← The How To Podcast Series - Podcast Co-Hosts, Practical Podcast Tips, and Podcast Community
The How To Podcast Series - Podcast Co-Hosts, Practical Podcast Tips, and Podcast Community
E685 - Podcasters, Make The Podcast That People Want to Hear, Not Just What You Want to Make
00:20:16
Loading summary
Transcript1 lines
- [00:00]
A
Okay, we're rolling. Hey, welcome back to the how to Podcast series. It's Dave with you. Hope you're doing well. I was listening to a podcast because I listen at work and I'm not looking at my screen. And when I was listening to this show, it was the new media show. It was a past archived episode a long time ago. Todd and Rob were there as the hosts, and they had Tom Webster on, who's the author of the Audiences Listening. Great book. Definitely go buy it. Have it with you all at all times. It's kind of like your manual to podcasting, I would say, and it'll serve you really well. When Todd. When Tom was on the show with Todd and Rob, Tom was talking about something that really stuck out to me, and I thought it was really interesting. I wanted to share with you. He brought up this point that making that we as podcasters, we need to make the show that people want to hear, not just the show that we want to make people want. We have to make the show that people want to hear, not just the show that we, as podcasters, want to make. There has to be a need for the content. There has to be a desire for somebody to be interested in what you have to say. You can pick an obscure topic and talk about it, but if nobody cares, then it's going to be hard to grow your show. It's going to be hard to reach an audience if what you're talking about has no relevance for anybody or a very small group. And I just. I love the idea that in Tom's book and through his conversations in podcasting, is that we as podcasters, we have this opportunity to reach an amazing audience and to build something meaningful and strong simply by how we show up and how we create the things that will resonate with an audience. I really think that's super important. We have to have an audience first mindset and all that we do in podcasting. Let's talk more about this. I'm glad you're here. There's a balance here, right? I do want to create something that I love as a creator that I'm passionate about, but at the same time, I also want people to actually listen to this. That's the balance that we need here in podcasting in our lives. As podcasters, you can't just chase what you think will be popular, but you also can't close your ears or pretend that nobody is listening to this. There's two extremes most podcasters seem to lean into. On the one side, it's, I'm going to make the show that I want to listen to in that mindset. It's all about what I'm interested in as a host. I don't care if anybody listens to this. I want to talk about this. That's one side. This is where podcasters pick a topic that's super personal, like and very specific. And you know, they're only going to talk about the yellow Lego blocks. Like a podcast about yellow Lego blocks. Wow, that's super specific. Very niche of you. Yes. And it's their obsession. Just the yellow ones, not the white ones, the red ones or the any other color, just yellow. Let's just do a podcast about the yellow. Very limited audience, I would think, and very limited outreach for that episode because it's so specific. Right. If it's fun for you and your family and that one friend who feels obligated to subscribe to your show, great for your self expression, but really hard to grow an audience. So when somebody comes to me and they're like, I want to do this very super specific content for this very specific person and I want to have a hundred thousand downloads. Those don't work together. You're never going to be in the top 100% of any top 100 shows of anything. You're not going to be a listen note score. You're not going to be any of those things when you have a very super specific topic. So keep that in mind. On the other side of this is the all make what's trending mindset. I was working with a podcaster and they came to me and said, I want to do a podcast. What should I talk about? Oh my God, it's a warning sign. They said, I googled and said, you know, what's popular and what's trendy right now? I just want to find something that's going to be super viral and I'll just talk about that. And they threw out a couple ideas about some things that were like newsworthy in the moment. I said to them a couple things first, do you think that you can talk about this for an extended period of time, like more than a few weeks? Because you know, news cycles, they come and go. Is this going to be relevant a year from now, two years from now, five years from now? And then the other part was just asking them, do you actually care about this topic? And they're like, well, actually no, I really don't care about about this at all. I just, it's just trendy and I want to just capitalize on what's happening in the news. And I'm like, well, you're gonna. You're gonna get bored of the topic if that's not what you're passionate about. Like, people are gonna hear it in your voice that you're just kind of clocking in and doing the thing. I've heard podcasters who jump on trends just to be. To catch the wave and to ride that wave into the sunset, and they generally abandon their podcast over time. When you chase every new topic and you copy every popular format or trend or whatever and try to make it sound like the podcast, that's your baby, but it's really. You have no interest in what you're talking about. You might get attention for a minute, but it can actually feel really inauthentic over time. And it's actually quite exhausting for you and the audience. I think the sweet spot is somewhere in the middle. Make a podcast that you want to make, but that someone else actually wants to hear. In a world of AI, you're competing with AI podcasts now created by AI, voiced by AI