wanted very purposefully to feel and put forward the idea that I was in control because I never wanted to let my mum down. Like, we were not going to be those people in East London that looked like what was going on, was going on. My mum was like, you better. You better brush your hair. You better pull your shit together and be, you know, like, be those people. And so I, Yeah, it just was never an option for me. It was never an option to fall apart. It was just like, pull it together. There's a lot of people that have got it much worse than you and figure it out.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Right. And yet there is that part. I certainly have this where. Because I can relate to a lot of what you're saying. Like, there is that soft part that does sometimes need to come out right, and to, like, be. Be tended to as well. And that's what I think is so interesting about, like, being a firstborn daughter, you know, like, parlaying it into life's work. And. And I have so many of the same strains running through. I have a couple of friends who were in that position of sort of having to raise their siblings and it made them, I would say, like, have some trepidation around having their own kids and, like, kind of going back to. Did you have that at all or.

[Emma Grede]

Definitely, I never wanted kids. Like, if you'd have asked me when I was 20, up until the point I met Jens. And honestly, even when I met him, like, I remember when he proposed to me, I was so excited. Until he started talking to me about marriage. I was like, well, I really just wanted to get engaged. I don't know about this whole marriage palava, you know, And I, I, at the time, his brother was getting married the year later, and I was like, thank God I can. Like, I was like, let's not, you know, like, rain on their parade. Let's do it the year after. And so I managed to, like, push this wedding off. And it wasn't about the wedding. It was like, what comes. Oh, am I gonna have to have kids and start a family and do that whole thing, like, I'm so not there. And then, like, honestly, it was. I don't know what happened to me. I got married and I was like, oh, I need a baby. Like, immediately I was like, let's just, like, get off of birth control and go for this. Let's start life and buy a house. And I don't know what happened to me because I'd never envisaged that very traditional setup in my life. I didn't want that to happen to me. And all of a sudden, it just came out of nowhere. So it was just, I don't know, waiting for the right guy.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I think, too, something happens in marriage where I feel like. Like you're creating, like, a special. This. This entity between the couple. And it's like you kind of bear fruit to this bubble that encapsulates you, and then, you know. So to me, it makes total sense that, like, so true, a baby would come next. So how old were you when you had your first one?

[Emma Grede]

31.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I was 31 when I had Alex.

[Emma Grede]

You were. It was a great time because I felt like. And this is not unimportant for my career. I. You know, I've always worked. I was. I dropped out of. So I, you know, I was like, an early starter in high school. I dropped out of high school. So I was, you know, I went to. In England, we call it college, but it was like, I dropped out of the London College Fashion. I was, like, 16 going on 17, and, you know, I just needed money. I'd left home, and I couldn't make ends meet. I couldn't get the train fares together. And so I decided, like, that wasn't for me and that I'd go straight into work experience. And I'd done a work experience where I learned a lot. And I was like, I'm just gonna stay on that train. So I would work four days a week in a store, and then the other three days a week, I would do my work. And for me, that was such an important part of my. Of my life because I just. I was learning so much in that time, and I was building. I think that those years were just really key to me to build up what it was that I needed to do and get away from where I was from.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Right. I mean, I imagine it must be so gratifying to. I don't know, like, it's like the American dream. You moved here. You know, you've had all this incredible success. And, like, are there ever moments where you think back to, like, this young girl in East London and think, like, your house then compared to now?

[Emma Grede]

Every day. Are you just, like, every day? You know, it's so funny. There's this brilliant skit, like, I'M obsessed with comedy. And Chris Rock used to say, you know, like, he keeps a bag packed in his own house, like. Cause he's expecting someone to knock on the door and be like. Like, get outta here. This is not your life. And that's how I feel. You know, it's like, I wake up every day and I have this beautiful pitch ceiling in my bedroom. And I'm like, this is insane. Like, whose ceiling is this? Like, imagine that's your ceiling in your bedroom. You know, I know. I genuinely feel like that because I am a person who, you know, I stop to smell the roses. Like, quite literally, I'll walk past a flower and I'll be like, imagine that flower is there and it smells so good and looks so beautiful. And I do feel grateful all the time. It doesn't. I don't feel far away from that little girl in plaster. It's still, like, very close.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

And do you cultivate that gratitude or is it just innate?

