← Duologue with Leslie Heaney
Duologue with Leslie Heaney
Root Cause: Understanding Your Health - Pt. 1 with Tapp Francke
00:39:13
In Part 1, Leslie sits down with clinical nutritionist Tapp Francke to talk about a more personalized, functional approach to health. Instead of only treating symptoms, they explore what might be happening underneath — from nutrition levels to gut hea...
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- [00:03]
A
Hey, everybody, it's Leslie, and you're listening to Duologue. Do you want to be healthier but you aren't sure what to do exactly? Are you frustrated, like me, by all the recommendations you get from Instagram or friends about what supplements you should be taking? Creatine, vitamin D, magnesium, protein powder. But you're not sure how much to take or what you should actually be doing? I've got a tray in my kitchen that's covered in vitamins. It looks like a vitamin store, but I have no idea what I'm doing. So I knew I needed to find an expert to come on the podcast to help make sense of it all. And thankfully for us, the great Tap Franke agreed to come on to share her expert guidance with us. Tapp is a clinical nutritionist and co founder of Hampton's Biomed, a center that provides functional and integrative approaches to health, chronic illness, and longevity. Tapp and I spoke for so long and covered so many topics that I've divided this episode into two parts. Part one, released today, focuses on vitamins, nutrients, gut, biome, genetics, why they're important, how we should test for them, what these tests show, and how we can use them to improve our gut and overall health. Next week's Part 2 focuses on environmental factors in the home that could negatively impact your health and clinically backed longevity treatments that have been shown to reduce your biological age. TAP has literally transformed the way that I think about and approach my own health. This episode, I hope, will do the same for you, too. Well, Tap, it's so great to see you. Thank you so much for coming on the podcast.
- [01:36]
B
Oh, my goodness. Thank you so much for the invitation. I'm honored.
- [01:40]
A
Well, I have a lot of questions for you because I feel like all the amazing work that you do and the services that you offer are just a hot topic among, you know, not just people my age, but people of every age just trying to live a healthy life and figure out what is the best way to support their bodies and their immune system and to try to do it in a natural way first before you need to necessarily go to medicine. So you yourself, though, started on your wellness journey, battling Lyme's disease and not getting any relief from the medicine that was being prescribed to you. Will you tell us a little bit about your own experience and kind of how that led you to the work that you're doing now?
- [02:25]
B
Absolutely. So, honestly, I had a totally different career. I had a completely different life. I had been a fine art major. I was an artist living in New York and then suddenly got this really debilitating disease. This was somewhat around 20 years ago, and nobody could help me. So, you know, I went through standard of care because that was all I knew. I went to the doctors, I went to the neurologists, I went to everybody for support and help because I was experiencing what was a, like a rapid decline in energy cognitive function. I was getting migraines all the time. Like something was wrong. Like, you know, when something is wrong. So I kept pursuing help and wasn't finding it.
- [03:16]
A
Were you diagnosed with Lyme at that point or you just were having these other symptoms? Okay.
- [03:20]
B
Nobody knew anything at this time. And this is also 20 years ago, so this was even less conversation on the topic. And it was when I ended up in this neurologist's office. And I had been to him three or four times for, for migraines and dizziness and all the, the not fun, CNS style symptoms that come with Lyme. And he said to me, I'll never forget it and he'll forever be the villain in my story. And I, I kind of feel bad about that, but then again, I don't. Is he said, why? Why does a girl like you feel the need to seek this kind of attention?
- [04:02]
A
Wow.
- [04:03]
B
That was my eureka moment. I just knew that this was not the avenue I was going to find help. Yeah, I actually ended up finding out that I had Lyme via my primary care. She had just run a standard Lyme test. I came back positive. And then it was finally like, okay, now we have something to work with. And that was terrific. She gave me two weeks of antibiotics, saying, you're going to be all better now. And of course, that's not the case in so many people. And it was really only after I did that initial course of antibiotics and didn't find much relief and that I started down the path of I need to look somewhere else. And that's where I found functional medicine, integrative care, really looking more to healing the body as a whole in order to help heal me from this dysfunction. So since then, I have come to understand that Lyme isn't just Lyme. Lyme isn't just a bacterial infection. It's actually something that affects your whole terrain. Why is one vulnerable to a Lyme infection? Is to do with something in their terrain. Whether it's genetic, whether it's epigenetic, whether it's some other exposure, whether it's a mold exposure, whether it's, you know, habitual. There are so many components that can lead to that poor terrain that then makes you vulnerable to an infection like Lyme. So it took me many years to get to that mindset, but once I got there, the understanding of how to turn your body around from that may started to make sense. Right. So the idea of Lyme being just something that you kill with antibiotics is not the answer or the story. Right. The story is more what's happening in your body and how can we create balance within the system so that the body starts fighting for itself.
