We Have News! Plus, Helping Our Daughter with Bullies + Jeremy’s Broken Hand

Summary

The Jinger & Jeremy Podcast

Episode: "We Have News! Plus, Helping Our Daughter with Bullies + Jeremy’s Broken Hand"
Date: October 1, 2025
Hosts: Jinger Vuolo & Jeremy Vuolo

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Episode Overview

This episode blends a personal family update with a significant announcement: Jinger and Jeremy have written a new children’s book inspired by real experiences helping their daughter navigate hurtful childhood moments. The hosts candidly discuss parenting challenges, their own struggles with people-pleasing and bullying, and the values they hope to instill in their children. In a warm, conversational style, they reveal the heart behind their latest project and recount stories both light (Jeremy’s broken hand mishap) and heavy (childhood bullying, self-esteem struggles).

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Key Insights & Discussion Points

1. New Segment Introduction: "Talk About It"

[02:11]

• Jeremy introduces an impromptu new segment where each host shares personal updates from their week.
• Memorable moment: Jeremy recounts the recent family visit and his accident at a concert.

Jeremy’s broken hand story:

• Jeremy slipped on wet stairs while holding their daughter, Felicity, at Gabby’s concert, resulting in a dramatic fall and a possibly broken hand.
• Despite the pain and concern for Felicity, she was mostly unharmed, while Jeremy’s hand swelled ominously.
• Quote:

  “I do not have a knuckle where I used to have a knuckle. It’s gone.” — Jeremy [05:04]

• Jeremy resisted getting an X-ray despite Jinger’s gentle insistence, even attempting (and failing) to play golf the next day.

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2. Real-Life Parenting Challenge: Felicity’s Experience with Bullying

[00:09], [06:00], [07:43]

• The episode’s main theme springs from Felicity’s experience at her homeschool co-op, where she was laughed at by classmates. It wasn’t direct bullying, but Felicity perceived it as hurtful and bottled up her emotions until she was with her parents.
• This experience sparked ongoing parental conversations about self-perception, how to process embarrassment, and the pain of feeling mocked or left out — even for very young children.
• Quote:

  “How do you tell a little five year old how to process that?” — Jeremy [00:45]

Processing the situation:

• Jinger and Jeremy emphasize the need to help kids manage other’s perceptions without letting it dictate their sense of self.
• They discuss their strategy of shifting focus to God’s love and approval rather than peers’ opinions.
• Quote:

  “God’s not laughing at you. He’s happy with you; He loves you.” — Jeremy [14:30]

Notable parenting takeaway:

• The challenge of striking a balance between sheltering kids and equipping them to face an imperfect world is highlighted.
• Quote:

  “You’re not trying to shelter and just protect them from this world. You’re trying to equip them to engage the world.” — Jeremy [40:12]

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3. The Impact of Bullying & People Pleasing (Personal Testimonies)

[16:36], [18:04], [24:21]

• Jinger’s experience:

  • She did not experience much direct bullying but deeply struggled with people-pleasing and self-criticism, which at times impacted her eating habits and self-image.
  • Quote:

    “I think I was my own worst enemy... I was so insecure that I almost created that effect in my own head.” — Jinger [18:04]

• Jeremy’s experience:

  • He recounts being teased by peers—particularly on a two-week international school trip—feeling isolated and unable to escape ridicule.
  • Describes the cumulative effect and feelings of “not belonging” stemming from being “different” due to homeschooling or personal traits.
  • Quote:

    “You feel like this is your world, this is your social world, and you feel like you can’t get a grip, and you feel like they’re laughing at you.” — Jeremy [26:32]

  • Notes the ripple effect, where bullied kids sometimes become bullies themselves, or bystanders fail to intervene out of self-preservation.

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4. Empowering Kids: Looking Beyond Themselves

[15:04], [32:39]

• The value of encouraging children to look out for others who are being left out or hurt, not just focusing on self-preservation.
• Felicity’s story of encouraging a classmate struggling with obedience illustrates teaching empathy and support.
• Quote:

  “How can I love and serve others, even who are in that tough place?” —Jinger [15:58]

• Another example: Felicity feeling upset not at being left out herself, but because other children were excluded, and standing up for them.

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5. Big News: Announcing Their New Children’s Book

[35:47]

• The pivotal news: Jinger & Jeremy’s new book, You Always Belong: Knowing God’s Love & Finding Your Place, is set for release January 26.
• Inspired by actual scenarios their kids (especially Felicity) faced with ostracism, embarrassment, and people-pleasing.
• Age target: 4–10 years old.
• The book’s aim: Equip kids with healthy frameworks to process belonging, identity, and respond to both negative and positive peer attention. Also encourages empathy for excluded or struggling classmates.
• Quote:

  “It encourages them to actually step out and to love others and help others who are going through that as well.” — Jeremy [37:00]

• Features beautiful illustration by Sarah Romero and an audiobook narrated by the hosts.