[Emma Grede]

No, I cultivate it. You know, I'm like the Oprah generation. When I used to come home, Oprah was on the TV and she was going on about the gratitude journal. I was like, what do I have to be grateful for? You've seen this house that I live in. It's awful. But I learned from a young age, and it just became a practice. And I really, you know, before I understood the connections between, you know, how that literally changes your neural pathways, I knew that writing a diary and writing things down was a way of me, like, just therapizing. Right? It was just this way of me being able not to be like everything else that was around me, which was angry and bitter and blaming. And I understood that the more I could get down on paper, the more I could get out of myself, the better I would be. And I feel like that just became a practice for me. From about the end age of 17, I started. I don't know that I haven't kept a diary since I was 17. You still. You still do it? Still do now. I still carry my journal every single day, and I'll write anything that I can in it. And I. And I really. I really love it. Like, it's very helpful to me.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I mean, it's brilliant because I don't. I think it like moves stuff out of yourself and like, onto a page. And I used to. And then someone read my diary and then I. I just stopped and I never did it again.

[Emma Grede]

Someone read your diary close to you or just like a.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Close to me? Yeah. Oh, why, shitbag I know.

[Emma Grede]

Yeah. That's not nice. I mean, if anyone reads my diary, don't tell me.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I know.

[Emma Grede]

Like, just don't.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I know. And then I was like, oh, man, what if I pick it back up? And then like, you know, the tabloids, like, I kept picturing.

[Emma Grede]

Yeah, that's what I would be worried about. Like, someone scrummaging through your, like, trash. Do you know what I mean? I'm never gonna write a diary. It is actually so revealing. I recently, like, after the fires in la, I digitized all of my photos and I found a bunch of old diaries and like, the stuff that I would write. I'm like, no one can ever see this. This can never go anywhere. It's unbelievable.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Yeah. I mean, that's kind of the beautiful thing though, is because you can go back in time and see kind of where you were and how you thought about the world. And it's crazy. I still have a couple, but I stopped doing it ages ago. I don't. Maybe I'll pick it up.

[Emma Grede]

Maybe you'll pick it back up. I know, but I feel like it's good, though. I agree.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I think I should. But every time I do, I get really self conscious.

[Emma Grede]

It's weird.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

You do?

[Emma Grede]

Yeah, it is something that makes you self conscious. But I feel like, for me, in the best way, because if I feel like I've got three days where I'm writing about the same thing, I'm like, Emmy, you need to move off of that. You know? I love Diane von Furstenberg. She's a dear friend of mine. And she says, you know, Emma, the most important relationship you'll ever have is the relationship you have with yourself. And it's right. She's so right. And that for me is the most honest relationship. Because I can talk myself out of anything in my head. I'm like, I'm a Libra. So I'll be like. And I feel like that is the. It's the record. It's there, it's in black and white. And I'm like, am I still thinking about this? Three days. Don't come back to this book and write in there tomorrow. Deal with it. So it's like this little record that pushes me over the edge.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

That's interesting. So whenever you open it, do you sort of go back over?

[Emma Grede]

I don't really. And that was what was so hard, reading these, like, I mean, they were like 17 and 19 year old diaries of mine with the big bubble writing. I was like, dinner, right? Like that wrong with me. But you know, I don't, but I just. I know if it's. It's almost like. I know it's there. Like there's something that's like. It's speaking to me and saying, you're still procrastinating on that thing. Like, move on. Go. Yeah, move on.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

No, that's. I think that's fair enough. I think that's. That is kind of like being a best friend to yourself in a way. Right? Like coaching yourself. Yeah, Pass something. I want to talk to you about your leadership style. I saw you. Was it on social or something you were talking about. Where were you giving an interview about making everybody go back into the office.

[Emma Grede]

Oh, that was. Lord, that was so good. Here we go.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Can of worms.

[Emma Grede]

What are you doing to me? I know that was not a popular opinion.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Oh, really?

[Emma Grede]

Well, let's. Let's be honest.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I thought it was brilliant.

[Emma Grede]

It was kind of 50 50, and I knew it when I put it out there. But I do think it's really. First of all, I'm. I feel like we need to be able to have difficult conversations. Right? And we need to be able to have conversations where we disagree with one another. I've never, since coming to America, I don't understand, like, you know, some of my friends will be like, I'm not friends with him. He's a Republican. I'm like, you're not friends with a Republican? That's so random. Like, I love the Republicans. What are you talking about? So it just makes no sense to me. So to me, the beauty of social is this ability to get information, share information, to hear what people are thinking. And I put that out there. Cause it's a position that I hold. I need people in the office. But not just that. I feel like we've lost, like, that work has become like somehow this villain to a certain group of people. It's like, do you know what happened to me at work? The best things, like the single best things that I met all of my best friends that I go on a girls trip with every single year. I met them at work. My husband, I met him at work. I kissed him in the elevator for the first time. You know, it's like nowadays, I don't know about that. It's like, yeah, I mean, we didn't even know what HR was back then. You know, it was just a different time. But not only that. It's like the biggest successes, the biggest failures, the biggest learnings that I've had, they all happened in those workplaces. The best nights out that I ever had. They happened after, like, a random Wednesday in the office when you, like, maybe won a bit of business. And so this idea that somehow work is only a drag, it's only a negative, it's only taking away from you. I'm like, on what planet people? And now I get it. We don't all do work that is really fulfilling. But guess what? Work is not even just about the work about the people. It's about the relationships. It's about the, like, stuff that happens in the kitchen. So I just, what I was trying to say is that, like, can we just have a different way of looking at things? And by the way, yes, I do need you in the office. Yeah, I need you there to do the work. Guess what? Cause I'm paying you to be there for four days. If you'd have said to me at 19 years of age, you know what, Emma, we are gonna pay you for five days a week, and you just need to come in for four, I would have been like, sign me up. Are you crazy? Like, you mean, I could go to that Pilates class, Be a bit late, check in on the thing. Because we know what everyone does, and that's cool because the way that we work now is very, very different. The expectation is different. I don't, my expectation is that nobody misses anything that's deeply important to them. But it's, it's like we have this contract, right? I'm going to pay you, you're going to do a job, and in return, there's an element of freedom, there's an element of trust between us. And I expect. Yeah, and that's that, like, I, I, I don't know that it's, I think

