#2510 - Devon Larratt

Summary

The Joe Rogan Experience #2510: Devon Larratt

Date: June 5, 2026
Guest: Devon Larratt, world champion arm wrestler
Host: Joe Rogan

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Episode Overview

This episode features Devon Larratt, considered one of the greatest arm wrestlers in the world. Joe and Devon engage in a deep, wide-ranging discussion on the physical and mental demands of elite arm wrestling, the evolution of training philosophies, anomalous strength genetics, and the intersection of sports and the extreme environments of military and war. Larratt shares personal stories, philosophical insights, technical breakdowns, and some wild tales from both the sporting and military worlds.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Devon’s Arm Wrestling Origins & Physical Impact

Timestamps: 00:00 – 06:00

• Devon’s Background & Reputation: Devon expresses gratitude to be Rogan’s first arm wrestler guest, acknowledging the debated GOAT (Greatest of All Time) status, mentioning other legends like John Brzenk.
• Physical Toll of Arm Wrestling:
  • Devon can't fully extend his arms due to years of competitive arm wrestling ("weaponized arthritis").
  • Surgeries have been necessary to manage bone growth and nerve constriction.
  • Experiences chronic pain and nerve issues, but continues to compete at the highest levels (<span style="font-size: 0.9em">[02:19]</span>).
• Quote:
  • “I'm as all in, in arm wrestling as you can possibly be. This is our cost of admission for some of us.” – Devon [03:03]

2. Unique Physiology and Chronic Injury

Timestamps: 06:00 – 13:00

• Wolf’s Law & Bone Adaptation:
  • Discussion of how bones adapt to repetitive stress, referencing David Goggins and others with freakish bone adaptations ("wolf's law").
• Devon's Own Battle with 'Bone on Bone' Joints:
  • Devon’s spent two decades with no cartilage in his elbows, highlighting the resilience in continuing to perform elite-level feats.
• Pain Management:
  • Mastery of pain, seeing it as an informational guide rather than a limitation.
• Quote:
  • “All the doctors will say something, but it's just not true. You can do anything, you know?” – Devon [10:35]

3. Training Methodologies: Evolution and Debates

Timestamps: 11:42 – 31:48

• Grip Training:
  • Rogan and Larratt discuss the intensity and frequency of grip training. Devon trains grip every day, but technical nuance is about forcing your opponent to grip you (“rising” and “top roll”).
  • Grip is vital, but a small part of the whole technical landscape.
• Arm Wrestling Training Principles:
  • Extensive daily volume, with two intense practice days each week at the club. Much of his training is high-rep, low-weight to promote blood flow and healing.
  • “Multispinner” and other unique equipment for hand and wrist strength.
  • Rejects generalist heavy training for super-specific, sport-driven motion and recovery.
• Quote:
  • “I call it weaponized arthritis... there are ways you can make your loss of range work for you.” – Devon [03:25]
  • “Just the monotony level is extreme... it's all day, man.” – Devon [16:24]
  • “I'm 51 and plagued with injuries, so I have to be very specific. This is the best formula I've come up with.” – Devon [21:14]

4. Evolution of the Sport and Lifelong Competition

Timestamps: 23:00 – 33:00

• Sport Longevity:
  • Arm wrestling allows competitors to remain at the top into their 50s and beyond. Larratt started wrestling with his grandmother at age 4; sees top competitors into their 60s and 70s.
  • The hand, being richly tendonous, takes decades to peak structurally—age confers distinct advantages.
• Sport’s Blue-Collar, Familial Nature:
  • Emphasizes garage and backyard clubs, accessibility, and tight-knit bonds.
• Quote:
  • “We’ve had world champions in the open division who are almost 70.” – Devon [25:41]

5. Genetics, Freaks, and Science

Timestamps: 32:00 – 45:00

• Genetic Outliers in Strength Sports:

  • Discussion of Devon’s own unique genetics (researched by geneticist Ryan Rosner) and the extraordinary genomes of strength sport athletes like Brian Shaw (mutant growth hormone).
  • Myostatin inhibitors, Follistatin treatments, bone and muscle mutations, e.g., “Beast Whippets” (dogs), Belgian Blue cattle.

• Debate: Nature vs. Training?

  • Not all mutations result in what you’d predict: Eddie Hall lacks fast-twitch muscle genes but set deadlift records.

• Quote:

  • “There's people out there with world records that don't have fast-twitch muscle according to their genetics. It makes no sense.” – Devon [38:36]
  • “I think balance is overrated. Balance is a nice concept for some imaginary world... I live in a world where I'm trying to win a world title.” – Devon [95:52]

6. Specialization, Skill, and Technical Adaptation

Timestamps: 53:10 – 73:50

• Extreme Specialization:
  • Devon eschews general fitness for relentless single-arm training (“pumpkin training”). Believes in putting all recovery and adaptation energy into his right arm for competition.
  • Cites one-armed “hellboys” like Oleg Zok as evidence for hyper-specialization’s effectiveness.
• Skill Over Strength:
  • Despite not being the biggest or strongest, Devon is world #2 in open arm wrestling—emphasizes precision, angles, and sport-specific skill as the true differentiators.
• Technical Evolution:
  • Discussion of “King’s Move” (outside top roll), pronation, cupping—the variety of technical approaches.
• Mentions of John Brzenk (“the GOAT”):
  • Brzenk dominated for decades with technique and no weightlifting, popularizing extreme sport specialization.
• Quote:
  • “The thing I love most is the family and the bonds. Arm wrestling clubs are special places... very blue collar, open doors.” – Devon [26:46]

7. Modernization and Sport Structure

Timestamps: 74:00 – 80:00

• Growth of Arm Wrestling as a Professional Sport:
  • From $500 prize matches to six-figure annual incomes for top competitors.
  • The rise of the “East vs. West” series, global leagues, and a post-pandemic social media explosion making arm wrestling more globally competitive than ever.
• Drug Testing and Open Leagues:
  • Discussion of tested (WAF) vs. open leagues (East vs. West). No testing means wide use of PEDs, “everything goes.”

8. The Psychology of Mastery: Discipline, Order & Chaos

Timestamps: 80:03 – 85:46

• Order vs. Chaos:
  • To achieve greatness, Devon sees the need to oscillate between periods of disciplined routine and “chaotic” off-periods to reassess, recover, and keep the mind sharp.
  • Uses reward systems and structured plans (even “sticker charts”) for motivation and habit-bonding.
• Quote:
  • “Somewhere between a balance between chaos and order, perfect performance is found.” – Devon [80:33]
  • “The most difficult piece is the psychological dedication to do 10 hours of wrist curls in a day.” – Devon [85:34]

9. Freaks, Rock Climbers & Crossovers

Timestamps: 95:27 – 107:18

• Crossovers With Climbing and Grip Freaks:
  • Discussion of Yves Gravel, a climber with near-superhuman grip. Rogan and Larratt marvel at the effectiveness of certain types of grip and tendon training, chart the rapid rise of crossovers between arm wrestling and other grip sports.
• Unique Training Approaches:
  • Some climbers and arm wrestlers are so specialized, their work translates to almost immediate elite performance.
• Quote:
  • “He can do pull-ups off a credit card. That's insane.” – Devon [98:30]

10. Mindset, Military, & Psychological Transformation

Timestamps: 130:29 – end

• Devon’s Special Forces Background:
  • Served 16 of 20 years with Canadian elite unit JTF2; left military for arm wrestling due to operational security and public exposure.
  • Military-life discipline, fear management, and persona switching transferred into athletic psychology.
• Storytelling: Demons, Giants, and the Unexplained
  • Fascinating stories of physically giant persons encountered in Afghanistan and Canadian wilderness.
  • Chilling tale of a friend and fellow soldier being possessed by a demon in the Middle East—eventually exorcised after displaying supernatural knowledge and abilities.
• Quote:
  • “You are not necessarily one thing. You are whatever you want to be, and you can change that.” – Devon [144:38]
  • “There's things out there we don't understand.” – Devon [160:07]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the technical beauty of arm wrestling:

  • “The real technical nuance of the sport is to try and make the other person hold on to you.” – Devon [12:46]

• On old age and the sport:

  • “I'm 51, and I probably competed at the highest level. I believe I can still go further.” – Devon [25:44]

• On the demands and monotony of elite training:

  • “The monotony level is extreme... I lead a very simple life at the moment... I wake up and I'm training like all day.” – Devon [16:24]

• On pursuing mastery:

  • “If you want to have a giant pumpkin? You pinch off all the flowers on the vine except for one. My giant pumpkin.” – Devon [86:04]
  • “If you give a guy four or five years of arm wrestling, they'll beat anybody who's not practicing. It's the same as jiu-jitsu.” – Devon [129:06]

• On the psychological cost of mastery:

  • “To be a world champion at 51 is to put all your energy into something so simple. The most difficult piece is the psychological dedication.” – Devon [85:34]

• On facing giants (literally and metaphorically):

  • “I couldn't walk properly for like four months... I think he might have ripped my spine apart.” – Devon, about competing with Levan Saginashvili [63:05]

• On war, fear, and persona:

  • “You can be whatever you want to be… it’s learning that you are not necessarily one thing.” – Devon [146:49]

• On supernatural experiences:

  • “He started speaking in tongues. He knew everything about everybody. He could speak different languages... they did an exorcism.” – Devon, regarding a possessed friend in Iraq [158:54]

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Significant Segments by Timestamp

• Devon’s Chronic Injury & Surgeries: [00:53 – 02:44]
• The Concept of “Weaponized Arthritis”: [03:25]
• Detailed Breakdown of Training Strategy: [15:18 – 24:16], [53:17 – 54:16]
• Discussion of Arm Wrestling Legends (Brzenk, Levan): [27:07 – 70:58]
• Genetics and Biological Freaks in Sport: [32:00 – 45:00], [114:34 – 116:55]
• Military Background, Persona-Switching: [130:29 – 147:38]
• Kandahar Giant and Other Tales: [151:07 – 157:14]
• Exorcism Story: [157:48 – 162:56]

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Tone and Style

The conversation flows naturally between highly technical, philosophical, and personal, with the mix of good-natured humor and awe typical of both Rogan’s and Larratt’s public personas. Devon’s depth as an athlete and person shines through his reflective, humble, yet intensely dedicated approach to both arm wrestling and life.

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Summary

This episode stands out as a rich, deep dive into one of strength sport’s most unique characters. From technical nuances and training debates to mind-blowing real-world stories about giants and exorcisms, Devon Larratt and Joe Rogan deliver a conversation that is as entertaining as it is revealing of what it takes to reach the highest levels of niche athletic mastery, and the extraordinary paths athletes walk to get there. If you want to understand arm wrestling—or the mindset behind the world’s best strength athletes—this episode is a must-listen.

Transcript

[Devin Larratt]

Joe Rogan podcast. Check it out. The Joe Rogan experience. Train my day. Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day.

[Joe Rogan]

Check, check. What's happening, my man?

[Devin Larratt]

I'm so happy.

[Joe Rogan]

So happy to see you. Wow. Let's go, Joe.

[Devin Larratt]

Thank you so much. First of all.

[Joe Rogan]

Pleasure.

[Devin Larratt]

Feel like, you know, you are the loudspeaker of the planet, man. And I'm so honored to be here.

[Joe Rogan]

That's a very uncomfortable position to be in, I'll tell you that. It's very weird.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, I bet, I bet. But look, I mean, you've talked to everybody on the planet, and I think I'm honored to be your first arm wrestler.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, if I'm gonna have an arm wrestler, it has to be the goat.

[Devin Larratt]

Highly debated. Highly debated. But I'll take it.

[Joe Rogan]

You're in the conversation.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, I'm in the conversation. There's a couple of us, I think. John Brzenk. I don't know. How close do you follow arm wrestling?

[Joe Rogan]

Very little. Yeah, I follow you. Well, I'm most fascinated by the fact that you can't extend your arm. Yeah, his arms don't straighten out.

[Devin Larratt]

No, they don't. Unfortunately, that didn't work. Yeah, it didn't work when I was trying to fight Thor either. It kind of limited the extension, but

[Joe Rogan]

when did that start happening?

[Devin Larratt]

So I was. I got into club arm wrestling. I'm wrestling with my. When I was a kid, but I got into club arm wrestling around, like, 18, by the time I was 20, 20 or so. We have this champion called Crazy George. Okay. He's like, a very old, very decorated champion. And he famously, at the time, for me, he couldn't straighten his elbows. And I was like, oh, man, I can't wait till my elbows don't straighten. Like a silly. A silly wish, right? So it started early. Like, I think I was, like, probably like, in my late 20s. And it just. The range started to shrink.

[Joe Rogan]

And how. What is that from?

[Devin Larratt]

It's just pressure. Mostly, like, just the constant pressure on the elbow joint causes, you know, osteophytes potentially, like. And it doesn't happen to all the arm wrestlers.

[Joe Rogan]

Have you gotten an MRI on it?

[Devin Larratt]

I've had three surgeries to straighten them out to remove bone and scar tissue.

[Joe Rogan]

Just chipped bones and stuff.

[Devin Larratt]

Chipped bones. Dr. Pollack, bless his soul, at the Ottawa Hospital, has extended my career till this age, you know. Yeah, that's probably one of the worst chronic conditions that arm wrestlers get is, you know, if the bone growth gets bad enough, it can start to constrict. Your nerves or blood flow, and that's when it becomes a problem.

[Joe Rogan]

Has that happened to you?

[Devin Larratt]

100%.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. So I was what I was probably. It was like 2013, so, like 13 years ago is when I had my first surgery. And at that point, like, trying to move forward, trying to move forward.

[Joe Rogan]

Pull it out as far as you can go. That's it.

[Devin Larratt]

That's it, buddy. That's it.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

The left is a little more than the right.

[Devin Larratt]

It looks like probably a little bit. Yeah. Yeah. And I've had two surgeries on the right, one on the left. But in my mind, you know, it's a small price to pay, you know, like, I'm as all in. In arm wrestling as you can possibly be. And this is our cost of admission for some of us, you know.

[Joe Rogan]

And does that happen to every arm wrestler?

[Devin Larratt]

No, no, no. There's lots of arm wrestlers. It's a style thing. It's a genetic predisposition. It's. I rolled the dice wrong one day and had a bad match. You know, I think what happens is, it's really. It's the pressure. It's the bones over time. If you're. And then it's. If you're a dummy and, you know, keep on doing it when you should probably rest, that probably doesn't help. And I'm. I'm guilty, you know, so like most of the greats anyways, I'm everything. It doesn't affect me in the sport. I actually. I call it weaponized arthritis. Okay. Because there are ways you can kind of make your loss of range work for you at times. Really? Yeah. Because there's like. Right. You know, like if you're doing an arm bar. Okay. Like your body resists with the ligaments and the tendons. So that starts higher for me. And I think that there's a muscular strength component that kicks in as well, right at the end of the range to protect you. So I just have a higher, you know, arm bar, you know, does it.

[Joe Rogan]

Did it help you in arm bars as well?

[Devin Larratt]

Oh, God, no, it doesn't. A good jiu jitsu guy is still gonna. He's still gonna arm bar me.

[Joe Rogan]

No, it's also. The bones would just snap.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. It' to snap higher.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, yeah. Snap in bad places.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Did you ever try hanging from like, a chin up bar to straighten it out?

[Devin Larratt]

I've tried a lot of things.

[Joe Rogan]

I saw a video with you and Juju Mufu.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Is that how you say his name?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, Juji.

[Joe Rogan]

Juji?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Juju Mufu. Okay, John call. Yeah, he's great.

[Joe Rogan]

He's great. He's such a character. But they were rolling. They were trying to, like, do some stuff with like, these big metal bars to roll out your muscles. And you were in agony.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

I was like, that is crazy to watch. Like, you really can't straighten your arm. And when they were trying, you were screaming.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah, it's terrible. I've kind of just accepted it.

[Joe Rogan]

Did you ever try to hang?

[Devin Larratt]

I've tried so many things, but I. When I was young. When I was 20, I was wishing for the day that I could be like Crazy George, where your arm doesn't straighten out. It's interesting, you know, like, I'm not. If I was like, all about straightening my arm, I could probably still do it because the bone is actually removed now. It's a sheath. There's like a capsule that surrounds a joint that is probably the root cause of it.

[Joe Rogan]

What is the capsule made out of?

[Devin Larratt]

I believe it's. Was it fascia? Just connective structure. I think it encapsulates the joint.

[Joe Rogan]

So everything is just sort of condensed to hold the joint together.

[Devin Larratt]

I think so, yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Kind of a unique study. If you were like a physiologist or you're studying human anatomy, you would say, okay, like, what is possible. Yeah, you know, like. Do you know about David Goggins knees?

[Devin Larratt]

I know David Goggins. I don't know about his knees.

[Joe Rogan]

His knees are so great. He's bone on bone.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

With both knees. And he went to the doctor and the doctor said, I don't know how you can walk with these knees. Forget about run thousands of miles. So his knees had the. It's. It's. What is it called, Jamie? It's like wolf something. It's like there's a condition when you're bone on bone for so long where the bone actually spreads out. And the doctor said, I'd heard about this in theory. I've never seen it on an actual human being. Where his knee. The bone had grown out so weird that his knees were moving at, like, odd angles. So they had a saw his tibia and move his knee down so he's still bone on bone, but now he has a flat surface. And so they cut it and then screwed it into place. And then he just rode a stationary bike for like fucking five months, like a maniac. And then started running again. Bone on bone.

[Devin Larratt]

Beautiful. Love it.

[Joe Rogan]

It's crazy.

[Devin Larratt]

He's wild.

[Joe Rogan]

See if you can. See if you can find what the condition is.

[Devin Larratt]

Says it's called Wolf's law, biological principle,

[Joe Rogan]

stating that bones adapt and grow thicker and denser. Physical stress. Is that. I think that's it. Yeah. And his grew thicker and like kind of mushroomed out.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

At the top of the knee. Because there's nothing there. There's no. And it's just bang, bang, bang, bang, bang. Yeah. So it just kept growing out. And if you see. See. Do we have the images of the surgery? It's. I know I sent it to you a long ass time.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

I mean, it's showing a bunch of pictures from when he was on here. So see that where he. The fingerprints on his shin. That's because he had so much edema on his leg that he could squeeze it and put his. That's after the surgery.

[Devin Larratt]

Awesome.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. But look at the actual. Yeah, look at that. The photo of what the knee looks like.

[Devin Larratt]

That's not him.

