#2332 - Oz Pearlman

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Joe Rogan Experience #2332 - Oz Pearlman

Release Date: June 4, 2025

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Introduction

In episode #2332 of The Joe Rogan Experience, Joe Rogan welcomes Oz Pearlman, a renowned mentalist and ultra-marathon runner. This engaging conversation delves into Oz's unique blend of mentalism, his extreme athletic endeavors, and the profound mental fortitude required to excel in both fields.

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Oz Pearlman's Extreme Running Feats

Oz begins by sharing his dedication to running, highlighting his impressive achievement of completing a 27-mile run in Austin, Texas, amidst challenging weather conditions.

[00:30] Oz Pearlman: "I always do phone calls while I'm running."

Joe is visibly astonished by Oz's endurance, prompting a deeper exploration into his training regimen and past achievements.

Discussion on Ultra-Marathons and Mental Toughness

Oz recounts his experience participating in the Spartathlon in Greece, an arduous 53-mile race from Athens to Sparta, which he completed in 33 hours. He emphasizes the race's brutal conditions and the strict time cutoffs that test both physical and mental limits.

[02:04] Oz Pearlman: "It's all mental. Physical is meaningless at that point."

A pivotal moment Oz describes is encountering a fellow runner at mile 72, who challenges his resolve, igniting a surge of determination that propelled him to finish the race the following year.

[02:02] Oz Pearlman: "He goes, 'If you can't run, you walk; if you can't walk, you crawl; you never, ever.'"

This encounter underscores Oz's belief in the supremacy of mental strength over physical prowess.

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Transition to Mentalism: Crafting Memorable Moments

Shifting gears, Oz delves into his journey as a mentalist. He explains how his passion for magic in his teenage years evolved into a sophisticated practice of mentalism, focusing on creating unforgettable experiences for his audience.

[14:10] Oz Pearlman: "I create memorable moments... I rework your memory."

Techniques and Philosophy of Mentalism

Oz elaborates on the intricacies of mentalism, differentiating it from traditional magic. He discusses the importance of understanding human psychology, misdirection, and the ethical responsibility that comes with his craft.

[15:10] Oz Pearlman: "It's about how you feel in the moment, the emotions... It's like hypnosis."

He shares a practical demonstration where he accurately guesses a seemingly random four-digit ATM PIN, highlighting his ability to read and influence thoughts.

[16:36] Oz Pearlman: "Men will lie. Bigger, women smaller. Men, like, fly by saying things are bigger."

Despite multiple attempts, Oz's accurate guess of Joe Rogan's PIN code amazes Joe, sparking a discussion on the ethical boundaries and perceptions surrounding mentalism.

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Balancing Life: Family, Work, and Performances

Oz touches upon the challenges of maintaining his demanding schedule, which includes running ultra-marathons, performing mentalism acts, and balancing family life with five children.

[43:42] Oz Pearlman: "I'm trying to avoid criminal yet so I want everyone to know."

He recounts anecdotes, such as performing at his daughters' birthdays, showcasing the lighter side of his life and the joy his work brings to his family.

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Ethics and Misconceptions in Mentalism

A significant portion of the conversation revolves around debunking myths associated with mentalism and psychic abilities. Oz emphasizes that his feats are based on psychological techniques rather than supernatural powers.

[103:25] Oz Pearlman: "It's not supernatural, it's layered... it's manipulative in a way."

He critically analyzes popular psychic acts and highlights the importance of understanding the methods behind seemingly inexplicable performances.

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Inspiration and Personal Growth

Both Joe and Oz discuss the impact of mental and physical discipline on personal development. They agree that pushing one's limits in any form fosters resilience and adaptability in life's adversities.

[57:59] Joe Rogan: "If you can work out really hard and push your body and push your mind, it makes other forms of adversity... much easier."

Oz shares his philosophy on gratitude, creativity, and the significance of continuous learning and self-improvement in his dual pursuits.

[64:22] Oz Pearlman: "If you're alive, you should be happy. You do not know what tomorrow will be."

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Closing Thoughts

As the episode nears its end, Oz reflects on his experiences, drawing parallels between mentalism and other forms of performance art like comedy. He underscores the importance of innovation, audience engagement, and the relentless pursuit of excellence.

[132:00] Oz Pearlman: "I'm the opposite. I don't want anyone's hope away... I'm a parent."

Joe expresses his amazement at Oz's abilities and the profound insights shared during their conversation, highlighting the transformative nature of the discussion.

[157:56] Joe Rogan: "This is, like, truly insane. I've been blown away before, but I don't think I've ever been blown blown away this much."

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Conclusion

Episode #2332 offers listeners a deep dive into the disciplined worlds of ultra-running and mentalism through the lens of Oz Pearlman. His stories serve as a testament to the power of the human mind and the endless possibilities that emerge when one combines passion with relentless determination. Joe Rogan and Oz's candid dialogue provides both entertainment and inspiration, making it a must-listen for enthusiasts of mentalism, extreme sports, and personal development.

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Notable Quotes:

• "[02:04] Oz Pearlman: 'It's all mental. Physical is meaningless at that point.'"

• "[14:10] Oz Pearlman: 'I create memorable moments... I rework your memory.'"

• "[16:36] Oz Pearlman: 'Men will lie. Bigger, women smaller. Men, like, fly by saying things are bigger.'"

• "[43:42] Oz Pearlman: 'I'm trying to avoid criminal yet so I want everyone to know.'"

• "[57:59] Joe Rogan: 'If you can work out really hard and push your body and push your mind, it makes other forms of adversity... much easier.'"

• "[64:22] Oz Pearlman: 'If you're alive, you should be happy. You do not know what tomorrow will be.'"

• "[132:00] Oz Pearlman: 'I'm the opposite. I don't want anyone's hope away... I'm a parent.'"

• "[157:56] Joe Rogan: 'This is, like, truly insane. I've been blown away before, but I don't think I've ever been blown blown away this much.'"

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Note: This summary is based on a partial transcript of the episode and aims to capture the essence of the discussions between Joe Rogan and Oz Pearlman.

Transcript

[Joe Rogan]

Joe Rogan podcast. Check it out.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

The Joe Rogan Experience. Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night.

[Joe Rogan]

All day.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh.

[Joe Rogan]

Yep.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Surreal.

[Joe Rogan]

Dude, you've only been here for 20 minutes. You already freaked me out.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Just freaked out.

[Joe Rogan]

And I'm freaked out with the fact that you're the first guy that's ever come here that ran a marathon. Yeah, before you got here.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You know, Wanted to clear my mind. It's a big day.

[Joe Rogan]

How long did it take you to run it?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You got to check online. I don't know. I think it was like 3 hours, 25 minutes, 3:30, something like that. That's a good time for southeast thunderstorming in Austin, Texas. And then looped around, went back, got some work done. I always do phone calls while I'm running.

[Joe Rogan]

How often do you run? You said you ran 27 miles this morning.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I think so. I don't know. I just. I. I turned around, I got it done. I need to get ready for this shower, but. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Is that a normal thing for you to do?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Very normal.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow. That's crazy. That's a lot of distance, man.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You know, there was like a sweet spot pre having as many kids and more family constraints and work, and now life is busy. But where I do 20 miles every day. That's crazy.

[Joe Rogan]

Like, what's the longest you've run?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You do 53 miles.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow. How long did it take you to do that?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

33 hours. Spartaphlon in Greece. Epic.

[Joe Rogan]

It's in Greece.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, it's crazy, man. You run from Athens to Sparta. This race is amazing. You ever see the movie 300 with Gerard Butler?

[Joe Rogan]

Sure.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So that's the story. A couple of crazy dudes in the 80s decided that they're going to recreate where he ran Pheidippides to deliver the message. Because in that movie, you remember, 300 Spartans defended against the Persian masses. And they frame it as the difference between us having civilization and not had those 300 guys not died while they assembled an army. And he delivered that message to King Leonidas. So when you finish this race, if you finish, it's one of the hardest races in the world. Like there's bad water, you know, Goggins mutual buddy of ours. But there's races they say are the hardest. This one kicked my butt first year.

[Joe Rogan]

I went because of the elevation. What is it?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's cause Europe does not believe in ice. So there's nothing cold for the first 50 miles. You're hot. And then the cutoffs are much stricter. So at 50 miles, you have to be done, you gotta fact check this, but nine or 10 hours. So you have to finish 153 miles in under 36 hours. You need to be running at all times. You can't walk for two hours and start throwing up. I was puking for eight hours straight the first time I did it. Still excuses. This is me just bitching. I should have finished that year. I wasn't mentally tough, but 100% that year. I just didn't have it mentally. And the next year I came back ready to die. I was like, I'm going to finish this race. Yeah. There was a guy in the middle of the night, I won't kid you, who looked at me and. And he says to me, there it is. He goes to me with like crazy eyes. And I've already given up in my mind, you know. You know, like they call it dnfing, did not finish in ultras. I already wrote the speech of like, I'm going to tell my friends. I learned from this, you know, all that, all that stuff of like, I already gave up in my mind. And I saw this guy at mile, I don't know, like 72, middle of the night, who looks at me with these crazy eyes. I'll never forget his looks. Crazy eyes like that, but 100 times more and goes, you're going to give up? He goes, if you can't run, you walk, you can't walk, you crawl, you never, ever. And I was like, yo, man, this guy needs to chill out right now because I've already quit in my mind. But I channeled that guy when I came back the next year and it was that. It was, I'm going to the hospital and you're not putting iv. I'm going to finish this race. And I came back the next year mentally like, there's no way. I'm not finishing.

[Joe Rogan]

Did you do anything different in preparation?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Listen, it's all mental. Anyone who tells you otherwise, physical is meaningless at that point. Physical is meaningless in most points, to be honest. There were guys who I saw when I quit, it was, you know, 2am who were slower than me. They were older than me. Every objective measure, I should have beat them. But they mentally finished. The next morning I got a night's sleep, woke up, watched them, ate lunch and saw them finish. I was like, I was crying. I couldn't believe the emotions of this guy finished, who was two hours behind me when I quit. And I learned that day it's mental 100% that the mindset is when you get there you know, if you're finishing at the start.

[Joe Rogan]

So did it haunt you that you didn't finish?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, haunted me every day.

[Joe Rogan]

Isn't that crazy?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Haunted?

[Joe Rogan]

Like what you did was really hard.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

But you know, that hard. It was, it was. I should have finished.

[Joe Rogan]

How far did you get?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I. I got halfway, so that's pretty hard. No, I.

[Joe Rogan]

75 miles.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

This. I quit when it was convenient because I got to an aid station and I'm like, oh, you know, I got 30 minutes on. I already decided in my mind I was quitting. But hold on, I got to pause because I walked in here and I told you before we start, I have something for you.

[Joe Rogan]

Right, right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

People always say, can I read minds? I can't read minds. I read people. Okay, this envelope, if they can't see it and they're listening, your logo sealed, right? This is your future.

[Joe Rogan]

My future.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

This is your future. I'm not psychic, I'm not supernatural, but I assure you, I want you to hold this from now until the end of the episode.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That's when we open it.

[Joe Rogan]

I don't even know if I want to know my future.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, no, this is all good stuff. Live to 120. Joe's going to be a two term president, you know. You know, shut the fuck up.

[Joe Rogan]

That's not good. I don't want that job.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You take it before we even start and at the end we open it. So nobody skips episode. You buckle up for the ending.

[Joe Rogan]

I'm here. People will just fast forward.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

They'll fast forward. They'll miss all the good stuff in the middle.

[Joe Rogan]

The quitters.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

The quitters. The people who did not finish Spartathlon.

[Joe Rogan]

That's so. That's insanely impressive though, that you run that much. When did you start doing this?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

My sister ran a marathon. Shout out to my older sister and there's a little bit of sibling rivalry. She's eight years older. I have twin sisters. And do you remember when marathoning became like commonplace.

[Joe Rogan]

Before you say anything, I have to shout out to my sister because she got upset that I didn't shout her out before because she ran Bert Kreischer's 5K. She's like, I can't believe you didn't shout me out. Sorry, sweetie.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well played, well played. Lovely.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, she's the best.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

They all are, right? So my sister ran it and everyone, at a certain point, marathoning became like a thing. Do you remember when Oprah ran one? And then everyone's like, I'm running a marathon.

[Joe Rogan]

I didn't Pay attention.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, but there was, like a moment where the zeitgeist. Everyone started running marathons. This was before that.

[Joe Rogan]

I believe you. Yeah, but I wasn't tuned into frequency.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I was. I. When my sister said she's running 26.2 miles, if she had told me, this is not that she's not fit. She was like a collegiate D1 athlete, swimmer, I'm like, what do you. If she had said, I'm going to the moon, it would have been equal of like, what do you mean? You're running a marathon? And so when she did it, I immediately, that day, signed up for a marathon just to be like, no, screw that. I'm not. I'm not. Not doing this right. And I was working on Wall Street. I was kind of getting fat and lazy, happy hours. And I. I go, this is all there is. Like, I'm just gonna keep. I'm making money. Don't get me wrong. I'm blessed. But I got. I gotta have something that fires me up. That's my instinct. And so I signed up for a marathon.

[Joe Rogan]

What year was this?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

2004.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And then I did one Philly marathon. You know, the Rocky. The whole thing. And at mile 23, I start, I stop, and I. I'm like crying. I. Again, this is a common theme. I've cried like twice in my life. My wife will ask, say, but I was wrecked. I was gonna quit. I see two dudes walking because I'm going decently fast at this point. I've trained terribly. I see two dudes walking about 100 yards ahead of me, and I go, misery loves company. I'm walk up and I'm going to catch them, but they're walking the same speed as me. So I decide, screw it, I'm going to run to them. I run. I get about halfway there. Do you know what they do? They looked at each other and they started running. And I literally screamed at them. I go, fuck you. And I got fired up. And I learned that day, anger is a great incentive. It's like something to fire up. And I got so pissed off, then my blood pressure. I ran the rest of the race.

[Joe Rogan]

You know, Goggins takes all of his haters comments and he records them and then plays it back to him while he runs.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, I know David well. I've known David going on like 15 years, man. Before Goggins became Goggins, I've seen the whole come up as you meet him. So we trained for ultramarathons together. He used to live in New York City.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, wow.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And we'd go out there and you know, he's shirtless and this is before now, man, he can't go anywhere. He's just, it's like next level.

[Joe Rogan]

He still runs on the street.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

He runs, but man, he's, he's like, that's such a fame. That's you, you know, we've talked about. But it's, he's, he's. I mean he's inspired countless millions.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, for sure.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

But you see, I don't know what your version is, but like somebody sees me, I just get like a, oh, hey, love what you do. That's it. You know, maybe a selfie. That's it. Occasionally some drunk like read my mind right now and I'm like, all right, all right, buddy, I'll do it, I'll do it. You know, I don't want to leave somebody behind. But his is someone comes up and you have to. You changed my life. Like I didn't kill myself or my brother. Like that's, that's a religious level fervor.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, no, for sure. I've been around him. When I've seen it happen. Yeah, yeah. He runs on the street. He was run on the street in Vegas. My wife, it was in the car, she rolled down the window and yelled out, stay hard.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Second time he's ever heard that. Right. Who's going to carry the boats?

[Joe Rogan]

That's all he hears all day long.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Stay hard, stay hard. The memes that people have put together are just those videos. And he's got a great sense of humor, which people don't realize. He's got a great sense of humor.

[Joe Rogan]

He's a fun dude.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

He's a really fun guy, man. Love that guy.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, he's a fun dude. He's just very serious.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

About, about pushing himself. Did you see the video of him and Israel Adesanya? Yeah, yeah. It was crazy. Yeah, Like Israel, world class athlete, world championship fighter.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Cannot compete. Can't keep up with this 50 year old man.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Who was the other one? Was it, was it, was it Jon Jones who was the other one? He trained Tony Ferguson. Tony. Tony who's like cardio is through the roof. I mean Tony was like that guy five rounds. It's just insane. Never, never gases out.

[Joe Rogan]

Yep.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, he might have over trained. He got it might go against Goggins running, ran through the washer.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, it would have been interesting if he got a hold of Tony when Tony was in his prime, you know, he got a hold of Tony when Tony was at the end of his career, essentially.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

You know.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, I mean, that's always it, right? Judge fighter at the prime.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, yeah, and absolutely. And with fighters, you know, there's just especially natural fighters that aren't taking any steroids or anything. When. When it gets to a certain point in time, the game is over. Just. That's just how it is.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right. Time is undefeated.

[Joe Rogan]

Time's undefeated. But fucking goggins, almost 50 still out there doing it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It has been injured so many times.

[Joe Rogan]

Not just injured. People need to understand the mental strength. And we've talked about on the podcast where we showed his X rays.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yep.

[Joe Rogan]

The work that he's had done on his knees, I mean, it's all insane. It's insane. They do experimental stuff on his knees, right? His knees are destroyed.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I mean they must be.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, they're destroyed. They're complete bone on bone. And he just keeps running on them. Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

He cross trains though. I mean the dude like the pull up record his hands. Cam Hayneson, right? TR I just saw that. Man, what a stud that kid is. I've been watching off the old block, follow him. He is. I've never met him, but man, he's great. That consistency and that, putting that together and. Yeah, very impressive.

[Joe Rogan]

I don't know, like I. I've known him since he was a kid, so to me it's fun to watch him become a man and then Because. Become this beast.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Beast.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, it's amazing. I mean he did. I think it was. Was it 9,000 chin ups in 24 hours or 10 more? 9,000 was the record.

[C]

10,001 and.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[C]

I'm good.

[Joe Rogan]

9,000 was the record and he got to 10,000. So he broke the record first. Then some cat in Australia broke the record, beat his record and then he just demolished that guy's record.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And then I saw his thing, which was a flex, which reminded me of something I did, which was like one of the highlight moments in my running career, which is he goes, I got another personal best in the same week at a marathon. And so he ran. So I one time did two marathons a week apart, like six days apart. I did New Jersey marathon, I won it. And then the next week I did Long island marathon and I got clipped by some college runner who beat me in the last like quarter of a mile.

[Joe Rogan]

Damn. You won a marathon?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I won that one four times in a row. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

That's insane. What's the time?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

My fast times at 2:23.2 hours and.

[Joe Rogan]

23 minutes for a fucking marathon?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. I love Goggins, but every race we've run against each other, I beat them.

[Joe Rogan]

You have two knees.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

But that's insane.

[Joe Rogan]

That's. That's world class.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I mean, it's. It's like a fast for a weekend warrior. My claim, 23 minutes, one year at the New York City Marathon. I want to. I want to remember this. I got 30th place. But at my shows, I tell people I was the fastest Jew. That's all that mattered. That's all. Fastest Jew, all that mattered.

[Joe Rogan]

That's super impressive that you win marathons.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, I won that one. And then six days later, six or seven, I did this other one and I got beat by this kid who was like 22. I don't care how old I was 30s. And he beat me and he fell and collapsed at the finish. And I'm like, again, I'm pretty fresh. He goes, oh, my God, man. He goes. He goes, is that your personal best? And I'll never forget looking in his eyes and this guy's wrecked. And I go, bro, that's not my personal best this week. And it was just. It was just the most fulfilling thing to say for not having won. But I'd run literally a week earlier, faster, so I. That was a great moment.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, but he beat you.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

He did beat me. True. First loser.

[Joe Rogan]

Weird flex. Yeah, it's a weird flex. So you were a stockbroker?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I wasn't technically a stockbroker. I worked on Wall street, but I.

[Joe Rogan]

What did you do on Wall Street?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So I went to school for electrical engineering and then worked like, I don't know, the tech guys who supported the I. Bankers.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay. And then how did you get involved in this mentalist thing?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

This mentalist thing. Right. What a weird thing. So when I was a teenager, I started doing magic tricks. So I saw a guy on a cruise ship and I'd never seen. Really a magician. I never. I wasn't into it. Didn't know about it. Didn't have a kids party magician. I was a kid and I was obsessed. Literally. I was on a cruise. I followed this guy around the cruise ship. It was a little bit stalker esque. And there's not that many places to hide if you're a grown man. So I was finding this guy everywhere to just see more tricks. And I got back home and I bought every book I could at Borders. I went to the library. I was obsessive. I'm kind of those types of people who. I don't do anything. 80%, 90%, given the running today, it's like 120%.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And that was the thing. For about, I don't know, 20 years. It was more. I was doing magic. I was always doing magic on the side. I paid for college. Doing magic. Really? Run a couple businesses. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

What did you do? Like, do shows.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So I graduated high school. I was 16. I, like, skipped a grade, all this. And then my folks got divorced, long story. And they moved back to Israel. I was born in Israel, so separately moved back to Israel. So I was a bit of a. I guess, I don't know, an adult. Like, I had nobody supporting me. So when I went to college, I turned 17. I had to pay all the bills.

