← The Human Upgrade: Biohacking for Longevity & Performance
The Human Upgrade: Biohacking for Longevity & Performance
The New SCIENCE of Energy Healing | Biohacking Updated : 1357
00:37:16
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- [00:00]
Harry Massey
When you've had more than three adverse childhood events, or very significant ones, like I had, like you had for sure. On average, there's a 20 year reduction in lifespan. I was basically in a wheelchair. I came across this scientist in Australia. He ended up basically healing me. I wanted to create a home wellness system that could work out how people like me could get better from home.
- [00:26]
Dave Asprey
Harry Massey spent years searching for why the body breaks down and how it heals itself. Today, he's a world leader in bioenergetics, the study of energy and living systems. He's built groundbreaking technologies that read and correct the body's information field to help people rebuild health, strength and purpose.
- [00:42]
You said you can do it digitally and it's wearable.
- [00:45]
Harry Massey
It'll increase the efficiency of energy in the cell by 22%.
- [00:51]
Dave Asprey
The hashtag turning on or off more than a thousand genes and yet a 22% shift in efficiency of converting sugar into electricity or heat just by wearing the correct.
- [01:05]
You're listening to the human upgrade with Dave Asprey. There's a really good chance that you don't get full use of the food that you eat. That's because you're not absorbing it. That's because as you age, even starting in your 20s or if you're stressed, which is pretty much all of us, that means that your enzyme levels drop. And enzymes are what turn your food into its components so your body can make full use of it. It's possible to eat a steak, but really only get half the benefits of the steak. Mast Zymes are full spectrum digestive enzymes that help you break down those proteins, the carbs, the fats, even the fiber. All you gotta do is take it with a meal so you get better digestion. And you can even take it during a fast. And then these enzymes will work on your own tissues to help break up.
- [01:51]
Things that you don't need.
- [01:53]
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- [01:58]
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- [02:02]
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- [03:10]
So you spent seven years in bed, what's that like?
- [03:13]
Harry Massey
It's pretty shocking, honestly, and extremely traumatic. And you lose all of your friends. You half the time don't even know what you're thinking. Pretty much it's like living in a big dark black cloud.
- [03:28]
Dave Asprey
Why did you spend that much time in bed?
- [03:30]
Harry Massey
So I had these three very traumatic experiences when I was 21. The first, I fell ice climbing off Ben Nevis. And ice is very, very brittle. I was ice climbing up, fell, hit a very steep snow slope, fractured my spine. Didn't know I'd fractured my spine at the time, so I just carried on as you do when you're 21. A few months later I went out to the French Alps doing more climbing. That time I got a fever and basically got a viral infection which turned out to be sort of to give me post viral fatigue later. And then the third thing that happened at the same time was a very traumatic emotional thing. I came out as being gay my 21st, but I didn't come out in the normal sense. The boyfriend I had at the time, he wasn't really my boyfriend, turned up uninvited, outed me to all my parents, godparents, family, 120 people. And after that my parents for a time rejected me and how important it was to have a normal life. And I could only be a barman or work in the the. So in that last year of university I went into a bit of a cycle of taking lots of drugs and escapism.
- [04:55]
Dave Asprey
Holy crap. So you had massive physical injury which causes inflammation, you had a viral thing which causes inflammation, fatigue, all that stuff. You had massive emotional trauma which causes inflammation, fatigue. And then you stack some, some drug use on top of that, which isn't always bad, but in the way you were doing it probably wasn't great.
- [05:16]
Harry Massey
Well, it is when you go out on a Friday night, take lots of ecstasy and amphetamine and keep going all throughout the weekend and then by Monday morning, collapse. When you do that for about six months in a row, you're totally toast.
- [05:30]
Dave Asprey
So you toasted yourself in every which way. Okay. And then you ended up in bed.
- [05:34]
Harry Massey
Well, I actually ended up in a wheelchair first because I didn't know what to do with myself. So after university and being fired from my first job, went back out to the Alps, tried to heal myself with all this fresh air and good French food.
- [05:48]
Dave Asprey
Did it work?
- [05:49]
Harry Massey
Totally not. I got so, so exhausted. I ended up going back home. Didn't know what to do so I couldn't work. So I'd already been fired so far. I'd enroll in an mba which when you've been through an mba that was so hard I had to stretch it out over two years and in the final year I was basically in a wheelchair. I did pass through a miracle, but I did do all my exams in a wheelchair and after that I was just totally bed bound back at my parents house.
