Gabriel Mizrahi (7:29)

He's like, oh, no, no, I'm definitely wearing it now.

Jordan Harbinger (7:32)

He's like, oh, I'm. Yeah, no, this is on now. So he lends me one of his, and I wear this thing. It's a little tight, but whatever.

Gabriel Mizrahi (7:38)

Hold on. I'm just catching up to this visual. So you and this Saudi guy. Yeah, and his sister.

Jordan Harbinger (7:44)

Yeah. Who's about 100 pounds lighter than me, by the way. I'm filling this thing out. But whatever.

Gabriel Mizrahi (7:50)

You look like a maester in Game of Thrones. And he just like, you guys are now hitting the town and you're dressed like a Saudi man. This is incredible.

Jordan Harbinger (7:58)

That's right. What a picture with my Saudi buddy picture. And the promoter knows what's up and he's like, oh, hey guys, what's up? Welcome in. So we go to this club and like I said, it's the hottest club in Hollywood at the time. So we're sitting at the promoter's table surrounded by the usual Hollywood types, models, muscle bros, out of work actors, some not out of work actors, not really my scene, but super funny and an amazing experience. And we see like the guy from the A team movie and the guy from the TV thing and the HBO guy. And then it was just so hilarious that my friends from Saudi Arabia come in and they're like, let's go maybe have a beer at a bar. Woo. Like let loose. And then it's no, we're going to the hottest club in Hollywood and dumping Grey Goose all over Instagram models. It's just like we're bawling.

Gabriel Mizrahi (8:42)

Also, yesterday you were American and today you're a member of the richest oil producing nation in the middle.

Jordan Harbinger (8:48)

And I'm wearing aviators indoors because that's how you do.

Gabriel Mizrahi (8:51)

Sure.

Jordan Harbinger (8:52)

Honestly, I only remember parts of the rest of the night because we got absolutely obliterated.

Gabriel Mizrahi (8:57)

Yeah, yeah, that makes sense.

Jordan Harbinger (8:59)

But one interesting detail I do remember about that week. Like I said, she didn't wear the burqa or the chador or anything while she was in the States. But I learned how some Saudi women handle that. She kept one in her suitcase for when she lands back home. And she had turned out she gave that to another girl that she stayed with. She never wears it if she doesn't have to. She said, I'm gonna buy one at the airport when I get to Saudi. And I'm like, oh, are you sure you can find one? She's like, there's a million places where you can buy this. At the airport in Jeddah. She also I thought was particularly interesting. She told me how she met her husband. So you can't just go somewhere and socialize. You're not just like at a university talking to the boys in your class. That's just not a thing. I guess that happens over there. So they met on Yahoo messenger of all places. Granted this is like mid aughts, so I don't even know if Yahoo messenger exists anymore. Anyway, either way, this was also not allowed or at least is dicey. But they wanted to meet up and you can't just be like, oh, I'm gonna go to my friend's place and then the guy shows up. Like that doesn't work either. This is a very strict society. So she told me this elaborate plot where the guy flew to her area on business and then went to her dad and said, oh, I heard you're a very esteemed businessman. I'm looking to get married. Do you know any single women between this age and this age who are interested or, like, I don't know how you do it. But he basically convinced the dad to introduce his daughter, her, to him even though they had already been talking for, like, eight months on Yahoo.

Gabriel Mizrahi (10:21)

What a weird con.

Jordan Harbinger (10:23)

Okay, isn't that weird?

Gabriel Mizrahi (10:24)

So weird.

Jordan Harbinger (10:24)

He basically thought, oh, it's my idea. I met this guy, they're hitting it off. I'm such a great matchmaker. Meanwhile, it's like a whole plot to just manipulate him.

Gabriel Mizrahi (10:33)

Wow. So they basically had to, like, con the dad into thinking it was his idea for them to meet and get.

Jordan Harbinger (10:38)

Yeah, he's, oh, I heard you're well connected. I'm looking for a woman to marry. And the dad was so flattered that he didn't go, huh, How'd you find me? Who told you about me? It was just like, my daughter's single, and he just brings the guy home or whatever or wherever this happens and introduces them. And they were kind of like, oh, cool, he seems nice. Let's get married. And meanwhile, they've been chatting online for eight months. It's so funny.

Gabriel Mizrahi (10:59)

So it worked out.

Jordan Harbinger (11:00)

Yeah. The other thing that was weird is I was like, hey, I heard you need your husband's permission to leave this country. And she's like, that's true. I said, how did you convince him to let you just travel around the US by yourself? She's like, I basically told him I was going to leave him if he'd said no. So I was like, oh, you don't have no leverage. You have some. She's like, here's the thing. I'm leaving him anyways. And I was like, oh, okay.

Gabriel Mizrahi (11:20)

Oh, okay. Such a weird end to that story.

Jordan Harbinger (11:22)

Yeah. She was like, just so you know.

Gabriel Mizrahi (11:23)

I thought it was like true love that they.

Jordan Harbinger (11:25)

No, I think it just, you know, it's hard to get to know somebody on fricking Yahoo. Messenger.

Gabriel Mizrahi (11:30)

And what about the brother? Was he attached or single or what?

Jordan Harbinger (11:34)

This took me a while to realize what was going on because you think, oh, it's a strict society. You don't realize just how strict it is until you start really talking to these folks. So her brother, he was constantly on Skype, Constantly Skype chat. And he would constantly have incoming calls at weird hours. And I remember a girl called him, and he answered with video. And I was like, oh, hi. And I waved, and she, like, ran off camera. And I said, oh, okay. Why you're wearing a tank top and shorts. I don't care. And he's like, this is bad. You can never see her like this. It's very bad for you to see her with her pajamas on. And I just thought, this is so ridiculous. But then I realized, nobody knows. She's calling him. She's calling him from bed. And that's why I was like, why are they calling you at night all the time? And he's like, hey, if they get caught chatting with a guy, they're in so much trouble. Imagine being a member of a conservative Christian family and they find out you're a cam girl or work at a strip club. That's the equivalent of your daughter calling a dude on Skype from Saudi Arabia. So what I thought was interesting is I go, so what happens? You just meet up with them? And he's like, no. And I said, how do you meet up with them? How do you make anything out of this? He's like, you can't. And I said, how many women have you talked with outside of your family? And he's like, none. Oh, man, can you imagine that? So he's only got these online relationships. He said one time he went to someone's house with a bunch of women, and he stayed outside and he saw the girl at the door, and she said, like, goodbye to him, and that was his contact with a woman.

Gabriel Mizrahi (13:08)

So strange.

Jordan Harbinger (13:09)

It's so bizarre. So just imagine how overwhelmed this guy was when girls at a club who are half drunk are sitting on his lap. You're so cute. Your fancy robe.

Gabriel Mizrahi (13:20)

0 to 100 with that one.

Jordan Harbinger (13:22)

0 to a thousand with a girl. Yeah. So it's a girl who guest starred on Pretty Little Lies on one side, and he's got a magnum of Gray Goose on the other.

Gabriel Mizrahi (13:30)

Yeah, wearing his traditional outfit is the funniest part of that.

Jordan Harbinger (13:33)

I will never wash this. It's got glitter on it. The whole trip was just peak couch surfing to be getting hammered in your 20s at an exclusive club in Hollywood with some Arab dude and his sister from Saudi Arabia. While we're both wearing traditional garb, they for sure never forgot their week in the United States. All right, Gabe, what's the first thing out of the mailbag?

Gabriel Mizrahi (13:55)

Dear Jordan and Gabe, my great Aunt Julia has reached the incredible age of 105 years old. Dude, that is so.

Jordan Harbinger (14:03)

That is so old. I mean that. Congratulations.

Gabriel Mizrahi (14:05)

I know one person who's over 100, but he's in rough shape and we don't kick it. Imagine having a 105-year-old person in your family. It's so cool. She lives independently in an apartment in New York while my mom, aunt, and I live in the uk. She's still sharp but profoundly deaf. The last time I saw her, she chatted away about all sorts of things, was energized by politics, and always had a lot to say. Over the last few years, we've kept in touch with Julia through her son Joe, due to her loss of hearing. It's a really important relationship. Julia's sister, my grandmother, passed away in Italy during COVID which was heartbreaking and reignited the importance of keeping in touch with Julia. In recent months, though, our correspondence with Joe ground to a halt. We sent Julia flowers on her 105th birthday but didn't get a response. We reached out to Joe and were blanked. After much Internet research, I found out through his employer's website that Joe had passed away. We hadn't been told. Even though he has children who could have easily contacted us, we all started to panic about who was looking after Julia and how she was coping. I found out where Joe's funeral was and wrote a message on the funeral home's memorial page. Joe's daughter Monica saw it, but she didn't respond. My aunt was eventually able to get an email address for one of Julia's neighbors, and the neighbor sent us a very distressing message. She said that Julia had come to see them shortly after Joe's death, crossing a busy road on her own to get there to say that Monica was going to put her into a home that she didn't want to go to. Monica lives 300 miles away from the home, so she would be unlikely to visit once Julia had moved to this home. The neighbors asked Monica where she was so they could visit, but Monica refused to tell them, saying she had been through enough and it would stir things up too much for them to visit.