Author’s Note (Excerpt):

[38:37]

"Did you know you were made for friendship with God? ... When you trust in Jesus, you’re never alone. God promises to be with you, help you, and love you no matter what...” — (Author’s note from Jinger & Jeremy)

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6. Takeaways for Parents & Caregivers

[39:32], [41:55]

• The hosts hope their book and this episode act as a practical support for parents, offering both tools and conversation-starters for tough emotional moments children inevitably face.

• Emphasize the limitations of parental protection and the importance of teaching kids internal resilience and healthy social engagement.

• Quote:

  “What we needed to do is find an avenue of conversation to help Felicity think through this... And then, so how do you respond?... Is God laughing at you? ... That’s what really matters.” — Jeremy [40:12]

• Jinger recalls how even a simple resource (like a podcast about visiting the dentist) can open conversation and provide comfort to anxious kids, reinforcing the value of thoughtful children’s books.

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7. Closing Thoughts & Preview

[43:56]

• Jinger and Jeremy acknowledge that parenting through these challenges is ongoing and imperfect. Their current experiences have made their second children’s book come from a place of personal learning.

• They’re excited for listeners to use You Always Belong as a resource, just as they needed it themselves.

• Quote:

  “Writing kids books with kids... It hits different.” — Jeremy [43:56]

• Tease upcoming episodes featuring guests from the “Duggar show world.”

• Brief final update: Jeremy still hasn’t seen a doctor for his hand injury—Jinger vows to make him go.

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Notable Quotes

• Jeremy [05:04]: “I do not have a knuckle where I used to have a knuckle. It’s gone.”
• Felicity, via Jeremy [00:35]: “Daddy, the kids were laughing at me.”
• Jinger [13:37]: “It can either build you up or cut you down in a moment if you’re living for that.”
• Jeremy [14:30]: “God’s not laughing at you. He’s happy with you; He loves you.”
• Jinger [18:04]: “I think I was my own worst enemy... I was so insecure that I almost created that effect in my own head.”
• Jeremy [26:32]: “You feel like you can’t get a grip, and you feel like they’re laughing at you.”
• Jeremy [37:00]: “It encourages them to actually step out and to love others and help others who are going through that as well.”
• Author’s Note Excerpt [38:37]: “When you trust in Jesus, you’re never alone. God promises to be with you, help you, and love you no matter what...”
• Jeremy [43:56]: “Writing kids books with kids... It hits different.”

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Episode Timestamps for Key Segments

• [00:00] — Introduction to episode and project news
• [02:11] — “Talk About It” segment & Jeremy’s broken hand story
• [06:00] — Felicity’s experience at homeschool co-op and parental response
• [15:04] — Teaching empathy: Felicity’s interaction with a struggling classmate
• [16:36] — Jinger’s childhood struggles with people pleasing
• [24:21] — Jeremy’s personal experience with bullying as a homeschooled kid
• [35:47] — Announcement: Release of their new children’s book
• [38:37] — Author’s note reading
• [39:32] — Application for parents: book as conversation-starter
• [43:56] — Reflections on writing this book as parents; closing

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Tone & Language

• Warm, candid, and slightly humorous (especially Jeremy’s injury anecdote)
• Compassionate, open about vulnerabilities and past struggles
• Faith-driven, with recurring emphasis on belonging in God’s family and finding security in spiritual identity

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Summary

This episode weaves together honest stories from the Vuolo family’s recent life—Jeremy’s mishaps, Felicity’s sensitive heart, Jinger’s childhood insecurities—with a larger message: all children need to know they truly belong. Forged from firsthand parenting struggles and fueled by faith, Jinger and Jeremy’s new children’s book aims to help kids process difficult social moments, while empowering parents to open honest, supportive conversations about belonging, self-worth, bullying, and empathy. The hosts’ realness, gentle humor, and actionable insights make this episode as heartening as it is practical for any parent or caregiver.

Transcript

[A]

We've got a great topic today. We've actually got some news for all of you which we're very excited about. We've got a project that we've been.

[B]

Working on and I'm so excited about this one.

[A]

What actually motivated this project was Felicity for kindergarten was part of kind of like a homeschool co op thing. And I'll never forget, she walked out of the classroom when I went to pick her up and I could see it on her face. It was like her face was about to burst into tears. And I asked her, felicity, what's wrong? And this little, maybe five years old at the time, trying to process, she said, daddy. The kids were laughing at me.

[B]

It's a lot. That's a lot to unpack because their little minds can't comprehend anything outside of like this perfect world.

[A]

And it started a conversation that we would have as parents helping her process. How do you handle people's perception of you? How do you handle making a mistake or being embarrassed? And how do you tell a little five year old how to process that? And so the exciting announcement that we have the project is what's going on, guys? We are back for another episode of the Ginger and Jeremy podcast. I am Jeremy.

[B]

I'm Ginger.

[A]

And we've got a great topic today. We've actually got some news for all of you which we're very excited about. We've got a project that we've been working on and we're going to get to that because it was motivated from some events in our life, specifically with our kids. And I wouldn't say around the topic of bullying per se, but issues that children work through when, you know, they don't know how to respond, when they're being laughed at, when they're being mistreated, when they make mistakes, whether it's at school or on the playground with their friends. So we've got a really exciting project that we want to announce to you. But Ginger, you know what podcasts do sometimes?