- [06:08]
A
So that's interesting. So you're from your perspective, like, you know, the, the course of antibiotics might work for some, but there are some people on. I love that expression, their terrain.
- [06:17]
B
Right.
- [06:17]
A
Based on their own unique body and how that your body is responding to the Lyme. That may require, you know, additional support. And I, you know, doing some research, because I like to do background research, tap for my, my interviews. You know, you, you really feel like you really need to start with nutrition and lifestyle. And I. You had a graphic, I think it was on your Instagram, of a fish in a bowl with clear water and then a fish in a bowl with murky water. I think you're philosophy there being that you need to address kind of the basic pillars of your health, nutrition, exercise, sleep. So you can kind of identify some of the underlying root causes of some of these diseases, whether it's Lyme or autoimmune, you know, other diseases that are, you can address with traditional medicine. But that's not the full story, right?
- [07:05]
B
It's not the full story. And when you're talking about anything that's in the, in the chronic range. So if we're talking about Lyme, long Covid, anything autoimmune, even sort of cancers, diabetes, diabetes, these things that tend to be long term, we're really looking more at the terrain than we are at being able to just go in and give a medication for it. And that really is, I mean, that graphic to me really sums up so much of my philosophy, which is, you got to clean the tank. We can't just throw medication at it. And you know, this whole experience that I had with Lyme, I did fully recover from that experience going back and, and, and reassessing all of those pillars on my own, and then found a wonderful functional medicine doctor who in fact is now my, my partner in Hampton's Biomed. And really together we were able to unravel this puzzle inside of me so that I could be a fully functioning, you know, human being again. And there's an interesting thing that happens And I've seen this happen in, in more people than just me. Once you've had an experience like that and you have been sick like that and not found help through standard of care, when you get better, there is this, this overwhelming obligation to share your experience and help others. You know, there's a great quote, and I'm not going to say exactly correctly, but it's when you come out of the fire, you turn around and reach out your hand and help others.
- [08:45]
A
Yeah, right.
- [08:46]
B
It's not like you just look at the fire and run for the hills. You know, you really have to understand that that is, that is an experience that, that must be shared.
- [08:57]
A
It's interesting. I interviewed a woman, Laura Delano, who wrote a book called Unshrunk. And her experience was, was with mental health and then being prescribed medicine and then having medicine addressed some of the. The side effects of the original medicine. And it wasn't until she stripped all the medicine away for a moment and just looked at kind of her tank did she kind of find a way to find some. A path forward for herself. You know, I have a very close friend who has an autoimmune condition and celiacs. It's a cocktail of different medicines that she's on and has never really figured out how to. I mean, she's been in ICU because her pancreas wasn't working like a really serious health condition. And, you know, perhaps there's something underlying there that she could, she could really take a look at to help improve some of her symptoms.
- [09:47]
B
I think that is 100% true. And that tends to be my basic client base are those people that have a little bit more of a complicated jigsaw puzzle. Right. And then they're just not able to solve it using these traditional approaches. And like I said, anything that's, that's on the chronic level, I feel like you have to have integrative care.
- [10:09]
A
Let's talk terrain, right? Figuring out your terrain as a clinical nutritionist. Your first step, right. Clients come in to see you and how do you assess their overall health and kind of nutritional needs? What do you look at? What lifestyle factors, diet, genetics? What is your first kind of step with an intake of a new client?
- [10:30]
B
My first step is hearing their story.
- [10:32]
A
Okay, Right.
