Do You Want to Be Healed? :: Christine Caine

Summary

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Podcast Summary:

The Grove Podcast — “Do You Want to Be Healed?” with Christine Caine
Date: July 1, 2026
Host: The Grove, Passion City Church (hosted by Signa Coleman)
Guest Speaker: Christine Caine

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Episode Overview

In this dynamic episode, Christine Caine delivers a passionate, scripturally-rooted message rooted in John 5, spotlighting the story of the man at Bethesda. Through both biblical exegesis and her own testimony, Christine challenges women to examine the ways in which they may be defined by their issues, rather than by the freedom available in Christ. She presses into the question Jesus asks: “Do you want to be healed?” and unpacks the implications of this question for anyone seeking breakthrough, healing, or a renewed sense of purpose.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Foundation in the Word

Christine opens by expressing her love and respect for scripture, framing the teaching in John 5 as not just a story but a living invitation to healing and freedom.

• (00:47) “The Word of God is what saved my mind. I was a right proper mess. And it is this word that brings life and hope and liberty.” — Christine Caine

2. Setting: The Pool of Bethesda (John 5)

Christine contextualizes the passage, explaining the significance of the pool, the number five (grace), and why multitudes of people with issues gathered there.

• (03:36) “Five in the Bible is the number of grace. And let me just tell you, there is grace upon grace upon this gathering.” — Christine Caine

3. The Multitude & Issue-Centric Identity

She notes that many people focus on their issues, using them almost as identity markers—something Jesus repeatedly challenges.

• (08:39) “The Bible says there's a multitude. There's a multitude of people with issues. … Have you ever noticed? … all the gossipers find themselves. … The naysayers will, the positive people will all find each other.” — Christine Caine

Social Media Parallels

Christine vividly ties the ancient “porches” to modern “porches” like Facebook and Twitter, where people gather and commiserate around their issues.

• (13:47) “Put it on Facebook. Oh, the porch looks a bit different than the ones that were around the pool of Bethesda, but it's just 21st-century technology. Same thing.” — Christine Caine

4. Personalization of Suffering; The Temptation to Stay Stuck

She points out the ease by which people gather more around comfort, affirmation, and pity than true transformation.

• (12:35) “They want to be accepted rather than changed. They’d rather be affirmed than changed… enabled than changed… pitied than changed because they find their identity in their condition.” — Christine Caine

• (16:21) “You have relabelled yourself in your mind. And you no longer identify as a daughter of the King. You identify as a woman that has an issue.” — Christine Caine

5. Jesus’ Provocative Question and Our Responsibility

Christine spotlights Jesus’ bracing question: “Do you want to be healed?” describing it as startlingly direct and counter to our modern expectations of pastoral sensitivity.

• (20:42) “Jesus says to him, do you want to be healed? Now, today, if one of us did that, we would be slandered all over Twitter.” — Christine Caine

• (22:53) “Because with healing comes responsibility. … Oh, it was easy to be a victim. Cause people feel sorry for you. … But, see, if you get up then you’re gonna... develop that potential… you’re gonna have to deal with a lot of the brokenness...” — Christine Caine

Christine’s Testimony

She vulnerably shares her own story of profound abuse, marginalization, and brokenness, illustrating the choice between being defined by those events or by Christ’s healing power.

• (23:07) “That I came from a background of 12 years of abuse and was left in a hospital unnamed and unwanted, and found out I was adopted at 33…” — Christine Caine

6. Excuses That Keep Us on the Mat

Christine unpacks the man’s response—not a ‘yes,’ but a list of reasons. She parallels this with modern Christians who may deflect or rationalize away the call to healing.

• (31:00) “The dude does not say yes. Can you believe that?” — Christine Caine

• (31:42) “We start with our excuses. His answer is, ‘there’s no one to put me in the pool.’ That’s us… the whole time they’re preaching, we’re thinking about why this doesn’t apply to me.” — Christine Caine

Insightful Critique of Modern Christian Culture

Christine dismantles the notion that freedom is found in personality types or self-help labels.

• (32:48) “Freedom is not an enneagram number. Freedom is not a personality type. … Freedom is actually a blood type. It’s the blood of Jesus Christ of Nazareth. It sets people free.” — Christine Caine

7. Making Christ’s Work Greater Than Our Pain

She exhorts listeners to decide that what Jesus did is bigger—more powerful, more significant—than anything done to them.

• (41:36) “I’m going to make what Jesus did for me bigger than what they did to me. I’m going to make Calvary my defining moment.” — Christine Caine

8. Walking in Healing Unlocks Purpose

Christine teaches that healing leads to open doors, purpose, and generational impact. Staying on the mat or the porch keeps us from these callings.

• (44:57) “There’s a temple for you. I’ve got opportunity for you. … You don’t even know.” — Christine Caine

9. The Danger of Legalism and License

She names two traps that keep us on the mat: legalism (denying the power to change) and license (refusing to confront sin).

• (45:07) “Legalism will always try to keep you on the mat. … But I’ll tell you what else will keep you on the mat. License to sin will keep you on that mat.” — Christine Caine

10. Generational Shifts—You Can Change the Future

Christine closes with a poignant story about her family tree and the power of drawing a line for future generations.

• (50:36) “I can’t change it. That stuff could keep me on the mat if I wanted to let it do that. … But I was thinking, as I was walking down that street… although we could do nothing to change the past, that past does not need to keep you on the mat.” — Christine Caine

• (50:52) “With us, adultery stops. With us, addiction stops. With us, divorce stops.” — Christine Caine

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• (12:35) “Misery loves company, pity parties love to bring other people in on their little thing and sit on the porch and just wait.”
• (20:34) “Jesus walks into this scenario. … And says to him the most unpastoral thing you could ever say to anybody: ‘Do you want to be healed?’”
• (41:32) “But there has to come a point in your life where you make a decision that you know what. I’m going to make what Jesus did for me bigger than what they did to me.”
• (45:07) “Legalism will always try to keep you on the mat. … License to sin will keep you on that mat.”
• (50:52) “With us, adultery stops. With us, addiction stops. With us, divorce stops. … You cannot change the past, but you can change the future. So today at the Grove, I say to you, get up, pick up your mat and walk in Jesus name. Be free in Jesus name, Be free in Jesus name.”