- [06:20]
Dave Asprey
So I guess they took you back at that point?
- [06:22]
Harry Massey
They did take me back because I think they had no choice and obviously realized, realized I was in a very bad state.
- [06:29]
Dave Asprey
Wow. So what did the doctors tell you was wrong with you?
- [06:33]
Harry Massey
So in England there's no real functional medicine or there wasn't back 30 years ago. So I was under the National Health Service and the statistics, well, they basically don't even believe. They call it yuppie flu. They didn't necessarily know the right blood tests so they just said, they said I was fine. Although after two years of doing blood tests they said oh well there is something wrong these. But they didn't know and you had.
- [06:58]
Dave Asprey
To wait two years to get your first basic blood test anyway because it was, it was the.
- [07:02]
Harry Massey
Well yes, and I was 21 so I didn't have any money to do anything and my, my parents were obviously they didn't learning about holistic health, alternative health. So it took that length of time for me to give up on the conventional system then start seeing nutritionists. I saw nutritionists for like three years. Did every, no, I wouldn't say every type of diets. Not every type of diet existed but like the macrobotic ones and I did the whole vegan fasting thing. I bet that wasn't, that definitely didn't work. But at that point I tried everything for about a year, year and a half to see if it would, what results it would get and then I would change tactic. And yeah, after about six years of changing all these different tactics I sort of came across. Well, I came to the conclusion that I wasn't really studying where energy came from, because every book on chronic fatigue, it's like, well, you have to get rid of the Epstein bar, or you're toxic and you're meant to take all of these pills to get rid of. And I just thought, actually, why don't I study where energy comes from from a positive state instead? And it was that mind shift that got me into the whole space of energy medicine. Dash bioenergetics. In short, I wanted to study where energy actually came from.
- [08:26]
Dave Asprey
We've had very similar paths. I had chronic fatigue and fibromyalgia. I didn't end up in a wheelchair or bedridden, but I'm pretty wrecked. And I also got to that point, like, I want to know where energy comes from. I decided mitochondria. What did you decide energy comes from?
- [08:40]
Harry Massey
You know, that point. I was looking, reading all these books about subtle energy, and I was more thinking about what on earth is controlling energy in the body. And I came across this scientist in Australia, and he'd been mapping out the energy and information fields of the human body. You know, I rang him up and I said, well, actually, a couple of things. I also had this strange idea that I wanted to create a home wellness system that could work out how people like me could get better from home. Because I couldn't travel to doctors. I couldn't actually drive a car at the time. And he liked that idea, and he ended up agreeing to meet. So I flew from England to Los Angeles. He flew from Australia to Los Angeles, spent 10 days together, and he actually started giving me what we now call an emphasutical that will basically imprint information back into the body. And. Very short story. No, it's a very long story short. He ended up basically healing me.
- [09:45]
Dave Asprey
Now, I've probably been the most skeptical of homeopathics or just this whole idea of energy and water for a long time. And then over the course of building the biohacking movement and working with some of the people I respect the very most. One of them was a Johns Hopkins ENT surgeon. So Johns Hopkins surgeons are kind of a big deal. At least I think they are. But he had left his surgical practice because he said, my patients don't get better. They come back two years later with the same problems and ended up having a whole set of homeopathic things. And I spent a lot of time with them in his office. And he said, look, my biggest problem is I never see a patient more than twice. Because they always get better, their allergies go away, their stuff gets fixed. And so I see him in the grocery store and then I hear that it worked. And then he said, dave, you're weird, because I've never had someone come in this number of times and not get better. And so he was the guy who first figured out this is a mold thing and it was multifactorial. But that was the first time, like someone I really respect who has done all the western stuff, who ended up at homeopathy as part of his very broad set of tools that just made me reconsider it. And since that time I've worked with guys like Dietrich Klinghardt who are using lasers and we're using lasers to program stem cells. So there's very clearly something happening with water which does store information. There's all this stuff about crystals and water and all. So I don't have a problem with it now. But I also don't like the idea of having to have a big rack of water, drops of this and drops that. It's just too much work. So you said you can do it digitally. Can you just email me on infoseutical?
