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The Jew and Gentile Podcast
Trouble in the skies, Don't forget the parapet, Touch grass moment, and Ikh hob dikh lib, Adon (Episode #189)
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- [00:10]
A
Hello, everybody, and welcome to another Jew and Gentile podcast. I am your host, Chris Katulka, and with me is none other than the Jewish sage himself, the one, the only, Mr. Steve Herzig. How are you, sir?
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B
I am really good, Chris. I wrote an article for the magazine about a giant and now I know where the giant's gonna be.
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A
Oh, you. The giant's moving.
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B
The giant is in New Jers.
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A
Okay. What is this giant?
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B
I wrote an article about a giant that is 16.5 meters high, 54ft. The giant is one of the world's tallest moving statues and it can mimic anyone in their appearance. I wrote about it, I think a couple years ago. I don't know if you, you never read my article anyway.
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A
I do. I remember that one. We talked about it, actually.
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B
Laura helped me find the information about that and I thought to myself, myself, what happened to that giant? We wrote about it. It was a big deal. And so I typed in Google and typed about the giant and then it says out of the NorthJersey.com it tells us about the statue. That's the giant. A 50 foot tall moving statue is coming to American dream.
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A
That's a big. I think that's right outside of New York City in New Jersey.
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B
Yeah, this is from last year, actually. January17. So I imagine it's there now.
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A
Oh, it could be gone by now.
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B
I don't know. It's in East Rutherford.
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A
Okay, there we go.
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B
That's it. So we'll put that in the show notes.
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A
Yeah. In case you're in New Jersey, you want to go see the big giant that Steve wrote about.
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B
That was. That was here and maybe not here anymore. I'm sending it to you right now, Chris.
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A
Thank you very much.
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B
As we go. And by the way, get a pin for free.
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A
That's right, get a pin. Text us at 42444, 1948 and you can. I'll send you a link. When you says, I'm going to send you a link. I'll say hello to you. We'll, we'll. We'll chat for a moment. I'm going to send you a link. You can get 50 free stickers and a Israel. An American pin with. Actually, I've never seen that one before. Steve with a star David. Oh, we got a Canadian one, too.
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B
And yeah, they're all different because I think they're dated. I've collected a few.
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A
Oh, look at you. You are a collector of fine pins.
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B
Yeah, well, I'm willing to give them away.
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A
That's 4 2, 4, 4, 4, 1948.
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B
Just contact us and I'll get rid of these pins.
- [02:32]
A
There you go. Hey, listen, everybody. Steve was down in DFW Metroplex, that Dallas Fort Worth Metroplex, and he was hosting an event. I'm sorry, you were the MC of an event.
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B
Please.
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A
Bill and Sally Ziprick. Excuse me.
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B
So upset.
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A
Let me rewind.
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B
They worked very hard. I just came in, said, hey, how you doing?
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A
All right, let me rewind. Bill and Sally Ziprick, great friends of ours and TIKVA volunteers. Steve's right. They hosted the event. They put the whole thing together. Steve went down to MC the event, which was to just share with people ways that they can get involved with Friends of Israel. And so it was a. I think, what, 20 some odd people showed up from all around the area.
- [03:14]
B
And we. I came out with a line that I love because Sally is so organized. Chris. I was walking around the house. She has several different vacuum cleaners and brooms, and they're arranged in order. They're arranged in, like, height order. I said, oh, man, you really do this right. So when I stood up to talk to everyone, I said, sally is scripted and I'm unscripted. And she came up to me and said, that's true.
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A
Yeah, you are unscripted. Well, the thing, though, is. So Steve is we were texting back and forth during the event because it's something we were. We love hosting or we love running these events, I should say. They're called interest meetings. And so if you ever have somebody you, maybe you're at a Bible study, you've got 10 people or 15 people, friends that you think might be interested in learning more about the Friends of Israel. We'd love to send somebody out there to. To. To. To share about ways they can get involved. And that's what Steve did when he went down to dfw. But while he was at the airport waiting to fly back, he sends me a text, and all I see is this line. You ready?
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B
Yep.
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A
Digestion issues. Not surprised. Okay. So I wrote back to him, what's happening? You okay? And then I looked up and I saw an article, and I said, oh, he's not talking about his own digestion issues. He's talking about this article that he sent me from Jerusalem Post. That Pilot has Orthodox Jewish passenger arrested for a hogging bathroom. Comments on how Jews act. So I said, we got to lead with this one when we do the podcast. So what happened, Steve?
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B
Well, I'm reading this article about this Orthodox Jewish man who shortly after the Plane took off. He went into the bathroom, and he was there for 30 minutes.
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A
I didn't know they were keeping track.
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B
30 minutes. And he. His issue was things weren't rolling along like they should be rolling along, and people were. You know, you got to get. You only have one bathroom in the regular section, and then in first class, you get another one. But I don't think he was in first class. I'm not sure. But either way, he was hogging the bathroom. He. And so he. They actually dragged him out with his pants down.
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A
That is mind blowing.
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B
Mind blowing. And I think he wants to sue because he's so embarrassed. But the problem. Look, I understand the problem. Jewish. Look, we wrote the books on digestive issues.
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A
Remember?
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B
What our ibs. We have all kinds of issues.
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A
When. When the. This organization had a CEO that was Jewish, he started a program called ibs. That's. It wasn't Ital bowel syndrome. It was the Institute of Biblical Studies.
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B
But still. But it couldn't. Far from his heart. That's right. So this actually happened. And I'm telling you, it just. It caught my eye be. Because of the issue. When I first met my wife and we were walking down the boardwalk, I did have some pain in the stomach area. So much so I was bent over. And this. We weren't married yet. My wife said, oh, yeah, yeah, I'm like walking down the boardwalk with a monkey. And I said, you're just gonna have to get used to this. We have. Jewish men have stomach issues.
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A
That's right. The. The Institute of Biblical Studies. The ibs.
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B
Right. That's right. Leave.
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A
Said he was, quote, experiencing constipation and that he would be out shortly.
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B
He said 30 minutes is short when you're in that kind of trouble.
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A
Really, that's nothing anymore.