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Important Timestamps

• (00:47 - 03:36) — Christine sets up the scriptural context and emphasizes the centrality of grace in the story
• (08:39 - 14:07) — Exploration of the ways people group around their issues then and now, drawing parallels to social media and modern culture
• (16:21 - 17:29) — Christine calls out the tendency to take on issue-based identities rather than recognizing ourselves as daughters of the King
• (20:34 - 22:53) — The calling out of Jesus’ blunt question, "Do you want to be healed?", and its contemporary application
• (23:07 - 26:58) — Christine shares her testimony and challenges the audience to count the cost and responsibility of healing
• (31:00 - 33:06) — The excuses we make in the face of God’s offer of freedom; “Freedom is a blood type.”
• (41:36 - 42:53) — Making the choice to let Jesus define our identity, not our pain; “Get up and carry the thing that used to carry you.”
• (44:57 - 46:33) — Healing leads to greater opportunities, and the warning against the twin dangers of legalism and license
• (50:36 - 51:47) — Final generational challenge; “You cannot change the past, but you can change the future.”

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Tone & Conclusion

The tone throughout is passionate, forthright, and hopeful. Christine Caine balances deep empathy for pain with a bold, unapologetic call to action. She urges listeners not to stay bound by their stories or circumstances, but to step boldly into the healing and freedom offered by Jesus—for their own sake and for the many on the other side of their obedience.

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For Listeners:

If you have ever felt stuck, defeated, or defined by past pain, this episode will challenge, convict, and inspire you to answer—once and for all—Jesus’ timeless question: “Do you want to be healed?”

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Transcript

[Podcast Host]

Foreign. Hey, Grove girls, it's Signa Coleman. And we are back with our third episode of our summer recap series here on the Grove Podcast. Today, we're revisiting a powerful message from our very own Christine Cain. As she walks us through John 5 and her own story, she reminds us that Jesus is calling all of us to healing, freedom and purpose. If you've ever felt defined by your life circumstances or wonder if lasting change is possible, this conversation is a reminder that Jesus is still asking all of us the same question he asked that man at Bethesda. Do you want to be healed? Let's listen in.

[Christine Caine]

I want you to turn with me in the scripture. We're going to dive right in. I have a sense that the Holy Spirit's going to do something very, very well, he's already here, but he's going to do something very special and powerful in our life. We're going to go to the Book of John, chapter five. Anyone love the Bible? I love, love the Word of God. I love every word from the first word in Genesis right through to the last word in Revelation. It's all true, the whole lot of it. And it brings life and hope and liberty. And Jesus saved my soul, there's no doubt about that. But the Word of God is what saved my mind. I was a right proper mess. And it is this word that brings life and hope and liberty. And I love it. I love the growth. Because when we come together, we'll laugh a lot. I mean, there is Ferris wheels and there is light music and you're gonna go into orbit in wor. But I tell you, we anchor everything in the truth of the Word of God. So I love that about this house in a big way. So I hope we're in John chapter 5. You can go wherever you want. The whole Bible's inspired. It's all good. Just feel free. You can read whatever you want. If you feel like reading along with me, you can go to John chapter 5. And so some of us are still in the dark ages. We, like, read real. This is a Bible. In case you don't know what this is, this is a book. This is like paper. And not everything is digital. There still is this. So this is a Bible. And I love, I love my Bible. The Bible says in the book of John chapter five, after this. After what? After John chapter four. Because that's normally how things work.

[Signa Coleman]

Four, five, six.

[Christine Caine]

Man, if this is your first time in church today, you're like, man, I just learned something. That's right. Even in the Bible 5 comes up to 4. So after John chapter 4, John chapter 4 is where Jesus met the woman at the well, the Samaritan woman, and kind of had a revival with her. And she went back to her town and. Cause that's what happens when you encounter Jesus. It's pretty awesome that you just can't help talking about him. And chicks are really good at talking about Jesus, so it's wonderful. We're good at gossip, so why not gossip about the right thing? So anyway, so she went back to her town and they had a little revival. And it was a big revival. More than a little revival. Jesus stayed with them a couple of days and then he went to Galilee, to Cana, where he performed his first miracle. And then he performed another miracle. There was an officer and his was like he needed to be healed. Cause he was gonna die in Capernaum. And Jesus just gave his word. Cause that's what happens when you encounter Jesus. You get forgiven for your sins. You get healed. It's all. This is a book of action. I mean, it's really, really. There's nothing boring in it. If you find it boring, you're not reading it right. And so then scripture says, after this. Cause there's always an after this with Jesus. There's always like the next thing. He really didn't stop. You think Chris and Nick or Pastor Louis and Shelley are full on for Jesus and keep going. Well, you know, Jes. That precedent. It's not our fault. People go, well, you know, Jesus went alone and he rested. It's awesome.

[Signa Coleman]

Yes, he did.

[Christine Caine]

But every time he went, a whole crowd turned up and really interrupted his rest. You need to read the Bible. He goes, well, not today. So let's just get some more people healed and let's get some more people saved and let's get some more people delivered. It's kind of what Jesus did. So after this, there was a feast of the Jews. And Jesus went up to Jerusalem, obviously because he was Jewish. And so he was going to keep. There are three feasts in scripture, really, in the Jewish calendar. Had Passover, Pentecost and the feast of Tabernacles. And most theologians think this was the feast of Tabernacles. So Jesus was a good Jew. So of course he's gonna go to Jerusalem to keep the feast. Now there is in Jerusalem, by the sheep gate, a pool in Aramaic called Bethesda, which has five roofed colonnades. I worked so hard to find a scripture that had five in it because this is our fifth anniversary for the grove So I want you to know, Shelley, I did. Five in the Bible is the number of grace. And let me just tell you, there is grace upon grace upon this gathering. And I just. You know, as I was preparing this, I thought, God has been so good to us in five years at the Grove. You couldn't make this stuff up. You couldn't force this. You couldn't market your way into this. Only God can do this. And I just think in the next little season. We're gonna see grace upon grace. And we're not gonna see addition. We're gonna see multiplication. And we're gonna see grace upon grace upon grace upon grace, upon grace, upon grace. And many, many women are gonna hear about the good news of the Lord Jesus Christ. Because of what's coming out of this movement. So now there is in Jerusalem, by the sheep gate, a pool in Aramaic called Bethesda. And so that means in Aramaic, grace and Bethesda. In Hebrew. You could tell. I've been at Wheaton College for the last couple of years, haven't you? I've just gone up another level of even knowing what some of this stuff means. And so what it means in Hebrew is. And so there's a pool of mercy. There's five colonnades, five porches around this pool. And it says, in these lay a multitude of invalids. Turn to your neighbor and say, there's always a multitude. There's always a multitude. A multitude of invalids. Blind, lame and paralyzed.

