The 'Secret Sauce' To A 10/10 Morning Routine : 1490

Summary

The Human Upgrade with Dave Asprey: "The 'Secret Sauce' To A 10/10 Morning Routine" – Ep. 1490

Date: June 25, 2026
Guests: Dave Asprey (host) and Founder of MTE (likely co-founder/CEO)

---

Episode Overview

In this engaging and practical episode, Dave Asprey (the "Father of Biohacking") visits with the founder of MTE, a new caffeine-free energy drink that claims to provide foundational energy, stress resilience, gut health, and mood support. The conversation explores the shortcomings of conventional energy drinks, dives into the science and formulating art behind MTE's ingredient stack, and gets personal about entrepreneurship, willpower, and the links between physiology, performance, and daily optimization.

Asprey and his guest blend humor, real-world experience, and technical detail about what it means to have a “10/10 morning routine”—and how smart routines and conscious supplement choices can transform not just mornings, but mood, motivation, and longevity.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Energy Drink Problem & MTE's Unique Approach

[03:06–05:52]

• Why MTE exists:
  • Most energy drinks provide shallow, stimulant-based boosts ("tsunami of stimulation") that create stress without helping foundational energy or mood.
  • MTE's promise: deliver "real" energy through prebiotics, adaptogens, and nootropics—without caffeine's downsides.
• Caffeine’s role:
  • Dave: “I’m unconvinced that caffeine’s bad for you… when people say be caffeine-free, it’s the same thing as saying be vegan.” [03:21]
  • Founder: Advocates for a "coffee in the morning, MTE in the afternoon" approach; not anti-caffeine, just wary of excessive/late-day consumption.

MTE's Ingredient Stack: Prebiotics, Adaptogens, Nootropics

[05:52–09:51]

• What’s inside MTE:
  • “It has prebiotics, has 4 grams of fiber, has three adaptogens, and it has two nootropics.” (Founder, [06:04])
• Adaptogens for stress:
  • Maca, Eleuthero (Siberian ginseng), and Ashwagandha—blend supports stress response & helps modulate cortisol.
• Nootropics for brain:
  • Paraxanthine, GABA, L-theanine, saffron ("mood stabilizer"). Paraxanthine is a caffeine metabolite, said to give “the good of caffeine” without negatives.
• On timing and stimulation:
  • Dave: Reports finding paraxanthine “stimulating, like coffee”—notes genetic differences in how people respond.

Formulation & Flavor Creativity

[12:12–14:54, 18:24–21:55]

• Flavor innovation:
  • MTE offers Mango Pineapple, Mandarin Orange Lemon Lime, Huckleberry Acai (“That last one... try it just for the name.” – Dave [14:06])
  • Inspiration for Huckleberry Acai came from a collaboration with Reggie Watts, Montana native and MTE fan.
• Sweetener choices:
  • Uses Stevia (Reb A & Reb M) for a clean, sugar-free product with minimal aftertaste—“front, middle, and back” of tongue considered in R&D.
• Formulation challenges:
  • “If you want to throw a bunch of sugar, a bunch of sucralose, then not so hard. But if you want to keep it clean label, it's difficult.” (Founder, [14:17])

Nuanced Energy, Not Just Stimulation

[09:51–11:32]

• Sleep-friendly energy:
  • MTE claims to “work” without disturbing sleep; founder can take it before social nights without sleep loss—contrast with Red Bull or Americano.
• Holistic benefits:
  • Emphasis on mood, gut health, stress resilience, and “foundational” energy—“not just being energy, that’s been done.”

Entrepreneurship, Willpower & Biohacker Mindsets

[26:39–39:00]

• Connecting athletic drive and business resilience; tackling endurance vs. strength sports, boredom, and the “pain cave.”
• ADHD, ability to suffer, and entrepreneurial grind are all tied together.
• Willpower wisdom:
  • Founder: Motivation comes from the enjoyment of process and competition (“I like the journey... it doesn’t really feel like motivation or mitochondrial.” [36:34])
  • Dave: “The less I use my willpower, the more successful I am… it’s the game of allocating my efforts where they have the most impact on my mission.” [38:47]
• Managing teams:
  • Bring problems, but with your best solution—even if bad—so leaders can help ideate: “If you come to me with no solution... get your resume ready.” (Founder, [28:09])

The Future—AI, Adaptation, and Personal Energy Management

[31:14–34:39]

• MTE’s growth: 14 employees, aiming to stay lean and innovative, leveraging AI.
• Dave and the founder swap thoughts about learning new tools, including the importance of AI adoption: "If you have the gumption to go, just ask AI to teach you... all of a sudden your boss thinks you're a genius." [32:02]
• Cultural riffs: Playful banter about generational slang, "gumption," and teaching kids/misusing their words.

The MTE Philosophy: Building a Better Daily Baseline

[41:24–42:15]

• The battery metaphor: Each day starts with a variable “charge,” and poor habits/stressors drain it quickly.
• MTE as a tool to extend battery life and make that charge count—offering not just energy for its own sake, but productive, mood-supportive, and restful days.

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On caffeine and energy:
  “There’s sort of two kinds of energy. There’s the peaceful energy and then there’s the I have so much energy from meth that I got arrested.” – Dave Asprey, [00:09], [42:04]

• On flavor creation:
  "That's an exotic flavor... huckleberry on its own, it's sort of a bitter blueberry. But we smooth it out with some acai and it's awesome." – Founder of MTE, [13:26]

• On entrepreneurship:
  “Being an entrepreneur is like eating broken glass every day...” – Dave Asprey, paraphrasing Elon Musk, [26:41]

• On team problem-solving:
  “If you come to me with no solution and your question is, what do I do? Generally, it’s like, get your resume ready.” – Founder of MTE, [28:09]

• On willpower:
  “The less I use my willpower, the more successful I am.” – Dave Asprey, [38:47]
  "I like the journey... I just love the process." – Founder of MTE, [36:34]

• On AI in business:
  "You better be good at AI. ...If you have the gumption to go, just ask AI to teach you... all of a sudden your boss thinks you're a genius." – Dave Asprey, [32:02]

• On building energy:
  “You want to wake up with the battery 100%, which most people aren't doing now... In the mood. And the other thing is, what if you do have energy? ...But you're in a shit mood. You have no motivation. You have anxiety...” – Founder of MTE, [41:24]