[B]

What?

[A]

They have segments.

[B]

Segments. Like what?

[A]

Well, we don't have. We don't. They. Well, they would have us like Raising Heights with the Kelsey Brothers has like new news, you know, and we don't have a segment.

[B]

Well, I think that we should add a segment.

[A]

I like that. So here's my segment idea. I just told Ginger about this literally before we hit record is I like our segment can be talk about it.

[B]

So let's talk about it.

[A]

Let's talk about it. So where it's something like what you talk about, whatever you want to talk about, like, an update on the week, whatever you got going on? So, Ginge, I don't know how to segue into the segment, but talk about it.

[B]

Yeah. We have family in town. We just had company in town last week, and that was super fun, hosting Kade and Gabby. And then now we have. Yeah, family. And they're actually at the park right now. And so we're recording this episode while they're out getting their kids out to play. And what happened, Jared? You talk about it. You talk about your hand.

[A]

Actually talking about Kate and Gabby. We went to Gabby's concert, and it started to rain, and so I go backstage, and there's, like, tile stairs, and I think my feet were wet. Maybe some water had dripped in. And I'm holding Felicity in my right arm, and I take two steps down the stairs and then immediately wipe out. So not the kind of wipeout where you're like, oh, that's slippery, and you kind of catch yourself.

[B]

Oh, it was bad, but it was.

[A]

Like we went down.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So my legs out from under me. I'm holding my daughter. Tile stairs. So immediately I thought she cracked her head. And my first thought, she started to scream. And my first thought was, good, because I thought her head whips back. I tried to break her fall with my arm, but it was a split second, so I didn't even have time to respond. I think my arm being around her did probably break her fall, but by God's grace, she. I, I. I'm holding her. I, I run outside of the green room, and she's crying, and, you know, I'm trying to console her, and then she starts saying, my butt, my butt. Like her back was hurt or her butt was hurt. And I was like, okay, is that the only thing that hurts? And she's like, yeah. And so then I was like, is it going away? She's like, yeah. So she calmed down really fast.

[B]

But you were.

[A]

Well, after. After I realized the. The shock of it, and, like, there's just immediate, like, panic because of her.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Then it sets in. Like, my elbow is bleeding. My hand. Well.

[B]

Cause she had blood on her.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I was like, wait, where did this blood come from? But it was actually from you, right?

[A]

Yeah, from my elbow. A little cut. And then later that night, I saw my leg, but my hand was throbbing. And so my hand. What's the guy that has the huge balloon hand? Pre Max or something? Baymax.

[B]

Yeah. Your hand ballooned up.

[A]

So my hand ballooned up.

[B]

It was crazy.

[A]

The next morning. But that Night it didn't, but it was throbbing. And so I have mobility. I have not gotten an X ray yet.

[B]

He needs to because it still is puffy.

[A]

I don't know if we have any, like, doctors or. But I.

[B]

Swelling will not go down.

[A]

But also, I'm missing a knuckle. So I do not have a knuckle where I used to have a knuckle.

[B]

He broke his hand, so I don't.

[A]

Know where it went.

[B]

It's gone.

[A]

It's gone. So that's what I'm talking about. I went to golf the next day and realized very quickly that wasn't gonna work.

[B]

That was a bad idea.

[A]

I'm swinging with just my right arm.

[B]

Oh, my word.

[A]

I had a few good drives and.

[B]

You busted a few windows.

[A]

Yeah. You know, my golf.

[B]

Needless to say, it's been. No, I was gonna say you're actually good at golfing, but it's been a crazy few days then.

[A]

It has. Yeah. And I just. I. I went into a physical trainer yesterday, and they were like, yeah, you should probably go get X rayed.

[B]

So I think you should.

[A]

So I'm gonna get X rayed. Yeah. All right. So that's our new segment. Talk about it.

[B]

That's it. We talked about it.

[A]

We talked about it. I like that. Okay, Ginge. So today, what we're going to talk about on the pod is we've got a very exciting announcement. So stoked for that. It's a cool resource. But before we get to that, what actually motivated this project was Felicity for kindergarten was part of kind of like a homeschool co op thing. And so she was going away for, I think it was twice a week she'd go and be with other students in a classroom. And I'll never forget, she walked out of the classroom when I went to pick her up. She got in the car and I could see it on her face. It was like her face was about to burst into tears. And I asked her, felicity, what's wrong? Or how was your day? And this little, maybe five or five years old at the time, trying to process, she said, daddy. The kids were laughing at me because I think she did something wrong in class or she did something which probably was funny, but the kids started laughing, and she felt like they were laughing at her. And she said, I didn't want to cry in front of them. And as she started to cry, she's communicating to me this. She didn't want to be vulnerable. She was afraid and wanted to be, you know, out of that setting she didn't know how to react, so she bottled up her tears. And then as soon as she gets in the car just kind of bursts into tears. And it started a conversation that we would have as parents helping her process. How do you handle people's perception of you? How do you handle making a mistake or being embarrassed? How do you handle it when people would bully you or mock you or make fun of you or gang up on you? And how do you tell a little five year old how to process that?