[Joe Rogan]

That's on him. Where's. That's the. That's like an image of what it looks like. Okay. So they saw it and then they screw it down in place. They saw it slightly, you know, like a wedge off a piece of wood. You lower it, level it out, and then screw it in place. This episode is brought to you by ZipRecruiter. When you hire a landscaper to create your perfect outdoor oasis, you want someone who cares. That's true for every role you hire for. And luckily, it just got easier to find that thanks to ZipRecruiter. Try it for free at ZipRecruiter.com Rogan Longtime listeners, you might already know that ZipRecruiter uses powerful matching technology to find qualified candidates fast. But now they also have a new feature that shows you candidates who are interested in your role first. You can even hear why. In their own words. Find candidates who really want your job on ZipRecruiter. Four out of five employers who post on ZipRecruiter get a quality candidate within the first day. Try it for free at ziprecruiter.com rogan that ziprecruiter.com roGAN Meet your match at

[Devin Larratt]

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[Joe Rogan]

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[Devin Larratt]

built to satisfy without slowing you down. Try wraps today in the app [e-mail] available at all participating locations. Yeah, for sure. I have something similar. I've been bone on bone for probably Two decades. Really? Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

All the cartilage is gone.

[Devin Larratt]

Nothing. So when. When I went and got my surgery, doctor told me I have no. Like, there's. There's nothing there but bone. He said, devin, maybe we can extend. Maybe we can give you another couple years on your. On your career, maybe.

[Joe Rogan]

How long ago did you say this?

[Devin Larratt]

That was like 15 years ago. I'm probably. No kidding. I probably pulled off my best show ever six weeks ago. Really?

[Joe Rogan]

How old are you?

[Devin Larratt]

I'm 51. That's amazing. And I have another shot at the world title. I'm still number one in the divisions, so I'm lucky. But I think it's. All the doctors will say something, but it's just not true. You can do anything, you know?

[Joe Rogan]

Well, Goggins is a perfect example of that, and I guess so are you. It's like the idea that you can't do something is based on when most people quit.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Pain is a. Interesting thing to try and master. You know, it's. It's information, and you have to be able live with it and work with it. But it's, It's. It's good. It's good to have this pain because it's kind of a guide on where you need to get better, you know, the tendons and the tendinous structures of the elbow are super, super taxed in arm wrestling. And the process of rehabilitation and development of these structures under great duress and trauma is difficult. And it requires a lot of time and monotony, which a lot of people aren't willing to put in.

[Joe Rogan]

I'm shocked at how much time grip training takes. Yeah, it takes forever. I've been trying to jack my. Those grip strength things. The strongest I ever got to is 164. And I'm like, I want to get to 200. I feel like in my lifetime, I can get to 200. I can't get past 164. And the thing is, like, I keep lifting weights with my arms. I keep. And I've always tired, so, like, every time I squeeze that thing, my hands are always sore. So I'm like, I got to take some time off to see if I can get it stronger. And so I'm doing all these wrist curls, and I've got the forearm finisher from Golden Grip, and I've got these big fat things that I use for. For cables to rotate wrists. And my hands got bigger. I'm definitely stronger, but it's like, I don't know when to lay off of it, when to put like how many days a week do you do grip training?

[Devin Larratt]

What's your guess?

[Joe Rogan]

Every day?

[Devin Larratt]

Of course.

[Joe Rogan]

Every day?

[Devin Larratt]

Every day.

[Joe Rogan]

And is that the way to do it? Is that the smart way to do it? Because I know you talk to a lot of those rock climber guys and they have the craziest grip strength.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. One of the things that I'll just say right away is a lot of people associate grip with arm wrestling and 100%, it's, it's of massive importance. But the real technical nuance of the sport is to try and make the other person hold on to you. Right. So it's not necessarily grip is more like defense and added offense. But the first step is to try and tax the other person's grip. But how do you do that? I think that everything there's, we are opening up like technical arm wrestling. Okay, open it up, let's go. Okay. So I think from my position, the opening move in arm wrestling is a concept called rising, like you know the movie over the top. Okay. This is the opening step of the sport and what it is, is basically an attempt to get a better grip. And if I can, the concept of making the other opponent hold on to you, that's the first step in technical supremacy. Okay. If you can make the other person hold on to you, if you can touch their fingers, if you can get their fingers activated and they're holding onto you, that's, they're less efficient.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. So it's about attacking weakness more than it is about going where you're strong.

[Joe Rogan]

So they're the most efficient when it's palm to palm and everything's gripped nice and tight. As soon as you get like out

[Devin Larratt]

here, you want the pressure interaction to be unfair to your advantage.

[Joe Rogan]

Right?

[Devin Larratt]

Right. Like if, if we were to arm wrestle, you would want to put the pressure in my fingertips like with like almost like a hammer type motion. Right. So you're basically. It's almost like a curl, it's, it's more complicated. But that' the first way to start to think about it. Like people think about arm wrestling, they think about pinning each other.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Devin Larratt]

And this is, this is a very short sighted way to think about the sport. You, you think about pulling the match close to you. This, this concept of rising is this upwards spinning, slipping motion where the end result is you have a better grip and anything that they try and do, it's going to go through the weakest system they have, which is their fingertips. Yeah. So it is great to have an awesome grip. Really.

[Joe Rogan]

It's not everything.

[Devin Larratt]

So like proportionately in my workload, if I was doing 21 sets. 21. Or I think I do 21 working sets. Typically in my workouts, one of them is dedicated purely to grip.

[Joe Rogan]

Every day.

[Devin Larratt]

All day.

[Joe Rogan]

All day. So you just do them throughout the day.

[Devin Larratt]

I lead a very simple life at the moment.

[Joe Rogan]

So structure it. Like, how do you do it?

[Devin Larratt]

My structure right now, and I think that I'm probably one of the most dedicated arm wrestlers in the world in time, in terms of like what I do with my life and how much energy I give the sport is I base it off of a week. Okay. So I train with the club probably twice a week. This changes. But typically I'm going twice a week and these are my hardest days. And I go in there and I just completely redline and max out in the sport. Okay. All the. Exactly what I got to do, I'm doing at my highest, highest capacity. I have my family, we're all wrestlers. So my kid, I mean, he's a pro too. Wow. Yeah, he's competing this weekend.

[Joe Rogan]

That's crazy.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, it's crazy. So we like, we have our own thing where we'll hit a. Like we'll train together. But really two hard sessions a week and then whatever. I fit in with my kids and then the rest of the days are like, like mindless. Not just the monotony level is extreme. My wife and I, I'm retired, right. So I have nothing but time and I try to make, I just try and put everything into it. So like it's all day, man. It's all day. I wake up and I'm training like all day.

[Joe Rogan]

So these machines, like this is some of the shit that you have now. Is this a machine that's specifically designed for arm wrestling? Did this exist or did you, did you create this?

[Devin Larratt]

This actually machine is handed down for me from the best female arm wrestler ever to exist. Leanne Dufresne. Johnny Roberts. So this is like a very standard arm wrestling equipment. It's basically an arm wrestling table with a cable system. And this is super old. Okay, this, this table you're looking at here, that's like 40 year old table. And it's, it's still working. But yeah, you can buy pulley system on a table and that's really like. This is basically all I do. I work on, off of a table. Different angles, different pressures that all just replicate the pressures in arm wrestling.

[Joe Rogan]

So you have a fat grip, looks like a PVC tube. And then you're using that to work your fingertips and roll your wrists and just get to be really strong at that position where you're turning someone's wrist over.

[Devin Larratt]

We call that a multi spinner. And what's interesting about it is, you see, it's a single point attachment.

[Joe Rogan]

Mm.

[Devin Larratt]

So it's a little bit like Swiss ball for the wrist. So it's. It's Swiss ball, you know, like a Swiss ball. Like, people do, like, squats on them. Like the ball in the gym, people do like.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, like a Bosu ball. Is that what it's called?

[Devin Larratt]

Bosu is like a half, right?

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, is that what it is?

[Devin Larratt]

Swiss ball is like just the big round balls that.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. And you see people.

[Joe Rogan]

Yoga ball, whatever they call them.

[Devin Larratt]

Right. You ever jumped on a Swiss ball and done squats or anything?

[Joe Rogan]

No. Okay, well, I have the half one.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

I do stuff on.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Swiss ball is way more unstable. So it's a similar concept where it's. It's very unstable through the wrist. And there's different wraps, but there's, like, a few base moves in arm wrestling, probably top rolling, hooking and pressing, and

[Joe Rogan]

you just do shit like this all day, all day.

[Devin Larratt]

And this is in my taper. Okay. I know, it's crazy. That's the hardest part.

[Joe Rogan]

This is in your what room?

[Devin Larratt]

This is in my basement.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, your basement.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. And what you see here, this was actually my final workout before I pulled the Russian champion, Vitaly Letin, like, six, seven weeks ago. So I've tapered normally all these movements. You see, I'm doing, like a hundred repetitions, so lots of blood flow.

[Joe Rogan]

And when you're doing 100 repetitions, like, what, 50% max weight? What do you weigh?

[Devin Larratt]

Nothing.

[Joe Rogan]

Nothing. Like 20 pounds, something like.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Really?

[Joe Rogan]

Is that the key?

[Devin Larratt]

I'm a bit. I experiment a lot. Okay. I've done so many different systems, but this is what I've come up with that I think is best. So basically, it all revolves around these arm wrestling practice days where it's 100%. This is what I want my body to maximize about. But the off days, the Tuesday, the Wednesday, it's all day just doing blood flow, just increasing the amount of blood that flows through the fascia, flows through these chains in arm wrestling motions. And the hundred is. All I'm trying to do is increase my circulation, especially through my connective structures. And movement is so essential.

[Joe Rogan]

Why that over? Why is that more beneficial than, like, hard strength training? Like small reps, like low numbers of

[Devin Larratt]

reps, but high weight, so super debatable. Okay. And I've done all of it. What I've found is, in my opinion, you only have so much energy, and this is something we gotta really weigh in. Because if I could just smash, you know, heavy stuff all the time and take steps forward, I'd do it. But I found that you don't want to detract from the thing that you're really, really trying to do. So anything that takes away from your ability to do that, I think you should look at cutting. The best part of my training is on the table, so anything that kind of messes with that, I don't want to do it. I've done a lot of systems where I'm lifting heavy, but the thing is, they take energy, they take resources, and what I really want to do is prepare my body so I can do that specific task as good as possible. The, the high rep training heals me. It heals me. A lot of people are like, oh, that's a lot of work. And I'm like, it's really not. It's just. It's a form of healing almost. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Interesting.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Just the blood flow and the consistent movement and high repetitions.

[Devin Larratt]

Yes. It's. This is highly debated. Okay. But I'm proving it over and over over the years. I, I started doing because arm wrestling is a strength sport, no doubt about it. So right away, people think, oh, you know, heavy weight and, you know, high reps is dangerous because you're going to become an endurance guy and it's, it's going to make you weaker. But when you go low, your, your work volume is tremendous. Okay. If you're doing light lightweight all day long, I mean, the amount of total weight that you're lifting becomes astronomical. And I think that that adaptation over long periods is wonderful. And you can't get the blood flow through the connective structures without movement. So this is, this is really why I do it. The healing aspects, the overall metabolic conditioning that you get. Yeah. And the taper is a big part of it as well, you know, but, yeah, I'm doing all my heavy lifting specifically in the sport. I'm not doing my heavy lifting at this time in my career. And Also, Joe, I'm 51 and I'm plagued with injuries, so I have to be very specific. I have to be very precise. Yeah, this is the best formula I've come up with.

[Joe Rogan]

And when you were younger, did you approach it differently?

[Devin Larratt]

I have made so many mistakes.

[Joe Rogan]

What was the initial approach? Just lift as heavy as you can.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, lift as heavy as I Can.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, you're a giant dude already, right? So you already naturally have like big bones, big genetics. So did you power lift? Like, what did you, what'd you do?

[Devin Larratt]

Initially, I was a judo guy, I was a basketball guy, I was a military guy. So I did a lot of different stuff. I was very cross trained. I even, I even did Iron man for a bit.

[Joe Rogan]

But it's gotta be so hard for you.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

All that weight.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. So I would. When I say Ironman, apologies. Not traditional military ironman.

[Joe Rogan]

So what's the difference?

[Devin Larratt]

Military ironman, you're doing it with a backpack, you're portaging a canoe, you're paddling, you're running with a backpack. So that race, you know, a winning time is, you know, probably anything under six hours, like five and a half to six hours. So it's long duration, but it's slightly heavier. So I'm still big even for that. Like most champions, most guys who win the Ironman are, you know, average size or even smaller. But yeah, the size. I mean, I'm a bigger person. But yeah, I did a lot of different sports, but I've always loved arm wrestling. It's always been the one I've come back to. It's, you know, what is it about it? I think that there's a lot of things about it. You know, for me personally, it was my first sport. Like, I started arm wrestling with my grandmother when I was like 4 years old.

[Joe Rogan]

With your grandmother?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah. Really? Never underestimate the power of a grandmother. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was a rowdy little kid and, you know, in a. In a. With a German mother who didn't let me do too much crazy stuff around the house. And my grandmother used to come over and it was a reward system. She'd tell me to do chores and the result was I got to arm wrestle with her. Yeah, I never beat.

[Joe Rogan]

That's crazy.

[Devin Larratt]

I never beat her. It's funny. Her name was Lavon and the current super heavyweight world champion is Levan. So I've never beat either of them. Yeah, it's a bit trippy. Yeah. So I started young. I love arm wrestling because it's a very safe fight. Okay. Like, I love fighting. Everything in my life has been about fighting. And arm wrestling is one of those fight sports that has super low cost. Like we don't punch each other in the head. I'll be able to walk, nothing on my spine, my elbows don't straighten, you know, so it's low cost. You can do it your whole life. Like we have We've had world champions in the open division who are almost 70.

[Joe Rogan]

What?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

What?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. That's cool, right?

[Joe Rogan]

That's incredible.

[Devin Larratt]

I love it.

[Joe Rogan]

How's that possible?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, the hand is weird. Like this thing here is designed for volume and it just slowly builds. You know, the hand is the structure. It has so much connective tissues in it, so much tendon, and that just. It takes so long to build. You know, age is an advantage in a lot of ways because you just have more time to get further in arm wrestling. Yeah, I'm 51, I'm telling you. I probably competed at the highest level and I believe I can still go further. It's non typical, you know, it's non typical. And the thing that I love most about it the very most is the family and the bonds. Arm wrestling clubs are special places. It's very blue collar, open doors, man. There's. There's not a lot of money associated with the sport in terms of membership fees. I'm wrestling in each other's garages and houses and. And it breeds a very tight family. Like, I consider the club that I train with, like, they're my family. Like, so that's my. I mean, that's what sports all about, you know? Yeah, yeah. And arm wrestling is very conducive to that.

[Joe Rogan]

So when you say it's non typical that you could compete at this level at this age. What, What? How old are like most of the top guys?

[Devin Larratt]

I'd say that you hit your probably peak typically when you are low 30s. So very standard, you know. That's my buddy, Pork Chop. Oh, there's Crazy George. This is the guy. Okay, so this guy, which one's Crazy George? The dude who's down there, not the guy in the green shirt. So these are both my good buddies.

[Joe Rogan]

And this is the guy who can't straighten his arms out.

[Devin Larratt]

He can't. No, he's super locked up. Okay. But. So he's doing this move called a king's move or outside top roll. And you see Pork Chops wrist is bent back. I love Porky. I train with Porky twice a week. But yeah, Crazy George. And Crazy George is like 160 pounds. And. Yeah, and Porky's like 230. Completely. Tremendously jacked and strong. Yeah. And Pork Chop is like a professional arm wrestler pulling at east versus West. Okay. That's our highest league. And Crazy George is. Yeah, he's.

[Joe Rogan]

That's incredible.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, it's completely incredible. Yeah. As another guy from our club, Matt Smith, against Crazy George, I Think Matt actually may have beaten him here. This is actually the time period of Crazy George's downfall.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay, so how old is Crazy George in this film?

[Devin Larratt]

He'd probably be late 60s here. Okay.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, he's an absolute legend to me in the sport, like, technically. So this guy, he spent the first, like 20 years in the sport. Two up, two down. Okay. Go to tournament. Double elimination. He's. And that's the Canadian champ. These guys are all champions that you see him arm wrestling with. And he invented. Basically, he didn't invent it, but there were very few people doing this style of arm wrestling, okay. We call it an outside toproll or a king's move. And he really figured it out and very difficult, Very difficult to deal with.

[Joe Rogan]

And what is he doing? He's dropping down and lowering his body weight.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. So there's many kind of main strengths in arm wrestling, okay? There's rising strength, there's pronational strength, there's cupping strength and this pronational. You see this? Like, this is like my favorite example.

[Joe Rogan]

Jesus Christ. Look at that thing. That's so weird. Yeah, show that, show that. Look at that. Who the fuck has that muscle?

[Devin Larratt]

Armrest. That muscle's so weird, right? So that I don't even think I have that.

[Joe Rogan]

Where is that?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, that's right. That's nuts, right?

[Joe Rogan]

That's. Mine is non existent. I was going to interrupt.

[Devin Larratt]

I saw it on this thumbnail and I was going to say, what is that? Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

I couldn't figure it out. That's fucking crazy.

[Devin Larratt]

It's one of my dreams to have bodybuilders when they're, you know, ifbb. Just to be doing pronator poses One day. One. It's the one you gotta first turn. Turn your thumb down like that. Yeah. And pop your wrist back. There it is.

[Joe Rogan]

See it there?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, There you go. That's the one. That's the one. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Little ass muscle. That's gigantic.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, like, different styles in arm wrestling, okay. Like, they have different roots. Okay. And the king's move, toprolling in general, outside toprolling is super dependent on pronation. So it's all this twisting. Yeah, twisting, yeah. It's weaponized, right? We get really strong and there's a relationship between all the angles in the hand. The hand is very complex, right? All sorts of stuff it can do. And the main two drivers, cupping. We call it flexion and pronation. And these two interact. So when one pronates, it attacks the other one's cup. So there's a relationship between them. So crazy. George is like the master of pronational styles. King's move is pronation style. I, over the course of my career, changed techniques, changed techniques changed. Probably my best technique is an open top roll or a king's move now. Yeah. And I learned a lot. It's like the guy that. One of my first coaches, guy called Troy Eaton. He. He could never be George. He couldn't beat George. We tried, we tried. We tried for years to figure him out. So. And that was back when I was like 20. Right. So I've been. I've been studying this style for 30 years. And yeah, it's a combination of locks and giveaways and balancing arm wrestling. Things happen really quickly, Very, very quickly. But it's a balancing act of all these different strengths.

[Joe Rogan]

So what is it about you that's able to keep competing at a very high level into your 50s, I think. Is it this approach where you're just doing all these reps all day long? Do you think that's a big part of it?

[Devin Larratt]

Huge, huge, huge part of it.

[Joe Rogan]

Because you're constantly forcing your muscles to work, you're constantly getting blood flow and you're not losing any strength.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. As you get older, it's a huge part of it. Yeah. The, the. My. My work volume probably exceeds most people in, in the sport with that. So metabolically and from a health perspective, it keeps my tendons and ligaments really functional. And, you know, I'm. I'm just. I'm just a very simple and obsessed person and I just. I arm wrestle at every opportunity.

[Joe Rogan]

Don't you also have some very freaky genetics? Like didn't Ryan.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

What is his last name?

[Devin Larratt]

Rosner Rostner. This guy's the best.

[Joe Rogan]

Very interesting guy.

[Devin Larratt]

Smartest person I know.