[Joe Rogan]

Whoa.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. So I was doing magic at restaurants. I've been doing magic at restaurants for, like, 30 years. And that's where I learned how to read people. Just how to go up to a table of people who are like, who's this twerp? Like, who's this nerdy kid with braces? Like, what are you doing here? Get out of here. And how do you win them over quickly? And that's honestly the biggest skill is how do you, in sales, read people effectively? Right? That's what I'm selling. I'm selling the thought of reading your mind.

[Joe Rogan]

Now, did you learn the techniques from books? Did you take classes?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No classes. Books and videos. Did magic. And so mentalism is kind of a field. Like, you had David Blaine in here, right? Legend and growing up, like, icon. So magic tricks are different because magic is. There's a sleight of hand, right? So you're deceiving your eye by making you look at the wrong place at the right time. When I do a move, and I can practice that move over and over and over until I get it perfect so that when I perform for you, it works, right?

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Stand up comedy, the most pure art form, right? You and a mic. That's it. Mine is the closest magic. You have props, mentalism. There's no props. Like, I don't need you to pick a card anymore.

[Joe Rogan]

I don't need it, right?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I can just tell you think of a card and that's where I go with it. So now you start knowing how people think, and you, in essence, reverse engineer the human mind. It's kind of like magic of the mind. And so that's where it kind of went from magic. And I kept doing more of the mentalism. More of it. But mentalism has a very steep learning curve. You know, if you go do an open mic and you suck, how many People get to the level of getting better. Getting better. Putting in the work takes 10 years to be funny for most people. Right. There's a couple of phenoms, but that's a different story. So most mentalists, they drop off because I'm just going to go back to magic tricks. This works every time.

[Joe Rogan]

Hmm. So it's more difficult to learn.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Way more difficult.

[Joe Rogan]

Is it sheltered? Like, is the material on it difficult to find?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Is like, I think it's more that people don't have the thick skin, like the same way you said the quitting mentality where I came back the year later. Most people won't improve because you can't practice mentalism in front of a mirror. You can practice magic. So when I do the trick on you, and it's a card trick, no offense to magic, it's great. But what we're talking about is a much higher level. I can't get it right. And the first few times you do it, the first hundred times you eat, you know, you eat shit. Like you're going to get it wrong. And most people don't want to do that. Watch, watch. Let's try something fun.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Okay, how about this? If I were to ask you, how long you been married?

[Joe Rogan]

16 years.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Okay. Nailed that question. Well, well played.

[Joe Rogan]

Thank you.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You got your sister's happy, your wife's happy. If I asked you, would your wife know your Social Security number?

[Joe Rogan]

No.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

She doesn't know it?

[Joe Rogan]

No.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So is there any way in the world I could know your Social Security number?

[Joe Rogan]

I don't think so.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right. You say I'm a stalker. Who knows?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. Yeah. You could get the information maybe online.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Agreed. Agree. I'm skeptical. You're skeptical.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, especially someone famous.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, fully. Plus, you can't change that, so I'm not going to do that to you.

[Joe Rogan]

Data dumps.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You know, if I told you right now to make up a random number, I'd say, get out your calculator, I'd love that. And you add it up and you do a random number. You know, I'm screw calculator. I want it to be spontaneous. Would your wife know your ATM pin code? No.

[Joe Rogan]

No.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Lie to me. Do not tell me your real ATM pin code.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Obviously. Unless you want to make up a fake four digit number off the top of your head, what feels to you, utterly spontaneous. When I say go. 1, 2, 3. 4 digit code, random. Go.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Say it.

[Joe Rogan]

20.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

20, 20, 20. Okay. So you ask me, how do I do what I do now? I'm going to write down 2020.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's weird, but statistically, men will lie. Bigger, women smaller. Men, like, fly by saying things are bigger. Right? No. Shocker. Okay, so I don't think I would tell you right off the jump. For me, that that means that your first number. You don't have to say anything yet. I wrote 20. 20 is smaller. That's what most people do when they're rushed. If I had given you five minutes, you would have done this different.

[Joe Rogan]

No, I wouldn't have.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, you would have.

[Joe Rogan]

Why would I you.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Because you would have thought about it, and then people go down a different path.

[Joe Rogan]

Nope.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No?

[Joe Rogan]

No.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Okay. Work. No for me. Either way, you'll be honest if I'm right. Okay, I got a hit. Which means It's a 0 or 1. I think the first number. Your code's a 1, isn't it your real pin code?

[Joe Rogan]

My ATM pin code? Why would I tell you that on the air?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Should I. Should I only show this to you?

[Joe Rogan]

Sure.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Only show it to you.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Can we acquiesce that the first number I got was correct?

[Joe Rogan]

Yes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Okay, now, you did repetition, so. Yeah. I like the fact when people always say to me, it's fake. When they watch the videos, they. They're like, you must have set up. Joe doesn't even want this to happen right now. He had no idea this was going to happen. You use two numbers in repeats. What that means is you probably did the same thing. You also didn't use any of the same numbers. I know. There's not a 2, a 0, or 2 in it. I don't think so either. And I'm watching you while I say it. You put the hand up. You might as well said yes to me out loud. So now I know. Think of the second number.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Third number, fourth number. Every time you did it, it's a data point.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I'm only gonna ask you one more question. I'm not looking for answers. The last number is the biggest, isn't it?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. I'm showing this to you. Is there a camera behind me? I don't want to make sure. I'm only gonna show it to you. It's not 2020. How'd I do? Joe, is that your ATM pin code?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, that's. I'm skeptical because I've got that pin code in the mail.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You know, he's calling his bank right now and be like, yo, do you know this? Has this guy been playing the long game?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. I don't like that. It's not 1950 anymore. People we know our food is different, highly processed and less nutritious. Industrial farming practices often strip nutrients from the soil and can deplete the nutrients available for us from food. Even the healthiest diets can have nutrient gaps, but AG1 Next Gen helps fill those gaps. It's a more in one daily health drink to give your body the nutrients that you can't get from food alone, especially in today's day and age. AG1 next gen is clinically backed, rigorously tested and trusted by athletes and experts. I've been partnering with AG1 for so long because they really do the work to help you feel a difference in your health. If you want to feel a difference and fill your nutrient gaps, subscribe today to try their newest clinically backed formula, AG1 Next Gen. You'll also get a bunch of other free stuff like a bottle of D3 plus K2 and five of the upgraded travel packs with your first subscription. Just go to drink a1.com Joe Rogan one scoop a day, your body will thank you again. That's drinkag1.com Joe Rogan have you ever done that to people and then withdrawed money?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No comment.

[Joe Rogan]

Interesting. Interesting.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I'm trying to avoid criminal yet so I want everyone to know. That was correct, right? That is you went 2020.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, that was correct.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Your wife of 16 years doesn't know it, but it's.

[Joe Rogan]

It's 2020. Not it's just because that's the year I moved here. It wasn't like.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I think, I know you think that's the case.

[Joe Rogan]

No, that's 100% the case. That's exactly what it is. What do you mean you know I think that's the case. You said a four digit number and I was like, oh, the data moved here.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right?

[Joe Rogan]

2020. Perfect.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I hear you.

[Joe Rogan]

You don't believe me.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's not that I don't believe you, it's that we got layers. So, like we're peeling through. And I know why you think you picked it and I know that you think you gave me no information, but I'm telling you that good luck finding out. How in the world could I have found out your BTM PIN code? You said nobody knows this. That informed what I did. So had you thought of a different number of your Social Security, you wouldn't have said 2020.

[Joe Rogan]

But that ATM pin code is one that was assigned to me by the bank and I never changed it, right? So I didn't pick it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That's even better, isn't it? Had you picked it I could have looked this up. That's actually, to me more.

[Joe Rogan]

No, you could get it from the bank because the bank is the one that sent it to me.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

If I guess. Man, if I have broken into your bank account. There are bigger things at play than this podcast. I feel I don't keep a lot.

[Joe Rogan]

Of money in that account.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Watch this, watch this. How many UFC fights do you think you've seen in person or commentated?

[Joe Rogan]

Boy, I don't even know. I really don't know. UFC 2002. What is it, 200 and 234 or something? What is it at now? 235 is the next one, but each.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Fight has an undercard. You got. You got the title fight.

[Joe Rogan]

Sometimes as many as 15 fights, right? Or as few.

[C]

3, 3, 3. 16.

[Joe Rogan]

What is it?

[C]

316.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

16.

[Joe Rogan]

UFC 316 is now coming up on June 7th.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

What?

[Joe Rogan]

Did I say two?

[C]

Yeah, I was thinking twos for a second. Didn't we have 300?

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, you know what I'm thinking? I'm confusing podcast numbers. We're in the 2000.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, yeah, there's a lot of podcasts.

[Joe Rogan]

UFC. Yeah, that's. So it's UFC 3. What?

[C]

316.

[Joe Rogan]

316, 10 fights. So I haven't been on all those cards, but I started commentary wise in 2021 and just as a post fight interviewer in 97, so. 97. I did it for two years, not as many shows. And then from 2001, I used to do 20 a year. I used to do a lot. I was doing most of them. I would say thousands of fights.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Thousands, Right. So probably watch this because I love that I like the way you think and I like that you're skeptical because I. I'm a huge skeptic. I'm always the one calling BS on this. Right. That's how I started doing it. If you think through all your fights and you go back in time and they need to know this is spontaneous, this is impulsive. You have not thought of this before this moment, have you? I want you to stop and start thinking of different fighters, past or present. Could be somebody huge, could be a legendary figure, could be somebody more under the radar. Okay, Maybe you've had them on the podcast, maybe you haven't. Watch. Make sure you think I'm not guiding you the same way. You said 20. 20. You go, I said that. I would have said that no matter what. Let someone jump into your mind right now that you've definitely seen one of his, I guess, or her fights.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Bam. I'm not guessing it. I don't care. Tell us, was it a specific fight you saw this person in, or you just seeing the fighter?

[Joe Rogan]

Just seeing the fighter.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, no. Go to a specific fight of that person. Try to, like, contextualize it.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Or change to a different fighter right now if you feel like you need to maybe.

[Joe Rogan]

Let me think, let me think.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

See, Joe's not gonna want to change now that I said that.

[Joe Rogan]

I'm trying to get it. Crafty.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, get crafty.

[Joe Rogan]

Move along here. Are you gonna come up with a name?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I'm not coming up with anything. I want to see how your mind worked. I'm only doing this because you told me. I would have said 2020, no matter what you think, that you had the thought, regardless of what I did. And I want you to see that there's causality. Boom. Do it. Now, who just came into your head?

[Joe Rogan]

Okay, tell us.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I'm not guessing.

[Joe Rogan]

Anderson Silva.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Anderson Silva, legendary, right?

[Joe Rogan]

Yes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Did he win or lose that fight?

[Joe Rogan]

He won.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

He won that fight?

[Joe Rogan]

Yes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

How many people did you go to? So funny. You said Anderson Silva, legendary guy. How many people did you think of before you landed on him?

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, I don't know. I scrolled. Rolodex. They just all went flying through my mind.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Just give me a guess how many times.

[Joe Rogan]

Dozens.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Dozens?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. They just all went flying through my head.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Dozens?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

If you had to put a number on it and you actually count them, how many do you think you went through? Guess.

[Joe Rogan]

I mean, let's be conservative and say for like, 14. Like, not even say dozens.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

He was the 14th fighter that popped in your head?

[Joe Rogan]

No, no. He was in there. He was in the mix.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

He was in the mix.

[Joe Rogan]

I was just trying to figure out which one to pick. I was gonna get one with a crafty Russian name.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Should have one of those Chechens.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

All right. No. 14 people went through, had Anderson Silva. It's. Do you think that at some point in this week you heard something that got that in the back of your head that made you say that? Now, do you think there's any way that that could have happened?

[Joe Rogan]

No, I don't believe so.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You don't write.

[Joe Rogan]

No, I don't believe so. I've just been a huge fan of his forever. I don't think something popped up that made me think.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

All right. I'm just curious.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No trick. I'm just curious why that happened.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Where do we go from here?

[Joe Rogan]

Where are you going with this?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I don't know where I'M going, you don't know. I do.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

But I'm not telling you yet.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, Joe's flummox. He's like, where do we go?

[Joe Rogan]

No, I mean, like, I don't know why you asked me the question if you don't have a resolution.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, I'm not guessing it. I wanted to see where you thought of why it came to your mind. There will be a reason. I don't want to explain it yet, but you'll see.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

There'll be a reason why it came in.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I think so. I think there is. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

What's the reason?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, I don't. I don't want to tell you yet. I'm selling the sizzle, not the steak.

[Joe Rogan]

So these techniques that you use, are these ones that you've invented or these.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

A lot of them.

[Joe Rogan]

A lot of them, yeah. Yeah. And how did you invent them? How they come to you?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I think my favorite form of entertainment by far is stand up comedy. Like straight up. I'm a fanboy of comedians, like, not the people that do what I do, because that's. I just love watching how you can take any premise and stuff that's not funny. Right. The people that really go, you know, you just like Andrew Schulz, life. Did you watch his?

[Joe Rogan]

I haven't seen it yet.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You haven't seen it?

[Joe Rogan]

No.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So how do you take infertility? Right. And just. It's not really a very funny subject. And make it incredible. Incredible. No, he's amazing. He's so good. So good. And so I like the fact that how you invent that. So I design with an end in sight. I say, what do I want people to remember about what I do? Because I'm not really in the business of fooling you, honestly, and like entertaining you. All of those are side effects. What do I think I do for a living? I create memorable moments, which is very definable because if you go see a movie, let's say you see a popcorn flick, you walk out of the movie theater 10 minutes, I go, what happened in the movie? I don't know. I was fun. I don't know. That, to me is 100% like the death of my show. You leave and you will remember things, hopefully for years to come. And that's because I can rework your memory. That's really a lot of the techniques I do. People think that your memory is infallible, that what you see is some sort of blueprint, like a video. And it's not. It has to do with how you feel in the moment, the emotions, the things you can position. The same way hypnosis works. So I can kind of engineer memories in a certain way. The way people remember things, the way they think, and create those moments that people talk about, hopefully for years. And that's what's been happening, you know, I guess that's what's been the driver of my business. And what's helped. Helped lead to my success.

[Joe Rogan]

Engineering memories. And when you first started getting into mentalism. Is that the word to use? Mentalism?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

You're a mentalist. But do you call it mentalism?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I guess so, yeah. Mentalism.

[Joe Rogan]

Did you know that or is it something that.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, I learned it. You know what? I learned certain things, and I observed them, and I didn't understand why they happened. You ever have that. You ever have a moment in a set where you say it's something that you didn't think was funny but got a huge laugh? Do you have that or do you always know?

[Joe Rogan]

Because it's.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's usually not the punch. It's like, I didn't know that would be funny. Right?

[Joe Rogan]

Then oftentimes with a new bit. Yeah, right. You don't exactly know where it's funny.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Where the beats are. What was the word I said in this way? What was that Inflection point? So when I was doing restaurants, I had this trick where I would have somebody pick a card out of a deck of cards, right? They would put the card back in the deck, they sign it with their name. And I used to do this at a bunch of restaurants. They would shuffle up the deck. I give them a rubber band. I say, rubber band that bad boy. And I would take the deck and I would throw it at the ceiling. It's kind of a famous trick. And then, boom. The ceilings were really high at all the restaurants I worked at. So nobody could peel their card would be stay stuck to the ceiling. And this was great for multiple ways. One, everybody talks about it, and they're like, dude, this guy stuck my card to the ceiling. How do they do that? They would also bring people back to the restaurant. You write, cha Ching, cha Ching. The managers love me because we'd bring more people back to see it and point at where their card was, right? Business 101. And so I create a great value proposition to the manager. Why am I there? I'm, you know, getting you guys more customers, right? But one time, I'm listening to people that came back in and they're talking about the trick, and they go, yo, Man, I picked a card, I put it back in the deck, and I shuffled it up. And next thing I know, I look at the ceiling, and my card's on the ceiling. And I'm like, yo, that's not what happened. I threw the deck up, the deck fell down, and then the card was on the ceiling. So I go, why did that guy misremember it? Right? Maybe he's just drunk. Maybe, whatever. But I'm trying to understand, why did he have a different memory of the same event? And what I realized is that people observe what you have them focus on. Tony Robbins has a great bit where he goes, right, now, close your eyes. Tell me everything that's green in this room. And you're like, green. I don't. You know? But then when you open your eyes, I see that the UFO lights are green instantly. But I say, close your eyes again. What's purple in this room? I'm like, I didn't look for purple. You find what you're looking for. So if I didn't say, it took me a while to, like, iterate and figure it out. But if I don't look up when I throw the cards, when I would throw the cards up and let them fall back down on my hand and not look up, the percentage would go 80, 90%. That afterwards, people, when they told the story they edited, they clipped out the part of me throwing the deck. And now it becomes a miracle. How the hell is that card on the ceiling stuck? You mean you shuffled it? It was signed. It's on the ceiling. That went from being a good trick to a miracle. And I kind of learned that at about age 15, and I started to realize, how do I do that with everything I do? Because that's a life hack for everything you do. That's not magic. That's life. How do you get people to remember what you want and forget the things you don't want?

[Joe Rogan]

Wow.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That's how you achieve success. You start to highlight your strengths. You find ways, and that's a learnable skill. That's not something for magic. That's something in all of life.

[Joe Rogan]

And what is it like when you're thinking this, when you're thinking, I'm going to get people to remember something, how do you. How are you doing this? Like, what's your intention when you're trying to devise, like, what the. What to do?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, I guess. I guess my intention. Well, at the end of the day, I'm a competitive sob. I want to be the best in the world at what I do. Like, I'm driven by that. It's like Olympic gold medalist. Like, I want to do the best things possible. Most people don't know what a mentalist is. You go on the street, 100 people, how many people are going to say.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, I have a second ATM card.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Leave that for the end, huh?

[Joe Rogan]

You want to try it again?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Not yet. I don't like to do the same thing. I gotta do better.

[Joe Rogan]

I want to see it again, though. I want to see if you could do it again.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

All right, before we go. How about that? Not right now. We're in flow.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay, okay, but I'm trying to throw you off.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You could listen. I don't get it right every time. That's the other part. A magic trick. Works every time. This doesn't. I've eaten it on live national tv, millions of people watching. Yeah, man. There's no safety net. Like, it's not a trick. There's not a card trick where you put it in. I find it. There's not like that.

[Joe Rogan]

So how are you doing it?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, I mean, I'm telling you, I don't read minds. I read people. I've got a whole host of different skills. Algorithms, you name it. Like misdirection. It's all a wheelhouse of skills that I'm using to create the impression. I can read your mind.

[Joe Rogan]

But this has got to be a weird thing to know how to do.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Weird like in a bad way or a good way?

[Joe Rogan]

Definitely a good way. Yeah, but weird to like, you have like an extra frequency.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I agree.

[Joe Rogan]

You're tuning into with humans. Like you're experiencing life in a different way because you're experiencing life through this understanding of, like, thought patterns.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You know what the best way. Do you remember in Bourne Identity? The first scene, like one of the scenes where he loses memory and he walks in the restaurant. You remember that scene? And he's sitting at a diner. Do you remember that one?

[Joe Rogan]

I don't.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

He sits there and he turns and he goes. He doesn't remember who he is. And he goes, why do I know? And I'm gonna massacre this quote, but why do I know that that guy's 250, can handle himself in a fight? Why do I know this? Why do I know that right now I could run for two and a half miles before my core temperature goes down to this, like, he. It's like this amazing superhero spy moment of like, how the hell does he know all that stuff? So he's observing life at a much more hyper focused level than Most people are, most people are dialed in at autopilot. If you could set a speaker to autopilot and here's what you're observing. I don't do it in my day to day life. It requires focus. It's not the same. It's kind of like, I guess, I don't know, I don't lift weights, I just run. But how much focus is required to try to do, you know, the largest bench press you've ever done? I assume that you have to get psyched up, you have to focus. You do everything right for that to work. Just an analogy, but for me, when I'm performing, you asked me why to run 27 miles this morning. That dials in my mind like I'm focused or I thought through everything I'm going to do today. I'm, it's, it's a laser focus that got me kind of in tune. I could also have not run, but that, that's, that's. I'm also away from home. So that was like My Joy is.