- [10:33]
B
Hearing their story tells me a lot about what I need to know. Additionally, I'm going to run micronutrient testing. Additionally, I may run some genetic testing. Additionally, I may run some, some mitochondrial testing. But their story and what they tell me about their history, their symptoms, their past Their habits, their diet. This is going to tell me more about them than, than anything else. Like that is, is the most crucial appointment that you ever have with anyone is that initial consult, because that's, are, are getting all of that information and you're also able to assess them visually. You're able to see what's their skin color, what do their eyes look like, are there, are there whites of their eyes? White or yellow or red? Are there, do they have any kind of skin condition, how do they sit, how do they present themselves? All of that really tells me what's happening. And just hearing that history and, and it's very, very complex, typically with somebody with an autoimmune condition because you' hear that they had chronic strep when they were kids, you're going to hear that they had a tonsillectomy or you're going to hear that they had an appendectomy. You're going to hear that these, these, this is a pattern. And in their mind it's been one thing after another. But the reality is it's been one thing.
- [12:00]
A
Can we talk through some of those tests you just mentioned? You mentioned a micronutrient test. You mentioned earlier genetics and epigenetic, which I'm curious about what that is because, you know, as a 51 year old woman, I'm, I just went to an endocrinologist who was telling me that my testosterone is so low and my estrogen, so, so I, and you know, and you, I watch these reels of Dr. Mary Claire Haver, who's also talks about how you need to have magnesium and you need to have vitamin B and. But I just feel like it would be so great if we were all just told this is exactly what we need to be doing, you know, for each of these different points in your life, right? When you're, when your body's changing or when you have an autoimmune disease or when you're having gut issues or you're tired. So I'm really curious about, for people, obviously the people that have chronic conditions, but then people who are just kind of going through life and just don't feel great. Client patient number one in front of you. Tap. Just tired all the time, all those kinds of things. How the, you know, what is my terrain? Like what are the, what, what's the story behind that? And so I guess when you mentioned some of those tests, what do those tests actually show you? Like you mentioned micronutrients. Would that be what nutrients or vitamins or minerals are you deficient in. Could we break that down a little bit? Sure, yeah.
- [13:19]
B
So the micronutrient testing is a test called metabolomics, or metabolomics, depending on tomato. Tomato, how you want to pronounce it. But what that's telling you is both intracellular and extracellular nutrients. So the reason why that's important is you can have lots of nutrients in the, in the space outside of the cell, but the question is, what's inside of the cell? So you have to look at that balance. A lot of conditions of fatigue, headaches, and even some mental health conditions can really be mitigated through balancing out those nutrients. If somebody is very deficient, for example, in folate or in B12, they can have anxiety. If somebody is deficient in B2 or riboflavin, they can have a lot of fat. So really looking at where that person is and then either recognizing that there is a gut absorption issue there or, or just replacing that with either foods rich in that vitamin or you take a supplement. Right. So, I mean, there are all kinds of options here, depending on the person. But what that testing would show me is what's needed and then you can start to take a look at why that might be happening. Right. If I look at somebody's metabolomics and I see a lot of availability in, in those nutrients, particularly in the B vitamins, but they're not inside the cell, then I'm going to say, well, there's going to be a genetic component here. Right. There's something that is not allowing those to absorb appropriately, and there may be a genetic piece. So it really depends on what the person's story is in terms of what, what tests they might require. Metabolomics is my favorite one because again, it's that cellular extracellular nutrients. The other test that I really, really like is a gut biome test. I know there's some controversy around gut biome testing because it's not a hundred percent accurate in terms of what your biome looks like. It also, there is no such thing as like a perfect biome.
- [15:19]
A
Anyway, talk about biome a little bit. So, you know, sorry to interrupt you there, but it's okay. I didn't. I recently was reading, I never connected these dots that there's prebiotics and, and probiotics and postbiotics.
- [15:32]
B
Okay.
- [15:33]
A
I didn't know, didn't even know about post. It wasn't even on the menu for me until now. And what are the differences between the two? And that's interesting what you're saying that. So it's not like cholesterol, where you want to have a certain level in your gut biome of these different kind of bacteria. It just is sort of based on your own body, I guess, your own terrain. But will you talk a little bit what those two things do and what, what the test measures? Because there's a test stat. Now I've seen it on Instagram where I get as my children are like, that's where you get all your information. I get a lot of information on Instagram, but hopefully it's all accurate. But the VIOME test is this at home biome test that I've seen. But what do these tests measure? And you mentioned that it's controversial. I hadn't heard that. So I'm curious about in what way there's controversy around it.
