Podcast Summary: The Jordan Harbinger Show

Episode 1276: Coltan Scrivner | The Evolutionary Logic of Morbid Curiosity

Date: January 27, 2026
Host: Jordan Harbinger
Guest: Dr. Coltan Scrivner (scientist, author, expert on morbid curiosity)

Main Theme & Purpose

This episode dives deep into the concept of “morbid curiosity”—the human attraction to the bizarre, dangerous, and macabre—from horror movies and true crime to real-world tragedies. Dr. Coltan Scrivner situates morbid curiosity in evolutionary biology, psychology, and cultural history, examining why we’re drawn to scary stories, violent images, and the grotesque, and what purpose this serves for individuals and society.

The conversation covers:

• The evolutionary roots and adaptive functions of morbid curiosity
• Common misconceptions about horror fans and consumers of true crime
• The neuroscience of fear and the psychology behind “scary play”
• Gender differences in consumption of violent media
• How stories and dreams function as “threat rehearsals”
• The “sweet spot” for scary experiences—and why exposing ourselves to controlled fear is often beneficial

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. What is Morbid Curiosity?

(07:19, 09:23, 26:25, 53:30)

• Defined as our interest in dangerous, threatening, or grotesque things—real or fictional.
• Scrivner started researching morbid curiosity because, despite it being a universal experience, it was largely ignored by academic psychology.
• It is not a sign of a “sick” or “depraved” mind, but rather functions much like other forms of curiosity.

Quote:

“For most people, [morbid curiosity] is a lot like other kinds of curiosity—it just happens to be about something that is dangerous.” – Coltan Scrivner (07:19)

2. Evolutionary Roots

(00:49, 26:25, 46:41, 73:04)

• Humans evolved to pay more attention to threats; gathering information about dangers increased chances of survival.
• Similar behavior exists in animals—prey animals cautiously inspect predators to assess threat.
• True crime fascinations and morbidly curious behaviors are, in a sense, a version of this, offering “threat rehearsals” without real risk.

Quote:

“Morbid curiosity really does seem like nature’s way of putting us in a position to learn something about the dangers around us.” – Jordan Harbinger (39:47)

3. Types of Morbid Curiosity

(26:25–31:26) Scrivner categorizes morbid curiosity into four main domains:

• Minds of dangerous people: Interest in the motives and stories of aggressors (e.g., true crime).
• Bodily injuries/outcomes: Fascination with what happens in cases of extreme danger (e.g., looking at accidents).
• Paranormal/supernatural dangers: Stories about witches, ghosts, aliens—ways to explain the unpredictable (see Little Red Riding Hood, 39:47).
• Witnessing violence directly: Watching fights, horror, or violent sports as a way of simulating real-world danger.

Quote:

“True crime stories mostly focus on the aggressor ... What people are most interested in is—who is this person, why didn’t we know they were going to do this, and what would have caused them to do this?” —Coltan Scrivner (30:11)

4. Misconceptions and Cultural Critique

(16:21, 17:25, 19:24)

• Horror fans and true crime enthusiasts are falsely stereotyped as unemotional, violent, or lacking empathy.
• Historically, critics like Siskel & Ebert condemned slasher movies as evidence of misogynistic or sick minds (e.g., their campaign against Friday the 13th).

Quote:

“They couldn’t separate their personal viewpoint of what they thought of the people who liked the films from just rating and critiquing the film itself.” —Coltan Scrivner (19:24)

5. Gender Differences in Morbid Curiosity

(16:38, 17:06, 29:30, 74:38)

• Women and men equally enjoy horror, but women consume more true crime; men are more drawn to violent sports and military history.
• These differences may have evolutionary roots based on differing threats men and women historically faced.

Quote:

“When it comes to examples of real life horror, like true crime, [women] are huge consumers—even more so than men.” —Coltan Scrivner (16:38)

6. Morbid Curiosity in Childhood, Culture, and Learning

(23:15, 39:47, 42:04, 73:04, 87:13)

• Children’s stories (like Little Red Riding Hood) function as encoded lessons about real dangers.
• Our long childhood period, compared to other species, exists partly so we can learn about social life, food gathering, and threats.
• Scary play and controlled exposure to fear as kids helps build resilience and emotion regulation.