[Joe Rogan]

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[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Gambling problem.

[Joe Rogan]

Call 1-800-GAMBLER in New York. Call 877-8-HOPENY or text Hopeny at 467-369 in Connecticut.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Help is available for problem gambling. Call 888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org Please play responsibly on behalf of Boothill Casino and resort in Kansas. 21 and over. Age and eligibility varies by jurisdiction. Void in Ontario. Bet must win to receive reward.

[Joe Rogan]

Minimum minus 500 odds required bonus bets.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Expire 168 hours after issuance.

[Joe Rogan]

For additional terms and responsible gaming resources, see DKNG audio. So when you're like putting together a show, when you're going to do a show, how do you structure it? Like how do you like day one you're like, okay, I'm getting ready to do a show.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You mean some on TV or like what I do for a living?

[Joe Rogan]

Like, like either one, Any kind of show you're doing.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So for my day to day living, which is I do a lot of like really big corporate events and then I do, you know, I guess a lot of private parties, things that sort performances, like live performances typically I structure it the same way I think anybody would. I want to go out the gate very strong. I want to very instantly establish credibility. Who am I? What do I do? Am I any good at it? And why should you be paying attention to me? Because all those questions off the jump is like, who the hell cares? I always go into it, who cares what you can do? You're special, I don't care. I like the thought of I'm going to prove to you that this is something incredible and that it's something you're interested in emotionally, right? If I told you just make a random number up, who cares? But now it's gonna haunt you that that's your frickin ATM PIN code. So I prefer that. So I do something very quick that freaks you out and then every single thing needs to have a very clear premise. Like I call it clarity of effect. I don't like a trick where I'm like, get a book, get a Rubik's Cube, get it. Like it's too confusing. You need to be able to explain to a six year old what I did in one sentence for it to be memorable. That's the key. The best things you've ever seen are typically stuff you can describe in one max two sentences. And for tv? For TV it's the same exact thing. But I always like to do new stuff. So I've done a lot of TV appearances and I always structure it based on who's watching. So rather than it being about me and me saying oh look what I can do and look how cool this is, right, you do a card trick. Again, I'm not saying that's not amazing, but the card trick's about you. Typically if I'M on espn, and I've, you know, done hundreds of millions of views, doing stuff for football players. You're watching this, you're a football fan. You're like, who cares about this guy? I'm gonna do stuff about football players and about what interests you. If you're a fan, I don't know if you've ever seen. I did a clip with Joe Burrow from the Bengals where I said, joe, I ever spoken to you a word in my life? He goes, no. Like, I. Honestly, the funny thing about that is I wasn't even supposed to use him in the show. They told me he's shy, he doesn't want to, like, don't use him in the show. And they said, if you can't avoid him. And I got in there, I tried to rile up the gang, you know, kind of peer pressure. And I'm like, should we get Joe in here? And they're like, yeah, get him up. Haven't spoken a word to this guy in my life. There's no access. I went in with espn, shout out to Adam Schefter, who I love, who set all these wheels in motion. But Joe stands up, doesn't know me from anyone. And I say, every wide receiver and tight end in the room, stand up. And I go, what if I could tell you who you're going to throw that ball to? What's that worth, right? That's the holy grail if you're in football. I go, catch the ball, quarterback. I go, look at everyone in this room. And now look at me. And I wrote on a huge, huge thing, showed the camera, throw it to anybody you want, throws it. Got the first one right. I go, let's do it again. I go, throw it to anyone you want. Anyone. I go, anyone throws it. Got the second one right. Everyone's freaking out. I go, one last play, one last two is luck. And I write fakes to Jamar. You can watch the clip. It's most viral thing I've ever done. And he fakes it to ja' Marsh, turns around, throws it to another guy. Nailed it. Exactly. Just. And you just see his face. And so I was thinking about how I would do that for two years. Two years of thinking of every single way that could work, not work, go wrong. Everything about it was, you know, he thought I went in the room. And it's so simple. That was two years of me thinking about it during every run.

[Joe Rogan]

So for two years, you knew you were going to do this, or you knew that you were.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I started with the end, you asked me the same way. I don't know how you, like, form a set, but you asked me, how do I design? I was designing with the story people would tell. And so people don't know who I am, don't anything go, yo, we saw this guy. Do you see this guy? Here's old Joe Burrow to throw the ball to any people. Throws it, gets it right. Throws it. Like the story is, I told the quarterback anybody he would throw the ball to.

[Joe Rogan]

So it was any quarterback. It wasn't Joe Burrow in your head.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, I didn't know who it would.

[Joe Rogan]

Be, but he said you could do it for two years. So for two years you thought you were going to be on ESPN and with a quarterback?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, no. So I had. He was the second season. So when I started it, I start brainstorming. I'm like, I can't control what thoughts come in. I'm constantly thinking about what I'm gonna do. And I. I just do notes, apps. I write stuff down in the shower. Like, when I run is when I come up with stuff. And in the shower. Sometimes on airplanes, but I sleep on planes. But that's when it hits me, like, where are your. Where are your bursts? You must have, like, where are you getting material?

[Joe Rogan]

Mostly late at night.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Right. Yeah. But sometimes driving.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Driving. You don't do phone calls or anything?

[Joe Rogan]

I mean, phone calls. I'm usually concentrated on talking to people.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

They're times where ideas come to me. A lot of times it's driving with no music on.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Wow. Yeah. I'm never in the car by myself, ever.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, really?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Family, but five kids.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, wow. Yeah, we're driving to work. You know, usually that's when it comes to me.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. And I'm in New York City, so there's Sauna.

[Joe Rogan]

Sauna.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Sauna's good. Because you can't be on electronics, right.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

The phones are a killer. The phones, like, you zap any creativity or boredom. You need boredom.

[Joe Rogan]

You do need boredom.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

You need boredom for ideas to come to you. For sure.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yep.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. That's the problem, essentially, with social media. It's like. It's a boredom. You are still bored, but you are occupied.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right. You don't get to sit with it.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Which I think is key because that's when they kind of fire off.

[Joe Rogan]

Yep.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And I think that's, you know, not to get into it, but, like, so many kids now have no way to deal with boredom.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Like, it's like panic. I gotta get My phone. I gotta. You know that whole feeling of, I wish there was a way to do that.

[Joe Rogan]

They're just completely unaccustomed to not being constantly entertained.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

And even entertained by nonsense. It's not even really entertaining. It's just distracting.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Which is a big part of it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

So you sat out for two years prepping this thing.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, I didn't sit out. I was just always thinking. It's like.

[Joe Rogan]

Right. I mean. But, you know, you set out. I should say set out in your mind. You had this idea in your head for two years.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

How do I do it? Yeah, how do you do it?

[Joe Rogan]

How do you do it?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That's. That. That was the question because I didn't know how to do it at first.

[Joe Rogan]

How did you do it?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Million dollar question. Right. I wouldn't be in business if everybody knew. That's kind of.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, okay, even better. How did you learn how to do this kind of thing?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So I started with books and then there's some videos. But it's a very.

[Joe Rogan]

What do the books tell you that's applicable?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

They give you a series of foundational things. Like. Right. Almost everybody who becomes a mentalist stars a magician. It's kind of like if you're a doctor, you gotta be a doctor before you become a plastic surgeon. So there's this core set of skills that you utilize to know how to fool people. Right. To know how people think.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right. Think about you. If I taught you a card trick right now, there's always a level of deception.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, that's sleight of hand.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, not even. There's tricks called self working tricks where you don't need to do any sleight of hand.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

They work by themselves as long as you follow the instructions, like IKEA furniture. Like step one, step two, step three. As long as you can work people in a certain way to do the right things versus somebody. I'm not doing that. You're like, oh, shit, what do I do right now? Right. You have to know how to finesse people. You have to influence people effectively. And so that same stuff within magic almost always applies to props. You need a thing to do the trick. Now, it could be a regular deck of cards, in which case you're luring slights. But also there's gimmicks. Right. There's tricks you can buy at stores, which, when I was a kid, I'm like, oh, teenager. I'm like, get me the next gimmick. But then to get better, you start being able to do stuff Impromptu, right? That's when you kind of hit another level where I don't need stuff. I can do stuff with anything. You know, I could do stuff. It's like a good story for my book that I'm writing right now, but it's like, where I just needed anything around. I was like, I end up in jail for a weekend. It's a long story, but, like, in jail one weekend, stupid weekend. But I walk in there by myself, and I should have been out that day. But anyway, I got stuck all weekend, and I watched them with cards, and it was like I had trained my whole life for this moment. I walked up, record scratch to like, 40 dudes, and I go, can I see those cards? And it was like everyone looked at me like, what's this guy about to do? And I just did card tricks for the next eight hours. When I went to take a shower, I'm like, am I. I'm like, thinking of the show Oz. I'm like, oh, my God, right now. I did. I had protection. I went to the shower. McCoster County Jail in Michigan. And literally, I had people being like, go take a shower. We got you, bro.

[Joe Rogan]

What did you go to jail for?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So stupid. So we had. This is so dumb. This almost derailed my whole career. Drunken idiots. I go up to visit a buddy in college and we steal from a Papa John's got, Don't ask me why, a broken phone at a college. Papa John's just being idiots. I paid for the pizza, but there was a broken phone on the counter. And, you know, this is like, me, slight, a hand style. I'm like, I'm just stealing this thing. It's just gone. And it was in my jacket. And then I told my buddies, you guys got to get something too. So they go in the bathroom, which doubles up as the employee locker room, and they take three dirty shirts, dirty shirts from a laundry bin and we bring them back to my buddy's house. Like, idiots. We wear them and we at the party, I barely remember this. I was like, blackout drunk are like, papa John's. Who wants a pizza? Who wants a pizza? I end up going to sleep on his futon, right at like 2am and at 4am someone comes in and they're like, yo, the cops are here. I'm like, do. It's not my house.

[Joe Rogan]

What do you want from me? You guys post the video?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, this is pre social media, man. No, no. Somebody ratted us out. Somebody's roommate, I found this out way later, called and goes, yo, bro, There's a bunch of dudes here with a broken phone from Papa. I didn't know any of this, but somebody comes in. They're like, yo, the cops are here. I'm like, they're here for you. And I'm like, here for me? What do you mean, they're here for me? I don't live here. And cops come in the room, and I'm wearing, like, aggressively small underwear at this point. This is like, tighty whities. This couldn't have been more of, like, a bad perp walk. And I. They go, yo, you're under arrest. And I'm like, for what? And they're like, for stealing from Papa John's. And what am I gonna say? I'm wearing the shirt.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, my God.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

This is on a Friday night.

[Joe Rogan]

How old are you?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I was 20 years old, and I was just about to get an internship from Merrill Lynch. And while this story is hilarious now, it's like a funny chapter in my book. It was like, God help me, did I avoid everything? And then when I went to jail, yo, scariest. One of the scariest days of my life, because it's.

[Joe Rogan]

How did you get out of everything?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So I got out everything because I had a clean record. I was pretty upstanding citizen. And, you know, not to get in the weeds. There's something called Holmes youthful trainee act. I wonder if they still have it. Whereas, expunged from my record. Didn't have to report it to, like, the Wall street firm. And they also said they were charging me. They put us in, like, a drunk tank, me and two buddies. And they said they're charging us with felony larceny. And I'm. I've seen some, like, Law and Order. I'm like, felony what? It's just like, what do we steal? Like, 20 bucks worth of stuff. They go, but you stole things they don't sell. Had you stolen $999 of pizza, it would have been a misdemeanor. And I know they're lying to me. I'm not a mentalist then. And I'm inebriated, but I can read the room. Didn't say a word. Knew this was bs. And then they separate us when we went to general population. And it's not like the movies, you know, It's. It's like. It was. It was wild. It was wild when I went in there, and I just knew this is my cheat code. It was like everything in life had prepared me for this moment. And the jail was also. Again, I didn't Know this, but it's very segregated. Like. Like, the white dudes are here, the black dudes are here, and I didn't know. What do you do when you go in? Like, what do you do? I'm five foot, nothing. I'm like a buck forty, dripping wet. What do I do? How do you make friends right now? And I see the black guys playing spades, and I just walk up and it's like, you make your move and I'm like, let me see those cards. And it was just. It's like a moment I have, and I didn't stop for hours, and I didn't repeat a trick. Like, I know tricks encyclopedically. I just go all day.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow, what an experience.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It was crazy. And then it was all thrown out and cost me some money. It was definitely a very, very stressful few weeks, and I never stole anything since. Honestly, that was scared straight. That was very, very smart. Like, I. You prefer to learn a lesson like that for my kids, especially without being stupid. But so many of us have to be stupid to internalize a lesson of touching the stove and I had to burn my hands.

[Joe Rogan]

But did you always talk this way? The way you talk? You talk very fast with a lot of energy. Is this your whole life?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I think so. Man. Anyone on 1.5x the way I listen to podcasts is going to be miserable with me. But, yeah, maybe that's it.

[Joe Rogan]

Like, you're listening to podcasts at that speed. You're communicating at that speed. It's like you're on and you ran 27 miles.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That's true. No caffeine. So I'm not a caffeine guy.

[Joe Rogan]

You don't drink caffeine at all?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I try to avoid it. Like, I'm not a coffee guy. I missed the boat on coffee. I honestly wish I did. It probably wouldn't be good for me, given how dialed in I am. But, like, I just never started drinking caffeine, so I never got into it.

[Joe Rogan]

Do you ever mess with any stimulants? Not really, no. Not really. What does that mean?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Like, what do you mean by stimuli? Like, I'll have, like, anything if I don't sleep.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And that happens a lot. So if I'm not, like, getting enough sleep and I've done a red eye and I'm this and that. I will occasionally do, like, a Celsius or Red Bull, but I don't really like it. I do it kind of as medicine because I have to be alive and functioning, but I really try to Avoid. Avoid it.

[Joe Rogan]

What is it like when you get hit with a Celsius and you haven't been drinking any caffeine?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So I only drink about a third of it and then I pour it out and. And my kids are always like, why are you pouring that out? And they call everything a brewski, which is a weird thing they call it just because before, I always, like. It was always like a brewski is what they've extrapolated to every beverage in a can being a brewski. It's hilarious.

[Joe Rogan]

That's funny. And so one third just like, must.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I can't do more than the roof.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, yeah. Like, if you drank a Four Loco. I did have booze in it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yo. Four Locos are like.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. But it has, like, caffeine too, right?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That's like bad decisions in a can right there.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. Like, what am I thinking of? Oh, a red line. Is that the one?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, I think it's Four Loko. It's caffeine mixed with alcohol.

[Joe Rogan]

One that's like. Was just caffeine. It was crazy.

[C]

That was the stuff to take, like pre workout. That was people up.

[Joe Rogan]

Was that a red line?

[C]

Something like that.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, there was that one. That was the other one. That was Rip Fuel.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

We all know Americans are still recovering from years of surging prices. Now some in Congress want to make cuts to Medicaid, a program that provides critical health care to 72 million struggling Americans, including veterans, people with disabilities, kids, and your friends and neighbors. 40% of American births are covered by Medicaid. And Medicaid covers health care costs for a third of children with cancer. Working families rely on this program. It has 77% support. Nearly 9 in 10Americans oppose Medicaid cuts. Did you know that 12 million Medicaid families live in rural communities? Many of these people voted for President Trump, but they didn't vote for this. If Congress cuts Medicaid, a lot of rural hospitals could close and a lot of rural families will be hurt. No matter how you look at it, cutting Medicaid just doesn't make sense. Tell Congress not to cut Medicaid. Our health and our communities depend on it.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, yeah. So you've always been like this?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I gotta ask my wife. I think so. Well, I'm more on now because we're doing something, but if I go on certain platforms or TV and I know I want to be slow, then I'll just calibrate down, but I'm getting fired up.

[Joe Rogan]

Do you, when you plan out a Show, whether it's a corporate show or a television show. Do you have like a whiteboard? Do you like, put your ideas on? Like, how do you. How do you do it?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So I take meticulous notes about everything, everyone I meet, everything at the end of a show, immediately, as quickly as I can afterwards, probably. Some people record shows. I hate rewatching myself on corporate shows and like live shows. I don't mind TV stuff, but for some reason those. If I've repeated material because it's like muscle memory, you've done this before, it irks me to watch again. But I write down everything that happened, every nuance, like paragraphs about everything that happened, which is a useful life hack because I remember it all. But also I get repeat bookings a lot. So if somebody brings me back now, it's like a real magic trick where I know everything about what happened. And if you even just recount stuff from two years ago, people think you have superhuman memory or what do they like? People's number one subjects are themselves, their family and their friends. The more you can do that and give them back stuff about them, the more they're like, wow, what a caring individual. Right. Being a good listener, a lot of times just repeating back to people what they just said.

[Joe Rogan]

Right? Right. When you do these corporate shows and you do these television shows, when it goes great, do you have this idea in your head? Like, now I've got to ramp it up. Now I've got to push it even further. Now I've got to make it even more difficult for me, for sure.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

For tv more than corporate, because corporate's not as big of a deal. Because what does somebody want there? They want a defined quantity. Right. They don't want somebody. You don't want to work out new material if you're being paid a lot. It's just, it's at a stadium. Are you doing new ones? Like, you're going to do your hour, you're going to do what's solid? So I do a lot of that. And the problem is I don't really have a lot of places where I can do new material because I'm. I'm just so busy. So I have so many events that I. I don't really have, like, anything.

[Joe Rogan]

That they're like open mics for mentalists where you can go practice.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

There might have been in the past, but right now it's not. It's just not where I'm at.

[Joe Rogan]

So you just practice on friends sometimes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Everything's in my head.

[Joe Rogan]

Everything.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. So I I. A lot of things I'll. I'll do on tv, I've never done before, ever.

[Joe Rogan]

Really?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. So I'm just thinking through everything that could go wrong. And I go through kind of like a list of what could go wrong here. What could go wrong here? What if they think this right there. What if we change this? I have like plan A, B, C, D, E. I have just a long list of what everything will go like. A pick your own adventure and typically I know where to go with it. And then controlling your body and your tension is everything, right? So you're a hunter, you step on a branch, animal hears it, what happens? Right? Gone. Right. It's a sense that we can feel, we have the same thing. We're animals. If I get tense when something's going wrong, you can sense it. Even if you don't know it on a conscious level, you can sense it. And now we have a cascade. So my job is based upon me being somewhere the alpha and being in control of a situation. And so if I think about it, if I just said, think of your pin code, you're like, I don't want to. Right? I don't want to. I'm gonna do this instead, I'm gonna do this instead. Right. How did you acquiesce to my will? You did what I wanted in essence, right? We could manipulate any way, but at the end of the day, you did what I wanted.

[Joe Rogan]

Right?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And in my show, I'm the one pointing the camera, I'm always the director. You don't get to point where you want. I'm kind of in charge. And even if I let you think you're in charge, I'm still in charge at the end of the day, right? Right. I come to my kids, I want them to eat veggies. I don't say, you gotta eat your veggies, they'll say no. I go, you're so lucky right now. Carrots, cucumbers or peppers, which one? You're so lucky you get to choose first before your brother or sister. Now, I've framed it differently, right? Anybody with toddlers knows that's the best way to do it. Don't go straight on, that's not gonna work.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So the same thing applies power dynamics in relationships with people. So I got lost in my train of thought. But in essence, if I am messing up and you know it, it's gonna go downhill really fast. And so on tv, some of my biggest mess ups, you don't know, but I am shitting my pants flop Sweat, like fully. And I can't let you see that. I need to be so calm because if I am not calm, you can actually, you can actually tell and it's gonna keep going worse. And I can't get you to go back to what I want. And now I've lost control of the situation. So years and years were spent doing that. I would say it's very akin to a sniper. I'm not a sniper. Don't get me wrong. I'm not military. But how do you calm your heart rate? How do you stay calm even when you're not? And I, I could have an HRM on me. I'm calm when things are going wrong.