[B]

It's a lot. That's a lot to unpack because their little minds can't comprehend anything outside of like this perfect world where everybody gets along. You have all these friends. Yeah, it's hard to share, but like when something like that happens, we ended up finding out it was difficult, so hard to see her in that place and feeling that way as well. But at the same time we ended up finding out like it was something that they actually weren't laughing at her, they were laughing at something that had happened. Yeah, she did. That was like funny, but she didn't realize that. And so in the moment she was.

[A]

Just shook and her little world was caving in. And that's what it sensed, that's what it felt.

[B]

Because she's like, why are my friends laughing at me? And that hurts. And it's something that is painful. And so, yeah, I think that that definitely started a conversation with her about a lot of those things. Of like, how do you even reach out to others who are being bullied or other people when they're doing something wrong? What do you do?

[A]

Yeah. And wanting to help her have a mindset where she's not rising or falling based on people's perceptions of her. So trying to build a mindset for our 5 year old where she doesn't feel like her world will cave in or be lifted up based on what the kids at school or what her friends at church think of her or say about her. Because we all know that kids can be cruel. Right. And the playground can be a very hard knock school of life. And there's real bullying that happens. Right. And often it's the result of a child, usually a child who's a bully. I mean, yeah, A child who's acting out in that way is probably being bullied or probably being mistreated or probably not being cared for like they should at home. And so they're bringing this, what some experts would call like this invisible backpack to school, where this invisible backpack of trauma where they've been slapped. They've been beat down, they've been spoken down to. So they bring that with them and they have a context coming into a group of other children where now they start to speak that way and behave that way toward kids.

[B]

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[A]

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[B]

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[A]

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[B]

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[A]

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[B]

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[A]

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[B]

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[B]

Yeah. It can either build you up or cut you down in a moment if you're living for that. And that's where it's like, well, we have to live for the glory of God. We have to do what's. Do what's right. And ultimately, like, even within friendships or within marriage, you want your spouse to appreciate you, you want people to appreciate you, want to be in community, which is what I've talked about in People Pleaser as you. We are designed for friendship. We're designed for community. But with that also comes a downside of where when you're living for everyone else's approval of you, then that disapproval will just so quickly cut you down if that's what you're focusing on and that's your identity. And so finding it in something deeper and greater than yourself, which is ultimately found in your relationship with Christ and who he created you to be. That's where you find purpose.

[A]

Yeah. And that's ultimately where we came to with little Felicity, five year old Felicity. I remember telling her, you know, Felicity, God's not laughing at you. So you can remember when other kids maybe are putting you down or laughing at you in a mean way. God's not laughing at you. He's happy with you. He loves you. And for her to be thinking, having this awareness of her relationship with God that allows her to transcend in that moment out of, you know, the walls are closing in socially.

[B]

And it's sweet to see too, because she's had other conversations with us about times where maybe she got an award for obedience one day. And then she saw another kid who had struggled a lot and he may have been pushing against the boundaries and against the rules or talking too much in class every time. And she was like, I just really feel bad for him. He hasn't gotten his award yet. And she's like, I wanna encourage him to ask Jesus for help. And so she did one day when he was acting up, you know, and she was afraid he was gonna not get an award. And so she was like, I just leaned forward and I said, maybe you can ask Jesus. Cause sometimes I don't wanna obey the rules either, but sometimes I just pray and ask Jesus. And she said. And he paused and he took a moment and I think he was thinking about what I had said. Because she really wants him to get an award. She wants him to be able to, you know, get to that point. It's not like she's perfect either. She has days where, you know, all kids do. But I thought that was precious because then you're looking beyond yourself and you're thinking, okay, how can I encourage even those who may be having a hard day around you to thrive? And I think that that is ultimately the goal. Like, when we get our eyes off ourself and our circumstances, it doesn't mean that you just let people run all over you. There's a balance in that. But I think that we see it in our own lives. Kids see it. And I think it's just a good reminder for us to like, look beyond ourselves and say, okay, how can I love and serve others, even who are in that tough place?

[A]

Yeah, that's huge. Do you remember any times when you were a kid? Because what? We're even. You know, even as I listen to you saying that, I'm like, we're bringing this adult perspective of Objectivity where they don't feel that. Right. One of my favorite lines from Love Boat Captain, it's a Pearl Jam song Eddie Vedder sings, the young, they can lose hope because they can't see beyond today, the wisdom that the old can't give away. So it's like there's this wisdom that those who've walked a longer path in life have an objectivity that are able to look beyond Friday night in high school. Right? Like, yeah, she broke up with you, she dumped you. Don't worry, you're not even going to remember her name in 10 years. When you're married and have kids, like, there's hope beyond today. But try to tell that sophomore in high school that when they're going, no, this is my whole world. My whole world is caving in. And they don't have hope. They can't see beyond today. And he says, the wisdom the old can't give away because it's a learned wisdom. And so we're sitting here talking about our five year old, you know, at the time. Felicity, like, all right, Felicity, you have some objectivity here. Do you. Do you remember when you were a kid, were there any moments where you felt like that, like, your world was caving in or your parents were so good at protecting you from, like, bully situations? In fact, maybe it was the other. It was more the isolation side. Right. Like being sheltered, but kids are kids.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Do you. Do you have any, like, core memories like that?