Jordan Harbinger (15:57)

That makes me angry.

Gabriel Mizrahi (15:59)

There was clearly some bad blood there. The neighbor said that Jo had established three people as power of attorney over Julia before Monica, and they weren't sure why she was able to do this.

Jordan Harbinger (16:10)

Yeah, what's this woman's deal? This is so odd. Did Julia do something to her? Does she just love having control over this woman, which is scary to think about? What's weird is if you want to move somebody to a home, you usually move them to a home near you Not a home near where they used to live that you don't live near. That's really sus.

Gabriel Mizrahi (16:29)

Good point. Also, you would think that you would be thrilled that people want to visit Julia, considering that she lives so far away. That should make her life easier, right? It takes the burden off of her. If she doesn't want to spend time with Julia, what does she have to gain by keeping her hidden away? I don't get it.

Jordan Harbinger (16:42)

Yeah, this is very odd. She clearly doesn't actually like her. Hates her. Maybe she put her in a really depressing nursing home. That's cheap. And she didn't want anyone finding out and yelling at her to put her in a nicer one or bring her home or something like that. There's something going on here.

Gabriel Mizrahi (16:56)

Or Julia knows something else about Monica that Monica doesn't want people finding out.

Jordan Harbinger (17:00)

Bingo. Yeah, I think so. Or, and I hate to say this because it's so depressing and cynical, but in cases like this, you always gotta wonder who stands to benefit financially. Does Julia have assets? Is Monica isolating her so she can get her hands on them? Has she already gotten her hands on them and she's just hoping Julia passes away and can't do anything about it? Those are really the only rational explanations I can come up with right now. Otherwise, Monica is just a jealous, controlling. See you next Tuesday.

Gabriel Mizrahi (17:27)

We've obviously tried to contact Monica. We've even been texting Joe's phone and we can see that the messages have been delivered after a couple of weeks. Monica replied to one of my messages saying Joe is dead. Which clearly she knew we knew.

Jordan Harbinger (17:42)

Right. So Monica has Joe's phone and she's keeping it activated so she can read his messages.

Gabriel Mizrahi (17:46)

What the hell? Apparently so creepy.

Jordan Harbinger (17:49)

Maybe like, okay, when somebody calls to get the mortgage payment, I'll have to tell them that he's passed away. And I can get information. I mean, I kind of get that, but you don't reply to somebody. Joe's dead.

Gabriel Mizrahi (17:59)

Something's off.

Jordan Harbinger (18:00)

But it makes sense. If Joe was the legal point of contact for Julia, this must be Monica's way of intercepting any useful information that would otherwise go to jail. It's very.

Gabriel Mizrahi (18:08)

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. My mom and aunt have also contacted the Italian consulate in London and New York, contacted the police in the county where we believe Julia is, and written to every nursing home listed in the county she's in. Because we live in the uk, we can't afford to just fly out and knock on the door of every Nursing home in New York At 105 years old, the clock is ticking. We're desperate to see Julia again and want her to know that she hasn't been abandoned. It's too cruel to get to such an amazing age and not be surrounded by family. How else can we try to find her? What would light Jordan and Gabe and also dark Jordan do? Signed. Something peculiar about what they've done with Julia.

Jordan Harbinger (18:50)

Oh, man, what a sad story. I'm so sorry for Julia that she's being isolated like this, especially because she's still sharp. She's probably got a lot to offer. I'm so sorry for you, your mom, your whole family, these neighbors, everyone who loves this woman and just wants to spend some time with her. It's tragic, but it's very disturbing. As per usual. We wanted to talk to an expert here, so we reached out to attorney and friend of the show Corbin Payne. And Corbyn's first thought was contacting the police in Julia's county in New York, trying to get them to do a wellness check. That's a good idea. It sounds like you've tried and you haven't had any luck. We looked into this in more detail, and you might need to file a missing persons report for Julia. If she's officially missing, then the police might be more obligated or motivated to assist in locating her. Even if she is in a nursing home, the cops have access to resources like databases. They can usually talk to healthcare facilities with more ease than a civilian. Corbin's second idea. Reach out to Adult Protective Services. If you don't know, they're the agency that investigates exploitation or abuse of elderly people. It's a very important agency. Super useful. Now, we don't know if Julia's actually being abused or exploited. Like I said, I have some questions about Monica, but who knows? But I would definitely make a report. Tell them your story. Ask if they'll look into it. Now, if they do track her down, they might not be able to tell you where Julia is right now. These cases can really be sensitive, but Corbin said that at the very least, APS could try to get eyes on her, confirm she's safe and healthy. Just know that Monica will probably find out if APS manages to meet with Julia. And it's not going to take Sherlock Holmes to figure out who tipped him off. But also, it doesn't sound like you have much to lose. Your relationship with Monica is already strained, to say the least. I'm sure you'd rather know that Julia is alive and safe. Than stay in Monica's good graces. We're going to link to APS in New York State in the show notes for you. I would make that a priority. Corbin's other strategy. Reach out to those three other people Joe set up as power of attorney. See what they know. Ask them why they didn't take on the duty of caring for Julia. Something's weird about this. If you can persuade them that Monica isn't taking proper care of Julia, maybe they'll step up. Also, if you guys have a legal reason to find Julia, like enforcing a power of attorney, then the police might actually be required to assist, Although that usually goes through legal channels first. So I'd definitely try to get your hands on that paperwork. If you can't find it, track down the attorney Joe worked with to set all that up. They should have a copy and they can tell you what your options are. They might not even charge you at this point. Having that power of attorney paperwork might also help you get around any HIPAA laws. These are our patient privacy laws here in the United States. That might prevent a nursing home from telling you whether Julia is a resident. The other thing you could do is hire a private investigator in New York to find her licensed private investigators. New York probably has more than any other state. Maybe Texas, I don't know. But if I had to guess, New York seems like a place that PIs would be a dime a dozen. They have access to databases and other resources that the rest of us don't. They're also not as expensive as you might think. Definitely cheaper than flying back and forth trying to knock on doors yourself. If they track Julia down, they could maybe even go and visit her or just verify where she is. And then you guys could do a wellness check of your own. A PI might not be able to actually get into a nursing home, but I bet you guys could. Corbin said that Monica has the ability to order a nursing home to keep people away from Julia, but she might not have yet thought to do that, especially if she thinks nobody knows where she is. Another option, and I'd probably do this regardless, you could retain an attorney to reach out to Monica. If Monica thinks there might be a court case over Julia, maybe she'll back off and let you guys talk to her or at least tell you where she is. Or who knows? This could go the other way and make her dig her heels and more, but an attorney would be super helpful in advising you either way.

Gabriel Mizrahi (22:28)

Corbin said there is one last nuclear option here, which is you could file a lawsuit in New York asking to be named Julia's conservator. Now, you'll need to prove that Julia is either being harmed or neglected or is in imminent danger of being harmed or neglected. That's how the court allows for these arrangements. That's how it works in Tennessee anyway, where Corbyn practices. But that's my understanding in most states. Also, terms like neglect and harm, they have very specific legal definitions in the ordinary sense. And also, like in a general ethical sense, it sounds like Monica is not taking the best care of Julia, but that doesn't mean that she's neglecting or harming her in the legal sense of the term. Especially if she's in a home, then she has a roof over her head. There are people looking out for her. So it's hard to say if you would be successful here. Also, this would be a process. It would be quite expensive, and it will almost certainly destroy any relationship you have with Monica and anyone else in the family who sides with her. But again, I don't know how much of a concern that is for you.