- [11:29]
Harry Massey
I mean, it wouldn't be very convenient to email an infosutical spam filter. No, I mean the way we've been thinking about that is actually it's best done through a wearable. And so actually I took, I took these emphasis. Well, that was 24 years ago I first started taking them and obviously you have to take the top off, add them to water, all of, all of that. So it's much better to do it through a wearable and then just. And the great advantage of that is you can get the right emphasical also at the right time of day because you know that there is timing. Like if you want to relax and rest, you want that signal at night. If you want to obviously wake up in the morning, you want that signal in the morning. There's a whole Chinese medicine clock. So every two hours it changes, which is the best information for each meridian. So actually a wearable is a way better way to deliver it.
- [12:25]
Dave Asprey
A lot of people have heard of the circadian rhythm and we think it's a 24 hour cycle. But German medicine, Chinese medicine, Ayurvedic has very complex circadian clocks for every different organ in the body. So totally lines up.
- [12:44]
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- [12:47]
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- [12:50]
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- [12:52]
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- [12:55]
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- [13:02]
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- [13:07]
I actually look forward to taking them.
- [13:09]
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- [13:10]
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- [14:04]
Remember, alcohol is not good for you.
- [14:05]
But you're probably going to drink it. You might as well not take the hits and then you'll feel better tomorrow. I don't drink alcohol very often, but when I do, I have Zebiotics pre alcohol before. In fact, I put it out at parties. If someone brings tequila that way, I know I'm going to wake up the next morning feeling good and so will my guests. This is even more important in the.
- [14:22]
Summer when people tend to drink more and you sweat more.
- [14:25]
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- [14:47]
You talked about doing this at home. So if someone is listening to the show right now and they're bedridden or they just feel like crap all the time the way that we both did, how would you go about diagnosing this using digital technologies or using these I'm just going to say esoteric principles.
- [15:03]
Harry Massey
So for us, it's a combination of using some Chinese esoteric principles with modern physics, but also actually modern blood labs. So what our wearable will do in the app is it'll look at your face and your face contains information from a Chinese medicine perspective. I'll stick out my tongue. But your tongue also contains information, like where it's inflamed in different areas of the tongue that contains information, your voice contains information. But just from the pure wearable perspective, if I read your pulse, I would just put three fingers here and I could basically feel the quality of what, 29 different pulses. So we mapped out those pulses just using a PPG sensor. So the wearable will basically classify it into those 29 pulses. And that gives us really good information about your emotional characteristics, but also organ characteristics. And when you combine all of that, and you can also upload your blood lab data and it'll correlate between Chinese and functional medicine as well.
- [16:13]
Dave Asprey
That's really cool. The first time I heard about this was 2004. I was in Tibet and I would see a Tibetan doctor and same thing, three fingers on the pulse and doing all this stuff, it's not about beats per minute, it's about the quality of the pulse. Kind of like what an EKG does, but even more sensitive. And so you've mapped this out using a digital sensor. So then you're using. Well, actually multiple lineages use the quality of the pulse. So you're measuring that digitally, putting in what, through an AI system?
- [16:43]
Harry Massey
Yeah, I mean, it's basically all based on the shape of a pulse. So, like. Well, I don't know if the screen. A normal pulse looks like that worry pulse has the sort of jagged edge, but yeah, in short, it's the shape that we can classify.
- [16:57]
Dave Asprey
Okay. And that's gonna say what's wrong with me?
- [16:59]
Harry Massey
Yeah.
- [17:00]
Dave Asprey
Does it correlate well with Western labs?
- [17:03]
Harry Massey
Different. Different aspects do. So, yes. Like someone with, like, low. Like low thyroid or something like that, you can see. You can see that in your tongue. You can see in the shape of your pulse. But yes, you can see correlations.
- [17:17]
Dave Asprey
Wow. And how well correlated is it? I mean, have you published studies? Are there studies saying this pulse equals thyroid?
- [17:23]
Harry Massey
I'm going to explain it a little bit differently. So from a Chinese medicine perspective, you know, it's not. It's. They never had blood tests in the first place. So I'll just give you an example of what these pulses mean. So if you looked at a. At A worry pulse, a WIRI pulses correlated to stagnant QI in the liver. And then when we, when you look at the liver, you can then make a correlation between the different emotional characteristics. So someone who's frustrated or angry, it'll show up in the liver. Or if we take a soggy pulse, that's correlated to spleen, that's also correlated to anxiety. And the positive side of that would be faith. So it's more, it's more like you can make these correlations between different organ systems. It's like less so with blood labs.
