B (2:51)

Oh, my gosh, no. I will stay home. Thanks. But I am fascinated that Black Friday is our most aggressive holiday and doesn't even involve fireworks or other explosives. And you're right, we do go from being thankful on Thursday to get the hell out of my way. That's my instant pot on Friday.

A (3:10)

Right? It's bizarre. But this is not a real holiday, right? This is just kind of a made up thing. Come on.

B (3:16)

Technically, no, Black Friday isn't a federal holiday. The government doesn't recognize it, the post office stays open and federal workers don't get the day off. But it is considered a retail holiday. The stock market closes early, and culturally.

A (3:33)

It'S a holy day for retail holiday. But what is Black Friday? Yeah. Fake. Fake af. What is Black Friday anymore? Is it still people camping outside Best Buy? Or is it more like an Internet bloodbath now?

B (3:46)

I mean, honestly, it's both. So Black Friday and Cyber Monday have kind of fused into one long shopping week. Black Friday was for big ticket items like major appliances and electronics, and Cyber Monday was for clothes, books, and smaller gadgets. But now it's all blended retailers offer both in store and online deals and start discounts before Thanksgiving and keep them going through what is now called Cyber Monday.

A (4:14)

So it's not even a day anymore. It's like capitalism month or whatever. But hasn't Cyber Monday killed the whole concept of Black Friday? I just figured that would happen. I mean, who. I don't go to stores unless I kind of have to, right?

B (4:26)

But no, Cyber Monday did not and will not kill Black Friday. Businesses are just too smart for that. And retailers just adapted. They learned that they can make more money by stretching the hype across platforms in store and online. So shoppers end up chasing both. The season is what matters.

A (4:46)

12 days of consumer debt. I guess.

B (4:51)

You should write that song. Black Friday does need a banger anthem. But the the sales marathon can also be a gamble. Some consumers find that waiting until Cyber Monday can lead to better deals. But if you guess wrong, you would have saved more in person on Friday. There can be a lot of disappointment on Monday. So there's even a name for it. It's called loss aversion. And it's when the pain of missing out on a discount is perceived as greater than the pleasure of acquiring the item itself.

A (5:21)

Turns out we aren't that thankful for what we have, I guess. Where did all this start? I remember when Black Friday was all about, like, the door busters. You know, people camp out, you got a tent in the parking lot at Walmart, trampling each other for Cabbage Patch Kids and slightly less expensive TVs.

B (5:37)

Right? I mean, the term Black Friday is interesting. It actually began with a gold market crash on September 24, 1869, after two financiers manipulated the price of gold. But it didn't have anything to do with shopping. Yet the evidence against these finance guys was literally a blackboard on which they had written their plans. So the term Black Friday was used for the next few decades to refer to any financial.

A (6:05)

Wait, what? So I. That's funny. So instead of a sale, it was actually originally supposed to be a financial scam, which is hilarious. And I. I thought this was because businesses were in the black. I thought it was. That was why they named it that. You know, from the sales they finally get out of the red and into the black. Cause the last two months of the year, whatever it.

B (6:22)

That's what it turned into, but not how it started. So the term was used again in the 1950s in Philadelphia, where police used it to describe the chaos the day after Thanksgiving when huge crowds of shoppers and tourists flooded the city for the annual Army Navy football.

A (6:40)

So from the beginning, it was about chaos. Perfect branding then, actually.

B (6:44)

Yeah. And the day after Thanksgiving was a burden for Philly police. They had to work overtime to manage the crowds and traffic. It was gridlock, fights, theft, total mayhem. Even back then, it still didn't have anything to do with describing profits. It was used to describe the dark nightmare for the cops. Retailers actually hated the term because they feared it kept people out of stores. And they tried to launch Big Friday for sales marketing, but that didn't. That didn't Friday.

A (7:15)

Okay. Of course, Philadelphia led the charge, though it's easy to make that city lose its mind. So it's so not surprising they turned Christmas shopping into a contact sport.

B (7:24)

I know. I mean, Philly folks are just passionate about everything, I guess. But by the 1980s, retailers adopted the term and gave it a new positive meaning. The day when they made their annual profit, moving from the red, meaning losses, to the black, meaning gains. That's when Black Friday became the brick and mortar shopping phenomenon. We know.

A (7:46)

Okay, but why do we do this? It seems like the antithesis of what we should want from the holidays.

B (7:53)

Well, it's part cultural phenomenon and part biology. Our brains are wired to chase scarcity. So when something seems limited, like only three left, it triggers the same reward circuits as survival instincts. Those sale ads land where dopamine meets desperation.

A (8:11)

Okay, so Etsy, you know, it's funny, Etsy does that. I'll put something in my cart. And it's like, so there's three left, and it's in 22 carts. Just saying. Just saying, right?

B (8:21)

Yeah. 25 people are looking at this.

A (8:23)

Yeah, this crocheted Mario Kart doily or whatever, and it's like, okay, must be a hot seller. So a door buster sale is like the retail term for fight or flight?

B (8:33)

Yeah, it's a lot like gambling or scrolling. The same parts of the brain are lit up. Throw in sleep deprivation, group frenzy, and the illusion of a once in a lifetime deal, and rationality goes out the window. Most people are hungover and running on adrenaline and pumpkin pie. And for retailers, Black Friday is meant to attract large crowds in hopes of ringing in more sales. So all that combined means many Black Friday shoppers aren't functioning at their best, resulting in grumpy moods and bad decisions.

A (9:07)

We know it's insane. We know it's dangerous. And yet every year people do it again. And I'm always like, why? Why are you doing this to yourself?

B (9:14)

Because it works. Our brains are reward seeking machines. When we score a good deal, it releases dopamine, the same chemical involved in gambling or addiction. It feels good. And it gets more interesting when you look at the studies showing how men and women respond differently to this frenzy.

A (9:32)

Gender bias in shopping. Go on.

B (9:36)

Well, we could do a whole episode on gender bias in shopping, but numerous studies confirm things like Pink Tax, where products marketed to women cost more women. Sellers online can charge more because people think they're more trustworthy. And how algorithms and advertising nudge men and women into different stores and sites. Economists call this statistical discrimination.

A (10:01)

So if you're running a scam, pretend you're a woman doing the scamming, and maybe you'll get away with more and be able to charge more. Really? That sounds like a fancy way of saying companies charge women more just for existing. Is that positive?