[Signa Coleman]

One man was there who had been

[Christine Caine]

an invalid for 38 years. Years. When Jesus saw him lying there and knew that he had already been there a long time. He said to him, do you want to be healed? The sick man answered him, sir, I have no one to put me in the pool when the water is stirred up. And while I'm going another steps down before me. Jesus said to him, get up. Take up your bed and walk.

[Signa Coleman]

And at once the man was healed.

[Christine Caine]

And he took up his bed and walked. Now, that day was the Sabbath. And so the Jews said to the man who had been healed. It is the Sabbath, and it is not lawful for you to take up your bed. But he answered them, the man who healed me.

[Signa Coleman]

That man said to me, take up your bed and walk. They asked him, who is the man

[Christine Caine]

who said to you, take up your bed and walk?

[Signa Coleman]

Now, the man who had been healed

[Christine Caine]

did not know who it was. I love that about Jesus. For Jesus had withdrawn as there was a crowd in the place. Afterwards, Jesus found him in the temple and said to him, see you are well. Sin no more, that nothing worse may happen to you. The man went away and told the Jews that it was Jesus who had healed him. And this was why the Jews were persecuting Jesus, because he was doing these things on the Sabbath. Don't you just love legalists? They would rather you remain in bondage than be set free. Just don't do it on the wrong day. Just don't do it in the right way. Legalists crack me up. So there you go anyway. But Jesus answered them, my Father is working until now, and I am working. So here we are by a pool. So Jesus turns up and he's going

[Signa Coleman]

up for the feast of Tabernacles.

[Christine Caine]

And he comes in by the sheep gate into Jerusalem, which. That's the gate that the shepherds used, obviously, with their sheep. And if you turn right, and I know there's a trip going to Israel very soon out of this house. But you turn right there, you come to the pool of Bethesda, which was

[Signa Coleman]

split in two at the time.

[Christine Caine]

There was a wall in the middle of it.

[Signa Coleman]

Now, one side was where the sheep

[Christine Caine]

would be washed by the shepherds before taking them in. The other side is where people washed.

[Signa Coleman]

Now, along here there was a colonnade of five porches. And so they were all around five

[Christine Caine]

colonnades around this pool in Bethesda.

[Signa Coleman]

And it was full of lame and paralyzed and mute and sick people. This is where invalids came.

[Christine Caine]

This is where sick people came.

[Signa Coleman]

The Bible says there's a multitude. There's a multitude of people with issues. There's a multitude of people with infirmities. This is where they came.

[Christine Caine]

Because what happened was. Well, of course, Jerusalem hasn't got any water.

[Signa Coleman]

So there's an underground water system. And then what would happen is every now and again, when that underground system would overflow, the water at the top in this pool of Bethesda would.

[Christine Caine]

Would move. It would begin to stir. It happened very, very rarely. Now, of course, there's always superstition in every era. The superstition here was that, you know, angels wings would move every now and again. And the wind from the wings would move the water. So, you know, superstitious people are just like, kind of waiting that this might be the day. But whatever it was, every now and again. And it's more likely that what happened was because it was overflowing from underneath, that the water would be stirred and the water would move.

[Signa Coleman]

And so what happened was sick people would be there waiting that maybe they would be the one. This could be My time, I don't know when it's going to stir. It could be once a year, maybe twice a year. And they gathered in their groups, the paralyzed, the lame, the sick. Because that's what happens. Misery loves company. And the Bible says there's a multitude of people. Have you ever noticed that? Always if someone's got an issue or an infirmity or people find themselves. Look, I've been in church life for 30 years and it is amazing to me. I've been in one church for 31 years and the interesting thing to me is it doesn't matter whether people come into church life from different backgrounds and at different seasons, but over a period of time, it is amazing to me

[Christine Caine]

how all the gossipers find themselves.

[Signa Coleman]

I know, not in your church here

[Christine Caine]

in America, just in our churches in Australia.

[Signa Coleman]

And you go, they're all like intersection, all the naysayers, all the negative, you know, all the ones that think, oh,

[Christine Caine]

this church is just not deep enough.

[Signa Coleman]

They'll find themselves, I don't know how. It's just like this power. They all just come in, they find they all end up in the same small group or they all end up sitting in the same section at church. Or the ones that, you know, we're just not radical enough here.

[Christine Caine]

It's just like, you know, I don't.

[Signa Coleman]

Carey job.

[Christine Caine]

Like, I don't know, you know, they'll find themselves. It is fascinating to me after 30 years of church life how people find themselves. The naysayers will, the positive people will

[Signa Coleman]

all find each other. The people that have a positive, faith filled perspective, they're all around each other and they're seeing a different whole church than the naysayers are. And they're all in the same place, but they have a whole different perspective because some are lying by the pool and others are standing up. And someone that's lying down always has a different perspective than someone that is already moving and someone that is going forward. There's always a different perspective. But here we are and they gather

[Christine Caine]

in their groups and it's comfortable.

[Signa Coleman]

If I'm paralyzed and you're paralyzed and if I'm lame and you're lame and

[Christine Caine]

I'm whatever, I might have a different

[Signa Coleman]

sickness than you have, or we both have some kind of similar past and we can all congregate on our porch, we love to sit on the porch and talk about it. Well, let's talk about what happened to us. Let's talk about our past. Let's talk about why things can't work

[Christine Caine]

and we Just congregate it. Just misery. Loves company, pity parties, love to bring

[Signa Coleman]

other people in on their little thing

[Christine Caine]

and sit on the porch and just wait. And that's what happened. Jesus walks into this scenario. The Bible says, a multitude. There's probably hundreds of invalids. A multitude of invalids were sitting there wondering, is this water gonna move today? Is something gonna happen today? Am I gonna find freedom today? Am I gonna be the one that's gonna dive in the pool today?