[Joe Rogan]

That must help. The running must help for that, I think.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So your heart rate, low heart rate.

[Joe Rogan]

Just in control of it as well, right? Like your, your heart muscles very finely tuned.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, I think it helps. I mean, it can't hurt.

[Joe Rogan]

My friend Cam Haynes, who also runs these crazy ultra marathons, he's also the best bow hunter in the world. And bow hunting is a lot of it is controlling your anxiety at the moment of the shot execution. And I would imagine for him, his heart rate is like completely under control all the time because he's always like very low. You know, because he does so many miles, like everything, he can stay calm. It's probably a really great tool just for staying calm, right?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I think so. I mean, the way I describe the ultra marathons, because they're silly, right? You. He just ran. I love cam ran 250 miles. You see that thing? Amazing. That's a crazy thing to do. That's not healthy. And I'm a nutcase who can say that? And for most people, like, I don't want to do that and you don't need to. But what is that? What is that really? When you do that, everything else in life becomes easier. The lows that you experience when you do something like that is a way you cannot fake in any other way. You cannot test who you really are than putting yourself. You could be on the couch saying, what would I do? And be tough guy. And you're pretend to be Goggins or Hanes. But until you get in that level where you're miserable, you haven't slept in a day, you have all that. There might be another way to push yourself, but that's where you learn who am I really at my core. And then when you go back to normal life, everything else, the volume is turned down. And when I come back from those races, all I do is Get a mirror to put up to see who am I really when things are at their lowest and when I want to quit and I don't quit.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, I think that's. That's a very strong statement. I think one of the things that you just said there, I've said a bunch of times that if you can work out really hard and push your body and push your mind, it makes other forms of adversity that you face during the day much easier. And I think that's one of the reasons why so many people are so filled with anxiety. It seems like that's such a simple solution that most people don't want to accept it. Like, oh, there's more to that. There's a mental imbalance, There's a this, there's that. Like, perhaps. But everybody that I know that does what I'm talking about, everybody they know that pushes themselves very hard in the gym or running or doing yoga or whatever, they're the most happy and the most relaxed and they're able to face adversity throughout the day much easier than people that don't take care of their body, that don't eat well, that don't exercise and don't experience any voluntary physical discomfort.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Couldn't agree more.

[Joe Rogan]

It's just, I think it's. It's. I think it's mandatory, you know? And it doesn't have to be what I do, or it doesn't have to be what you do. It's. Go find. Do pickleball. Okay. Go play some other sport. Tennis. Do something that's fun. Jiu Jitsu is a great one. It's fun to do. And then you learn how to do something while you're working out. Muay Thai is another one like that. You know, there's a lot of stuff that you can do that's fun. That's exercise. But, but, man, you should exercise.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You know, you gotta move your body.

[Joe Rogan]

You gotta move your body.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Again, I don't wanna speak out of turn, like medical, but they've shown over and over that exercise is just. It's almost as effective in certain regards. And like. Like just being a certain level of healthiness than antidepressants. Yeah. More effective. It's unbelievable.

[Joe Rogan]

Statistically, clinically, more effective.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

More effective.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. Cause it's. Of course it is. Of course it is. Like, this is the reason why people are so filled with anxieties. Cause your body has certain physical requirements. Your body was designed to fight off predators and to run away from enemies and to hunt and gather food. That's the same DNA as people that live tens of thousands of years ago courses through your body, that's. Or the fabric of your body, that's you.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

You can't deny that. And there's a reason why this, this sedentary sort of generation that we're experiencing right now because of phones and tablets and all the sitting in front of screens all the time. It's the most depressed, right?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, for sure. Anxious too. Like the Jonathan Haydon. Like, it's, it's, yeah, it's, it's wild. The correlation and it's just so clear cut. But yeah, social media is very, it's, it's, it's one of those things. There's some benefits, but man, oh man, you can't put that genie back in the bottle. You gotta find the right way to do it.

[Joe Rogan]

There's some benefits in that. There's a lot of inspiration.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I agree.

[Joe Rogan]

You know, and also information. You know, I'm not completely off of social media. I, I tap anywhere, but I've radically reduced it over the last month or so and in doing that it's really been much, much nicer. Like life is way easier. But occasionally I'll find something really interesting on social media. So it's like, boy, I don't want to not know that. I don't want to not like find out about some new scientific breakthrough or some new thing that's going on. One of the things that I found that helps me though, instead of social media, I just, I just have a bunch of stuff that I curate in my Google News app. And so I'll just like find like any sort of scientific breakthrough or some weird discovery or a lot of really interesting things about ancient civilizations. I just have that stuff curated. So it just shows up on my feed.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Where do you get that? On your phone, right?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, it's just the Google News app. It's great because it's like, like that way I can find stuff out without having to go and just hopefully randomly run into it on X or on Instagram.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

You know, that's helped. That helps a lot.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Terrible with X. A lot of my friends get news on X. I'm just like, it's too much negativity. It's all a lot of negativity. And for Instagram for years I started realizing that it just like a compare and despair is one of, you know, that like where I'm like, why am I getting off of this and feeling worse than I did getting on it? And so I really had to flip a switch in my brain to, to, to. I got rid of that. Anything that I don't like, I don't show. And I stopped focusing on what I don't have and what I focus on what I do have. And so it.

[Joe Rogan]

So did you like used to go to it and you see someone with a giant house and a Lamborghini or something like that. Was it material possession?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It wasn't material. It was. I need to use so I don't look at people and hope, hope poorly upon them. I look more at it and say I'm not doing enough. So it's like a inferior. You're always going to be lesser than right. You're always going to be. Someone's going to be younger, richer, smarter, like every er. But in my case it was more of I wanted to achieve a level of success and just seeing other people in my field or other fields and I felt like I'm not doing enough. Somewhat driven, ambitious. So I'm like, I'm just not doing enough right now. And it's that constant feeling of I'm not doing enough doesn't drive you. It would be better to see. Look at them. I'm so happy for them. I'm gonna do that too. Like I. It should be a positive, uplifting thing and it's a flip in your brain. It's like multiplying negative 1 times negative 1 and much more of the inflection point of gratitude. Like I do you know Jay Shetty? Jay. I don't know, podcaster. Really good dude.

[Joe Rogan]

I've definitely heard.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Met him last year and he told me something very stuck with me for the last year, which is million thoughts a day. We're on social media, we're all this that he goes, the only two thoughts. You can't control them all, but try to control two thoughts each day. The first one when you wake up and the last one you go to sleep. It's that easy. Those two just try to have the first thing you wake up be one. And before you go to bed, just have one last thought. And they're always. For me, it's like, yo, I'm every day alive is a blessing. Like, I literally, I believe that in my core. I don't know what's going to happen tomorrow. Like a parent in my school just passed away recently shattered like young kids, cancer. I've known a few people and you see that and you're like, no, that's for real though. You don't know what will happen tomorrow. So I've hit the lottery, like I'm blessed beyond measure. Wife, way out of my league. Smart, gorgeous, sharp as a whip, five beautiful kids. Like I try to focus on everything I have and never on what I don't have. I get to do what I love for a living. Like my mindset is completely evolved of why would I think of what people don't? And everybody. If you're alive, you should be happy. You do not know what tomorrow will be. And I know that's all like New agey, whatever, but that's. You don't know when you're. Your clock's up.

[Joe Rogan]

We were just talking about that in the green room last night at the comedy club about gravity. The problem with gratitude is that too many people have co opted it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

And really annoying people. Annoying, Annoying. Like wooden beads types, you know, like gratitude. But gratitude is really important.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

But no, it's actually what you think because your thoughts create a lot of your reality. The same way I said looking around the room. So if your mindset starts to become one more of rather than you see someone, you're like screw that guy, he's rich. Right. That's how the mindset. That's easy for you to say, they're rich. You see that in comments all the time. Yeah, I'm like, I think that person worked their butt off to get to where they are and what did they do? And you know what, that's inspirational to me. What can I learn from that? And so that's just a mindset of. I don't see it as a zero sum game.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, it's one thing that those people that post things like that have in common when you go to their page. They're all very boring.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right? Right.

[Joe Rogan]

It's really interesting. You see like the expression of their dull mind. That's like them, they got money, right. I don't have money. They got money. It's a dull brain. And I always wonder like what is it like to be that person? Is that person? Is that a biological hitch or is it just learned behavior? Like what is it that makes them that stupid?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I don't know if it's stupid. I mean I don't know if a judge but I think you project your insecurities.

[Joe Rogan]

It's a little bit of that, but it's a. It's is clearly a stupid way to think.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

You know it does. It's totally not empowering like to complain about someone else's success or be angry about someone else's else's success is not empowering in any way, shape or form. And so that's inherently stupid.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

But you find the excuses because you're like, if I had that, if I had that.

[Joe Rogan]

And rather than must be nice.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, exactly, Must be nice. Rather than saying, how do I do this for myself?

[Joe Rogan]

Exactly.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's much easier, especially if you've given up on certain things.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Now, once you've given up, it's better to make excuses and someone else down to try to bring you up.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, here's what's dumb about it. And this is why I said it's stupid. It doesn't get any better when you think like that. Instead, if you can shift your focus and see someone doing something, recognize that these tinges of jealousy that you feel are completely natural. But realize that to get the most out of this, you have to switch that in your mind to inspiration. And that person's success, that's kind of freaking you out. Now becomes fuel. Right now becomes fuel. And you can motivate yourself, but you have to avoid the. That guy. And this, that. That doesn't help you at all. That does zero good for you. And in fact, it occupies all of your precious time with complaining when instead, if you can manage it and it can be managed, you can turn that into inspiration and then go out and try to do something thing either focus more on what you're doing, realize maybe I'm doing this where it's not as efficient, or maybe I can have more energy. Maybe I just need to do it more. Maybe I need to be a little bit more disciplined in my approach, whatever it is. But those little shifts will have measurable changes in the outcomes. Huge, huge changes, major down the line, especially the big one. Change jealousy to inspiration. Love that you have to be able.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

To do it right?

[Joe Rogan]

It's. It's a giant key. You know, I remember when I was 21 years old, there was a guy who was going on stage, and I was hoping that he bombed, right? I remember thinking that I was hoping that he bombed. And the reason I recognized it, I was realizing that I was recognizing that he was talented and that he was really funny, and it bothered me that maybe I wasn't as talented as him or it wasn't as funny as him. So instead of, like, seeing him going, what is he doing? Like, wow, this is great. Instead, now all of a sudden, I was hoping that he failed, right? And then I realized, like, oh, here's the problem. First of all, that's just like, general bitch thinking that, like, can enter into your head and you got to figure out how to stop that.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yep.

[Joe Rogan]

But I also realized that I was getting to this weird, precarious position, which happens to a lot of artists, where you get into something, whether it's music or stand up comedy, because you love it. As a fan, you love watching it. Like, I loved comedy, but then I. When I became a comedian, I stopped loving comedy. Now I was comparing everyone to myself.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right. That's brutal. Right?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. And it's not good for you. And I was like, no, no, no. You got to go back to laughing at stuff that's good and not connecting it to you at all. It has nothing to do with you. You. So when someone's really good, that should be great.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

And then you should be laughing. Even if you don't like that person, you should be laughing.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

Just you. Even if you hate someone and they're funny, you should be laughing because it's good for you.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. And it's. I find that it's over time. It's. It's. It's almost. It's selfish, but it's selfless at the same time is I like to show love to people coming up as much as possible and try to highlight them and try to kind of pay it forward in a way.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That's for the new people that are kind of doing what I do or doing different things.

[Joe Rogan]

It makes you feel good.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It makes you feel good to do good for others. Right.

[Joe Rogan]

It's selfish to help people. Isn't that funny? I say that too. It's very funny. We think the same. Yeah, I think exactly the same way. It's kind of selfish, but it's also. It's. That's what Community is supposed to be about. It's supposed to be not just about you. And that's the difference between Community and a cult.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right?

[Joe Rogan]

Cult is like. Then you have the cult leader, he starts bagging everybody's wife and he wants everybody's money.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

There's always an inflection point where you're starting to bang wives. That's always. Where is that in the culture? There's always a message from God. Right.

[Joe Rogan]

That tells you you need more pussy.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And you're like those two right there. I don't know why he didn't. I didn't say it. I didn't say it for the record. Yeah, he said it.

[Joe Rogan]

God said it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And then always the part else is there's always some sort of a end point, like the world's gonna end. But it didn't because we prayed so hard. So we're back, baby. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. Those guys Are great. There was a billboard in Los Angeles a while back that had the date of the end of the world.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

And you drive by, and I was like, I can't wait to show up here and take a selfie in front of it the day after this fucking stupid date.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

Because those guys are never right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Never. Right.

[Joe Rogan]

That's weird. They're the worst mentalists. You know, the.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

The cult leaders.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, cult leaders. They just never see the writing on the wall.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

The cult leader has, like, a very unique. Where, again, there's. There's a fine line between. If you looked at a path of my life, again, I don't see myself cult leader, but a con man is very similar in many regards to what I do, because that's using these skills in what I would describe as like an unethical way. Right.

[Joe Rogan]

Don't you think they're the same thing? Occult leaders, a type of con man.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, I'm saying what I do is like a con man.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, but you are a con man for entertainment purposes, right?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Exactly.

[Joe Rogan]

It's different. Like, you have an understanding of the human mind, but instead of using it in a. You do it for entertainment, which is, like, a good way to use it for sure. Everybody gets happiness.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's happiness. And you're not lying about the premise. Which is. The premise is, I'm starting from the jump. I'm not psychic. I'm not supernatural. People ask me, is this like a talent or is it a gift? And I think it's similar. Well, yeah. I mean, you've got to have some sort of thing in you to be a good comedian or a good musician or anything like that. You can work on it and get better. But I'm never going to the NBA. You know what I'm saying? That's. You have to have some attributes, right?

[Joe Rogan]

There's like a personality trait that just is embedded in you from the time you're young for whatever the thing is that you love to do.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Maybe it was like watching my folks. Maybe there was a lot of weird stuff. I was very good at math as a kid, like, unusually good at math. And I would do weird stuff. Like, I count steps every time. I knew every step in every place I ever went to. Like, some Rain man stuff. And when I would go, this is from the time I was like, six. We go to Little Caesars. I'll never forget. I lived in metro Detroit. And before they rang up the food, I knew the percentage tax it would be. So when they did it, I would instantly say, before I'd look. And I know what my mom is going to take on. You know, you're going to get $16.18. How did you know that? And change, change. And it was like a weird. It was like a weird thing that I got very good at. And I think the boom. Dopamine hit. Dopamine hit. They would like that. And so it's ingrained where I was good at. Again, people become the joker because there's some sort of dark thing in there. Not everybody, but typically there's some, I don't want to say trauma. But you're not going to be funny or amazing unless something happened in your life where you have a reason to be entertaining, Right? And so I think there's points in time where I could take people's minds off things. And this was a great way to do it. And also magic. People don't get to know you. They get to know the character, the performer. So you get that nice little separation, which I learned at a young age was really like how to make rejection. Fear of rejection, fear of failure. Most people, that's their number one fear. And I learned at 14 how to make that gone, like, eliminate that entirely.

[Joe Rogan]

Interesting. That's interesting. It's also the dynamic of you being in control, which I think you talked about earlier. I think is. Is for whatever reason, imperative when you're speaking to people. You have to be in control for them to let you kind of guide everything. You don't want other people, you don't want to ask questions and have everybody, like, free to talk and.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, I don't mind that. No, I don't mind that. But if they do it when I want them to, right? It's like, again, so the best salespeople in the world aren't the used car sales, like, buy this, buy this. That's. Nobody does. Well, the number one salesperson organization is the one who gets you to sell yourself. They're bending over backwards to be like, I gotta. I gotta do business with you. Right? You get someone to the point where at the end you don't have to hard close, right? Every organization I work for and I go in there and like, show you how to DO Sales Training 101. It's going to be the person who gets the other person to sell themself. That's what you do. You lay the breadcrumbs into the trap. The trap is not a bad thing. But the same thing happens in my show. I am leading you in a certain direction. Watch, I'll show you something. How often is Jamie. Jamie. When I walked in, I talked to him for like 2 minutes. Said he loves magic.

[Joe Rogan]

He does.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Is that true? Is Jamie off mic?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[C]

What's up?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

He didn't know I was gonna do this. You have daughters, correct?

[Joe Rogan]

Yes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So it's hard. I have three girls, two boys and I found when I named our girls, but we named them together. Obviously the naming of the girls was far harder than the boys. When you named your daughters, was it agreed upon? Were you like shortlisted? How did it go about.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, I feel like my wife did way more work than I did for sure. So she carries the baby in her body. And I said, listen, I would just want veto power. Veto where you can't name the kid applesauce or something fucking stupid. But she. I go, I don't think it's a fair proposition. That was like literally what I said. I said, I. And I don't give a about names.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And they've got your name for last name, which is not fair.

[Joe Rogan]

But yeah, right. It's right. Yeah, exactly. And so does she. But my name is Joe. It's a boring ass, stupid name. It doesn't bother me at all that I have the same name as a billion people.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

So for me, names don't mean anything. And it meant something for her. So I said, you decide.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So watch this. What are the. Do you know what the most common names are right now? I know this. Recently we have like a one, a two week old. But the most common names right now are not the same as when you were naming your daughters is my guess. If they're teenagers. What? Do you know what the most common name right now in. In America? I think it's six years. Running this up? No, no. For girls. For girls.

[Joe Rogan]

Is it? No.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Olivia, can you look up top 10? Look up. It just came out. Social Security. I know this because like I said, we were trying to figure out names is. Am I right? It should be Olivia's number one.

[C]

Know what site to go to, but.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I don't Google top 10. Who do.

[Joe Rogan]

You think of when you think of Olivia?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I thought initially of Olivia Wilde.

[Joe Rogan]

Who's Olivia Wilde?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Movie star.

[Joe Rogan]

Do you know who she is? Oh, that lady? Yeah. Oh, she's great.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

I thought of Olivia Newton John.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, that's second. That would have been second. I performed for Olivia Wild, never Olivia Newton John. What did you get? Did you find out?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[C]

Do you want me to show you the list?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, yeah. It's not a trick. I just want to say, see Olivia's number one.

[Joe Rogan]

Emma.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Emma Charlotte, Mia.

[Joe Rogan]

Mia. Sophia, Isabelle, evelyn. That's interesting. 8. I would have never imagined that.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right? You did not hear those names when you were growing up. There were probably no girls named Ava when you were a child.

[Joe Rogan]

None of any of these names. Maybe Olivia, after Olivia Newton John. But that's crazy. Sophia is number 10. That's interesting.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And Sophia spelled two different ways, so it's technically number one. Jamie.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, really?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

If I ask you. Okay.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, that's right. It is. It's still ph and F. Wow. Interesting that Sophia is number one. Really? Huh.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Harper.

[Joe Rogan]

What's Harper? 11. 12. Camila. Camila. Number 11. That's nuts. Eleanor.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Older names are coming back. Yep.

[Joe Rogan]

Really? Older names? Yeah. That's like Eleanor. It's like my friend Eleanor Kerrigan. She's in her 50s. These ill. Ileana. Ileana's number 18. That's crazy. What are the odds, right? What are the odds that if you told me is Ileana in the top 20 of names? I'm like, shut the up. Whose names are kid that I think someone.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Someone I know.

[Joe Rogan]

It's a beautiful name.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Love that name.

[Joe Rogan]

It's not a bad name. It's a beautiful name. But it's like. It's like. I would have never thought it was that kind of common.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So when you think of how this is happening. Watch this. Jamie, I ask you to come up with somebody absolutely random from your past. Absolutely random.

[C]

I dug deep.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Okay?

[Joe Rogan]

You already got it. Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You know what? How do you know this person? Not. Oh, you shouldn't have said that. Oh, I shouldn't have said a word. You know, right away.

[Joe Rogan]

What did you know?

[C]

It's from preschool.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Preschool. Somebody in preschool?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You still keep in touch?

[C]

Met him?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, she said to him. Why do you say him and then her?

[C]

Sorry, I met them is what I guess I was trying to say.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

This guy's playing the pronoun game. What's going on here? You know what? No, no. There's too many giveaways. Just said wasn't on the list. Doesn't this. Let me ask you a question.