- [16:23]
B
First, let's talk about what the biome is. The biome is the collection of microbes that live in your lower intestine, mostly in your large intestine. Those particular bacteria control 90% of your serotonin production, 50% of your dopamine production. I think it's 30% of your GABA production. It's 70 to 90% of your immune cells or your antigens are, are created in the gut biome. So when we talk about this, this sort of microbial population, which is as many as £8 in your gut. So I mean, this is a really large population. They're controlling so much of your body, right? They're controlling your immune function, they're controlling your mood, your digestion, your inflammation is all controlled by these, Us, not us, right? Our biome is bacteria that is not our DNA, right? It's. It's bacteria. It's, it's its own. It's its own thing. So when we talk about what this biome is, it is as unique to us as your fingerprint. So in clinical studies, identical twins who live in the same household, eat the same food, will still have a different biome. So the controversy lives in when we do biome testing. There's no such thing as an ideal biome. So then what is the value of learning your biome if you're, if there's no, if there's no perfection, if there's nothing to really balance it out against? My argument for that is that I don't look at it necessarily as, oh, you have this level of bacteria, that level of bacteria. Unless it's aggressive, right? Unless it's like something that is, that is going to be problematic. Instead, it's that you look at it as intestinal health. So as an overview, I would say that the healthiest biome is going to be the one that is the most diverse. Right. You want to have as much diversity in your microbiome as possible. And by having a high diversity within your microbiome, what you're doing is you're allowing for as many of those productions of neurotransmitters, hormones, immune cells, and postbiotics, which I'll tell you what that is in a second to take place.
- [18:52]
A
Okay?
- [18:54]
B
So the prebiotic here is the, is the food that feeds the probiotic.
- [19:02]
A
Okay.
- [19:03]
B
So fiber is a prebiotic. I say that is the food for the probiotic, which is the biome. That's the microbial population in the gut.
- [19:14]
A
Okay.
- [19:15]
B
What that microbial population produces is a postbiotic. I see.
- [19:23]
A
Now would that be your stool?
- [19:25]
B
You would identify that in your stool. Okay, so that's what those biome tests.
- [19:31]
A
Are going to go, stool here today.
- [19:32]
B
But I, but I, but I do stool every day. I talk poop every day.
- [19:38]
A
I, I seen, you know, we have the book everybody poops just to take the, you know, the, the stigma, you know, out from the whole thing. But, but there, that is a, an indicator, right, if of health, your, your.
- [19:52]
B
Stool, which I literally talk about all day, every day. So I am very, it's like, let's talk stool phobic. I am certainly not stool phobic. I am here to talk about your poop. As a clinical nutritionist, that's literally what you talk about a lot of, is a huge indicator of your gut health, right? So is it regular? Is it daily? Is it formed, what color is it? Is there an acute smell? All of these things are part of that initial consult to see what's happening in the gut. And what I find is that so many people are dysregulated, right? They are either, you know, not able to go to the bathroom. They're going to the bathroom way too often, way too much. It's the wrong or not wrong, but it's not an ideal form, right? It's either too loose, too hard. So all of those things in order for your body to be functioning appropriately. And if you think about, again, what your gut produces, that gut has to be in as good health as possible in order for all your other systems to run. So we look at that gut biome, we look at the, the, the stool, we look at what's in the stool via this, this gut biome testing, and we're able to see where things may, have, may, may need support, whether it's an Inclusion of probiotics, whether it's an inclusion of more specific types of fibers or whether it's really having to knock down some of the more aggressive bacteria that may be creating some issues. So I do find a lot of value in those biome tests, controversy aside.
- [21:30]
A
Okay, really interesting, though. You know what you were saying earlier about how the gut or the large intestine is the producer of your serotonin and your dopamine and that connection, it's sort of your. They talk about your gut and your brain being so connected. I never realized just how connected. That's very impactful. You know, obviously, like what you are, what you eat is. It's kind of taken to a whole new level for me, understanding that, that piece of it, because that those are the two. And I don't know if serotonin, dopamine would be. They're characterized as hormones. I mean, are they.
- [22:09]
B
Yeah, they're neurotransmitters.