[Signa Coleman]

But see, these people and people that

[Christine Caine]

gather together with issues that really wanna be changed. They wanna be accepted rather than changed. They'd rather be affirmed than changed.

[Signa Coleman]

They'd rather.

[Christine Caine]

They'd rather be enabled than change. They'd rather be pitied than change because

[Signa Coleman]

they find their identity in their condition. They haven't come to church on a Sunday to be transformed. They don't come to the growth so that they can be changed. It's like, no, no, no. I want to come and I want to find people like me. I need someone to comfort me. I need someone to affirm me. I need someone to sit on this porch with me and tell me that

[Christine Caine]

it's okay to be here. Now, look, we see this throughout Scripture. It's not a new thing. We love our issues.

[Signa Coleman]

We're the generation.

[Christine Caine]

And 2018 is the year of issues.

[Signa Coleman]

It's the year of issues. And we love to highlight them and sit on the porch and talk about them. And wow, we even have social media now so we can easily find the other invalids on the same porch. As usual, just tweet out. You'll get a reply with other people

[Christine Caine]

sitting on that porch in a heartbeat.

[Signa Coleman]

Put it on Facebook. Oh, the porch looks a bit different than the ones that were around the

[Christine Caine]

pool of Bethesda, but it's just 21st century technology. Same thing. Same thing. Sitting on a porch, tweeting about our issues, talking about our issues, complaining about

[Signa Coleman]

our issues, thinking about. I mean, look, eventually we forget that we are daughters of the king because we spend so much time talking about our issue. We don't know who we are. We see this in the Bible. We see a precedent of people. We don't know their names, they're nameless in the Bible, but we do know their issue. We see that in the book of Luke, chapter 8. There's the woman with the issue of

[Christine Caine]

we don't know her name, but we know her issue right here in John, chapter four.

[Signa Coleman]

Before we get to five, there was this Samaritan woman. We don't know what her name was,

[Christine Caine]

but we certainly know what her issue was. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. We have the woman in John chapter

[Signa Coleman]

8 that was caught in the act of adultery.

[Christine Caine]

We don't know her name, but we know her issue. Some of us, that's how we're defined in life, by our issue. I mean, you can go through other people with physical issues in John chapter nine, there's the man born blind. We don't know what his name is, but we know his issue. There's the leper in Mark 1, the deaf and mute man in Mark 7. Scripture's full of people that so identified with their issue that they no longer remembered their name. They only remembered their issue. Now, I know I've come to the Grove tonight and none of you have any issues.

[Signa Coleman]

And the issue is that you have got.

[Christine Caine]

But I'm talking about your girlfriend that's not here tonight.

[Signa Coleman]

You know, the one with all the issues. Cause we don't think we've got any. But if I just ask your friend, they'll quickly tell me about your issue. Cause we go around and we go,

[Christine Caine]

well, you know, don't tiptoe around her. Cause she's got an anger issue.

[Signa Coleman]

And you're like, I'm fine.

[Christine Caine]

You know. No, don't say.

[Signa Coleman]

Don't press that button or you're going to spark that issue. And we get to a point where all we do is tweet and text and talk about our issue. That we no longer remember that we are daughters of the King. We are defined by issue. We've forgotten our name. And we talk about our issues. And we sit on the porch around our pools and murmur and grumble and complain and talk about. You don't know what they did to me. You don't know what happened to me.

[Christine Caine]

And we talk about our issues. And that's what happened here. I've come to the Grove. Yes, I did probably invite myself, but I really believe it's the timing of God. I came here with such a passion as I was writing this. Cause I've come for someone that's been hiding behind your issue. I don't know what it might be. It might be a broken marriage. It might be someone hurt you, someone offended you, something happened in some other place at some other time. But whatever it is, you've been so identified, you got a certain diagnosis, someone spoke a certain thing over your life. Someone said, you're dumb, you're stupid, you'll never amount to anything. Something happened in your life and you

[Signa Coleman]

have relabelled yourself in your mind. And you no longer Identify as a daughter of the King.

[Christine Caine]

You identify as a woman that has an issue. Oh, and chicks are great with their issues issues. And so here in the text, we see that in the midst of all of that, Jesus turns up and there's one. I've come for the One tonight.

[Signa Coleman]

There was one man, there was one in the multitudes. Scripture tells us multitudes, not just one. Multitudes were there by the pool of Bethesda. But Jesus came looking for the One. Often he would talk to crowds and he's looking for the one. No matter what I do, I'm looking for the one. Whether, you know, we have 15, a 21 officers in 13 countries, but I'm always looking for the one. There might be 40 million slaves, but I'm looking for the one. I come to meetings like this, it's not about the crowds. I'm looking for the one because there's someone here tonight that wants to leave their issue behind and get on and walk forward with the Lord Jesus Christ. I've come looking for a woman that wants to get rid of her issues. A woman that says, I want to

[Christine Caine]

move on from where I am. So Jesus comes to this pool and he's looking for this one. And this one dude, the Bible says

[Signa Coleman]

was lying by the pool 38 years. It's a long time. 38 years is longer than Jesus actually lived. Jesus lived for 33 years. This man was lying by a pool for longer than Jesus Christ was alive. He was lying by that pool. Can you imagine what that was? 38 years.

[Christine Caine]

I made them get this because I've got issues with germs. Anyone that knows me knows that that's true.

[Signa Coleman]

38 years. Can you imagine? The dude's lying here, 38 years, he's looking at that water. 38 years. There is nothing that will torture or torment you more than being able to

[Christine Caine]

see something you just can't get into.

[Signa Coleman]

Seeing a glimpse of your future, seeing a glimpse of what God's got for you. And you can see it there. But you, you can't get to it

[Christine Caine]

because of your issue. 38 years lying there. 38 years hiding behind his issue.