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

it's a really, I mean, look, it's something that I wrestle with here. Did you see Jamie Dimon? He had a great, the head of JP Morgan did amazing rant about it too, where he was just furious that he would be on a zoom and he could see, like, people on their phone and in the zoom and, or

[Emma Grede]

people off on the zoom, like in the back screen.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

It's hard. I mean, I think in California, we still are the least back to the, the office work culture of all the states.

[Emma Grede]

Yeah, not in my office.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I know.

[Emma Grede]

No, I just, I, you know, I don't want to sit on Zoom. That's not the type of work that I do. If I wanted to have that type of job, quite frankly, I wouldn't work in the apparel business. I'm an in person in real life. In real Time. I don't want to even send emails. You know, I still go to people's desks. I'm like, hi. And people are like, oh Lord, is she in real life coming to you? I'm like, don't worry, it's not a bad thing. I just want to have a chat and I don't want to send 25 emails.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

And is it all teams you expect in like even accountants, data science, everything?

[Emma Grede]

Yes. Customer service. All the things that like everyone wants to outsource? No, it's, you know, because here's the thing again, I go back to this idea of a contract. We're at a time right now where, you know, we are talking about AI taking so many jobs off the table, right. Like I honestly could walk into the office and perhaps like reduce the workforce by 200 people tomorrow. I'm not doing that because I don't understand where like we, we haven't caught up with ourselves, right? It's like, yes, AI is going to create a lot of job. So right now the people that would be losing their roles are not walking into these AI ified jobs right now. So my viewpoint is that I'm going to keep people in work and my expectation is that you will show up.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Yeah, it's not that revolutionary.

[Emma Grede]

I don't think it is. Really.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

It's not.

[Emma Grede]

I don't think it is. It's not popular.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

It's not popular in California. But I think that this is the way the world is moving.

[Emma Grede]

And the great thing is the unemployment rate is at an all time low. So if you don't like it, I always say to people, like, this is my expectation. There's lots of places where you can come in two days a week or you can take the Monday and Friday off. That's totally cool. You should go there.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Right.

[Emma Grede]

I'm not holding a gun to anyone's head. Right.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

But then you see like the results that your companies are having and it's like a tough consumer market these days and there's so much competition and you guys are just crushing it.

[Emma Grede]

Well, and also what I do is fast. You know, I saw Sam Altman did a really good quote a couple of days ago and he said, I'm yet to meet a successful person that moves slow. Like me too. Like I'm fast. You know, that's why I don't send a lot of emails. That's why I don't like sitting on zooms. That's why I don't do one hour meetings because like, I need to go

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

quick I love that.

[Emma Grede]

Quick, quick.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

And you hire people around you that they understand your shorthand and they can take your ideas and sort of execute quickly.

[Emma Grede]

Yeah. Like, I hire real experts because, you know, at the end of the day, I'm a bit of a J. Right. I do, like, a few things kind of well. But when I think about what it is that I'm uniquely good at, I'm very good at focusing. Right. I know how to focus on what matters. I know how to get better at the things that matter. And I'm very good at tuning out everybody else's opinions.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

That's amazing.

[Emma Grede]

And on those three things, that's what I. So those are the important things I don't do lots and lots and lots and lots of things. I do very, very few things well.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

And what about as an example, the skims, marketing and like knowing to pull in, you know, whatever's like the culturally relevant thing in the second. Like, how do you think of that?