B (10:12)

That's right. Okay, absolutely. But the bottom line is everyone wants to feel like they got the best deal, especially on Black Friday. And these studies show that men and women actually approach the chaos differently. For men it's about self control. The more self control a man has, the less likely he is to be affected by the music, the crowds, the colors, everything designed to make people push, shove, cut in line because they are made to feel like they have to buy something interesting.

A (10:43)

Yeah, I can sort of vouch for that. Like I'll be in a store near Christmas and they're blasting Mariah Carey and throwing out the pumpkin spice latte, whatever it is like fumes into the mall and I'm like, I'm immune to this. My wallet shall not open. I'm just here for the festivities. And it's like, why am I here? But yeah, I don't know, it doesn't, it doesn't work on me and I am proud of that. Okay, so it's not the same for women, I take it.

B (11:08)

Well, don't shoot the messenger here, but for women, self control doesn't really matter.

A (11:13)

Warm up those emails folks. Yeah, all right. Not getting. Yeah, you better explain yourself.

B (11:19)

I think this is based on science, everyone. So what?

A (11:23)

No arguing science.

B (11:26)

What matters is social awareness to women. What researchers call public self consciousness, meaning how much you care about how other people see you. They find that women who are more self conscious are more likely to lose it when in a retail setting if they can't get exactly what they want.

A (11:45)

So the ones who care the most about appearances are the first to go viral. Karen. Okay, interesting. All right.

B (11:52)

Yeah, because it's not about the behavior at the store, it's about, you know, keeping up with the Joneses. They want the right color and they don't want to wait in line. Marketing website designs and in store environments are aimed differently at men and women. The lights, the playlists, the people in the ads are catered toward emotions for women shoppers because they are found to be influenced by storytelling while catering toward deal bragging for men. So they feel they got the best price of their wit.

A (12:23)

Interesting. It's men fighting impulses and women worrying about image. And this all leads to outrageous battles like men smart women emotional man. This explains a lot of Reddit videos though, right? These crazy Black Friday ones especially.

B (12:37)

And the shopping environment fuels it both online and in person. Corporations are very aware of shoppers mentality. So retailers design these sales to create scarcity and urgency. All meant to trigger that adrenaline fueled response. Emotional shoppers are really good for sales.

A (12:56)

I can't remember where this was. It was a. There's a bar that I used to go to, I think in Michigan and I just. This is always stuck in my head Sorry, New York, actually. And there's a sign on the jukebox that's always there around this time of year, and it says, no Mariah Carey. Between it's like, December 27th and November 28th or something like that. So basically, like, from the day after Thanksgiving until the day after Christmas, you can play Mariah Carey and you're not allowed to do that beforehand. And I remember asking, what happens if somebody plays it? Because you obviously don't need the sign if you can just remove it from the jukebox. And he's like, I will. He said, me or the other bartender will stop what we're doing. We will walk out from the bar and we will rip the plug out of the wall, and that's it. And when people start going like, boo. It's like, no Mariah Carey. Like, they just wait till people complain and then they plug it back in, which, of course, like, resets it. So if you had money in there, like, tough. So everyone hates the person so much. I know. I was like, that's amazing. But also, wow, you guys really, you know, maybe have a drink. Bartender, maybe, that Maybe you should relax a little.

B (14:03)

Yeah. I mean, music, it's powerful and it can set the mood, it can build anticipation, it can even make people spend more. I mean, those playlists are curated very, very particularly to make us happy to be in the store. And I don't know about you, but there's a few times I've teared up at a commercial for a product I have no interest in. Like, it got me, you know? But when shoppers have an emotional reaction, good or bad, they're actually more likely to miss the pages.

A (14:34)

Yeah. No, you're like, tear up. And you're like, I need this Sonicare. And you're like, wait, what's wrong with me? What's wrong with me? This is great advertising. Misbehave, okay? Like, steal a pair of slippers or what?

B (14:46)

Not quite, but consumer misbehavior is the broad term for all the chaos on Black Friday and the unethical and disruptive ways people act while shopping. The stuff that violates social norms, like ripping a doll out of a child's hands or pushing an old lady down to get a product first. Cutting in line things that can harm businesses or other customers and turn shopping into this moral freestyle.

A (15:14)

So basically, we need shoppers anonymous meetings. Like, hey, I'm Jordan. I shoved a granny down for a discounted air fryer. Hi, Jordan. I can never relate to these people. I'm just like, order the thing online. Calm down. You were going to save $12.

B (15:28)

I know. I mean seriously, something happens to people on Black Friday in 2011. On Black Friday, just after midnight, a 61 year old man collapsed at a target as the doors opened. People literally stepped over him during those first critical life saving minutes. Eventually an off duty nurse and paramedic tried to help, but it was too late. He died in the frenzy of a cell.

A (15:53)

Well, he should have had a heart attack at home. No, that's awful. That's right. That is terrible. So this is, is this bystander effect, is that right? Everyone assumes somebody else is going to help, but nobody does. Even when the emergency is over. Like a laboboo doll or. What's that? There's like a glass bear at Starbucks. You know anything about this?

B (16:12)

Yeah, I just saw that this week. What is going on? People are brawling in Starbucks over honey bear thing.

A (16:20)

I don't, I will never understand why. I will never understand. People who don't care about most things will be like, but they engrave your name on it while you wait. And you're like, and, and it's just like you're, they're like sweating. They need it. It's crazy how you can induce this kind of want in people.

B (16:36)

Yeah, those people should not try hard drugs because that's what it's, that's what it's doing.

A (16:40)

You think this glass bear is amazing. You should try cocaine. You'll really like that.

B (16:45)

You'll love it. But I mean retailers know exactly how to create that mayhem. They make it feel like it's every shopper for himself. This is war. And those doorbusters like the only two left signs, they're just bait to get you inside. Once you're there, they hope you'll buy other high margin shops.

A (17:06)

You sure you saved a hundred bucks on a TV? Now buy a $90 HDMI cable that was 38 cents to manufacture. It's a sneaky strategy.

B (17:14)

And the crossed out original price, the crowd, social media. So many things are engineered to make you think the deal is life or death. Like even the presence of other shoppers can drive you insane. And it's just proof of what influences people's decisions. Those store layouts are intentionally confusing to keep you wandering and bogging.