[Signa Coleman]

38 years turning up to church, listening to sermons, reading the Word, looking at the promise that God has, but thinking

[Christine Caine]

that your issue has disqualified you from laying a hold of the promise of God. So, so many of us, like that man, lie, looking at the promise, never stepping into it because of our issues. And we've so become accustomed to them. And we're so comfortable with our issue that we think it's never gonna change or we don't want to. And it's interesting to me that Jesus walks into this scenario.

[Signa Coleman]

He comes to the man at the mat, on the mat, and says to him the most unpastoral thing you could

[Christine Caine]

ever say to anybody.

[Signa Coleman]

Jesus says to him, do you want to be healed? Now, today, if one of us did that, we would be slandered all over Twitter.

[Christine Caine]

Christine Caine has no compassion. She walked into a lame man and said, do you want to be healed? I mean, honestly, can't she see how broken he is?

[Signa Coleman]

Can't she see that he's been like that since birth? It's not his fault. Can't she see there's a reason for him lying on the mat? Can't she see the science? Can't she see the history? Can't she understand the psychology? Doesn't she get the medicine? Oh, she is so

[Christine Caine]

not compassionate. She's so not loving. And Jesus walks into a multitude of invalids and asks the question, do you want to be healed? Because Jesus will always get to the root of the issue. Jesus is not going to placate you in your issue. He's not going to comfort you in your issue. He's going to comfort you in your distress and pull you out of that into your future. Make no mistake. But he is not going to enable your issue. He is not going to say, you

[Signa Coleman]

don't have an issue.

[Christine Caine]

It's very quiet in this Presbyterian church right now. I'm just going to move over to this side of the room. I'm moving over to. You're the holy ones over here, in fact, in the overflow room. That's where I feel the anointing right now. I know you're shouting me down over there.

[Signa Coleman]

And so Jesus was asking him, do you want to be healed? He wasn't saying, do you think I love you if you lie on the mat, my love for you? Of course I do. But I'm asking you, do you want to be healed? The question to our generation in 2018 is, do you want to be healed? Because a lot of us, we don't want to be healed.

[Christine Caine]

Oh, no.

[Signa Coleman]

Because with healing comes responsibility. You all know my story.

[Christine Caine]

That I came from a background of 12 years of abuse and was left in a hospital unnamed and unwanted, and found out I was adopted at 33,

[Signa Coleman]

grew up second generation migrant Greek and

[Christine Caine]

the poorest zip code in my state. So marginalized because of my ethnicity, my gender.

[Signa Coleman]

Oh, it was easy to be a victim. Cause people feel sorry for you.

[Christine Caine]

Oh, poor Christine. Christine, stay on that mat. We so understand that you were abused, Christine. So, man, I understand it.

[Signa Coleman]

I get it.

[Christine Caine]

So I understand why you can't submit to any male authority, Christine. I so understand why you wouldn't want to be in one church, Christine, because I know what men did to you.

[Signa Coleman]

I so understand.

[Christine Caine]

Oh, yeah. We love people right out of their destiny. And we love people right out of their purpose. And we love people right out of their healing. Oh, Christine, I know how hard it was for you. And you were so marginalized as an immigrant in Australia. And I was where they used to write, go back to your own effin country in graffiti on my house. We had to put bars on our house, broken into all the time, called the worst names you could ever imagine because of our ethnicity. And I could be lying on the mat. You don't know what happened to me. And I went to the worst school. The school that rated lowest in all of Australia for all of our academics. We rated awesome when it came to, you know, drug dealing and teenage pregnancy. We did so good on all that. But we were rated the lowest on any academics. Well, Christine, you know, it wasn't your fault. You didn't get the right education. You didn't speak English until you were five. You grew up in the poorest zip code in New South Wales, third poorest zip code in the whole country. You grew up in government housing, Christine. It's not your fault. And, man, you were sexually abused for 12 years. So, Christine, I'm just gonna get on this mat with you, and we're just gonna lie here, we're gonna tweet about it, and, you know, maybe we'll even graduate to Facebook. And, you know, I don't even know.

[Signa Coleman]

We might even take a selfie and

[Christine Caine]

put it on Instagram because we want

[Signa Coleman]

to lie by this pool of Bethesda. Because I so understand what put you on the mat. I so resonate with what put you

[Christine Caine]

on the mat, Christine.

[Signa Coleman]

And it's not fair. And we're just gonna spend our whole time on this earth talking about what got you on the mat. And we're gonna lose sight of the one that came to get you off the mat. And Jesus comes and says, do you wanna be healed?

[Christine Caine]

Because, Chris, if you do get healed, see, I've got a future for you. And it involves rescuing the victims of human trafficking. So that's.

[Signa Coleman]

Hang on.

[Christine Caine]

If you lie on the mat, Chris, it'll be easier. Cause you could just be the victim. People feel sorry for you. But, see, if you get up Then you're gonna. And I heal you. Then responsibility comes with that because I put potential in you and I've put purpose on the inside of you. So you're gonna have to develop that potential. You're gonna have to develop that purpose. You're gonna have to deal with a lot of the brokenness that would stop you from doing what God's called you to do. Now, I've got thousands and potentially tens of thousands of women and children that you know that. That their freedom is contingent on you getting off the mat. But you know what? If I was the devil, I'd want to keep you on the mat, and I'd want you keeping talking about that mat, and I'd want you to keep talking about what got you on the mat. Because, you see, you're already saved, and that's okay.