[Joe Rogan]

Want to try again?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, no, I'm. Do something better. We'll switch. This is a glitch in the Matrix. Jamie, close your eyes. Close your eyes. You got to look. Okay, so pretend you're closing your eyes. I'm going to put you on the spot.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's not the. A pre preschool girl. I want you to close your eyes, go back in time and try to picture the face. I always call us the one that got your first big crush. Can you visualize her face or you can't see her clearly?

[C]

That's. You asked me this before. It's like a. It's a tough question because the way you started wording it was like, is this a first crush for me was like the first person. Like, I knew there was like TV people and stuff like that.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, is it a TV person?

[C]

That's what it would have been, technically, I guess, yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Your first crush was a TV person?

[C]

Sure, yes. Someone and I saw on tv.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Is that right?

[C]

I think so.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Okay, guess.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, I don't know. Is that.

[Joe Rogan]

I don't know.

[C]

I'm trying to.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

If I were to ask you to look up how popular this name is. Well, no, I'm not gonna do it again. It's not top 10. Is that correct?

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[C]

It wasn't.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Okay, hold on. Look this way at me. I want you, without using your fingers, to count the number of letters in this person's name.

[C]

The real name or the characters name. I don't know if that matters.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I don't know. I don't. I. I've never had a fictional character as my first crush. This guy got weird. I don't know. Whatever. I don't ever name you went with. I. I don't say it out loud.

[C]

I'll go with the fictional character.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Don't say. Don't say. No, no, don't.

[C]

To me. They weren't a real person then. So you know.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, I don't know. Oh, don't say oh. Don't tell. Oh, man. Don't tell me. Don't give me any more clues.

[C]

You're not going to figure it out.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Good. All right, you know what? Do this. Joe, I want you to see this. Should we get a piece of paper right down. There's mics everywhere.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay, screw it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Don't even write down. Don't even write down. No, no, not you. I was gonna have him write it down.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Eight or nine. Do. Do me a favor.

[C]

Sure.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Count again, but to yourself. Don't do it out loud. Count to yourself.

[C]

What, the letters?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, don't do it out loud.

[C]

The 8 or 9 wasn't the letters, but. Go ahead.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I'm so confused. All right, good. This got all over the place. Jamie wants this to go wrong.

[Joe Rogan]

He does. I do.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I don't know if this the real name or the fake name anymore. But before today and me asking you to think of this person. Be honest. Would it have been days, months, or literally years before today since this person even crossed your thoughts?

[C]

Honestly, this Would have been a couple months.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Couple months. Couple months. Could Joe know it?

[C]

No.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

All right, mix up the letters and stop. Like Scrabble tiles. Freeze. And grab out a letter somewhere in the name. Maybe grab one out of the middle.

[C]

Middle.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Okay, you got it?

[C]

Sure.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

He did two and he switched.

[C]

I was trying to look to you.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, no, you did. Shifty eyes. He did this one and then this one. You didn't do a vowel, did you?

[C]

I don't know.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, you can tell me. It's.

[C]

It's.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You did a vowel after all that. A, E, I, O, U. Look at me. First when I picked and you went to the end, do you think the last letter.

[C]

No.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

The last letter is a vowel, though, isn't it?

[C]

Sometimes it is.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Here we go.

[Joe Rogan]

Sometimes. Why?

[C]

Yeah, that's the only way.

[Joe Rogan]

A, E, I, O, U. It's sometimes. Why?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Take a look. Don't say it. Don't say it.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I don't know. I. This is. Who knows? Was it nine letters? The name is nine letters long, isn't it?

[C]

Her. The real person's name is nine letters.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, I think. Yeah, yeah. The real. And. And he hadn't thought of this person in a vow. Yeah, it does. I know. I saw. I saw it. And you switched the one. And I wrote this down. Joe. You see it, right? I can't change it. No trick here, no bs. What's her name? This first crush saw on tv.

[C]

Her real name is Christine.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Christine is what I wrote down. Christine is what I wrote down.

[C]

Her fake name's Melody from.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Hey, dude, you don't have to tell me. I know.

[C]

Stan. Christine Taylor.

[Joe Rogan]

How did you know?

[C]

There's this.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Wait, wait, hold on. Right now, right now. I want to try this. Here's. I want to try. Joe, how many people? How many people?

[Joe Rogan]

Just happen.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Wait, where did I put this?

[Joe Rogan]

Are you an alien? Do you work for the CIA?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I gotta take a leak like crazy. It was. Where's the bag? Dude, I drank like two gators before I got in here for the run. That was a mistake.

[Joe Rogan]

What bag?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

There's a bag. Oh, I didn't bring it.

[Joe Rogan]

Didn't bring it?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No.

[Joe Rogan]

You go peeing?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, no, I've got. I've got. I've got. I've got it. Look, I want you to do this. I put together. This is for you. You. Joe, take these, okay? 50 people chat. GPT.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Look through that list.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And these are all people. I didn't make this up. I just wrote them down.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Who have been on the show multiple Times and that or. And that idea. How would I describe this? My guess is you have a personal connection. You know these people. Is that a fair assessment? Rattle off if there's anybody in there that you feel is not fits the bill or you don't talk to me anymore. Throw it away. I don't care.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay. Yeah, I know all these people.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You know these people?

[Joe Rogan]

Mm.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Okay. Sure it not a trick. I'm not gonna guess who it is. I wrote the list. I know who they all are.

[Joe Rogan]

Got it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I don't care. You want to mix them? You want to do something? I don't care. Whatever you want to do.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Once you mix them up or whatever you want to do, put them in front of you, please. Like a pile turn kind of. Oh, you're not gonna look? Because I want them to be, like, random kind of put them in front of you, kinda turn them sideways.

[Joe Rogan]

Turn sideways.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, I want to see what you're doing.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And I think we're gonna do this together. I don't know if I'm gonna reach over or not. Okay, here's what I want you to do.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I want you to take. I'm gonna do it with you. Is I want you to lift off like a chunk.

[Joe Rogan]

A chunk?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, like a chunk. And put the chunk over over here. No, no, no, like, next to you.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Like, I don't know. How do I. Can I move over with the mic or no?

[Joe Rogan]

Yes, come over here.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Take the headphones off.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Should I take them off or leave them on?

[Joe Rogan]

Take them off.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Take this.

[Joe Rogan]

Take this. Okay, well, take.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Take the piece. And I want you to take. And the same way that I'm making a bunch of chunks like this, I want you to take. And I want you to be in charge of this. So take these ones.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And would you agree that's pretty randomized?

[Joe Rogan]

Very randomized. Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And I want to assess right now. There's five of them.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Is. Take one of the piles.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And put it. Like. Which other pile you going with?

[Joe Rogan]

Another pile.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Like, point to another one.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay. This one? How about this one?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, perfect. And I want. You don't show me.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I want you, like, grab that one.

[Joe Rogan]

All right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

The card.

[Joe Rogan]

The card on top.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Whatever you want. Take it, Grab it. And look at that person's name.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And don't let me see it. How likely if you were to text this person, do you think would they answer?

[Joe Rogan]

100%.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, you sure?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. 100%.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Most of the list was a guy. Guys. Is it a guy?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Not judging a lot of dudes on the show. Put them all back together. Okay, let's assess this. I don't want to know who it is. I don't care who it is as long I want to see. And if they're not going to answer, I would tell you to text somebody new. Text this person in your own words and say, I don't know. Got a minute? Need a favor and see if he texts back. If he doesn't, we go to somebody new. We'll give it, like, I don't know, 15, 20 minutes.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay. Can I tell him what's going on?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I would hedge and not say yet because I want to see where he goes with it. Because if you tell him, like, I. I don't care, but I want to. I want to keep this very. I don't want him to know where we're going yet.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay. Should I tell him? Text me back.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, I guess. Text me back. That works.

[Joe Rogan]

Hey, brother, do me a favor and text me back as soon as you get this.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's gonna sound like someone's dying, but okay.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, it depends on it. Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

All right. And put it down. We'll revisit later. Pressures. Let's see. Let's check back in a few minutes.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Will it vibrate if he did?

[Joe Rogan]

No, I have it on do not disturb, but I'll take it off. There we go. Okay. He's very busy, so he might not be in front of his phone.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No worries. If it doesn't go, we'll give it some time, and if not, we'll switch gears.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

But turn your phone face down so you don't think I can see it? I don't want to know.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Who, what, where?

[Joe Rogan]

Alrighty.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

We'll revisit. We'll come back.

[Joe Rogan]

Put it on my lap so I feel it when it vibrates.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I'm holding it in, though. I knew the Joe Rogan effect.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay, we're just gonna sit here and wait for him.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, no, no. We'll check back in later.

[Joe Rogan]

That seems ridiculous.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Is it?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, because he could be working out. He could be doing it, anything.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So if we get it, it's meant to be. This is. We'll see.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's not. It's not pressing.

[Joe Rogan]

You have an idea who it is?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I. I don't know. I. I can look through the list again. It's not Cam Haynes, is it?

[Joe Rogan]

After you said all that was someone popping into your head.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I'm not going to guess who it is.

[Joe Rogan]

Not at all.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No. Because here's the reason why, if we reveal stuff. I don't want you to. If, If I guess, like, something very specific about this person that will. Like, he might not want everyone to know his ATM pin code or Social Security number.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, you're going to guess it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I don't know what I'm going to do yet, but I don't want. You could tip it. But he's gonna be pretty pissed if everybody finds out something, so I prefer if nobody knows yet. But if we wanna. You'll see.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay. Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Take it to the next level. Jamie's in the room.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

But what if we could just get anyone who you could have picked anybody, you know, right now it's different. Right now it's never been done before.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You asked me what do I wake up with, thinking about how could I do this?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, how are you gonna do this?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I don't know. Let's see if it works.

[Joe Rogan]

Let's see if it works. So. Okay. Oh, he got me.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

He did?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Okay, here's the thing. I think that if I were you, I'd say later. Well, it's texting. What if somebody saw something? No, no, no, I haven't. I don't give any clues yet. If you're. There's microphones everywhere. We just asked him to think of his first crush, but he did, like, someone fictional. And, like, that's a.

[Joe Rogan]

Can I tell him I'm in the middle of a show?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Maybe say I'm in the middle of a show.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay, okay. Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And say we're doing a bit. I, I. Do you want to call him? Because if you're texting this. Do you want to call him or do you want to text him?

[Joe Rogan]

Well, if I call him, people are going to hear his voice.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, but what if you call him and you just go over there. Which one's better to you? Which one's more impossible? Where later you go, there's just no fricking way. Is it better if he texts you or is it better if he calls you? What do you think is just more impossible?

[Joe Rogan]

I could have him call me.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. Why not do this? Have him call you. In a second, you'll go over there where there's no microphone, and I want you to ask this guy the same question I asked Jamie. Do you remember the name of the first girl you had a big crush on? And sometimes people don't remember. I just want you to know I've done this a lot.

[Joe Rogan]

Should I ask him that?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Not yet. I would do it on the phone.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. Screw It. Ask him that.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay. Do. Okay, hold on a second. I should have just did it with voice.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, no, because I know. Well, yeah. Nobody's listening to this. I'm sure.

[Joe Rogan]

No, but I mean, it's quicker.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Don't tell me what he says.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

If he says no, a lot of people don't remember this question.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So then I hedge and I go, well, who. Who's the first girl you ever kissed? Let's see. But make sure. There's absolutely no way I can see what's on your phone right now. Are we? Boom. Get that tight.

[Joe Rogan]

Fancy.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Just get mad.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Does he know? He doesn't know. He knows.

[Joe Rogan]

Yep. Right away.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Did he tell you?

[Joe Rogan]

Yep.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No.

[Joe Rogan]

Yep.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Ask him. Is it the same as the first girl he ever kissed?

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

See what he says.

[Joe Rogan]

Here we go. No.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Does he remember her name, too?

[Joe Rogan]

Okay, there we go. Yep.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's two weeks ago, right? No, I'm kidding. Put away. You have two names in your head.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Can we establish the fact that you have 50 people that have been on your show?

[Joe Rogan]

Yes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That you took anybody.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

If this person would have texted back. Text somebody else. I don't care who it is.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

There is no conceivable way. This isn't a bank. That gave you a number.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And if he didn't know who it is, we would have done something different. I don't care. Put the phone away.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

How am I gonna do this?

[Joe Rogan]

How are you gonna do this?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

How am I gonna do this? Right. And he said, what happens when it goes wrong? Nothing. I'm not getting paid to be here. I don't care.

[Joe Rogan]

You're freaking me out.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Think of both names. They're different. He had two different people.

[Joe Rogan]

Yes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

The same way that you did 2020 and you didn't know. Think of both names. And I want you to juggle back and forth between the two. The first kiss and the first crush.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And is one name more interesting to you or like, they're equal or is one name more interesting or not really.

[Joe Rogan]

Not really.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Okay. So, you know, like, if you gravitate, I would have been like, go to one. Okay. Count the number of letters in the first crush to yourself. Don't use your fingers. I can see. Count the number of letters to yourself for the first crush.

[Joe Rogan]

I do that. Psych you out.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

I started doing this.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And then count the number of letters in the first kiss. Oh, you looked up interesting. They're not equal. Can you agree with me? They're not the same amount of letters, are they?

[Joe Rogan]

No. They're not.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No. See, because you would have had the same reaction. Do you know when you put somebody in a polygraph test? Have you ever been polygraphed?

[Joe Rogan]

No.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

They can't just ask you the questions right away. They can't because they first have to get your benchmark. Same way. Blood doping. You gotta test someone's blood against their blood. People have different amounts of testosterone naturally. So I had to see how you would do each one. And then you did the thing with the eyes that throw me off the first crush. Is that name shorter than the first kiss? Yes. Yeah. Go to the first crush. I'm gonna go with that one less work for me.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

One more time. Count the letters.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And you were trying to avoid it. Six letters. Is that name six letters?

[Joe Rogan]

Yes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. Mix up all the letters.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

In that first crush's name. Forget the first kiss. Scrap it.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And pick any one in your head. You got one.

[Joe Rogan]

Got it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Jamie gave me a gift on a platter. Thought of a vowel. When he did that, it was a hundred percent. You wouldn't pick a vowel later. You didn't do a vowel in the name, did you?

[Joe Rogan]

No.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Dude. I'm here for a reason. Right? I haven't done this. I've been doing this for a long time.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Told you. Goal is to be the best in the world at this. I have watched. I know everything you just did. Second letter. Do you think the second letter.

[Joe Rogan]

I will.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Mmm. M. Amanda. Is the name Amanda?

[Joe Rogan]

Yes. What the fuck did you say?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And you will talk about this for years.

[Joe Rogan]

Hold on. I'm texting him back. Can you figure out the second one?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, I'm done, man. Come on, showbiz. You do your closer, you drop the mic and you pick the mic back up. Never.

[Joe Rogan]

Do you wanna know who it was?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, I don't wanna know.

[Joe Rogan]

My friend said you're a witch and he said kill him now.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Definitely a comedian. Definitely a comedian after that. It's definitely a comedian.

[Joe Rogan]

It might not be. I hang out with a lot of weird people.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. I don't know how to go back to conversation mode. Am I right? I got pissed like a racer. What do I do?

[Joe Rogan]

Go pee.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Do I pee or no. Do I. Do we keep going? Do we go strong with this? No, I'm just saying we'll. We'll. We'll recalibrate.

[Joe Rogan]

It's always easier to pee.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Is that all right?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, it's perfect because you don't to want to. It's too hard to form sentences when you have to pee.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

All right, I'm take a quick break.

[Joe Rogan]

We'll be right back.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Rapid fire. Are we back?

[Joe Rogan]

We're back.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Lightning. I feel like.

[Joe Rogan]

Much better.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Brand new. Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

I know the feeling.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I was sitting on it.

[Joe Rogan]

You rehydrate.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And I drank so much Gatorade right before, and I was like, oh, party foul. Should have thought that one through seven miles.

[Joe Rogan]

You deserve a little Gatorade. So do you want to know who it was yet?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's up to you. I like hanging a hanging thread, but it's up to you.

[Joe Rogan]

But what is the purpose of hanging the thread? Red?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, I just tell us at the end.

[Joe Rogan]

Can you tell me who it is?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I could, but. Come on. No, I'll tell you at the end.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You already gave the comedian. You said this. No, it's a comedian. He's a witch. Kill him. 100. 100. That's not Ben Shapiro. You know what I'm saying?

[C]

As you say. Which did you.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Did he tell you?

[Joe Rogan]

No, no, no.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I took the quickest pee of my life. I raced over there.

[Joe Rogan]

I didn't tell him.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You didn't tell him?

[Joe Rogan]

No, I don't want him to know.

[C]

Curate. Do you think that there's people that knew this back in the days of witches? They figured out some of the powers, maybe not power.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I think that 100% psychics of the past used a lot of the same techniques I'm using. Because when I watch psychics and I have people always tell me at certain things, they tell me like, oh, you know, I saw psychic do this and this and this. And I hear it and I go to myself, you know, I could do that same trick and I could, no offense, do it better. But think about it. I'm doing this right now from with an ethical compass versus if I go, oh, oh, I'm getting this. And I thought about this, and this is what happened with your dad. You're like, oh, my God. You know, I'm like, well, it's only 25 grand more to have a private session. Let's talk to him a little bit more, right?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I'm not saying there's nobody psychic. I'm telling you that a lot of the psychics that I'm watching them, like, I know how you're doing that.

[C]

That was my other question. It's gonna be as any. Have you caught anyone trying to get some stuff by you? Like, I don't know, like a psychic? Not a psychic. You're buying a car and someone's trying to pull Some trickling, like, I know what you're about to do here.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

100, you know, not a shameless plug. But, like, I literally write. I just wrote a book. It's coming out October, where it's all about. It's called Read. And it's not me telling you how to be a mentalist, because 99.9% of people don't want to guess a first crush. It's not useful to you in your life. But what if you could read people more effectively to help you in your life, at home, at work, in relationships. That is a quantifiable thing, that. The tools of a mentalist, when not used for entertainment, but in life, day to day, are extraordinary.

[Joe Rogan]

For sure.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. I mean, you must be great at all kinds of things because of this. I don't know, anything dealing with human beings.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right. Negotiating. Oh, I would imagine I've never sold a property at a loss. Let's just say that it's been pretty good so far. You get in there, you're like, I won't take a dollar less. I'm like, I know you will. I know you will.

[Joe Rogan]

That's funny. That's funny. What a weird skill to have, right?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

What's a good book, A good book.

[Joe Rogan]

To read on this?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, on becoming a mentalist or so.

[Joe Rogan]

In any of these skills. Like, what did you start with? Do you remember the book you started with? With?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Do you mean if you want to learn how to. Do you remember the book that you.

[Joe Rogan]

Started with when you first started learning this stuff?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So the first book I started reading was a book called thirteen Steps to Mentalism. But, man, is it going to be tough for most people because it was written in the 1920s. So it's kind of like, you know, when. It's like watching an old movie. No offense to old movies, but I'm like, oh, it's hard to get into this with my attention span now because it's antiquated. Some of it still applies, but you have to really do a big reach to know how do I apply this? Because back then there were no TVs or no phones. There's no. It's just. That's what I started with, but I had to learn the hard way. So much of what I do now is, again, I told you, I don't really do what other people do because I don't explain. It's. They create different. Right. If you are building a house and you have all these tools you're gonna build using your tools, does that make sense? So I've got this set of tools. I knew a hammer does this. I do this. That I create with the house already built. So my vision again and why. What's been a differentiating feature is I build with the person at the end in mind. And I already know what the house is going to be. I know what the memory. I know what you're going to say. Like cnbc, do you ever watch that channel?

[Joe Rogan]

I try not to.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So cnbc, Fox Business are financial channels. I have been on those channels dozens of times. How many other mentalists or magicians have ever been on them? Zero. Why is that? Because it's, it's unusual. That's a serious network. Why do you put me on? Because I do stuff around the markets. And so if you're watching it, you buy in. Because my stuff's about stock market, interest rates, all stuff. And it's like, this is crazy, but it had to do with stuff I know. So the same thing when I do espn, I'm creating from a different perspective than most. I customize the content. Like when I do a corporate event, I learn in and out your business and when I go up there, I sneak in the medicine. So now you're actually. Your people aren't just seeing a show, they're getting messaging and they're getting it in a way where they don't tune out because they don't realize they're being spoken to. It's mostly entertainment. But boom, I planted those thoughts. And you leave there with, you know, what's the product launch? What's this? All those things are now internalized and remembered.