[Emma Grede]

No, I wish I could say, you know, it's so funny. I get so much credit out there and it's really, really funny. I think this comes back to. To, you know, hiring incredible people. But I think that some, like between Jens and Kim, I'm lucky enough to be on that group chat. I'm like, wow, that's such a good idea. It really. It's the two of them, they're amazing. They're like obsessed with popular culture and they're just in it. And again, it's quick. Right. If you are going to hire the two girls from White Lotus, like, you need them in that moment just as the, you know, finale's coming up and we're all obsessed and we've been very, very good at that. But then, you know, I think the discipline comes from making those things, things, habits. Right. You expect that from skims and, and having that type of cultural relevance never happens by accident. It happens because it's a muscle and we practice it. And I think, like, anything that you practice, like, I am like a default happy girl. I wake up, I'm like a seven, you know, it's like that's who I am. But it's like I've practiced being that way because I don't enjoy the other side of my personality on the other side of the Libra. I can go down, down. And so it's something that I try to do. I have a habit, habit of doing things that I know keep me well and make me happy. And it's the same thing in businesses. You have to create the. The Culture for something to become a habit within that business, and we happen to be pretty good at that.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

That's so brilliant and so smart.

[Emma Grede]

Yeah.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I mean, I think it's funny, that idea of sort of, like, operationalizing instinct or ideas, like, that's really, really resonant.

[Emma Grede]

And you can do that. You can operationalize excellence. Like being obsessed with something. Right. We're obsessed with our customer. We've operationalized innovation. We've said if that's the most important thing, having, like, the fabric, the thing, these moments that people go, like, and then lose their minds over. Like, how do you make sure that those come in? They don't. They're not accidents. You have to work on them. You have to create the conditions for them to happen. You have to create the space in people's workloads for those things to become part of the fabric of what you do. And so I think that that is. That's part of our. It's part of our culture.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Can we. Can I ask you about off season for a minute?

[Emma Grede]

Yes, please.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

So it looks so good.

[Emma Grede]

It's like, the product. I'm really proud of the product, I have to tell you.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I mean, I haven't seen it in person, but.

[Emma Grede]

Oh, I'll send you one.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Oh, my gosh.

[Emma Grede]

Sporty girl. J. I'm like, you are now. Okay, I'll put it on. Put it on.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

But it looks really high quality. So is it a much different price point?

[Emma Grede]

It is. It's a really different price point from everything that's out there. And, you know, the. The whole kind of, like, sports merch market, it's a bunch of horrible stuff. Like, if I sent you something from, like, I don't know, wherever people get their stuff, you would be like, no, thank you. You wouldn't put it on and feel good. There's no fit. There's no fabrication. There's nothing that feels remotely like, luxurious or premium. And so what we wanted to do was a premium experience. Something like a puffer jacket that you would want to wear, a top that you would put on with a pair of jeans and feel cute. And now we're seeing sports being so much more part of everyday life that it just felt like the time was right and the culture was right and women's sports is in the right place. And I am the person who is really the one saying, okay, like, how do you make an amazing puffer? Like, what should a puffer do? It should keep you warm. It should look really cool. It should sit just right. If it's oversized, it needs to be that. And so it's about obsessing over every little detail. And then of course, we've been lucky enough to be in partnership with the NFL. So we're making for these like, you know, incredible teams with these amazing legacies and finding the little thing that makes that jacket and that team, you know, those fans, like really set up and stand out.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

And how did you get them to partner with you?

[Emma Grede]

You know, it was, I have to say, Kristin Juszczyk, who's my partner, she is the wife of Kyle Juszczyk, who's a player on the 49ers. I'm learning along, let me tell you. I thought football was soccer up until a few months ago. I'm like being corrected every day. So she had been creating outfits for herself every single game. Like literally taught herself to sew on YouTube.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

You're kidding.

[Emma Grede]

No. She sent me like 25 DMs. I cannot tell you. And at some point you don't get the DMs of people. You don't follow. And I didn't know who Kristin was. She has a lot of followers. Super popular girl. But I think, I don't know, maybe like nine or ten people got in touch with me saying, do you know Kristen Juszczyk? You have to speak to this girl. And I was like, who is this chick? Like, I have no idea. I took a call with her and I fell in love, you know, and like she just reminded me of like a 27 year old me. She was like, I'm going to do this company and it's going to be successful. And she had a brilliant idea. And I thought, wow, there's a huge gap in the market. I know how to make incredible products. You understand, you know, this business, the NFL, and we're in a time where people, they want to feel nostalgic, they want to go back to this familiarity. And you know, football ball is about as American as it gets. It's about as family orientated as it gets. And so I'm, you know, the NFL are an amazing organization and we got a lot of, what do you do?