- [18:13]
Dave Asprey
Okay, so it's more correlated with psychology and emotional stuff. Okay, but you're not going to say my IL6 is high and my LDL is 147.
- [18:22]
Harry Massey
No. However, from an AI perspective, to get a really good health analysis, if you've got the TCM perspective, you've got blood lab perspective from functional medicine, I mean, like, the more inputs you have, the more, the better the overall picture of working out what's going on with your health.
- [18:40]
Dave Asprey
Is there published research on infoceuticals?
- [18:43]
Harry Massey
Yes, we just had a paper published by UCSD and that was looking at. Basically we took our wearable and we put it next to these rat cardiac cells and then tested all the different effects. And what we found is a number of things. Like, one, we could increase the mitre chondrial density by 50%.
- [19:07]
Dave Asprey
50%. Is this Dr. Hamil Patel?
- [19:12]
Harry Massey
Yeah.
- [19:12]
Dave Asprey
Oh, he's been on the show. He's the guy who does the ME screen mitochondrial test that I've been dreaming about forever. And I've actually been to his lab, so. Okay, so he's very legit as a researcher. What did he say? Was he kind of like blown away or was he saying, yeah, we see this all the time.
- [19:27]
Harry Massey
So I met him three and a half, four years ago. You know, I met him at a Joe Dispenza event.
- [19:32]
Dave Asprey
Me too.
- [19:33]
Harry Massey
And, you know, I had, I had lunch with him there. And obviously in that conversation, well, he's, he'd just been on stage explaining about how he was reducing Covid viral penetration into lung tissue. And I just said to him, look, you can do that through an emphaceutical. And he was, he was questioning and skeptical, but he said, just send the emphasuticals off, you know, off to his lab. Took him around four months to get round to it because, you know, I think I was just a. Like a. Probably an annoying fly in his world. But I kept annoying him until he actually did.
- [20:10]
Dave Asprey
Yeah, his lab is legit it's very big.
- [20:13]
Harry Massey
But anyway, he eventually did it and he came back, he said, he rang me, I said, harry, you're right. Actually it beat the meditation effect by a few percent. So that was good. And because if that hadn't happened, he wouldn't have carried on, but because it did, then I was basically able to set up a whole research program and we have like a full time postgrad employed that just, just basically does experiments on a continual basis there using the digital product. We've actually done both. We did the liquid in suitable and the digital, but the results are the same because the liquid in the end, you're imprinting a liquid with a tissue culture. You're imprinting the medium that the tissue culture is living on so that the effect is the same.
- [20:57]
Dave Asprey
Is this the that?
- [20:59]
Harry Massey
Yeah, that's the wearable.
- [21:00]
Dave Asprey
And what's it called?
- [21:01]
Harry Massey
Oh, the gem. That stands for guided energy management.
- [21:04]
Dave Asprey
So this is the gem. How come you haven't given me one?
- [21:07]
Harry Massey
I've got one backstage for you.
- [21:10]
Dave Asprey
All right. And it's e4l.com Dave. Yes, people can. And what do they cost?
- [21:17]
Harry Massey
They cost $400, but there's a 10% discount if you add the code.
- [21:21]
Dave Asprey
Dave.E4L.com Dave. So that puts it down about 360 bucks.
- [21:26]
Harry Massey
Yeah. Okay.
- [21:28]
Dave Asprey
And do you have to pay monthly?
- [21:29]
Harry Massey
You've got a choice. So it will do all the detect side and it. You can also manually correct yourself and that's just included in the price. If you want to do it in a subscription where it's basically looking at every single hour, it's correcting everything to your personal pulse, then that's a subscription.
- [21:51]
Dave Asprey
Do you have clinical trials or observational data you've collected from people? Like what kind of results are you seeing from it?
- [21:57]
Harry Massey
So there's a couple of things. So the, the paper I was just describing, so it has a whole bunch of things, but it'll increase the efficiency of energy in the cell by 22%.
- [22:09]
Dave Asprey
As measured by mitochondria.
- [22:11]
Harry Massey
They basically measured the amount of energy output with the amount of sugar that they were feeding it.
- [22:17]
Dave Asprey
Okay, so that's mitochondrial efficiency.
- [22:19]
Harry Massey
Yeah.