[Joe Rogan]

Whoa. And this 13 steps that was said, it was written in the 1920s.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, fact check me, but I think it was the twenties.

[Joe Rogan]

What did this guy do? What was his job? He was a mentalist.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, but there were no mentalists back then. There were just a few people. But they was mostly. They were telling you the skills of psychics. They were showing you how psychics did stuff. And it wasn't really debunking. But they're showing you all the tools, the 13 steps. Like, what are the ways that we can read people more effectively and what are the tricks of the trade of what we do? Right? Like how do you know when someone's counting something like that, Right. And you're counting the letters, you know, because. Because to me, you might as well be playing drums. Do you understand what I'm saying? Like, if you're playing drums and I have an ear for it, I can hear the beats. So once you learn how to do certain things, they build on top. I can. If you're counting letters, like, again, names are anywhere from three to 12 letters. It's not rocket science for me to figure it out. And again, I can't do it in a vacuum. If you turned your back and said, I'm not. Nope, I'm not doing anything. Again. If you control the environment, I can't do it as well.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It goes back to that fear thing. If I started messing up right now, you'd be like, oh, it's getting awkward, and you would pull back and I wouldn't be in control anymore.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So, like a lot of what I'm doing is. Is I'm, you know, showing you how I can read you. But also you're allowing yourself to be read.

[Joe Rogan]

Right. So, like when you're saying, count the letters. You can see me counting them.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I can see when you're counting. I can see when you try to throw me off the count. It's like a poker player. Poker player knows if you really have aces, pocket aces or you have two, four, and you're bluffing. The best ones do. Which. Which brings the question up. Why don't I play poker more?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, why don't you play poker?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's just. It's too boring. Like, I. That's a grind, man. I'd rather make money doing this one.

[Joe Rogan]

And a half speed. Yeah, your whole life is one and a half speed. That's wild. That's really interesting. I'm fascinated now. I think I'm gonna read one of those books. I'm gonna probably get that one.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I'm gonna send you one. I'll try and find a better one.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, that one's interesting too, because I want to. I want to read the origins. I want to read it like when it first started out. Like, what was it like in 1920? Like, what did he learn and where Learn it is it. You find it?

[C]

Yeah, 50ish or so.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, 19.

[C]

Well, but it's also not known.

[Joe Rogan]

This is the guy. Yeah. So he's born in the 1930s.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, I screw this up. It wasn't 1920, so. No. The other one's 13 steps. There's another one by Theodore.

[Joe Rogan]

He did not make his birthplace public. Oh, you sneaky. He's a sneaky. He's a first mentalist and he's sneaky. Though is believed to have been Mill Hill suburb of London, for unknown reasons, he renamed himself Tony Cornish. So he's born Thomas William Simpson and he renamed himself, for some reason, Tony Corinda. A variation, the surname Conrad. When he began working as A mentalist in 1950, he opened up a shop where he sold all manner of stage magic goods but catered especially to mentalists. Later took over the magic shop on Oxford Street. The shop was at street level and thus catered mainly to the regular public, so that many of the items sold were either practical jokes or beginner's tricks. But items for semi professional magicians and hobbyists were also sold around the same period. Corinda had the magic concession in Hambly's Toy shop on Regent Street. Interesting. So the book 13 Steps to Mentalism was in 1961. So he wrote a series of 13 booklets on mentalism between 56 and 58, each one dealing with a different aspect of mentalism or allied art. Art. Interesting.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I'm getting you a copy.

[Joe Rogan]

I am. I'll buy it. Let's. Is it. Is it reprinted or is it one of those.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Definitely reprinted and see, it's. It's since become to be the Essential Mentalism reference book. But again, you're gonna have a big problem because you're gonna read that book and if you make it through to the end, which, God bless you if you can, you're like, yeah, but how the hell did you do all this stuff? It's not gonna. You're gonna get to the end of it and been like. So it's. That's baby steps. And then you've gotta like, sure, yeah. Get to the next level.

[Joe Rogan]

I'm sure. I'm not thinking I'm gonna get all the information. Information from that. But I'm curious as to like, what the origins of it was. Like, how did this guy devise these things? Like, how did he figure it out?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Psychics. So it's. Again, people with psychics want to believe anyone who's in that room who paid that money to hear psychic has someone they've lost and they want something with them because there's, you know.

[Joe Rogan]

Do you believe in any psychic powers at all?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So again, I'm not like a debunker because I. I'm kind of like agnostic in this thing, which is. I just believe what I've seen so far. And in a lot of instances, I've never personally experienced something that I couldn't explain yet. But a lot of people have told me their experiences.

[Joe Rogan]

Have you heard of the telepathy tapes?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, so that. I know you had her in here, but that's. Have you watched the videos? I mean, come on.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, that's wild.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, no, I'M the opposite. I do not think that's real. Oh, yeah? Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, really?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No.

[Joe Rogan]

Why? Well, tell me about what? The videos. Can we show the videos?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, I don't know if he's got the paywall again, I don't want it controversial. But they're whole holding. In many instances. In that form of communication, the person who knows the information is holding the letters. Do you understand what I'm saying? So right now, if I had shown you a word and you're either touching somebody, you could get. Do you know what a two person code act is?

[Joe Rogan]

No.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So two person code act is like a mentalist thing with two people. There's a few that are the best in the world. Avison's Mind to Mind in Dubai. Like a few really good ones who've done this. And what they do is they can be blindfolded in a different area and anything you hand to them, anything you say, the other person knows it. No electronics, no nothing. They just look at your credit card and they'll guess the credit card numbers. And the way that's being done is they're communicating to each other based on pauses, based on like a million ways that you can't think of. It's the best codec ever without speaking. And you'll watch it and you'll be like, there's no way they're communicating. But they are. And so it looks like telepathy, but it's not. You get them in the room with scientists, you'll fool every scientist under the son. What they're doing is like not bulletproof at all with the kids. And again, God bless, if I had a child in that condition, I for not one moment wouldn't want a solution. And I would want something to know that they're not. That they're in there. And I could talk to them. And I don't want to speak out of turn, but from the videos I've seen, I can explain that in a minute. They are moving things around and positioning the letters. If you do a double blind study where the person does not know the word that they're trying to communicate, I'm even saying psychic. Just don't tell them the word, the person holding it it. And only show the word to the person who should be saying it. Right?

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

If you're the autistic child, show them the words. There, I see it. And then have them type that word in and do that for me nine out of 10 times and they've not been able to do that. That's not even Psychic, that's just show to me that you can type the word in that you saw. And so when you do, like, a deep dive on that, it's been.

[Joe Rogan]

She offered to have someone come in with their parent and do that. Would you do that with us?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Sure.

[Joe Rogan]

So you could, like.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I don't want to take anyone's. I don't want anyone's hope away. I'm a parent. And like, again, I don't think they're making money on it. And I like. No, I'm very. I don't like to. Again, when you ask me psychics, there's people had real deep experiences and who is it for me to take that away? But when I watch that and you're like, talking to somebody who's a pro at doing this, same as psychics, I can see exactly how that's done.

[Joe Rogan]

But what did you think about their ability to read languages that they've never studied?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So, again, you're missing it. So that's again, the devil's in the details. It's the memory, what you remember of the story. Show me how they did that. Did either of the people there present know that language? Who was doing it, and how was that being communicated? Did the end person who's moving the board around know what the meaning of the word was? Do you understand what I mean?

[Joe Rogan]

Yes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So, like, again, you're hearing the Cliffs Notes, the end edition. Watch the video and show me something that I can't. There was nothing I saw in that special initial or that. In that telepathy tape in the videos that I couldn't readily explain.

[Joe Rogan]

Really?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That's correct.

[Joe Rogan]

Interesting. Very interesting.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So could it be right? Yes. I'm not saying it's not. I'm not. Again, they could be 100. Right. And I could be 100% wrong. Hubris.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I haven't been in the room with them. I'm judging simply from videos I've seen. But as someone who is, for a living, pretending to read people's minds, but I'm actually reading people's minds. I can see how it's being done. The method. It's kind of like a casino boss. I see how that person's cheating when they're playing cards because I know all the cheating methods.

[Joe Rogan]

Interesting. The other thing that they said was these kids all have this area that they go to called the hill.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yep.

[Joe Rogan]

They go to their. What do you think of that?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So again, I heard it. It was unbelievable. Like, the podcast was incredible. I don't know. I don't like, you know, I've heard psychics tell me. People tell me, I saw psychic. And how do you know that? My friend died after we saw a Grateful Dead concert and did. I'm like, well, I'm seeing lot of stuff on you that looks Grateful Dead vibes. Like, if I told you that you're a big Roger Waters fan, you'd be like, how did you know that right now? So for everyone not looking, Joe's wearing a Pink Floyd shirt. Like, you can figure out a lot of stuff based on cold reading. I can see what's the wear on your wedding band? How do you behave? What are certain things? When do you pause at a certain moment about certain things? Did you lose someone? I can tell instantly if you're having a feeling of emotion. Like anyone good at this, and not even great, but, like, good, good. Can notice a lot of things. Like a psychic just watches you, so.

[Joe Rogan]

You can kind of tell, like, what a person's done that day.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, I think you can get, like. You can guide them to what you want, which is when you get a hit. Right. Think of that game when you're a kid. Hot, cold. You hide stuff.

[Joe Rogan]

Right?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right. Your brother, sister looks around, they go, cold, cold.

[Joe Rogan]

Do you think I woke up early today? Or late?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I don't know. There's no on demand feature to the show. I think you woke up early, though.

[Joe Rogan]

Really?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Why do you think that?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I don't know. Just based on what you've seen, said it.

[Joe Rogan]

Nope.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Nope.

[Joe Rogan]

Up late.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Good. I got it wrong.

[Joe Rogan]

I'm happy.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I'm happy. You'll be like, we screwed this guy. Finally we got O's, and it was with a 50. 50.

[Joe Rogan]

I was. Yeah, that was just a rando coin flip. Yeah, that was.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You know, we'll do a coin flip before I leave.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay. Who has coins anymore?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I brought one coin.

[Joe Rogan]

I heard that there's a penny that's in circulation that's worth millions of dollars.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I heard that too.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. That wheat penny, the one with the wheat on the side of my buddy Lewis.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

How is Had I saw that on my social. He found. Found one.

[Joe Rogan]

Really?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I think so.

[Joe Rogan]

Whoa. It's super millions.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I'd be like, give me that wheat penny.

[Joe Rogan]

That's crazy. A penny worth millions. Okay, so what's in the. The one that's sealed? That package?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, that's. That's nothing. I was gonna. I was gonna get it out, but I'll do it later as a gift. No, it's something silly.

[Joe Rogan]

Why do I not believe you?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I swear. I swear. I thought I would have it out.

[Joe Rogan]

But now you thought you'd have it out, but you don't want to have it out.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Not the right fit.

[Joe Rogan]

What do you mean?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, I was gonna do something. You had a lot of books here and I thought we'd get a book. But like, eh. I don't think I'm do. It just doesn't feel right. No.

[Joe Rogan]

What feels wrong?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Self curated. I don't know. It's not gonna work. You gotta go on instinct. It's not gonna work.

[Joe Rogan]

It's not gonna work.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Nope.

[Joe Rogan]

What was the goal? To get it to work. You could say it now since we're not gonna do it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

The goal to get it to work was. I thought I had some sort. I thought. I know. If I get you to get a book.

[Joe Rogan]

Book.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

We have less books in this room. We have books in that room. I just. I don't know. I brought it in. I always have a backup plan. Plan A, B, C. And this one's not meant for this one. This one might be if I ever come back and do another.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Jre.

[Joe Rogan]

We'll put it in the safe.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Okay.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Do it.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That's a great idea.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, we'll put it in the safe.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Put in the safe. I'll never touch it again.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay. Won't touch it either. Let's make sure that we know it's sealed.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You know, two bricks of cocaine. You're in big trouble.

[Joe Rogan]

No, we should get a wax seal. Yeah, you know, like Game of Thrones style.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Let's do it.

[Joe Rogan]

Seal it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I love that show.

[Joe Rogan]

Great show.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[C]

We can't play this, but I found one of the tapes that someone put on YouTube. Do you want to. It's only a. One minute.

[Joe Rogan]

All right, let's watch it for us. Let's watch it for us. We can't play it because it's copyright. Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

If you right now got the best two person codec in the world in here, they would do nothing. She would literally be in another. She could be 100ft away behind this person's back.

[Joe Rogan]

Because she's touching, doing, touching, moving.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I mean like those are for letters. You only have 26 options. Do you have any idea what this is right there? Somebody effective right now? Just this, right now. And pausing before they say a word. Could have given you a full credit card number, right? Insane.

[Joe Rogan]

She was kind of moving him a little bit.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Moving him. Like if you could. If you can. How do you compress data? Right? Like if you do hexadecimal or ascii, you could take a 16 digit number and break it down into three letters. So you see the movie the Martian?

[Joe Rogan]

Yes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Great movie. Right? Another Matt Damon reference.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Love Matt Damon, by the way.

[Joe Rogan]

Me too.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Has he been on here?

[Joe Rogan]

No.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Such a good dude.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, I talked to somebody about getting him on. Like he was gonna reach out. We're gonna do it eventually, I'm sure.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I love that guy. Yeah. Met him a couple times. Love him. As nice as you'd expect. So if you can. In that movie. In the Martian, he didn't know how to send data because he only had the camera. So he shows a thing where he figured out how to take and compress big things into small. What's the easiest way you can make it very small so you can send information in a certain way. Again, I don't want to blow anyone's copy, but there is absolutely. When I see that, I know exactly how it's being done. But I don't know if she's doing it on purpose. I think they've just learned each other's rhythms and that's an H and. Oh, okay. You know, like you gotta have her in a different room.

[Joe Rogan]

Right, right, right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Read my mind. Read my mind through a door.

[Joe Rogan]

Haven't they done stuff in a different room though? Didn't Kai Dickens. Didn't.

[C]

She said in particular that another magician actually told me that they had an issue watching that particular kid's videos. They thought that those two were doing something funny.

[Joe Rogan]

Yep, Clearly.

[C]

But that's right. The other videos. I don't.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That's.

[C]

They're behind a paywall. You have to get to them.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That's it. That's. The sneaky biz. Is everyone that sees the paywall. I had a couple sent to me and I'm like. Because people asked me this and they were like, what do you think, man? And I listened to all the tapes. I thought it was amazing. It got a little wild at the end. If you got to the end like the hill and that. And you want to believe. Who doesn't want to believe that there's psychics amongst us. And especially kind of like the superhero story of all these are kids who nobody thought was in there and they're really in there and they're communicating with each other. It's.

[Joe Rogan]

I mean, so it's essentially you're saying that instead of psychic energy there's a sense of like a kind of micro communication.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You know what?

[Joe Rogan]

And people want to believe. And so you kind of have confirmation bias looking at the evidence. You want to believe. Kai Dickens clearly wanted to believe.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Just super simple. Have a mental. And maybe a scientist involved. And a mentalist is better than a scientist. Because scientists, they can watch me and they'll be like, I don't know how he's doing it. Right. We're designed. We're literally. It's like, get a card sheet to beat other card sheets.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So get me involved.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And then let's do the same thing. And I'm gonna say, here are the three things I need you to do different. And I'm not gonna say how you're doing it, but do it with these three things. And if you do that, I'm convinced.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay. We might have to set this up.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

I wonder if they both.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

But the problem is, is that. Exactly. There's very little to gain from that. And then also, we got bad energy in the room. Right. That's the whole thing. Do you ever see when Uri Geller was debunked by the Amazing Randy on Johnny Carson, and he couldn't bend the spoons? And he goes, I can't do it with him here. He's got bad energy. It's not. And it's like, you know, is it bad energy or is this a guy who knows how you're bending the spoons?

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And so every time you're about to do a move, he's like a sob. Was like, stop right there. Don't move your hand. Keep the spoon right there. Don't, don't. No, no. Don't look away. Look, it's like. It's like my nightmare.

[Joe Rogan]

I had a guy show me how they do the spoons.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

We had a guy demonstrate magic, and he goes, I could show you how to do this one.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

And it was like a different kind of spoon. It wasn't a regular spoon.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, no, you could do with real spoons. I could do any spoon.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

You could bend it with your mind.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I mean, again, I don't want to knock it, but that's more of a. It's not really. It's not a psychic power that falls more into the category of a magic trick where you're misdirecting people. You're doing something else where I'm not really bending a spoon with my mind. There's not supernatural powers involved. They can't lie to you and say that I'm doing it in such a way where you don't know the method. And it's layered, but it's sure going to look like it's bending by itself. But it's Not.

[Joe Rogan]

This guy was saying, that's a kind of metal, that as he moves his hand around, he heats it up.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. He's lying to you.

[Joe Rogan]

He lied because he didn't want to tell me how he does it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, damn it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Got me again.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Got you.

[Joe Rogan]

You must enjoy getting people, though. People. Lights in your face when you're accurate. Is really fun to watch.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I hope it's. It's contagious, but I enjoy watching reactions. Yeah, clearly that's the rush, right?

[Joe Rogan]

Laughs.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Do not love laughs.

[Joe Rogan]

Of course. Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You ever go into a room and nobody's laughing and you just bomb and you just eat it.

[Joe Rogan]

It's like, not fun.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

How often do you bomb anymore?

[Joe Rogan]

New jokes bomb. So you'll bomb for chunks. You bomb in segments. You know, you have to figure out how a bit works. And sometimes you try a bit in a way. Like in the middle of it, you're like, ooh, this is not the way. And then you have to kind of adjust.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And you're doing a lot of sets at the mothership, I assume. And how much do you get allowances? What's the clock for? Being Joe Rogan before it's like, oh, no, let's just see if you're funny as a person. Where does that end?

[Joe Rogan]

You gotta be funny pretty quick.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You think so?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, People are good for like a minute.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

They're happy to see you for like a minute.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's only a minute, huh?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. Not much time, man. Jerry Seinfeld talked about that once. He's like, being famous buys you about 30, 30 seconds.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, I thought it's more.

[Joe Rogan]

That's what he said. No, no. Especially on a night filled with like, really top notch comedians. Which killers is the mothership? Every night it's all a bunch of killers. So you gotta be. But that's also why we do it that way. You know, the one thing that's really bad for comedians is when they start only doing their crowds. So, like they do it on the road and they do large places and then they have the same opening act over and over again. So they're never challenged. Yeah, that. That makes people soft 90 of the time. Yeah, I made that number up.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I don't know what the number is.

[Joe Rogan]

But it's like a high number, you know, because you get soft.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right? Yeah, I did. This is funny. So I used to go to the Comedy Cellar. I told you I love comedy. Like aficionado. I lived in the Village for, I don't know, years. And this is pre kids. A lot More time. We used to go to the Cellar when you could get in the Cellar like that. Now, good luck, right? And we would see just everybody over and over, and I think you had him on Mike Vecchione.

[Joe Rogan]

Sure.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So good man. Very funny guy.

[Joe Rogan]

Great guy.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So great guy. Amazing, super funny. And he went on. On a night where it was just like, dropping, dropping, dropping. And he had to follow Seinfeld, and Seinfeld goes on and just hammers it. And then Mike Vecchione comes on. And you know the bathroom in the Cellar, right? Which is about the size of literally, like a quarter of this table where you're touching arms when you're taking a leak next to some dude. I went in there, and I was quite drunk. And I'll never forget this. I've worked with Mike since. And I was telling him, dude, you probably don't remember me, but I was such a drunk idiot. And we were touching arms while we're peeing, and I always felt bad about them. So drunk, I'm like, dude, forget Seinfeld. You killed it. You're. He's like, stop talking to me while we're peeing.

[Joe Rogan]

This.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I had crossed that threshold. And I tried asking him, like. Cause we did a gig together, and he opened for me, and I was like, do you. Is there any chance you remember? He's like, dude, so many drunk idiots have been next to me at the Cellar telling me stuff. I'm like, the night where you Dr. Drop, you know, that. That. Trying to see if you remember it right. And I wanted to apologize for it because I felt so bad. And I'm like, I was talking to you while you're pissing, and, dude, I just loved you so much. And he had forgotten. He didn't even know this moment, you know? But I'm like, I've been holding this weight for a while, Mike, and I'm a big fan. And I'm sorry I talked to you while we both had our dicks out. It was not okay. It was not okay.