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B
So I was wondering why I didn't take a Jerusalem Post with them. You. You might as well catch up on the news.
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A
Well, I promise you, somebody is currently probably up in the air reading the Jerusalem Post all about this issue and saying, I got to get out of here ASAP from this bath or you'll.
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B
Get caught with your pants.
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A
All right? So anyway, Steve, I thought that was kind of funny because you wrote hilarious stomach. What was the line again that you wrote to me? I'm checking right now. Digestion issues. Not surprised it wasn't you. It was that poor guy, that Orthodox Jewish man.
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B
Yeah, yeah.
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A
Up in the air.
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B
Imagine going on an LL flight where almost everybody is Jewish, so you can.
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A
Never get in the bathroom.
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B
You'll never get in the bathroom.
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A
All right. Well, as I'm sure people are tuning out right now, as we see, we.
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B
Chased three of the seven out.
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A
That's right. Well, Steve, let's talk about. We've been going through various laws of the Bible and last week we talked about boiling a calf in its mother's milk from Exodus and also from Deuteronomy mentioned three times in the, in the Torah law. And so when it's mentioned three times, it's used in a very unique way. And we talked about the various arguments that were presented and one that I had never thought of before. And, and it seemed like you, it kind of hit you as a new idea about that, about that concept, because an entire, an entire law is built around that phrase. The idea of boiling a calf in its mother's milk. Entire systems are of, of, of Judaism are built around kosher laws. All of it are built around those things. My wife once brought her cheese pizza into a, when we were at Israel once and brought it into a, a hamburger place. And hey, the whole place exploded because of the cheese and the meat. They could lose their license a hundred percent. And so. But this particular article said this could have just been an idiom to talk about new things versus old things.
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B
The old generation and the new generation. You don't mix them together.
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A
That's right. So very fascinating. But there are other laws too, Steve. And we were talking about last week how Israel and the Jewish people have influenced Western culture. That. And you even went to the. As far as to say you invented Western society.
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B
That wasn't my idea. We, we were reading an article about that.
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A
100%. Yes.
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B
That's a whole article.
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A
There's a book written about it that's coming out.
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B
That's. That's exactly right. And so the, the idea of next time any of our seven listeners go through the Torah, most of the time you have people and I'm one of them. Oh, man. I'm reading through the Bible and you got to go through some Leviticus and Deuteronomy and all these laws and what do they mean and do they have any. What can I learn? Since Jesus fulfilled the law and we're not, the church is not bound under the law. Is there any advantage to reading about them? Are they significant to us? Well, it's interesting as I've, I'm reading chronologically through the Bible. I think I mentioned that.
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A
Where are you right now?
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B
Right now I'm in Judges.
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A
Okay.
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B
Right, right. No, about to enter Judges. I'm now all the land in Joshua given to the various tribes. That's where I am right now, given this. And it's by the mountain here and it's go to this place and I.
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A
Would love to see you, you know, when Joshua is delegating out all the land and you're like, zyga zun. Just where do I. But this mountain is. Where's my zeitgeist? You do you. I'll be over here.
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B
And he's talking about, you know, Ekron and Gaza and.
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A
Ashkelon. Ashdod.
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B
Yep. All those cities along the coast. And I'm just reading. But it's. Why read all this stuff? It's God's word. It's as though God were telling you vocally. So it. Cat, you have to say, man, this is important. But I feel like a 10 year old, you know, when this parent is talking to him and he's hearing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And the parent is going through all this stuff 100%. So it's significant. And why all these various rules? Let me just read. I had texted you this from Deuteronomy 22. Just.
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A
And these are. It's a sampling of various laws. We want to draw this out a little bit because sometimes I think the laws get confused in people's minds about what the laws are. But Steve, go ahead. Maybe you can let me.
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B
Well, first, in Deuteronomy 22, it says this. When you build a new house, okay, there's a lot of building going on. When you build a new house. God is now telling them when you do it, it's going to happen. Then you shall make a parapet for your roof. So now he's an architect.
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A
That's right.
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B
He's going to say if you're building and it's a high rise, more than one floor, you better put a parapet there. Why? Because that you may not bring guilt of bloodshed on your household if anyone falls from it.
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A
That's right.
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B
So he wants to prevent a lawsuit and he wants to make sure that no one gets hurt. You shall not sew your vineyard with different kinds of seed.
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A
Now can we just say too, a parapet is. It's a guard rail.
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B
Yeah, it's a. Yeah, it's a fence in front of the thing so. Or around so that you won't fall off. Kids are up there, adults are up. Hey Chris, we've seen in like Colorado in the mountains, people have fallen because there is no parapet. Yeah, yeah. There is no parapet. So we'll talk about all these. But I just want to Go. The next one is now you're a farm. God's a farmer now. Oh, you're building a vineyard. You're going to plant a vineyard. You better make sure that the seeds are the same. Don't mix your seeds. Make sure, lest you yield the seed which you have sown and the fruit of your vineyard be defiled. So in other words, if it isn't all of one thing, it's now defiled. According. You can't mix well.
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A
And this, this will become huge in, in how the law gets developed through Judaism. The idea of you can't mix certain by mixing anything.
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B
Wait, wait, there's another one here. You shall not plow with an ox and a donkey together. They got to be this. You got to be two oxes or two donkeys.
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A
And Paul will pick up on that later on as well. You know, to be evenly yoked, you.
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B
Got to be evenly.
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A
When you get married, you want to be evenly.
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B
All these things come to play. You shall not wear a garment of different sorts, such as wool and linen mixed together. So that means that if you're Jewish and you're following the law, you can't, you can't do. You can't put different materials together. You shall, ah, this one a lot of people already know. You shall make tassels. You shall make tassels on the four corners of your clothing with which you cover yourself. So we have the sitsit, which are tassels, attached to a like scarf. We call that the talit. And wearing tassels, when I was very young, raised in that very Orthodox synagogue, I went to an Orthodox camp. And you have to wear an undershirt. And then over your undershirt you wear these. It's like a. It's got the front looks like a bib, but it's got the back. So it's. You got an open head, you put your head through it. On the front are two tassels and on the back are two tassels. So God told us we have to have four tassels. Now, the reason given to me, which made sense, by the way, oh, that reminds us of the Jewish people scattered to the four corners of the earth. It also reminds us of the laws. The knots in them are 613knots in those tassels. And so. And the tassels, rabbinically, the tassels have to be exposed. So if you go to synagogue or, I mean, if you go to Israel or you go to an Orthodox synagogue, you'll see Jewish men with. It looks like, wait, don't they tuck their pants in? They got, they got these strings hanging out of their pants. They have to. That's according. That comes right out of the Torah.