[Signa Coleman]

But there's a whole lot of people

[Christine Caine]

in bondage, and if I can get your eyes off them and get you on your past and what happened to you, then you're not going to be able to affect anyone else. And Chris, I've got Propel and I've got arenas and I've got hundreds of thousands of women. And then tomorrow night I'll go and we'll do that, and I'll talk to women in 55 countries that are running chapters. But, Christine, if you stay on the mat, then I can stop you from doing that. We've got 12 chapters, I think, now in Pakistan. But, Christine, I don't want you to

[Signa Coleman]

reach those women in Pakistan. So stay on the mat and get everyone else with you and build a hashtag around it so you know who your porch is. And Christine, I want you to talk about that and I want you to keep going on about that, because then when you're not talking about Jesus, the one that'll get you off the mat. And so are you willing to be healed? I think that's a question to the body of Christ. Right now, Jesus is saying to us, look, church, do you want to be healed? Are you willing to take on the responsibility of getting off the mat? Are you willing to take on the responsibility of healing and wholeness? Because there's a world that is waiting for us to get off, metaphorically speaking, our mats and get off that porch and go into a lost and a broken world with the love and the grace and the mercy and the compassion and the justice and the truth and the. And the freedom that can only be found in and through Jesus Christ? Are you willing to give up your

[Christine Caine]

current way of life? Are you Willing to move on from groups of people? Are you willing to step out from the unfamiliar to the familiar? Are you willing to let go of the unforgiveness and the bitterness and the resentment and the shame and the guilt and the condemnation and the anger and the greed and the lust and the selfishness? Are you willing to be healed? Jesus asks us what he asked this man. I mean, if Jesus was on our pastoral care team, we'd fire him. He wouldn't have a job in most churches because imagine if he just walked in. We think there's no empathy. Jesus doesn't have any compassion because we've confused and we have misunderstood what love is and we've misunderstood what compassion is and what mercy is. And we need to have scripture to understand what these terms are because they lead to healing and wholeness. Thank God I had people that didn't

[Signa Coleman]

just get on the mat with me, but got me up off the mat

[Christine Caine]

and helped me be propelled into my God given future and my God given destiny.

[Signa Coleman]

We will forever jump into pits to pull people out, but when you jump into staying with them, you are not helping them. You are now both lost in darkness and everyone else that's on the other side of your obedience is not being reached or helped or set free or being given an opportunity for salvation. There are destinies at stake. There are souls at stake. There is freedom at stake. There is a loss world that is depending on us getting up off our mats

[Christine Caine]

and walking. So I've come to ask you the question on our last gathering before the summer, do you want to be healed? Do you want to be healed? And so what happens? This dude, he's lying here.

[Signa Coleman]

This is us, Jesus, the Messiah, the one that can heal us, comes and says, do you want to be healed? Every Sunday we sit under the Word and have the opportunity for wholeness and healing and growing and maturing. Jesus calls us to maturity. There's nowhere in scripture that talks about an evolving faith, that talks about a maturing faith. We are called to mature, to grow up, up and become mature in the things of God.

[Christine Caine]

Maturity comes with wholeness and healing. Immaturity comes with lying on a mat, murmuring, grumbling and complaining about what got you on the mat. I want you to understand this, what scripture says Jesus, the Messiah, the healer comes and says, do you want to be healed?

[Signa Coleman]

The dude does not say yes. Can you believe that? I mean, seriously, that's like us. The dude doesn't say yes. 38 stinking years he's been on that match and Jesus comes and says, do you want to be healed? And this is what he does. And we all do that. We start with our excuses. His answer is, there's no one to put me in the pool. That's us. We're coming to church. Pastor preaches a life giving, liberating word from the scripture. But the whole time they're preaching, we're

[Christine Caine]

thinking about why this doesn't apply to me. Oh, if they just knew. Well, I know Christine Caine was left

[Signa Coleman]

abandoned and unnamed and unwanted.

[Christine Caine]

I know she was sexually abused. I know she was from a poor background and immigrant.

[Signa Coleman]

And I know it was. But you.

[Christine Caine]

But that's okay for her. Cause Jesus can heal her. But that's just not my personality type. Chris is just a high D. I mean, she's obviously an eight on the enneagram. And Jesus can only heal high Ds and eights. And you know, that kind of healing. Well, that's not really my love language. No, no, it's not my love language. We write Christian books to excuse Christians from being Christians. It's awesome. It's just amazing to me there is only one love language. It's called die to self. But anyway, that's another sermon for the next time I invite myself to the grove. Just so that you all know,

[Signa Coleman]

I

[Christine Caine]

need you to know. Freedom is not an enneagram number. Freedom is not a personality type.

[Signa Coleman]

Freedom is not a love language.

[Christine Caine]

There's actually freedom is not contingent on

[Signa Coleman]

anything I am or you are.

[Christine Caine]

Freedom is actually a blood type. It's the blood of Jesus Christ of Nazareth.

[Signa Coleman]

It sets people free. It sets people free.

[Christine Caine]

And so the dude goes. He doesn't say, yes, we walk out of church and we walk out of women's gatherings and we do 150,000 Bible studies and nothing's changed. Still in bondage.

[Signa Coleman]

Still got my issue. You don't understand. So if I just adjust scripture, then it'll be easier. Cause I've still got my issue.

[Christine Caine]

And so he goes on and he says, there's no one to put me in the pool. The one that can get him up off the mat is standing right there. But he's still looking at someone to put him in the pool. And every time we open this word and every time we come into the presence of God, there's the opportunity for you to leave. Different every time. Some change is incremental. Not everything is an instant zap. But you can be different every time. A little bit, Little bit, little bit. And the fact is that when you've been lying on the Mat for a really long time. It's really hard to get your hopes up when you face constant disappointment. I really wrote my book unexpected for that reason. Because I couldn't believe how many people were unraveling when unexpected events happened. As if somehow God fell off his throne because there was a shift in government or because there was a cyclone or because Wall street dropped a few points, or Mr. Dow Jones. I don't even know who he is. But anyway, he just. Whoever he is. Because he depressed you. Cause he went down three points. Sounds like my hormone levels. Anyway, so it's just. But here's the deal. That when unexpected stuff happens, that's called life. That's called life. We get unexpected sickness diagnosis. But some of us have been lying by that pool and go, I'm giving up believing for my healing. Because, man, I'm giving up believing that this marriage can be restored. Because I've been lying by that pool for 38 years. My perspective is one of total hopelessness. Believing for my kids to come back to God. I've just given up on that because they're just so far away from God. And God. I didn't expect you to disappoint me like this. Cause I raised them in the house of God, and now they're not walking with you. I've been lying by this pool, God. I've been morally upright. I've been serving at church. And I've just been believing you to bring me a husband. And now I'm 40 and I'm still the president of the Singles Till Rapture Club. And I don't want to be any longer. And all the single girls. And God.