[Joe Rogan]

Geneticist. And he was explaining to me how unusual your genes are.

[Devin Larratt]

We all have unusual genes.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, but you have really unusual genes.

[Devin Larratt]

Well, that topic is so big, you know, the genetic piece. I think that. What a massive piece going forward for our species. You know, the mastery of genetics. It's right at the top, I think, of our highest priorities.

[Joe Rogan]

You know, there was a thing that they were talking about last night in the green room. See if you could find this. They think they might have figured out a way to end down syndrome. They think they might have figured out a way with genetic engineering, with CRISPR or whatever. They're using whatever modalities they're using to end down syndrome.

[Devin Larratt]

Sure.

[Joe Rogan]

Which is wild.

[Devin Larratt]

I think that there's so many answers with genetics. You Know, from, I personally believe that and you know, this is a big topic with freedom and everything like that, but I, I really believe that when you're born, you should be swabbed and it should accompany your health, you know, card or whatever. And just as a information, you know, there's so much.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, it probably will be in the future as these, all these techniques and all this new stuff comes out. CRISPR takes a bold leap towards silencing down syndrome's extra chromosome. Wow. So scientists have taken an important step towards a gene therapy that could one day turn off the genetic material that causes down syndrome. Down syndrome is a genetic condition caused by an extra chromosome 21, and consequently hundreds of triplicate genes that lead to developmental and neurological issues. According to Washington based National down Syndrome Society, one in every 640 babies in the United States is born with down syndrome. That makes it the most common chromosomal condition. So there, so what is it doing here? Okay, so Beth Israel Deaconess Medical center and Harvard Medical School found a way to silence much of the extra chromosomes activity in the cell at once. Details of their research are published in a paper in the journal Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences. Wow. So what is weird about your genes though? Ryan told me, but I don't remember. He was, he goes, you got to talk to him.

[Devin Larratt]

Well, Ryan's actually got to talk to. I mean, I'm a high school educated guy and I, I've been down to Austin several times to hang out with Ryan. I absorb everything I can from this guy. But I think that my genetics, I think I'm predisposed to endurance, actually.

[Joe Rogan]

Endurance.

[Devin Larratt]

I think so. I think if you take an overall look at my genetics, I think I have a lot of, you know, favorable mutations that are, you know, predispose me to, to good. But it's weird. I don't know, man. Listen to the genetic side of things. I'll sound silly if I try and talk too much about it. I'll just tell you that there are, there are favorable genetics for sure. You know, there's favorable mutations and it's amazing, you know, if you could capture all of them from everybody and, you know, put it together and you never know what you get.

[Joe Rogan]

Brian Shaw.

[Devin Larratt]

We've scanned Brian. Yeah, that's the thing. So this, this, this project that Ryan is doing and I like to help him out a little bit, we've been, we've been looking at elite performers and with the goal to find favorable mutations and yeah, we scanned Brian.

[Joe Rogan]

He's in the Bible that guy's in the Bible. He's like David and Goliath. They're real people out there like that.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah. Brian's.

[Joe Rogan]

So his genetics are one out of every 500 million people. Isn't it something crazy along those lines?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, he's completely. He's right at the peak of human performance. Right. From a genetic standpoint, just freakish.

[Joe Rogan]

Freakish bone density? Yeah, everything.

[Devin Larratt]

Everything. And it's not just his bone density. The dude's mindset. Like, there's many pieces of Brian's genetics that. That make him a champion, but yeah, he has some stuff in him that. That Ryan's never seen. Yeah, no, nobody. No, he had. And I probably shouldn't be speaking about other people's medical stuff, but I love Brian and he can sue me if he wants. Nobody has his growth hormone. He has a different type of growth hormone.

[Joe Rogan]

What do you mean?

[Devin Larratt]

I don't think it's the same.

[Joe Rogan]

What?

[Devin Larratt]

I don't think he has. We're opening something so cool because you talked about the down syndrome and there's some very interesting stuff with that, but, yeah, Brian. I don't believe that. Brian's growth hormone is the same as yours and mine.

[Joe Rogan]

What does that mean?

[Devin Larratt]

It might be molecularly different or it might have. You're gonna have to talk to Ryan.

[Joe Rogan]

But growth hormone is different. He said different kind of growth hormone.

[Devin Larratt]

He has a mutation in his growth hormone.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, that makes sense.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, it does.

[Joe Rogan]

I mean, he's almost seven feet tall and he's £400.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. And he. And he doesn't stop. He doesn't stop. But it's weird. The. The whole, like, down syndrome thing. They can do stop codes. Like some genes, like some mutations that you get. From what I understand, there's like a stop code on a gene. So whatever your gene is, when the, I guess MRI lands on it and starts to do its thing, like there can be a stop code or something that just stops that gene from expressing. And I think that that's likely what they. They do with that. They'd somehow insert a stop code. But I mean, there's people out there who have, like, world records, like, for things like deadlift that don't have fast twitch muscle according to their genetics. So it's really weird.

[Joe Rogan]

What do you mean? They don't have faster.

[Devin Larratt]

Like they have a stop code on their fast twitch genetics just naturally doesn't make any sense at all.

[Joe Rogan]

They're just born weird.

[Devin Larratt]

Born super weird. Yet they're capable of beating world records on the deadlift.

[Joe Rogan]

So wouldn't you think that deadlift is a fast twitch thing?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

So I don't understand.

[Devin Larratt]

I don't either. It's an amazing field. Genetics is an amazing field.

[Joe Rogan]

Is that a lack of understanding of what fast twitch do, or is it they can compensate with the other muscles in some way?

[Devin Larratt]

I don't think it's other muscles because I think that it would probably apply to all the musculature. So there's something that we don't understand. There's something weird going on. Eddie. You can sue me. Eddie Hall. I love you. I love you. Eddie's got a stop code in his genesis on fast twitch muscle. Makes no sense.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, that doesn't make any sense.

[Devin Larratt]

Makes no sense.

[Joe Rogan]

He moves so fast.

[Devin Larratt]

I know.

[Joe Rogan]

And he hits so hard. That's crazy.

[Devin Larratt]

It's crazy.

[Joe Rogan]

How is that possible? I've seen that guy hit mitts.

[Devin Larratt]

And you're like, I know, right? I know.

[Joe Rogan]

Is this what the.

[Devin Larratt]

The Hercules? No, not that. No, Something else.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay. Oh, that's myostatin. That's myostatin inhibitors.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

So it regulates the production of myostatin, a protein that stops muscles from growing too large. So with myostatin inhibitors, they done that with. I'm sure you've seen those whippets.

[Devin Larratt]

Yes, of course.

[Joe Rogan]

So whippets are a weird dog. It's a very skinny, fast dog. And some whippets are born with this genetic mutation that's a myostatin inhibitor. And they look like the Hulk. It's the crate. Show an image of that, please. It is the craziest. That doesn't look like a real dog.

[Devin Larratt]

Right?

[Joe Rogan]

That doesn't look like a real dog. That's a crazy bodybuilder dog. Because if you see a regular whippet. Show me a regular whippet now, please. Yeah, regular whippets. That's a. Yeah, regular whippet. Like a real fast, almost like a greyhound looking dog. And then you see the ones with the myostatin inhibitor gene, and you're like, what the hell is going on? They look like. Like the most freakish bodybuilder of all time, but in a dog form. And some humans have that Belgian blues also.

[Devin Larratt]

The Belgian. The cows.

[Joe Rogan]

Yes. Yeah.

[Devin Larratt]

And they have it too.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Devin Larratt]

So they offer already genetic therapy that gives you Follistatin. So there's a balance between Follistatin and myostatin, from what I understand. Like, the key that turns on the cell for growth is Follistatin. And myostatin tells the cell to stop growing. You're big enough Important, Very important.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Devin Larratt]

And so if you don't have Myostatin, all that that turnkey gets is Follistatin. So the only thing signal that you're ever getting with a myostatin deficiency is Follistatin. And so. Yeah, so they offer a genetic therapy that increases your Follestatin.

[Joe Rogan]

They offer it to who?

[Devin Larratt]

Anybody. Anybody ready to get jacked. Anybody with enough money. I'm just. Yeah, yeah. There's a bunch of genetic therapies that they've already created. Follistatin is one of them.

[Joe Rogan]

And so that would be for power lifters or football players or someone who just wanted to get fucking huge.

[Devin Larratt]

I think initially it was created for longevity because as you age, your Follistatin drops. And that's why people get smaller, they shrink as they get older. And Follistatin just helps you maintain muscle mass. Yes. So I think it's mostly promote it as an anti aging remedy, but. Absolutely. Like you want to get your performance up. Yeah. Increase it.

[Joe Rogan]

They're doing so many wild things now. They've got this new therapy now for people with disc degeneration. I'm sure you have it. I have it. A lot of people have it. Especially anybody who does Jiu Jitsu has it. Your discs just get worn out from getting cranked on and like heavy lifters always have it. Lower back issues. The disc is the soft cushion in between the spinal columns and those, those big bones push down that disc and over time and all that compression, it squashes. But now they've got stuff that they can inject into the disc that inflates the discs.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

And so all these people that have been getting artificial discs and fusions and all the problems that come with that, because there's massive problems, they're going to be able to eliminate that, which is amazing.

[Devin Larratt]

Super cool.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, so super cool. And I tell everybody, if you could avoid back surgery, please avoid back surgery. Don't fucking do it. There's a lot of different ways. Like I always tell everybody, and I'll tell everybody again. Louis Simmons, his invention, that, that invention, the reverse hyper.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Incredible. One of the greatest invention ever for people with lower back problems. I have one here in the studio. I have one at my house. I swear by that machine. It's so good. It decompresses the spine on the, on the decel and on the uplift. When you're lifting up the weights, it strengthens the muscles out. It's like a perfect exercise for lower back issues.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah. It's wild when we look at the future in terms of performance and how far the age is being pushed. Like we see Crazy George. But I think I'm optimistic that all the ages are just going to be pushed and pushed until you probably maybe not going to be a champion until you're 60.

[Joe Rogan]

That's crazy, right? That's crazy. Well, that's for arm wrestling. Well, I wonder what's going to happen with. Well, the thing is with regular sports, the stuff that's pushing this stuff is performance enhancing drugs, you know, peptides, stem cells. Not really, that's not really performance enhancing drug, but for injuries, but testosterone, all these different steroids, all these different things. The thing about like combat sports in particular is that you can't use those things. They're not allowed. But when you can use them, you see these older athletes that have the mind of an older athlete, but the body that works like a young guy.

[Devin Larratt]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

My favorite example, that is Vitor Belfort when he was in his prime.

[Devin Larratt]

TRT Belfort. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

TRT Vitor was the scariest guy ever.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Because he was jacked up with testosterone. But he was also 37 years old with a lifetime of combat sport experience, lifetime intelligence, but hadn't lost any speed and lost any strength and in fact had like superhuman speed and strength because he was juicy. Super juicy.

[Devin Larratt]

But.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, but it makes you think like, man, what would the sport look like if that was open to everybody?

[Devin Larratt]

Right, yeah. Interesting.

[Joe Rogan]

It is interesting because there's a lot of guys that want to keep competing, but their body just doesn't respond the way it used to, to training. Because they're 37 or 38 or 39 or. Yeah, but if you could get them on the sauce.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, right. Where's the limit?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, right. And why not let them?

[Devin Larratt]

Absolutely, why not? You know, I, I'm a big believer in tested sport. You know, I think that that's. And I think that that'll never go away. And I think it's important. But I'm also a believer in open up the gates and let everybody play.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, that's why I really love this whole idea of doing the enhanced games. It didn't really pan out the way everybody hoped. Nobody really won any records other than the one guy in the swimming, but he wore a prohibited suit. That lets you swim quicker, apparently. I don't understand swimming, but I was hoping like you're going to see some freakish superhuman performances. But I feel like if that's going to happen, that's going to take years. I don't think you would get the kind of gains that these people are hoping to get to achieve, like world record super freak human performance. Unless you're doing that stuff for a lot. Like, you know as well as anybody that training takes forever. Takes to build strength, to build speed, to build endurance. Takes a long ass time. I think you're going to get strength in three months. Like, you get a little stronger for sure, but you're not going to get freakish strength for fucking years. It takes years.

[Devin Larratt]

Years, Decades.

[Joe Rogan]

Like Gigi Moofu. Like, how long has that guy been lifting weights? That guy's a fucking freak.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You can't build this stuff overnight.

[Joe Rogan]

And I bet he would melt a piss cup.

[Devin Larratt]

Listen, I think.

[Joe Rogan]

Not a chance.

[Devin Larratt]

Gigi, Gigi, look at so many. Look at myself included, you know, I care about performance. This is, this is what, what I care about. And so many people fall into the same boat.

[Joe Rogan]

Look at that guy. Damn chance of hell. That dude's natural, you know, I'll tell you, Juji is probably amazing though, that he can do that. That kind of flexibility with that kind of mass is. Look at that. While overhead pressing a full side squat or side split. That's nuts on chairs. Jean Claude Van Damme style.

[Devin Larratt]

Judy started out tricking. Okay. Like, it's a form.

[Joe Rogan]

That sounds like.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah. So. So he actually started off, sounds like

[Joe Rogan]

he's picking up guys.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. No, no, juju is super cool. It's like flipping.

[Joe Rogan]

He was on America's Got Talent.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. It's like a form of like acrobatics or gymnastics, right? Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, I've seen him do acrobatic stuff and it's really nuts.

[Devin Larratt]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

Like his physical ability, like it defies what you expect from a guy with that kind of mass.

[Devin Larratt]

Right. Yeah. So he's a combined like almost gymnast and bodybuilder and he's probably better now than ever. And he's. I mean, I think juji's in his 40s. Wow. Yeah. And yeah, he's massive and healthy and, you know, absolutely kicking ass. Probably the most positive human being that I've met.

[Joe Rogan]

He seems super positive in his YouTube videos.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

And we have snorted his fucking smells like it's strong. He's got the best stuff.

[Devin Larratt]

He does.

[Joe Rogan]

We've snorted his stuff about a hundred times on this show.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Actually, look at him doing flips.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

That's crazy that a guy with that kind of mass can move like that.

[Devin Larratt]

Juji is actually the inspiration for this modern, this, this latest way that I'm training. It was actually really? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Juji came up to my place probably about a year and a half ago and we were just redlining in our two hand work. Okay. And it was so good.

[Joe Rogan]

Two hand work.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. So. Okay. So I would be considered like the senior guy in my club. Okay.

[Joe Rogan]

So.

[Devin Larratt]

And we have this kind of rule in the, in the club just to make things work properly. Senior holds, junior works. Okay. So the senior is kind of staying with you, floating with you, and the junior is able to control their intensity. So the guy who would normally win the match doesn't win.

[Joe Rogan]

You're just holding him in place. Okay. Right. Like defense work in Jiu jitsu.

[Devin Larratt]

Exactly. Okay. But just to help out, that guy typically will do two arm work. Okay. To kind of flip the script for him so somebody can hold like me with two arms and kind of let me get to redline.

[Joe Rogan]

Mm.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. So Juji and I were doing that like a year and a half ago and it was so good and it was so much fun. I was like, what am I doing? You know, having anything kind of cut into this. And that's when I stopped doing heavy lifting. It was, it was as a result of training with Juji.

[Joe Rogan]

So this two arm work of just holding and just work on that you feel is more important than all the lifting and all the other stuff. Yeah, because it's sport specific.

[Devin Larratt]

Exactly.

[Joe Rogan]

And does he arm wrestle?

[Devin Larratt]

He does a little bit. Juju does everything.

[Joe Rogan]

But why did working with him make you train differently?

[Devin Larratt]

Juju's a special guy. I think that just you don't have to be the best in your field if you have a certain energy or certain thing with you. Juju is a wonderful, creative, hard working guy. And when you get a chance to train with him, it doesn't matter that his skill level, it's just his level of energy is so good that when we work together, it helps me. I don't know, I don't know how it happened, but he unlocked this understanding of the priority of that training for me. I've always done it, but never.

[Joe Rogan]

How did he unlock it? I'm not getting it.

[Devin Larratt]

I think that our training session. Okay, so what happened was Juji came over and I normally on days that I do table work, I do not hit the gym. Okay. Because I don't want anything to kind of impact my, my, my table work. And because I only had a day with Juji, I wanted to show him how I was training. And at the time I was training very heavy. I was training very heavy. So we did this circuit I showed him all my latest exercises that I was prioritizing. And then we went to the club that night and we had this awesome two arm work. But I felt as though, you know, the singles and everything that I'd done earlier in the day had a slight effect and I was like, I can't ever let that happen again. I, I need to put, make sure I put all my energy into this table, table training. And it's funny, you know, being 51 and having over 30 years competitively in the sport, I still feel like I learn, you know, I still feel like I change things from, from event to event.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, well, that's a sign you're doing something fun.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, right.

[Joe Rogan]

That's the key. Continue to get better at it and continue to grow at it.

[Devin Larratt]

Key to life.

[Joe Rogan]

So just the one training session with him changed your perspective on that because you just weren't performing as well.

[Devin Larratt]

That was a tipping point. That was a tipping point for me. So I generally have a protocol, like a training kind of balance, a recipe that I'm going to follow pretty much from event to event.

[Joe Rogan]

And this is all made by you?

[Devin Larratt]

It's made by me. And I watch everything. You know, I love arm wrestling, but I'm looking at sports. I'm always trying to get better. So yeah, it's my protocol that I come up with and then I'll tweak it based off of my results. Okay. So if I'm doing good, not much changes. If I don't do as good as I think I should do or there's like something, I'll tweak it from event to event and. Yeah, and that night was the night that I decided I need to get rid of heavy weights because this is so good, this training is so good when done properly. And that's the key. When done properly, like two armies work can suck. Like if you do two arm work wrong, it can hurt you, it can set you back. But when done properly, it's the best training that there can be.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, specifically super specific. And do you do stuff that's not specific for arm wrestling, just for overall body strength? Like, do you feel like there's a balance to be achieved?

[Devin Larratt]

This is the greatest criticism that I always receive as an athlete is because

[Joe Rogan]

I don't really just arm wrestling stuff.

[Devin Larratt]

I go for walks.

[Joe Rogan]

That's it.

[Devin Larratt]

I'm terrible, really.

[Joe Rogan]

No lunges, no legs.

[Devin Larratt]

I'm trying a little bit to work it back in in some minimal way. But it's interesting, you know, cross training versus specialization. I have a Long background in very broad training. Okay. Like, I once upon a time was a fit human being in many aspects, but. But I really care about being a champ, you know? And I could probably be a healthier guy and be able to run and squat and deadlift, or I can be a little bit of a cripple and be pulling for world title shots is the way I kind of look at it. And I chose that. Wow, I should do more squats.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, my only thought would be that if you conditioned and strengthened your overall body, it would just help your overall strength. I mean, that is the thought about deadlifting and squatting is that it helps everything because your whole body just becomes stronger, and it would just not, like, naturally, like, your base, everything, your core, everything would just be much more. Your foundation would be stronger. I hear you, but I don't know. I'm not. Obviously, I'm not an arm wrestler.