- [22:20]
Dave Asprey
Holy crap. So in, I mean, Headstrong, my book about mitochondria in the brain, I talked about Frank Schellenberger's work on mitochondrial efficiency and how 48% of people under age 40 have inefficient mitochondria. And everyone over age 40 has it. We just call it aging. And yet a 22% shift in efficiency of converting sugar into electricity or heat just by wearing the gem.
- [22:43]
Harry Massey
Correct. Yep.
- [22:46]
Dave Asprey
You're gonna wear this for a while.
- [22:47]
Harry Massey
Yeah, I know you should.
- [22:48]
Dave Asprey
Does it do sleep tracking too? Because I.
- [22:50]
Harry Massey
It does. I mean, it does, it does all the normal stuff like hov movements, sleep tracking, but that's not the magical part. The magical part is how.
- [23:00]
Dave Asprey
But if I don't have to wear an aura ring. So this does everything that an Oura ring does?
- [23:04]
Harry Massey
Yes.
- [23:04]
Dave Asprey
Oh, and that's kind of.
- [23:06]
Harry Massey
Now, Oura ring is an $11 billion company and we're a relatively modest company, so potentially their sleep algorithm will be a little bit better for maybe six months. But we will, we will be there.
- [23:19]
Dave Asprey
Okay, that's kind of cool. So if you're willing to wear a wristband, then you get the sleep and steps, for whatever that's worth, and then you're getting an actual signal into the body. This is really intriguing.
- [23:33]
Harry Massey
Well, the cool, the cool part is it'll give you awareness of your emotions. So you talked about aging, but the biggest, biggest factor of reduction in lifespan. You know, the ACE studies, the adverse childhood event studies.
- [23:48]
Dave Asprey
Yeah.
- [23:49]
Harry Massey
So when you've had more than three adverse childhood events, or very significant ones, like I had, like you had for sure, he, on average is a 20 year reduction in lifespan. And honestly, that's one of the biggest energy leaks of the body that most people don't talk about. Like, we all talk about toxicity and lifestyle, but we don't really talk about trauma. So actually having awareness of your emotions and a path. I'm not going to use your word, I'm going to use the word transformation. But, but when you have a path to transform your negative to positive emotions, that obviously has a massive impact on reducing the amount of energy leakage from your body. And when you've got much more energy available, actually that has a direct correlation to extended lifespan.
- [24:41]
Dave Asprey
The effect of trauma is such a big deal. That's why Heavily meditated, I think, is my most important book that just came out. So I. 40 years of Zen has been around for 10 years because I had to do a lot of that deep work. And the first step is awareness and just knowing what's going on in there. You don't have a signal. It's disconnected for a lot of people, even if they didn't have a lot of trauma as children. So if the GEM is helping people go, oh, if the state that you're reading digitally is this, then you can correlate that to your felt state and you can do something about it. So for me, practices like this, oftentimes with digital technology, sometimes with therapists, allowed me to have a really detailed set of instrumentation about my emotional and physical state, which is what lets me do half the stuff I can do. So this is.
- [25:29]
Harry Massey
Well, then when you meditate, you actually have that awareness of what happened in the last 24 hours. And you can think, well, why was I anxious? Why was I impatient? You know, why was I frustrated? Then you can think about, you know, well, I should be more joyful, more gentle, you know, more abundant or whatever the state should be.
- [25:50]
Dave Asprey
Okay. And guys, if you're thinking, this is kind of interesting, it's E4L. Just E number 4L dot com, Dave. And you get 10% off when you do that. I think this is worth your attention, especially if you don't already have a sleep tracker or a fitness tracker. This is, well, about what you'd pay for one of those anyway. And it kind of does a few other things.
- [26:12]
Harry Massey
Even if you do, you should replace it with this.
- [26:14]
Dave Asprey
Oh, well, there we go. All right. Straight from the founder of Matt.
- [26:17]
Harry Massey
Yeah, I know. Totally credible.
- [26:19]
Dave Asprey
He has absolutely no bias.
- [26:22]
Harry Massey
So that's. That's pretty cool.
- [26:23]
Dave Asprey
All right, so you've increased mitochondrial efficiency.
- [26:26]
Harry Massey
And, you know, the other exciting part about the research is Professor Hamel is able to look at all the RNA transcriptase factors, and he noticed 11, 24 different gene expressions, and they cover all sorts of different things, but increased antioxidant capacity, obviously, increased mitochondrial efficiency, increased cell resilience.