---

Timestamps for Major Segments

• 03:06 – MTE overview & founding purpose
• 05:52 – Ingredient components: adaptogens, nootropics, prebiotics
• 09:51 – Effects on energy, sleep, comparison to Red Bull
• 12:12 – Flavors & collaboration with Reggie Watts
• 14:10 – Sweeteners and flavor science
• 18:24 – Absorption discussion and science language banter
• 26:41 – Entrepreneurship = suffering; resilience strategies
• 31:14 – Team size, AI adoption, future of work
• 36:27 – Willpower, motivation, and the biohacker mindset
• 41:24 – The “battery” metaphor for personal energy management
• 42:04 – “The opposite of meth” tag and product summary

---

Conclusion

Dave Asprey and the MTE founder take listeners deep into the “why” of foundational energy, challenging quick-fix stimulation paradigms and making the case for smart, full-spectrum support. They connect the dots from biohacking protocols and flavor innovation to entrepreneurship, willpower, and the demands of modern life. With humor, candor, and a practical lens, the episode offers both immediate takeaways (try a smarter afternoon pick-me-up) and broader reflections (build your own routines around mood, energy, and longevity).

Transcript

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

You're in a shit mood, have no motivation, you have anxiety. But how you want to get through life, even if the energy is working for you, you have no tools to use it. The focus, the mood, the gut health.

[Dave Asprey]

If you look at, like any kind of energy drink and you're going to go out and stay out late, you're screwing up your cortisol curve enormously. There's sort of two kinds of energy. There's the peaceful energy and then there's the I have so much energy from meth that I got arrested.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

That's our new tagline, the opposite of meth. I call it my limitless powder.

[Dave Asprey]

But I mean, can you take MD before bed?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah, I do.

[Dave Asprey]

You do. And you don't have any problem from a caffeine metabolite in your brain. That's interesting. You're listening to the Human Upgrade with Dave Asprey. Every breakthrough in human performance comes down to one thing. Just changing your state. And right now, the science and the technology and the ancient practices are converging faster than you realize. For 50 years, bad policy and stigma blocked scientific researchers from studying some of the most powerful tools for the human brain. And that just changed. This October, the researchers, the clinicians, the guys, pioneers in consciousness, tech and psychedelics are all going to be under one roof in Austin. And you can be there too. With me. For the first time ever, I'm hosting and operating beyond Wonderland. Two full days where you'll learn the science and the practice of changing your state. And you'll get to talk to the researchers doing it. You'll learn how these tools unlock a version of yourself you didn't know existed, Find talks about altered states with or without the psychedelics. A tech hall where you can try the tools yourself. Breakout sessions, breathworks, ceremony integration circles, and more. This field is moving really fast. And the people who are here in Austin on October 13th and 14th with

[Advertisement Voiceover for Danger Coffee and Braintap]

me are going to be years ahead

[Dave Asprey]

of everyone who finds out about this later. Learn more. Get your ticket [e-mail] Life's too short

[Advertisement Voiceover for Danger Coffee and Braintap]

for hotel coffee or that burnt and blended green label stuff from who knows how many plantations. So what do you do about it? Here's what I used to do. I'd grind up my Danger coffee, pack it in my bag and take it through tsa. It got screened every single time, but it was worth it because most instant coffee, it's horrifying. They use damaged, broken and moldy beans, the kind they couldn't even sell you. Then they liquefy them under heat and pressure and extract about 66% of the bean into a powder that's mostly cellulose, basically sawdust. What's left? About 33% actual coffee, heated, scorched, stripped of flavor. So they load it with artificial flavorings and fake scent molecules. They don't even have to list on label just so it smells like coffee. All junk your body can't even digest. I don't settle for garbage just because I'm traveling, and neither should you. That's why I made Instant Danger. It takes over 72 hours to brew because cold brewing below 36 degrees extracts the clean, smooth flavor without the bitterness or burnt notes. Then we freeze dry it. No heat, no spray drying, so those coffee crystals stay intact and taste like your home brew. Drop it in hot water, cold water, your smoothie, whatever fuels your day. This is real Danger Coffee instantly. Grab yours at Danger Coffee and use code DAVEPOD at checkout for 15% off.

[Dave Asprey]

What is MTE? Why does it exist?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

MTE? Caffeine free energy drink with prebiotics. And we built it to help people energize foundationally as opposed to the tsunami of stimulation from energy drinks.

[Dave Asprey]

The energy drinks are pretty much bad news. Although, I mean, you talk a lot about caffeine free with mte. Can't use it with caffeine because there's a lot of longevity studies of caffeine, even independent of coffee. Like, I, I'm unconvinced that caffeine's bad for you. And, and I kind of feel like when people say be caffeine free, it's the same thing as saying be vegan.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah. See, that's the misnomer. I think a lot of people, they first of all, like one of the most common use cases, Coffee in the morning, MT in the afternoon. I think the misnomer is, it's all encompassing. We think, we think caffeine particularly and, and like a nice Americano in the morning. Great. In a tsunami in the afternoon through energy drinks.

[Dave Asprey]

A Red Bull.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah, right, Exactly. Not good. And so it's. And it's also, remember it's, it's a combination of energy. We wanted it to work. It was important because most of the stuff that's caffeine free people are like, immediately, that doesn't work. Yeah. So we wanted this to work, but we also wanted to be foundational and boost all the things that actually help you generate your own energy. Right. So stress response, better sleep at night, gut health. Right. So it's, it's sort of a full stack Like, I created. I've never been an energy drink user ever, but it's. I've added it to my routine because of those things. I love the stress response. I love the mood. Right. I get a nice, calm, focused energy to help me power through the afternoon. But this isn't a all caffeine is bad type of thing.

[Dave Asprey]

I like to bring founders on the show who are doing something different in beverage or supplements or any of the CPG things, just to learn the thinking behind it and sort of unpack what's in it and why is it worth paying attention to. So tell me your why behind mte.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

So the why is we're energizing as a society the wrong way. We're getting this tsunami. It's really stressful that we're creating, and it's not doing anything for the foundational leveling you up. So instead of charging our battery gradually through the day or slowing the depletion throughout the day, we're just band aiding this thing, like over and over and over and putting ourselves on a flywheel to the bad. So, you know, we felt like. And then on top of that, even if the energy is working for you, you have no tools to use it. The focus, the mood, the gut health, the sleep at night. So we wanted something full spectrum to kind of react to modern society.