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A
That's right, the law.
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But all these things promote order. There is. God is interested in details and he's interested in keeping things pure.
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A
That's right.
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B
Right. And he's trying to prevent defilement.
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A
Well, and also, you know, that, that's why I'm saying sometimes the law gets confused because we can. We. We oftentimes think of the law in terms of like a ritualistic religion. You know, we, we separate, you know, because of the culture that we live in, which you so, you know, which you helped invent, which is amazing. We've also created this division between the church and the state. So the things that are holy and the things that are sacred and the things that are from the scriptures, we keep over here. But then the things that are political and the things that are the things of order in, in politic and, and, and community and structure of how we do our towns and mayors and, and senators and all, you know, that's over here. We separate the two. Where God doesn't do that in the law. There. The Ten Commandments are a perfect picture of how we relate with God. And just in the main framework of the law, the Ten Commandments, it's how we relate with God vertically and how we relate with one another next to each other. So how we honor him and how we honor each other are all bound up in the Ten Commandments. But what's interesting is that sometimes the laws are basic laws to help ensure that there's just safety in the community, you know, and build a parapet. Yeah, it's, it's. Think about it.
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B
You don't want somebody falling over.
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A
Well, think about, you know, I hate this. We in the state of New Jersey, you know, I, I have my own opinions about how they manage building codes and, and permits and whatnot. It's a very strict system that they have. I think one time when I moved in, I said, the guy talking to me was talking about permits in the house. He goes, well, you don't have to get a permit to paint and you don't have to get a permit to lay down new floor. And I go, wait, so everything else I need a permit for. Basically, you need a permit for everything. And then I have to go get a permit and I have to. But you know what God is doing permitting here? He's saying you cannot just have the open part of your house, you know, without Any guardrails or somebody could fall off. And then the. What's the point that, you know, the bloodshed is the idea that someone's died on your property. That's not good for you. Nope, that is not good for you. Even earlier on, he'll say In Deuteronomy, chapter 22, if you. If you see your fellow Israelites ox or sheep straying, do not ignore it. But do not. Do not know. Do not ignore it, but do not know who owns it. Take it home with you and keep it until they come or anything else they have lost. Do not ignore it. Help your neighbor out.
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B
You're getting trouble if you ignore it.
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A
That's right.
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B
You have to keep it.
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A
It's the Good Samaritan law. You know what I mean?
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B
You know what I pictured when I read that? I. Oi, I'm gonna take this. They're gonna accuse me of stealing the thing.
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A
Do you know what happened?
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B
Now I've got real tourists.
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A
Well, do you know what happened to me? Once a couple, when I first moved to New Jersey, got a knock on the door in the evening and somebody handed us. UPS handed us a box. We order things all the time through mail. So UPS brings a box and I open it up and it was a brand new Apple Watch. And I look at Karen. I go, did you order an Apple Watch? He goes, no. She goes, did you order an Apple Watch? I go, no. So I got this brand new Apple Watch. I have no idea who it's for, what it's, you know, our address on there, our name, all of it.
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B
Oh, your name, too.
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A
I believe the whole thing was to us. Somehow it came to us, okay? So I look at it and I go, well, I'm just going to put this on top of the refrigerator. Someone's going to call me. I know it. Well, nobody calls for like a week. So I'm. I go, I'm going to call ups. And UPS goes, not our problem. So I said, all right, well, I'll call Apple. So I call Apple and I go, I got this brand new watch. I'm not ignoring you.
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B
Called Apple and got a live person.
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A
I did. Oh, yeah, they're pretty good with customer service.
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B
Unbelievable.
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A
So I call them, I say, I've got this serial number, blah, blah, blah. And they go, purchase done. Nothing we can do unless you want to bring it into the store. And I go, I'm not bringing it into this. Look it. I'm not going to bring this thing into the store. I'm trying to help you all out So I keep it up there. And several months goes by, we never open it up. We never open it. And sure enough, one night knock on the door. This person's at the door. She goes, do you happen to have an Apple watch? And I go, yes, we do. She goes, we live at the same address in a different town, and they put the wrong information in there. And I go, really? And she goes, I've been waiting for you to turn it on so then I could say you stole it. She told me so because it will beep where it is the moment it logs in. She could see where it is. And Apple's like, just wait till they open it. You'll find it right away. We never opened it. And so again, it's a perfect. We didn't ignore it.
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B
How did she find you?
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A
Because she just did some basic, like, well, if I'm in this town, our towns have very similar names and we have the same address. And over. This was the first time it happened. We've gotten. We've gotten pizzas and Chinese.
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B
Did you tell her you called?
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A
Oh, I told her everything. I said, I've called ups. I called the Apple store. I promise you, it's been sitting up in this box unopened, you know, and she's very grateful for it. She bought it for her husband who was going over to, you know, serve in the military.
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B
Oh, man.
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A
And so hopefully she got it to her. But we didn't open it. We didn't ignore it. None of that. But that's the whole point is don't steal it. Don't take it for yourself. If you see your fellow Israelites, Verse four, donkey or ox falling on the road, don't ignore it. Help the owner get to its feet. If a woman must not wear men's clothing. Oh, now we're getting into. Nor a man wearing women's clothing for the Lord. That's right. It says it right there. That's all I can say, people. But it goes on and it gives laws that are often. There are various laws, but the laws are also just basic laws that you might read in your local state laws or your local town laws or your local. The federal laws. They're very. Some of them are very basic laws on how we relate with one another as well. Like the building code of putting up a guide, a guardrail.
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B
The difference is, Chris, I mean, we can incorporate them. And I, I. We would make. You and I would make the argument some of these have been incorporated. We invented. Our people, invented law and order, Western civilization.