- [26:52]
Dave Asprey
So the. The gem is turning on or off more than a thousand genes, correct?
- [26:58]
Harry Massey
Yeah.
- [26:59]
Dave Asprey
What's inside that thing? Is this lights, electricity, fairy seahorses, or what's going on?
- [27:06]
Harry Massey
I mean, the fairy seahorse is what we said at the beginning, which is basically the information that's carried on the field. And you can carry information using lights, you can carry it using sound, you can carry it using pmf. In this case, it's carrying it with light and pmf. But in the end, the information is digital. It's binary. But we're putting a binary signal into the body.
- [27:29]
Dave Asprey
So is it laser or led?
- [27:30]
Harry Massey
It's led, and that doesn't matter.
- [27:33]
Dave Asprey
Okay. Now, some people would say carrying information. I'm a former network engineer. I taught about 1500 engineers in Silicon Valley how to build Networks in Web 1.0. And going from everything, from the signaling layer all the way up to how we carry data. And this is how I see the world inside the body. We have incredibly beautiful signaling networks, but not just one. And we can communicate with chemicals, which are slow. We can communicate with movements or vibration. We communicate with light, we communicate with magnetism, and we communicate with quantum entanglement and maybe information fields which could be similar to quantum. We're not quite sure yet. Each of those networks has different speeds and different uses. And each of those networks can be intercepted and hacked. Because I was also a computer hacker. And all we're talking about here is in computing, what we call a data injection attack, except it's for your own good, not for bad things. So we're going in there and saying there's faulty information flow on this signaling network. So let's use a network that's accessible and PEMF and light are accessible. So when those are accessible and we know how they use light or magnetism to send a signal, we just replicate the signal and we send the signal we want into the network. And then the body responds. This is the same way that I would take over your mobile phone and steal your crypto if that was what I was into. It's exactly the same thing. Am I right?
- [29:11]
Harry Massey
Yes. But we're not going to steal any energy from your body by doing it.
- [29:15]
Dave Asprey
So if the body's hackable like this, how did you reverse engineer the signaling system in the body?
- [29:21]
Harry Massey
So that was the work of Peter Fraser and he. That was the work of Professor Peter Fraser and he was part of Melbourne University. And I met him 24 years ago. And he actually did it all through trial and error. But he would. Well, there's many, many different examples, but if I take. I'll just take the example of what we call cell driver. So he would look at all the different pathways in the cell that generate energy. He'd also look at how heat and infrared would basically pass into H3O2, the structured water and cell spin out an electron, how that electron then ends up going to the cell membrane. But, you know, he was looking at conventional pathways, but also energetic pathways. You map out the full sequence of information and then we basically convert that to binary. And that's a little bit of a trade secret. So I probably won't tell you how we convert it to binary.
- [30:19]
Dave Asprey
You don't have to share that. I don't need to know. But the idea that someone studied this for a long time who did it, and this doesn't pass the sniff test because we all have a picture of how things work. And we're taught this from childhood. We're taught how history worked. By the way, that story is entirely nonsense. When they teach you in history classes, it does not reflect what actually happened because there's many, many, many data points that don't match. But then they can't see them or they explain them away.
- [30:47]
Harry Massey
Well, can I destroy the conventional view for you?
- [30:50]
Dave Asprey
Sure, let's do it.
- [30:51]
Harry Massey
So let's just look at chemistry. Let's say we're traditionally taught and we believe the whole body works off chemistry.
- [30:58]
Dave Asprey
Just chemistry. Right.
- [30:59]
Harry Massey
So you know, we eat a supplement or we take a drug, digest it, the liver processes it, the chemical goes around the blood, gets to a cell. How long did that take?
- [31:09]
Dave Asprey
It depends on the drug, but minutes to hours. Yeah.
- [31:12]
Harry Massey
Yet we've got 70 trillion cells in our body. Every cell has 3 trillion operations that happening every single second. So you know, that's trillions times trillions of magnitude of complexity. The only way the body can stay alive is if you've also got a field based system. Like you need a far quicker communication system than just chemistry. Or you could take the nervous system, you know, that's another example of a control system. Yet all the nerve fibers are completely different widths, they all travel at completely different speeds. You just take an example of a baseball player, you know, who accurately hits the, hits the ball at 120mph and he hits the bat and he just, it's sort of like magic how he does it, but it can't be explained by normal nervous system model. The reason is, is because there's information being carried on the field outside the nervous system. The nervous system is more like it's just said it sets up the field, but information is carried over the top of it. Now actually when you're looking at the body or fields in the body, I mean there's somnoluminescence effects, there's biophotons which obviously very, very fast. And there's also, there's also say the information carried by the field and in totality that's what we would call the body field. But without that we literally wouldn't be able to be alive. And it just chemistry alone doesn't work.