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Crumble someone from the NFL and go back to your old partnership, Go back

[Emma Grede]

to the old Emmett licensing era and be like, let's do a deal, guys. They'd already established like the beginnings of a partnership. And so it was one of those ones where we had to go in and say, hey, we're starting a brand. And I was really lucky. I know Michael Rubin, who started Fanatics. And so, you know, he's got the whole sports licensing locked up. And I was like, hey, Michael, want a partner? He's like, what are you talking about? I was like, no, seriously, do you want a partner? And Michael is like, the best of the best of the best, as it turns out, to, you know, like a solid person. You know, I think I had one meeting with Michael. I think six months later, what he'd said in that meeting was exactly what we ended up doing. He was like, we'll do this, we'll do this, we'll do this. And I was like, thank you.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

That's incredible.

[Emma Grede]

Best, most brilliant person.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

That's amazing. Yeah, sometimes it's is about, like, the right person, right. Getting to the right person and that. I was wondering if you had, like, certain tenants that you live by in terms of, you know, because I, I. I feel so underwater with just Goop and my kids already went to college. Like, you have kids in the house? You know, I feel like I have no time. And, you know, GOOP obviously has, like, a bunch of different verticals, so those each require attention. And now there's food and all this other stuff. But, like, is there something that you are very clear about, like, in terms of how you approach leading teams, how you get the best out of people? Like, do you have certain rules or certain practices or certain, like, you know, quotes? Or, like, what are your leadership values? How would you articulate them?

[Emma Grede]

I think I'm pretty clear in my philosophies, and I would like to say that, you know, I have. I've learned a lot along the way, but I also think that when you, you know, I'm 42. It wasn't that long ago that I was someone's employee. And so I took a lot from that time of knowing how you didn't want to feel. And I think when you get down to the crux of it, what do people really want? They want agency over their lives, right? They want to, for the most part, people want to come to work. They want to do a great job. They really do. They want to feel good about what it is that they and what they're part of. And they want to feel that they're part of a bigger picture, that what they do adds to the whole thing. And as a leader, I think it's my job to articulate what the possibilities are for you to feel great about what it is that you do. So having a mission, having a purpose, having a vision, that is something that is so clearly articulated that every single person doesn't matter if you work on the front desk or whether you're in the C suite in the executive leadership team, you know exactly what we're here to do. Not making denim. Right. We're here to make women feel great about themselves. And then there are all of these different ways that you can add to that mission. And then you gotta get out of people's way. Like, you know, I have so many different jobs. I have four children. I don't have time to micromanage. Like, I really don't. And so people that can work well with me are the ones that take an enormous amount of accountability. But I will also get out of their way, because I've already told you, like, here's the vision and here's the goal, and I only care about winning. Like, literally, like, I learned very early on in my career this idea of, like, what is an enterprise mentality? We are all here. We're not a family. That's not what we are. We're not here to be mates. And we might be mates, but that's not what we're here for. Right. The purpose of the reason that we're all here is to drive this thing forward. Now, can you make money from it? Yes, I hope so. Can I make money from it? Like, we better. Can our shareholders make money? Absolutely. If we're all on the same page about that, then we can all go forward. But I kind of don't make any mistakes about trying to pretend about why we're here. I'm very, very, very clear. Like, no one is ever, like, I wonder what Emma's thinking. So I've already told you, I'm not waiting for that feedback moment, for the assessment. Where's the. Sit down. I'm like, come over here. Like, this thing just didn't work for me. So my thing is, do you give

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

feedback like that in the moment?

[Emma Grede]

Oh, yeah, like, immediately. Because I can't keep in. That's more about me and who I am. But I think that people appreciate that because they want to know they stand. Nobody wants to go home being like, did I say the wrong thing? Did I make a misstep? I'm like, yeah, you made a misstep, and here's how you could do it better next time. And by the way, there was this thing that I did before, and these are the steps that I took to make it better. So I'm very literal about what it is that I need and what my expectations are, but I think that that helps set everybody up for success. And then it is really about this craziness that I have about hiring because I. There's nothing I love more than surrounding myself with brilliant people. And I think that in beginning of an entrepreneurial journey, you can get a little bit worried about, is this person gonna show me up? Are they so much better than me? And I learned really early on I was like, the better the people are around me, the better I look, you know, 100%. And so I've really made it part of my mission to just get amazing people.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

What are your hiring rules?