Jordan Harbinger (23:27)

Yeah, I agree. I don't know if they'd have much luck there, even if they want to give it a go. So those are your conventional approaches? One dark Jordan idea I had. What if you contacted Monica posing as somebody from the state lottery, for example, or some sort of sweepstakes, saying that Julia has won a bunch of money, you need to get in touch with her. Something tells me Monica is going to respond to that, especially if she's trying to get the money for herself. And that's what this is all about. But you have to say that you guys need to verify her current residence or you need to talk to her directly in person to sign some. Whatever it is, that's maybe how you find out where she is. Now, is this strictly legal? Probably not. But you're not fraudulently posing as a state lottery official to get money. You're just trying to track someone down. And besides, you guys are in the uk, so New York state law can kiss your crumpets as far as I'm concerned. Right? Who cares? Look, I'm so sorry this is happening. It's super sad. It's gotta be very stressful. I hope you guys catch a break and you get to spend some time with Julia before she's gone. She is very lucky to have so many people who want to track her down and spend time with her. If you find her, it's going to be so sweet giving you and Julia a big hug and wishing you all the best. And by the way, if you do want to retain a private investigator in New York, get back to us. Because that's where Kevin Barrows works, isn't it? Primarily Gabriel?

Gabriel Mizrahi (24:46)

Oh, yeah, I think so.

Jordan Harbinger (24:47)

And he's like the guy. Retired FBI. He's been on the show before. He specializes in finding missing people. I don't know what his rates are or anything, but if somebody's missing in New York State, Kevin Barrows can find him. You know what's a great use of your imaginary lottery winnings? The fine products and services that support this show. We'll be right back. This episode is sponsored in part by BetterHelp. When did we all decide that struggling alone is kind of a flex? Like, oh, yeah, I'm totally fine while internally screaming into the void. Meanwhile, the people we admire, leaders, mentors, successful folks, they're out here actually asking for help when they need it. Maybe they're onto something. Therapy isn't just for when your life is in full meltdown mode. It's for learning how to deal with stress and relationship issues. And BetterHelp makes it so that you have no excuses not to get started. It's fully online. No sitting in traffic making awkward eye contact in a waiting room. They've got over 30,000 therapists, so you can actually find somebody who clicks with you. And if your therapist isn't a good fit, which pro tip, you definitely want to try a few out, you can switch it anytime, no extra cost. I've done that myself a few times. So if you've been meaning to try therapy, but you keep procrastinating, consider this your sign. Your future self, the one who actually has their life together, is going to thank you. Build your support system with better help. Visit betterhelp.comjordan to get 10% off your first month, that's BetterHelp. H-E-L-P.comjordan this episode is also sponsored by Deleteme. Ever get a scam call where they know your full name and even your address? Yeah. That is not just a weird coincidence. That is data brokers selling your personal info to the highest bidder. These companies collect everything. Your phone number, email, home address, even details about your family. And they don't just sell it to advertisers, scammers, spammers. All kinds of sketchy third parties can buy your data, too. Which means more phishing attempts, identity theft, risks, and worse. That's why I use and recommend Deleteme. It's a subscription service that tracks down and removes your personal information from hundreds of these data broker sites so you don't have to spend hours doing it yourself. And Deleteme keeps scanning and removing your data on a regular basis to make sure it stays gone. They also send you privacy reports so you can see exactly what they've found and erased, which is honestly pretty satisfying. Take control of your data and keep your private life private by signing up for Deleteme now at a special discount for our listeners. Get 20% off your delete me plan when you go to JoinDeleteMe.com Jordan and use promo code Jordan at checkout. The only way to get 20% off is to go to JoinDeleteMe.com Jordan and enter code Jordan at checkout. That's JoinDeleteMe.com Jordan code Jordan thank you for listening and supporting the show. All of the deals, discount codes and ways to support the podcast are searchable and Clickable over at jordanharbinger.com deals. Please consider supporting those who support the show. Now back to Feedback Friday.

Gabriel Mizrahi (27:23)

Okay, next up Dear Jordan and Gabe, I recently received a message out of the blue from my cousin's ex wife. Let's call her Megan. This was odd, not just because I've barely ever spoken to her, but because this cousin, her ex husband, molested me as a child. He was a child at the time too. Seeing this message raised a lot of complex emotions for me as I'm currently dealing with another immediate family member being investigated for similar actions. Megan was apologetic, but I couldn't help but feel that there was a motive behind her outreach. She claimed that she tried to advocate for me, but was berated for being a quote unquote bad wife and not standing by her husband for something that boys do. She went on to say how enabling my aunt is and how my cousin has always played the victim. I feel a knot in my stomach when I think that by minimally responding with appreciation for her acknowledgment and shared confusion for the family dynamics, I'll be fueling a drama seeking Wounded ex. I've worked very hard to heal through integrative therapy, meditation, microdosing, and bodywork. I have a wonderfully sensitive and courageous husband who continually shows me what men can be. We have two children and I love my life. I'm grateful to be in a place where this memory has lost the power to harm me, and yet I'm triggered by the negligence of Megan's approach. I'm grateful to her for acknowledging the wrong and reaching out to express her feelings, but I'm not sure she considered My feelings, what this would bring up for me, or if I'm in a place to receive this bomb? I'm also confused because there's no relationship to heal between us. I'm not interested in forming a relationship based on a perceived common enemy or within a live divorce. And I honestly don't want to know what's happening between them. How can I respectfully establish a hard boundary while still coming across with respect? Is she using my past to create a negative narrative for custody? How do I close this open loop? Signed, thrown by her tone and all these unknowns when I've already grown and I'd rather she leave this alone. Besides, does she want to atone or just bemoan her own woes?

Jordan Harbinger (29:38)

Gabe, that sign off was longer than the police report the cops filed last week. That sign off went on for days. Jeez.

Gabriel Mizrahi (29:44)

Oh, man, I can't stop thinking about that story, by the way. I can't believe that happened to you.

Jordan Harbinger (29:47)

Me neither. I can't believe I was the victim of an attempted hold up.

Gabriel Mizrahi (29:56)

Wow. Were you sitting on that the whole time? That was nice.

Jordan Harbinger (29:59)

No comment.

Gabriel Mizrahi (30:00)

I love that, though. That was a good remix of a classic.

Jordan Harbinger (30:02)

All right, so first of all, I'm very sorry that your cousin did this to you when you guys were kids. It's awful. It's traumatizing. It's all the things you know it is. And my heart goes out to you. We've taken several letters on the show from people who've experienced this kind of abuse, and it comes with its own unique traumas and challenges. So you're not alone in struggling with the aftermath of this. In a message like this, it can bring up a lot. It can put you in touch with some very painful memories and feelings. It can dredge up stuff you've mostly put to bed. I think that's all very normal. That said, it sounds like you've done truly extraordinary work in your life. You've come so far. I'm so happy to hear that. Good on you for seeking out the support you needed, for finding healing and insights from so many different sources. You should be really proud. So, look, I totally understand why Megan's message threw you. I also don't know what her intention was. It's absolutely possible that she was trying to express her love and support for you. And maybe she did that in a clumsy or ignorant way. Maybe she didn't think through what it might be like for you to receive that message. Maybe it would have been nice if she said, hey, I know this might bring up some stuff for you. Maybe you don't want to talk about it, but here's what I know. Here's what I'm seeing. And I just want to tell you that I'm on your side. And I'm here if you need anything that might have clarified things and landed better with you. But if Megan's never been through something like this, it might be hard or even impossible for her to frame things like that, to even imagine that her message wouldn't be welcome. Now, is it possible that she had some ulterior motive? Sure. Is she stirring up drama? Is she looking to bond with you over something dark? Maybe. Could she be trying to create evidence for a custody battle? Honestly, that makes a lot of sense to me considering that she's in the middle of an active divorce. The timing is pretty sus. But do we know for sure? No. It's also possible she's just trying to be kind and empathetic in her own weirdly imperfect way.

Gabriel Mizrahi (31:50)

It's also possible that reaching out to you is a way for her to assuage some guilt she feels about not holding her ex husband accountable, not calling out her mother in law, not being more supportive to you while they were together. Which, sure, that motivation might ultimately be more about her than you. And that would be something else she probably could have acknowledged in her message. But that doesn't mean that it isn't also about wanting to be kind and genuinely wanting to apologize and heal your relationship. Even if this is not a relationship you feel needs to be healed. None of this means that you're wrong for feeling weird. I'm just saying maybe stay open to a few possibilities here, like Jorphdan is saying. But I gotta say, Jordan, from where I'm sitting, she is 100% allowed to not engage with this woman if she doesn't want to. You don't owe her anything, especially as it relates to this very painful history. It's your history primarily. It's not hers. So if you don't want to talk to her about it, that is absolutely fair. And you could literally say, hey, Megan, thank you for reaching out. Thanks for sharing this. I'm sure you're coming from a good place. I can hear that you're having your own experience of my cousin. But respectfully, this is not something I'm super keen to talk about. It's painful, it's private. It's something that I've worked hard to move on from, so I'll just have to leave it here. And I hope you're well, it really could be as simple as that.