- [32:42]
Dave Asprey
You can also just blow holes in the chemical model really easily. It's called the placebo effect. If the placebo effect exists, then we're not running on just chemistry.
- [32:53]
Harry Massey
Well, what's the placebo effect like? Even that? That's a field based, it is a field based effect.
- [32:58]
Dave Asprey
But in the people who insist only chemical beings like little meat robots, so well, we have to beat the placebo effect. And then what, you're just discounting that as not being something worth studying or amplifying. So I know.
- [33:12]
Harry Massey
Don't you think if medicine had just studied the placebo effect would be a lot further? That's saying how the body works or how you heal.
- [33:20]
Dave Asprey
And medicine did study that. If we go way back in time to the Enlightenment, the early natural philosophers, especially society, which was where science came from, they knew electricity at least was a part of the system and that chemistry was part of the system. And these other field effects were there. Tesla was working on that. Royal Rife was working on that. And then someone figured out you could make pharmaceuticals out of petroleum and happened to be named Rockefeller. And he's been at war with any medicine that is not petroleum based to make us see the world in that model. But there's another study that shows every time your heart beats that the proton spin in every cell in the brain reverses direction, which means that there's quantum entanglement inside the body. So we have proof. We're quantum systems, our microtubules are quantum. So all these things are simultaneously true. We are chemical beings. You don't believe me? Eat cyanide. Well, you won't believe me after that either, because you're chemical, right? At the same time, sit in an electric chair. Well, you don't believe me after that either because we're electrical. And we can also, Cookie, with magnetism and all these other things, we can end life with these things. So that means that they're controlling life at some level.
- [34:33]
Harry Massey
You know, I think it's a bit funny about medicine is they're very aware of these systems. Like you have an an MRI system, you have an EKG and eeg, yet they think all these fields don't do something. They're just sort of, I don't know, like this noise or something that you can read, but it doesn't have an effect on the body.
- [34:51]
Dave Asprey
It kind of makes me laugh when people come into upgrade labs. We have very powerful light based systems and magnetism based systems and manipulating oxygen, which is technically a chemical based system, and temperature. All these things, they're all just variables in the world, but you got to look at the totality of them. And what's impressive about what you're doing is you're taking these ancient practices and you're applying rigorous scientific method to them to figure out what works and what doesn't. And that's what biohacking is all about. Let's use what we already know and let's prove whether it works or it doesn't work. And let's maybe accelerate it, because I'm pretty sure Back in China, they'd have been sticking needles in you and giving you eye of newt and batwing. And I'm sure you've been to a traditional Chinese herbal store. It's remarkable. They're getting these jars of God knows what out and putting them in newspaper and telling you to boil it, but it works. And if you can do this with a digital thing, I think that's remarkable. And it's very expensive to have an 80 year old Chinese guy walk around with you every two hours, measuring your pulse points and then telling you what to do. In fact, it's impossible.
- [35:59]
Harry Massey
And giving you acupuncture treatments every two hours too.
- [36:01]
Dave Asprey
Yeah, that would be fun. It's like a pincushion. So this is a continuation though of a very long lineage and it's particularly cool. This pisses off rationalists and it's fun to be a rationalist and an irrationalist at the same time. But my friend Mark Lemley, who ran the IP practice at Stanford University, I met him in a yoga class and he published a paper years ago about the myth of the lone inventor. And in this paper he showed that for all the big transformative ideas in society, there were always at least three people simultaneously working on it. One of them got to the patent office first, but there was always at least two more days or months behind that were also creating the same thing without talking to each other. Because when it's time for an idea, the idea is going to come through and no one knows why that happens.
- [36:51]
Harry Massey
I mean, actually I've seen it with this wearable. Like there's a, you know, there's another wearable out there that does the correction side, but they don't have the, the research behind it and they didn't really map out the information. They don't have the pulse part, but it, but it's happened at the same time. I'm a little bit later, but that's because I've been working on it longer and better.