[Emma Grede]

You know, the first thing is I see a lot of people, so I will meet people even when I'm not hiring. Just purely speculatively. You're out, you're in the market. Like, I'm taking a meeting. If you're a good. And I've heard great things about you, I'm just going to take that meeting. I also. I kiss a lot of frogs. You know, I listen and I ask a lot of questions because I'm not just trying to figure out, are you right for me, I'm like, how do you do it? How do you do it over there? How did you do it in the company before? How did that work? What the pitfalls? So I am like, again, I'm always in learning mode, and I'm trying to figure out, like, what is the best way that that role works outside of where I am so that I could potentially bring that in. I also hire for attitude over experience. I don't care if you've done it for 25 years. I haven't done it for 25 years, and I'm great at it. So I'm like, give me the person that has the flexible mentality. Because if you come to me and you're like, this is the way it should be done, I'm like, no, thank you. You know, I'm like, are you flexible? Are you that type of person that can see a new thing and run? Like, are you a team player? Are you somebody that can. Again, sometimes you need real specialists, but more often than not, I need people that understand how every part of the business works and they can be a really, really deep in their vertical, but that they have enough foresight that they understand a little bit about what everybody's doing. You know, management speak, they call it a T shape leader, but it's like, that's what I'm looking for. I need you to have enough understanding that you can see the patterns, that you can understand the story. You can put that all together and then run with it.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

So good.

[Emma Grede]

That's what I need. Not a lot. Then I don't ask for much.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

No, it's. No, I think it really is everything. And it's something that I've learned slowly and along the way. It's just. It's everything. And you said it exactly like people that give you leverage, you know, people who are. Are smarter and better. And it's so critical. Okay, what about working with your husband? How do you, like, how are you like in a P and L with someone and then like, want to out with them?

[Emma Grede]

It's so funny, you know, I. The funny thing about Jens is that again, we do very different things. There's. There's no overlap. When we got this new office, we just got this beautiful new office building. And we were going to have like, eyesight of one another, like from one glass office to another. And I was like, somebody build a wall. I can't see this the whole day. I am not looking for that, you know? And we laugh because we go to work sometimes in two cars and we're like in convoy, but we're separate. Cause he'll both be on the phone we had. You know, I used to work for Jens. He was my first investor, him and Eric. And I think that what I had was a way of working with him before we had our marriage and our relationship together. And he's Swedish, so he has a very good way of separating everything, you know, like, he's just very black and white, you know. You know, I'm like, just not, you know, I'm emotional and I'm like, all the things all the time. And he's like, emma, pull yourself together. I feel like some of the hardest things I've learned come from him. You know, he's really very straightforward and honest. And I'll ask him a question and he'll tell me the actual truth. And I'm like, don't do that. I needed you to, like, you know, soften that up and be really all sweet and lovely. And he's like, oh, I'm so sorry. I'm like, hell, like, read the room, you know. But I think ultimately we don't do what each. And he has a lot of respect for my ambition. And when we moved here, it was because of me, you know. He was like, you have a moment in time. This company's going crazy. Good American. And I think that we should go to la. And I was like, really? Like, we're gonna live there with the actors and the actresses and like, you know. And he was like, yeah, it'll be great. The sun shines and it's beautiful now. You couldn't take me back to England if you tried.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Yeah, it's hard to go back after all.

[Emma Grede]

I mean, you've definitely, you've done it that the other way around. And it's like, you ain't going back to Highgate. You're not going back to those gray

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

mornings, you know, that's tough. The school run in February. It's hard.

[Emma Grede]

I miss it. As opposed to this beautiful sunshine and a, you know, drive through, drop off.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

No, it's pretty. I know. It's okay.

[Emma Grede]

Good.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Tell me about the 15% pledge and how it started. It's so incredible.

[Emma Grede]

Thank you. So the 15% pledge is incredible economic justice organization that was started, It's a nonprofit. It was started by my dear friend Aurora James. I'm the chairwoman of the pledge, which is one of my proudest accomplishments. And we work with brands and retailers all over the country to have them redirect 15% of their annual spend towards black owned businesses. And you know, when the pledge was started, just after the murder of George Floyd and it was, you know, really directly an initiative that was there because so many business owners and so many leaders were being, what is it that I can do and how have I ignored this for so long and how can we create a more equitable playing field? And at the end of it, you know, I, I look at it now, the pledge has been unbelievably successful. We've created a $16 billion pipeline for black owned businesses. So much opportunity, so many incredible brands from Sephora to Macy's to Nordstrom to Ulta, they've all taken the pledge and they're doing incredible work. And for clarity, it's not, you know, you're not putting your hand up and pledging, you are in a contractual commitment to work towards greater equity for these businesses on the shelves. But I think what's been really interesting is to see how that's really enhanced the customer journey. Because if you're somebody like me and you always want to make things great for customers and I think, look, supporting small businesses, small American businesses is an idea everyone can get behind, right? It's like it's always a good idea. But when you think about it through the customer lens, what do you get when you walk into Sephora? Well, more people can shop there, more people can find great products there. And if you make a great hair conditioner and you just so happen to be a black founder, well, guess what, you can use that hair conditioner. I can use that anyone can. So it's about creating better choice for the customer and then bringing more customers into your business. So it's something that I love. It's something that is a nonprofit and does really great work and helps so many of these founders to really create stability within their own businesses and. And their own brands. But more than that, it's been amazing for these retailers that have got behind it. So in this moment where we see so much reversal of De and I policies, I was just going to ask you, you know, I look at this and I say, wow, what. How incredible were those brands that, quite frankly, when they could reverse and they could decide, you know what? Nobody's looking right now, and it will be a great moment to come back on our commitment. That they're still doing the work isn't just a testament to them being great brands. They know it's a great business proposition. It's just that simple. Nobody would stay doing it if it wasn't commercially viable.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

So brands are sticking with it.