[B]

I think looking back, thankfully I was protected from a lot of the bullying. But ultimately, when it comes to people pleasing, I struggle with that so deeply. And so on that side of things, that was an issue. And I felt like, oh, I don't fit in. I'm not going to be liked by these people because maybe I'm not, you know, as cool as them. Like, even in Broomball, I shared that story about, like, just feeling insecure. There was a lot of insecurity in my own heart. And I think that I was my own worst enemy and critic was myself. And just how I was so insecure that I almost created that effect in my own head about, like, oh, no one's approving of me. Yeah, no one's going to like me. And that led me down a bad path that really was not healthy for how I process life. And there are days where it's still hard for me to process things correctly because I think those patterns that we allow, like, thinking through, okay, how are others viewing me right now? I want to put on the best front for them. Or I want to present myself in a certain way or look a certain way. So even my eating habits, you know, I remember that was something that no one, I don't ever remember somebody telling me, oh, you're not, you don't look pretty or whatever. But I think that thought process in my own head drove me there to where I would look at my friends who were skinnier than I was and I was skinny, but they were skinnier than I was. And so I was like, oh, I don't need to eat as much because I'm afraid of being too fat. And I don't want them to not approve of me. And so that led me down that path of like trying to avoid food. And that was very unhealthy. And so I've seen that as something that has continued from when I was young. It continued up through my teen years. And then once I finally realized, I was like, wow, it doesn't matter. I don't need to be so concerned about that. I can eat healthy or I can work out, but I'm so focused on that and no one else is even thinking that way. It was a self imposed, sort of like mindset. And so even though I wasn't bullied, I think I kind of wanted to fit in. I wanted to have people like me and that's how I thought I could. We want to take a break from this episode to tell you about Function Health.

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[B]

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[A]

When you first have a baby. Tell me if I'm wrong. Sleep routines. Nap routines can feel impossible to get into because the baby's always waking up or you don't know when they're supposed to sleep. Nanit makes a huge difference in that because it actually tracks sleep patterns and it does the heavy lifting for you. It tracks sleep patterns, milestones, so you can stop guessing like, when's the best time to put them to bed? How are they sleeping? Nanit gives you all that information. It's really incredible.

[B]

Oh yeah. I think one of the first purchases we made was to make sure we had a good baby monitor. And Nanit is the best. It is literally the top of the line. You can see your baby from above. They have this awesome, like they have an above view camera that you're able to see your baby. Like you said, those abilities to track will give you such peace of mind.

[A]

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[B]

Now back to the episode. I think like you see it as kids. Like there were a couple times, I'm sure, like I do remember just a couple times where, you know, maybe like an older group of kids would be playing and they'd be like, well, you're too young or you can't run as fast as us. So you know, like you can't play this game and it was just friends or siblings or something and those things happen. And as a kid it definitely feels so massive and ultimately like it's processing that as a five year old. Processing that as a ten year old. It's gonna be harder than it is now as an adult. Looking back, I'm like, oh, that was so small. It was so insignificant, but for little minds, it feels so huge. And yeah, I just want to even turn that back on you, that question, because I don't know, was there ever time that you felt like you were bullied and how did your parents walk you through it or how did you deal with that?

[A]

Yeah, you know, I. I definitely was like, I. I don't know if you and I have even talked about this much, but in high school, middle school, actually, it started. I would start, you know, I was homeschooled for those early years until basically almost all through high school. And because of that I was. Not to the degree you were, but I was definitely sheltered as well. And so I started playing sports. And so a lot of my friends were in public school and outside of the church setting or the church context, and they just knew stuff that they were growing up at a. At a rate that I wasn't in terms of their knowledge and understanding of the world. And so that would leave me feeling kind of lost and left out and wondering what's going on. And I. It never, you know, they would laugh at me. Like, they would ask me silly questions and I would give a dumb answer. Cause I just had no idea what it was. And I remember one time, you know, in a circle right before soccer practice, a kid asked me a question and I'm like, what are you talking about? And they all started laughing. And I'm like, okay, like, trying to figure out, like, what's going on here. And I would respond kind of in kind. Like, I'd start jabbing them back, you know. Seth Hurley, apologize for that. Seth. Seth's a buddy of mine now, but there was a time where I went on a trip to England in 2002 to play soccer. And we did a tour of England, Wales and Ireland. And that whole trip was brutal for me. I was teased incessantly. Like, incessantly. They did not stop teasing me about everything, about what I knew, what I didn't know, how I dressed this, that. And I could not. It was like. It's like a little kid on the end of a mob. Like, you cannot. Anything you do to fight back is just mocked. And it's the dumbest stuff. So you're thinking like a 14 year old teasing, but they would just mimic your voice, like, oh, whatever it was. And you know, kids are kids. And I just remember being on the end of it and getting more and more exasperated, which of course fuels the fire, right? Like the more that you react to it, the more they're instigated to do it.