- [37:11]
Dave Asprey
There you go. And just in the world of biohacking, it's now a $36 billion industry and it was a new idea that's so related to this. It was let's measure and then change. And before that, like let's just kind of measure and then maybe do something. But the real time, measuring and changing, that's what biofeedback and neurofeedback are based on. And a lot of the biohacking innovations around sending a signal in from all these environmental variables. In fact, the definition of biohacking it's change the environment inside you or the environment around you so that you have full control of your biology, of your state. So that means you're sending a signal. And I don't care if it's sunshine or if it's a gem or if it's jumping up and down on a trampoline, it doesn't matter. It's a sign signal. If you know the right signal, you know the state of the body, you can change the state of the body or of the mind. It actually just makes sense. Right. The problem has been knowing the right signal. And AI is getting better and better. And when you get some lab work in there, and we're doing a lot of lab work within upgrade labs right now, and then when you start getting bioenergetic readings and you're doing this very ancient stuff that you're doing in GEM and you're combining those things, it seems like a really powerful thing. So I'm going to wear one for a while and I'm expecting to be like 6 inches taller. What else should I say?
- [38:28]
Harry Massey
You're going to be more aware emotionally, you'll be. You'll basically manage your energy better, sleep better, and have more balanced emotions. Well, those claims we're making in react. God, what can I say on the podcast? I mean, there's all the, there's all the health stuff, but I probably can't make the claim.
- [38:46]
Dave Asprey
One of the fun things in the US is that you're actually not allowed to speak the truth if you're doing health stuff. So every supplement manufacturer out there, every device manufacturer out there says the dumbest things. Right? And we all say that because we're not allowed to say what it does because legally only drugs can do that.
- [39:07]
Harry Massey
I think you can interpret what our GEM does from the research that Professor Hemel has done, and there's a very likely to be a strong correlation between that research and what happens in the body.
- [39:18]
Dave Asprey
There we go. That sounds good. So I unfortunately haven't tried the gem, but I have tried the tech that it's based on just from knowing you for 10 years and working with it. So I, I know there's some efficacy there. The other thing was pretty bulky and have to carry around in your pocket and all. So I'm, I'm excited, really excited to try the gem. And guys, it's e4l.com so sl Dave, and very affordable. Thank you for coming on the show and just for innovating on this and knowing you for a long time. You and I both have been through an unimaginable amount of suffering and people who haven't had chronic fatigue and just been like, I'm a highly functional human being and no matter how much willpower I apply, like, my body will not move out of bed. I just don't have it today. It doesn't matter how much you want or push or try. It's just empty. And you've been there. And I am absolutely certain, like, I'm not going back. And I'm not going back for any reason, right? And I monitor all the systems and it's just something. I don't want anyone else to ever go there. And I know you run on that same thing like, it, it's not worth it to go there and we don't have to go there. And it's expensive and difficult to get out of it. So preventing it is a lot easier. A lot of people today are running at 50% of what they could run at and they think they're fine. A lot of people are at 40% and they know something's vaguely wrong. But whatever, I got shit to do. And if you can do something that's relatively inexpensive and relatively easy, that brings you back up to 60, 70, 80%. The difference is profound because people are nicer to each other and we don't feel like crap all the time. It makes the world better when people have more energy. So this is important work you're doing. Thank you.
- [41:02]
Harry Massey
Thank you guys.
- [41:03]
Dave Asprey
E4L.com Dave this is real. See you next time on the Human.
- [41:11]
Upgrade Podcast.
- [41:16]
Podcast Host (Dave Asprey)
The Human Upgrade, formerly Bulletproof Radio, was created and is hosted by Dave Asprey. The information contained in this podcast is provided for informational purposes only and is not intended for the purposes of diagnosing, treating, curing, or preventing any disease. Before using any products referenced on the podcast, consult with your healthcare provider carefully, read all labels, and heed all directions and cautions that accompany the products. Information found or received through the podcast should not be used in place of a consultation or advice from a healthcare provider. If you suspect you have a medical problem or should you have any healthcare questions, please promptly call or see your healthcare provider. This podcast, including Dave Asprey and the producers, disclaim responsibility for any possible adverse effects from the use of information contained herein. Opinions of guests are their own and this podcast does not endorse or accept responsibility for statements made by guests. This podcast does not make any representations or warranties about guest qualifications or credibility. This podcast may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products or services individuals on this podcast may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to herein. This podcast is owned by Bulletproof Media. It.