A (17:37)

That Pavlov would be mesmerized first of all. But this reminds me of ikea. You ever go to Ikea and you're like, I just want like a bookshelf.

B (17:46)

And it's like the one place that gives me anxiety.

A (17:49)

You Feel trapped. It's set up like it's high stakes. Your reward is meatballs. When you get out of this rat maze, you go in and you're like, I need a lamp and a bookshelf. And then suddenly you're like, ooh, I do need, like fluorescent wire lighting that I can wrap around the bottom edge of my bed frame. Oh, look at this. A new shower door. A bunk bed.

B (18:07)

Salt and pepper shakers.

A (18:08)

Yeah, Shaped like airplanes or whatever it is. So my friend hates ikea. I mean, I don't like going there just because of that maze and the fact that it's a madhouse, but my friend really, really, really hates ikea. Let me rephrase this. We are not that close. This person is a little crazy, but he sent me a. This is awful. I shouldn't even. I hate giving people ideas. Okay, so it was. You know how IKEA has bathroom setup? So it's like a shower door, a toilet, and then there's another layout. So what. Oh, yeah, is he took. He printed out a piece of paper that had like fake IKEA letterhead on it, right? Just color logo. And then he wrote, this bathroom is functional. Be respectful of other shoppers, but give it a try when you get a chance and see how this fits in with your existing decor or whatever, something along those lines. So basically he put it like next to the toilet. So you know damn well somebody was like, wow, this bathroom's functional. Well, there's no one else here. I'm just gonna urinate in this thing. And it's like, this bathroom was not functional after all.

B (19:13)

I love that so much.

A (19:14)

It's horrifyingly disgusting. And you know, you know, someone tried it. Someone sat there and did that. But great prank.

B (19:21)

Yeah, that's my kind of prank for sure. And that could lead to, I would imagine, some disagreements on the floor of IKEA and Black Friday. Violence stories are endless. You know, the worst story I came across is from 2008 at a Walmart on Long Island. Two thousand people were waiting outside, glass doors shattered as they stormed in and a 34 year old employee was trampled.

A (19:47)

Oh, Jesus. I mean, for what? A discounted microwave? This is such a shame.

B (19:51)

I know. I don't think it was microwaves, but 2008 was the year of hot items like the Nintendo Wii, Xbox360 and PlayStation 3. And when the Walmart on Long island tried to close because someone had died, shoppers complained they didn't want to lose the deals over one. Music.

A (20:10)

Yeah. Did anyone ask for his employee Discount. Yeah. What? They're not gonna. They're not gonna get more dead. And I need Legos. So. The Hunger Games. But substitute Jeff Bezos as President Snow. Basically.

B (20:22)

That's not wrong. That same year, at a Toys R Us in California, two couples argued while shopping for a toy. It escalated to such an extreme that the men each pulled out guns and shot each other to death.

A (20:38)

No wonder Jeffrey went out of business. Peace on Earth, goodwill toward men. Unless it's the last Tickle Me Elmo doll. Then y' all better stay strapped. That's crazy to me.

B (20:47)

Yeah, I mean, that's being human. Unfortunately, all it takes is one bad seed to ruin the experience for everyone. People see someone cut in line or grab the last item, and suddenly everyone's adrenaline spikes. Fairness disappears. Mob mentality takes over. In 2012, at a Sears in San Antonio, Texas, on Thanksgiving night, a shopper cut in line. A guy in line behind him punched him in the face. The cutter pulled out a gun and then took off. The police caught up with him, but he was released because he had a concealed handgun permit. And then Sears gave him a store voucher for his next visit. And amazingly, shopping just resumed as normal 10 minutes after the incident.

A (21:34)

Wow. Okay, I guess a lot of it plays off parents wanting to make perfect memories. But, like, here's the memory of grandpa going to prison because he pulled out a Glock on somebody after they punched him in the face because Grandpa cut in line because he really needed to get you that. I don't know. What is it? My daughter has these, like, unicorn dolls that they don't hatch from eggs, but they come in eggs, and they're scented, which is just disgusting. Yeah, it's like endocrine disrupting fake fragrances. And I'm just like, can we throw this away immediately? And, you know she loves them.

B (22:04)

Yeah. I think in my day, My Little Pony.

A (22:06)

Yes. And they smelled, too. They had scented ones, and it's like just some chemicals smear across the ass of this plastic pony that already smells like plastic.

B (22:14)

Geez, it makes me feel bad for any time I was ungrateful for a gift when I was little, because who knows what my parents went through to get it. I know, but have you ever gone over the top for something? Like, above and beyond for a gift for your wife or kids?

A (22:30)

This is going to sound privileged, but I don't care, because I'm telling you the truth. I don't do the lines, man. My trick is simple. I just overpay online. Yes. Someone is probably scalping my Xbox thing or whatever. But if that idiot wants to camp outside Target all night and then use his inside man to get one of these things, I can just pay 20% more and have it shipped to my door. It's worth it. That's actually how I got. Not the original Xbox. I have this slightly different shaped, more powerful one. I can't remember what it's called. Maybe it's Xbox One or something like that. And it was like, it's not available anywhere. It's out of stock everywhere. And I was just like, let me look online and find one. And the guy was like, here you go, but I'm charging 50 extra dollars. And I was like, I don't care. I can't find one unless I wait in line for it every weekend when they release it. I'm not doing that. He gave it to me in person and he was a nice guy. And he's like, yeah, I just kind of make money this way because my brother works at Target or something like Gamestop. Whatever it was, I was like, yeah, fair. I don't care. I'm paying the premium for you. Having gone through the trouble to source these, like, fine finders fee of whatever. Percent. 10%. I don't care.

B (23:32)

Yeah, I mean, you're outsourcing chaos pretty much. You're efficient. Maybe a little unhero.

A (23:38)

Very unhero. Correct. I am not a hero. I am a man who values sleep and peace. And I don't want to get maced because I'm trying to get an Xbox. I just don't care that much.

B (23:48)

I want to be on your gift list.

A (23:50)

You are. Hey, I got you those blue blockers.

B (23:52)

Oh, that's right, that's right. But I want you to fight for a gift.

A (23:56)

Red flag. Red flag for anyone who's thinking of dating Jess. She wants you to fight for her for gifts. Now, God knows what she's going to do in part. One of many red flags.