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A
That's it.
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B
But these words actually come from God. So those who believe in the Bible, when you read these, they take more significance than just your civil government. Look, there's much to be said about civil government, both in the Old Testament as we're reading. The Apostle Paul makes sure that believers, as he wrote to the church in Rome in, in Romans 13 about their representatives of God, the people who are lawmakers are actually representatives of God. And so you have to respect them, which. So the Bible is overflowing into the culture and those who want to separate it. That's where you get craziness, mishigas. We've already done that word, mishigas, craziness. It doesn't mean we're bound under the law, but we should at least respect and try to understand what is being said and should we use those as principles in our everyday life?
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A
Well, and even the Apostle Paul picks up on a lot of the laws and moves them into. Like we said with marriage, you know, talking about don't mix the. Don't have a donkey and an ox together. Well, now he's talking about the issue of marriage and he's saying don't a.
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B
Donkey and an ox. And now we're talking about like who's the ox and who's the dog.
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A
I don't want, I don't, I don't want to go that far.
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B
It's just being unequally yoked.
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A
That's the point.
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B
The animals.
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A
That's right. Well, and it talks then about mixturing, mixing things. And Steve, I, I found this. I always like to use this Old Testament commentary that kind of highlights some of the more cultural things that were going on. And the author says some mixtures were considered to be reserved for sacred use. The mixing of wool and linen was used in the tabernacles and in the high priest's outer garments and was reserved for those uses. So it separates, makes it holy. That's right. This interpretation is offered in the Dead sea scrolls of 4 q. Mmt. Sewing of two types of seed is also prohibit prohibited in Hittite laws with a death threat to violators. While it is not entirely clear why these mixtures were prohibited, it is possible that their origin is based on either religious or cultural taboos. The fact that the crop is defined, filed or forfeited to the priesthood suggests religious implications and perhaps a reaction to a Canaanite fertility ritual or practice. In Leviticus 19:19, the prohibition is against mating two kinds of animals, while here it is concerning plowing with them together. Experiments with hybrid. Hybridization and crossbreeding are attested as early as 3rd millennium BC so you can see that sometimes when God designed the laws, they could be as something as simple as, look, you're you, you. You're not in the law. You're not supposed to murder. So how do we make sure that we're not killing and people aren't dying? Well, you put guard. Guard rails up on your home. That's a. A good basic law. But then sometimes they were overlaid. Law, law in the Old Testament was overlaid so that culturally and spiritually God is moving you away from the Canaanite or Hittite cultures that were embedded in the land already. Remember as Steve was mentioning earlier, about the Israelites coming in with Joshua and he's, you know, designating out the lands and whatnot, there were still people living in the lands that were not Israelites.
- [25:35]
B
Those people are being judged. Their sin is full. And now he's using his chosen people to come in and to do judgment on them and giving them the land.
- [25:45]
A
Giving them the land. But then also trying to reinforce through the law that this is the way you're supposed to follow me. This is going to separate you or else you're just going to look like the Canaanites or else you're just going to look like the Hittites or else you're just going to look like the parasites or Jebusites.
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B
Hey, they did. They already did that a few years back when they became back like the Egyptians.
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A
That's right.
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B
They built the. We're all capable of going back into that kind of practice.
- [26:10]
A
100. So these were just some various laws that, that border on the basic. Hey, the building code. Help each other out to the, you know, don't ignore each other. Help each other, be with one another. You're in a community together. To more even religious mixing. The idea of mixing things right down to the tassels that Jewish people wear as a reminder of the 613 laws. Steve, I often hear this and I'm interested your thoughts. People will say, and I've heard Christians say the law. I could never keep the law. I could never. When you hear that, what is that a reality or is that a kind of a misunderstanding of the law?
- [26:50]
B
Actually, Chris, I got saved by trying to follow the law there. You could keep the law from a human standpoint. The problem is you're supposed to do it every day, all the time, and not mess up. The law taught me I was a sinner way before I even heard the gospel. I knew that I could not Follow the law. I knew that by junior high I was going to Hebrew school. And I remember asking my teacher about that, and he was a great guy. I think we talked about this early on in our podcast career where he was the. He was the first one to keep kosher at University of Michigan. They didn't have it. He flew it in. So this guy, I respected him. And I remember saying, no one could keep the law 100%. 100% of the time. What you do on Tuesday, you might not do on Wednesday. And what you. It's just impossible. And so he said, you do the best you can. Well, that's not what the law teaches. God is holy. And so the law, just as the. I related to the Apostle Paul and what he was saying. The law is wholly just and good. There's nothing wrong with the law. What's wrong is us.
- [28:12]
A
Right?
- [28:12]
B
Jesus did every law required he did without messing up, without failure. He is holy. He was. He was the only one who was able to do that. But that doesn't make the law bad. So if somebody says, I can't keep the law, I tell him, I agree, you can't keep the law. But what does the law teach us? That's the key. The law teaches us sin. Well, then how, if the law won't clean me up, how do I get clean in order to please God? Well, that's the whole gospel message. God sent his son, who knew no sin, that we who are big time sinners might believe in him. And therefore his righteousness drapes over our righteousness.
- [29:00]
A
You know, I'm reading a book right now, Steve, by. Yeah, good for you. Yeah, it is an accomplishment. If I can make it through. It's written by an Israeli scholar. His name is Yair Frustenberg, and the book is called Purity and Identity in Ancient from the Temple to the Mishnah. Wow. And it is something else. And the whole premise is we're talking about the laws here, is that you have the Torah, you have the Torah law. And then what happens is, of course, over time in Judaism, they begin to layer the laws with more laws, and they become mandatory.
- [29:37]
B
Building a fence around the law.