[Signa Coleman]

I even went to the singles meeting twice. And I didn't find a husband. And you said if I went once, but I went twice. So now I'm gonna go down the nightclub and find my own.

[Christine Caine]

And God's like, I'm so scared. Well, why go to the nightclub when you can go to Tinder? But anyway, that's another sermon. Y' all are so glad we're breaking for the summer, aren't you? There's a spirit in the air. Because we do not war against flesh and blood, but against powers and principalities. I need you to remember that we're in a spiritual battle. So you need to understand what's happening. There's a spirit in the air that's making women think that you can't be made. Well, making women think that you can't be made whole. Making us think that we're just victims and that we can't be victors or more than conquerors. Through Christ Jesus who strengthened us, there's a spirit that's telling you there's no use getting up because it's not going to make any difference to your life. So we'd rather gather around porches with people that will enable us in our dysfunction rather than come to our Jesus who will make us whole and functional so that we could be fruitful on the earth. Because it is to our Father's great glory that we bear much fruit. When you're lying on a mat, lame and crippled, identified by your issue, you're not bearing fruit and God's not getting any glory. It is to our Father's great glory that we bear not just a little bit, but much fruit. And every one of us is called to be fruit bearers. If you are born again and you've been sealed with this holy Spirit of God until the day of redemption, you are on the planet to bear fruit. Whatever your vocation, whatever your season is, whether you're married or single, have children or don't have children, wherever you are, we are here to bear fruit for the glory of God and to expand the kingdom of God on planet Earth. That's what we are here to do. The band can come up, and if

[Signa Coleman]

you don't complain because there's no one else to put you in the pool, he still hasn't said yes. I want to be made whole. The second excuse is someone else got in before me. It's not my fault. God, I turned up and they picked

[Christine Caine]

someone else to serve at church.

[Signa Coleman]

It's not my fault. I turned up and I tried, but, man, I'm still single and they all got married. You know, your friends just want you to stay on the porch with them. Think about all you single girls. And it's amazing. Everyone's on the porch and we're all, like, bashing guys together. What do they call it, like, man?

[Christine Caine]

Yeah, that too.

[Signa Coleman]

Whatever it is. But when you're talking about, like, the

[Christine Caine]

way men are explaining everything nowadays, we see you all know that's dangerous. But anyway.

[Signa Coleman]

But there's like this anti. I'm like, what are you going on

[Christine Caine]

about, this anti man thing?

[Signa Coleman]

I love men.

[Christine Caine]

One in particular.

[Signa Coleman]

But there's this whole deal. And you know, your girls are like, yeah, poor us.

[Christine Caine]

But just wait till one of you gets a boyfriend or you'll see how happy your friends are for you. Because people hate you to start getting well. Oh, no, no, no. You start getting healed, you start going to a church that's alive. You start really getting into the Word. You really start getting off your mat. They're gonna try to pull you back on the mat because they want to enable their own dysfunction. So stay here on the mat with me. Just try to get well and see what starts to happen. People love you to stay back. So you're gonna have to make a decision at some point. The biggest decision for most Christians in the day in which we're living is to make have the guts to get up and say, I'm stepping out of this crowd. You can all be murmuring, grumbling, complaining. You can all be full of fear and doubt and negativity. But you know what? There was a certain amount, at least a million people that did laps around Mount Sinai for 40 years and then dropped dead in the desert because they murmured, grumbled and complained. As for me and my house, I'm going into my promised land in Jesus name. I'm going into my promised land in Jesus name. And so you can complain.

[Signa Coleman]

Someone else got in before me. It wasn't my fault. I didn't get a good start. I didn't ask to be conceived in iniquity. I didn't ask to be left in a hospital, unnamed. I didn't ask to get adopted into an environment where then I was abused for 12 years and I could spend all my life on earth saying, I didn't ask for that. God, wasn't my fault. Did I ask to be born that way? Did I ask to be abused? Did I? I could. I would spend all my life on

[Christine Caine]

the mat talking about all of that, and so many of us do.

[Signa Coleman]

God, it's not my fault. I got no one to put me in, no one to give me a lift up. God, it's not my fault everyone else

[Christine Caine]

got in before me. I didn't get the right start. It's not my fault.

[Signa Coleman]

But there has to come a point in your life where you make a

[Christine Caine]

decision that you know what. I'm gonna make what Jesus did for me bigger than what they did to me.

[Signa Coleman]

I'm going to make what Jesus did for me bigger than what they said about me. I'm going to make what Jesus did for me. I'm going to make Calvary my defining moment. I'm not going to make what happened to me in my past the thing that dictates my entire life on this earth. Jesus Christ came from heaven to earth, died on a cross, shed his blood, rose again from the dead so that we do not need to live as Christ victims from our past. We could be more than conquerors through Christ Jesus who strengthened us. There is resurrection power on the inside of us. The same spirit that raised Jesus Christ from the dead lives on the inside of you and me. You do not have to stay on that mat. You can rise, you can pick up your mat, and you can begin to walk. Jesus said to him, I want you to get up and I want you to pick up the thing that was carrying you. I want you to begin to carry the thing that was carrying you. I want you to use it to bring freedom and hope and liberty and life to a lost and a broken world.

[Christine Caine]

Jesus made him do what he couldn't do. Hear me, girls.

[Signa Coleman]

In the overflow flow, it is not a lack of compassion when men and women of God come and stir you for greatness, when we task you to do something you don't think you can do. Jesus asked a layman to do something that was impossible. I'm asking a generation, through the power of the Lord Jesus Christ, to show a world that Jesus is alive by picking up our mats and carrying the thing that once carried us and walking with strength and life and liberty.

[Christine Caine]

And the legalists and the religious people that don't believe in the power of God to heal will want to put you back on that mat. Why'd he do that? It's a Sabbath. They were more concerned about how it was done than what was done. Miss the whole miracle. Miracles are happening around us every day. But you know what? If you spend all your time reading Twitter and not the Bible, you'll miss the miracles and you'll stay on the mat for the rest of your life. That's what's going to happen. That's what's going to happen. And then Jesus went into the temple and found the man. I need you to understand that healing will open up opportunities for you that the mat will never give you. The man that had for four decades of his life laid by the pool suddenly had access to the temple. You don't even know what's in your future. You don't even know what opportunities God will open for you. The access to places that are currently closed to you because you're sitting on

[Signa Coleman]

a mat and Jesus is saying, there's a temple for you. I've got opportunity for you. I've got doors for you. You don't even know.