[Emma Grede]

Oh, they're all sticking with it, which is really great. So Sephora is. To me, they are. They've done such an incredible job. But Nordstrom, Macy's, Bloomingdale's, they're all completely sticking with it. Ulta Beauty, these are just like, you know, companies that do the work. They're amazing at what they do, and, you know, they're doing. They're doing amazing business.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Yeah. But also, Emma, it's like you're able to seed, you know, you're going to create generational wealth for black founders the way you've done it for yourself.

[Emma Grede]

Yes.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

You know, it's such a beautiful thing to do, and it does make the brands better, and it does make it better for the consumer. It makes things more diverse and more interesting and opens the aperture and it's. I think it's amazing.

[Emma Grede]

No, me too. And I think what's been kind of nice for me is to see, you know, you have to think about, you know, and I'm sure you give a lot, and nonprofit is a really interesting world. This is so tangible. Right. When you put a brand on the shelf of Nordstrom or Sephora, that has an immediate impact, those founders are able to stay in business. They're able to put their kids into good school, they're able to hire more people, they're able to have impact in their community. And you don't need to wait five years for that to happen. It's immediate. And so what I love is seeing businesses that we started with at the pledge and they, you know, had a couple of million dollars of sales or maybe not even. And now they're, you know, doing their Series B. They're like, you know, they're proper that have surpassed those initial few POS that came from pledge takers, and now they're in big box retail. And for me, I'm like, that's the part that I look at. I'm like, oh, that's amazing. Like, I remember that girl when she applied for the achievement award and we gave her 200, you know, 200 grand grant, and now look at her like, those things, you can't. They stay with you. And for me, that's the bit that I'm. I just. I can't get over. I'll never get over it, I'm sure.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Tell me about this new podcast that you're working on. I'm very excited.

[Emma Grede]

So am I. Well, you know, it kind of comes down to this thing of I never actually wanted to start my own business. It's not like I grew up thinking I'm going to start my own company and become an entrepreneur and make a load of money and, you know, do more and more and more companies. To me, work was something that, you know, you did to pay your bills. And for most of the people that I knew, it was, like, quite unenjoyable. Right? You didn't really love what you do. You just did a job to pay the bills. And what I understood as I've started to have more success is that everyone asks me the same questions. They're like, how did you do it? How did you do it with no education? How did you go from being, like, this corporate chick to running your own companies? And in fact, how do you just, like, ask for a pay rise and be really confident how you are? And I know that I have great access. You know, if I call you and say, hey, Gwyneth, would you be on my podcast? You go, yeah. And I was like, really?

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

You will?

[Emma Grede]

Thank you. That's so cute. But, you know, it's like, I have a lot of access and I know a lot of people, and I think that information is so key. You know, it's like the type of things that I've been told and the learnings that I have and what I've seen that's enabled me to be really successful. And so I was really thinking about this idea of how do you scale mentorship? Like, how do I create this, like, way of spreading information? And taking it is taking what I've learned, taking the people I know, and making that more accessible to more people. And, you know, I love to chat. So I was like, let's do a podcast. It will be amazing. You get the right people on and you explore their journeys. And we talk about, you know, the things in the most honest and open way. And I also know because female founders, specifically all face very, very similar problems. And I'm sick of toxic positivity. I'm allergic to it. I'm like, no, you can't just close your eyes and manifest it, babe. And it's all going to work out. It doesn't work like that. You know, you've got to come to work. You got to do some stuff. And some of it is really, really difficult. And this idea that I always get told off for, like, talking about money, I'm like, really? Like, do you know what happens when you don't speak about money? When you elegantly avoid the subject of money? The money has a way of elegantly avoiding you. You know, it really does. The money goes seed skirt, and it goes, like, somewhere else. And so I want to talk about those things. And I don't think it's inelegant, and I don't think that we have to be like men and talk about it in that way. We can be like women, but we can still speak about these things that somehow seem to evade us. You know, it's like, I want more women to have big positions of power. I want more women to start companies, and I want more women to, like, come into a lot of money so that they can make the decisions and the choices and do all the things that I get to do. So that's why I thought I'd start this lovely cast. It's called Aspire with Emma Grade. Because I feel like we're all aspiring to something, right? Like, everybody wants to build the life of their dreams, and everybody wants to do great stuff. And so I'm going to speak to people that I aspire to and that, you know, can share some. Some good stuff.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Okay, we're going to end with the rapid fire. These are cute.