[Dave Asprey]

So would you say MTE is an adaptogen, or is it a nootropic? Or is it a prebiotic? Or how do you categorize it?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yes would be the answer to that.

[Dave Asprey]

You're going to boil the ocean.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Well, I mean, no, we're not, but it is all of those things. It has prebiotics, has 4 grams of fiber, has three adaptogens, and it has two nootropics.

[Dave Asprey]

Let's talk about the adaptogens. Okay, what do you put in MD and why?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Maca, Eleuthera. And what is our ashwagandha?

[Dave Asprey]

Ashwagandha, okay.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

We use adaptogens in our formula for stress response. Okay, Right. Primarily, they work harmoniously with the nootropics, particularly the paraxanthine. But generally speaking, our adaptogens are just there for stress response.

[Dave Asprey]

Okay, so you got the stress response and you'll lower cortisol with astaxanthi or not with astanthin. With ashwagandha. All the A's, man, all these A neurochemical things. You guys can see how my. My bubble sort algorithm works in my brain there. Like it's one of the long A words, because I'm entirely visual in the way I think. So ashwagandha is blunting the cortisol spike, which you. You don't. You need some cortisol in the morning, you don't want to have it later in the day. I totally see that one. And Eleuthero is also known as gins, so that's a well known adaptogen. Okay. So it's helping people to respond to stress. I like that. And then you've got. On the nootropic side, you said two nootropics, or cognitive enhancers. Which ones?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Paraxanthine. We also have gabathionine, noteworthy. And then saffron.

[Dave Asprey]

Oh, cool. So actually that's a pretty effective stack. So gaba and theanine are chill out things. Right. And saffron is a mood stabilizer.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yep.

[Dave Asprey]

Okay, so this is an interesting combination that can like push in, in sort of two different directions beneficially at the same time. But paraxanthine is just a caffeine metabolite.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Mistplay and AutoTrader]

Right.

[Dave Asprey]

Is that a nootropic or is that just another form of caffeine in fancy clothing?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Well, both. Right. I mean, you know, caffeine's a nootropic. Absolutely. But this is, you know, it's the good of caffeine. Right. I mean, caffeine does come with a few, you know, the theobromine and theobromite, you know, aren't great. Most of the benefits that you get from caffeine are from paraxanthine. So it's. It's.

[Dave Asprey]

Are we certain of that? I mean, so paraxanthine, just so people know what it is. Sean Wells came up with this, and Sean's a friend who's been on the show. And so caffeine breaks down into three metabolites.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yep.

[Dave Asprey]

I don't think it's theobromine, though. That's like a chocolate thing. And just to be really clear, we have a discernment. This is caffeine on my arm, tattooed. So trimethylxanthine is my friend. But basically you take off some of the methyls and you get paras, xanthine instead of trimethylxanthine. So you demethylate it. So it's a downstream metabolite that does have beneficial wakeful effects. I just know if it's all the good effects. But for people who tweak on caffeine and there are some who can't break it down, like there's a really clear case for it. But I mean, can you take MDE before bed?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah, I do.

[Dave Asprey]

You do and you don't have any problem from a caffeine metabolite in your brain. That's interesting.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

Got it.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

I know Sean's that way too.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, I found it was, it was stimulating, like coffee for me. But it could be a genetic thing.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Is that right?

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Well, it's probably the tattoo.

[Dave Asprey]

It could be the tattoo. So I tend to look at anything with paraxanthine as, like before two. But I am very open to people saying, well, I do it before bed and it improves my sleep. And so that's surprising to me. But I believe you because, I mean, you're in the business of this.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

I am. Well, no, remember, I'm not taking this at 9 o' clock at night.

[Dave Asprey]

Oh, that's what I thought you were saying.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

But I have taken it. You know, I'll go, I'll have a night out.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Mistplay and AutoTrader]

Right.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

And I'll be like, I need a little bit of a pop before I go out. I'm gonna take an mte, go to dinner. It's two hour dinner. I come home, I sleep like a baby. Yep. If I were to do the same thing and, and crush an Americano before I went out, I would not go home and sleep like a baby. Okay, so that's. And of one. Of course, this is what we hear regularly.

[Dave Asprey]

It's always tough when you run a company because you'd rather just say, this is what happens, because I've seen it a whole bunch of times. But then people are saying, well, you don't have evidence. Like, what about all the people who told me that's what happened? Isn't that evidence? And it is evidence, actually. So look, if you're, if your customers and your experiences, you know, you can drink this when most people have a Red Bull, but then you sleep much better with MTE than you would from a Red Bull.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

You have a win right there. Right. And I believe you on that.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Well, yeah, but I mean, if we're going down the rabbit hole of like comparing MTE to a Red Bull, there's a lot of benefits.

[Dave Asprey]

Well, you stomp all over it. But just literally, Red Bull is. I don't know what all is in there other than caffeine and sugar and taurine, but that much caffeine at night is provably going to tweak you. Right. And so if you had a choice. And I know tons of people who drink a Red Bull before they go out to a club, right?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah, totally.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah. Even people who are biohackers sometimes, you know who you are.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

So this strategy of saying this is definitely going to be less of a hit and maybe even just straight up beneficial because of all the other things like the prebiotics and the adaptogens. And if you look. Yeah, you look at, like any kind of energy drink and you're going to go out and stay out late, well, you're screwing up your cortisol curve enormously. But if you were to take the adaptogens that are in mte, okay, maybe you got to stay out late and party, but you didn't take a hit the next morning. Right.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

That's the plan.

[Dave Asprey]

I mean, all right, that's actually kind of a cool strategy.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

It's. I mean, look, it was purposely built to not just be energy, and that's been done.