Jordan Harbinger (33:08)

It can be even simpler than that. If you don't feel like sharing your reasons why, just, Sorry, not interested. You could even ignore the message completely. Although I do appreciate that you want to close this loop. I'm the same way. I'd rather put something to bed than just dodge it, even if it is a little uncomfortable. But honestly, I don't think it requires much more than that.

Gabriel Mizrahi (33:25)

But before you do that, maybe just take a beat and decide if you want to know more about M3gan's intentions here. Maybe you don't and end of story. But I also don't think there's anything wrong with saying, hey, just so I understand where you're coming from, why did you reach out to me now? What were you hoping to get from this conversation? I just want to understand that better before I decide whether to talk about it after all of this. Time and again, I just want to stress this. There is zero obligation to do this. I'm just telling you that it's fair game. And it might give you the information that you need to decide how to feel about all of this. Because, look, Megan might in fact be a good friend to you through all of this, or she might be oversteppy and meddlesome and yeah, maybe she has her own agenda here. Or she might just be really tone deaf and misattuned and just doesn't have experience talking to people who have been through something like this.

Jordan Harbinger (34:14)

And how she responds to that question, that's probably going to tell you a lot about whether she's somebody you want to let in.

Gabriel Mizrahi (34:19)

I also wonder if what was difficult about Megan's message wasn't just her clumsiness, but having to be in touch with some difficult feelings again. And then wondering, I feel very triggered by this. Am I really as healed as I thought I was? Do I really have all of this sorted, which I think is very normal. You said in your letter, I'm grateful to be in a place where this memory has lost the power to harm me. And now all of a sudden, I wonder if it feels like this memory does have the power to harm you because of what Megan brought up in her message. I can imagine that would be unsettling. The anger that you feel toward Megan for the negligence of her approach might be warranted if she really is not being very thoughtful, or maybe if she does have some ulterior motive. But it's possible that part of your anger is simply about being in touch with this wound again at all. And yes, that is one more reason that Megan should have been way more thoughtful about how she framed all of this, or maybe should not have reached out to you at all. But it might also be a reason for you to meet this reaction that you're having with a little more curiosity, a little more compassion, and to remember that even if you're in touch with this wound sometimes, which is not entirely under your control as you're finding out with this message, that doesn't mean that you haven't made massive progress in your life or that you're somehow in trouble or that you don't have the tools to process this pain, because you do.

Jordan Harbinger (35:43)

Good point. That's actually what I think her letter is about. Not just what to do about the Megans who trigger you, but how to move through these moments when the legacy of this abuse pops up again. Megan is the easy target of that anger. And like you said, that might be appropriate to some degree. But I get the sense that this anger is best directed at this cousin and perhaps his mom, if she really did enable him. And I also wonder if she might be a little angry at herself for simply being vulnerable in this department. Look, I haven't gone through what she's gone through, but I can relate to that. Sometimes somebody will pop up in my inbox and say something thoughtless that pisses me off, and I'll hear myself going, hey, screw you. Why would you say it that way? Or whatever. And then I'll go, okay, I'm a little raw in this department, feel a little off kilter. This person just revealed that to me, so maybe I also need to look at that. So I'm with you. It's important to parse our anger and make sure we're directing it at the right people and drawing the right conclusions from it. Also, I would talk to your therapist about all this if you're still working with them and see what they say. That's a great place to talk through the upsides and downsides to engaging with Megan and more importantly, whatever her note has brought up for you. But again, this is totally up to you. We're just inviting you to get more curious about what Megan's note is bringing up for you and your process, in addition to whether you want to take her up on this invitation to chat, sending you a big hug and wishing you all the best. You can reach us Friday@jordanharbinger.com Please keep your emails concise. Try to use descriptive subject lines. That makes our job a whole lot easier. If you're locked in an endless custody battle with a psychotic ex? You're gaming out career moves in this highly unpredictable world. Or your doctor friend is accusing you of victim blaming after they had an affair with an abusive mentally ill patient. Whatever's got you staying up at night lately? Big or small, hit us up@Fridayordanharbinger.com we're here to help and we keep every email anonymous. Also, our newsletter wee bit Wiser. It's a bite sized gem from an episode from us to you delivered right to your inbox most Wednesdays. If you want to keep up with the wisdom from the show, I invite you to come check it out. You can sign up@jordanharbinger.com news okay, what's next?

Gabriel Mizrahi (37:43)

Dear Jordan and Gabe, I work in a very busy branch of a local credit union. We're one of the best in our area. An excellent customer experience is expected and I'm very good at what I do. But the area manager, let's call her Diane, and the regional manager, let's call her Becky, are your typical corporate mean girls. They like to gang up on certain employees and make their lives miserable. Diane is the big problem. She's manipulative, doesn't like to be out of the loop on anything, and is a legendary micromanager. She's insisted we always reply all to emails for requests so she can make sure we're doing our jobs and has even gone as far as to watch the cameras to make sure we were accurate on our time cards. She recently found out that I had applied for another position with another department, which would mean moving up to an amazing position and being out of her control. She was livid. There's absolutely nothing wrong with what I did. I followed protocol and the assistant branch manager and the branch manager gave me the green light to apply. But Diane said something to Becky which prompted some weird comments during a meeting about how if anyone wants to apply for one of these other departments, the area manager must be notified.

Jordan Harbinger (38:57)

What a cartoonishly petty, annoying boss this woman is the worst. Getting strong Monica vibes from Diana over here.

Gabriel Mizrahi (39:05)

She doesn't want me to advance in my career. She all but said that to me months ago during a review where I laid out my goals for the year. One of those goals was to shadow the department that I applied for and she wouldn't allow me to with no other reason than get better at your current role, which makes zero sense because my metrics are improving month over month. I'm meeting or exceeding goals and I have a member base that loves Me and would not like to see me go.

Jordan Harbinger (39:32)

That might be part of what's happening. I wonder if Diane wants you to stay where you are because you're a hit with customers in addition to the control piece, because that's good for her. It reminds me of these guys who. They're like the best coder in their department at Amazon, and they're like, why can't I get a promotion? It's like, because you're the best coder and they want you to be a workhorse, not a manager. Or they want you to be a workhorse in their department, not a workhorse in a better department because they don't care about you.

Gabriel Mizrahi (39:57)

It would explain almost everything about the situation since this happened. I interviewed for that job. It went very well. They thought I was a great fit and loved me. But ultimately they went with another candidate with a little more experience. So I'm going to do what I can to gain more knowledge to position myself for the next opportunity.

Jordan Harbinger (40:14)

Love it. I'm sorry you didn't get the job, but it's a great mindset to have.

Gabriel Mizrahi (40:18)

Yeah, I appreciate that a lot. Today, my assistant manager, let's call her Tracy, confided in me that she felt like Becky and Diane were trying to push her out because she should have said something to our new branch manager about Diane not wanting me to apply for other roles in the company.

Jordan Harbinger (40:34)

How many managers does this credit union have? What is going on here?

Gabriel Mizrahi (40:38)

I don't know, man. Straight up, gaggle o managers at this place.

Jordan Harbinger (40:41)

Yeah, Elon, get in there. This org chart is insane. That's my main observation so far.

Gabriel Mizrahi (40:46)

Yeah. Way too many diagonal lines at this place. I don't get it. So she goes on. We've both reported Diane to HR over the last year for many reasons, most of them about the way she talks to us. I won't get into the offhand comments she's made. I'll just say that she's very backhanded in her compliments. As a result of all of this, we seem to have developed targets on our backs. I want to be able to advance in my career without the threat of needing approvals, and I don't want Tracy pushed out. She's amazing. I love working for her and she's been a rock throughout. A lot of turnover and upheaval over the last two years. Is there anything I can do here? Signed. Rising up at this credit union when I'm not getting much credit and there's very little union.

Jordan Harbinger (41:29)

Oh, man. I'm very sorry. You're dealing with all this. The Diane's and the Beckys of the world are so irritating, so petty. They can make life miserable and they really have no business managing people at all. The fact that she's making you unhappy and preventing you from moving on is so lame. So weird. You reported her to HR and she still wants you to stay in her department. Any rational boss who had an employee making their life difficult would be like, yeah, sure, get her out of here. Be someone else's problem.

Gabriel Mizrahi (41:55)

Good point.