[B]

Did anybody stand up for you or.

[A]

Yeah, a couple times. There's a couple of my buddies who wanted to stand up for me, but then they also didn't want to be. There's a pressure of like, they know if I stand up for them then I'm going to receive the same treatment. And so they would kind of be laughing and they'd look at me and say, hey, sorry. But they wouldn't really stick up or they'd come to me afterwards during the trip. It was like a two week long trip too. And they'd be like, hey man, I'm sorry about this guy, you know, whatever. And I'm just like, whatever. And so I'm responding as a 14 year old kid getting angry or trying to jab back. But it was like these guys were genuinely funny and they were the kind of guys who could hold an audience, you know, like they were the kind of guys that now would be like a stand up comedian who can like control a room. And so as I think back on it, I'm like, shoot, those guys were clever. But what they were doing was cruel as well. Like they knew they were ganging up on me. But then you think, okay, here's a 14 year old kid, he's being egged on, he's not gonna have the maturity, even the kid who's doing the bullying or whatever you wanna call it, to go, hey guys, let's ease up. Hey man, I'm sorry, that was funny, but let's pick another target. Like let's make fun of me now. They're just gonna keep piling on, you know. And so I remember that, but I remember just being like, I can't get out of this. And you don't have the objectivity of going like, hey, you know, let's all be, we're all gonna be adults one day who have responsibilities. You're just, this is your world, this is your social world and you feel like you can't get a grip and you feel like they're laughing at you. And I remember like genuinely like having a couple nightmares about it and just feeling like I can't win and I didn't have the greatest objectivity around it, but I do look back and remember like that was really a difficult time and it was frustrating and you don't know how to process it. You don't have all of the faculties to handle it appropriately. So I remember one time, you know, I started like, you know, yelling at the kid or whatever and it's like, yeah, what are you Supposed to do, like, how do you respond to this? And that was not severe. That's a homeschool kid who's out of the loop, who's getting picked on some jokes. But there's severe bullying that happens to kids. That's physical. But even worse than being shoved to the ground is like the emotional or mental torture, feeling like you genuinely don't belong. And I do remember when I went to school, I went to public school the last couple years of high school, and one of my fears, which I don't think I would have articulated at the time, but was walking into the cafeteria and nobody to sit with. So that, I think was a projection of me having this sense of I don't belong. I'm the odd man out because I'm peculiar, I'm unique. Whether that's because I was homeschooled, or whether students or kids who maybe have a physical characteristic that is different, or they look different, they act different, they come from a different culture, Whatever it is, it's opportunity for the other kids to point out those differences and mock them for it. And so then you start to feel like, I don't fit in, I don't belong here.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

And that makes a big impact.

[B]

It does, for sure. And even the confidence that you have, and I think that can just cut to your core. And it's sometimes words people say, they might be like, you know, saying a joke, you know, not really meaning it, but that cuts deep and it can affect how you move forward in life and the level of confidence you'll have in a lot of things. Or like critiques. Then if somebody critiques you, then it's like, oh, it cuts to my core. I can't take that because I'm so insecure.

[A]

And you either crumble under the critique or you fight back because you're used to, I've got to fight to survive. And so you see, kids respond in different ways. They'll cave in to themselves, or they fight back and they start wanting to bully. And so they pick on someone smaller than them. Right. Cause it's like this trickle down effect. So I'm getting bullied by these kids, who are the kids I look up to. So I will go and look down on someone else and treat them the same way, kind of trickle down. And that happens from parents to kids to kids than other kids. Which is why our counsel to Felicity that day when she came in and devastated by how her classmates had treated her, was we wanted her to think outside of their perception, which is why we started Saying, felicity, God's not laughing at you. Like, God is not. God is not. He doesn't think you're stupid, or he doesn't think you don't know enough, or he doesn't think you're, you know, whatever, God. Let's think about how God views you. And I think she was really grounded in that.

[B]

Yeah, I think so. It helped her so much to have a category, to process it. And ultimately, like, yeah, there are times where as parents, you'll then need to go talk to a teacher and say, like, okay, you know, what happened? Or how do you handle situations like this? But ultimately, like, it was good, because then. Then if that happened another time, then she was able to talk about it and have a framework for dealing with it in the moment. And I think that that was also encouraging to see, like, her response. And, yeah, when you're little, like, it all hurts so much deeper. And so those things will come up all the time. And, yeah, I think of another scenario. There were a lot of kids playing just the other day. And it was something where Felicity thought, oh, their game they're playing doesn't seem so fun. Cause there were other kids who maybe they were just feeling a little bit left out. And so she tried to speak up for them. And then she was hurt that maybe the other kids were like, well, we're already playing this game. And it wasn't a bad game. It was just, like, something.