and posted out into the world in a flood of content. And it's all quite boring. It's all devoid of any human humanity and just feels like. It feels like candy after a while. Sure, great when you first try it, but after a while you're like, I can't live on candy. I want to live on candy. But you can't. You can't create something that's in demand. Not just on demand. When we talk about creating something that's in demand, the best way to find out what's in demand is go to your search engine, go to your AI model, whatever you're using, and look up what people are searching for. And then ask yourself some simple questions before you. Before you move any further with your podcast. What. What questions are people asking about my topic, my genre, my niche right now? What are they? What questions are they looking for answers to? And then what topics come up again and again in comments? As I work with people, as I talk to listeners, as I'm out in the community, and I rub shoulders with the people who would be my ideal audience? What am I hearing online, in forums, on. On social media, on YouTube speakers and authors? What's going on in the space that's really important? And then what are people curious about? What are people talking about? Where are the gaps in information? What are people doing that I could do better? I feel like they're missing something, and I feel like I can fit that gap. All of these things help you to position yourself to focus on what's in demand, not just what's on demand. We need to find the overlap between passion and need. As podcasters, a powerful way to think about this is that simple overlapping circle thing, the Venn diagrams you hear people talk about. We have a circle on the left and the circle on the right. And where they overlap, that little spot in the middle where the two circles kind of COVID each other, there's like this spot where they interact. That's where you should be focusing. Right circle one could be on the left, could be you're genuinely interested in this topic. And circle on the right could be simply what people are actually asking for and where those two kind of converge over top of each other and touch each other. That's the spot that you should be focusing in on. That's the sweet spot where they overlap. You talk about something that you care about, but you frame it in a way that solves a problem or answers somebody's curiosity. You become the go to for the people in your space because you're passionate about the space. You're not just creating content because it's trendy. You're creating it because you love it. It's going to show in everything you do. That's how you build a podcast that people actually want to hear, not just one that people just make because they want to make a podcast. You need to be focused on your audience. How do you test if your concept is in demand? Like, how do you even do that? First of all, when you're talking about testing whether or not your concept is actually in demand, you don't need to guess. You need to check. Stop guessing. Start checking. Listen to comments on other podcasts in your niche, like, focus in on what's happening in the space. Go through Reddit feeds and Facebook groups and discord channels, whatever you got. Run a quick poll and ask 10 people in your circle, in your ideal audience, what. What's the one thing you wish someone would explain about? I know I'm old when I say, but, yeah, fill in the blank, right? If you hear the same question three or four times, you just found a topic for an episode, your audience is going to tell you. And what I find a little bit annoying is when podcasters create a show and then they lament that they don't hear from their audience. But I ask them, have you gone out to talk to your audience? And they're like, no, I just wait for them to reach out to me. You're going to be waiting a long time, long Time. So I have a dad podcast. Going to a dad event makes sense. My ideal audience are dads. So any kind of dad thing, I should be there. I have an author podcast. I'm going to be going to this author. There's an author event happening in my community. There's going to be a bunch of authors coming, book signings, speakers, and I'm going to be the only podcaster in the room with a table. It's going to cost me $75 to set up my table, put out some business cards and have my mic, my headphones. And I'm just going to talk to listeners who love authors and books because they can hear my show. And I'm going to talk to authors about being on my show as a guest. I'm the only podcaster in the room. Be the only podcaster in your the room for your niche, your area, your genre, your group, your community. Be that and you will find topics galore because you're with your people. Podcasters make the podcast that you want to make, but don't ignore the fact that the audience is listening. As Tom Webster's book talks about, make the show that you believe in. You really believe in this. You believe in your content. You believe passion for it, but make it for the people who actually are out there searching and asking and curious about what you want to talk about and ready to press play on your podcast. Great content will always gather a crowd. It will because you have your finger on the pulse on what's happening in the world. And your show is a place where people gather. And when you align your passion with what people want to hear, you're not selling out, you're actually tuning in. And that's the main thing that we need to do as podcasters. Tom Webster, the audience is listening. Great book. Again, I have it next to me at all times. It's in with our with it within arm's reach for any time I'm working with anybody. And when I work with people one on one, it's one of the required readings I have for them. And if you want to work with me, you got to read the book first or listen to the audiobook. There is a test. I'm going to make sure that you actually did what you said you did