[Dave Asprey]

Oh, yeah.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

And gut health has been done. Stress response has been done. But nothing does it all together.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, I see what you're saying.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

So, you know, we wanted to make a flywheel where it's something you could add to your routine. Like, I was never an energy drink user.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, me either.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

I love Americano in the morning, and then I loved adding something to my routine in the afternoon to help me dial, knowing it's building. Also, gut health and the saffron helps you sleep better at night. Doesn't help you go to sleep, of course. And then we wanted the parazanthin in there because we. If you didn't feel it, then it's like every other supplement. Maybe it's working, maybe it's not. I hope it is. And we wanted something where you could actually feel.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

So, you know, and so you get this full spectrum and, you know, you feel it and you're like, I call it my limitless powder.

[Dave Asprey]

That's really cool. Now what does it taste like?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Tastes great. Now four flavors. Mango, pineapple, mandarin orange, lemon, lime, and huckleberry acai.

[Dave Asprey]

That last one, Huckleberry acai. Can you say that three times fast?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Probably not.

[Dave Asprey]

So this was a while ago. I made something called fat water that won the most innovative new beverage in the country award. And I went down the rabbit hole on flavors and combining them, and it's an incredibly comple art. But that is the first time I've ever heard of huckleberry as a flavor in general. Plus, aai, how did you come up with it?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Right.

[Dave Asprey]

I'm actually just curious as an entrepreneur.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

So we did it with. Do you know Reggie Watts?

[Dave Asprey]

No.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

So Reggie Watts is a, like, this force of nature. Comedian, musician Ted speaker, and he's a huge MT fan from Montana. He lives in LA now, but he's from Montana. So we're talking to him and we just wanted to do some work together and have, you know, Reggie, what do you think? How could we work together? And he was like, well, I'm going to tell you guys something. The state fruit of Montana is huckleberry. We're like, what? That's hilarious. And he's like, let's do it. Let's formulate. Let's do a flavor with huckleberry.

[Dave Asprey]

And that was why.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah. And so we did a flavor with Reggie and we led with huckleberry. But huckleberry on its own. There's a reason you don't see a lot of stuff flavored with huckleberry. Yeah, it's not bad. Like, it's sort of a bitter blueberry, if you will. But we smooth it out with some acai and it's awesome.

[Dave Asprey]

That's an exotic flavor.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah, it's. Yeah, it's really. That's what we wanted to do, like fruit punch and all that, you know, it's just been done. We wanted to do something. And mango pineapple is by far our best seller. And this. And this is sight unseen. Right. There's just, I think, people looking at it going, that's a cool combo. Yeah. Right. So huckleberry. I'll say the same thing.

[Dave Asprey]

Okay.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

That's when, like, you have to try it just by the name.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

If I was ordering right now, I'd say I'm getting one of those just, Just to see.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Totally.

[Dave Asprey]

Right?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

Okay. And then talk about the sweetener.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Stevia.

[Dave Asprey]

Stevia.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Okay. So yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

Straight stevia or Reb A?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Both. Okay. We do both. So we wanted, it was very important. It was sugar free, of course. Yep. We wanted no glycemic spike and we wanted, you know, clean label. And so we, we looked at, you know, you formulated, we looked at everything and, and, okay. I mean, I was telling somebody yesterday, I'm sure, you know, this formulating over caffeine or paraxanthine, it's hard. Like if you want to throw a bunch of sugar, a bunch of sucralose, then not so hard. But if you want to keep it clean label, it's difficult because that stuff raw, it's tough. Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

You don't want to just like, you know, take a. Take a lick of caffeine powder. You will not like your life.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

You won't.

[Dave Asprey]

This is a funny story. When I was maybe 18, I worked in the computer labs at University of California, as, you know, like the Nerd helping kids on the computer. And so I got into what, what would now be called Reddit was Usenet. This is where I sold the first, the first E commerce product ever was that caffeine T shirt. And I found this professor of caffeine chemistry and I was sending him text only messages on this email system called Pine, which is what we all used before Gmail. And I'm like, hey, can, can you make me a caffeine spray? Like I need a caffeine spray.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Because I was just like a sublingual.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, I just, I really wanted to do it because I was just so tired, had brain fog. I didn't realize I had like ADHD and autism and toxic mold and all sorts of shit going on. But I just knew coffee made me happy.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

So he writes back this long really cool email which I saved it somewhere and it's like, well, you know, I've thought about this idea, but the solubility of caffeine in water isn't high enough. So. And he kind of went through all these different strategies and that might have been the first thing that got me really interested in, in formulating nootropics years later. I hadn't thought of this in years, so you mentioned that, but it's because it just, he's like, it tastes terrible and you'd have to drink like a half a liter to get enough in water. Unless you do a strategy like, like you're doing or clearly you can put it in coffee, tea, all sorts of things because it occurs there. But yeah, it was, it was kind of a, like a wake up call. This is harder than I thought it was totally.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

I saw a paraxanthine pouch the other day.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

One of my guys sent it to me and I was like, that doesn't, that just doesn't seem right. I mean I'm sure you can absorb some of it through your cheek and gum, but it's really, you know, and.

[Dave Asprey]

Oh, a pouch, like a, like a zin style. Yeah, yeah, but that's going to taste horrible.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Beyond that, like I don't. I think the efficacy is, will be extremely limited.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Danger Coffee and Braintap]

Your brain is probably underperforming right now.

[Dave Asprey]

No judgment.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Danger Coffee and Braintap]

Most brains are. In fact, you're probably not thinking as clearly, sleeping as deeply or performing as

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

well as you could be.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Danger Coffee and Braintap]

Braintap helps you unlock your full potential. It offers More than 2000 in app audio sessions and an innovative headset that together deliver light pulses, binaural beats, isochronic tones, guided visualizations and 10 cycle holographic. Music to rewire your brain for higher performance. In just 20 minutes, you can achieve deep brainwave states that would take hours through traditional meditation. It also helps regulate your sleep wake cycle, making it easier to fall asleep, stay asleep, and wake up refreshed without drugs or dependency. This isn't just some trend. Braintap. Braintap leads with tons of real science. They've conducted multiple studies proving this works. From enhancing memory and focus to accelerating cognitive learning, managing stress, and deepening visualization. Braintap is a holistic tool for peak performance in work, creativity and daily Life. Go to BrainTap.com Dave to get $100 off the BrainTap power bundle.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Mistplay and AutoTrader]

Playing mobile games and not getting rewarded for it is a thing of the past. Why haven't you switched yet? If you're going to spend the time playing, you should be earning rewards doing it. With Mistplay, you play what you love and earn points for gift cards and more. Plus, you can enter the Myst Play sweepstakes for your chance to win tens of thousands of dollars in cash bundles and gift cards every week. So, yeah, keep playing games, just maybe get rewarded for it. Download Mistplay today and enter for your chance to win.