Jordan Harbinger (41:55)

Not that you're a problem. I just mean Diane, of course, probably sees you that way. So that means she's getting something out of keeping you where you are. Either your talent or your reputation with customers, or the opportunity to control you and. Or enjoy retaliating against you for what you did. All of which are super gross. So here's what I'd do if I were you. First of all, I would keep your eye on the prize here, which is to rise up to explore these exciting opportunities. It's not to win against Diane, at least not directly. She's clearly an obstacle, so you have to give her some thought. But as much as you can, don't get pulled into fighting dumb battles with a petty boss. What I would focus your energy on is doing everything you can to keep growing and positioning yourself for a promotion. And that comes down to a few basic things. Investing in your relationships inside your company, outside your company. Building up your knowledge, your skills. Doing online courses, taking on more responsibilities at work so you can learn. Continuing to crush it, exceeding your goals, Making sure that your wins are visible to senior people beyond Diane. And basically just putting one brick in the wall every single day. Now, I know Diane is c blocking you from shadowing this other department, and that sucks. But that doesn't mean you can't find another way. If I were you, I'd just go straight to the people in that other department and be like, hey, I want to learn more about what you do. You want to grab lunch and then ask all your questions, or stay an hour later, a couple days a week, and pitch in in that department. Informally cross train with them, essentially. Or give this department a couple hours of your weekend off the clock, whatever that looks like. If that's a thing at Banks. I don't know. You guys seem to clock out when you CL out. But I'm sure your colleagues in these other departments will love you for this. And you'll basically be interviewing for future openings before they are even announced. And I'd keep finding clever workarounds like that. Every time Diane blocks you, treat it like a game. How can I maneuver around this person? How can I use her to show me where I need to be more proactive, more creative? She might be able to control where you physically spend your day, but she can't control how you use your mind and how you spend your time outside of work. The other reason your relationships are so important here is they're gonna start to tilt the balance of power here. Diane has the power right now in some limited way. She can make up policies. She can tell you, oh, go there, do this. Don't talk to those people. CC me on every dumb email with your lunch order in it. And you gotta play along to some degree. But if you start to develop great relationships across the bank, especially with more senior people, if you have a few key champions looking out for you, I promise, one day soon you're gonna have more power than she does. It could be as simple as somebody who's higher up poaching you for their department and telling Diane, sorry, too bad, she's ours now. Or it could be HR taking your next complaint more seriously because you built great bridges with them and they're more inclined to fight for you. Relationships are the greatest form of capital. They're more powerful than money. Experience, time. So I would really orient your plan around cultivating great relationships. And speaking of hr, I would not keep reporting Diane unless it's absolutely warranted and necessary. But I would keep documenting everything she does that's problematic so that you have a record of it. Quick notes is all you need. Nothing too involved. Dates, times, comments, witnesses, all of that. Then if Diane ever does something truly egregious or she becomes an insurmountable obstacle to rising up, like you have no prospects at this place because of her, then I would consider going to hr, ideally with Tracy's support, so they hear it from more than one person. And then your months of documentation could just bury her. Also, if you talk to hr, I'd focus less on the petty behavior like. Like the backhanded compliments, and more on behavior that creates legal risk, stuff that's more easily definable. Retaliation, discrimination, favoritism, creating a hostile work environment, that kind of stuff. And I'd also make it clear to HR what the impact of Diane's behavior is. How it's affecting productivity, morale, the bank's ability to retain good employees, for example. If it's true that Diane is trying to push Tracy out for not enforcing a completely made up policy that benefits her, that's specific that could be considered retaliation, and that's something HR would probably take more seriously. But again, don't make it your mission to get Diane in trouble. The time you'd spend writing up a memo or being interviewed by HR about all this, that's time I'd much rather you spend shadowing or doing a class or crushing it in your role. The real victory will be moving up and getting away from her. And if none of this works, then I'd consider jumping ship to another credit union. If you do everything we're talking about, you're going to be positioning yourself for a great role one way or the other. Maybe you rise up here and you get out from under Diane. Maybe you meet a manager at another bank and you tell them your story and suddenly you have a job offer. In the meantime, stay laser focused, be unflappable. Don't give Diane any more fuel than necessary, and channel all this anger into your job search. Keep climbing. Good luck. Now go CC Diane's busy body micromanaging ass on this word from our sponsors. We'll be right back. This episode is sponsored in part by Audible. Okay, let's talk about the new year. You're probably thinking about resolutions, like maybe hitting the gym. You're gonna eat better. Maybe you're gonna finally organize that junk drawer that could double as a time capsule from the 90s. But here's an easier one. Let Audible expand your life just by listening a little bit. Like this podcast. But seriously, Audible makes self improvement feel doable. They've got over a million audiobooks, podcasts, and exclusive Audible originals. This show is the app if you want to get fit without actually leaving your couch. There's advice for that if you need relationship tips that don't involve arguing over the thermostat. Okay, they got you covered. If you're thinking about making a career move or tackling your finances, they've got listens for that, too. And the best part is you can learn and grow while doing stuff you already do. Commuting, working out, folding laundry. Like an absolute champion. Suddenly you're crushing your goals and you didn't even break a sweat. Unless you listen to audiobooks while you're working out. Then sweat away. Start your 30 day trial at audible.com jhs it's like a personal trainer for your brain without needing to break a sweat. This episode is sponsored in part by Strawberry Me. You know, I'm a big believer in coaching. I've got a fitness coach, a nutrition coach, a voice coach. I used to be a coach myself. It's simple. Anytime I can save by learning from somebody who's trained in what I want to master, it's money in the bank. Why waste time fumbling around trying to figure out things when you can have somebody guide you along the way? Well, that's when Strawberry Me approached me and I was like, heck yeah. Absolutely. Strawberry Me makes personal growth/life coaching accessible and within four hours they had me connected with a certified coach. It's online, affordable, incredibly flexible. You can schedule live video sessions that work with your schedule. You can message your coach at any time if the coach is not a fit, switch anytime, no additional cost. So whether you want to work on your career or financial growth or life transitions, you got some self doubt. Time management, Building healthier habits, staying motivated. Their network of certified professionals has somebody who specializes in exactly what you need. Visit Strawberry Me Jordan today and get a $50 credit applied to your first session. That means you can try personal coaching for as low as 25 bucks to see if it's right for you. This episode is sponsored in part by the Defender. We all have those big goals that seem just out of reach, right? But the truth is, that's what keeps us moving forward. For the people who embrace challenges and explore their way, there's the Defender. The Defender is built to handle whatever comes its way with legendary capability on road or off. It's engineered with a tough, rigid body, tested to the extreme and built with durable, lightweight architecture for strength and confidence. But it's not just about ruggedness. It's an icon reimagined with a design that feels modern yet honors its adventurous roots. Plus, there's a Defender for every kind of Explorer, from the Defender 90 to the 110 and even the 130, which seats up to eight people. So whether it's just you or the whole family, there's a model for your journey. If you're ready to embrace the impossible, the Defender is your perfect partner, beyond capable and ready to go wherever you're headed next. Build your defender@land roverusa.com if you like this episode of Feedback Friday and you find our advice valuable, I invite you to do what other smart and considerate listeners do. Take a moment and support our amazing sponsors. All of the deals, discount codes and ways to support the show are searchable and Clickable over at jordanharbinger.com deals. The AI chatbot is also there to help you surface codes, and if that doesn't work, you can email me jordanordanharbinger.com, somebody here will dig up the code for you. Yes, it is that important that you support those who support the show. Now back to feedback Friday. Okay, what's next?

Gabriel Mizrahi (50:20)

Dear Jordan and Gabe, my older brother Dave has had a rough life. He was misdiagnosed with ADHD at 6 years old and he was bullied throughout elementary school by both classmates and teachers for being different. The bullying got so bad that when he was in the fifth grade, my mom decided to pull him out of school and homeschool him. This did not go well because my mom was wildly inexperienced and unprepared to teach grades 6 through 12. As a result, Dave never earned his high school diploma or ged.

Jordan Harbinger (50:52)

Oh man, this is so sad. Bullied by students and teachers and then he doesn't get the education that he needs on top of it. This poor guy.

Gabriel Mizrahi (50:59)

When Dave was 15, he got into legal trouble after fooling around with the girl next door. He was let off with probation and the incident did not go on his permanent record, nor was he required to register as a sex offender.

Jordan Harbinger (51:13)

Oh, okay, that's intense. So she was too young. Clearly. Otherwise. Look, this is usually a non issue for two minors. If it's like a 15 year old boy and a 14 year old girl, okay. But if it's like a 15 year old Boy and a 10 year old.

Gabriel Mizrahi (51:25)

Girl or 11 or something, sounds like what happened. But this experience devastated his self worth and gave him severe social anxiety. I trust him with my life and I don't believe that he's a threat to anyone. At 19, Dave was formally diagnosed with high functioning Asperger's syndrome.

Jordan Harbinger (51:44)

Interesting. So that has since been folded into autism spectrum disorder in the dsm.

Gabriel Mizrahi (51:49)

Yeah, that's right.