because it covers so much that we can then move past all that other stuff that Tom covers so well and we can focus on really what you need for your show. So if you want to work with me in the future, if you want to skip the line, get the audio version Which I love because Tom is very cheeky and fun, and it's a great pot rate. Podcast a book to listen to on audible. Grab an audio version, grab the paperback. I got both because I love it so much. But go check out the book if you want to work with me. It's gonna. You have to do it anyway. But yeah, it's a. It's a great resource. Tom Wester. The audience is listening and yeah, let's go create the show that people are looking for, people are anticipating, and that meets a need, because you're going to have a great show. You're going to have great connection with your audience. It's going to resonate, it's going to draw the right people to you, and all of that success and all of those rewarding experiences are going to come as a result of reaching an audience where they are. Right? Do what you can with what you have, where you are. It's what we do in podcasting. Wishing you the best. Take care. Thank you so much for listening to the entirety of the episode, including this part. You know what? A lot of people leave right now, so we'll let them leave. Give them a second to go. Okay, now it's just you and me. We have our meetups that we do for the how to Podcast series. We do them during the week, and we also do them on Saturdays. So twice a week, you have the opportunity to meet other podcasters just like you. Some people have just started. Some people haven't even released an episode yet. Some have been doing it forever. And we get together and talk podcasting. We want to help you in community, to continue with your show, to start your show, to grow your show. So come and meet listeners of this show in one space on meetup.com again through howtopodcast ca. You'll see the links. It's completely free to join. Come whenever you have an opportunity to come. There's no commitment. You don't have to sign any waivers. You can just come join us. Come join the conversation. We'd love to have you there. Because the only thing that's going to make these meetups better is you being there. So I'm hoping you will say yes and you'll say, dave, I'm tired of podcasting by myself. I wish there were people I could connect with that are fellow podcasters and share my frustrations with guests who ghost me. And my editing software is crapping out on me. And I'm just having this hard time. I'm having a hard time coming up with podcasts episodes and titles and all the things. And social media. Wouldn't it be great to get in a room with other podcasters and share best practices and learn? Three of our four Saturdays every month are themed. So you have a topic. Put that last Saturday of every month. It's open. Question and answer. Ask anything. Come meet a podcaster. Come enjoy the podcasting community throughout a podcast. Ca come to our meetups. Can't wait to see you there. You're still here. Amazing. Okay, when we talk about niching down, because we're in Canada, we're outside of the U.S. american friends, which is like 80% of my audience, you would say niche, which is fine, we'll let you. It's fine. You can do whatever you like. Niche, niche, Whatever you like. As you niche down. One of the things I don't think we talk about enough is the fact that you as the podcaster might be the niche. Just you yourself as the creator of your show might actually be the niche. What do I mean by that? I mean that there might be multiple shows that talk about your topic. There are a ton of podcasts about podcasting. Just what happens. And you found this one, which I'm glad you're still here. That's a great sign again to the all the apps that you. You actually enjoy this content because you're still here. So thank you. You actually might be the niche. Your opinions, your view, your outlook, your history, your stories, your education, everything about you makes you one of one. And that actually might be the secret sauce to your podcast. Your podcast doesn't sound like, act like, feel like all the other shows because you're the host of your show. You're not the host of those other shows. So where other people are rude. I know podcasters who podcast about podcasting that are quite rude. Kind of off putting. Not the pudding you eat off putting. They. They're embarrassing and they use some pretty, pretty rude examples of things to try to prove their points. And they like being a little edgy and it's awkward and it's a little gross really. And, and people don't resonate with that. Not everybody resonates with that. So the fact that you are you. If you want to be edgy, be edgy, then go for it. Like do that, do that well, be hilarious, be. Be absurd, be ridiculous, awesome. But for me, I, I don't go that way. I'm trying to reach the broadest audience possible while being as focused as I can be to reach the best possible audience for the show. You might be the niche. Your topic might be talked about in multiple shows but you are actually the thing you need to lean into the most. So be you show Show a side of you that nobody else gets to see. Throwing out content Giving me a list of three things A list of five things. Seven ways to do this four three ways to do that Facts Facts facts Topic topic Content content content Done. Great. That's. That's what I can also get from AI. I need you. I'm here because I like you. So give me a little more of you. Set aside the script from time to time. Focus on the audience and focus on speaking directly to the people that listen to the show. You might be your own niche. Think about that and try to adapt that into your next episode. How can I make this not about me as the host but how can I lean into me to connect better with the audience who is enjoying the podcast? You might be your own niche. Interesting. Need any help at a podcast? Ca talk soon.