[Emma Grede]

Love a rapid fire.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Okay, first thing you do when you

[Emma Grede]

wake up, say, thank you for the ceiling.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Last thing you do before bed.

[Emma Grede]

Kissy ends. Good night. So sweet.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

One thing always in your makeup bag.

[Emma Grede]

Eyebrow pencil. Always.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I didn't think you were gonna say that.

[Emma Grede]

Oh. It's the only thing I care about.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

A favorite place to unwind.

[Emma Grede]

In the front of my house on the beach in Malibu. Yeah. It's the best thing ever. It's the best thing. Best Thing I've ever done in my life, thankfully, yes. My goodness.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Favorite meal in Los Angeles.

[Emma Grede]

Oh, I love Anna Jack Thai. Ooh, that's good. It's just so delicious. And I cannot do one dish. I need all the dishes. I'm like a 14 dish orderer just for taste.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

That's in Sherman Oaks, right?

[Emma Grede]

Yes, it's so good. It's so delicious.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Favorite meal in London.

[Emma Grede]

Oh, Scott's. Scott's old fish restaurant. I love a good old fish restaurant. Delicious.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Okay, you have 48 hours off. Travel time is not included. Where are you going?

[Emma Grede]

Paris. With no shadow of a doubt. I love it.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

What's your favorite restaurant in Paris?

[Emma Grede]

Oh, you know, like, I like the memories. Like, I want to go to, like, cafe floor and like, sit there and just like, you know, like, be how I was when I was like 25, smoking or something.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Those were the days.

[Emma Grede]

Those were the days.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Favorite campaign you've ever worked on?

[Emma Grede]

Would it be Gwyneth Paltrow for Hugo Boss back in the day? Thanks for that job, by the way.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

You're welcome. Thank you very much.

[Emma Grede]

It was good for both of us.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Definitely the most arresting campaign that wasn't yours. Like, it could be anything. It could be, you know.

[Emma Grede]

Know what I liked? I thought that Pete Davidson reformation one. I was like, oh, I should have thought about that.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Oh, I missed that.

[Emma Grede]

It was good. It was like, I don't know, it was like a boyfriend sitting out of a. Outside, a fitting room. But I was like, that was smart. Like, it. It was a Valentine's Day thing. And I was like, good casting. You reformation girls. Damn it, they're great.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Which shark would you most want to partner with?

[Emma Grede]

Mark Cuban all day long.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

Mark Cuban.

[Emma Grede]

Love me some Mark Cuban.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

He's a nice guy.

[Emma Grede]

The nicest man.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

When you meet with a founder, is there an immediate turnoff?

[Emma Grede]

Yes. Someone who says to me, the market size is $15 billion. I'm like, talk to me at mark. Tell me how you're going to get a customer. Don't tell me the size of the market for, like, floss. Like, please know.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

And what about the biggest founder? Turn on just the energy.

[Emma Grede]

I want. I want someone who is nuts about what they do, you know? Like, if you can tell me about all the competition, like, I am obsessed with you. I'm like, yes. And I don't care what it is, what the category is. Like, I invested in these girls who have nipple covers, and there is not a thing that they don't know about. Undergarments, nipple covers. They're amazing. I mean, they did $120 million last year, I think. Do you have cakes right now? Do you? Yes, I wanted for cake.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

And who's your favorite of your kids?

[Emma Grede]

No, I was gonna have one as well. Everyone has a favorite kid. Don't lie. Really? Of course. Yeah.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

I have two, and I have a boy and a girl.

[Emma Grede]

And you're also. You have a favorite boy and a favorite girl? No, no. I mean, look. Yeah, I mean, I'm not gonna say it because it would traumatize them, won't it? But. Yeah, yeah.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

You know, but is there something that being a mother has taught you, you that is surprising?

[Emma Grede]

That's a lovely question. I don't think I understood how maternal I am. You know, I always thought that I was just gonna, like, have these kids and. Yeah, I'm not gonna roll with me. I'm like. I'm extremely maternal as a person. Yeah. That's so sweet.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

See, you're the dream. Now you know why you're my girl crush.

[Emma Grede]

So sweet. I do.

[Gwyneth Paltrow]

That's so lovely. Thanks for tuning in. This has been a presentation of Cadence 13 Studios. I hope you'll listen, follow, rate, and review all of our episodes, which are available for free on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Odyssey, or wherever you get your podcasts.