[Dave Asprey]

Not everything absorbs through the. The buccal membrane in the mouth.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah, buccal. Buccal.

[Dave Asprey]

How do you say that?

[Advertisement Voiceover for Blue Lizard Sunscreen and Podcast Disclaimer]

I don't know.

[Dave Asprey]

I just read it.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Just say both and we'll edit it out.

[Dave Asprey]

It's one of those funny things where there's a bunch of words in science like that, and then I go and I ask the professors and PhDs and they all say it different because nobody knows.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah. However you're saying it's the right way, you just say it with authority.

[Dave Asprey]

There you go.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yes.

[Dave Asprey]

Many people, like 20% of people just get like a weird, bitter response to stevia and they just hate it. But if you use Rebbe the way you're doing it with a smaller amount of stevia. Very few people taste that. So I like it that you're using that combination of those as a way to get a sweetness without like the cloying stevia thing that can be there. So that's also very. It's an art to flavor things. Right. With that. Where it isn't like, oh, it's.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

It's. What's weird is like there is a cilantro soap effect. Yeah, Right. Number one. Which is like, I find that very interesting because I love cilantro.

[Dave Asprey]

Me too.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Blue Lizard Sunscreen and Podcast Disclaimer]

Yeah.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

I had some people over one time. We. Their friends from out of town, they came Down. And we, over the years, we talked about my tacos. Yeah, Like, I make amazing tacos. You guys got to come down, you know, street style. And I just didn't even think about it. I just, you know, contorto, right? Cilantro and onion. Right. And they're like choking them down. And I later learned their cilantro tastes like soap people.

[Dave Asprey]

I was like, oh, why don't you just tell me you ever heard of cilantro gaslighting? It's one of my favorites. So what you do is when they say they don't like cilantro because it tastes like soap, I just put a little bit of actual soap in. So then they eat that? No, it just tastes like soap all the time. Then I put cilantro and they're happy. What do you think you put? No, I've never done that, but I want to now these.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

I like it. That's interesting about Stevie. And what I, what I've learned, which I think is pretty cool, is like to your comments about formulating the, the tongue and in terms of sweetness, you have front, middle and the back. Yep. Right. Which I mean, who knew that? I mean, I know, you know, you put. We've all done the. Put the lemon on the tip of your tongue and a vat. You know, we've all done that. But knowing that there's actual formulation where like Rev M is the middle. Right. And Reb A is the front and kind of, you can kind of smooth it out and help people enjoy the experience. Not just, oh, I kind of like this at the front end, but I hate the aftertaste or vice versa. It can be smooth all the way throughout. I find that it's fascinating. And you. And you're pulling these different levers of a little bit more here. There. It's cool.

[Dave Asprey]

I've had a couple people think that I'm probably a supertaster, but I don't know if there's a quiz or a test for that. But I did some work a while ago with Dr. Barry, who's been on the show, and he comes from the. The lineage of 5,000 year old lineage that protects the emperors of China. This is where Shaolin comes from. Is this, this one temple in the middle of the mountains somewhere in China. And so that would include tasting food for the emperor to know if there's poison in it. That's cool. And he's one of nine living grandmasters. He's a Western doctor. And so he can taste something and like close his eyes and like figure out where in the body it's going and the color. And he taught me some of that stuff. And it's kind of cool when you take a compound or you just really mindfully taste something. You do sort of feel how your body is sensing it.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

Which is. Which is kind of fun. But just that first sense of where is something on the tongue. A lot of people never notice.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

That's nuts.

[Dave Asprey]

That's like.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

He's like a master psalm for the world, for everything.

[Dave Asprey]

So I won't name names here, but, yeah. Earlier in life, based on that skill, one of the top perfume designers on Earth was like, please, please work with me.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Mistplay and AutoTrader]

Like, what?

[Dave Asprey]

Whatever you want. He's like, that's not what it's supposed to do. Because he was a doctor.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

But, yeah, there's a. There's something there. And. And also the same with professional coffee tasters. You know, the black apron guys. You know, you. You can. You can taste it and. Yeah, you know, I'm not the guy who's going to say, oh, that's a Guatemalan from two years ago. Yeah, yeah. But we do the same with coffee and with wine. I know. You're a big wine guy.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah, I love wine.

[Dave Asprey]

Does MTE cancel out wine?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

It makes it better. Sadly not, no.

[Dave Asprey]

You're also really interesting from a physiological perspective. You didn't think I was going to say that?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

No, I did.

[Dave Asprey]

So you do.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Somebody last night on the plane, I just flew home and somebody. I was in a suit, I just. I came back from a funeral and the guy next to me said, you kill people for a living in a suit.

[Dave Asprey]

You would look like. Yeah, I was getting that vibe too.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

I go, no, just for. This is a hobby.

[Dave Asprey]

That's the best answer ever.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

He was like, you know, big cocktail in the whole flight.

[Dave Asprey]

Only if they ask me questions on airplanes.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Exactly, exactly.

[Dave Asprey]

There's sort of two different gene clusters that we see in. People are really good at sports. And I had some guys on years ago who looked at Olympic athletes and said, all right, what genes do you have? And they had a bronze medal strength athlete on, and they're like, damn, Dave, you have more strength athlete genes than our medalist here. But I didn't have a lot of endurance genes. And then there are other people, probably like Griff, who's semi professional triathlete guy who's a president upgrade labs. And he'll, you know, he'll go out and crank out 10 miles just. Just for fun.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

I'm like, lunch break.

[Dave Asprey]

Like, what kind of masochist is this? Man. Right. But you're both a long jumper, which is very much a strength, you know, power kind of thing. Yeah. And you like to do. Is it cycling? Right?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah. So what's the. What's the. The multiple personality sports disorder you have that makes you want to do chronic. Chronic cardio cyclist and the like, they're. They're so diverse. How do you do that?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

I just like to move.

[Dave Asprey]

Okay.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

I like to do stuff.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

You know, and I get bored doing one thing all the time.