[Devin Larratt]

I don't know either. Okay. Everything I'm playing with, everything. This is constantly what pretty much every reasonable person tells me. And I just am like. I get to a point where I do my arm wrestling work, and I'm like, okay, here I am. If I want to beat Levan, what do I do from here? And I just am like, more wrist curls. You know, what does he do? He's a bit more balanced than me. Lavan lifts super heavy weights. Like, stupid.

[Joe Rogan]

What does this dude look like? Show me Levan. What is his last name?

[Devin Larratt]

Saginashville.

[Joe Rogan]

Whoa.

[Devin Larratt]

This is the pinnacle of our sport. Okay, this is the guy.

[Joe Rogan]

How big is this dude?

[Devin Larratt]

He gets about 420. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, my God.

[Devin Larratt]

I love this guy.

[Joe Rogan]

Look at the size of this.

[Devin Larratt]

This. This is holy.

[Joe Rogan]

That can't be real. Is that AI? Is that picture AI? No, that one right there.

[Devin Larratt]

Okay. That's real.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, my. This is real.

[Devin Larratt]

This is real.

[Joe Rogan]

I don't know, Jamie. That might be real. He might just be pumped.

[Devin Larratt]

Levan is the pinnacle. Okay. We scanned him, too, and surprise, he's a weirdo also.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, yeah.

[Devin Larratt]

Duh. Yeah. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Look at the size of that motherfucker.

[Devin Larratt]

He's in Little Rock in two days.

[Joe Rogan]

In Little Rock, Arkansas?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Where does he live right now?

[Devin Larratt]

Georgia.

[Joe Rogan]

Georgia, the country.

[Devin Larratt]

There's so many weirdos that come from Georgia.

[Joe Rogan]

Really? Yeah.

[Devin Larratt]

Proportionately, their strength is not normal. Levan is. He hasn't. Nobody has beat this guy since 2017. He is absolutely, absolutely flattened the field. Okay.

[Joe Rogan]

Like, he's so hairy, too. Oh, he looks like a primitive man. He looks like a science project. Look at the fucking size of that guy.

[Devin Larratt]

Oh, my God. Smart guy.

[Joe Rogan]

I bet.

[Devin Larratt]

Very cool guy. I absolutely love Levan. He has beaten the piss out of me at every opportunity.

[Joe Rogan]

But he's so big.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, he is. He is so big and he's so good. He grew up in the trenches, arm wrestling. Okay. He's not one of these guys who came in. He made his way through the world championships. Yeah. He hasn't lost in 10 years.

[Joe Rogan]

And so does he do different stuff than you do?

[Devin Larratt]

He does. A lot of the guys have different formulas. Okay. Levan does a lot of pull ups, really heavy ones, and he does a lot of really heavy curls. This is the base. But he does all the same. Like, we do all the same exercises, just different. Different formulas.

[Joe Rogan]

Now when you hear the best guy is doing things different than you.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

What keeps you from doing what he does?

[Devin Larratt]

So we are all different.

[Joe Rogan]

Right. That's what he used to look like.

[Devin Larratt]

That's crazy.

[Joe Rogan]

Shout out to steroids. Shout out. Shout out to all the scientists out there.

[Devin Larratt]

He's very young in that first photo. Of course, you know, he slowly evolved through the world championships to what he is today. Yeah. It's interesting when you see different champions and I try and learn from everybody. I watch what everybody does. I see what they're doing. You have to also consider where your body's at. Okay. I can't do the things I did when I was 25. Physically, I just can't. I have. I have, like I said, I've had surgeries.

[Joe Rogan]

But yet you can still arm wrestle.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

So obviously you're very strong in these particular areas, and it's not holding you back at all. So what is holding you back when you say injuries?

[Devin Larratt]

Well, arm wrestling is a big thing. Okay. There's several things that you can kind of choose to focus on. Probably my biggest limiting factor is my elbow because I've had multiple surgeries on it. I burn it out. Like, at the beginning of my career, I was more of a hook style arm wrestler. That's where, like, the primary kind of drive in the sport is the flexion of the wrist. And you're moving forward with your shoulder and you're kind of trying to attack the person's arm more. But over time, my elbow just got broke down to the point where, you know, I just don't have a lot of stability now. I continue to work on it, and quite honestly, my hooking now, this stability is probably pretty good. I think that we all, as athletes do the best thing we think we can. And I think that the work That I do is very precise, like the way the Lavan trains. And I. And, and please, I don't like to criticize Levan. He's the best. Okay. But egotistically and arrogantly, I'm going to say that my training is more precise than his. Okay. So I'm working on very precise angles where he's a sledgehammer at times. You know, like, I'm working on very fine angles through my wrist. You know, a lot of pronation in my style, a lot of hand control, a lot of table time. Like, I'm doing a lot of skill based training. Lavon's base movements, his. His row, his is. I mean, he's doing. He's doing 180 kilo curl, you know,

[Joe Rogan]

two hands or one hand?

[Devin Larratt]

Two. But that's a. That's crazy. But he's. The amount of weight that he's wrist curling. I'm never, I'm never gonna get that. Okay. I'm never gonna catch him there. Okay. I need to catch him through something smaller. Like I need to be able to like a pitbull, like somehow nip onto like his fingertip and not let it go.

[Joe Rogan]

Because you're never gonna be as big as him.

[Devin Larratt]

Probably not.

[Joe Rogan]

But do you think that it would benefit you at all to add size to get.

[Devin Larratt]

I try it for every single prep that I do. I'm trying in the super heavyweight division. I'm trying to get as being as strong as I can.

[Joe Rogan]

What do you weigh now?

[Devin Larratt]

Today I'm probably 265.

[Joe Rogan]

And so you're giving up a considerable amount of weight.

[Devin Larratt]

When I compete, I can get up to 300. Okay. When I'm competing and hopefully by the time I face him again, I'll be my biggest ever. I hope when I pull him, I'll be 310 or 320, you know.

[Joe Rogan]

And when you do that, what would you do to get that big? Would you add a bunch of weightlifting stuff? No, no. What would you do? Just eat.

[Devin Larratt]

Eat. Stay in my basement, you know? Yeah, yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

But he's doing all this other stuff. This is why I'm confused. Like, have you tried adding all those chin ups and all the different things that he does?

[Devin Larratt]

I am very far down the road. I'm very, very far down the road. I've been doing this for like 32 years. Competitively, I've gone through so many systems. While it is incredible to have a great row, While it is incredible to have a great wrist flexion, wow. It's incredible to have great legs. Like, I Go to tournaments sometimes and my legs are sore. But typically the reason why you win and lose the match is very small things in the hand and the wrist. Like this is typically the failure point. So I just try and put everything into the most valuable pieces that I think is actually going to determine my victory. And look at, apart from Levan. It's working. You know, this guy has raised, he's raised the sport, you know, and I continue to chase him. I continue to try and beat this dude, you know, my wife.

[Joe Rogan]

Have you gotten close?

[Devin Larratt]

The first time, the first time he tore my bicep.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, whoa.

[Devin Larratt]

You know, see that tattoo? See, it's a cat with 415. I used to call him a 415 pound pussy. You know, in the workup to the match I was teasing him and in Georgian it says Lavon was here because he ripped it. Second round. So that was the first time was a wash. The second time I pulled him, I stopped him. I stopped him. Round one.

[Joe Rogan]

What does that mean?

[Devin Larratt]

So a lot of times in arm wrestling get everything straight. Don't move, go. And to stop a match means there's no movement.

[Joe Rogan]

So no one's winning.

[Devin Larratt]

Nobody's winning.

[Joe Rogan]

And you don't just keep going to the death. Oh yeah, you do.

[Devin Larratt]

Oh yeah. 100%. Yeah. But I, I got like, if you look up the second time that I arm wrestled for round one. Yeah. Okay, so this is, this is the last time I pulled them, which is 20, 24.

[Joe Rogan]

And when you say pulled them, it means you have a match with them.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, that's right. Okay, so everything goes to the straps. And I'm telling you, like.

[Joe Rogan]

So is that what happens when the match doesn't work out and the hands slip away from each other?

[Devin Larratt]

Straps.

[Joe Rogan]

Straps. Do you guys put powder in your hands or anything?

[Devin Larratt]

Yep. Use chalk. But yeah, every, this sport is a strap based sport at this point. Like, rules are evolving in arm wrestling. It used to be. Well, in some leagues still you get a foul if there's a slip, somebody intentionally did it or it's a neutral slip. And then they go to the straps. But yeah, so we get to the straps and this first round is the closest I've gotten to him. And in this match, I think he, I think he might have ripped my spine apart. Like. Yeah, I couldn't walk properly for like four months. Really? Yeah. Yeah. Okay, so I'm top rolling. I get into his wrist and I'm just like, I'm in shock. I'm like, I can't believe. So I Kind of. I think I had the opportunity here to do a little bit more, like to seize the initiative. But I was in such shock that I got him to this point. You know, I'm just. And then here we go. His wrist is starting to go. And so that's a floppers press. And I get a foul. Okay. First, see, my shoulder goes below the table. This is called decline. Humorous. And it's a foul. You can't do that.

[Joe Rogan]

So you start from scratch when that happens.

[Devin Larratt]

Well, I'm actually on my second foul, so that's a loss because I was being too much of an idiot in the setup and they gave me a foul. And then from here on, he just runs me.

[Joe Rogan]

So it's a loss. What do you mean?

[Devin Larratt]

So in arm wrestling, if you get two fouls, it's a loss.

[Joe Rogan]

So the match is over.

[Devin Larratt]

Match is over. But see, this is best of seven. So from here he runs me over, but this is the closest I've gotten. Okay. We've practiced since then. We've gone into. I'll probably practice with him this weekend, but I'm slated to pull this monster again. It's gonna happen one more time for sure. It's what keeps me in my basement.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. One guy, this guy the size of that motherfucker.

[Devin Larratt]

He's awesome. He's a beautiful human. I love this guy. He's. He's lifting the sport in terms of performance, you know, like, he's so hard to deal with. Yeah. And that's it, man. It just gets worse. It just gets worse. But, yeah, so I can still win in like the 115 kilo division and the 105 kilo division. I think I've got those ones pretty much wrapped up. But it's the open man to be the best. Yeah. Regardless of weight.

[Joe Rogan]

That's so much weight to give up. I know, but you're giving up what, 135 pounds?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, but it's so cool to try, you know? It's so cool to try. And what he does is he cleans my life up. If it wasn't for him, I wouldn't do all this. Really? No. I'd be happy being the champ, you know? But when you're not the champ, you're not happy and you're going to do everything you can. So.

[Joe Rogan]

So even though you're a champ at your weight class, is the Open. That open haunts you.

[Devin Larratt]

Haunts me? Yeah. I've been there before, like. So in 2008, I was actually. I won against this legendary figure of the sport, John Brzenk, he's considered the greatest of all time. John brzenk, basically for 40 years. 40 years from the time he was, like, 18 to, like, almost 60. Okay. He went undefeated for. Basically undefeated for like, 25 years. Yeah. In American. This guy. This guy, super cool. Okay. Different era. And you'll see the difference. Okay, so you'll see that this sport has changed.

[Joe Rogan]

Can we pull him up?

[Devin Larratt]

John Brzenk. John Brzenk's the Goat. Yeah, yeah, he'll be there this weekend, too.

[Joe Rogan]

And is he still competing?

[Devin Larratt]

John is not really competing, but he's just so tied into the sport, I think it's inevitable that he comes back.

[Joe Rogan]

But how old is he?

[Devin Larratt]

He's like, 60, 61 or. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, he's the man. This guy's the man. So you know the movie over the Top? So Sylvester. That's actually John. The tournament was real over. Yeah, that was a real. The movie followed the tournament, and John is actually the guy who won it.

[Joe Rogan]

And John's not that big.

[Devin Larratt]

No, he's not.

[Joe Rogan]

How much does John weigh?

[Devin Larratt]

On a good day? On a great day, John's like 230. But. But. But when he was young and healthy, probably 195, like, so when he was winning, when he, like, he went, like. He went like, 25 years, around 210 pounds, beating every single person on the planet.

[Joe Rogan]

How?

[Devin Larratt]

He's awesome. He's awesome. John Brzenk. So John started arm wrestling when he was a kid with his dad, and he's one of the first guys we

[Joe Rogan]

see him do it.

[Devin Larratt]

John's one of the first guys who. Arm wrestling has kind of evolved in its respectedness. Okay. As a sport. I think if you went back, like, 40 years and you talk about arm wrestling, people would be like, oh, that's cool. Yeah, let's go arm wrestle. And I'm gonna get better at arm wrestling by doing pecs and glutes and, you know, getting my whole body strong. And Jon was kind of one of the first guys who was like, I'm an arm wrestler. I practice arm wrestling. I go to tournaments. I don't need to lift weights. Okay. So he started young. The dude's thumb is probably, like, bigger than mine, and he's like, you know, six foot one, six foot two. So he's, to a certain degree, built for it, but masterful technician.

[Joe Rogan]

So he doesn't lift weights?

[Devin Larratt]

No.

[Joe Rogan]

So all he did was arm wrestle to train for arm wrestling.

[Devin Larratt]

Isn't that wild?

[Joe Rogan]

That's crazy, right?

[Devin Larratt]

So it gave him.

[Joe Rogan]

He's not a big guy.

[Devin Larratt]

No, he's not. That's a former Russian champion, Zack. Actually, no, Sauer might be Georgian. He might have been Russian at this time, but he's a Georgian. Yeah, yeah. John's technique was way above everybody's way, way above. I remember coming up, like, I had heard about John Brzenk for years before I ever saw him, because, you know, it's pre Internet, right? John Brzenk, like, silently ruled the arm wrestling world for decades, you know, pre Internet, pre. All this stuff. And. Yeah, and he went around the world beating all the monsters, all the. And this is who I actually got the. The world title from. So I beat John in 2008 for the world title. And it looks very different now, you know, like, so before. So I was probably the last of the small super heavyweights. If you call. If you call me small, like, I'm bigger than John. But not by a lot. Not by a lot. See Dennis the plank off on the left? That guy's a really famous arm wrestler. He was one of the guys who really raised the level. So that guy had a strength level. Dennis, he came in and he won the world title without really doing anything. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

I can't believe he doesn't lift weights.

[Devin Larratt]

He doesn't lift weights.

[Joe Rogan]

All he does is arm wrestle.

[Devin Larratt]

All he does is arm wrestle.

[Joe Rogan]

No other kind of physical training at all.

[Devin Larratt]

He's a mechanic. He's a special guy. Listen, that's incredible, man. The arm wrestling world loves and worships John Brzenk. He's the goat. He's like the forefather. I remember when I was coming up, I read everything this dude wrote. He is one of the reasons why we all kind of respect table time. Don't need weight so much specialization. John is kind of poster boy for specialization.

[Joe Rogan]

And what kind of training did he do?

[Devin Larratt]

Dude, he arm wrestled.

[Joe Rogan]

Just arm wrestled. He would do specific things when he was arm wrestling and that.

[Devin Larratt]

We keep asking the same questions about John. Like, we think, like, some people think he had, like a secret setup in his basement and stuff like that, but everything kind of points towards. Even if he's kind of kidding us and tricking us, it's certainly not a lot. He arm wrestled with his dad as a kid. Okay. And you know, they're practicing all the time. So this Iceman, okay, that's the. That's the guy who John beat to become kind of the best. Okay. This guy is like the guy before John.

[Joe Rogan]

So he was the original king of arm wrestling. He is Johnny Walker.

[Devin Larratt]

Johnny Walker, yeah. Iceman. And he. He was the best for a long time, but John eventually beat him. You know, you see, that's. John is like a kid, right? John's probably like 17 there.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah. But no, John arm wrestled all. Like, arm wrestling is going to make you strong.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, imagine.

[Devin Larratt]

Oh, you. You will get that. And that's a lot of reason why we get guys into the sport who are in the strength field. Like, if you're a strong man, if you're powerlifter, you try arm wrestling, you'll be so sore, you'll be like, oh, my God. Because people look for that, right?

[Joe Rogan]

Like, people want something that can get you really sore.

[Devin Larratt]

Arm wrestling will get you so sore that you can barely move. I've been so sore from arm wrestling matches, I can't even walk. I can't even get up for days. For days. Wow. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Unbelievable. Because it's something about the way the body's designed. Like, we are actually probably designed to resist things from happening more than we are to make things happen. So we're very, very strong to stop things from happening in arm wrestling is what that. That's the strength we really hone in on. Right. Because we're locking. We get into these locked positions and then we're trying to open the other person up. And this process of being ripped open is super taxing. Super, super taxing. So, yes, John. John ruled the arm wrestling world for like 25 years. He's still around. Yeah, I'll get to. I'll get to talk to him tomorrow. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

And so do you think he thinks about competing again?

[Devin Larratt]

Of course he does. Of course he does.

[Joe Rogan]

But he doesn't. When was the last time he did it?

[Devin Larratt]

Last time he competed was in Dallas. He competed against a guy called Yoshi Kanai, who's the number one guy from Japan. John is way past his prime. Okay. Like, John. John. When John was like in his 30s, he was like the Levan, but 210 pounds, nobody could beat him. It took a while. But the thing is, arm wrestling got cool, you know, to a degree where we were on espn. Governments started to recognize it. So if you were from the right country, you know, you could be a pro arm wrestler. Like if you're from Georgia or Turkey or Kazakhstan, you know, so the level started rising.

[Joe Rogan]

When did this start happening?

[Devin Larratt]

I think that governments started to recognize it. I'm going to guess here that a lot of them started to do it around the turn of the millennia. Okay. Probably they started around Then. But it takes a long time for it all to get in. And some countries are still switching over. I think Sweden just got recognized, I think, within the last year or so. But once a country recognizes it as a sport, it's a massive influx of cash and support. So that'll raise the level. But what happened was we got. There was all these leagues. Like, there was the PAL in Europe, there was the Wal in North America. And it got the sport to a point where if you were the best, you could probably quit your job. Okay. And that was a huge step forward because, you know, yeah, that's a big step, right? And that happened around 2015.

[Joe Rogan]

And do you think that's because of the Internet? Like, YouTube videos, like, popularity increases, TikTok, Instagram, that kind of shit?