Jordan Harbinger (51:50)

So I assume that played some role in the incident with the girl next door. Maybe not. But maybe they're totally unrelated. But I know ASD can make it hard to read certain cues, control certain impulses. It can impact decision making in general, even if somebody is high functioning.

Gabriel Mizrahi (52:04)

He found some peace by volunteering at our local humane society. And after he turned 18, they hired him full time in animal care. Though he no longer works there, he still works in animal care, which seems to be something he enjoys. But at 27 years old, Dave still struggles with self control and personal responsibility.

Jordan Harbinger (52:23)

Interesting. There you go. That might help explain that incident with the neighborhood.

Gabriel Mizrahi (52:27)

For example, he needs reminders to take showers, brush his teeth and put on deodorant. He lives with my parents and spends most of his money on things like Legos and video games. He won't get his driver's license because he's terrified of driving. So he takes the bus to work, or sometimes my parents drive him. Dave shuts himself in his room. In social situations, he usually sits in the corner and scrolls through his phone. He's very socially anxious, and it's clear that he struggles to connect with people. I largely blame my parents for not setting him up for success, especially my mom. She's a covert narcissist, and my dad is a pushover. They still defend their decision to pull him out of school, and they aren't doing anything to help him move forward. I believe in Dave and think he has the potential to live independently and support himself, but my mom disagrees.

Jordan Harbinger (53:20)

Look, I know it can be hard to know how to best care for a child with special needs. It's confusing. How much do we accommodate them? How much do we empower them to be on their own? How much do we protect them? So I feel for your parents there. This is a really challenging child to have. It's a lot. But it does sound like they might have made some pretty big mistakes, and they are not owning up to those now. And they might not be helping him become independent, which it sounds like he might actually be totally capable of, even if he does forget his deodorant here and there. And that's really worrisome. What does a person like Dave do when his parents die?

Gabriel Mizrahi (53:52)

I think about that a lot. And I think also about how that burden so often falls to the person's siblings, which is very intense.

Jordan Harbinger (54:00)

It's not fair.

Gabriel Mizrahi (54:01)

No, it's not.

Jordan Harbinger (54:01)

This is not his son. That's quite a burden to carry. And meanwhile, the parents don't seem to be doing much to make this as easy as possible down the road.

Gabriel Mizrahi (54:08)

Yeah, absolutely. Let's come back to that. So he goes on. Since I was 16, my mom has been practically begging me to take care of Dave when they can't anymore. She breaks down in tears every time she brings it up.

Jordan Harbinger (54:20)

Of course she does, because she knows that her tears are going to manipulate you. Now, that's a cynical view, but you said she's a covert narcissist, so it's par for the course. Look, this is not okay. I feel very strongly about this. I can understand why she's emotional, assuming her tears are not. Again, just a way to prey on your sympathy. But for her to put Dave's care entirely on you, starting when you were a teenager. Not okay. And apparently unnecessary.

Gabriel Mizrahi (54:44)

Totally agree. I'm actually very impressed that you're strong enough to Be able to say, not so fast. I have a life, too. I can't just orbit around Dave forever.

Jordan Harbinger (54:52)

Yeah, good for you. This is going to be a crucial boundary for you to actually enforce.

Gabriel Mizrahi (54:57)

While I love and care about my brother, and I'm not opposed to putting in some effort to help guarantee his well being, I've just had my first child, and I want to grow my own family without Dave being my primary focus. I've suggested that my parents enroll him in an adults with autism program to help him get on his feet, but they refuse, insisting that it won't help.

Jordan Harbinger (55:18)

Fascinating theme on today's episode, huh, Gabe? People clinging to control over situations instead of letting go, letting people in, being open to new approaches. Just incredible how much that can backfire, right?

Gabriel Mizrahi (55:30)

I'm so curious to know what the parents have to gain by keeping Dave close.

Jordan Harbinger (55:35)

Narcissistic supply for mom.

Gabriel Mizrahi (55:36)

Is that all it is?

Jordan Harbinger (55:37)

Yeah.

Gabriel Mizrahi (55:38)

Or letting someone else in would mean that they have to admit that they can't do it all themselves or that.

Jordan Harbinger (55:44)

They screwed up their kid, which a narcissist is not gonna want to do.

Gabriel Mizrahi (55:47)

But this is just putting him in a program that any adult with autism would benefit from. It's not necessarily an indictment of them.

Jordan Harbinger (55:53)

But if he becomes independent and actually goes, you know what? I don't need Mom. That's her worst nightmare.

Gabriel Mizrahi (55:59)

Then they don't. Ah, so it's about they need to feel needed.

Jordan Harbinger (56:01)

It's not that it won't help. They're actually afraid that it will help. That's my bet. I think they're afraid that it will.

Gabriel Mizrahi (56:07)

Help, but then they also want their other son to take care of him when they die or when they slow down. Unclear. But, yeah, you're right. My parents are in their 50s now, and they're starting to slow down physically. How do I make sure Dave is set up for success when my parents can no longer take care of him? How do I handle this with my parents who are set in their ways? Signed, charting a course to get my rents to endorse some helpful supports so they don't just outsource my brother's care to me. Of course.

Jordan Harbinger (56:36)

Well, put Dave in the program and kill your parents. Not necessarily in that order.

Gabriel Mizrahi (56:40)

Darkest of dark, Jordan takes right there.

Jordan Harbinger (56:43)

Yeah, I'm kidding. Do not do that, Menendez. All right, so this is a really good question. This is so intense. Look, like I said, I really feel for you here. I obviously feel for Dave, too. It's a really tough diagnosis to have. It's a tough life he's led. My heart breaks for anybody who was treated poorly, who struggles to take care of themselves. And I feel for your parents too, despite their flaws and their mistakes. They obviously didn't ask for this. And I'm sure that raising Dave has been extremely challenging, to say the least. But right now I largely feel for you. Because not only have you been impacted by having a sibling like this, your parents are putting a massive responsibility on you. And as you can tell, I'm a little angry about that. Not because Dave doesn't deserve love and support, of course he does. But because taking care of him for the rest of your life, that is not fair to you. You have your own family now. You have your own life. And caring for your brother, Dave forever, it does not even sound necessary. So let's get tactical here for a moment. I think your first order of business is to start working with your parents to put some structure around Dave that'll allow him to live independently as much as possible. And I'd start now because certain programs can take a while to access and you want to have all the pieces in place before your parents are too old to care for Dave. Specifically, I'd start looking into options for housing, supported living arrangements, options to live alone with, support services, group homes, co housing communities designed for neurodiverse individuals. There are tons of options out there. I would also think about what Dave is going to require financially. That might mean setting up a special needs trust. That's a kind of trust that protects a person's assets without jeopardizing their eligibility for government benefits. That is a super useful thing to have in place. It can be managed by a trustee who could be you. I would also look into something called an able account. That's a tax advantage savings account for people with disabilities. Lots of helpful financial products out there. On the legal front, you're going to want to look into whether you guys should have some kind of guardianship over Dave or allow for something less restrictive. Basically supported decision making where he gets to call a lot of the shots with your input. Obviously the housing money, legal pieces of this, that's all top priority. Because Dave struggles with self control and personal response. The last thing you want is to set him up with a bank account and he drains it in a few months to buy a bunch of expensive Lego collector sets on ebay or something like, I know that sounds like I'm being mean, but if he's got impulse control and he spends all his money currently on Legos, that might not change when your Parents are gone, it might just get worse. You're going to want to talk to a family attorney and, or an estate attorney about all of this. Maybe somebody who specializes in disability law. That's going to be key. Healthcare is another area you're gonna wanna look at, although I'm not sure that there's a ton for you to do here right now. Basically just make sure Dave has access to doctors, that he can talk to a therapist if he needs to.

Gabriel Mizrahi (59:31)

Yeah, I agree that that's slightly less urgent, but it actually is very important in Dave's case because it sounds like he has really severe social anxiety and it does not sound like he talked to anybody after that incident with the neighbor. Apparently that whole experience left him with some serious issues. The severe anxiety. He's probably very scared of other people. Sounds like it was traumatic for him and for the victim and that might be holding him back from building his own life in all sorts of ways. So if he could talk to a therapist, I would love that.

Jordan Harbinger (59:59)

Yeah, that's true. That is sad. I also think some general life skills would be nice. Cooking, budgeting, advocating for himself, maybe some vocational training, supported employment services. And then there's the social aspect of all this. Clubs, interest groups, maybe pairing with mentors through a non profit who can give them some guidance, some friendship. I know you said he's kind of a loner, but I also wonder if your parents didn't encourage this part of his personality very much. I don't want to go down a whole rabbit hole of resources here, but we went ahead and gathered a bunch of great ones for you. From financial planning to housing to employment support to mental health. We're going to drop all of that stuff in the show notes.