[Dave Asprey]

Okay.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Like, I was talking to a friend of mine the other day, training for a marathon, and I was like, I've just. I'm out. Yeah. No way. I would do like a 10k or something like that, but I would just lose my mind where I was. Like cycling, at least I'm able. Like you can get in the pain cave a little bit and just sort of go, yeah. You know, and you learn early on, the pain never really gets worse. It just kind of sits there and you come to actually like it. You know, it feels good. But you're seeing, like, differing landscapes and things are changing. Right. Whereas running, it's just so. I'm like, no.

[Dave Asprey]

I was a long distance cyclist for years in my twenties when I was trying to do it to lose weight. And I just had to get like extra spokes in the wheels so I wouldn't bend my rims. Cause I was £300. It never worked. I mean, the spokes worked, but the cycling didn't. But yeah, there's a beauty and a nature and Yeah, I totally get you on that. And it's funny, yesterday I was with Jesse Itzler, who's also been on the show. Hilarious guy. And he's talking about all these, like, ultra endurance things. I just decided to go, you know, outrun David Goggins or something, which he'd probably try to do. And. Hey, David, if you're listening, shout out. But I just don't get it. Like, like I said 10k maybe, maybe. But I. I just don't want to do that to my body. Like, I'm. I'm a longevity guy.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Plus, beyond that, like, I just don't. It doesn't feel good. Right. Like, I don't want to go. Suffer.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

For no good reason. Like, I'll go. It's. I'll train hard and go deep into something that I like, like anaerobic threshold training and love. You get off that and feel like you want to puke and fall asleep all at the same time. But it lasts 5 minutes, 10 minutes. So that I love. That's one of my favorite things on the bike, too, is we'll do anaerobic training on a real bike, go find a straightaway and just go all out for a minute, and then on it goes. So, yeah, I like it both, but really, it just comes down to get bored easily. So I like to switch it up, and I like to stay active.

[Dave Asprey]

Okay, got it. So it's like an ADHD fueled thing.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yes. Yeah. Yes.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah. Now, we mentioned two things that are related. Ability to suffer ADHD and being an entrepreneur. And I think Elon's the guy who said, you know, being an entrepreneur is like eating broken glass every day or something. Because when you're CEO and you built a company over 15 years that did a lot of good stuff, luggage free, and, you know, this is your. This is your second entrepreneur.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

MDE is.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

So Elon's saying that because, well, all the problems no one else can solve land on your desk every day. And that's literally what happens all day, every day. Right?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

And if you're going out and doing the media tour, which you're doing too, you're like, oh, let me be the face and the problem solver. So that means that capacity to ride a bike up a hill, even when you hate your life, is directly correlated to, you know, taking yet another issue when you really didn't want to deal with it. Right.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Sometimes I wake up and I'm just like, we just need a win. Right. Like, if you have a problem that needs solved, like, just, I need to hear about it tomorrow. Like, I can't.

[Dave Asprey]

You know, I spent a lot of time with my team going, I'm totally cool if you bring me a problem, but you got to bring me your best solution, even if it's just crap.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

Because it'll help me help you. But if it's like, what do I do? That means you take a deep breath because you should know more about it than I do.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

Right. I might have a different perspective, but just teaching people that it's okay to come to me with the best solution that they know isn't very good.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

Just so we can ideate better. Right?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Totally. I. I like, if you come to me with no solution, and your question is, what do I do? Generally? It's like, get your resume ready. It's what you do. Like, wow, you need to come. You need to come try.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Like, I'm all about effort, making mistakes, learning from them. Like, you know, I don't want people to feel Paralyzed or intimidated to come ask for answers. But you have. But when you don't try, it's like my kids, you know, they'll just make no effort and say, well, throw their hands up and say, what do I do? And I'm like, the first thing you do is start trying.

[Dave Asprey]

And it is sometimes little kid energy. And I see this from 40 Years of Zen. Even really powerful entrepreneurs, powerful people in the world, we get kind of stuck in that. And the my very best people, if they don't know what to do. Here's the situation analysis and 10 bullet points or whatever I thought of these three things, and here's why. They all suck. What do we do? Like, okay, let's. Let's get there. Let's roll up our sleeves. That is so helpful. But in more than a decade of being an entrepreneur, you've definitely come across that. And having more energy would be beneficial for your employee and for you. Right. So do you ever sit someone down and just say, drink this mte. Drink the huckleberry aside flavor and then come back?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

We waterboard people with it regular.

[Dave Asprey]

There's a whole ad campaign about MTE Waterboarding.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

I'm telling you, it's a requirement of the job.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

You have to be waterboarded first before you can start. Yeah. What's funny is it's clearly we have now, like, starting. You start a brand and you're just trying to get off the launch pad. Right. And now we have people coming saying, I'm a huge fan of the brand. It's changed my life. I want to come work for you guys and help tell the story, which is super rewarding, you know, as opposed to going out and. And you just see the tide start to shift and, you know, we're still, you know, like. And somebody put it the other day, like, most people still don't know mte, but. But the crowd is getting bigger.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Blue Lizard Sunscreen and Podcast Disclaimer]

Are you really buying a car online

[Dave Asprey]

on Autotrader right now?

[Advertisement Voiceover for Mistplay and AutoTrader]

Really?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

At a playground?

[Advertisement Voiceover for Mistplay and AutoTrader]

Yeah. Really? Look at these listings from dealers.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Blue Lizard Sunscreen and Podcast Disclaimer]

Wow. Your search can really get that stuff specific.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Mistplay and AutoTrader]

Really?

[Advertisement Voiceover for Blue Lizard Sunscreen and Podcast Disclaimer]

And you just put in your info and boom. Cars in your budget.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Mistplay and AutoTrader]

Mom needs a second.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Blue Lizard Sunscreen and Podcast Disclaimer]

Honey, you can really have it delivered.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Mistplay and AutoTrader]

Really? Or I can pick it up at the dealership. One sec, sweetie.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Blue Lizard Sunscreen and Podcast Disclaimer]

Mommy's buying a car.

[Dave Asprey]

Mommy, look.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Blue Lizard Sunscreen and Podcast Disclaimer]

I think your kid is walking up the slide.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Mistplay and AutoTrader]

Kyle. Again? Really?