- [22:10]
A
Neurotransmitters, exactly. See, I'm forgetting my bio here. But, you know, that there, that. That is produced in the gut is really, really fascinating to me.
- [22:20]
B
So here's another one. The vagus nerve. You're familiar with the vagus nerve?
- [22:25]
A
Yeah.
- [22:25]
B
Right. So that runs between your brain and your gut. Right. It's basically sending signals back and forth. 90% of the information runs up, only 10% runs down. So my argument is always who's in charge? Like, I think it's your gut. Right. 90% of the information running on the vagus nerve is running from the gut to the brain. Only 10 runs from the, from the brain to the gut. So when you say like the gut or when I say the gut is the second brain, I'm like, it's actually kind of the first brain, too. Interesting, because it is so responsible for so many aspects of your mental health.
- [23:08]
A
Right.
- [23:08]
B
And your brain and of your overall health.
- [23:11]
A
So why is it. And maybe it's just because it's. It's always been this way, but it's just becoming more widespread or more known about because of social media or other things. But why is the gut like the New Friday, like your gut? Biome growing up, we never talked. I just don't feel like that that connection was really ever discussed, or it seems it has been the past few years. Is that because there's new research or that that has developed over the, you know, recently in this space and the connection between the two?
- [23:45]
B
There's quite a lot of research in this space right now, and I think there's a lot of interest in individual strains of microbes in the gut and what their various jobs are. Certainly the research is, is a big part of it, but I think a bigger part of it is people are starting to understand how, how their behaviors affect their health and that really does come down to the gut. So the use of excessive antibiotics for ex. Really impact the gut microbiome. Of course, use antibiotics when they're necessary. But you know, there is, there is a certain thing that, that I know did happen, I think it's happening a lot less in standard of care is that you're, you're being given antibiotics for a cold, right. For a virus. And so that every antibiotic is, is impacting your gut microbiome. So when any of my clients need to take an antibiotic and everybody does, I immediately do a six to eight week gut rebuild. Right. You need to literally replenish what was lost and help build that bacterial population that's helping you in so many different ways back up to where, where it was before.
- [25:06]
A
We were in Italy with our children, I don't know, 10 years ago. And one of them, I can't remember which one got had strep throat. We literally went to the hotel, then the pharmacy and the pharmacist gave us prebiotics and probiotics and was very adamant that we take them. And I thought this is so fascinating. Why is this and that's right happening here and we're not getting this information in the US it was not part of. We've never been told. We had great wonderful pediatrician in New York but it wasn't part of their recommendation at the time. So it's really interesting that you know, we gave it. That was one of our sons. We gave it to him because they, you know, they told us that he needed to take it. But obviously they're, they were sort of ahead of the curve over the United States and kind of the importance of that piece of the puzzle when you're taking antibiotics. I wanted to go back for a second about what you were talking about that, the interior and the exterior of. And I don't know if it's, it's not mitochondria, is it? Mitochondria. You were talking about the.
- [26:09]
B
No, it's just the cellular space. So there's like, there's extracellular space and intracellular space.
- [26:14]
A
I was throwing out some bio terms to tap just to get that. But you know, I don't. I had seen Gary Breca on a podcast or a reel somewhere talking about how you can or what he recommends, and I guess they. They're not free, but they cost around five or six hundred dollars, he was saying is to get a methylation test to see how your body is actually, how your genetics actually absorb these nutrients, which is what I think you were. I don't know if it's the same test.
- [26:47]
B
Yeah. So I. I mean, I'd like to clarify something there, and I think this is a really important piece, is that when you talk about your genetics, right, What Gary Brecke is talking about, he has a. He has a methylation test that he looks at the various different genes that help to move or are part of what's called the methyl cycle, right. That create methyl donors. And so if there is a block anywhere there that's going to impact how your body can. Can literally move forward. Everything in your body is a chemical reaction. So you need these methyl donors to create that, that, that response. So when you're talking about any kind of. And I. I'm really going to get up on my soapbox here for a second. When we're talking about this genetic testing that you can do online, the only thing that you're going to learn is potential. Your genetics, your gene, right? You get a gene test, you're going to learn whatever. However many of your genes, you're never going to learn them all. That gene creates an enzyme, and then the enzyme creates a reaction, okay? So when you learn what your genes are, that's all you know. You don't actually know how your body is responding. So when. And that's the epigenetics. So that's the above genetics part. So these genetic tests that just tell you what genes you have is telling you about a tenth of the story.