B (24:05)

One of many. But for those who can't afford to overpay, the stories of sale shopping desperation, they just go on and on. In 2011, a woman Pepper sprayed every shopper around her to score an Xbox that was 20%.

A (24:23)

There you go. See, I.

B (24:25)

Maybe that's the one you got.

A (24:26)

Happy holidays. I brought the mace. Wonder how much her legal fees. See, this is the thing. You maced everyone. You got this thing. How much of your legal fee is your bail money? I mean, what a moron. You'll be lucky if they only cancel your Costco subscription, which is worse than going to Jail in most people's opinion, right?

B (24:44)

I mean, there's something about savings and sales that cancels out logical thinking for some people. I cannot believe how many stories there are of police finding kids alone in cars in parking lots on Black Friday while their parents rush in to shop for discounts. You know, it's all kinds of things.

A (25:04)

All right, we talked about that lady who pepper sprayed a crowd for 20% off an Xbox. Don't do that. Just stay home. Keep your dignity. Support our sponsors. It costs a lot less than bail. We'll be right back. This episode is sponsored in part by Uncommon Goods. The countdown is on. Holiday shopping season is officially here. If you're like me, you've got a list full of people who are impossible to shop for. That's why I love Uncommon Goods. They take the stress out of gifting with thousands of unique, high quality finds you won't see anywhere else. Uncommon Goods has everything from handmade jewelry to personalized keepsakes to clever stuff that just makes you laugh. I found a really funny pickleball ornament. It's a little pickle playing pickleball that I got from my brother in law who's obsessed with the game and for his girlfriend, pickleball paddle earrings. Yes, the perfect mix of thoughtful and you know. Where the heck did you find this? Everything at Uncommon Goods is super high quality, often handmade, crafted by independent artists and small businesses. So every gift actually means something. And when you shop there, you're not just buying a product, you're supporting creativity and craftsmanship. Plus they give back with every purchase. Uncommon Goods donates a buck to a non profit of your choice. They've already donated over $3 million, so don't wait. Cross those names off your list before the rush. To get 15% off your next gift, go to UncommonGoods.com Jordan that's UncommonGoods.com Jordan For 15% off, Uncommon Goods were all out of the ordinary. This episode is also sponsored by Uplift. I spend a lot of time at my desk, man. Researching, prepping, interviews, recording, responding to your emails. You name it. And when you're sitting all day, you really start to feel it. My back, my energy, my focus, all takes a hit. That's why I use the all new uplift V3 standing desk. You can sit, stand, stretch, just move throughout the day without losing momentum. The new Uplift V3 combines the best of their previous designs into one smarter, stronger setup. It's got redesigned steel reinforcements for extra stability. It assembles in just a few minutes. And the built in cable management system keeps everything tidy, which is huge. If you're recording or podcasts like I do, you don't have wires all over the freaking place. What I love most is actually how customizable this is. You can pick from a ton of desktop styles and accessories. Mine's got a walnut top, it's got under desk drawers, I got a headphone stand. It's sleek, stable, makes my workspace actually feel inspiring. Which when you work from home is kind of everything. Transform your workspace and unlock your full potential with the all new Uplift V3 standing desk. Go to upliftdesk.com harbinger and use code harbinger to get four free accessories, free same day shipping, free returns and a 15 year warranty that covers your entire desk plus an extra discount off your order. That's U P l I f T-E-K.com harbinger for this exclusive offer. Don't forget about our newsletter, Wee Bitwiser. It's almost every Wednesday. It is a two minute read. Very practical, something you can apply right away that will affect your psychology decision making. It's a gem from a past episode. From us to you. Jordanharbinger.com News is where you can find it. Now back to Skeptical Sunday. Look, the true meaning of Christmas is childhood trauma. We already know this.

B (28:04)

I guess the psychology behind it is incredible. The adrenaline, the crowd mentality, the fomo. It's the perfect storm of human weakness. And honestly, marketing genius stores literally engineer the panic. Limited stock one day only those online pop ups that say, you know, seven bought in the last 20 minutes. All of that triggers what's called perceived scarcity and it makes people act irrationally even when the product isn't actually rare.

A (28:36)

And I imagine that starts before people even get to the store because driving on Black Friday is always a nightmare.

B (28:43)

Oh yeah, incidents of road rage and fender benders skyrocket every Black Friday as people race to these perceived bargains. I couldn't find official statistics, but I'd bet a lot of phones and laptops don't survive Black Friday either. After pure rage, clicking and swiping still doesn't land the deal. Everyone's sleep deprived, maybe hungover and just annoyed at others in traffic when they're parking.

A (29:09)

The crowds pissed if something is out of stock, right? And they end up overpaying on ebay for doll.

B (29:16)

Oh yeah. I mean, I've been there. I dated a guy with kids and went to lengths online to score a hatchimal for his daughter when every store was Sold out. I'm not proud of how much I overpaid, but when she opened the impossible to get toy, I mean, that little kid's face was priceless. You thinking about it? I mean, she still better have this.

A (29:35)

Yeah, I mean, she's probably in college by now, but I. I have to admit, I have no idea what a hatchimal even is.

B (29:41)

Oh, they were these stuffed animals that came inside an oversized egg, and you'd put them on the shelf, and then they hatched. I mean, they had minimal tech, and they were just impossible to get. In 2014, it was like the Cabbage Patch Kid mania of the 80s all over again.

A (29:56)

I guess a lot of it comes down to parents wanting to make perfect memories just at any cost. And meanwhile, we're forgetting about the retail workers who have to survive this madness.

B (30:07)

Oh, absolutely. It's not just shoppers behaving badly to each other. Employees are treated disrespectfully, and retailers see spikes in shoplifting, property destruction, all kinds of consumer misbehavior. There are countless stories of otherwise good citizens caught shoplifting just because the lines were too long or they wanted to get to another sale, usually not because they couldn't afford the interest.

A (30:32)

It's really unbelievable. And people, you know, they're calling it the holiday spirit, I suppose, but. Yeah, yikes.

B (30:38)

Oh, people get spirited. And it's not just security guards that have to be on high alert. The employees at retailers are often working in nightmare conditions.

A (30:48)

Yeah, it's easy to forget that people have to work through this nonsense.