- [29:39]
A
That's right. And there's a whole class, there's a whole podcast that we could do on that. But what's fascinating about this book is that the Pharisees and the Sadducees did not write that much about what they did. So the greatest insight that we have about the law from the Pharisees and Sadducees, from the new. From. From The New Testament. The greatest like resources that we have about what they believed and what they held to. Actually for Jewish people to know what they did, you have to go to the New Testament. And that's the. One of the greatest resources, which is amazing to me. And then you have another one from that time period, which is the Dead Sea Scrolls. And you have Josephus writing a few things as well. But there, a lot of scholars argue that you can never really get back to what the Pharisees wrote in the Mishnah. And the Mishnah is a series of those laws that were developed for centuries that eventually were kind of codified into a book called the Mishnah by 200 BC by the famous Rabbi Judah Hanisi. And so he develops the Mishnah and he puts it together. He collates all of these arguments about the law and the way that the people should live and things like that. And so scholars have tried to dig in and say, well, we can find out what the Pharisees believed by going into the depths of the Mishnah. And their, their laws will come boiling out, you know, if we do that. So over the years, many scholars have tried to do that and they go, it's impossible because the guy who wrote it all is using, yeah, we, he could be using these old Pharisaic laws, but he's used them for his time period and he wrote them with such confidence and reworked them that it's basically just laws for the people. We can never really separate the Pharisees laws from the ones that were codified by Judah Hanisi. There's just no way to pull them apart. We'll never know. Well, he's writing this, this guy, Yair Fustenberg, and he's saying, no, we can go back, we can uncover through the Mishnah what the Pharisees were teaching in the law. So I'll let you know what I come up with.
- [31:44]
B
Please do.
- [31:44]
A
It's a very fascinating things. But you know, what he calls. As a Jewish man, I appreciate it. He goes the only way. The greatest insights that we have come from the Qumran period and from. He calls it the Jesus tradition. So what we would call the New Testament, but the Jesus tradition and what was built around that. So anyway, when we think about the laws, it's not just in, in Torah, this is. We're looking at the heartbeat. We're looking. When we look at Deuteronomy, we study these things. We're looking at the, the, the core of the law. The law. But then what happens over the years is that it gets built upon and built upon to the point like what we had mentioned earlier, you have laws that are built upon laws about mixing and how much you can mix to this and how much you can mix of that, or what plates you can use because of milk and meat. And all of these things are built upon just a simple sentence that comes out of Deuteronomy or Exodus or Leviticus.
- [32:36]
B
Well, you know, Chris, there's a lot of practicing Jewish people. I mean, they're Orthodox, they're committed to the system, and that's a discipline, but they don't necessarily. Some of them don't read the original. They're not familiar with actual what the text says. In fact, there's a group of them who believe that you can't really understand the Bible until you get to the Kabbalah, and you can't study the kabbalah until you're 40 years old and have reached a certain plane. So for them, you're supposed to fall in line, follow what the rabbis teach, and then hopefully someday you'll be able to understand you. It's free country. People read. But you're really not going to understand until you reach the zenith year of understanding, which. Chris. I remember being in Atlantic City and sitting under a giant pavilion, and we used to do that on purpose. I have a loud voice, and if I would get into a conversation, I made sure anybody at the pavilion heard it was intentional. That's right. So. So I would. I had a great opportunity to share my faith at a pavilion in Atlantic City. And I saw a couple of individuals, very religious, and they came up to me near the end of our conversation, and they were headed out, and they said, you know what you're saying, you don't know what you're talking about. You. You won't. You're too young. You don't. The text, you. You could read it, but you'll never understand it. You have to go to a certain school at a certain age, and then maybe you'll understand. And I, I said to them, you mean God gave the Torah to elite people? I. I don't just. And they said. And, you know, they abruptly left. The Bible doesn't say that. He remember, he get. Moses gathered everyone later on, Ezra, he gathers everyone. The amazing thing is that they stood the whole time listening.
- [34:41]
A
Yeah.
- [34:41]
B
Can you. Can you.
- [34:42]
A
Listening from Genesis to Deuteronomy.
- [34:46]
B
How did they do that?
- [34:48]
A
You know, do you remember we had the Orthodox guy come in one time?
- [34:51]
B
I do.
- [34:52]
A
And he was telling. He wanted to partner with us. And it was. He had a great thing going on. And. But he goes, but you. You just don't understand. Well, we do understand.
- [35:01]
B
To go to his classes in order.
- [35:03]
A
To understand you're not at the level that I'm at. That's what he would say, things like that. You know, you're not at the level that I'm at. But it's funny to me. What do you need to know? Don't. Don't. When you build a home, put a rail around it so people don't get hurt.
- [35:16]
B
Don't have a donkey and an ox together when you're plowing, even though you might be thinking of marriage.
- [35:22]
A
That's. That's a right. It's not that hard. Sometimes it's right there in your face.
- [35:27]
B
Exactly.
- [35:28]
A
All right. Well, Steve, you know, speaking of spiritual things, I just want a quick reminder before we get to the news that the friend. That the Friends of Israel's Jew and Gentile podcast is sponsored by FOI Equip. That is your opportunity to learn the Bible from a Jewish perspective. And why is that important? Well, because the Bible's Jewish, that's why. From Genesis to Revelation, the whole thing is Jewish. Your Messiah is Jewish. Your Savior is Jewish. Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, Jewish. Peter, Jewish, James Jewish. You name it, they're all Jewish. So why not learn the Bible from the culture that they came into and understood and how God used the Jewish people to bring a blessing to the entire world through Jesus, the Jewish, Jewish Messiah? You can find all of that by going to foi equip.org you can become an equipper. And on April 10, we have a class coming up, a Survivor story. In fact, you're gonna.
- [36:21]
B
This is amazing, Chris. Our survivors of the Holocaust are almost completely dead.
- [36:26]
A
That's right.
- [36:27]
B
They're almost gone. There are, thank God, a few left. But this is our opportunity, Their opportunity. An encounter to zoom in, literally on zoom, and hear a survivor, his story. It's an amazing opportunity.
- [36:43]
A
Yep. George Rishfield's gonna share about his story of being a Holocaust survivor. And it's gonna. It's something that you need to come here. And as Steve mentioned, we're. We're kind of at that last phase of history where we're gonna be able to hear from. Directly from the mouth of a survivor. And so this is your opportunity to do that if you've never before. Again, it's called a survivor story. It's free. All you have to do is go to FOI equipped.org and there you can register and, and, and Chris, we have a free offer.
- [37:13]
B
Give them a free. Free offer. A download. How do they do that?