[Dave Asprey]

Auto trader.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Mistplay and AutoTrader]

Buy your car online. Really Be fearless in the sun with blue lizard. Australian sunscreen. Whether you're diving into ocean waves or simply chasing your kids around the backyard. Blue lizard has you covered so you can enjoy every moment worry free. Designed for your whole family and free from fragrances, parabens, and phthalates. Blue Lizard is your go to mineral sunscreen, trusted by dermatologists, pediatricians, and parents. Shop now on Amazon.com and be fearless in the sun with Blue Lizard Australian sunscreen.

[Dave Asprey]

How many employees do you have now?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

14.

[Dave Asprey]

14. Okay, cool. So, yeah, you're getting up there.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

We're getting there. But I'm trying to build it. Like, I. I always think about. I think we talked about this last time I was here, like, Instagram selling to Facebook for a billion dollars with like, 11 employees or something.

[Dave Asprey]

Right.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

That's what I want to do. I don't want hundreds of employees. I want to go all that out.

[Dave Asprey]

The good news is that good news for entrepreneurs anyway is that there'll be a lot less employees coming up here. And, yeah, I'm telling everyone everywhere, including people on my team, you better be good at AI. Yeah, right? And it's not that hard because you can go into your favorite AI, which hopefully isn't OpenAI, because it's just too narcissistic. But go to any AI except OpenAI. And, sorry, OpenAI, if you're listening, I wasn't talking about.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

About you.

[Dave Asprey]

Save that permanently for me. Okay, good. But I just tell them, look, you can do so much more and so much less of the crap work of your job if you have the gumption. That's a word I haven't used in, like, 40 years. If you have the gumption to go, just ask AI to teach you or take one of the free classes and then come in and start doing it. And all of a sudden your boss thinks that you're a genius. Yeah, right. Just because you got help. But the ones who don't do that, they're like the people who never learned how to type or use a mouse.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

You know, gumption is a word that usually are used when you're like, dog cussing somebody, isn't it? Like, I can't believe you have the gumption to say that.

[Dave Asprey]

It's like something my grandfather would say. This is a word. I want to make a product called gumption. It's like a chewing gum with caffeine in there, Parazine or something.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

There you go. There you go.

[Dave Asprey]

Somebody make that company just so I can, like, hold it up and laugh.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Gumption. You have to have it, right? It's funny.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Mistplay and AutoTrader]

The.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

The crew that we have are really dynamic on AI. Like, I have one guy who's like, yes, we can create these. These Personas, and it, you know, it basically will know everything we know within an hour, half hour, and then have it begin to solve problems. And, you know, it's like, we're like a puppet master, if you will, on this thing. And it's already pumping out really compelling work. And I'm having the same conversation. I think everybody is. You have to. We don't use OpenAI. We have another one we use that we love. What's your favorite? Claude. Claude.

[Dave Asprey]

It seems like most Americans are switching to Claude, and everyone else who is balancing their budgets, including American Silicon Valley or San Francisco companies, they're all just going to Kimi and like, oh, this is 1% the cost of Claude. So, you know, anthropic. If you're listening, you need to kind of make this a little bit more affordable, you know, fix those models a little bit. And by the way, I want Mythos so I can hack everybody.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Blue Lizard Sunscreen and Podcast Disclaimer]

Right.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

It's a lot of messaging to a lot of AI bots you're sending out.

[Dave Asprey]

I know they're listening, and they're saving this forever. So we should also both just say, I, for one, support our new robot overlords.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah, I always say that. I always use my manners. When I'm using, I'm like, thank you very much.

[Dave Asprey]

Please don't kill me, future boss.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah, it's weird. Like, a guy was looking. We were working together, and I was. I was literally typing, please and thank you, and he's like, dude, it's a robot. Like, just. You can cut the. I was like, well, I don't know. It's just. That's a Midwestern in me.

[Dave Asprey]

I. I swore at. Because I. I still have an OpenAI account because I program with a bunch of crap for one specific use.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

That I like. So I went in, and I literally started the query with. Or the prompt with don't bullshit me.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah, yeah, right.

[Dave Asprey]

Because I can ask any questions. Like, you're so smart. I'm like, actually, I wanted you to tell me what was wrong with what I said. So, yeah, I ask them that.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

My kids call it glazing. Yes. Machine is constantly glazing you. You're thinking about this the right way.

[Dave Asprey]

Dave, how old are your kids?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

15 and 12.

[Dave Asprey]

Okay. I got 16 and 19. And one of my favorite joys is misusing their words. Do you ever do that to your kids? Sometimes I'd be like, don't six, seven me. But that's not what you say. I'm like, I know that's not what you say, and I got you mad, right? Like, you're doing it to us. And I'm like, serving it back.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

And.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, that's just fun.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah. What is it, Riz? Aura glazing. Six, seven. I think that's dying off, though.

[Dave Asprey]

Oh, yeah, they. They killed it at Christmas earlier. They did a meme reset. Oh, thank God you didn't need it in here. That's okay. The new ones will be dumber.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Will they? I don't know. That was. That was dumb. I mean, that was dumb. Nobody even knew what it meant.

[Dave Asprey]

They were just like, oh.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

I'm like, what does that mean?

[Dave Asprey]

It's. It's probably satanic mind control. When you really get into it.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

I think that feels right.

[Dave Asprey]

That's what I tell them anyway. And they're like, dad, yeah, now I do want to get back to this. This combination. I see it a lot when I'm working with entrepreneurs where you have like a sports or just a physical performance side that you push yourself on, and you have a business side that you push yourself on. And I know that pushing yourself is directly a mitochondrial thing. You don't have willpower if you don't have mitochondrial function. There's studies I've written about in my books about that. So where do you think willpower comes from for you?

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Nobody's ever asked me that before. That's weird.