B (30:52)

Right. And for most retail workers, Black Friday is not a holiday. It's a stress test. More than 4 million Americans work in retail, earning about 16 bucks an hour on average. Fewer than 5% are unionized, which means when stores extend their hours or double their crowds, workers just have to keep.

A (31:13)

That's not a great deal for them. Are they paid more for Black Friday? I mean, it's. I guess if it's not a real holiday, there's no holiday pay.

B (31:20)

Yeah, exactly. And many describe being understaffed, overworked, and dealing with customers who are, let's just say, not in the holiday spirit. It's the time of year. Everyone wants to relax. But if you work retail, that's impossible.

A (31:36)

Retail workers are expected to sacrifice personal time, peace of mind, soaring cortisol levels, and personal safety, apparently, for a company that would not sacrifice a dime for them at all.

B (31:48)

Right. And certainly not share in any of the holiday profits. You know, the psychology of Black Friday for employees is brutal. Long hours, the Intense stress, high pressure, customer traffic, marketing expectations, inventory management. Add in aggressive or disappointed customers, and it's a recipe for frustration.

A (32:09)

How can you cope with that kind of chaos?

B (32:11)

Me either.

A (32:12)

How do people do it? I really don't know.

B (32:14)

Yeah, they get creative. If you can't find an employee during the holidays, it's probably justified. Workers are observed to take more breaks, focus on manageable tasks like folding clothes, or create mental distance. There's not much incentive for employees to step up to the madness. They just want to survive the day without losing.

A (32:36)

And companies just kind of throw these employees to the wolves, eh? I mean, yeah.

B (32:40)

I mean. Well, to be fair, they do know having plenty of staff helps. A 2014 study looked at how big crowds and rude customers affect employee behavior. Shocker. When a store's overcrowded and everyone's snapping at each other, even the nicest employees.

A (32:58)

Turn into contagious rage. Another reason I stay home.

B (33:01)

Yeah, right. Retail workers don't have that option, though. To make it worse for employees, Black Friday is what's called a blackout day, meaning you can't request the day off. And if you call in and say you can't make it, even with a legit reason, that often means instant termination, especially if you're new or.

A (33:23)

That is brutal. You're overworked, underpaid, and one flew away from being unemployed. And a headline popped up in my feed earlier that said Target is enforcing a rule that employees have to smile if they're within 10ft of a customer this holiday season. I don't. Is that real?

B (33:40)

How the hell is that enforced? I mean, I'd quit or start drinking. That's crazy.

A (33:44)

So does online shopping give brick and mortar stores any break from the chaos, or are we just creating new levels of hell?

B (33:50)

A bit of both. Online shopping has reduced some of the chaos, but just because you're stressing out in front of the laptop doesn't keep you from the effects. So online customer service agents are verbally abused at a ridiculous level. And for the consumer, the ding of the email, those push notifications, the limited time offers. They're the modern Pavlovian dinner bell that you referred to previously.

A (34:16)

Okay, so we got fake scarcity, temporary joy, exhausted workers. But there's an even darker side with the scams and the fraud, Right? You gonna tell us about that?

B (34:24)

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, every year, scammers get more creative. You'll see fake websites, fake ads, fake order confirmations, all designed to steal your data or your money.

A (34:36)

So I think a lot of people don't really understand exactly how a website can be fake.

B (34:43)

Well, scammers build sites that look identical to big brands. A really famous example is Microsoft.com, but scammers will change that M in Microsoft to a lowercase r and a lowercase n. And when they are next to each other, they very much look like an M. It's wild. So unless you're really reading your URL, you can't tell that you're on a different website. It's wild. So fonts and similar lettering can be easy to fall for. Target.com can be confused with Target co. So if you're a trusting grandma surfing the web for the hot toy your grandkid wants, you know you can be easily scammed. Another big one is phishing emails that say your order has shipped. Click here to track it. This relies on the chance that you have ordered a bunch of stuff and you will click on the fake tracking link which installs malware and gives access to all your sensitive payment information.

A (35:40)

Yeah, I fell for one recently. I mean, I didn't click on the thing and do well. I did, but I didn't go the. I didn't give them what they wanted, I should say. But it was a lawsuit. A fake one. It was like, here's your offending content. And then it was like, it's on Facebook. It's on your Facebook page. I was like, okay. And then it's like, log into Facebook. And I was like, this is a really convincing looking fake secure login window for Facebook. But then you look at the URL, which isn't displayed. They have like a fake URL in the graphic that looked like facebook.com, but if you look at the title of the window, it was like a bunch of nonsense, you know, And I was like, oh my God, no one's looking at that. No one is looking at this. So you would type in your Facebook credentials and it would be like, you know, not work or something like that. You give up. But then you've given your credentials to a bunch of scammers. So, man, it's really like, I'm saying the scams are really convincing sometimes. I've been known to bite on a scam here and there. Like, you figure it out after a few seconds or minutes. And I know how easy it is to fall for something. I mean, people fall for things, especially when they're busy. I think I mentioned before I wanted a remote for RC card. It was like really expensive. And so I found a really cheap one on a website and I used their Pay with PayPal link. It was like an eBay Pay with PayPal link. Clicked it and then immediately once I, it looked all legit and it was PayPal. Like I checked. And then once it sent, it was like, here's your receipt from paying, like wangsheng4127mail.com and I. Or hotmail.com and I was like, that is not a company. So I reported it immediately. PayPal immediately said, We've blocked this offending account and given you your money back. But I'm thinking, okay, what if you just didn't notice that that was a personal name and not the name of a company? Or like you missed the checkout window because you were looking at your phone, you just would never get the device. And then you'd wonder what happened. If you're busy, you're distracted, and. Or not as savvy as somebody who's really paying attention. I mean, that's a deadly combination to get scammed.

B (37:33)

And for every person like you who does notice, they've suckered, you know, a hundred other people.

A (37:39)

I guess my point is it's not all a bunch of people who are like, no, I have to pay my IRS taxes with Apple gift cards. And you're like, do. Or like, you know, with Steam video game gift cards because that's the only currency that the IRS accepts.

B (37:51)

Yeah, they're sneakier.

A (37:52)

Yeah. They're sneakier than that. They're sneakier than that.

B (37:56)

Yeah, it's too good to be true. Social media ads on Instagram or Facebook, they're often counterfeit products or just nothing at all. I'll see stuff. You know, those ads come up now and it has the learn more thing at the bottom. They're mostly fake. Yeah. Plus gift cards are often resold online with nothing on them, so you look like an asshole to whoever you gift cards.