[Joe Rogan]

There's.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

There's a line in the sand that I have just crossed, brother.

[Joe Rogan]

That's hilarious. And he forgot about it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

He didn't know, dude. I mean, it's like when I have gigs where people come back to me, and three years later, like, dude, do you remember this thing? And I go, of course I do. Yes.

[Joe Rogan]

No, most of. The. Most of the time, you don't remember.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You try. I remember the best and the worst, man. I remember, like, I remember some moments where I've bombed so bad that it is seared in your DNA. You know that feeling?

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And it's usually ones where you're not to blame. Same. But the buck stops here. You know what I'm saying? Like, the setup is terrible. The outdoor gig, the. I had one where, God, it was like the town of Charlotte or some, some town hired me, some city. And I had to insert all these data points about the city. And we're like, normally we do two or three things. I will mention two or three things in the course of a show. And if it's 10 minutes, forget it. It's. I don't want to be a salesperson up there. People tune out if they're like, what, are you selling me something right now?

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And I had to say eight or nine things about the town of, was it Charlotte? And they. At the last moment, we do dress rehearsals. Go. By the way, we're all dressing as genies and we're gonna have a life size genie lamp on stage. And it's gonna start doing smoke while you're doing this. I'm like, I don't really like any of these things. But I was newer to show because I'm like, I go with it. The whole time I'm on stage, the smoke is going like at 100%. We're coughing, it's going terrible. I can't see the person whose mind I'm reading. I'm sweating. I'm trying to talk about the Billy Graham Museum. Am. I'm dying a slow death up there. I get two things in a row wrong. And you know, if you bomb your opener and your closer like, you're dead. I left apologizing. You never want to leave a stage apart. They somehow still loved it. I don't even know how, but I, I sweated through that suit. It was like, I, I. You know when you question what you're doing in life.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That was like a qu. I'm like, maybe I'm not supposed to be doing this.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, also, you probably say, oh, okay. Never doing that kind of setup again.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Kind of. But me, I more catastrophize. And I'm like, yeah, I should just be done. But then I came back. I came back, I picked myself up. Yeah. Funny enough, tomorrow's one of my daughter's fifth birthday and I'm doing a show at school for five year olds.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, wow.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, man, I gotta get back. But sweetheart, this is like the sweet spot where they still think I'm cool.

[Joe Rogan]

That's cool.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Before I'm gonna be like, don't do this and embarrass us, dad. And last year, for my oldest son, who was at the time had just turned eight, I did his school, second graders, and, dude, they ate me alive.

[Joe Rogan]

Really.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Because I. I'm not doing this. Like, this is. You know, my sweet spot is mentalism, right? I had to brush off the dust of my kids show, which I haven't touched in, like, 25 years. Thank God I'm not doing kids shows anymore. No offense to kids show magicians, but, like, that. That ship has sailed. And, man, second graders are ruthless. Really ruthless.

[Joe Rogan]

Why second graders?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Because I don't know, man. Like. Like one kid, I. I finished this show, okay? And during the show, my wife is in the room recording. I'm like, don't record. Don't record. And I had. I had to, like, look at my wife at one point, and I whispered, this is a nightmare. Because one kid's like, it's in your hand. Show me that. Show me that. And I'm like, dude, shut up. And I'm not good at it. I'm not. I haven't done it in a while, right? So I'm just bombing on tricks. And thankfully, 95% of the crowd actually liked it. It was just these two kids who. Who just got me. When I went home, one of my neighbors saw me, and he goes to me, he goes, oh, my God. What's wrong? Are you okay? Because my face was, like, ash and white. He thought somebody died. And I'm like, dude, I don't. I don't. You know, I don't even know what to say right now. Like, I. Maybe I shouldn't be doing this. I had to at one point tell the teacher. I'm like, I'm actually like, I'm. I actually do this for a living. I feel like I had to try to flex. I'm like, I have an Emmy. Like, I. I wanted to let them know I'm not actually this bad. Like, I.

[Joe Rogan]

That's hilarious. Yeah, that's hilarious. Don't you think comedy is kind of a bit of hypn. Hypnotizing people?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, yeah. The best comedians, you. The pacing, the rhythm. Like, I was watching a Tom Segura special this morning. I don't know how well you know his material. I mean, you know him well, but, like, he had a bit about flying first class. Do you remember that one?

[Joe Rogan]

I don't.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, he talks about. I don't think he's using this material anymore. The fact that he gets upgraded. He buys coach tickets early. It was years ago. And he gets upgraded so much that he gets first class tickets. And he go, should I not say this bit? I don't know if I want to say. And he goes, it. Literally the moment I get upgraded, this feeling of superiority washes over me where I'm like, don't. When people are walking, don't look at me, you poor piece of shit. Like, he's just so. He goes, I dare you if you're in coach to try to use my bathroom. If I'm in the front, I will put my hand on your chest, bro. It's. I've seen that 100 times. And it's just as funny, if not funnier every time I watch it. And it's like the timing, the rhythm, I. I learned more from comedy than ever. Magic or mentalism.

[Joe Rogan]

Way more interesting because we've talked about it a bunch comics. I'm like, I think we're hypnotizing people. Because I feel hypnotized when someone's killing. When someone's killing, I'm allowing them to think for me.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yep.

[Joe Rogan]

You're like, they're taking me on a ride and I'm just. I'm not thinking at all about what would I say, what would I do? I'm just in there head or they're in my head.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right. And also when you bring someone along and when you have that, like, just. You drop just amazing line. Like just. There's so many. I mean, listen, I consume so much comedy, but like, I love watching the rhythm, seeing where people go with it. The people that are more short form, like punch delivery. Right. Versus like a long form, like a Nate Bargazi. Like watching Andrew do his things. Sh's amazing, man. Some of these guys are just, just like. You can't see where the joke is gonna come and how you just squeeze every bit of juice out of the orange. And the good callbacks.

[Joe Rogan]

I think the ultimate hypnotist is David Tell.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. Oh, yeah, David Dave.

[Joe Rogan]

Cause David, there's a rhythm. There's a rhythm. The way he does, it's like you just get lost in his thinking, right? And he just takes you on the. And he's so effortless and he does so many sets, like, he's so polished that there's like this effortlessness to his movements and the rhythm and everything. It's like, it's wild.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Paul. Like Sebastian Maniscalco. I just freaking love watching Sebastian. There's so many. There's so many people that came up now that I've seen like over and over and over and watch them go up like Sam Morill. I've been a fan of Sebastian was.

[Joe Rogan]

Actually the first guy to recommend you to me.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I love Sebastian. Shout out to I love you, Sebastian.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Was there anyone else after that?

[Joe Rogan]

A couple people told me you were awesome.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Nice.

[Joe Rogan]

Quite a few now.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Sebastian's such a stand up guy.

[Joe Rogan]

This friend of mine, when I told.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Him that Shane Gills. It's Shane Gillis, isn't it? It is, yeah. You just thought of it. You shouldn't let down your guard. I just knew it.

[Joe Rogan]

How'd you know?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I just. That was it. That was the moment.

[Joe Rogan]

What did you see?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I can't tell you that. Right when you said this friend of mine, you, I knew you're going to protect your parks. And I said, could have been Ari, could have been Mark. And I immediately knew it was going to be Shane Gills because neither of those two would have said, definitely not. Mark would have said, kill him. He's a witch. He's. I just knew it.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, that's Shane. That's such a sense of humor too. He's a witch. Kill him.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. That's so Shane. That's so Shane.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. That was a little bit of a giveaway because I said it was my friend.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yep. That is, that was the giveaway.

[Joe Rogan]

That was a giveaway because I didn't tell you it's someone.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You said 100. So now I'm thinking like, he must live in Austin. Like there was a lot of, a lot of indicators. Yeah, whatever.

[Joe Rogan]

But that's part of the thing.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right?

[Joe Rogan]

But that's also you admitting that this isn't like supernatural.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I'm not psychic. So everybody, when people put me on the spot and like, tell me this right now, I literally go, it's not Netflix. No on Demand feature. Like I, I again, that's where these skills, when people like, why don't you win the lottery? Why don't you like all these things that are silly where you don't get what I do, apparently.

[Joe Rogan]

Do you believe that there is any sort of psychic power that people have? Like when, when someone gets a phone call from someone, they're just thinking about intuition. Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I think there's, I think there's, I mean, listen, that's like a bigger picture question. Like, you know, where does your mind expand? Like psychedelics, like where, where, where. What is there beyond this plane that clearly, you know, people are aware of? There's, It'd be silly to think, but how do you kind of get on that frequency? There's no question that people have an intuition again. Could I call it psychic powers? I've had things happen that I can't explain to you based on the skills I have. Does that make sense? Well, I've guessed things from people where I didn't do the normal way I do it. Do you understand what I mean? Like, I normally have a. There's a series of steps on how I do it. Kind of like a chess player, right? You get a chess player, you get Magnus Carlson here, you get the best chess player in the world. They can literally blindfold play 30 people. And I'm like, how do you. How did you. How are you doing that?

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That's like magic to me. But you're keeping track of all that stuff in your mind and you're doing stuff that is indistinguishable from real magic, in my opinion. But you've hyper focused on one skill. That's what I've done. You just think it's a lot of skills. What I focused on is one thing is assessing what people are thinking and what they give away that they don't think they're giving away. That's all. I just guess secret information for a living. But to make it exciting, entertaining, I add bells and whistles and make it interesting. Otherwise it'd be boring.

[Joe Rogan]

How many mentalists are out there? Like, is there a community? Guys, you share notes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Sure. So there's like a. I wouldn't call it a brain trust, but there's people I bounce ideas off of when I'm creating. Kind of like you punch up jokes where they. There. Here's what's rare in our world. There's creators and then there's performers. Do you know what I'm saying? Like writers. And it's like singer songwriters. How many people have their songs written for them? Some of the biggest stars in the world. And how many are like Taylor Swift style where you write and this and you get a piece of you in it.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And there's something about when you write your own song. I'm not knocking people that don't write their own song, but there's something that you feel different.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Do you know what I mean?

[Joe Rogan]

Which explains the connection Taylor Swift has to her fans.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I believe so. Because you're getting a piece of you that somebody else can't. I'm sure that just a random pop.

[Joe Rogan]

Star that gets like some factory.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You'll still like it. Like, I freaking love a Backstreet Boy song. Don't get me wrong. I dare you. I want it that way, Joe. But like when you are with her, and I'm sure, like Jack Antonov, she has a huge, amazing crew of writers that I'm sure get things out of her. And I know a lot of, like, music producers, but you feel some connection. So what, again, I think is differentiating. There's a lot of mentalists, but it's a really small number that. That are the singer, songwriter, the creator, performer, who. Who have the thoughts and are constantly doing new stuff. Because we are a cover band, most mentalists are a cover band of other mentalists.

[Joe Rogan]

Got it?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

We don't need to do new stuff. You could literally do the same thing. This is pretty amazing. I could do this for the next 40 years and make a good living. God bless. And why do new stuff? Like when Louis CK was popping out. Three specials a year, everyone, like, what the. You know, why are you doing this to all the rest of us? You're so creative. You don't have to. And in our profession, you really don't have to because you don't have to bury material.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

If I'm not putting stuff online, if I'm not going, like, crowd work. The Matt Rife model, who, by the way, I love that guy. But like, it changed the game. Now if you want to blow up on social, you've got to be doing this. Or do current events, do topical, do things you can burn. But I can't put my real act out there.

[Joe Rogan]

Right, right, right. So. But you enjoy the creative aspect.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I love it. I find it boring if I keep doing the same. Stu, I'm. I'm bored.

[Joe Rogan]

Right, Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And I get, like, sad.

[Joe Rogan]

Right. But it's. It's interesting because, like, I wonder how many people you can bounce ideas off of. It seems like you're kind of a lone wolf, like, in that world. I don't think there's. I mean, there's a lot of comedians, like, I could call a lot of comedians right now.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

Bounce an idea off of.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

There's way less mentalists and there's way more magicians. And then of the group of mentalists, if you were to do the core one. And again, this is not subjective. I'm much more, like, objective. The way we looked at names, how many of them have done certain volume of TV appearance, certain volume of views, like, which ones are getting the attention of the world and the zeitgeist? It's a very, very small number because you got to innovate. Right. This is like an attention economy. You have to do stuff that's compelling to the viewer. And for Me, I don't think about myself. It's a trick in life. I think about who's watching.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, that's. What do you mean by it's a trick in life?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, like, it helps you in everything in life. Right. My secret sauce is that I hold the mirror up not to myself, but to you. Do you get it? Like when you're watching and you're watching a football thing.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

What's intriguing is the fact that you're a football viewer. If you're meeting somebody and you want to be memorable, learn more about them, start listening more. I'll tell you a story. I met Steven Spielberg. I did Steven Spielberg's dad's birthday and I got in that room. Have you met Steven Spielberg? No. And I'm like, you know, a crazy fan. Like, I can't explain to you how many movies he had as a kid that were life changing. I'm like, dude, Close Encounters, Third Kind.

[Joe Rogan]

Like, yeah, he's one of the greatest of all time ever. Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And so I'm in the room. I've done stuff for his family. This is not like a big blowout corporate event. It's like 80 people. Hope he doesn't mind me sharing this. And. And it was great time, amazing. And at the end of it, I'm like getting some facetime with speaking Spielberg, right? And I walk up to him and we spent almost 20 minutes talking to each other, which is like, I didn't expect that. I thought he'd be like, oh, great job, you know? Do you know how many questions I had? A million questions. Geo many questions. I asked him.

[Joe Rogan]

How many?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Zero.

[Joe Rogan]

Really?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Zero. And that's like, right there. I learned a lesson in life that applies to everything. That's why Steven Spielberg, he is naturally curious. This guy. Wealthy beyond belief, stories beyond belief. He could make it ego driven. And he could have been telling me, oh, this. And I would have been hanging on my every word. But instead he wanted to know more about me. And he kept asking me. I was like, just pause, dude. I have like a lot of questions. Like, come on. And so I learned. And I could have just left that and been like, I didn't get any questions in with Steven Spielberg, but instead I realized this is the person at the highest level of what he does. And he is naturally curious and he lets other people shine. And this is something to do in life, which is you don't know when you meet someone, somebody who they'll be or what they'll be or what can. I'm not doing it from A transactional sense. But why I've had so many TV appearances is when I go into a place, I'm gonna do stuff for the security guard. I'm gonna do something for the person who irons my shirt. I'm gonna leave that place like a bomb went off of amazement. Where everyone around there now likes you. And you don't know when they'll jump ship to another network, to another thing. And if they like you, sales 101, they're gonna want to keep doing business with you. And so those people become your champions elsewhere. And it was kind of a lesson where he could have talked about himself the whole time. He didn't.

[Joe Rogan]

Interesting.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So I shouldn't either. When you go to other places, let other people shine. And that's something I've carried with me. And I think that's a superpower in life that most people don't do. They think, what am I going to say next?

[Joe Rogan]

Right. That's kind of the key to running a good podcast too, because you really want to extract the most out of the person possible.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

Where you just want that. My questions are basically just try to get you expand. And I would just want to find out how you think. Think.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

And for Spielberg, a guy who deals in all these stories and narratives and all these characters and heroes, to meet a unique character like yourself is probably really fascinating to him too, because he's probably like, oh, I don't know anybody like this.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

You know, like, what are you doing? How are you doing? Like, and now, now he's got like a new tool in his toolbox.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Totally.

[Joe Rogan]

Because he's got you, right? Like this. You know, you have the spectrum of. Of possibilities in terms of like the humans that you meet. And then you meet one that's outside of that. You're like, oh, I hadn't even considered you before.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right. What do you.

[Joe Rogan]

Where. How's. Who the are you?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That was pretty much the question. And then he had like, he. But he was interesting because I don't know if you get this, but I get like x. Like the 20 questions is what I call it. Air quotes.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Which is how'd you get into this? Like the opening questions, which you can't blame someone if you got a weird. Your job.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

People want to know how about it. Right. Like, did something your family do it? Like, there's all these questions you're gonna get every time. God bless people. I don't hold it against them. Mine is always, I'm doing like a sound check for a gig and and there was like, all right, so we got this. We got this. I go, don't you know that we have that? Like, I'm like, okay, so just real quick, where's the green room? Like you don't know already. And I'm like, okay, this is. I just smile and I'm like, you know, I never heard that one before. But it's. It's. You get that?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

But in this situation, again, it's like, he. He didn't ask those questions. He was very uniquely, finding ants. Questions that weren't, like, the usual.

[Joe Rogan]

Of course. Because he's a study. I mean, he studies humans.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right?

[Joe Rogan]

I mean, to be a great filmmaker the way he is, to do Schindler's List, to do that.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

That's such a heavy movie, man. Have you seen that recently?

[Joe Rogan]

Private Ryan?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

He's got heavy, heavy movies. And then, you know, Close Encounters is one of my favorite movies of all time. I mean, the con. It's interesting. You know, one of the things I really liked about that movie is he, after he became a father, changed how he felt about the ending of his own movie. He wouldn't have the father leave everybody.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, wow.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. Because the end of the movie, Richard Dreyfuss, his character gets on the spaceship and leaves the aliens.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Wow.

[Joe Rogan]

He's like, I would never do that.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I didn't know that.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Do they film it or. Or. No.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, he. It was after the fact. Like, you know, he made the movie, I believe, when he was younger and he didn't have children. And then as time went on, you know, he looked back on it like, oh, God, I would never leave my kids to go on this ufo.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

Nor would I. Nor would you. No, no. Like. But in this idealistic version of who he thought the Richard Dreyfus character was and the circumstances, like, he had to leave. He had to go. You got to go.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

The aliens sure as hell get my phone out and try and get good footage for a change. I'm, like, right here. Good stuff. I like the tic tac and gimbal, but I want to see it close up in high def.

[Joe Rogan]

I know.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You got anything off air? You got something. Come on.

[Joe Rogan]

I. I have off air. What? I think. Are people bullshitting me.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, I. You don't have to be off air. I've watched these. I can read people. I can tell on.

[Joe Rogan]

On air where the snake oil is, but feel it. That's where it's instinctive. Like, I don't have the tools that you. You have, but there's a part of me that's like something smells.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I told Jamie when I walked in here, and I said, this is again, passing sniff test and pardon my French, but everyone takes crap, right? Everyone in the world. I don't care if you're the Pope, you take a crap. So if they're being held in a facility, someone's taking craps, right? And who's cleaning it? I don't think the scientists are. There's a janitor. There's someone in that room. So are you telling me that there's nobody in there that's got a 401? Okay. Health insurance, some sort of. How is someone not getting. Tell me, explain to me what NDA they're signing or what they're doing, that if they found this out, someone loose lip sync ship, somebody would have told somebody who works in that facility, who's not the scientist, who's not the military person. And word gets out. How is that buttoned up tight where nothing gets out ever? Well, for 50 years, you're telling me there's a basement somewhere in this country. Country eight stories down, where they got those things and no one else knows who's credible and can release it how? Occam's razor. What do you think?

[Joe Rogan]

I think the government can keep things secret for a long time. I think they did with the Manhattan Project. I think they've done it with other projects in the past. I think it's possible.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You think it's possible it's just siloed.

[Joe Rogan]

Nobody knows all the info because people do talk there. There's a lot of people talking and people share similar stories, and they have for decades. And I think there's something to it. I just don't know what it is. I think, you know, we had Jesse Michaels on yesterday, who has this amazing show on YouTube, probably the best YouTube show on aliens and UFOs and UAPs. And he's very agnostic in his thinking, and he's. He's very objective. And he also is very, very, very thorough as far as his understanding of the information. Information. And even he is baffled as much as he knows. But he knows more about siloed technology than pretty much anybody does in. In regard to this UAP phenomenon.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

And he points to this guy, Thompson Brown, who was working on gravity technology in the 1950s. They were. They had working models like they. They. He thinks that they have some sort of a gravity propulsion device. But then there's things like Roswell, where. The crash. Like, if all those stories are true, that's too early. It's 47. There's too early. There's no way they had working models of these, these devices back then. So he thinks it's possible. You know, he's not a. I know this is true. He thinks it's possible that it is both United States government secret projects that people are seeing and there's probably quite a few of them. We actually pulled a few of them up, up and showed some of them that look like UFOs. That probably is part of what people are seeing, but he thinks is also probable that there's some other things and these other things could be from anywhere. And then there's just the Fermi paradox. Like if they're all out there, where are they? There's so many planets, there's so many galaxies.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, that's, that's got to be the case.