Gabriel Mizrahi (60:36)

Yeah, highly recommend checking those out. I think they're going to give you a running start on all of this. Now look, I know you're up against a lot with your parents. You're up against your mom's apparent narcissism, you're up against your dad's passivity, you're up against their general rigidity about all this. I'm sure all of that comes from God knows where the deep stuff comes from. But it sounds to me like there's a lot of fear and guilt, denial and probably just feeling totally overwhelmed after years of this. But it's going to be an obstacle to getting things done. So when you talk to your parents, I would try to understand their feelings as much as possible. Make them feel heard. I know it's difficult, but your empathy for them is Key. And I think it could slowly lower their defenses and make it safe for them to start at least imagining other ways of taking care of Dave. So before you go in there and start pitching solutions, you might want to make some space for them to talk about how they feel without being judged, talk about why they're resistant, and just listen and try to validate that for them. You could be like, look, I hear you. The future is overwhelming. Mom, I get it. I understand you, dad. You don't want anyone else taking care of Dave, that kind of thing. And I would reassure them that you want to protect Dave as much as they do, and you're not going to let them fail or fall into trouble once they're older, once they're gone. That's probably really important for them to hear from you. And then when the time is right, you can work up to saying something like, look, I know it's hard to imagine anyone else caring for Dave the way you do. I get it. But the best way that you can protect him is to put these supports in place now while you guys still have a say. And just imagine how much peace of mind that's going to give you to know that everything is in place no matter what. And that's also going to really help me take care of Dave the way you guys want me to. And then you can tell them that you'll be their partner in doing all of this. You'll help them every step of the way and wherever possible that you'll involve Dave in these decisions about his future because that's also the right thing to do. And that will also be empowering to him.

Jordan Harbinger (62:35)

And look, if they fight you on this or they're like, yeah, okay, you're right. And then they keep burying their heads in the sand and do nothing, you might need to make the this urgent for them. Maybe you say, look, if something happened to you tomorrow, wouldn't you want to know that Dave is safe and cared for? Wouldn't you want me to have the support I need to do right by him? How are we guaranteeing that he's going to be okay? Hey, maybe you can even make their collaboration with you a requirement of your help. I feel like I would do that. I'd say, look, I'll keep an eye on Dave and make sure he's okay once you're gone. But if you don't help me find the support we need, you cannot count on me for that. I am out. I know that's a little intense to say, but you might need to Scare them a little or take a harder line if they refuse to be cooperative. My mom actually is considerably older than her siblings. You've probably all heard about the one who was, like, a heroin addict and died. There's another one who was mentally ill. And my grandparents never set him up for success, and my mom had to take care of him, and he had a guardian, and he was always mean to her and stuff like that. It was just this really annoying situation. And it was made a million times worse by my grandparents doing nothing to set him up for success. They basically made it impossible for my mom to have any resources. Then finally, when they finally passed away, they left him a trust, but unfortunately, they didn't make her the sole person in control of it. It's just this huge mess, right? So he's fighting her on everything. And then she finally got him a guardian from the state, and the dude basically just embezzled the money. At this point, my mom was like, I've done all I can. I'm not gonna, like, keep helping you if you're gonna be a total prick to me and then take control away from me. And then this guy takes some money. It's like, oh, well, too bad. Bye. And it's really a shame because if my grandparents had cooperated at all, my mom could have set him up for success, and it wouldn't have necessarily been smooth sailing, but they made it harder, and it's already hard to take care of somebody.

Gabriel Mizrahi (64:34)

Oh, my God. So they both made it her problem and did not equ to do the job they wanted her to do.

Jordan Harbinger (64:39)

It got in the way of every single solution. Basically, what's happening with this guy right now, that's infuriating.

Gabriel Mizrahi (64:44)

Poor Bev. Another thing you can do, you can share some stories with your parents. Hey, I read about a family online that you could tell this story that Jordan just told.

Jordan Harbinger (64:53)

Honestly, have him call my mom.

Gabriel Mizrahi (64:56)

Yeah, just get Bev on the line. She'll sort this out in 15 minutes. You could say, look, I've read about families online that didn't come up with plans. And when the parents had a medical emergency, their child ended up bouncing around feeling unstable, feeling confused, or worse. And it really opened my eyes to how critical this planning is. Or I listened to a podcast from a family that did this, and they did it really well. And it inspired me to start thinking ahead. And I realized that this is totally doable. Both of which, by the way, we encountered while doing our research for this. So I'm sure you'll find stories like this too, for sure.

Jordan Harbinger (65:28)

And if they can hear those stories directly from other parents in similar situations, that would be even better. So maybe you also take your parents to a couple support groups or parent networks. You get them talking with other parents in their shoes, I bet that would make an impression. And then you got to break all of this down into very small, very doable things. I would tell your parents, hey, look, we don't need to tackle everything today. How about we just look at housing options, see what's out there. No commitments, just information you want to look for easy Wins, attend a 30 minute webinar with your parents. Schedule a quick consult with a special needs planner. Small things that aren't overwhelming, that'll show them that this is way less scary than they think.

Gabriel Mizrahi (66:06)

Yeah. And on that note, I would also go back and listen to episode 1016. There was a question. I think it was question four. On that episode, we took a letter from a guy who was also wrestling with how to get his family to best care for his autistic brother. And interestingly, there were a lot of parallels with your brother's story. I think on that episode we shared some ideas and resources for helping a special needs person become independent and take good care of themselves. So I'd give that a listen too.

Jordan Harbinger (66:30)

I'm having a dark Jordan idea here. I wonder if you can use your mom's narcissism to your own advantage here just a little bit. Maybe you tell her that setting this stuff up is going to be the best thing she ever did. It's going to make her look like such a loving mother that's going to last way beyond her lifetime. You've done so much for Dave over the years. This is how you can make sure that love continues. Everyone's going to be so impressed with you. This is how you can make us feel that you are an amazing mom even after you're gone. Now, this is manipulative, but if it works, I think it's fair game. 5050 on this working because her immediate need for narcissistic supply might trump the long game here. But who knows? Listen while you do all that. Stay connected to your empathy. Keep treating your parents as your partners in this. That might be hard sometimes. There are so many intense feelings wrapped up in this conversation about your brother. But the more you approach your parents with kindness and patience, even when they make things difficult, the more you're going to be doing right by your brother and by yourself. Most importantly, I really want to encourage you to keep prioritizing yourself and Your family. I think that you already know this, but it doesn't make you a monster. You deserve a life of your own. You're not abandoning your brother. You can help take care of him in a way that's fair and sustainable to you. Feeling secure in those priorities, not letting this caretaking eclipse your own life or impinge on your own family. I think that's crucial and I'm proud of you for that. Good luck. Now for recommendation of the week. I am addicted to lip filler, so I use Crystal brand deodorant. It's basically a rock of alum salt. The reason I'm bringing this up, normally I don't recommend things like this, but I hate smells. But I also don't want to smell myself. Of course, this is a rock of alum salt, which kills bacteria that ends up stinking, but it does not have its own smell. It doesn't smear on stuff, it doesn't end up on your clothes. None of that gross waxy perfume crap. This stuff lasts like five years. In fact, it lasts until you accidentally drop it and it shatters. That's how long these things last. I swear I've had one of these for like a decade and you just rub a little thin layer of it on. And I don't even need to use it all the time. I just use it when I know I'm really going to be stinky and it will absolutely demolish Bo. I don't totally get how it works. I guess it's just impossible for bacteria to grow in that little place. You only need a little bit. It goes a long way, it travels well. I can't recommend it enough for people who hate deodorant. This is deodorant for you and it's not antiperspirant. You're still gonna sweat, it's just not gonna stink. And I don't know. Antiperspirant I think is bad for you. Who knows? Also, in case y'all don't know, there's a subreddit for the show if you want to yell at me about how alum salt is secretly bad and I just don't know. You can find a receptive audience over on the Jordan Harbinger subreddit if you're a redditor. Alright, what's next?

Gabriel Mizrahi (69:08)

Hey, guys. For the last few years, I've worked in sales for a roofing company. I was recently set to receive a five figure commission, but right before I was due to leave, the company fired me. I complained to my bosses and they basically Told me to get bent. I then requested a copy of my employment contract which I had signed but but didn't have a copy of, and they told me I had no contract. I reached out to a lawyer buddy of mine and his view was that because there's no employment contract, the non compete clause that was a part of the contract also doesn't exist. So I called up all my clients, told them what happened, convinced them to leave my former employer, then walked those clients about a mile down the road into a brand new job with my former employers main competitor.

