Podcast Summary: The Joe Rogan Experience #2301 - Ben Lamm

Release Date: April 7, 2025

In episode #2301 of The Joe Rogan Experience, host Joe Rogan sits down with Ben Lamm, the CEO and co-founder of Colossal Biosciences. Colossal is pioneering the field of de-extinction and species preservation, aiming to bring back extinct species and conserve endangered ones through advanced genetic engineering and synthetic biology. This engaging conversation delves into the intricacies of their work, the technological breakthroughs, ethical considerations, and the future of conservation.

1. Introduction to Ben Lamm and Colossal Biosciences

[00:03] Joe Rogan introduces Ben Lamm, highlighting his dual life as a CEO and an enthusiast of synthetic biology. Ben shares his journey into founding Colossal Biosciences, inspired by his interactions with George Church, a renowned figure in synthetic biology.

Ben Lamm [00:22]: "I'm the CEO and co-founder of a company called Colossal Biosciences, the world's first de-extinction and species preservation company."

2. The Vision: Bringing Back Mammoths

[00:31] Ben elaborates on Colossal's primary project: resurrecting the woolly mammoth. He compares their efforts to the fictional Jurassic Park, emphasizing the real-life applications of their work in ecosystem restoration.

Ben Lamm [02:39]: "We thought that there was a huge application to elephant conservation. The reintroduction of mammoths back into the wild could actually have a net benefit to the ecosystem."

3. Understanding the De-extinction Process

[03:22] Joe and Ben discuss the scientific process behind de-extinction. Ben details the challenges of working with ancient DNA and the role of AI and computational biology in reconstructing genomes.

Ben Lamm [03:38]: "We have about 109 mammoth samples ranging from 3,000 years old to 1.2 million years old. It's a fragmented puzzle that requires immense computational power to piece together."

4. Genetic Engineering and Woolly Mice

[24:27] Ben introduces Colossal's experiment with "woolly mice," genetically modified to exhibit mammoth-like traits. This project serves as a proof of concept for their genome editing capabilities.

Ben Lamm [24:37]: "We made woolly mice to test phenotypes. These mice were 100% the edits we predicted, showing the efficiency of our genome engineering process."

5. Ethical Considerations and Interactions with Academia

[40:43] The conversation shifts to the ethical debates surrounding de-extinction. Ben expresses frustration with the academic community's resistance and highlights Colossal's open-source approach to conservation technologies.

Ben Lamm [41:14]: "We're trying to solve conservation problems, but the academic system imposes limitations that hinder innovation."

6. Cloning and the Dire Wolf Project

[49:42] Ben discusses Colossal's ambitious endeavor to clone the dire wolf, an extinct species once native to North America. He showcases the first three clones—Romulus, Remus, and Khaleesi—and explains the meticulous care involved in their upbringing.

Ben Lamm [49:42]: "We have three direwolves so far, Romulus, Remus, and Khaleesi, living in a secure 2,000-acre ecological preserve with 24/7 care."

7. Collaboration with Conservation Partners

[80:17] Ben emphasizes Colossal's commitment to working with various stakeholders, including indigenous groups, governments, and private landowners, to ensure successful rewilding projects.

Ben Lamm [80:17]: "We're partnering with 48 conservation groups globally, providing our technologies for free to aid in their preservation efforts."

8. Future Innovations: Artificial Wombs and Beyond

[95:39] Looking ahead, Ben reveals Colossal's exploration into artificial wombs, aiming to revolutionize cloning and species preservation by gestating animals ex utero.

Ben Lamm [95:39]: "Artificial wombs could allow us to clone endangered species without relying on surrogates, significantly advancing our rewilding capabilities."

9. Addressing Global Challenges with Synthetic Biology

[125:23] Ben outlines how Colossal's technologies extend beyond de-extinction, tackling issues like plastic pollution through engineered microbes capable of breaking down plastics efficiently.

Ben Lamm [125:23]: "We developed microbes that can break down plastics into biomass, offering a sustainable solution to the global plastic crisis."

10. The Intersection of Technology, Ethics, and Conservation

[143:22] The discussion culminates with reflections on the broader implications of synthetic biology. Ben advocates for responsible innovation, stressing the need for ethical frameworks as technologies advance.

Ben Lamm [143:22]: "Synthetic biology is akin to discovering fire. It's powerful and transformative, but we must harness it thoughtfully to benefit humanity and the planet."

Key Takeaways

• De-extinction and Conservation: Colossal Biosciences is at the forefront of bringing back extinct species, with mammoths and dire wolves as primary projects.
• Technological Innovation: Advanced genome editing, AI, and synthetic biology are crucial in reconstructing ancient genomes and ensuring the health and viability of cloned species.
• Ethical and Collaborative Approach: Colossal emphasizes ethical considerations, open-source technologies, and collaboration with conservation partners to address ecological challenges.
• Future Prospects: Beyond de-extinction, Colossal is exploring artificial wombs and engineered microbes to solve broader environmental issues like plastic pollution.
• Philosophical Implications: The merging of technology and biology raises profound ethical questions, necessitating responsible governance and societal discourse.

Notable Quotes

• Ben Lamm [02:39]: "We thought that there was a huge application to elephant conservation. The reintroduction of mammoths back into the wild could actually have a net benefit to the ecosystem."
• Ben Lamm [24:37]: "We made woolly mice to test phenotypes. These mice were 100% the edits we predicted, showing the efficiency of our genome engineering process."
• Ben Lamm [41:14]: "We're trying to solve conservation problems, but the academic system imposes limitations that hinder innovation."
• Ben Lamm [49:42]: "We have three direwolves so far, Romulus, Remus, and Khaleesi, living in a secure 2,000-acre ecological preserve with 24/7 care."
• Ben Lamm [80:17]: "We're partnering with 48 conservation groups globally, providing our technologies for free to aid in their preservation efforts."
• Ben Lamm [95:39]: "Artificial wombs could allow us to clone endangered species without relying on surrogates, significantly advancing our rewilding capabilities."
• Ben Lamm [125:23]: "We developed microbes that can break down plastics into biomass, offering a sustainable solution to the global plastic crisis."
• Ben Lamm [143:22]: "Synthetic biology is akin to discovering fire. It's powerful and transformative, but we must harness it thoughtfully to benefit humanity and the planet."

Conclusion

Episode #2301 of The Joe Rogan Experience offers a deep dive into the revolutionary work of Ben Lamm and Colossal Biosciences. From resurrecting extinct species to innovating solutions for environmental conservation, the conversation underscores the immense potential and challenges of synthetic biology. Ben's insights reveal a future where technology and ecology intertwine to restore biodiversity and address pressing global issues, all while navigating the ethical landscapes that come with such profound advancements.