[Devin Larratt]

That was massive. But it happened a bit later. First, what happened? A lot of small little steps. You know, there was a documentary pulling John that came out. There was a couple rich guys who thought arm wrestling was cool, and they just started to run leagues. Robert drank with the UAL Ultimate Arm Wrestling League out of California. I mean, it went from, like, when I first started the sport. Mike Gould, classic. If we won 500 bucks, it was the greatest day of our life. You know, it was so cool. We won 500 bucks. Like, you know, that was it. And then we. By 2010 or so, even before that, the PAL, we were talking about thousands of dollars, $10,000, WAL came along, and we got a massive influx of money. You were talking about $20,000, okay. And then we were on ESPN, so there were sponsors, okay. So you could get some sponsor money if you were the best. You could barely make it. You could barely make it. And then Covid happens. And Covid burnt down. Everything burnt down. All the leagues, which were kind of fractioning the sport, right? We had the best guys from Europe competing together, best guys from North America. When all the leagues burnt down from the ashes and a lot of people. And that's when TikTok and YouTube really started kicking because everybody was locked in their house. And somehow arm wrestling got found and our views went through the roof. People started to follow. Arm wrestling's good for TikTok. Attention spans, you know, you can see a whole. Yep. And. And then. Yeah. So east versus west came along, and now we're everything ufc. We're like the UFC of arm wrestling now. East versus west, all the best guys in the world all pulled east versus west. And there's an event every seven weeks, international.

[Joe Rogan]

So, like, what does a top guy make to win a Tournament now,

[Devin Larratt]

you know, it's, it's tricky when we talk about money, but, but you will make. Like, if you're a, if, if you're a top arm wrestler now, you're, you're definitely, you definitely don't need a side job. You definitely don't. And you're, and you're, you're probably, definitely making a healthy, a healthy six figures, you know, Definitely.

[Joe Rogan]

So.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, so east versus west kind of raised the level after Covid. It's not the same sport. It's not like the champions now. Like, it's tough. It's tough to win a world. Way harder to win a world title now than it was 10 or 15, 20 years ago. Yeah, yeah. Now we have Levan.

[Joe Rogan]

Right. Is there any drug testing at east versus West?

[Devin Larratt]

There's not. Okay, so it's, it's F1. You know, everything, everything goes.

[Joe Rogan]

But what does F1 mean?

[Devin Larratt]

You know, like IndyCar. Everybody's got the same car.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Devin Larratt]

F1. Like innovation. Right, innovation. WAF. Government funded that has testing.

[Joe Rogan]

What is WAF?

[Devin Larratt]

Oh, sorry. World Arm Wrestling Federation. So World Arm Wrestling Federation is kind of like the base of the sport. Okay. It's. It's a world level. So every country kind of plugs into it. They have state or provincial, then they have national. They have like, Europeans or North Americans. And then they have a world championships annually, different part of the world every year that's tested.

[Joe Rogan]

It's such a universal thing. Like, I remember arm wrestling, kids in high school, you know, everybody knows how to arm wrestle. It's always been around. It's always been a thing. So it's really interesting to think that it's becoming more popular now than ever.

[Devin Larratt]

It is wonderful. I, I love the sport. I, I think that it's a great sport because of its safety, its longevity, its simplicity. Yeah. Beautiful sport.

[Joe Rogan]

But there's a lot of aspects to it. It's simple, but you're still learning.

[Devin Larratt]

It is.

[Joe Rogan]

So it can't be that simple.

[Devin Larratt]

Like anything, you know, the more you dive into something, the more it opens.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, yeah.

[Devin Larratt]

At the level that I'm at now, you know, I continue to learn subtleties on a technical level, but it overflows more now into more vague and kind of like lifestyle principles. And I feel like that's how I get my big gains now is, you know, is. Is the way I live my life. Like the sport, you know, kind of cleans up my whole life.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, because you want to perform well.

[Devin Larratt]

That's it.

[Joe Rogan]

And so you're just so dedicated that, like, you're on top of your nutrition, your sleep, Everything.

[Devin Larratt]

Everything. Yeah, yeah. Somewhere between a balance between chaos and order, perfect performance is found. Yeah, yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

The balance between chaos and order is interesting because you kind of. To become great, you kind of have to have some chaos.

[Devin Larratt]

You. It's so essential. Yeah, Chaos is a huge part.

[Joe Rogan]

Talk to me about that.

[Devin Larratt]

What is that? This is. This is. I love this one. This is so good. This is one of my latest learning points that I've taken into account, and it's massively affected my planning, the way I plan events. So I have met many people in my life, and I've met probably in my entire life, probably, like, two people who I would consider completely pure, you know, like, basically like a Jesus Christ kind of person. Like, no sin. Okay, but. And on the other side, I've met only, like, a couple people who I thought were genuinely pure evil or, you know, But I think most people are somewhere in the middle, okay? And they need that balance in their life, you know? And I think that you need to. If you're talking about performance on a single date, this balance of what you are needs to be structured. So I think that actually in the fight, like, when you're actually fighting, a lot of people, I think perform best in chaos, okay? So when you get into the stage, you have to be completely wild. No rules. Like, you need to be completely unhinged. But leading up to it, you need to structure. You need to really become very ordered. And the more you can bring order into your life, the better. I went to a kind of a presentation by this guy Mack, okay? He's a geneticist as well, and he was talking about how life only exists in this balance between chaos and order. And from that, I brought that into my training by making sticker charts. So when I was young, my mom used to motivate me through sticker charts. So when I did a good job, she'd give me a sticker, and I loved it. So I have brought this concept into my training where there's only two stickers. There's a blue sticker, which is. He didn't quite make it. It's representative of chaos. And a white sticker, which is representative of order. And after I compete, I purposefully move into chaos. And it's not as though, like, oh, I'm in chaos, and I let everything catch on fire. I just. I don't need structure. I can go wherever. I can learn new things, I can try new things. I can open up my mind to whatever I want. Nothing's required, but really, I'm trying to gather data, put together a plan so that when I move into structure, I have a new kind of plan.

[Joe Rogan]

So how do you structure that? When you say you move into chaos, like, you allow yourself to not have a plan.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

So this is obviously very planned.

[Devin Larratt]

Yes. Yeah. So I will move from major. My life is structured that I'm. It's in blocks. Okay. So I move from major event to major event. I am now at the very beginning of probably the longest block that I've ever had in my life. I'm gonna face that guy levon in, like, 16 months. It's forever. It's an eternity, you know? So I am now in this period when I can travel. I can. I can just. I can be more open in a way. It's. It helps get me there, you know, I am trying to come up with what I think is the perfect blend so that when I lock into my basement, I'm being super accurate. But I do believe that if you just try and be good every day, if you try and live a certain way every day, it creeps into your life. I need, like, a finish line. Okay. Like, if I know I only have to be like this for four months or five months, I can make it. You know, if I'm like, I have to be like this for my whole life, everything creeps in. It falls apart. But it's an aid for me psychologically to remain disciplined, and it's a way for me to fit chaos into my life where it satisfies me as a human being, and I get to have fun, and I get to go outside of my box. But that's the hardest thing. To be a world champion at 51 is to put all your energy into something so simple. This is the most difficult piece, is the psychological dedication to do 10 hours of wrist curls in a day. You know, this is the difficult.

[Joe Rogan]

You do 10 hours of wrist curls a day?

[Devin Larratt]

I do. I'll get up in the morning, and my wife Jodi will help me. Okay. We'll have food. And I'm doing, like. And that's the thing. So right now, I'm coming up with the formula for the next one. But I was doing 147 times 2 because I was doing right and left. I'm going back to pumpkin training, which is right hand only.

[Joe Rogan]

Why do you call that pumpkin training?

[Devin Larratt]

You know, about growing giant pumpkins?

[Joe Rogan]

No.

[Devin Larratt]

You know those. You know, you ever seen those fairs where they have, like, a. Right. Yeah. So. So what that teaches is if you Want to have a giant pumpkin? You pinch off all the flowers on the vine except for one. My giant pumpkin. Yeah. So I've tried and put everything into the right. I try and put all. And this is, so, this is specialization. So I've done this project for like, I did it for like six years before.

[Joe Rogan]

So when you're saying you put everything in the right, meaning you don't do literally wrist curls or anything with your left hand.

[Devin Larratt]

Nothing.

[Joe Rogan]

Nothing.

[Devin Larratt]

Nothing. Really? Yeah, yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Now is this a energy resource allocation?

[Devin Larratt]

Yes. Yeah. It's interesting.

[Joe Rogan]

Interesting.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

There's a difference in your right and your left.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Jesus Christ. So you see, and I, I came up with this theory, you know, a little bit because of just nature. Okay. And I see how nature works and.

[Joe Rogan]

But yeah, you have one giant.

[Devin Larratt]

Is this one big form? Bigger.

[Joe Rogan]

Look at the size of the difference.

[Devin Larratt]

It's a bit bigger.

[Joe Rogan]

It's twice as big.

[Devin Larratt]

Okay? And, and I was balanced, okay. I was equal. I was left hand world champion also. Okay. I, I've. But, but as of age, I'm like, how can I remain at the top of the sport? I'm gonna have to cut things, you know.

[Joe Rogan]

But why does training your left arm take away from your right arm?

[Devin Larratt]

I think we only have so much energy. I think there's like a finite amount of energy that we have. And if I tell my body that my energy goes here, more of it will go there and more development will happen. I don't think it's like I have this limitless amount of energy where I can be like a proportionate bodybuilder and be a world champion. I think that to be at the very top, you need to be very specialized and very focused. That's what I believe. This comes. A lot of people criticize me for this, okay? I get heaps of criticism and I'm very well aware of it. And I think that if you were to.

[Joe Rogan]

Can I stop you there?

[Devin Larratt]

Yes.

[Joe Rogan]

When you say heaps of criticism by who and is it valid?

[Devin Larratt]

I don't think it's valid.

[Joe Rogan]

So who's criticizing you?

[Devin Larratt]

I think that most of the criticism comes from more junior players, Okay. I think that most senior arm wrestlers, most guys who are like, on my level, they understand it and to a certain degree we all do it. Okay. I'm just an extreme example, but a lot of guys do it. Okay? A lot of guys do this in the sport. There's a couple things that lead me to this. Okay? The pumpkin is just a fun metaphor, okay? But when you get hurt in the One side. I think that a lot of people notice that somehow there's this amazing compensation that happens. Another thing is we have freaks in the sport. We attract some real weirdos. Okay. A guy called Oleg Zok or Matthias Schlitty. Okay. And these are hellboys. Real life hellboys. Okay, so they have like one arm that is crazy jacked.

[Joe Rogan]

I've seen this one cat, he's a small dude.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

And he has one arm that's like a leg.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

What is his name?

[Devin Larratt]

Probably Oleg. It's Oleg or Matthias. They're our best examples. Oleg is, is better like Oleg. Oleg's a world champion.

[Joe Rogan]

What's his last name?

[Devin Larratt]

Zok.

[Joe Rogan]

What a great name.

[Devin Larratt]

Oh, he's so cool.

[Joe Rogan]

What a great name.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

And that's the dude. Yeah, that's the dude.

[Devin Larratt]

And I've fought him.

[Joe Rogan]

I love the size of his fucking left arm. That is. That is insanity.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah. Okay. I actually pulled this guy at the UAL many years ago and he was like 165 pounds. And I was. And I was the current world champion. And the kid almost beat me. Okay. Yeah, yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Left handed.

[Devin Larratt]

Left handed? Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Jesus Christ. His arm is insane.

[Devin Larratt]

Isn't that awesome?

[Joe Rogan]

That is so crazy.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

He has the arm of a 300 pound man, dude.

[Devin Larratt]

At 170 pounds, he was almost. Not even the world champion in his division. He was almost the world champion in the open.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay, look at his left arm. And it's crazy.

[Devin Larratt]

And what's extra crazy about it is the insertion points. It's not just that he's hypertrophied and blown up. Like the insertion points are different. He's like the angles of his musculature, the development, like it's wild.

[Joe Rogan]

And how is that genetic? Is that built?

[Devin Larratt]

He was born like that to a certain degree.

[Joe Rogan]

But his right arm looks normal.

[Devin Larratt]

Normal.

[Joe Rogan]

So how is it so different on his left arm?

[Devin Larratt]

So it's my theory, okay, that he has a bit of a blood flow disorder. Okay. I believe that. So the arterial spread in the body for most of us is all the same. We have like an even distribution across our body. But I believe that his arterial spread is different. I think he's got a heavy arterial flow to one side.

[Joe Rogan]

This is just your own personal theory I've heard.

[Devin Larratt]

I talked to Matthias. Matthias is another guy with this disorder. He was the one who kind of led me to believe that this is what was going on with him. And so this made me believe that there was so much value in blood flow alone when it comes to the expression of what you are like, I think anything that just gets more blood flow enhances. Yeah. The expression of the human being is largely determined by the circulation that the genetic piece receives. And I think with guys like this, it happened like, in utero.

[Joe Rogan]

That is crazy. That left arm is crazy.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah. And he got in a vicious car crash, a horrible one, almost killed him. And he's. He rehabbed and he's. And once again, he's. He's the world champ again in the 85 kilo division completely. And he, like, he should be dead. Like, he broke everything, like super trauma. And he's still the best.

[Joe Rogan]

Pieced it back together again.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, Pieced them back together. He's still the man. Yeah. But what he taught me and what other people taught me is the value. And I believe it's all theories. Okay. I could be wrong on everything, but I think that it's the blood flow that really. It heals, it strengthens. And a lot of the thing is, the heart isn't strong enough to feed all the structures, and that's where movement comes in. So that's why I train this way. Increase circulation. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow. So. But I still don't understand, like, clearly he's working that one arm more than he's working the left arm. Excuse me, the right arm.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. I think to a certain degree, but because of the way he was. Yeah. This is Matthias, right?

[Joe Rogan]

Same deal.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. And he's. And he's like German. German national champion kind of level. Yeah. And like, it's just. It's hard to compete with.

[Joe Rogan]

Right. But how much of that is just work with the right side over and over and over again? And how much of it is, you think, a genetic component?

[Devin Larratt]

With these guys, it's a lot of genetic. Really? Yeah, with them. But I believe the reason why it's expressing that way is because of an arterial spread. Okay. And talking to Matthias, he's the one that led me to believe that initially.

[Joe Rogan]

Is that arterial spread influenced by work? Like, does it change the expression of the arteries in the muscles?

[Devin Larratt]

I think you can influence blood flow for sure. Like, I think if you are repeatedly working one region very heavily, your circulatory system is going to adapt. Like, my endurance capabilities on my right and my left are completely different. And that's from years of doing this. And so I have to think that, you know, it's not just a cellular thing. It's gotta be the blood flow. It's gotta be everything that has adapted over years. Yeah. And look, I really care about being the best and all the information that I have makes me. I'm doing it again. Like I laid off it for a couple years, but I've started to do it again as I do my final prep. One more time.

[Joe Rogan]

When you say do it again, what are you doing differently?

[Devin Larratt]

I'll go back to. So my work capacity, work amount that I'm doing between my right and left arm, sometimes it's equal. Sometimes what I do with the right is what I do with the left. Sometimes when I go to the club, I'll do right arm, I'll do left arm. And now I've just swung it back. So I go to the club and I'm basically arm wrestling everybody I can right hand until people are kind of bored. And then I'll do some left hand work, but the right is the priority. And the same thing, when I do my homework in the basement. I'm doing like 85 to 90% work on the right and maybe like just 10%, like just, you know, just for timing and whatever. On the left. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Super specialized. Yeah, yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

It's. It's insane.

[Devin Larratt]

I. I was, I'm sorry. I was so worried like that I was gonna develop like back issues. Imbalance issues. Yeah, none of that ever happened, huh? Yeah, yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Guys do that from archery. They develop imbalance issues just from pulling a bow one sided. Like my friend Evan, he got a left handed bow just so he could practice left handed as well because he felt like it would balance him out.

[Devin Larratt]

Right. I think balance is overrated. Really? Yeah. I think balance is a nice concept for like some imaginary world that you live in. But if I live in a world where I'm trying to win a world title right handed, then I need to let my body know that this is what I'm getting ready for and not confuse it.

[Joe Rogan]

There's an interesting comparison in Jiu jitsu because there's a lot of guys that have like a very strong right side attack. Like Eddie Bravo for instance. Eddie Bravo's attack is almost always on the right side of the body. Obviously he has a black belt level attack on the left, but his right side attack is where he puts all his energy to. And his philosophy was along those same lines. If you just develop this one side, like so lethal.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. I think that so much is about, you know, being able to have an icebreaker, you know, something that stops a match or wins you the match. And at a world level, it's, it's everything. Like if you can, if you can bring something from a 99 to 100, you know, but it takes 15 points off your left. That's a trade that a lot of people are willing to make. You know, if I can do anything to push my right a level up, if it let makes me, you know, wither away in my left. Good trade.

[Joe Rogan]

One of the things that I watched that I thought was really interesting, I've been watching a lot of these rock climbers and their ridiculous grip strength.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

A lot of these guys. There's that cat that has a YouTube channel. I know you've been on it. Magnus. Magnus. How do you say his last name? And he had that one dude who's just a super freak.

[Devin Larratt]

Eve Gravel.

[Joe Rogan]

Yes.

[Devin Larratt]

He trains with me.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay. That guy went right into arm wrestling and was fucking people up right away, which is crazy. Which makes me think that maybe that kind of specialized training is like a cheat code.

[Devin Larratt]

It's close. It's close. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

That guy also has like enormous leg sized forearms.

[Devin Larratt]

Yves Gravel.

[Joe Rogan]

See, you can find him training with Magnus because they're in Eve's basement where he does all of his training. And he's doing these like how many millimeters is the holes? Okay, so he's doing two millimeter holds with his fingers where he's hanging.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. I'm telling you, it makes no sense.

[Joe Rogan]

He's such a freak.

[Devin Larratt]

It makes zero sense. Like Magnus is super stud, okay? Magnus is like world level climber. Eve. When it comes to the strength component of climbing, it doesn't even make strength. I don't even understand how anybody could even do it. Like, it's like credit card. He can do pull ups off of a credit card.

[Joe Rogan]

That's insane.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

How?

[Devin Larratt]

I don't know. I don't know how he does it. It doesn't. And like he has like rounded surfaces where there is nothing to bite. Right there, there's nothing.

[Joe Rogan]

So he's just chalking up his fingers and he hangs off of those. I want to see that.

[Devin Larratt]

There's nothing there. I don't know how he does it. There's nothing to bite. There's nothing. And he's pulling up off. I can't even understand how he does it. So he came into arm wrestling and

[Joe Rogan]

he's like £150, but it's £40 of his forearms.

[Devin Larratt]

So we have a tournament in Ottawa, where we both live. It's called the Ottawa Open and it attracts the strongest dudes in the region to win. The Ottawa Open is really tough. He won it his first year after arm wrestling. Six weeks. What? Yeah. He's complete no no, he's.

[Joe Rogan]

And he weighs what, 1 6, 15 pounds? Oh, my God.

[Devin Larratt]

Yves Gravel is a complete weirdo. I've never in my life met somebody who can do the stuff with grip that he can do.

[Joe Rogan]

And it's all that training that he's doing. He's doing all this insane grip training, which makes me think, like, what if

[Devin Larratt]

you did that stuff?

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Devin Larratt]

Yes. Let me tell you, as good as Eve is now, he's gonna get even better. Okay.

[Joe Rogan]

I can only imagine.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Nobody is touching Eve's fingers. But like I talked about earlier. So if you kind of relate it to climbing. Okay.