- [28:22]
A
Okay?
- [28:24]
B
So the way that I've always approached genetics is to look at what is a person's life history, what is their daily. What are their daily habits, what is their diets, what medications are they on, what supplements are they taking. Then you look at their labs, then you look at their micronutrient report. Then you look at their biome. And then as a. As a newer part of the genetic piece, we're really looking now at something called mitomy, which is really looking at the inside of the mitochondria in terms of how it's able to produce energy, okay? Then you take all of that information, which is real life, which is real time. This is what's actually happening in your body, and then you look at the genetic potential and you bring them together, and now you have a really comprehensive view of what is actually happening in your body and the things that you can do to support it. So when you're just looking at the genetics, I feel like you're flying blind.
- [29:29]
A
Right.
- [29:29]
B
And when you're just looking at what's happening currently, you're not understanding some of the whys. So when you bring them together, that's when I think you get like the, the real magic.
- [29:40]
A
Can you give an example of that? Sort of like, because you're mentioning that, you know, the genetic testing is only telling kind of 10% of the story, you know, are there certain genes that you know and I don't even know how they're categorized? Well, I know like for cancer there's the BRCA gene, whatever. There obviously must be genes around nutrition and health that you know, with your expertise. So if someone has it or doesn't have it, what is that telling you with these certain genes? Is it telling you that when you have that gene they don't really process vitamin D very well or what is it? Could you give an example of?
- [30:13]
B
Sure. The most well known one which I think will resonate the most for people who have been listening in this space for a while is the mthfr. So MTHFR is a very well known gene and what that does is it codes for methylfolate. So that's vitamin B9. Right. And that's a big part of this methylation cycle. Like you need to know your MTHFR status. So if you go and you get one of these genetic tests and you find out that you have a genetic variant or you know, a double genetic variant on mthfr, the standard application would be you need to take a methyl folate. Right. So essentially like you're looking at the methylation cycle, B9 enters the methylation cycle and it hits MTHFR. So if that MTHFR has a variant, a single variant, it means that that particular enzyme is reduced by 30%. If it is got a double, then it's reduced by 70%. So that means that B9 hits that enzyme and, and can't really go further. So the idea is you would need to dose somebody on methylfolate in order to frog jump over that mechanism of action of that enzyme in order for it to continue in the folate cycle. Now I, I, there is value in that. However, if you balance that against testing and you can see actually where their benign status is, they may not actually need to be dosed on methylfolate. They may actually be making up for that in their diet and in their lifestyle choices and in quite honestly, all the other genes that work in. In constellation with mthfr. So just knowing the status of a gene doesn't to me tell you very much. Right. I need to know, well, what else is going on? Right? I need to know first of all, what are the genes around it say, right? What is their status and also what is your individual micronutrient status with vitamin B9, both intracellular and extracellular. Right. I need to know all that before I can say, in fact, you know what, maybe methylfolate would be a good choice for you because maybe it won't.
- [32:42]
A
That's a question. So, you know, I wish I took a picture of the tray in my kitchen that has my husband and I am like, some days there's creatine, other, there was something like an oregano oil that one of us ordered. I, you know, I was looking at that this morning. We've got B, we've got D, there's C. You know, I don't know what we're doing. I mean, and I, I know everybody.
- [33:06]
B
Needs to be managed. Yeah, right. Like everybody needs to be managed by somebody that knows this information. Because you can do it.
- [33:14]
A
Yeah, you can do harm. That's what I know.
- [33:16]
B
But you can do harm. Yeah, absolutely.
- [33:19]
A
So you really need to know because let's say you're taking too much B, you're using the example of the, the circle and frog jumping and what you need, I mean, potentially, as you just mentioned, it could, you could cause damage if you don't, you're putting too much in or it's really a very delicate balance. So it seems like everybody should be having this testing done to understand what the landscape is.