Jordan Harbinger (69:57)

Oh wow. I love this man. What a play. Well done. So delish.

Gabriel Mizrahi (70:02)

Stiffing me on a five figure commission cost my former employer almost half a million dollars in potential business over the next three to four months and shredded their credibility with other contractors in the community. Meanwhile, I'm probably bringing in about $1.5 million in new business to my new employer over the next period.

Jordan Harbinger (70:23)

Unreal. Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face. What a bunch of clowns. What a shortsighted play, man.

Gabriel Mizrahi (70:28)

Hoist by their own petard and not even for a good reason. Just because they don't want to pay him like 12 grand in commission. So ridiculous.

Jordan Harbinger (70:35)

Look, unless he's not telling us something, like he did something before all this to piss him off and they're like, you owe us this. I don't know, it doesn't sound like he did it. Sounds like they were just being selfish. Or who knows, maybe the company's in dire financial straits and they couldn't pay him. But then you explain that you come up with a payment plan, you work it out. You don't just fire somebody and tell them to get bent and then pretend you can't find their contract because you don't want to abide by it. Whatever the reasons, they were dicks about it and they deserve every part of this.

Gabriel Mizrahi (71:02)

The day after all of this went down, my old bosses magically found the contract.

Jordan Harbinger (71:07)

Of course they did. Yeah. Oh, here it is. Right in the drawer.

Gabriel Mizrahi (71:10)

But my lawyer friend and I told them that they've repudiated the contract and were my lawyer told me that he spoke with their attorney and that attorney could barely keep a straight face as he threatened to sue us. My friend thinks that any judge that they would bring this in front of would throw my former employer out on its ass. And the attorney knows it.

Jordan Harbinger (71:29)

Yeah, it's always fun to talk to a lawyer who knows their client's full of crap and has absolutely no recourse. You just watch them desperately Tap dance while you lay out the facts.

Gabriel Mizrahi (71:37)

Plus, this is such a big hit to the business that they now have an existential crisis on their hands and they can't focus on this. Just wanted to share my story with you guys in case it makes you laugh. Maybe it'll also give your listeners some ideas for what to do when an employer screws you over. Signed. Reshingling my own roof while making myself bulletproof.

Jordan Harbinger (71:59)

That sound you hear is me licking my fingers because this is so tasty. Man, what can I add to this absolute masterpiece? This is a Feedback Friday gem. Real dark, Jordan play. Although it's not even that dark. It's a little diabolical in the best way, but it's totally fair game. And like I said, these people almost certainly deserved it. From the sound of it, what I'm taking away from this story is a few things. First, and this goes back to the letter from our friend at the credit union, the one who's working under Diane. Relationships are everything. If you own a great relationship, you own the power. I don't mean that in a Machiavellian way. I'm not saying you should own the person. I'm saying whoever has the better relationship wins. And in this case, you owned the relationships with these customers, and you were probably well positioned to do that. Being in sales, you were their main touch point with the company. Your employment contract that they couldn't find probably says otherwise, but that doesn't matter. And I'm also willing to bet that you treated those customers pretty well before all of this happened. And there was some trust and rapport built up there because all it took was one phone call to get them to follow you to a competitor, which says a lot about you. And that's awesome.

Gabriel Mizrahi (73:01)

Yeah. And it's not just these customers. It's also his lawyer friend. Right. That's a crucial relationship.

Jordan Harbinger (73:06)

Totally. There's another relationship that completely changed the game for him here. And by the way, whoever that lawyer is, take that guy to a great dinner. Share a piece of your new commissions with him. He earned it. That's a homie right there. And a damn good lawyer, by the way. This other thing he said how his old bosses shredded their credibility with the other contractors in the community because of what they did. That also goes to show how important your relationships are. Reputation is crucial. These people shot themselves not just in the foot, but in both feet. But this is also something only people who don't take their relationship seriously would consider doing. This is why I'm always banging on about digging the well. And I'd be remiss if I didn't shamelessly use this opportunity to plug six minute networking over at sixminutenetworking.com everything our friend here probably did leading up to this crisis, what he did during the crisis, it's all in the course. It's totally free and you will love the course. The other big thing I'm taking away from this letter is we can't control so much about what happens to us, like being fired, but we can control how we respond to it. And that's really the game of life. Finding the healthiest, most productive, most proactive ways of meeting adversity. Using these setbacks to catapult you into something better, or learning from them in a way that sets you up for even more success down the line. And if you can be clever and take some calculated risks when you do that, like this guy did, it can pay off massively. So well done bud. Super proud of you. I'm gonna file this one under just frickin pay people what you owe them. And if somebody screws you, look for fun ways to turn lemons into lemonade and just keep moving forward. Such a great story. I'm super excited for you. Enjoy this new chapter and good luck. Go back and check out our episodes with the one and only David Eagleman. Always just a favorite here on the show and our Skeptical Sunday on Feng Shui Show. Notes and transcripts on the website, advertisers, deals, discounts, and ways to support the show all@jordanharbinger.com deals I'm JordanHarbinger on Twitter and Instagram. You can also connect with me on LinkedIn, Gabe's on Instagram, Abriel Mizrahi, or on Twitter Abemizrahi. This show was created in association with Podcast One. My team is Jen Harbinger, Jace Sanderson, Robert Fogarty, Ian Baird, Tata Sidlowskis, and of course, Gabriel Mizrahi. Our advice and opinions are our own. And I'm a lawyer, but I'm not your lawyer. Do your own research before implementing anything you hear on the show. Ditto Corbin Payne. Remember, we rise by lifting others. Share the show with those you love, and if you found the episode useful, please share it with somebody else who could use the advice we gave here today. In the meantime, I hope you apply what you hear on the show so you can live what you learn. And we'll see you next time. You're about to hear a preview of the Jordan Harbinger show with an investigative journalist that uncovers how a fraudster siphoned off billions of dollars.

C (75:41)

Jho Low was a kid from an island called Penang just off the northwest of Malaysia. Very, very, very skilled networker. He was sent by his father to Harrow in the uk, which is one of the sort of most expensive boarding schools in England. And then he went to wartime in America. It was almost like a family con that was going on here from a very young age. They wanted their son to network. He's sort of overweight, not very good looking, not particularly charming, actually. But what he did do is he changed people's lives overnight. You know, he would drop $50,000 chips on the floor drunk, and other people could pick them up and cash them in. And that changes your life. You know, what he does is after he graduates from Wharton, his childhood friend is a son of this character called Najib Razor. And Najib Razak becomes Prime Minister of Malaysia. Jho Low persuades Najib. He says, look, I can help transform your country by bringing all this Middle Eastern wealth in. And it sets him up as this sort of eminence Greece, or a Svengali type figure behind the Prime Minister. It's incredible because he's only 27 at the time. He just took all the money out of a sovereign wealth fund overnight. You know, when he wanted to amp it up a bit more, he forged links with this Goldman bank, Goldman Sachs helped this fund that Jolo's running from behind the scenes scenes to raise, you know, billions and billions of dollars. And Jholo just steals half of it. You know, we think he stole at least $6 billion. But Jho Low was an imposter for all his billions. People still question, who was this guy? Where did he come from? Why is he splashing all this money around?

Jordan Harbinger (77:08)

To get a deep dive into the shadowy world of corruption, money laundering and embezzling by the shadiest shysters among the elite. Check out episode 602 of the Jordan Harbinger Show. Go. This episode is sponsored in part by Vital proteins. I want to tell you about vital proteins. Collagen, peptides. That's a mouthful. It's a daily supplement that supports your hair, skin, nails, bones and joints all in one, in one simple step each day. Collagen makes up about a third of the protein in our bodies. But as we hit our 30s, it unfortunately starts to decline. That's when you might notice things aren't working quite like they used to. Your joints, your skin, maybe even your hair. Vital Proteins steps in to help keep those areas supported so you can stay active and keep doing what you love. Vital Proteins is the number one collagen peptide brand in the US So they know what they're doing. It's super easy to take. Just add a serving to your coffee smoothie, even water. It doesn't even taste like anything, so it blends right in. The key is consistency. Making it a daily habit is how you see the benefits. Get 20% off by going to vitalproteins.com and enter promo code Jordan at checkout. These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. Last year, Americans ate 32 billion chicken wings. Who knows just how many helpless sides of celery were heartlessly thrown away? But this year, celery neglect can stop with you and irresistible Jif peanut butter.

Gabriel Mizrahi (78:29)

Because you can make a snack to make a difference. You can buy a jar of Jif.

Jordan Harbinger (78:34)

To save the celery. So please don't let celery be decoration for wings. Tap the banner to save the celery.