[Joe Rogan]

Can you show me some stuff with that guy doing things? Well, I was trying to find that one, but just show me some of the other freakish things he does. Because he could pick up things from the ground that nobody could pick up.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. He does grip competition too, so. So that's another world that's closely tied to arm wrestling is the grip championships. Right. Where they're just. It's like powerlifting for grip, right? Yeah. And he's the best at that too. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

It's just nuts.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, it's really nuts. Yeah. So there is a high degree of crossover, right? There is. But there are slight intricacies, like a kind of way to think about it. In climbing, if you have a great grip, you are able to climb the wall. Okay. But in actual arm wrestling, you actually don't want to be the climber. You want to be the wall.

[Joe Rogan]

Right, Right.

[Devin Larratt]

You want to make it hard for the other person's grip. You don't necessarily. He's capable of climbing any wall. Okay. But once he figures out how to be the wall instead, he's gonna be so, so difficult. It's fun to work with him. Our club in Ottawa, we have like super freaks now. We have all these new guys with ridiculous potential. We got a guy come in who's bigger than Brian Shaw.

[Joe Rogan]

Did you ask this, can you show me some video? This guy, he wasn't doing anything there. He was like, there's a bunch, Right. And I'm on not his channel too. I'm like. It's bouncing back in between. So here's doing fat grip one arm chin ups.

[Devin Larratt]

Did you see the. The Thomas inch? You know, see a Thomas inch on the left?

[Joe Rogan]

Yes.

[Devin Larratt]

Right. Nobody picks up the Thomas inch one. They're 150, you know.

[Joe Rogan]

That's nuts.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, it's crazy.

[Joe Rogan]

Like, this kind of grip is just insane. Oh, my God. That's crazy. He's pinch gripping.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

And that guy Magnus is strong as shit too. Like, I saw a video of him training with Eddie hall.

[Devin Larratt]

Crazy strong.

[Joe Rogan]

And he's doing these one arm rows with like 180 pounds on each side. And I'm like, that is bananas. Because he's not a big guy.

[Devin Larratt]

No. But he's ridiculously strong as well. And that.

[Joe Rogan]

But even him, he's dwarfed by this guy's strength.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Which is crazy.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Eve is considered the strongest climber in the world.

[Joe Rogan]

And did you ask him when he started this and how he got that strong?

[Devin Larratt]

I've talked to Eve a lot about his training. He's so detailed. Like, the way he trains is very interesting, very progressive, very science based.

[Joe Rogan]

Look at those forearms. That's bonkers.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah. Eve is a. And, and he's an artist too. He makes masks.

[Joe Rogan]

Masks?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, you know, like movie. Movie masks.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, wow.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, that's, that's his main job. He makes masks and he. And he can climb anything. Yeah, he's super cool guy. Yeah. Wow.

[Joe Rogan]

So seeing that though, makes me think if a guy is that small and he has that kind of grip strength, that that has to be a massive factor. It is in your ability to arm wrestle. So why wouldn't everybody do that? If a guy is 150 pounds, that he could do that shit. And he's doing it with two arms. I mean, both of his arms are super jacked.

[Devin Larratt]

There are levels of specialization.

[Joe Rogan]

Right. Do you think it's maybe too late for you to do what he's doing? Because he's been doing this for decades and decades.

[Devin Larratt]

I believe that he is so good at all his grip work and his grip work is so high and it does have a lot of crossover. It does. Would I want that strength? Yes, of course. I just think that the motions that I'm doing are actually even more dangerous for the sport of arm wrestling. Like, if I was to advise, even I do. I talk to Eve, like every week. I tell Eve, you know, the way he's going to progress his game is by probably doing these more precise movements to become the wall, you know, to become the thing that's hard to hold onto.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Devin Larratt]

He has an amazing ability to hold on to anybody. Okay. And that's going to take him really, really far in the sport. But I think that as he's Eve, I've told him he's older in terms of entry, but he has world championship potential. You know, he's less than a year in the sport.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. He's been arm wrestling since like last November. Yeah. Give him like. Give him like a year or two or three, and he's going to be knocking on the North American, like, you know, top pro level.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. It won't take him long. Yeah. He's a freak, for one. And he's super smart. And arm wrestling is a very nice crossover for climbers because so many of the strengths are similar, really similar.

[Joe Rogan]

And when you say so. He's very scientific about his training. Like, what does he do?

[Devin Larratt]

The thing that struck me when I spoke to him about his training is he kind of does testing. I found that very, very different from the way I train. So before he does his workout, he does these tests, like with his grip, and he, like, says how easy or hard they are. And if. And if he's not feeling right, he won't do the training. So he'll continue to rest. He'll abort a training session because it doesn't feel right. Well, yeah. And I'm like, I'm doing it right, Right.

[Joe Rogan]

Interesting.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Look at whatever. I've seen it. It's very detailed. It's.

[Joe Rogan]

And where did he learn this from?

[Devin Larratt]

I think he's. He's crazy. He loves armor. Sorry. He loves. He loves climbing, and I think he's just obsessed. And I think he probably digests everything. I probably. I think he probably studies everything about climbing and strength and he just put it all together.

[Joe Rogan]

So what is he doing here?

[Devin Larratt]

It looks like a static wrist test. Looks like he's measuring it through a way to see how much in a static capacity he can generate. Wow. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Pushing isometrics for arm wrestling.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

So all just wrist curling.

[Devin Larratt]

Isometric. Yeah. Maximum output, which is really the main strength that arm wrestlers need, that locked, isometric or even negative strength. And all his squeezing.

[Joe Rogan]

That's crazy.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Yeah. He's very special.

[Joe Rogan]

That is crazy.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. So that's the thing. He's got all these charts, and so

[Joe Rogan]

he's doing this all himself because there's probably no one that could teach him this stuff because he's probably at the top of the food chain when this.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. He's a gift to have come around. We love that. We love that we've kind of got him because.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, I'm sure. Because when you get a freak like that, like, out of nowhere, what is he doing here?

[Devin Larratt]

All right, so he's working his curls and he's adding resistance through the elastic. So you can see he's. This is not a climber exercise, I don't think anymore. He's really switching, you Know, arm wrestling. I think he's got the bug. Yeah. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow.

[Devin Larratt]

It won't be long. It won't be long. He'll be at east versus West for a 70 kilo world title.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, it's such an enormous advantage to have. Have these gigantic forearms and insane strength.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

And it's just so weird that you could get these guys that are so physically small, that are so damn strong. Like when Magnus was doing Rose, you're like, where's the force coming from? You have 150 pound, 160 pound body and you're doing these 180 pound single arm rows.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Like, where's the force coming from? Like, where's the. Is it a tendon strength? Is it. Where's the tissue? Right. Like you look at Eddie hall, you're like, okay, that makes sense that that guy could lift that much weight. He's massive.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

This guy's not massive. If you saw him in a T shirt, you wouldn't even. Unless you looked at his forearms, you wouldn't even think he was strong. You'd say, well, it probably runs or something. Looks like a normal guy that's fit. He doesn't look like a guy who can do 180 pound one arm roast. So what, what is that? How do you do that? Where's it coming from?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, I think that for. I think that arm wrestlers, climbers, a lot of athletes, fighters too, they start to recognize the value of the hand. You know, a lot of guys, you know, in the, in the communities like strongman, powerlifting, other strength disciplines, they get immense strength through their body, through their shoulders and different parts that by the time it goes through the chain, through the elbow, through the wrist, into the fingers, only a small portion of that is able to get managed.

[Joe Rogan]

Right. I see that with guys when they work out with straps. I've never used straps.

[Devin Larratt]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

Because to me, with Jiu jitsu, grip is so important. I never wanted to rely only on my muscles and not have a strong grip. Like, it didn't make any sense to me.

[Devin Larratt]

In so many functional things, the hand is the shortcoming or the feet. Or the feet.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. I talked to Nick Kirsten once, who's a strength and conditioning trainer, and I said, what do you think is like the number one thing that fighters lack on? He said, foot strength.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

I said foot strength. He goes, yeah, foot strength. He goes, once your foot strength breaks down, everything breaks down. Your movement breaks down. Your power breaks down. Your ability to get out of the way of things, the ability to close the distance yeah, yeah. On the grip strength, what did he get? 160.

[Devin Larratt]

Oh, that's crazy.

[Joe Rogan]

I got more than him.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, he just did it really hard, too.

[Joe Rogan]

That's crazy. But that makes sense. I'm £200. Right.

[Devin Larratt]

But it's a chain, and grip is a part of the functional hand chain.

[Joe Rogan]

Right. You know, but clearly he's way stronger than me with Rose.

[Devin Larratt]

The interesting thing with grip is grip is only a small part of control. Oh, this guy. What's that guy's name? He's. He's actually the best. Andra, Right?

[Joe Rogan]

What did he get?

[Devin Larratt]

He's actually the best climber in the world right now.

[Joe Rogan]

161. Same thing. Okay. That's crazy.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Derek Lewis got 218. Derek Lewis, the guy who fights in the UFC, and he did it casually.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, he just.

[Joe Rogan]

I mean, Derek's got giant paws, like catcher Smith paws, and he. He pulled 218. He got higher than anybody, and it didn't even look like he was trying.

[Devin Larratt]

The guy I just arm wrestled, I think had the world record for. For some time. Vitaly Liletton.

[Joe Rogan]

What was that?

[Devin Larratt]

I don't know what the number is. It was. But I know he had the world record. Vitaly Liletton. He. So I. I'm actually not big on grip. I'm not really. I'm not, but most people are.

[Joe Rogan]

There's a guy that I follow on Instagram, Jamie Pullm Up. His name is Michael Ecker. And. 351.

[Devin Larratt]

Boom. Is that Vitali? Yeah. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, my God.

[Devin Larratt]

So listen. So listen. So mine is probably like 70 pounds, but I beat him.

[Joe Rogan]

Wait a minute.

[Devin Larratt]

You. You don't know. It's terrible.

[Joe Rogan]

No, no.

[Devin Larratt]

I'm crippled.

[Joe Rogan]

Shut the fuck.

[Devin Larratt]

I'm telling you, there's no way.

[Joe Rogan]

I'm such a disappointment. Squeeze stronger.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, you do. No, you probably do.

[Joe Rogan]

That is literally not possible.

[Devin Larratt]

I'm telling you.

[Joe Rogan]

Look at the size of this guy.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, he's like six, nine. Like he's about three. Yeah. Yeah. That is so crazy.

[Joe Rogan]

154 kilograms is so bananas.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

That's so strong. You can only do 70. That doesn't make any sense.

[Devin Larratt]

When I was younger, I could do like eight or nine reps of the number three Captains of Crush.

[Joe Rogan]

So I could do this sucker here on the table.

[Devin Larratt]

What is that? Yeah, I don't know what this is.

[Joe Rogan]

You tell me.

[Devin Larratt]

Tell me what you think. £200. So this isn't a captain. The Crush.

[Joe Rogan]

This is a. I think it is. It's not.

[Devin Larratt]

I Bought this. They just have a number on the bottom. Can't do it, Joe. Can't. I can't do it. I can't do it.

[Joe Rogan]

I do that all day long.

[Devin Larratt]

You should come and arm wrestle with us.

[Joe Rogan]

No, I could beat people who suck.

[Devin Larratt]

Grip is interesting. Okay. Grip is a part of control. But so much of the control through your hand has to do with the ability to control the angles. You know, can you control this way, this way, this way, this way way. You know, can you spin? You know, the grip is like the final inflection point. It's the final piece to add.

[Joe Rogan]

Right?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, I understand that it's not everything. It's the thing that I've been obsessed with lately because I'm not strong at it.

[Devin Larratt]

Grip's beautiful.

[Joe Rogan]

So this 162kg.

[Devin Larratt]

Jeez.

[Joe Rogan]

And I, I this guy, Michael Eckert on Instagram, he's a guy that I follow and he has all these grip strength tutorials. He's a Marine and I guess as a straight. That's him. And he can do 220. And he doesn't look like a very big guy either, but he does like crazy one arm pull ups and, and he has massive forearms. But like, look at his thing right there. There's a thing below it. You see numbers. There it is. Oh. So this is what he's lifting. This is. He's doing.

[Devin Larratt]

Oh wow.

[Joe Rogan]

For chin ups. But he has the grip strength thing. The really good one is the one that has knurled metal. It has very little play in it. And so you get a real accurate. He said it's the most accurate one of all. Them go that one right there. See what says 119. So I think that's 119kg.

[Devin Larratt]

Hand is. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

What is that at? 262. So he could do 262 and he's not a very big guy. So he does a hundred pounds more than me and he's not a big guy.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

I mean when you're looking at him. But he does crazy like chin up stuff. 256. That's nuts. So his. It's Michael Eckert. L Elikart. No, Eckert. E C K E R T E C K E R T. So it's Michael Eckertfit on Instagram and this guy's turned me on to a bunch of stuff. Told me stuff to get and what to work out with. But I just blown away because I look at him and I go, well, you're not that big that's what's crazy. Like, you look at, his forearms are obviously very big, very strong, but he's not like this massive guy. Like, who's that giant Russian cat? Yeah, boy, He's.

[Devin Larratt]

He's something real.

[Joe Rogan]

If that guy pulled 262, I go, okay, that makes sense. But I look at Michael and I'm like, he's not the biggest guy in the world, but he does so much grip stuff. Stuff.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. We're praying for Smythe to come into the sport.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, my God.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

That guy's a freak.

[Devin Larratt]

Freakiest. Not just freak. Freakiest.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, yeah. How is he alive? Like, you gotta think. There's not a lot of time on that hourglass.

[Devin Larratt]

Live hard, die fast.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, he's pushing. There he is. Yeah.

[Devin Larratt]

But, yeah, I mean, all these strengths for our sport, they all add together.

[Joe Rogan]

Hands, they don't even look real.

[Devin Larratt]

Oh, he's.

[Joe Rogan]

And he's open about all the sauce that he's on. He's on everything. I mean, someone who was in here that was explaining how much growth hormone he takes.

[Devin Larratt]

I heard he debunked that.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, really?

[Devin Larratt]

I. I saw a video where he said it wasn't true, but I have

[Joe Rogan]

no idea that he wasn't taking that much. Yeah, I mean, someone was saying he

[Devin Larratt]

was taking like 100 or something.

[Joe Rogan]

Some crazy thing, like 10 units of growth a day.

[Devin Larratt]

No, I heard it was 100.

[Joe Rogan]

A hundred units?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. I heard it was like.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, that doesn't even make right. That seems like you would just grow. You would just become a giant. Like that's like a pituitary disorder, right? Yeah, more than right, because that's what you're getting.

[Devin Larratt]

It's a lot.

[Joe Rogan]

Clearly he's done a bunch of stuff, though. I mean, if you see him when he was younger, he looked like a normal athlete.

[Devin Larratt]

I never saw him normal. I mean, I've been following him for probably like six or seven years. Yeah, I mean, I think the first time I saw him, he was doing chin ups with like 250 pounds strapped to him. You know, I think that's the first time I saw him. He. Not normal.

[Joe Rogan]

So it's a left size. Who's. What's the left? When he's 17?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, I mean, he was. Look at. That's not a. That's not a normal 17 year old.

[Joe Rogan]

No, clearly. Yeah, he's pretty jacked. But I. That makes sense. Like that guy on the left makes sense. Like, I've seen guys like that before,

[Devin Larratt]

but not at 17.

[Joe Rogan]

No, but go to that photo again. But the guy on the right, he looks like the Incredible Hulk. Like, he looks like a superhero. Like, it doesn't look like a real human being. Like, the size of his forearms, the size of his biceps, that doesn't look like a regular human being. It looks like a complete freak of nature or science.

[Devin Larratt]

And he's training for arm wrestling.

[Joe Rogan]

I could only imagine.

[Devin Larratt]

So he's like, if you follow his Insta or whatever, he's doing the arm wrestling lifts, like, the Pronation. And his lifting is already at a level of like, World War II.

[Joe Rogan]

Go to his Instagram, please.

[Devin Larratt]

It's. His Instagram got taken down. So it's like some new. Yeah, that's right. He didn't have it.

[Joe Rogan]

Why did he get taken down?

[Devin Larratt]

I don't know. I don't know, but I heard it was taken down. But he does have a new one, whether it's his or it's a fan one. I know. I just saw it yesterday.

[Joe Rogan]

Why would they take down his Instagram?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

The only one I could find is, like, Smythe official, and it's 27 weeks ago. There's a bag and that's all that.

[Devin Larratt]

But no, there is there. I know because I saw it, like, yesterday.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, so it's gone. The page is gone.

[Devin Larratt]

There's some fan page where he's doing pronation lifts.

[Joe Rogan]

What the fuck? What is wrong? Why would they take this guy's Instagram down?

[Devin Larratt]

Because he's inspiring people to turn into monsters.

[Joe Rogan]

Do you think that's what it is?

[Devin Larratt]

I don't know. I don't know. There. This is what I'm talking about. See, now this is a much more normal, like, for arm wrestling. This is actually more functional than anything through the grip, I think.

[Joe Rogan]

So this is all Pronation.

[Devin Larratt]

That's Pronation.

[Joe Rogan]

Turning the wrist, lifting insane weight.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. And just based off of that information that I see there, I already know.

[Joe Rogan]

Click on that one that you got your. Yeah. Size of this guy.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

That is so crazy. Explosive jumps.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. And the crazy thing about him is he's not competing in anything.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Devin Larratt]

But I think that this is a guy who's just going to show up whether it's. And anything. He gets to pick. And he's probably gonna show up at,

[Joe Rogan]

like, a world level, like, anything. Like what?

[Devin Larratt]

Besides, I'd say anything whether powerlifting.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Devin Larratt]

Strong man. I. I'd be terrified if he even got to, like, blue belt in June.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, my God.

[Devin Larratt]

Like, what are you gonna do?

[Joe Rogan]

What are you gonna do? How much does he weigh?

[Devin Larratt]

I think like 340, 350, 340.

[Joe Rogan]

And preposterous strength. Like. Yeah, strength. You know, Mark Coleman always used to say that strength is a skill. And there's something to that. Because if you are that strong, there's only so much you could do with that guy's body.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Especially if he developed actual skills and understanding of leverage positions.

[Devin Larratt]

Even just the base movement patterns that

[Joe Rogan]

are really 52 lean.

[Devin Larratt]

Jesus. He was supposed to pull. There was a proposal for him to pull. One of our guys called Leonidas Arcon.

[Joe Rogan]

What a great name.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, it's a German guy. He just competed against Brian Shaw like six weeks ago. He beat Brian. What? Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Someone beat Brian Shaw in an arm wrestling match.

[Devin Larratt]

Leonidas Young, German champion. They competed in Germany. It was a great fight.

[Joe Rogan]

How big is Leonidas?

[Devin Larratt]

Leonidas is pretty awesome.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay, Leonidas, this is Leonidas and Brian Shaw.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, my goodness. That is crazy.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Right? And nobody's got a stronger grip than Brian either. Brian's grip is completely wild.

[Joe Rogan]

Seeing someone beat Brian Shaw in anything physical seems ridiculous. It doesn't even make sense. How much does this guy weigh?