[Dave Asprey]

I hear that a lot.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

I don't know. Would it be weird to say within. No, I'm kidding. I don't know. I feel like I just like to compete and the process and they're sort of intertwined in my mind. So, you know, going out and just every day creating a process, being a part of the process. As we talked about, building it for others, helping shape it, define it, and clearly it's dynamic since it's all ever changing. And then stacking that on with the competitive nature of it, whether it be I'm trying to compete with myself just to improve my conversion rate or my average order value this week or lifetime value over the next six months, or, you know, or with others. Of course, that's a well worn path. So I think when I be. When I wake up and factor those things in of, you know, like, that's really what drives me is the process and then. And then ultimately competition. You know, put succinctly, I like the journey, right. And so it's fun. It's not even, you know, it doesn't really feel like motivation or mitochondrial. It's just, you know, it's. I've tapped into it, it's like working out. Like, I don't go to the gym or get on the bike or whatever I do and suffer. To me, it feels like a gift. I love moving my body and just doing it. I feel whether I'm going for a walk or going to throw the Frisbee or whatever it is, I just. I love it. This white knuckling work or working out or what I'm putting in my body, all those things, they're not sustainable, and that's not how I want to go through life. So I don't know if I've hacked my brain or convinced myself this is the truth, but I really feel like it's come naturally. I just love the process. What about you?

[Dave Asprey]

Probably there's an intrinsic motivation that comes just from knowing your purpose and for doing that. And I think people would say that I have a lot of. A lot of willpower, and I've done a lot of stuff in the world, so I guess you could say that. But what I found is the less I use my willpower, the more successful I am.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Is that right?

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, I. I fundamentally believe that human laziness comes from mitochondria, and it's really smart. Don't use more energy than you have. So if you can do it with less energy, that would be optimal.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

In business, yeah, I could. I could spend a lot on an ad or a little on an ad. Which one do I want to do? So for me, it's just the game of allocating my efforts where they have the most impact on my mission in the world. And so sometimes that looks like willpower, but to me, it's like I'm pursuing the beauty of the most perfect allocation of the electrons that I can make. That's fair. Which is kind of a nerd answer, but to me, it's actually just beautiful to be like, wow, look at all the things that lined up. And move, you know, with one. One move versus 100 moves.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah. One finger instead of 10.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah. I dig it.

[Dave Asprey]

Now that you asked me, it kind of. It goes back to when I was a computer hacker. Like, if I could write that code in three lines or 300 lines. Like the. The guy writes in three lines is the wizard.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah. Right.

[Dave Asprey]

So it's being the wizard.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

You want to be the sensei.

[Dave Asprey]

Yeah, there you go.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah, I like that.

[Dave Asprey]

Also, I hate stupid things. So there's that. The war against stupidity is not a very positive way of putting it. So we'll put it the. The pursuit of the opposite. Like Just. Yeah, it's just of elegance. There you go.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Okay.

[Dave Asprey]

But for all that stuff, man, if I'm at the bottom of my mitochondrial energy because I'm. I'm deconditioned because I just can't make enough energy, because I'm blown out, whatever the thing is.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah.

[Dave Asprey]

That's why I take 150 supplements a day and spend $3,000 a month or thereabouts on supplements. And I spent two and a half million dollars upgrading my biology, reversing my age and all that because having more raw energy to pour into the allocation towards things, it's kind of a.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

An easy.

[Dave Asprey]

An easy thing to do. That's why I wanted to have you on to talk about mte. Just because you're solving kind of four domains all at the same time, it's compatible with what most people are doing today. Right. So, you know, you can have it in the morning, you can have it in the middle of the afternoon. And the saffron is. When we haven't talked about too much, but that mood stabilizing effects. I use saffron just about every day. Missy Daniel, Amen. Who's a dear friend who's been on the show many times. I'm on his board of directors. It's his favorite brain supplement and one of mine too. So getting that and some prebiotics. Like they're. It's all lined up. So it's a cool blend. It's cool blend. And it does. And it does go into that. How much energy do you have at the end of the day? Yeah, right.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah, totally. That's what it's all about.

[Dave Asprey]

Right.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

We're trying to look at it as like a battery. Right. Like let's. You want to. First of all, you want to wake up with the battery 100%, which most people aren't doing now already. So that's. You're behind the eight ball and then expeditiously burning it because of too much stress or your gut health is in the toilet. You know, on it goes. So in the mood. And the other thing is, what if you do have energy? What if. What if you hammered a Red Bull, another cup of whatever it is. Yeah, but you're in a shit mood. You have no motivation. You have anxiety. You know, you may white knuckle it through the day to our conversation earlier, but is that optimal? Is that how you want to go through life?

[Dave Asprey]

There's. There's sort of two kinds of energy. There's the peaceful energy and then there's the. I have so much energy from meth that I got arrested. You get to choose.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

That's right. And we're. We're trying to be. That's our new tagline. Actually been working on it. The opposite of method.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Mistplay and AutoTrader]

So good.

[Dave Asprey]

And on that note, getmte.com Dave and that's 15% off. So you give this a try. If you've never tried any of that combination of ingredients by themselves or in an elegant blend, this is a cool chance to try it. And I gotta say, the huckleberry acai, you gotta try that just so you can say you've tried anything with that flavor.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Totally.

[Dave Asprey]

That's really innovative. It's cool.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Yeah. When's the last time you had huckleberry?

[Dave Asprey]

Well, with my daughter who's into botany, she knows where they grow on our farm up there. So I'm probably the only person who would have said, oh, last time I was in Canada, besides you.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

When's the last time you had huckleberry?

[Dave Asprey]

There you go. It's been really fun catching up. And congrats on. On all the success.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

Thank you.

[Advertisement Voiceover for Blue Lizard Sunscreen and Podcast Disclaimer]

The Human Upgrade, formerly Bulletproof Radio, was created and is hosted by Dave Asprey. The information contained in this podcast is provided for informational purposes only and is not intended for the purposes of diagnosis, diagnosing, treating, curing, or preventing any disease. Before using any products referenced on the podcast, consult with your healthcare provider carefully read all labels and heed all directions and cautions that accompany the products. Information found or received through the podcast should not be used in place of a consultation or advice from a healthcare provider. If you suspect you have a medical problem or should you have any healthcare questions, please promptly call or see your healthcare provider. This podcast, including Dave Asprey and the producers, disclaim responsibility for any possible adverse effects from the use of information contained herein. Opinions of guests are their own and this podcast does not endorse or accept responsibility for statements made by guests. This podcast does not make any representations or warranties about guest qualifications or credibility. This podcast may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products or services. Individuals on this podcast may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to herein. This podcast is owned by Bulletproof Media.

[Founder of MTE (likely a co-founder or CEO)]

There.