[Christine Caine]

Jesus went to the trouble of walking into the temple to tell this man a very important thing that our generation needs to hear. He said to him, make sure you don't keep sinning. Yes, yes, come as you are. But I'm never going to leave you how you are. I'm going to take you to a place that is exceedingly, abundantly above and beyond anything you could ever ask, hope, or think. Do you remember where else Jesus said that to the woman caught in the act of adultery. Ah. I don't condemn you. Love you, Grace, Mercy. But by the way, if you don't want to end up back on the mat, go and sin no more. Because I'll tell you the two things that will keep you on the mat. Legalism will always try to keep you on the mat. Legalistic religion will tell you that there is no power. Accept your condition, accept your identity, and sit on the mat for the rest of your life. That's what legalism will do. But I'll tell you what else will keep you on the mat. License to sin will keep you on that mat. If you think that there are no consequences for disobeying God, then don't wonder why you're not fulfilling the purpose that God has for your life. Because God has so much more for you. And. And he says, don't sin anymore.

[Signa Coleman]

Is it just about you? No.

[Christine Caine]

Why am I talking with such conviction? I feel this, obviously very strongly because

[Signa Coleman]

it's about more than us.

[Christine Caine]

We had Mother's Day yesterday. You saw a picture of my girls. You know, the work that I'm doing with Propel and a 21.

[Signa Coleman]

None of that would exist. I wouldn't be married.

[Christine Caine]

I wouldn't have kids. I was so messed up.

[Signa Coleman]

I was so messed up.

[Christine Caine]

You don't even know all the sin that I committed, all the dysfunctional relationships I was in.

[Signa Coleman]

You don't even know. Today's society would tell me, Chris, there's no hope. They would rather keep me on the mat bound than tell me that there's a savior that can set me free. And on the other side of it, there was a family that was 821. There's Propel, this, whatever the Lord's called me to do. And on the other side of your obedience, there's people. There's a lost world. There's 8 billion people on this planet.

[Christine Caine]

You know, I went on a. I spoke at a conference in England, and my major is in English. So, you know, I did years of Shakespeare, so I was speaking in a place called Bedworth. And near Bedworth is another place called Stratford Upon Avon, which is where Shakespeare wrote most of his plays and lived. And so I thought, you know what? I'm so close, I'm gonna Go and visit Willie. I always wanted to go to Willie's house, and I was hoping Willie was home. And so I went to visit Willie, but he wasn't there. But my husband Nick is. You know, he's the 14th of 15 children. And I know his mother had 15 full term pregnancies in 17 years. Like, seriously, no television in that part of Australia. And she could have been a good American Southern mama. Anyway, so in the midst of all of that, Nick is British and I'm Greek, so you could imagine the fireworks. And so. But this was at the time of the royal wedding. So I thought, you know what, maybe Nick is keeping a secret from me. Maybe Nick is really royalty. Maybe he is kind of connected to royalty. Maybe he's got a secret Downton Abbey house somewhere. Maybe, you know, he's a lord or a baron or a knight. I don't know. You know, I thought, maybe I'll get a wedding invitation. I was so pumped.

[Signa Coleman]

So I went into.

[Christine Caine]

There was this genealogy shop across from Willie's house. So I went to the genealogy shop and Nick's last name, Cain. I typed in the name Cain and I'm waiting for Lord Baron Knight. Okay?

[Signa Coleman]

And instead of that, it spits out this chart.

[Christine Caine]

No word of a lie. It says, pirates, convicts, criminals, murderers, thieves. That's how they ended up in Australia on those convict ships. That's how they got there.

[Signa Coleman]

So I'm walking down the street, cracking

[Christine Caine]

myself up and I'm going, gee, I'm married. Well, great bloodline. Awesome, awesome. And then I started to laugh even more because I thought about my family and I thought, well, there's my background, you know, there's adultery and fornication and incest and divorce and brokenness and shame and guilt and all that.

[Signa Coleman]

I can't change it. That stuff could keep me on the mat if I wanted to let it do that. You and I cannot change the past.

[Christine Caine]

Not even our own mistakes.

[Signa Coleman]

But I was thinking, as I was

[Christine Caine]

walking down that street in Stratford Upon

[Signa Coleman]

Avon, I was thinking, imagine when my daughters grow up and they go to a genealogy shop and they put in

[Christine Caine]

the name Cain and it's going to

[Signa Coleman]

spit out this family tree. And, man, it's going to look pretty

[Christine Caine]

brutal in the generations gone by. Thieves and convicts and pirates and criminals and murderers and incest and adultery and fornication. Just everything. Divorce, brokenness, addiction.

[Signa Coleman]

But then they're going to. As they're reading it, they're going to

[Christine Caine]

get to this weird thing.

[Signa Coleman]

Suddenly in that family tree, they're going

[Christine Caine]

to see 30 March 1996, Nicholas Joseph Kane marries Holy Ghost terrorist Christine Caine.

[Signa Coleman]

And although we could do nothing to do change the past, that past does not need to keep you on the map. Because on the 30th of March 1996, Nick and I, we drew a bloodline in the sand. And we said, with us, adultery stops. With us, addiction stops. With us, divorce stops. With us, it stops. Abuse stops. Fornication stops. Every form of alcoholism, poverty. With us, it stops. You cannot change the past, but you can change the future. So today at the Grove, I say to you, get up, pick up your mat and walk in Jesus name. Be free in Jesus name, Be free in Jesus name.

[Podcast Host]

What a powerful reminder that our past does not have to define our future. Through the power of Jesus, we can leave behind the things that have kept us stuck and step into freedom with him. If today's message encouraged you, make sure to subscribe to the Grove Podcast and download this episode so you never miss what we're up to. For more from Christine Caine, you can follow her at Christine Cain on Instagram Graham and learn more about her ministry through A21 and Propel Women. Thanks for spending time with us today, girls, and we'll see you next time on the Grove Podcast.