[Devin Larratt]

He's like 285 when he's in good shape. But again, stupid strength. He's like a bodybuilder slash arm wrestler. He's not just a picture of me reacting. Yeah. He's been in the sport like, oh,

[Joe Rogan]

my God, he's gonna curl a D. Yeah.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Crazy strength.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, my God. He's massive.

[Devin Larratt]

Massive.

[Joe Rogan]

I just can't believe that he beat Brian Shaw. That is nuts.

[Devin Larratt]

And that's where skill comes in.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, because Brian Shaw is 100 pounds heavier than him.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, but it's. It's levels, you know, like. And that's the thing, like arm wrestling has enough technique to it. It's not just how strong you are. Look, you can look at me, okay? I'm not on any of these guys levels. They're all stronger than me. But I'm the number two in the world. In the open division, everybody in the top 50 is stronger than me, you know, but there's a. There's a high degree. That's a great picture.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow. That is crazy. The size difference is so massive.

[Devin Larratt]

But I'll tell you, Brian probably has a higher potential than Leonidas.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Devin Larratt]

Brian's been arm wrestling less than two years.

[Joe Rogan]

Right. And Leonidas been armrest about five. Okay.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

So there's a lot of technique to it.

[Devin Larratt]

There's a ton of techniques.

[Joe Rogan]

Technique and a lot of just repetition. Understanding the positions where to go, what to do, how to hold.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Miniature martial art.

[Joe Rogan]

Interesting. Yeah, makes sense.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Because there's some people that are not that. Like Marcelo Garcia, for instance, not. Not a physically imposing guy has the craziest squeeze. Like there's something about a squeeze, like learning a position over and over and over again, fine tuning it. That's what's interesting about power in general. It's like the repetition of movement creates more power. And some of it is genetic, but some of it is also just fine tuning that motion to just this perfect chain of energy from the floor to the strike.

[Devin Larratt]

And it's two of us, and it's that interaction. It's what you're doing, what I'm doing.

[Joe Rogan]

And the more you're doing it, the more you understand what to do and when to do it and what's happening and. And how to counter it and when to push, when to pull, when to hit the gas.

[Devin Larratt]

And somebody's leading the dance and someone's following and the efficiency just changes very quickly and before you know it, you're gassed out.

[Joe Rogan]

I'm sure you're aware of that guy in Australia, Tom Havin.

[Devin Larratt]

Tom Hatland. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

He's another one.

[Devin Larratt]

He's another one.

[Joe Rogan]

That's another one, right. Who's doing this stuff in his backyard with a fucking shirt on and jeans and work boots.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

And all the images, most of them are just his back.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Awesome. He's another one. He's another one of these strength giants that lives out there that everybody kind of wants to pull in. I message Tom every once in a while, like, dude, when are you coming in? Arm wrestling. When are you coming in?

[Joe Rogan]

And what do you say?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, I'm optimistic. I'm optimistic.

[Joe Rogan]

Is he interested?

[Devin Larratt]

I think so.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, he's also crazy lean too, which is really weird.

[Devin Larratt]

He's a strange character.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, the strangest, because, like, this is most of his images or his back.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Which I don't understand why he's doing that.

[Devin Larratt]

Well, I had the theory that he was an SF guy, you know, I had the theory that he belongs to some organization that requires him to be discreet.

[Joe Rogan]

But there are photos of him. Yeah, not many, but there's plenty where you could see his face.

[Devin Larratt]

Yes, but he doesn't go around broadcasting it too much, does he? I don't know. Look it. I don't know what he is. I've asked and guys say he's not. I don't know what the deal is, but for whatever reason. And he could. Right. This is a guy who could probably again go to any one of the strength disciplines and compete. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Because he's almost £400. He's six foot eight.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

And fucking shredded. See if you can find some of the images. There are images on this page of him with his shirt off, doing stuff where he's, like, walking with, you know, doing, like, farmer carries. So there's some images of him with his shirt off. Yeah, like, there he is.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah, he's. He's a. He's a Brian Shaw type. He's a. He's a Smaev type. You know, just where the baseline level of strength.

[Joe Rogan]

But Luke's more athletic than those guys, do you know what I'm saying? Like, it's. He's not as massive. He's massive, but he looks massive in a more mobile way. Do you know what I'm saying?

[Devin Larratt]

I do, but, you know, Brian Shaw, one strongman, and, like, there's a lot of athleticism in strongman.

[Joe Rogan]

Oh, for sure. I'm not saying there's not. I mean, but Brian Shaw looks like an ape. He looks like a giant ape, whereas this guy looks like a super athlete.

[Devin Larratt]

He does.

[Joe Rogan]

He looks like. Like that image of him with his shirt off on the far right. Like he's shredded. Yeah, it looks different.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

And it seems like he's just working on his strength. He's just, like, constantly. Yeah, look at his fucking forearm muscles. Like, what the fuck is going on with the. The top of the forearm where it meets the bicep? What the fuck is that?

[Devin Larratt]

Tom, if you're watching this, come to east versus west, buddy. We love you. We love you.

[Joe Rogan]

Has he ever done anything. Yeah, Any arm wrestling stuff?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, I know he has because. So down in Australia, the. The president there, Phil Rasmussen, he's good friends with him, and I know that they're arm wrestling a little bit, but, yeah, there's something with him where he doesn't, kind of. He doesn't want to, I think. I don't know what it is with some of these people where they have this amazing ability, but they don't really pop. You know who Eric Spado is?

[Joe Rogan]

No.

[Devin Larratt]

Eric Spado's a guy out of Vegas, former number one in the world bench guy. Okay. Like, he broke the world record for bench. Okay. But he didn't go to a powerlifting meet until he could break the record. He didn't even show up. He just showed up and he beat the world record. He was doing the world record in his bass. But. Wow. And. And everybody's like, you know, Eric, why don't you go and make it legit? You know? But these guys exist out there, these guys in their basements or, you know, wherever they're living, and they. And they, for whatever reason, they don't show up until they're the best. Yeah. Eric, this guy. Yeah. And he's an amazing arm wrestler, too. Same theory, though. Like, it was hard to get him into competition, but. But I personally know that he's, like, one of the strongest arm wrestlers, but he doesn't compete. Doesn't compete. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Strength's amazing, man. It's fun to chase strength.

[Joe Rogan]

It's not everything in your sport, though, which is interesting.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Strength, combat. So we're a combat sport that relies heavily on strength. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

It's interesting you consider it a combat sport.

[Devin Larratt]

It's 100% combat sport sport.

[Joe Rogan]

Why so? Because it's not applicable to real fighting. So why do you call it a combat sport?

[Devin Larratt]

I mean, real fighting is hard to define anyways. I mean, is it? Well, there's levels, you know, there's levels of real fighting. I mean, what we look at. I. I love ufc. It's cool. But we invented guns long ago, you know.

[Joe Rogan]

Of course, but that's not a sport. I mean, it is a sport in terms of, like, being able to shoot accurately and stuff like that, but you use an external device, using a weapon.

[Devin Larratt]

Right.

[Joe Rogan]

With your physical body. Combat sports. Why would you consider arm wrestling to be a combat sport?

[Devin Larratt]

Well, because it's between two people, and there's so much interplay and, you know, there's not the rigidity of a lot of sports that measure strength. Okay. It's very much adjustment, adaption, decision making. A lot of games, a lot of. A lot of technique, a lot of adaptation. You can be super strong, but if you can't adapt, if you can't think, if you can't speak, if you can't play.

[Joe Rogan]

Right.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, you're gonna.

[Joe Rogan]

But in that sense, do you consider football combat sport?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. There's two sides and you're fighting. It's metaphor. Okay. Look at all this stuff. I love the ufc, but I consider it a combat sport. Sport, you know.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, it definitely. Yeah, it's a combat sport.

[Devin Larratt]

100 probably one of the best examples of.

[Joe Rogan]

But the primary example, if I was

[Devin Larratt]

going to put together, like, you know, the ultimate, like, you know, we were going to take out, like. Like, if we were going to go to war against another nation or whatever, you know. Yeah, for sure. I'm looking at UFC guys, for sure. I'm looking at football guys, you know, looking at whoever can get the job done. And there's a lot of pieces to that, that.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, that's different. I mean, you're look, if they're going to war with just bots only using your body, that's one thing. But, you know, obviously, with war weapons rule above all.

[Devin Larratt]

Absolutely. Yeah. I think that that's where we're at these days, so.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, now we're with thumbs because now it's basically drones.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. You know. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

I mean, that's the. You're going to get to a point soon where human beings are going to be a role of it.

[Devin Larratt]

So when it comes to sports, arm wrestling is. Falls. For me, it falls into that combat sector, you know, where two people are engaging in a fight, a metaphorical fight against each other.

[Joe Rogan]

I get it.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, if it wasn't a combat sport, then the stronger guy would normally win, and he normally does. But as soon as you. I can get like. If I could get like a guy who's been practicing arm wrestling for like four or five years, they'll beat anybody. Anybody that's not practicing. It's the same thing as like a jujitsu guy. If you. If you give a jujitsu guy like four or five years on the mat and you get Brian Shaw or like some giant come in, who's gonna win?

[Joe Rogan]

It really depends. I could teach Brian Shaw a few things real quick.

[Devin Larratt]

Of course you could.

[Joe Rogan]

He could strangle pretty much anybody.

[Devin Larratt]

And Brian Shaw is an extreme example.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, but someone your size. Yeah, it's like size, the side, the sizes commensurate. Yeah. The person who's training. Yeah, they're gonna win every time. And. And small people dominate big people all the time.

[Devin Larratt]

Right. Because it's that technical, it's that skill based.

[Joe Rogan]

It's just. It's also repetition under. Understanding the positions, understanding mistakes, understand, you know, knowing where to be and what to do, how to flow, how to move with someone. So you're not just going strength for strength against them, you're flowing with them.

[Devin Larratt]

I think. I think of it as a combat sport as well, because I try and make it that way.

[Joe Rogan]

Right, well, you definitely do. And you definitely make it, like, psychologically.

[Devin Larratt]

I try.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah.

[Devin Larratt]

I try and pull all that stuff in.

[Joe Rogan]

But you have an extensive military experience too. Like, you started off, like, when. What. What is the Canadian version of what you would. What branch of the military you were in?

[Devin Larratt]

I was with a unit called JTF2 for 16 out of my 20 years. Yeah, it was great. I'd still be there if I could, really, but it got too complicated and I had to leave. But how?

[Joe Rogan]

So what do you mean?

[Devin Larratt]

It was. You know, I don't want to say it was entirely one thing or another, but it really probably had a lot to do with arm wrestling and the visibility of arm wrestling. Like, I've been arm wrestling my whole life, but Jesus was 19, I think. Or, sorry, 19. It was 2014, and we were on ESPN at the time. And up till that point, I was not declared military in the public eye. Like, I was a farmer as far as everybody was concerned. You know, I tried to play the operational security as well as I could, and, you know, I was an active, active JTF2 member. But there were a lot of concerns about the growth of arm wrestling for me and my, you know, exposure. And, you know, part of being an operator is, you know, you have to. You have to be anonymous. You get on an airplane, you can't have people taking pictures of you. Oh, right, right. So arm wrestling, because of where. Where I was, and it was on ESPN and going further, they're like, devin, you have to choose. And I'm like, oh, my God, I've been armor since I was a kid. So the long and short of that is they offer me a year off. Off, no pay. I took it. I took it. I took the year off. And we were. I was gathering apples and eating sardines and sending my kids to school with dried apples, and me and my wife were like, oh, my God, are we crazy? Like, are we crazy?

[Joe Rogan]

Just so you try to make it in arm wrestling.

[Devin Larratt]

It was. It was complicated. It was complicated. Yeah. I'd done, like seven tours.

[Joe Rogan]

And

[Devin Larratt]

it's weird, when you do a lot of tours, you know, things start to gray out a little bit. Everything is about mission in life, right? Like, everything. Like, if you don't have a good mission, your life is gonna fall to shit. And as soon as you start to question any kind of that, and, you know, you play in that realm long enough, most guys start to. At the beginning, I mean, you're just either so patriotic or, you know, just so down to, you know, help your country or whatever, or the people around you that you don't really. You're undeterred. And I think that probably sometime around that point in my career, maybe I was struggling slightly. And that combined with the. Them telling me that I wasn't able to do something, that was like, the only thing I did, you know, when I left work was kind of the thing that kind of make me take kind of a stand in my life that I was gonna, you know, follow sport instead of war. Sport's beautiful. Sports, very clearly building civilization and war, you know, the further you go in, it just gets to a level of merc where you're not sure. So.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, so when you say you're not sure, you're not sure if you should be doing what you're doing. You're not sure if the mission should be happening.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, because I think most people join the military and stay in the military because they genuinely believe that they're benefiting mankind or civilization to some degree. It's a big part of it. Not nobody's there for the money, you know, I mean, somebody at the beginning, some people are because we're broke. Right. But I mean, once you spend like 10 years, I mean, you're probably okay. And. Yeah, so it start. I mean, you. You play enough in that world and it starts to get confusing that you're maybe you're not doing the right thing. So. Look, I loved my work. I thought it was great. Loved all the people I worked with, some of the best people in the world. But yeah, it came to a point where there was some issues, you know, with opsec, not even in my career, but in others. And it kind of trickled down into unit policy, and they shut down everybody's extracurricular. And yeah, they're like, devin, you can't arm wrestle anymore. And I'm like, oh, my God, I'm a current world champion. Like, I am currently the open world champion. And you're telling me I can't do it? So I was like, yeah, we're gonna have to come up with some other solution. They're like, yeah, okay, years leave without pay. Here's your final offer. So we took it. And my wife and I were like, oh, my God. So, yeah, so I went from making non money and I had. And I didn't come. We didn't have money, you know.

[Joe Rogan]

But you were getting by.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, getting by. But it meant that on that year, I, like, had to win. It was no longer, like my hobby. It was like, if I don't win, like, my kids are like, not. I'm gonna have to sell a house or, like, I'm gonna have to do the gamble. It worked out. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

What was that stress like?

[Devin Larratt]

Dude, it was so wild.

[Joe Rogan]

How old were you at the time?

[Devin Larratt]

Okay, that was 2014, so I'd be 39. Oh, wow.

[Joe Rogan]

So you're already older as an athlete?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah. Wow. Yeah, it was totally trippy. I remember being so stressed out. I was so. It was, it was a wal finals. Okay. I was in the 225 pound division. 20,000 bucks for first place. Right hand, left hand. And I had a great sponsor. Okay. They were matching my pay, so anything I won, they doubled it. And they were doing some other stuff too, so. But, but if I lost, I got nothing. Right. So I'm, I'm in the back, I'm in the back in the warm up area and I'm, I'm breathing, I'm getting ready. I'm going against this guy, Ron Bath in the finals and longtime mentor of mine. Guys like my older brother, this guy Mike Gould comes over to me. He's like, Devin, he's like, like, he's like, you used to run the practice when you were 18. He's like, you're just here because you love it. Don't worry about it. Just go and have fun. And I'm like, okay, you're right, you're right. And I went out and I just had fun and worked out. But yeah, so I ended up, I ended up doing my year's leave without pay. As soon as I was taking my leave, they're like, we want you to declare, like we want you to tell people that you're special force is now. So I went from, why'd they want

[Joe Rogan]

you to do that?

[Devin Larratt]

Because they pushed me into recruiting. Yeah. So when I got back, I tried again. I think they'd already made up their mind. When I got back, I'm like, yeah, can I have my old job back? And they're like, you're gonna keep arm wrestling? And I'm like, well, you know, and they're like, okay, you're going to recruiting. And I was on. So at that point I was on my 19th year. Okay. And you only in the Canadian forces at that time. Now I think you need 25. But it was 20 years continuous service and you get like a base pension. So I did my 19th to 20th year. I went around Canada and I told people how great the JTF was and that was it. That was my career done. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Now full time armrest for the last 10 years.

[Joe Rogan]

What a jump at 39.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

That had to be so nerve wracking.

[Devin Larratt]

It was. I just, you know, I thought it was very selfish of me. You know, I thought that I was being very irresponsible. I thought, you know, because I really believed in soldiering. I did. And you know, to leave it, you know, made me Question very much whether I was doing the right thing with my life. And then on a family level, I was like, am I being irresponsible? Chasing this, you know, thing that I love to do, and it's costing my, my kids, you know, their, their university education. It's costing my kids, you know. But, yeah, we, we believed in it, we went for it, and it's all worked out. It's all worked out. I mean, it's been a second life for me. I still love all the guys I work with. Some of them are still working. My God, guys do like 30 year careers in the Special Forces. It's crazy. It's crazy. Yeah. A lot of the guys that I went through with, they're now in senior positions and I bump into them every once in a while. I just tell them how much I love them and how great they are and. Yeah, I live a civil, simple life now. It's beautiful. You know, like before, life was very complicated. Going on tours, you know, Special Forces. Life is super complex. You know, you're. It's, it's difficult to balance how my wife and I made it through that. I have no idea. I have no idea. But we did. But, yeah, now, Now I'm at home. Every day I wake up, unless I'm on, you know, going to some arm wrestling tournament. It's beautiful.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, I gotta think that the discipline that came from that life transferred over to the discipline of becoming a great arm wrestler.

[Devin Larratt]

I think I'm still learning today from my career year. I'm still digesting some of the greatest days and some of the stuff that I did. I'm still integrating it into my life. Yeah, it's a great teacher.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, you can't fail.

[Devin Larratt]

No, you can't.

[Joe Rogan]

It's just like the ultimate consequences, the ultimate stakes.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's beautiful. I, I love the concept of soldiering. I think I have it as one of the highest things that you can do. Like there's being a mother and there's being a fighter, you know, and I, I personally have always believed that one of the highest orders of fighters are the guys in the military, you know, the SF guys. Like, it's, it's, it's, it's pretty awesome. But, yeah, it's, it's, it's. I try and take all those lessons and bring them into the sport, and I try to. Well, I try and let that chapter of my life, you know, feed and inspire me today.

[Joe Rogan]

Do you talk much about your tours?