- [37:17]
A
That's right.
- [37:18]
B
And what is it?
- [37:18]
A
Okay, so we want to give you a free Passover devotional. We, Steve and I worked with our team on the field, our interns, our colleagues at Friends of Israel, to develop a brand new, a devotional for you called Finding Messiah and Passover. We had Finding Messiah and Christmas. Well, now we have Finding Messiah and Passover. And what we did is we took the book that Jewish people use to walk through the story of redemption, the story of God leading the Israelites out of Egypt.
- [37:46]
B
It's called a Haggadah.
- [37:47]
A
A Haggadah. I'm using one later on today. I'm doing a Passover Seder for a bunch of homeschool kids, which I'm excited about. But we. I'll go through the Haggadah, the declaration of the Passover redemption, the Passover story. And so we took the Haggadah and we turned it into a devotional, and that's what you'll be able to walk through. And it's free. It's free to you if you want to go to it. It's a fine. It's Messiah. It's. Excuse me, here it is. Messiah in Passover.org Again, that's Messiah and Passover.org you sign up and you will get your free digital download of Finding Messiah in Passover, our free devotional to you. So happy Pesach, happy Passover, happy Easter, happy Lord's Resurrection Day. But this is a great opportunity for you to prepare your heart for the resurrection of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, the Lamb of God.
- [38:33]
B
Well, Chris, next week we won't have enough time to go through. I want to give it justice. We'll put it in the. Let's do something we've never done. Let's give them a preview and they could read it. Before we come back on, we have an article titled Christianity was borderline illegal in Silicon Valley. Now it's the new religion. Chris, I just came across this texted to you over the weekend. Read about it. San Francisco. San Francisco. Chris, Alice and I used to go to San Francisco probably. We, We've been there about three, four times. We have representatives outside of that area, and it was great. And then San Francisco got all kinds of bad press. I think just, just, just. I think it was just that they did lots of homeless and drugs and crime and lots of things and activities going on that, quite frankly, Christians just would not care about. And something's happening, Chris, according to this article.
- [39:41]
A
Well, and this comes from the Vanity Fair, and I think this title source that I found.
- [39:46]
B
Vanity Fair.
- [39:47]
A
Yeah. Well, even the title alone makes you go. It makes all of the assumptions that you had go. Oh, it was real. Christianity was borderline illegal in Silicon Valley. Now it's the new religion. So, Steve, why did this article hit you? Because, I mean, you got excited when you read this.
- [40:08]
B
This. First of all, the gates of hell will not prevail against the church. That's, I've heard through the years, people's frustration with how this world is going. The young people, they're. They're off on their own. What's going to happen? Only older people care. Where are the young people? On and on and on it goes. And I understand that it's a frustration, but we have God's promise. God's promise is that he's not promising every local church is going to live on forever, but he is saying that the gospel is never going to. No one's going to triumph over the gospel. His church will never die. And this is an example of really talented, powerful tech people. Names like, you know some of these names. I didn't. Gary Tan, Peter Thiel, Trey Stevens, Alex Karp, Michelle Stevens, Sam Altman. These are names. I don't know their personal testimonies, but I do know that in the, in the quotes on this article, for instance, there is meetings that are going on called Code and Cosmos. And its underlying thesis is that the fields of science and technology, once considered diametrically opposed to religion and spirituality, might converge with the teachings of the Bible. In other words, business networking for the spiritually curious. So, Chris, I was going through the law and all that and texting, you know the way once you get online and if you're your train of thought, it's kind of like you start here, you go there. It keywords make you keep researching and that. I don't subscribe to Vanity Fair. I don't know who publishes it. I just. I don't think I've ever read Vanity Fair, but I've seen it.
- [42:06]
A
You have now?
- [42:07]
B
Well, I've seen it years ago when you sat in a doctor's office. You know, there were offices, they had literature. Now there's no literature to read. You gotta sit on your phone.
- [42:18]
A
The last time I had a Vanity Fair, I was sitting next to Michael Keaton, Batman. Oh, on an airplane, just me and him sitting side by side. And we chatted for a moment. Then we were just getting off the plane and there was A Vanity Fair in my seat, back pocket. I didn't know, I didn't know where it came from. I didn't even look at it. And he leans over to me and he says, are you gonna read that? And I said no. And he said, do you mind if I take it? And I said, have at it. And so he took the Vanity Fair and walked off the plane.
- [42:45]
B
There you go. But this, this article, Chris and I think giving it to our seven listeners who have access, they could read it ahead of time before we start discussing it. We've never done anything like we're actually planning something.
- [43:01]
A
Let's see how that goes.
- [43:02]
B
Scripted. This is gonna be scripted and unscripted.
- [43:06]
A
Guy Sally Ziprick is rubbing off.
- [43:08]
B
She's rubbing off on me.
- [43:10]
A
Hey listen, it says this. It's not a not only Theo. Last summer in an interview with Jordan Peterson, Elon Musk described himself cautiously as cultural Christian. I do believe that the teachings of Jesus, Musk said, are good and wise. To have two of the world's richest technologists worth a recently estimated 400 billion Musk and 14 billion Thiel speak admirably, I'm sorry, admiringly about biblical teachings and challenges the view that Christianity is anti capitalist or even anti intellectual. Meanwhile, downstream of Thiel and Musk are people like Tan who are busy shepherding the Valley's next cohort of entrepreneurs and who occasionally tweet scripture from his ex account. So again, we're not saying that like there's this, you know, all these tech giants are, you know, putting their faith in the Lord Jesus Christ. Someone like Mus though, I mean it's a big in the, in the anti God world that we live in to say that you angle toward what the scriptures teach. That means that number one, you're reading the scriptures or you're engaging with the words of Jesus. I always like to remind people that Jesus said go and make disciples. Disciples aren't necessarily people who right away follow everything that you teach. It means that they start to kind of listening a little bit to the rabbi and they kind of peer into what he's saying and they maybe like a little bit of this and a little bit of that. It doesn't say go and make converts, it says go and make disciples. Which means that who knows? I, I, I, I don't know how God I, I'm, I hope God surprises me but I don't know how God is working in, in, in these leaders lives because they can influence other people for a positive, in a positive way. But when you look in and you peer in the words of Jesus are doing exactly what the Rabbi's words were supposed to do to bring people in to say that the teaching matters. But the we, Steve and I always need to be clear about this. The only way to the Father is through Jesus, the Jewish Messiah, through the Savior who died and shed his blood for us, and having a personal relationship with him through repentance and faith, by his grace being poured out that you would have a relationship with him, not just the fact that you like his teachings. That's not enough. It's that you have to have a relationship with him through his son. But the point though is, is that we're seeing a huge, huge cultural shift in Silicon Valley right now.