[A]

They were just leaving other kids out.

[B]

They were leaving other kids out. And so she felt really bad, and she came crying to us and was like, oh, I really want them to not feel left out. And so one of the kids came back later and apologized. I'm so sorry. You know, I'm sorry you felt left out. And she. Her standing up for them in that moment was really encouraging for us to see, because even though she was like, I'm not gonna play that game, because you're not including these other kids.

[A]

Well, that's what I. When she was crying, I went over there and I thought, okay, someone's done something to her. Like, that's typically what you see with a. If they're hurt because someone. But she was really upset because of how they had treated some other children.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And Felicity is very sensitive.

[B]

She is.

[A]

And which is really sweet. But for her to be thinking about how they're mistreating someone else, that's a huge part of people pleasing as well. And that's a huge aspect of your book, is when you are enslaved to people pleasing, you're not the Only victim. Like, oh, I guess I can just kind of suck it up and endure. And I'm kind of trapped by my need for everybody to like me. Well, sure, you're victim number one, maybe. But then actually what'll happen is what I just communicated with, you know, my friends in England when we were on that trip. They don't want to stick up for me because then they'll be perceived away. So now you're watching as someone else is being harmed out of your own self preservation. So all of a sudden you're not the only victim. Now there's a lot, there's a string of victims. So you're the kid on the playground watching that little kid get bullied, and you're refusing to say anything Even though there's 10 of you who could easily overpower the situation and stop the bullying from happening. But you're so entrapped to your own.

[B]

Self preservation because you don't want to stand alone and you don't want to take be grouped him with him.

[A]

And so telling Felicity that when she makes a stand, she's not alone because the Lord is with her and the Lord loves her and the Lord is.

[B]

Not laughing at her and he's pleased with you.

[A]

It emboldens her to not only not have her own world caved in, but when she sees others being mistreated to go, hey, guys, no, we don't do that. Like, we don't play those games. You know, we ain't about that. Because she's not operating out of a sense of I need these kids perception of me to be spot on, otherwise I'm not approved. So it's elevating that thing. And so here's the exciting thing. These conversations and these situations we recognized are commonplace. Right. Like every parent's dealing with these.

[B]

Yeah. Almost every day. I mean, from like little kids all the way up through college through adulthood, I mean, we never stop facing that. People pleasing. Most of us, I would say, are facing it in some way or another. If it's us or if it's, you know, a friend or a child, we're gonna come in contact with it almost every single day.

[A]

And so the exciting announcement that we have the project is we have written another children's book.

[B]

We have. And I'm so excited about this one. We both are. But I think because my book, People Pleaser came out and we were having all these conversations with our kids about people pleasing and we really wanted to have a resource for them.

[A]

Yeah. And so this is written for children like ages 4 through 10. It's called you always belong, knowing God's love and finding your place. And it really actually plays through some of these scenarios that we've actually walked through with our own kids where they are in a school program and they experience something like what we've been talking about, or they're playing sports and they fail, and children respond to them a certain way. And what's really exciting about this and why I love this project is because it's not only like trying to help them process for themselves, like, hey, you don't need to perceive yourself the way they're perceiving you, but it encourages them to actually step out and to love others and help others who are going through that as well.

[B]

Yeah, for sure. To look beyond yourself and show them the love of Christ, which is what I love. And so this book, it's been a fun project. We put in special touches, things that our kids love. But ultimately it's geared towards just kids in general. And I think that it will hopefully be a good resource for you. So if you have a child who's struggling with these things that we've talked about today, it really focuses on the heart of people pleasing on finding your identity in Christ alone. And so, yeah, we're excited that this book will soon be in your hands.

[A]

We partnered with Sarah Romero. The art is beautiful. It'll come out in January 26th, but you can get it as a gift and kind of pre order and even for the holiday season, you know, get pre order as a gift for people that will receive it right after Christmas. I want to read you at the back. It says you were made to be part of God's story. A beautiful note in his song. So let his light shine as you walk through the world and remember you always belong. And actually, I thought this isn't giving away too much. If I were to read the author's note that we wrote to the parents and the kids, this is what we wrote. Did you know you were made for friendship with God? That's right. You were created to be known and loved by him, to enjoy life with him forever. But something went wrong. Sin broke that perfect friendship and made our hearts wander far from God. That's why Jesus came. He died on the cross and rose again to bring us back to God so we could always belong in his family. When you trust in Jesus, you're never alone. God promises to be with you, help you, and love you no matter what he brings you into. His story gives you a purpose and fills your heart with hope. So when life feels hard or you feel left out, remember you are not forgotten. You were made to walk with God and shine his light in the world. We're praying that you'll trust him. Walk with him and always remember you belong with. Love, Ginger and Jeremy.

[B]

I like it.

[A]

Yeah, it's exciting. We also did an audiobook for it.