[Devin Larratt]

I don't. A lot. It's not that, you know, anything matters at this point. I mean, it's all, like. It's all in the past, and, you know, there's nothing that I could really say now that influences too much. But, yeah, I don't make it part of my general promotion too much, but everybody knows that I was. You know, it's a wild time in my life. You know, it's a huge chapter. You know, the military stuff. The tours that I did, you know, we. We did a lot of work in Afghanistan. So, you know, the highlight of my career is working in Kandahar, you know, working with the American forces, working with the indig forces. You know, we. JTF does, like, counterterrorism, so we're doing hits. Doing hits at night, you know, going out and various kinds. But, yeah, it was always funny to me. People would. Because people didn't know I was, you know, widely and be, oh, Devin's scared to come to this tournament. You know, And I was like, I am in a goddamn war right now. I am not scared to go to Nemro, because, you know. But, yeah, that's funny. Yeah, that must have been hilarious. It was so funny for me. I'm like, you have no idea how scared I am right now, what I'm doing. You know, war is a. War is a wild thing. You know, the degree that it psychologically affected me is. It's been neat, you know, I think that a lot of who I am was shaped by combat, you know, by the fear and the lacking that I had. Like, the not being enough to be everything I could be in combat shaped me so much, you know? You know, when you go on a tour and there's different people, there's different dudes. Okay. I know some dudes who really don't get scared. They really don't. Like, they're, like, so down for it. Like, they can't wait to go on the next mission, you know, And I was kind of the guy who was, like, completely scared shitless, but I go anyways, you know? And what I kind of learned to do, which I have a great value in, is kind of the separation of myself, you know, I am a very different person day to day than when I compete or when I, for example, went and actually did the job, you know, I. I would completely transform my character, and this is something that I learned. The first tour was hard. You know, you're a regular dude with a regular brain and a regular mindset doing this terrifying thing. And then, you know, you come back and you. You know, you've Seen a lot of shit. And you. You got ptsd. You wake up and your heart's going and. And it's like an injury. And you can let an injury kill you, or you can heal and develop some kind of resilience to it. And I think that I, to some degree did that by learning how to become a different person. People call it a switch, you know, where you like all your values. The person that you are is different.

[Joe Rogan]

Different.

[Devin Larratt]

You're not the same person when you're out in the field than you are when you're. You're back on base. And I created a Persona that loved it, looked forward to it, that lusted for it, because that's what you need to be to actually perform properly.

[Joe Rogan]

When you say you created a Persona.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

What was the steps like? What did. How did you do that?

[Devin Larratt]

Well, I think that one of the things is to really wrap your mind. I think the first step is to wrap your mind about the worst possible outcomes with any fear. And I don't know if a psychologist is going to tell you to do this, but, like, for example, like, I'll take it a step back and we'll talk about jumping. Okay. I don't like to jump in airplanes. Okay. Didn't really, you know, it's kind of scary. So I had a certain fear there. Okay. Now I got over it. I've got, you know, I've got hundreds of jumps. But what I did was I used to watch parachute fails over and over and over and over and over. And I just kind of desensitized myself to it and kind of became okay with it. And I think to a certain degree, I did the same thing with the overall concept of worst case scenario with the war, you know, kind of accepted that I'm gonna die. It's okay. I believe in the cause, believe in the mission. It's okay. So now I have to solve how to actually, how do I get to the best performance state to do that? And you have to love what you do. You gotta love what you do. So you have to find a way to love the violence. You have to find a way to love the aggression. You have to find a way to. And I think it's inside all of us. Yes. I think that the person that you are is who you've kind of created for a certain circumstance. But the truth is, you might act a little bit different when you're sitting at the table with your mother than when you're sitting at the table with your best friend to. When you're going out and doing a hit on the front lines. And it's a different psychology that's going to perform best in each of those. And it's learning that you are not necessarily one thing. You are whatever you want to be, you know, and you can. You can change that. You can. And you can become that. And the more time that you spend as that role, the more you roll it out, the more you build it out, the more you're comfortable with it, the more you might even look forward to doing it again. You know, I certainly rolled that psychology into my arm wrestling.

[Joe Rogan]

What's interesting, you say, I don't know if a psychologist would tell you to do that. I don't think a psychologist would have the ability to understand that experience even is. There's one thing about theory and about books and about learning in school. There's a giant difference between that and application. In a real world scenario where you might lose your life and you have to take a life, that's. I don't think there's a psychologist in the world that could explain that. That's why I'm always very hesitant about even sports psychologists or fight psychologists that, like, teach people how to prepare for fighting. Like, you could probably give a fighter some tools, but for you to actually tell them what needs to be done, if you're not doing that, how can you. What you're. It's just theory.

[Devin Larratt]

Theory.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah. And there's a giant difference between theory and application where you are trying to keep your fucking brain together in the craziest thing a human being can do.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Parachute down and gun people down. Like what? What is fucking crazier on earth than that? I say nothing.

[Devin Larratt]

Well, look, I used to have that attitude as well, but I've changed my attitude when it comes to that. I think that it's about excellence and mastery. I think that that's what life is about. And if you're in the soldiering realm. Yeah. That's excellence in mastery in that field. But I think wherever you are, if you're a businessman, if you're an artist, if you're a farmer, there's levels. You can be a farmer that has weeds and kind of doesn't get up at the crack of dawn or whatever, and then you can be a completely psychotic farmer, that does. And I think that you're on that level. You're on that level of mastery. And I think that that is what life is really about, is finding that thing that you're comfortable doing and becoming a master at it. Yeah. Am. Yeah. And now I am the Bonnie Blue of arm wrestling. Come one, come all. I got. I get the first base with everybody.

[Joe Rogan]

I gotta ask you about this, and this is a silly thing to ask you because you said Kandahar. Have you heard of the legend of the Kandahar Giant? Of course, yeah. What did you hear? When did you hear?

[Devin Larratt]

Oh, I've seen. Okay. There's some freaks out there, man. There's some freaks. So, yeah, I mean, I've seen the YouTube video. I've. I've heard about it from other people, but legit. Legit, okay. Hard for me because I was far away. Okay. I was probably about 200 meters away. We were doing a mobility exercise. Okay. Mobility. I hate mobility. Okay. Mobility was my least favorite. Off mobility. Basically you get a bunch of trucks and you kind of roll out and you kind of look for a fight. Okay. So we were doing like a two week mobility in this. This region kind of north, north of the Panjwe. I don't remember exactly what it was called. It was just surrounded by mountains, this big valley, and we were rolling around and. And so there was a village that we were going to check out. And I'm. I'm like a gunner, okay. So I don't know everything that's going on. I'm a dude on a machine gun, okay. But I can see everything that's happening. I kind of know what we're doing, but I know that there's a meeting. And what they have is they have these warlords. It doesn't. It's not the same kind of political system or anything that we have in, like North America. Kind of the baddest dude in the region becomes in charge. Okay? So we were meeting with one of the local warlords. And so the town was like 500 meters away. They drove out from the town about 500 meters. And we had our trucks about 200 meters from the meeting point. Our officer and a couple dudes went forward and we're looking. This guy, I mean, he was maybe twice as big. He was huge. He was a massive dude.

[Joe Rogan]

Look how big.

[Devin Larratt]

I think he was eight feet. I think he was eight foot something. And it's embarrassing. It's like, devon, you're crazy. He's big.

[Joe Rogan]

And he was 200 meters away.

[Devin Larratt]

He's about 200 meters away, but I can see the guys. We got optics. Our officer was probably somewhere at the bottom of his chest. Great big Afghan dude, big beard. Big dude. Big dude. And his lackeys around him were normal sized. Great big warlord. So they're out there, there's big people. There's.

[Joe Rogan]

Eight feet is nuts.

[Devin Larratt]

I have personally seen people who were probably over eight feet.

[Joe Rogan]

What?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

In Afghanistan.

[Devin Larratt]

No, no, I saw these guys up north. Northern Canada. Crete. I was up in Ojibugumo. Okay. This Cree village. I remember walking up. I'm there for arm wrestling. We're having an arm wrestling tournament. And I'm looking up, we're walking up the stairs in this hockey arena. This dude, I'm like, that's a really big dude. By the time I got there, I was about me and I'm like, six, five. I was about at his nipple.

[Joe Rogan]

What?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, big, big, big hands. Big long hands, like out of the Goonies, like, misshapen. And face. I'm like, my God. I'm like, like, how big are you? He's like. Just laughed at me and he's like, my brother. My. He's like, my dad's 8 foot 11. He's like, like, what? Yeah, big.

[Joe Rogan]

My dad's 8 foot 11.

[Devin Larratt]

I'm telling you, there's big people. And. And people don't know about him. Guinness doesn't know about him. They live up in the woods. There's big people out there and not all.

[Joe Rogan]

That guy, Jamie, he's from that region, apparently.

[Devin Larratt]

I don't know how to say that.

[Joe Rogan]

Eduard boy. So there's just giants that live in that region.

[Devin Larratt]

The Cree are very big people. And the thing is, is when they get to eat what they're supposed to eat, the problem is so many of them eat junk now, Right. Because they, you know, they grow up on pounds, maybe, or 367. Sorry.

[Joe Rogan]

Eight foot two and a half. 367 pounds. Age 33. Whoa.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. I forget the name of these brothers, but there. There's a bunch of of them. Yeah. Yeah. There's some weird genetics out there, you know? Yeah, yeah. We're going to try and swab them. I'll give it to Ryan before you know it.

[Joe Rogan]

But. So this guy in Afghanistan was this one isolated incident.

[Devin Larratt]

I saw one. Yeah, I just saw the one.

[Joe Rogan]

And he had to be 8ft tall.

[Devin Larratt]

He is big. He's big. Yeah, he's big. Big human being. Far out of the standard. Yeah. And he was a warlord. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. They're big. They're big people out there.

[Joe Rogan]

And so the Kandahar giant story, the guy is supposed to be even bigger than that.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah, I heard.

[Joe Rogan]

Believe it.

[Devin Larratt]

I. I do. Yeah, I do. There's freaks out there. There are.

[Joe Rogan]

But this guy supposedly had, like, six fingers and Six toes.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I believe. I believe that stuff. I. I just. I mean, I think that we get so used to normal people and every once in a while there's a weirdo

[Joe Rogan]

and these people are not being studied. There's no one there. Like, that region of the country is extremely remote.

[Devin Larratt]

Extremely, extremely. Like, they don't. It's like going back to like the 15th century. Like, there's motorcycles and some people have gas. I mean, but they don't have electricity. Yeah. There's not even really roads. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

And there was this one guy who was a warlord that was eight feet tall.

[Devin Larratt]

I saw him.

[Joe Rogan]

You saw him?

[Devin Larratt]

I saw him, yeah. From a distance. But I mean, there's no way he was any shorter. Like, he was huge. He was a massive. And he was broad across the shoulders too. He was probably twice as broad. Massive. Massive human. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

What was that like? Just seeing something like that.

[Devin Larratt]

That. It's wild, man. Yeah. You know, it's. It's neat. Yeah, yeah, it. It was. It was shocking. But. But, you know, it's neat how they structure their leadership. That's the guy in charge.

[Joe Rogan]

The most massive.

[Devin Larratt]

I hope he was a nice guy.

[Joe Rogan]

Probably wasn't.

[Devin Larratt]

I don't know. I don't know. I mean, he seemed reasonable. Like, we didn't get in the fight. Like, we didn't. There was no fight there. Wow. So we worked it out, whatever it was. But yeah, there's. There are anomalies. And. And it's. It's neat. It's kind of cool that he made it to a leadership position. So he must have been a smart guy too, and he must have been a good guy, because I don't think a dick could have been in charge.

[Joe Rogan]

So. Did you hear of that story, the Kandahar giant story? So the pose. Supposedly what happened is it's American military guys encountered this guy in the mountains.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

That was just absolutely enormous. They said he was like 12ft tall.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Well, what happened with the nephilim, you know? Right.

[Joe Rogan]

That's the thing. Well, that was. The thing is, like, supposedly they had six fingers and six toes as well.

[Devin Larratt]

Look it. I. I believe that things come to visit and sometimes things get left behind and who knows? Who knows? You know, there's a good chance that he's maybe just a little bit closer to all that. Or somehow a recessive and a recessive somehow found their ways together. And there you go.

[Joe Rogan]

And somehow there's a surviving population of these people still in the world that are undiscovered.

[Devin Larratt]

It's a Beautiful part of the world, that region. Perfect climate, super fertile. Like, if you were gonna. Like if there was nothing. What a beautiful place to start life. Afghanistan is beautiful country. So rich for agriculture. The climate is perfect. You know, with the mountains and the rivers, the seasons, it's tough to beat. You know, I would understand why people would fight so hard to have that territory. And, you know, if you were a giant, 12ft tall, and you could live anywhere you wanted, you know, in a valley where the rivers fed your land, I could pick there. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Did you hear that story when you were over there?

[Devin Larratt]

That story is famous. Yeah. And I asked around. I've never met anybody who was involved in that op. I haven't, but.

[Joe Rogan]

But it seems like a story that has something to it because there's too many people telling that story. There's only. Only one story like that.

[Devin Larratt]

There are a lot of stories.

[Joe Rogan]

There's more stories like that.

[Devin Larratt]

There are.

[Joe Rogan]

I mean, I should say there's only one story like that online that people repeat over and over again. This one encounter.

[Devin Larratt]

There are fascinating stories out there, some that I'm closer to.

[Joe Rogan]

Like what.

[Devin Larratt]

Probably the most interesting story that I'm in any way kind of close to is from that region of the world. And this is a whole nother can of worms. But it's. It's so weird. It's demonic possession. You know, we've. We had a guy. A guy. He was my. He. I worked with him very closely for. Super smart guy, great guy, awesome dude, awesome soldier. And. And, yeah, I mean, he got possessed by a demon. He started speaking in tongues. He knew everything about everybody. He could speak different languages. He. He knew everything about everybody's life. He knew all their sins. Yeah, he knew. He knew all the sins people did, even from their childhood that he got taken to. He got taken to the medical. Through the medical system. Before they knew it, he was out of the medical system. And he was with the padre. The. Like, the priest that comes along on some military missions. They. They did a. What do you call that when you cleanse the demon from. What do you call it?

[Joe Rogan]

Exorcism.

[Devin Larratt]

They did an exorcism. He. He. They sent him back to Canada. He. He's now watched by the church. He has to go and check in with the church every. Every. Every week. I don't know what to tell you, Joe. There's a lot I don't know, but. Yeah. And then. And the crazy thing was, is the priest who did the exorcism said he knew the demon.

[Joe Rogan]

He.

[Devin Larratt]

He'd already. Exorcist. Exorc. He'd already done the exorcism, like, three or four times.

[Joe Rogan]

Different people.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. That demon was, like, popping in and out of guys. Yeah. So other guy, Joe. I don't know what's going on in the world. I'm an arm wrestler.

[Joe Rogan]

Okay, but this guy knew things about you?

[Devin Larratt]

No, I wasn't on the tour, but the unit's very small. Okay. I. All the guys who were there, I have very close personal relationships with, and there's no reason for me not to trust him. And this is the. All the. And. And the guy who had it done to him, I'm very close with. Like, he comes over my. He was my stall part partner. Okay. And I see him.

[Joe Rogan]

When you say how to dun. To the guy who was possessed.

[Devin Larratt]

Yes.

[Joe Rogan]

You knew him?

[Devin Larratt]

I know him very well.

[Joe Rogan]

And what did he say about it?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, he doesn't like it very much. Yeah, he's. He. It scared him a lot. Yeah. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Does he recall being able to speak different languages?

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, he can remember it. Yeah, he can remember.

[Joe Rogan]

He can't speak those languages anymore.

[Devin Larratt]

No, it was like he was aware of everything happening, but he was like. He was a visitor. He was, like, there for the ride. Whoa. Yeah. Yeah. Apparently he. When it started, it started to, like. Started. He was freezing. He was locking up, and then he was locking. And then he started speaking in tongues, and then he was, like, fully. Joe, it's. It's. It's. It's weird stuff out there, man. There's a lot of things that we don't understand. Right. And. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know what to tell you. I don't know. It wasn't me, but I trust the story because I know the people. I know them. I know them very. I could hook you up with them. You want to talk to him? Tell you I'm nervous, Tell you all about it?

[Joe Rogan]

I don't think I would.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

And how long was he possessed for?

[Devin Larratt]

He was possessed, I think, for a couple of weeks. Maybe like a week or 10 days, something like that. Wasn't super long, but he was all messed up afterwards. Like, he got, like. He was done working after that, really. He retired medical. Wow.

[Joe Rogan]

But psychologically, like, it wasn't like he had a schizophrenic break. So whatever it was he came back from.

[Devin Larratt]

I don't know that schizophrenia can explain the language. I don't know.

[Joe Rogan]

I don't think it can. But what I'm saying is they didn't diagnose him as having.

[Devin Larratt]

No, the diagnosis was he had to go to church.

[Joe Rogan]

Jesus Christ. Literally.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, right. Isn't that wild?

[Joe Rogan]

That's so crazy.

[Devin Larratt]

That's one of the craziest ones that I've seen, personally.

[Joe Rogan]

Have you heard of other experiences like that where people have been possessed?

[Devin Larratt]

That's it.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, you would think that if a demon was going to visit someone, war would be the place to visit them.

[Devin Larratt]

And that's an ancient. That was in Iraq. That was in Erbil. Okay. And, I mean, that's an ancient, Ancient, ancient part of the world. Yeah. So whatever's like, history is long and misunderstood, and something's going on. Something's going on. I can't explain it. And I've kind of just been like. I'm kind of like, at this point in my life, I'm like, whatever. I know. I don't know everything. I'm just gonna. I'm just gonna do wrist curls in my basement for the next one. Yeah. He's awesome. Martin, if you're watching, come over. Let's party. Yeah. Yeah. I love this guy.

[Joe Rogan]

Does he talk about it?

[Devin Larratt]

A little bit. A little bit. I. I'm so curious.

[Joe Rogan]

Do you think he would come on here and tell the story?

[Devin Larratt]

Yep.

[Joe Rogan]

Really?

[Devin Larratt]

Sure.

[Joe Rogan]

Of course.

[Devin Larratt]

Of course he would.

[Joe Rogan]

I'm nervous.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Nervous.

[Devin Larratt]

Jamie. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Martin. Yeah. He's cool. Dude. Dude.

[Joe Rogan]

Wow.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah, I love him. I love him. Yeah. Great soldier. Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Brother, you've had a pretty wild life.

[Devin Larratt]

It's been great. Really? Ton of fun. Happy. Happy to be here. Yeah. It's been good. It's been good.

[Joe Rogan]

Well, I really enjoyed this conversation, man. I'm glad we did it, Joe.

[Devin Larratt]

Thank you so much. And really, like, I feel like it's kind of closing the loop for something with my brother.

[Joe Rogan]

Yeah, well, you should. We should tell everybody. I knew your brother before I met you online. And this is from your brother. Your brother made this candle, and this candle will now sit here. He is no longer with us, but the candle will remain.

[Devin Larratt]

Thank you so much for your time, Joe.

[Joe Rogan]

My pleasure, brother.

[Devin Larratt]

Anytime you want to get into arm wrestling, come on over. We'll get your grip strength working for you.

[Joe Rogan]

No, no, I'm good, but thank you. I appreciate it.

[Devin Larratt]

It wonderful.

[Joe Rogan]

And good luck.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah.

[Joe Rogan]

Beating that giant dude.

[Devin Larratt]

I'm going to need it.

[Joe Rogan]

Sixteen months.

[Devin Larratt]

Sixteen months, man.

[Joe Rogan]

Maybe we'll talk to you before then do it again.

[Devin Larratt]

Yeah. Cool. Okay. Thank you so much.

[Joe Rogan]

Thanks, brother.

[Devin Larratt]

All right.

[Joe Rogan]

Bye, everybody.