[Joe Rogan]

It has to be the case. It's the question of whether or not they have visited or whether or not they're here. Here.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

You know, and then there's these like weird Peruvian mummies that we went over that. These tridactyl mummies that they take CAT scans of and you see the tissue and the bones and you know, they, they were all found. And what, what is it called? What's the kind of Earth that they found that these things are the d. Something. Do you remember what it is? Where they were all dried out?

[C]

I know, I know exactly the description.

[Joe Rogan]

But I don't remember the word something Earth. I know the word. I can't. It's, it's escaping me right now. All that stuff's very fascinating. So ancient depictions on cave walls of these things and we pulled up these tapestries are a thousand years old that had these three fingered creatures. Very weird, very weird. But that doesn't necessarily, doesn't mean they're alien.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

You know, we talked to, we talked rather about all the various versions of human beings that they're finding now. You know, from Denisovans to the island of Flores, Hobbit people. There's like these, there's a weird variety of humans that went extinct.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

And these tridactyl things could very well have been that.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, you had, it was Christopher Melanon. Right. And that was my favorite one because he had, I think, I don't want to butcher, but I think he called it ultra terrestrial. It makes the most sense. Which is, think about right now, if you just dropped a bottle in the ocean. Ocean, right. What are the odds you ever run into that bottle in the ocean? It's impossible that's what time is. If we've been around for 13 billion years, sure, there's aliens, but how do you. We've only been around for a few thousand, like it's such an infant. It's a grain of sand in the whole beach. So what if you, what would you do right now? If we had technology a thousand years from now, 2,000 years from now. Right. AI, multiply it out, the whole nine, what would you do? You'd send these things everywhere.

[Joe Rogan]

Sure.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Just like sci fi. And you'd plant them and you'd come out every now and again and check what's up.

[Joe Rogan]

Sure, sure.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So that's. I don't, I don't. My likeliest thing is I don't think there's any biological beings or aliens. I think you've just got automated drones in essence that are running patterns that have some sort of like, I don't know, that makes way more sense.

[Joe Rogan]

It certainly could be that. I mean, that's what we're doing currently on Mars.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right?

[Joe Rogan]

What we do with, you know, probes, you know, with the James Webb telescope, a lot of different things that we use. We just send a machine out and get information from them. And then also, I think at a certain point in time we're being realistic about what we're doing right now. We're going to have biological being beings and then we're going to have some kind of digital being. We're going to have some sort of a. Whether it's, whether it's an actual physical robot or whether it's just an artificial intelligence. That's a signal that we can send and you know, it has enough compressed information where it can compute and calculate and do. It's a technology beyond our wildest, wildest dreams is a thousand years away from that. Right? A thousand years away. We have a God. Right. So what, what if, if you extrapolate where we're at now with quantum computing and the ability to calculate things that if you turn the entire universe, every molecule of the universe into a computer, it would take you so much time, according to Marc Andreessen, that the universe would die of heat death before it could solve an equation that a quantum computer can solve in minutes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

This is, we're talking about nuts.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No, it's crazy.

[Joe Rogan]

And this is just 20, 25 stuff. You know, if you looked at the Internet from 1994, it's like archaic 14, four modems.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I remember it, I remember it.

[Joe Rogan]

I'm that generation, you know, that's 31 years ago. So like what Are we talking about when we're dealing with 31,000 years? So if conceivably a life form has existed and gone through the same stages as us, without catastrophes, without nuclear war, without all the things that could trip us up, we could be dealing with, with things that are beyond our imagination, literally beyond our imagination. And they're probably around us all the time. I had an idea that I wondered, I've always thought, what if ideas are life forms, right? Because we think of life as being. It has to breathe, it has to have cells, it has to. But everything in this room and everything in this city and everything on this planet that's a man made physical object came out of an idea idea. And the ideas compound upon each other that, you know, the more people working on these ideas, the more competition, the more the ideas will flourish and the more the, the ideas will be more complex and, and more efficient versions of this idea like it has. But it has to start as a creative thought inside someone's head. And either a creative thought that you can apply to existing creative thoughts or a completely unique one like Francis Crick, or you know, when they're figuring out certain aspects of biology or certain aspects of the quantum field, whatever they're doing, that's, that's a breakthrough thing like where is that coming from, right? Coming from an idea. And then these ideas, they manifest itself in physical form through human labor.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, it's Schrodinger's cat, right? Does it happen if you don't observe it? That's the weird thing about quantum physics, right? It's completely. You can't imagine in it. But if you don't open that box, nothing's happened yet. It hasn't happened until you observe it, right? They prove that.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, that's what it gets really weird, you know, when people. There's a lot of people that are deciding now that to approach it, approach it as if consciousness is the reason these things exist. Not consciousness is seeing that these things exist, that they only exist when you're interacting with them. Which is like what some of the.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Stuff, when you read that, like I've read books about string theory, about quantum physics. It's just, they're too, it's too hard to process in the real world when you're at the table. But the table's actually empty space. There's almost nothing in it. Solid, every atom. I don't even know what the numbers are like Neil Degrasse Tyson. But how small is the nucleus and the actual physical items out of it? They're all empty. Everything's empty.

[Joe Rogan]

Everything's empty. And then you get to subatomic and you're like, okay, well, now this is just pure wizardry, right? Yeah. They exist and they don't exist.

[C]

This is something Michael Jackson said about ideas. Start like right here.

[Joe Rogan]

Philip says, we went and met with Michael. And Kenny said, michael, you've got to stop. We've got an incredible show. We don't need any more vignettes. Michael said, but Kenny, God channels this through me at. At night I can't sleep because I'm so supercharged. Kenny said, but Michael, we have to finish. Can't God take a vacation without missing a beat? Michael said, you don't understand. If I'm not there to receive these ideas, God might give them to Prince.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Incredible. Just an incredible. Michael slept one night. And that's why Purple Rain exists. Did you know that little red Corvette was gonna have a totally different meaning with Michael Jackson?

[Joe Rogan]

Isn't that crazy? God might give them to Prince.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow. Wow.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Well, songs are interesting like that. You know, I met. Last year. I was in Sweden. I did this conference. Brilliant minds. Amazing. And I met Max Martin. Do you know who that is?

[Joe Rogan]

No.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Max Martin is. You should look this up. How many hits he has. So Max Martin has, I think, more number one hits than anyone but Paul McCartney. Check that if I'm right. But I got there. There's so many interesting people. Amazing conference. And I was ready to geek out with him because I'm just so curious. It's the creative. Like, how does somebody come up with something? Is fascinating to me. And one of his recent songs was Blinding Lights by the Weeknd, you know, such a massive hit. And I just. I love that song. And I just, like. Just like, perfect. Sounds like a movie track in my mind. And how did you do that? Like, how, you know, where did you start? Did you guys have a beat? Did you know the lyrics? Like, I'm just so curious. How does that happen? Is it like in 10 minutes? Is it months? And he just walked me through, like he had a vision. We have this. We have like all this stuff that we sit down and then the first the music. Then I'm like, just, wow. It's so amazing to create something like that that a billion people now listen to. Number one in every country in the world. It's like, how do you manufacture something so kind of perfect that everyone in the world likes it?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And is there for. You know, it's going to be the hit before it is the hit. That to me is the most host. Like, how many bands get stuck for the rest of their life playing a song that they freaking hate that they didn't know was going to be there? Especially if you're a one hit wonder. Yeah, you're like dead in the eyes. You're like, I gotta play this again. Yeah, I gotta, you know, Come on, Eileen. Like, you better love my song.

[Joe Rogan]

You love a song and the artist doesn't want to sing it anymore. Like, oh.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And then they start singing it a different way at a concert. And you're like, why are you doing this weird acapella, bro? I want to hear like the radio.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, that's, that's interesting. That's kind of the difference though, between musicians and anybody else. Because musicians, you want to hear the same thing over and over again.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Exactly. Yeah, I have that a little bit where if I get clients who book me over and over, they'll. I say to them, do you want me to do something different? Because it's like jokes, right? You know, it's like, I've seen gaffing. You can do Hot Pockets. Like, people call it out. I want to hear it. But you know the punchline, Right, right. Something that especially you're known for. So I found that if I did a completely different show, people are kind of mad. Like you. I don't have exit surveys, but like, I, I, I kind of listen in and see what's going on. I wish he did that one. Bon Jovi has got to do. Living on a prayer at every game or people are pissed. For me, I need at least two of the things to be the same because people want to see if they can catch it the second time.

[Joe Rogan]

Got it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So there's a level of they heard about it and they're like, oh, you gotta do that thing with the thing. Like, you know, and so if I do everything new, yeah, they're kind of happy, but they still want a greatest hit. And it took me years to learn that because I used to be like, oh, I can't do the same thing. I gotta be, you know, unique. And then I learned that that's not better.

[Joe Rogan]

You know, I was just thinking, like, mentalists would be the best police interrogators.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right. Minority Report style.

[Joe Rogan]

Right. Don't you think? Like, if someone. But don't you think if a police interrogator learned the skills of being a mental.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I think they could. But again, it's the best analogy that I can give you is a director holding the camera. I'm always holding the camera and pointing it at what I want. Does that make sense? What police interrogator is gonna say, okay to the perp, think of where you were that night. Look this way, look that way. They're not gonna do all that stuff. This is done when it's done under the guise of entertainment.

[Joe Rogan]

And if they do do that, you're kind of leading the witness.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You could lead whatever people are gonna. It's not a show. So you're not gonna have a willing participant hypnotized against your will. Most stage hypnotists, they do compliance testing first. Do you know what I mean by that? They have everyone in the audience hold your hands together and imagine in like and like, who can't get their hands apart. And the person who goes like this, right away, they're like, I'm not bringing them on stage. They're not doing anything.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You have to be able to be hypnotized. You have to be suggestible. Mine isn't necessarily suggestible, but mine is a maze where every time you hit a road block, I'm moving you around until I get you to the spot where you go through. And so that's why you asked me, why I didn't do this. It wasn't going to work. I knew it wouldn't. I have. I have more things planned than you know right now.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I've been thinking about this for a while, but I'm not going to do them all.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Because again, how you structure an act, you leave the best for last. You never leave here doing the best.

[Joe Rogan]

We're going down the home stretch.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Are we? Are we home stretched? Are we at the final moment?

[Joe Rogan]

We're almost at three hours, so.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah. Wow, this goes fast, huh?

[Joe Rogan]

Flew by.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Remember when you asked me did I wake up early or late?

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

The only thing I got wrong.

[Joe Rogan]

Right, Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Except. Well, he said the vowel, but he thought of melody. But the Y was the. You know what I mean? That was a little bit tricky because. A, E, I, O, U. Anyway, it doesn't matter. Here's what I want to do. You said 50. 50 coin flip.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And I brought one. You said, who has coins? What do we got here?

[Joe Rogan]

A coin.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

What is it? Candy. Half, right?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

All right, let's go. I feel like one is not exciting enough. That's like a football game. Here's what I do. I don't know if you can see me from over there. Let's do three tosses.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Statistically, how many we get? Right?

[Joe Rogan]

Two, one.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And a half. All right. All right. Either way, Call it in the air.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Can you see me with that? I'm gonna try. The table's real busy.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Call it in the air.

[Joe Rogan]

Tails.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You going tails.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

What do we get? Pets. All right.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

All right. Whatever. Oh, for one.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You felt good about it when you did it.

[Joe Rogan]

No.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Okay.

[Joe Rogan]

Should I really put it in my head?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

No. Do what? I mean, it's a coin flip. It's not a trick.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Now it gets in your head because you guessed it, and you're like, it didn't work the first time, but nobody cares. Nothing riding on this. You already call it in the air. What are you going with tails. You going tails again?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You're going tails again?

[Joe Rogan]

Yep.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I can't. I see. I. That time. I would never change his hats. Oh. All right. All right. Third try is charm.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You think you got it?

[Joe Rogan]

Yep.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

What are the odds on that? So this has got to be your shot. Call it.

[Joe Rogan]

Tails.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Tails. I always go tails. Never fails. What do we get? Joe, you're over three.

[Joe Rogan]

Heads again.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You're over three. You done?

[Joe Rogan]

Nope.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You want one more?

[Joe Rogan]

Sure.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You insist?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

All right. You're not done. I said three. Okay. Should I go over here? Has that envelope been there the whole whole time?

[Joe Rogan]

This envelope? Yes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

We sealed this right? The moment I arrived at the studio.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Okay. You're gonna get it this time. Just for the rest.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Call tails. Tails.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

0 for 4.

[Joe Rogan]

Are you doing this?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I'm not doing anything.

[Joe Rogan]

You're not making it land on heads? No. Do you know how to do it? Like, do you have a method?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Call it. Call whatever you want.

[Joe Rogan]

Tails.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So did I do it? You said it.

[Joe Rogan]

What is it?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's heads. But that was. That didn't count. That didn't count. You're just bad luck.

[Joe Rogan]

Is that five in a row?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I don't really count that one.

[Joe Rogan]

That seems odd. Let's try one more.

[C]

Double check. The.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Do it yourself, do it yourself.

[Joe Rogan]

Double check What?

[C]

Double check. There's still tails on there.

[Joe Rogan]

I still do.

[C]

Okay.

[Joe Rogan]

Just check it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

But this doesn't count because this one's yours.

[Joe Rogan]

Whoops. That was very clumsy of me.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Put. Anyway, do it on the table. I just didn't have room on the table.

[Joe Rogan]

It's tails.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

But did you guess tails?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, okay.

[Joe Rogan]

I just kept going. I feel like it's got to be tails.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's not a trick. It's statistically statistical.

[Joe Rogan]

All right, but statistically, five in a row of heads, it seems odd.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I said to you, I hope everyone stayed along for this. Journey. I said this is your future.

[Joe Rogan]

This is my future.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Right, but I lied. Past, present and future. Hold on. I'm gonna come over there, open it up. You'll see what I mean. But I want you to open it. You open it up. There's two things in there. Now freeze right there. Okay, show us what you have.

[Joe Rogan]

Two envelopes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

One's not an envelopes.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, one's folded piece of paper.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Folded piece of paper.

[Joe Rogan]

And one is a manila envelope.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Is it all right if I come over? Is it. Is it taped everywhere?

[Joe Rogan]

Yes, taped everywhere.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

So I'm coming over.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You want to do it? Can you guys hear me?

[Joe Rogan]

We're going to open it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Where am I? Is a camera here?

[Joe Rogan]

There's a camera over there.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

There's a camera. Okay, you tell me. Okay, I'll go around you. I just want to make sure you can see this.

[Joe Rogan]

All right, Joe, look inside, okay?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I want you to look inside, and before you grab. No, no, no. Look, look, look, look, look.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay, I'm looking.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Tell me. You see, it says two words. Can I turn this around?

[Joe Rogan]

Joe Rogan.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It says Joe Rogan, and I don't want to touch. Will you do it? I want to touch. Grab that one, that pink one, okay. And read to us. Grab that. That's your pass. Hold on to this.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Read out loud. That's been in there from before we started.

[Joe Rogan]

It says, Joe Rogan will get three coin flips in a row. Wrong. Insist on doing one more and then get that one wrong, too.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

The present. You can't change that. The past. Joe, take out what's in there. Tell us all. Look around the edges. Is this. It's stapled.

[Joe Rogan]

Stapled.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Like, I usually used to lick stuff. Feel like. Do this. Bring this over. I want you to see. Look, look. I don't want to touch. I just want you to, like, look around.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, it's fully stapled.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's stapled. Is there any. When I walked in here, Joe, I made a big thing of it. I said, I want you to have this before.

[Joe Rogan]

Right. Sealed. It's been here the whole time. Sealed, yes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Impulsive, spontaneous. In the moment.

[Joe Rogan]

Got it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And I said to you. Did something get in your head? Who? Earlier when I said, any fighter you've ever. You've ever seen, what fighter came to mind?

[Joe Rogan]

I said, anderson Silver.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Anderson Silver.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

And how many fighters. Rip it open.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

How many fighters did you say cycled through? And I said, be very specific. How many fighters do you think cycled through your head?

[Joe Rogan]

I don't know. I Said a dozen at least.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Did he say a dozen?

[C]

With 14.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

You said 14. Read, please. Open that up. Take that out. And I want you to please read what's been in there. From the moment I walked on this.

[Joe Rogan]

Set, it said Joe will have 14 fighters go through his head. But with Anderson Silva in the end, and a fight that he won.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Past, present, and future.

[Joe Rogan]

That's insane.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Past, present, future. The other piece of paper, there's one.

[Joe Rogan]

That'S got literally insane. Because at first I was gonna go with Zabit. Zabit, maga, Mob, Mag. Sheroff.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Do this. Grab the other piece of paper. It's got a paperclip. Freeze. Right there. This is the future. Stop, stop. Don't move. Hold it right there in your hand.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay, I'm holding it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Nobody knows the future.

[Joe Rogan]

Nobody knows the future.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It's true. Nobody does. Imagine right now, best magic trick in the world. Boom. I throw a smoke bomb, right? Disappear. Disappear.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Anyone, ever. Someone famous, though. Otherwise, I want to see my grandmother again. Appears right here. Instead. Imagine you literally. I don't want Jamie Doob. You pull up a photo. You show me this person's photo.

[Joe Rogan]

Got it?

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Say it. Who? Who do you see right there in that chair? Say it. What's their name?

[Joe Rogan]

Miles Davis.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Can I ask you a question?

[Joe Rogan]

Yes.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Because I like this. Here's what I always like to do. I always call it, the grass is greener. I can see when people's eyes shift, when they have one person and they're like, I want that person. But that's the front of their mind. I can always get in the front. But for this to be a legendary ending. Who is in the back? Who is the person you thought of before Miles Davis? Tell us.

[Joe Rogan]

Muhammad Ali.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Muhammad Ali. Right. That's what I love. The gold standard. The reason you're going to talk about this for years is because you changed your mind at the last moment. That's been in there from when I walked in here. Look at what's in there right now.

[Joe Rogan]

Muhammad Ali. How is that possible? That's insane. You are a witch. We're gonna have to kill you. Lock the door, Jamie.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Bam.

[Joe Rogan]

That's really insane, man. That's really weird. I want to ask you how you do this, but you're not going to tell me.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Yeah, off camera. Tell you everything. You show me where Bob Lazar's hiding the ufo.

[Joe Rogan]

I wish I knew. I wish I knew. That's insane, dude. That's crazy. It was Anderson Silva versus Rock Rich Frank. Rich Franklin.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Oh, what a good fight.

[Joe Rogan]

What a Great fight.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

This you keep. This you keep. You lock in the safe for when I come next time. Assume the clothes.

[Joe Rogan]

I will. I'll be back down the safe. This is really nuts, man. I don't know how you did it. It's really crazy. The coin flip, the 14 different fighters. Like all of it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Thank you.

[Joe Rogan]

Nuts, man.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Change your bank pin code right now. Change it?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, I'm going to. Jesus Christ. Jamie, anything to add to this? Nope.

[C]

We should have walked off when you silent. We should just send it there.

[Joe Rogan]

This is like pure wizardry, dude. I. I don't know how you're doing it.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Appreciate that.

[Joe Rogan]

I don't think you're ever going to be explained to me either. Thank you.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

I appreciate you, man. I'm a huge fan for many years, and I love what you're putting out in the world. And I'm telling you, I just. I love it. And thank you so much. I'm honored to be here.

[Joe Rogan]

It's an honor for me, too. This is, like, truly insane. I've been blown away before, but I don't think I've ever been blown blown away this much. This is really nuts. And it's, like, shattered my worldview. I have to rethink how I think about everything and what signals human beings give off and, like, how someone could read something like that. Pretty nuts.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

Thanks, brother.

[Joe Rogan]

Thank you. Bye, everybody.

[Mentalist (speculated name not provided in the transcript)]

It.