- [45:45]
B
Unbelievable. And near the end of the article it says this. When I took Tan aside to ask why he thought a Christian perspective was relevant to anyone working in artificial intelligence, he told me that it was imperative for people working in tech to realize that they're building for something beyond themselves, their families and communities. He said technology is so powerful right now that you need to have this sort of touch grass moment. People are so ready to make AGI their God. Tan added, we're trying to do with events like this to give them an alternative. Chris, this could be kind of a shovel turning event in, in San Francisco. Things won't be the exact same way that they have been for the last couple of decades as there seems to be spiritual or an interest in spiritual things. Let's talk it that way.
- [46:42]
A
I like that. And you know, you use that phrase that stuck out to me when you were reading that in my office earlier, which is the touch grass moment to go out and to see, you know, these developers, Steve, they're really, I mean, we're not joking. These people are changing the world as right now, in the world that we live in, we are going to see a drastic shift in, in, in how we relate with technology through AI, artificial intelligence. I mean, what we're doing now I don't think will compare to what my kids will grow up in in the next 10, 20, 30 years. AI is going to change everything. And you can almost get the feeling that you're kind of like, if you're developing that, you're kind of like a God. But reality is, is that you got to go out there and touch the grass and realize I'm just the creator of zeros and ones, you know, binary code going back and forth. You know, I just, they learned how to use it differently. Where really the ultimate creator, the one who created all things by speaking it, not typing it, but speaking it into existence that actually has intellect and love and. And compassion and mercy and is creative and all those things is the creator of the universe, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. You got to touch the grass to realize how small you actually are. No matter what we're creating, it's small compared to what God has done already.
- [48:07]
B
Well, we should discuss this more in depth the next time we come together.
- [48:12]
A
That's right, the Vanity. Steve Herzig reading the Vanity Fair.
- [48:15]
B
Which segues Chris into something I saw that I didn't know people might remember. The astronauts that were rescued, our president said, you got to go out there. They've been there months. We got to get them.
- [48:30]
A
They were supposed to be there months.
- [48:32]
B
Instead of eight days or something. They were supposed to be up there a week. Well, the headline here from Harbinger's staff reads, this way. Rescued astronaut applauded for his bold faith, proclaiming the gospel while stranded at the space station.
- [48:48]
A
That's.
- [48:49]
B
I did not know that. Did you know he was a believer?
- [48:51]
A
This is kind of like your Pavilion story, where you're under the pavilion speaking as loud as you can about Jesus so people hear your faith. Look at. They're all trapped in a space station, flying around, orbiting around Earth. And what does he do? He uses his extra nine months to share the gospel. You know, I. I think this plays in perfectly with what we were just talking about. And it's the idea that here's an astronaut that lives in the world of science. Science, science, science, definitely technology, all of it. And he. He is. He allows himself to see the crossroads, the connection, I should say, between science and faith in. In God. And so this is a big thing. And then he proclaims that truth as well.
- [49:33]
B
Listen to this. Evangelism evangelist Franklin Graham and FRC President Tony Perkins gave God gave glory to God for the rescue of the astronauts and commended the astronomical faith of Captain Wilmore following the crew's return home. Answers in Genesis Founder and CEO Ken Ham, who stayed in contact with Wilmore at the space station, also praised the Lord for his safety and proclamation of the gospel. Barry's a great friend of the ministry, and he kept in touch with us during his long stay. Could you imagine getting a call from outer space? Ken Ham got a call from outer space.
- [50:13]
A
Ah, that's amazing.
- [50:14]
B
Ham noted, we're thrilled that he and Williams have returned to our planet safely. It is amazing. It is amazing what man could do. But it's all under the auspices of what even Greater. No comparison to what God has done.
- [50:31]
A
You know, it's kind of like. Do you think Ken Ham said, do you see any floods emerging from up there? Do we need a boat? Because I have one out here in Kentucky.
- [50:40]
B
Yes, we do.
- [50:41]
A
All right, YNET News, I found this interesting. Steve and I know we're not gonna have too much time to talk about it, but this defines Israeli culture perfectly. In fact, even Jewish culture, when we talk about you and Sally being scripted and unscripted. But is. Is. This is the title from YNET News. Israeli Chutzpah and Japanese Perfectionism. Sony's Israel's success story.
- [51:07]
B
That is. Think about that. Chutzpah and perfectionism.
- [51:11]
A
That's right.
- [51:12]
B
Is amazing.
- [51:13]
A
Well, I can tell you this right now because it's nothing against the Israelis because they, they. They utilize their chutzpah perfectly. But there is. Things are chaotic. I mean, like, I've worked in that system over not. I mean, I've worked with Israelis and nothing ever works perfectly. One of my. The things I laugh at the most whenever I'm driving down the road in Israel is. No, it'll say the. The town or the road or whatever in Hebrew, but it is never spelled the same in English. There's always a different, you know, way of. No, there's nobody guiding or giving direction to. That's not the way it's spelled. That kind of stuff doesn't bug them. They're not perfectionists like that. But they get the job done and they do it right. Sony Chutzpah and Japanese perfectionism. Sony's Israel success story. Sony Semiconductor Israel develops groundbreaking chips for smart devices while maintaining Israeli leadership under Japanese management and overcoming cultural challenges. No, he. Semel hands me a thin silicon chip about the size of a one Shekel coin. It's about a nickel. See the black part here? He said, this is the chip we're developing and manufacturing. Here's the gps. He points to this, to the bottom of the chip. The SIM is embedded in here and so is the antenna connectors. SAML50, a resident. Kfar Saba is the CEO of Sony Semiconductor Israel, the local branch of the Japanese electronic giant.