[B]

We did the kids audiobook. It's so fun. So both of us went into studio, recorded that for you guys. So that can be a resource for your kiddos to listen to. Even if you're on the way back from school or this conversation comes up, you can play the audiobook for your kiddos and kind of just if you played it, I thought about it, like, even playing it over and over, it can get that concept in their mind of always belonging in God's family.

[A]

Yeah. And it's a good conversation starter. Like, the most valuable resource in moments like that for a child isn't going to be necessarily a children's book or like a video they watch. Right. It's going to be the relationship of a mom and a dad talking about these things. And yet what we found so helpful in these conversations is hearing from other parents how they've engaged that conversation. Because I'll tell you, when I first saw Felicity walk in the car, eyes ready to burst with tears, you're racing through, going, how do I respond? Do I respond in anger toward those kids? Well, that's shaping how she's going to view those situations for the rest of her life.

[B]

And those kids.

[A]

And those kids.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So, okay, let's help her respond in anger toward anyone who ever speaks against her? Well, that's not helping her. Do we immediately go to the teacher and go shut it down and exercise this sense of power, which you can do as a parent in, like, kindergarten through sixth grade, probably to a degree. Right. Like, you can. You can raise awareness and. Yeah, but eventually your kids are gonna get into the real world, and they're not gonna have mommy and daddy to come, you know, hitting their bully with a purse anytime someone says something bad or they cross the street and someone, you know, curses at em. So you. You're trying to equip your kids. You're not trying to shelter and just protect them from this world. You're trying to equip them to engage the world. So what we needed to do is find an avenue of conversation to help Felicity think through this. Okay, Felicity, let's think about it. Were they laughing at you because they were mocking you? Were they laughing at you because you did something silly. Let's think about what was motivating them. And then. Okay, so how do you respond to that? Well, is God laughing at you? And then she's answering, well, no, God's not laughing at me. Okay, well, that's what really matters, right, Felicity? So engaging her in a way of processing this, that's gonna help her. Well, this book is that, like, we want this to be a tool for parents to help process with their kids the challenges of life and the challenges of identity, Feeling like they don't belong in scenarios, feeling like they're the odd person out. And instead of leaning into that with anger or isolation, having them be empowered to actually engage the children around them to better help them.

[B]

I'm so excited for this resource. I really hope that's what it is for you guys. Just an opportunity to open up and engage with your kids on a different level. And I think that it's interesting because we had kind of brainstormed about this, and as we had more and more scenarios that were coming up in the. On the daily, I think that's kind of what propelled this. And I remember even, like, back in the day, like, we took our kids to the dentist, and it was, like, a very scary thing. You found a resource of a podcast that was super helpful for them to engage with them, and they were listening to these stories about going to the dentist, and it was fun and it was interesting, but it also talked about the scary side of, like, going to the dentist. And it was something that we were looking at as a parent, like, oh, I'm so thankful for this resource because we had talked with them about it before. We're gonna go get our teeth cleaned. It's gonna be loud. This is what we're gonna process through. So, like, it's just helpful. It's a support for parents to have things like this to be able to pull out. And so if you're a grandparent, you can get this for your grandkids and talk to them about it.

[A]

If you know children, if you know.

[B]

Any children, if you know people who.

[A]

Know children, yeah, you could get this.

[B]

And if you haven't checked out People Pleaser for adults, this is the adult version.

[A]

Yeah, it really is. It's like, this is the. That's what started the conversation was People Pleaser was received so well, and I think such a help to you writing it and others reading it. We were like, well, we can. We can help kids with this. Like, this is something that, you know, our children are going through, and really, you get To a point of living as an adult entrapped by people pleasing. Because of how you learned how to process things as a kid.

[B]

Yes, 100%. That's for sure. So, yeah, we're just excited for this project to be in your hands. And like Jer said, it's available for pre order and you can even around the holidays, you can be talking to your kids like about getting this for them and go ahead and get it, pre order it and that way it's ready to go.

[A]

Yep. We are stoked. So I like these kids books now. Having kids. It hits different writing kids books with kids because now they're coming out of. Our first children's book we wrote was when Felicity was really, really young. So we weren't even having these conversations yet. And now that we're having these conversations, it's like there's all of these ideas. Not that we've got it sorted out, but ways we've had to kind of work through to help our own kids. And so to be able to provide that as a resource for others is. Is. We're really happy about that. Okay, guys, well, thanks for tuning in. Thanks for all of your support. We hope this is a major blessing to all of you. We're excited to get it into your hands and into your little children's hearts because it will be a good resource for families. Okay, guys, well, thanks for listening. As always. Subscribe to our YouTube channel if you want to get updates. We've got some very exciting guests coming up, some straight out of the Duggar show world. So those will be coming up soon. Yeah. Stay tuned. Follow us on Instagram, follow us on TikTok Ingerandjeremy and subscribe on YouTube to stay up with the latest.

[B]

Turn on those notifications to hear if Jer's hand is actually broken or sprained. I'm gonna try to get him to the doctor today.

[A]

Yeah, we gotta go. Okay. Grateful for you guys. Take.