- [33:42]
B
Honestly, I don't think anybody should walk into a health food store and dose themselves on supplements. Right. I think that that should be guided by testing and I think it should be guided by somebody who's educated in what is, is going to be appropriate for your body. Because there are a lot of things that go wrong and there are a lot of supplements that are not appropriate for certain people, even though it seems like they're great. Like, you'll hear it about it on Instagram and everyone's gonna want to run to that particular supplement. But, but maybe that's not appropriate for you. And I'll give you an example. There's another genetic, there's another gene called Comti, like Com tea, when it has a double variant on it, significantly downregulates your body's ability to get rid of things. Right. It slows down the Process. So if you take somebody who say, has a single variant on mthfr, right. And so they're told, oh my God, you've got to take say 1200 micrograms of methylfolate. But what they find is they take that and they have horrible anxiety. It's because that comti is going so slow that they can't then get rid of it. Right. Like you can create problems for yourself that you didn't have before by taking the supplements that are supposed to be helping you. Which is why I think it's so important to look at the whole picture.
- [35:07]
A
Yeah, yeah, for sure. And so whole picture again, for people that are listening, obviously you would be a great first stop, obviously to have all this testing done. But you want to look at your gut biome, you want to do a micronutrient test, you want to do genetic testing. Is epigenetic testing on.
- [35:27]
B
No, no, epigenetic. It's actually an interpretation of the genetics.
- [35:31]
A
Okay.
- [35:31]
B
So the EPI part of it is that how is above genetics. So it's like what is influencing your genetics? So that's the lifestyle, that's the diet, those are the supplements, those are the medications, those are the tests. Right. That's telling you that's the EPI part.
- [35:46]
A
Okay. And then micronutrients is really just. Is that a blood test looking at your, your vitamin levels and your mineral levels in your blood?
- [35:53]
B
Yeah, the particular one I use is a urine test, but you can do it with blood.
- [35:57]
A
Okay. What would you say for the clients that you're seeing? What is the most common thing that they're lacking with nutrients or vitamins? Is it people low being low in vitamin D? Is it, is it one particular thing or is it just sort of across the board depending on the person?
- [36:14]
B
I think it's very person dependent. But some of the things that I see really regularly are vitamin D deficiencies, which can have a really big impact on not only, you know, bone health and immune health, but really looking at, you know, optimizing that D level is really important. And I do find that, that people generally are pretty low in that, you know, some, some less so than others. And another important thing to understand again on that sort of dosing, people dosing themselves is they'll hear me say, or some other, you know, person on, on Instagram or on a podcast, say vitamin D is so important, and then they'll go down to their local health food store and they'll buy some vitamin D, but they don't know what their vitamin D status is. Right. So vitamin D can also be toxic. Right. Because it's a fat soluble vitamin. Your body holds onto it so you can be too high. You know, same thing with vitamin A. So though vitamin D deficiency is really common, I also see a lot of vitamin D toxicity.
- [37:19]
A
Interesting. So I just had my blood work done at my annual physical and my doctor called me. He says, you're vitamin D deficient. I always am. And he said, you need to take supplements last. You got to take some supplements. But I didn't, you know, he didn't say you need to take a thousand IUs or two thousand IUs or. He didn't sort of tell me how much to take. But if you're doing these tests, these tests that you're. You would actually be able to tell a patient. Exactly.
- [37:48]
B
Well, I would be able to tell how much you needed to take based on your vitamin D result.
- [37:55]
A
Okay. And then how long does it take to take someone from being deficient to being. I guess it's a proficient or efficient.
- [38:05]
B
Sufficient.
- [38:09]
A
Proficient. Feels like proficient.
- [38:13]
B
I don't know about that one.
- [38:15]
A
Sufficient. Thank you. Tap. There we are. So, but. So how long does that usually take?
- [38:21]
B
So that depends on the person, but typically, if you're dosing them on the right level, they can become sufficient in about a few weeks.
- [38:29]
A
Okay. Oh, that's great.
- [38:30]
B
But that just depends. I mean, there are so many factors, like there are a lot of genetic factors here in terms of how your body absorbs D and how your body manufactures D that that will also guide sort of best practices on how much to give and how often.
- [38:48]
A
That brings us to the end of this episode of Duologue. A huge thank you to Tap Frankie for joining. Be sure to tune in to next week's episode of part two of our conversation. If you enjoyed this episode, please rate and review us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. A new podcast is released every Wednesday. So until next week, this is Leslie and thanks for listening to Duologue.