- [52:42]
B
Working together. I would just love it. I wonder if they're using English as their means of communication with each other. So you have the Israeli accent, the Japanese accent. The Israelis with the arms flank the Japanese who kind of, you know.
- [53:00]
A
That's right. Exactly.
- [53:01]
B
Unbelievable.
- [53:02]
A
It's a great. It's a great little article that we put in the show notes for you to kind of see the Differences in how Israel works with a bunch of different cultures, Japan being one of them. But the Israelis, they don't lack chutzpah. That's the reality.
- [53:18]
B
So I'd like to see a Japanese person with chutzpah.
- [53:21]
A
I bet they're out there.
- [53:22]
B
That would be pretty cool.
- [53:23]
A
I bet they're out there. All right. See, we got one more here. Houthis declare Ben Gurion Airport no longer safe after renewed Gaza fighting. Steve. So this is another one that Steve sent to me. The Houthis announce an aerial blockade on Ben Guri, Ben Gurion Airport, and threaten any airlines that fly to Israel. You know, Steve, Israel's taking care of Hamas. Israel's taking care of Hezbollah. There's been very. It's been quiet on the borders, but the Houthis, another proxy of Iran, continues to wage war against Israel. And now America's involved as well. And so this is an interesting article especially.
- [54:02]
B
But, you know, it's kind of funny, too. And I'll, I'll tell you why I said that. Because the group, the Houthis, wrote this after the success of our Yemeni armed forces in cutting off Israel shipping in the Red Sea. The Houthis have not been that successful. I, I mean, they've, they've done some damage. They're there to be reckoned with. I, I admit that. But he said, now we're blockading Ben Gurion Airport. Have you heard Ben Gurion Airport closed?
- [54:35]
A
Not one bit. Yeah.
- [54:37]
B
So I, it caught my mind. Number one, they're on the radar, but they've been on the radar. And what's interesting is how Israel, as you said, is just taking care of leadership with Hezbollah. I think they're down to their third or fourth.
- [54:52]
A
Leader. Yeah. Their levels of leaders.
- [54:54]
B
One guy lasted less than 24 hours.
- [54:58]
A
So did you see the funny video of. They're all like, the. Hezbollah is having a meeting. It's just a, It's a parody. And they're having a meeting. And they say, we're excited to announce that so and so is our new leader. And the guy goes, not me. I don't want that job.
- [55:13]
B
Could you. If they, if you had a meeting like that. In my mind, we're announcing, let's have a vote for the next guy, and the guy wins. The losers would jump under a table waiting for a, for a rocket to.
- [55:26]
A
Come in, get out of here.
- [55:28]
B
Or their phone blowing up.
- [55:29]
A
Well, and the reality is this is that according to Israel National News, I just read that the, An Iranian commander for the, Their cod forces Went to Iraq to meet with their, the, the Iranian ambassador in Iraq along with other individuals, Shiite pro, pro, Shiite pro, Iranian backed individuals in, in Baghdad. And he said, hey look, this includes Houthis as well. You gotta relax, don't do anything right now. And he's basically asking them to not launch any warfare, anything against Israel. Because I, I, I looked at it and kind of said, I bet it's because Trump has recently said to the Houthis and to Iran, anything's possible right now with you guys if you don't get yourself under control. All options are on the table. I think that's what the national Security advisor Walt said. All options are on the table for Iran right now. Which I think has them going, hey guys, let's not the bullies in the region, the Houthis, let's calm down you factions over here, let's not go crazy, let's pull together. Because really the reason why Iran is completely, you know, feeling like it's dismantled, it's got to rebuild. It's because one group, Hamas, attacked Israel. And that one attack on October 7th set in place a domino effect of taking out Hamas, taking out Hezbollah, the fall of the Assad regime, all of that was to the detriment of Iran. Iran has lost. They've lost. And then they were attacked by Israel and key nuclear sites were taken out. So they've got a lot of rebuilding to do. So when you got the little buddies, the Houthis over here launching rockets, they're saying, guys, can you just calm down? Because all options are on the table with the Trump administration for us. We don't want any trouble right now. We want to rebuild. So I'm imagining they've got a lot to think through and those Houthis are over there in Yemen launching rockets.
- [57:20]
B
So very interesting.
- [57:21]
A
Well, Steve, we got our Yiddish word of the day. I'm going to let you say it especially as we think about the law.
- [57:27]
B
We're thinking of the law. And when you read the law, Moses penned the law and there's several places throughout the Torah that talks about I love you Lord. I love the Lord. He is the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. And so in Yiddish to say I love you Lord. Isab Dicklib.
- [57:49]
A
Oh, Adon.
- [57:50]
B
Adon is Lord in Yiddish. So it's iab. It's Adon.
- [57:58]
A
There you, you are a pro.
- [58:00]
B
You are.
- [58:01]
A
I wish there was an applause effect.
- [58:02]
B
I knew a few Yiddish work and now I'm looking online for other other words of the day, trying to coincide with what we're talking about.
- [58:10]
A
Well, and you know, you nailed it because, you know, a lot of times David in the Psalms angles his love for the Lord based on his love for the commands that God gives him through the law. And so that's nothing that we should balk at or anything. We love you.
- [58:26]
B
Lord is holy, just and good. Coming from a holy, just and good God.
- [58:30]
A
Your word is a lamp unto my.
- [58:32]
B
Feet and a light unto my path.
- [58:34]
A
Preach it, brother. Hey everybody, thanks so much for being a part of the Friends of Israel's Jew and Gentile podcast. Hey, you know what? We've got free stickers. You want free stickers? We want to give them to you. 50 free stickers, including if you want a pin, an Israeli pin that has Israel and America on there. All you have to do. You ready? It's easy. Text us 424444 1948. And when you text us, I'm going to send you a link and that's where you can register to get your 50 free stickers. Don't forget FOI equipped.org there you can sign up for a survivor's story with George Rishfield to hear a holocaust survivors testimony of what took place. You're going to want to be a part of that April 10th. Again. That's foie equipped.org everybody. Thank you so much for being with us and we will see you next week.