A (38:19)

So what, you just don't click anything about orders or shipping? But I, I like to track every moment in my packages. Don't you do that?

B (38:27)

I mean, absolutely. But unless you're trying to get your identity stolen, I would disregard a lot of emails unless you're a hundred percent positive it's related to a real order. So go to back to the site and log in and, you know, take those extra steps instead of just clicking a link in an email. Because sometimes they come in saying someone sent you a gift. It just plays on the emotions that come up around the holidays of people wanting to feel loved and worthy of.

A (38:55)

I use the Shop app from Shopify. Look They're a sponsor, but they didn't ask me to do this or anything. I'm not 100% sure how that app works from the inside, but what I think it does is it seems to dig into packages coming to my address through various carriers and it tracks them with those carriers and then it updates them inside the app. So I don't need to divulge sensitive info or bookmark a bunch of tabs. I just log into the Shop app and it shows like Amazon sending you this, this company sending you that, this other company sending you that. And it's not just Shopify stores. It'll track pretty much anything I even see, like publishers. It's like, oh, you have a package coming from Random House tomorrow. I'm like, oh, I'm gonna get a book. And that might actually protect some people who want to track their items. We can link to that in the show Notes. It's a really light app. It doesn't bother you for stuff really. It just shows you when your packages are coming. Sure. When you open it, it's like, hey, add these socks to your cart. You know, fine. But it's sort of safer than clicking on a bunch of links in your email because it does all the tracking for you and you don't have to go anywhere.

B (39:54)

Yeah, that is so worth it. I mean, that Shop app you use has really strong security measures to keep personal information safe. That's the most important thing. There's other ones too, like Mercari and whatnot. They implement all kinds of protections, from two step authentication to all kinds of encryption tricks. And they help. But the problem is hackers and scam artists are always finding ways around them. So it's like this security cat and mouse game.

A (40:24)

So one thing that's annoying me right now is I ignore bitcoin scam emails and bitcoin scam texts and all this other crap. But I'm getting calendar invites that are like, hey, Bitcoin transaction, PayPal, something something. And I'm like, okay, no, no thanks to this invite decline on this invite from rzx1274, that whatever nonsense thing, cx domain. And it's like trying to get you to click on this bitcoin transaction. And it's like, if this wasn't you click here and it's like, why are you sending me a calendar invite with this? And it's, it gets around your spam filter because it just goes to your calendar. So it's very stupid and irritating, but it blows my mind how good A lot of these scams, look, now, there's professional websites that have clean design, brand logos, even customer support numbers. They'll get you that way.

B (41:11)

Yeah, they prey on trust and speed. Black Friday is all about acting fast, Right? So scammers create urgency.

A (41:19)

And are the products themselves even the same? They have to be. Right?

B (41:23)

Well, this is going to bum you out. They call it tiered manufacturing or tiered supply chains. Basically, companies make slightly different versions of the same product for different retailers or price points. So it's the same outside, but different inside. Like, the base might be the same, but components will vary. So sometimes it's cheaper electronics, different engines, or plastic instead of metal stuff. You won't notice unless you dig into the specs. Think Walmart gets a cheapo version while a Deluxe or Tier 1 version goes to a specialty store. Right.

A (42:01)

So it's not just cheap, it's cheaper. And your bargain is less than it seems. That seems so misleading.

B (42:07)

It's totally crazy. But it's how supply chains work. There are layers of suppliers. So tier ones make finished parts, tier twos make components for the tier ones, tier threes that supply the raw materials, you know, send it up the ladder. But the farther away from the final manufacturer, the harder it is to monitor product.

A (42:32)

Do you have a few examples of that? That's crazy. I kind of want to add some of these brands that do this.

B (42:38)

I mean, it's pretty much everyone. Okay. In plumbing fixtures, you'll see it with Moen, Kohler, Delta. The faucet at a big box store might look identical to the one a plumber buys at a supply house. But inside the big box one will have plastic valves instead of brass. Sometimes the only giveaway is the tiniest change in the model number, like an R prefix, or that you'll have to call a professional eventually to come out and fix it. I see.

A (43:06)

Yeah. So the warning is, hey, the guts in this are crap. How's anyone even gonna notice that?

B (43:12)

Well, savvy shoppers compare model numbers. They check specs. They'll even talk to specialty stores if it's a major purchase. So the outside packaging lies less than the supply chain does. John Deere is notorious for their mowers at Home Depot or Lowe's being what they call entry level versions with cheaper engines and parts. If you want the commercial grade one, you have to go through a license.

A (43:38)

So landscaping has a class structure. That's unreal.

B (43:42)

Yeah, pretty much. And major appliance makers like Whirlpool and Maytag create exclusive quote unquote exclusive models for certain retailers, which is usually a cosmetic tweak, like one handle or piece is a different color. That prevents price matching in a sneaky way, and they often downgrade parts to hit a specific price point. So Mattel, the big toy company, they rely on tiered manufacturing for its Christmas profits, so anything in the electronics department is going to be the worst offender.

A (44:16)

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B (48:26)

That's exactly tiered supply chain. That's exactly how it works and what they're counting on. You're going to order this one online, so you're going to get a lesser quality. The Black Friday specials are often built into the price and they aren't the standard models. They are that cheaper screen protector. So the shell might look the same, but inside are cheaper panels and less advanced, you know, processing chips or whatever.

A (48:51)

No one is studying the package specs that closely. It's so unfair though.

B (48:55)

I know, but it's really the only way a shopper will know. So always check the exact model number. If it's identical across all stores, you're not being ripped off. If there's even a letter off or an extra number tacked on the end, that's a store exclusive version. And you're paying for cheaper parts. This happens with everything from car parts, blenders, bidets. Someone's out there making the budget version just for.

A (49:22)

Yeah, the American way, I suppose.

B (49:24)

Yeah, right. And that's why you need to use the Internet to your advantage. It's easier online to check those model numbers, read real reviews and compare specs before you assume you're buying what you want.

A (49:37)

That's a lot of homework for somebody who just wants a new toaster oven or whatever.

B (49:41)

Yeah, right, true. But is the difference between a real deal and getting duped? You could just not buy anything and save yourself from all the headaches. But we have to buy something.