Quote:

“Humans have this unique interest in things that they don’t quite understand that are dangerous or misfortunate ... Ascribe those actions to something with agency.” —Coltan Scrivner (43:09)

7. Morbid Curiosity, News, and Modern Culture

(29:30, 21:42, 53:23, 66:43)

• Media coverage, “rubbernecking” at accidents, and even banned internet posts (like r/WatchPeopleDie) illustrate human drive for forbidden knowledge.
• Despite easy access today, humans are not necessarily “more” morbidly curious than in the past—we just have more opportunity.

8. Horror Movies, Video Games & Moral Panic

(53:23, 54:07)

• Scrivner recounts the “moral panic” over violent media: from slasher movies and Mortal Kombat to today’s video games.
• Decades of data show that consuming violent fiction does not incite real-world violence.

Quote:

“I’m sympathetic to the idea that horror or violent games make people dangerous—but that’s just not what the data show.” —Coltan Scrivner (56:17)

9. The “Sweet Spot” for Fear

(84:15)

• There is a “Goldilocks zone” for controlled fear—about a 7/10 intensity level—where experiences are most fun and beneficial.
• People self-titrate their immersion and involvement to match this threshold (e.g., watching horror out of the corner of one’s eye).

Quote:

“There does seem to be this sweet spot of fear ... Everybody’s seven out of ten is a little different.” —Coltan Scrivner (85:18)

10. Benefits and Downsides of Morbid Curiosity

(37:07, 62:47)

• Upsides: Learning about risk, building emotional resilience, threat rehearsal.
• Downsides: Excess (e.g., constant exposure to true crime) can lead to paranoia or overestimating danger, but is easily mitigated by engaging with reality.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the allure of true crime:
  “I just feel like I could kick a serial killer’s ass now because I know all these red flags...” – Jordan Harbinger (34:47)

• On scapegoating horror fans:
  “If you like it, you’re a bad person.” – Jordan Harbinger, referencing Siskel & Ebert’s critique (19:22)

• On fables as survival lessons:
  “If you didn’t have that story, kids would never know what a wolf really looked like or acted like, or where you would find one.” – Coltan Scrivner (41:05)

• On rituals and showing off aggression:
  “Humans do that all the time—in cultural ways. One example is lifting your truck or making it look like you can handle something bigger and larger than what it needs to be.” – Coltan Scrivner (15:47)

• On paradoxical comfort in horror:
  “When we watch a horror movie, we’re typically watching someone having the worst day of their life, and almost always whatever’s happening to us pales in comparison.” – Coltan Scrivner (81:55)

• On dreams as threat simulations:
  “Dreams are still kind of the last frontier of consciousness...It would have been pretty useful to simulate encounters with different kinds of threats while you’re asleep, because you can prepare for them, maybe literally, but also emotionally.” – Coltan Scrivner (75:46)

Memorable/Important Timestamps

• 00:49–09:23: Reasons for our attraction to the morbid; experiment with monkeys and snakes as analogy.
• 16:21–20:30: Demographics, historical criticisms, and women’s affinity for horror/true crime.
• 26:25–31:26: Four categories of morbid curiosity and their evolutionary grounding.
• 39:47–45:44: Fairy tales, supernatural thinking, witches, and cultural explanations for the unseen.
• 53:23–57:37: Video game violence, Mortal Kombat, and the problematic logic of media panics.
• 62:47–66:43: Downsides of morbid curiosity and modern digital behaviors.
• 73:04–75:46: The function of dreams, gender differences in nightmares, and evolutionary theories.
• 84:15–85:49: The “sweet spot” for fear and how personal thresholds work in horror media.

Takeaways

• Morbid curiosity is an adaptive trait that facilitates learning about potential dangers, helping us prepare for and avoid them—physically, emotionally, and socially.
• Women and men express morbid curiosity differently, tied to evolved social and survival roles.
• Stories, horror media, true crime, and dreams all serve as “simulations” or emotional rehearsals for coping with threat.
• Fear, when experienced in safe, controlled doses, makes us more resilient, not more anxious or violent.
• Being drawn to the macabre is not a sign of dysfunction or lack of empathy—in fact, often the opposite.

Final Thought

“Morbid curiosity is not about enjoying suffering. It’s about learning where the edges are—without having to fall off. It’s rehearsal. It’s emotional practice. It’s your brain saying, ‘Let me understand this so I’m ready if it actually ever matters.’” – Jordan Harbinger (91:51)

For more on Coltan Scrivner’s work and resources mentioned, see the show notes at jordanharbinger.com