A (49:50)

It's not just sketchy pricing and scams. Right. There's a whole illusion with the sales themselves.

B (49:56)

Oh, absolutely. And here's the secret. A lot of Black Friday sales are exactly that illusions. Some stores quietly raise prices weeks before the event, then discount them back to the regular price so it looks like a massive bargain. So there's tools like Camel Camel Camel, which is an app that tracks the fluctuation of prices on Amazon so you can see the price history. And that's when you realize a lot of those huge discounts are just smoke and mirrors.

A (50:27)

I love that we need surveillance technology. To protect us from sales, we save 50% off the fake price they just made up two days ago. And they print new price placards.

B (50:37)

And it works because the brain doesn't calculate, it reacts. You see was 9.99 now 6. 99. And your brain fires off dopamine before your logic kicks in. It's more about emotion than right.

A (50:51)

It's not how much you save, it's how much you feel like you saved. So it's like a little hubris or ego there.

B (50:57)

Yeah, for sure. It's cognitive dissonance in a shopping cart. Gratitude and greed back to back. But it's also about belonging, shopping together, feeling part of a national event. It's, you know, it's ritualized consumption.

A (51:10)

And now it's online. So you don't even have to put a. You don't even have to put on pants to join the mob.

B (51:16)

Right? Right. Same frenzy, just digitized. Instead of trampling each other in a Walmart, it's people screaming at their laptops when the pages crash at checkout. But it doesn't mean in store madness is just nostalgia. It still happens, just not on the same scale. It's like less mosh pit in the aisles and more chaotic line dancing or something. But, you know, crowds still form for hot items in the sneakers.

A (51:42)

It's kind of amazing to me, honestly, that people still do in person shopping or like lining up for a hot item. It's like, dude, just buy it online. I don't get it. I can't relate.

B (51:51)

I know there's a sneaker store near me that I swear, it's like once a month, there's a line around the block. It's wild, but retailers depend on it. I mean, we spend billions in a very short window, and stores need that yearly boost to justify keeping those doors open. So, yeah, stores design the event to get you in. Because Black Friday and the days around it can make or break a store's entire year. They need that frenzy. It's part of the business model. So some stores implement precautions now by organizing crowds at entrances and in line. But it still gets wild.

A (52:27)

So they need us to act like maniacs. Are there actually good deals? Is any of this worth it or are we just getting played?

B (52:33)

Mostly played.

A (52:34)

That's what I thought. People love saying, oh, I got this at 60% off, and then they show their receipt or whatever. But not everyone is buying into this madness, right?

B (52:42)

I mean, not everyone. My favorite Black Friday stunts are always from the makers of Cards against Humanity. Do you know?

A (52:48)

Yes, it's a fun party card game.

B (52:50)

Yeah, it's so fun. It is. So every Black Friday, they raise the prices, Raise the prices of their products online, and people still buy it, and then they take the profits and donate it to charity. So they started this as a way to create awareness for this dark hole consumerism is creating in our souls. And I mean this literally.

A (53:12)

What do you mean?

B (53:14)

So in 2016, they came up with the Holiday Hole. They literally dug a hole in the ground and told people, we'll keep digging as long as you keep sending money. And they raised over $100,000 on Black Friday to dig nothing.

A (53:31)

That is not a scam. I don't know what that is. Is that performance art?

B (53:34)

I guess. I mean, it was satire, but it was done to prove a point. Their tagline for it was, when you gaze long into an abyss, the abyss also gazes into you. And they were right. You know, people will spend money for the experience of spending money. And it was a perfect metaphor for the void of consumerism that just. Just goes nuts on Black Friday. So cards against humanity pull stunts like this every Black Friday. One year, they actually sold nothing for $5. It was advertised as nothing, and they made $70,000 off people who knew they were buying nothing. Another year, they sold literal bull feces to 30,000 people, bringing in 180,000.

A (54:20)

Wow. What a world. Is Black Friday just an American thing, or is it global? Actually, I don't even know.

B (54:25)

Yeah, no, for sure. The madness has been exported. Black Friday has spread to more than half the world's countries. Europe, all in the uk, France, Germany, Spain, Italy, and Latin America, too. It's a thing in Argentina, Colombia, Brazil, even parts of Africa and the Middle east have their own versions. In some places, it's called White Friday or Blessed Friday.

A (54:48)

That is incredible. Other countries watched Americans brawling over big screens and thought, like, we need that too. We need to bring that over here.

B (54:55)

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Australia and New Zealand got on board around 2013. They kind of were holdouts, and now it's one of their biggest shopping days. It's just this homogenization of the whole world.

A (55:07)

So the chaos is international. We've successfully globalized impulsive spending. Fantastic.

B (55:13)

Yeah. Capitalism is the world's love language.

A (55:16)

Santa must be sighing some places. And people must not buy into this madness, though, right? I mean, this can't be a thing everywhere, right?

B (55:22)

I mean, Cards Against Humanity has fun with it. But there is an anti Black Friday campaign called Buy Nothing Day. They encourage people to take a pause on spending. This is My kind of holiday. I fast on Thanksgiving and I don't spend a penny.

A (55:37)

Buy nothing day.

B (55:39)

Yeah, yeah. It started back in the 90s as anti black Friday protest. So instead of shopping, people are encouraged to reflect on their habits, fix things they already own, donate or just chill and not participate.

A (55:53)

Do people get into it? I mean, that sounds like a hard sell.

B (55:57)

Yeah. Oh yeah. I mean there's also creative protests like zombie walks where people dress up and march through malls and stores to highlight consumerists mindlessness. They promote not buying anything for 24 hours to raise awareness about environmental and ethical consequences of over consumption.

A (56:17)

I kind of like that a horde of undead moaning deal deals. It looks like a flash mob for the Thriller video, but then they're just getting in your way while you're trying to get to the Lego store.

B (56:26)

Oh my gosh. Yeah, that's so silly. But message received, right? Buying less could actually make us happier and less stressed. So there are buy nothing groups all over the world and members gift and request everything from furniture to tools to food. Like they actually have an app similar to other ones like Offerup, if you've ever used that. And they're just sort of community swapping types of things.

A (56:51)

Is that more performance art or capitalism eating itself? I can't tell which one it is.

B (56:56)

Maybe a little of both I guess. But it's overwhelming now that Black Friday has become Black November. Especially when we see ads. I saw one the other day. Black Friday starts Wednesday.

A (57:08)

Pretty sure that's just called Wednesday. But if spreading it out keeps people from getting maced at Circuit City or whatever, I mean, fine by me. So what's your advice for people who do want to shop without getting scammed or trampled to death?

B (57:23)

First, stick to reputable retailers. If you're online, look for the HTTPs and the lock icon, you know, in the URL bar. Use credit cards, not debit, for better fraud protection. And don't fall for wild discounts or sketchy links. I mean that's good advice every day, not just during Black Friday. Focus on genuinely needed items. You know, Black Friday is a great time to save on items you are already planning to buy for yourself or as holiday gifts.

A (57:55)

Yeah, Jen does this. She saves things in a list for Prime Day or Black Friday and then just goes to town online and done.

B (58:02)

Yeah, I mean that's the smart way to do it. And remember those doorbuster items or special store only models are sometimes cheaper for a reason. So always compare model numbers and reviews before hitting buy. The hype can make you buy stuff that you don't need and that can negate any savings you might have made. So just be mindful.

A (58:24)

Yeah, so be paranoid, be boring, and you might actually survive the holidays. Sounds good.

B (58:28)

Yeah, pretty much. But if the holidays feel like something you have to survive, you should evaluate what and how you're celebrating. I mean, the truth is these sales are designed to serve corporations, not to spread savings. Joy.

A (58:43)

Thanks, Jessica, for saving us from crazy consumer bullies, clever opportunistic retailers, hackers, and maybe even ourselves. And thank you all for listening. Topic suggestions for future episodes of Skeptical Sunday to me. Jordanordanharbinger.com advertisers, deals, discounts, ways to support the show, all@jordanharbinger.com deals I'm at Jordan Harbinger. We are having a Black Friday sale. No, I don't think we are, but I. But I bet a lot of our sponsors are. Actually, I'm at Jordan Harbinger on Twitt and Instagram. You can also connect with me on LinkedIn. You can find Jessica on her substacks between the lines and where shadows linger. We'll link to those in the show notes as well. This show is created in association with Podcast One. My team is Jen Harbinger, Jace Sanderson, Tata Sidlowskis, Robert Fogarty, Ian Baird, and Gabriel Mizrahi. Our advice and opinions are our own. And yes, I'm a lawyer, but I'm not your lawyer. Also, of course, we try to get these as right as we can. Not everything is gospel, even if it is fact checked. So consult a professional before applying anything you hear on the show, especially if it's about your health and well being. Remember, we rise by lifting others. Share the show with those you love. And if you found the episode useful, please share it with somebody else who could use a good dose of the skepticism and knowledge that we doled out today. In the meantime, I hope you apply what you hear on the show so you can live what you learn. And we'll see you next time. We worry about secret societies online, but the real danger may be hiding in trusted institutions that we see every day.

C (60:07)

I'm a financial reporter by background. I basically fell into this rabbit hole and so I began to dig. And this Spanish priest called Jose Maria Escriva dreamed up this kind of group which called itself Opus dei, which is Latin for the work of God. He saw his followers as part of this hidden militia that would infiltrate society and use their positions there to basically push society in the right direction. And he lived, literally tasked them with infiltrating government business, the world of education, becoming journalists and kind of using their positions there to be this guerrilla reactionary force. The thing that makes this so much worse is that this is an organization which has been legitimized by the Catholic Church. It has the stamp of approval from the Pope, from the Vatican. The way that Opus DEI operates is that it's using scripture to push back on anything progressive and for anything kind of left leaning. And it's a misuse of religion really. I think the vast majority of Oberstay members, they don't have a clue about this human trafficking and the way that, you know, certain members are being drugged, labor trafficking, I mean, grooming of children, all kinds of kind of financial fraud and spiritual fraud as well, all of these abuses going on. I think they would be absolutely horrified to find out what is going on inside the organization. They have thousands of members. The network runs far and wide, assets in the billions. Anyone that isn't part of Opus DEI is an enemy of Christ.

A (61:36)

Gareth Gore uncovers how Opus DEI built a global empire of secrecy and why dismantling it might be the fight of our time. Check it out on episode 1170 of the Jordan Harbinger Show.

B (61:53)

With stays under $250 a night, VRBO makes it easy to celebrate sweater weather. You could book a cabin, stay with leaf views for days. Or a brownstone in a city where.

A (62:03)

Festivals are just a walk away. Or a lakeside home with a fire.

B (62:07)

Pit for cozy nights with friends. Or if you're not a sweater person, we can call it corduroy weather. More flexible. And with stays under $250 a night, you can book a home that suits your exact needs.

A (62:20)

Book now@vrbo.com this episode is sponsored in part by the Something you should know podcast. Finding a great new podcast can feel like searching for a needle in a haystack. Let me save you some hassle. Check out something you should know with my friend Mike Carruthers. Every episode is packed with fascinating insights that you can actually use. Mike interviews top experts on topics that shape your life, like how to optimize your brain chemistry, the best and worst ways to apologize. Probably could have used that recently. Why couples hate to talk about money. No matter the topic, Mike asks the questions you'd want to ask, getting straight to the good stuff. And the conversations are always engaging, always insightful, guaranteed to leave you a little smarter than before. They've got thousands of five star reviews, but do you even need that? I'm recommending it and you don't need other people's opinion right at this point, I would hope anyway. Give it a listen. Just search for something you should know wherever you get your podcasts. Look for the bright yellow light bulb and start listening to something you should know. This episode is sponsored in part by cup of Justice Podcast. Ever feel like you want to understand the legal system better? Well, you can start that journey by diving into the cup of justice podcast. It can be tough to grasp the complexities of our justice system. I'm a lawyer non practicing now and it's complex even for me, but it can be a lot easier when you've got the right guides Mandy Matney and Liz Farrell, the journalists who famously cracked open the Murdoch case. Teaming up with renowned attorney Eric Bland, this trio brings together a blend of legal expertise, journalistic rigor, and a relentless pursuit of truth that makes the murky waters of justice clear and accessible. We're all bound to encounter the legal system at some point, so why not get savvy about it while enjoying captivating stories from both the newsroom and the courtroom? It'll be your gateway to gaining the knowledge and tools you need to navigate or even challenge public authorities. Check out cup of justice wherever you get your podcasts.