A Fight Over Buc-ee’s and for the Soul of the American West

Summary

The Journal: A Fight Over Buc-ee’s and for the Soul of the American West

Episode Release Date: July 22, 2025
Hosts: Ryan Knutson and Jessica Mendoza
Co-Production: Spotify and The Wall Street Journal

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Introduction to Buc-ee’s: More Than a Gas Station

Timestamp: 00:05 - 02:57

Buc-ee’s, a beloved Texas-based gas station chain, has transcended its primary function to become a cultural phenomenon. Known for their vast size, cleanliness, and distinctive branding featuring a smiling beaver mascot, Buc-ee’s has cultivated a dedicated fan base. Host Andi Minoff shares personal anecdotes illustrating the chain's appeal, such as the pursuit of the perfect brisket sandwich, while colleague Jim Carlton describes his firsthand experience visiting Buc-ee’s for research purposes.

Notable Quotes:

• Andi Minoff: “If you've driven through Texas, you may have stopped at a Buc EE's. It's a gas station chain, but it is so, so much more than that.” [00:05]
• Jim Carlton: “I did try the brisket sandwich. It was pretty legit. Actually.” [01:34]

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Buc-ee’s Westward Expansion: The Colorado Initiative

Timestamp: 04:03 - 06:07

Traditionally concentrated in Texas, Buc-ee’s has set its sights westward, opening its first Colorado location north of Denver last year. The company now aims to establish a second foothold along Interstate 25 between Denver and Colorado Springs. The proposed site spans 41 acres in a notably rural area, posing logistical challenges due to the lack of existing municipal services. To address this, Buc-ee’s engaged local lawyer and political lobbyist Mark Waller to explore potential annexation by nearby towns.

Notable Quotes:

• Jim Carlton: “It's been zone commercial since 1955, surprisingly, and nothing had ever been built on it because the developments just reached there.” [04:32]
• Andi Minoff: “Palmer Lake is two miles away. So that's how Palmer Lake got on the map on this story.” [05:20]

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Palmer Lake: Preserving Rural Charm Amidst Development

Timestamp: 06:07 - 10:03

Palmer Lake, a small town of approximately 2,500 residents, prides itself on maintaining its rural character, contrasting sharply with neighboring communities embracing suburban sprawl. Situated at the base of the Rocky Mountains, Palmer Lake's residents cherish the area's natural beauty and tranquility. Buc-ee’s proposal threatens to disrupt this idyllic environment with increased traffic, extensive infrastructure development, and the establishment of a massive commercial entity resembling a "gas station theme park."

Local residents, including Jonathan Flanner and his wife Cheryl, express deep concerns over the potential loss of the town's serene landscape and the influx of non-stop commercial activity. Their resistance coalesces into a broader community movement aimed at halting Buc-ee’s expansion.

Notable Quotes:

• Jonathan Flanner: “I just think there's some areas that should be left alone for recreation, for people to have a little more peace and get away from the city and enjoy the wilderness.” [07:53]
• Jim Carlton: “We have two competing views of the Old West.” [15:23]

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Escalation of Conflict: Protests, Public Outrage, and Political Fallout

Timestamp: 08:05 - 10:03

The initial excitement among Palmer Lake officials quickly soured as local opposition intensified. Residents organized protests and vehemently opposed permits, leading to heated town hall meetings. In December, a significant showdown occurred during a Buc-ee’s developers' presentation, where hundreds protested against the proposed development.

Tensions escalated further when Palmer Lake’s Board of Trustees voted in May to approve the annexation, despite overwhelming public dissent. The situation deteriorated as personal insults and accusations permeated social media, culminating in a texting scandal that forced Mayor Glant Havenar to resign. Her derogatory remarks toward anti-Buc-ee’s residents—labeling them as "fat ass and terrorists"—highlighted the extreme polarization within the community.

Notable Quotes:

• Jonathan Flanner: “So now when they put a buc EE's there at night, all I'm gonna see is this glowing white light.” [07:13]
• Palmer Lake Resident: “Voting against the people is not just bad leadership, it's betrayal of our democracy.” [09:08]
• Jim Carlton: “When I started to do this story, I knew it was gonna be controversial, but... the level of just like, personal insults and fighting like this... took the cake.” [10:03]

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Broader Implications: Land Development Conflicts Across the American West

Timestamp: 10:03 - 11:20

The Buc-ee’s controversy in Palmer Lake is emblematic of a larger struggle over land development in the American West. As states like Colorado experience rapid population growth, vast expanses of farmland and ranch land—6.6 million acres lost between 2017 and 2022 alone—are being transformed into commercial and residential developments. This urban sprawl threatens the traditional Western lifestyle and the preservation of open, natural spaces.

Jim Carlton contextualizes the Palmer Lake dispute within a nationwide trend, noting similar conflicts in places like Moab, Utah, where development pressures challenge the preservation of iconic landscapes.

Notable Quotes:

• Jim Carlton: “This is a story about Buc Ees, a fight over Buc Ees, but it's really about land development in the American West.” [11:20]
• Data Highlight: Between 2017 and 2022, Colorado lost more farm and ranch land than any other state.

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Introducing John Malone: The Cable Cowboy Championing the Old West

Timestamp: 11:51 - 16:05

Amidst the Palmer Lake turmoil emerges John Malone, known as the "Cable Cowboy," a billionaire telecommunications magnate with a deep-seated passion for preserving the Western heritage. As the second-largest private landowner in the United States, Malone owns 2.2 million acres across Colorado, Wyoming, and New Mexico. His extensive holdings near Palmer Lake—17,000 acres—are meticulously maintained by cowboys, epitomizing the rustic Western lifestyle he fervently seeks to protect.

Malone’s involvement introduces a formidable opponent to Buc-ee’s expansion plans. Through his organization, Liberty Media, and with the assistance of land preservation head Rye Austin, Malone mobilizes resources to oppose the development. He has proposed purchasing the 41-acre Buc-ee’s site, which is still under contract, and is prepared to support legal challenges against the expansion. This move positions Malone as a pivotal figure in the fight to maintain the traditional Western landscape against commercial encroachment.

Notable Quotes:

• Jim Carlton: “Malone said he especially wants to preserve the western rustic lifestyle.” [13:20]
• Andi Minoff: “Malone really didn't want the new Buc EE's. He co wrote a newspaper editorial which called the buc EE's beaver, quote, an invasive species from Texas.” [15:23]

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Current Status and Future Outlook: A High-Stakes Showdown

Timestamp: 16:05 - 18:25

As Palmer Lake's Planning Commission finalizes a report on the feasibility of the Buc-ee’s development, the community braces for a decisive vote later in the summer. The situation remains volatile, with both pro-development forces and preservationists mobilizing their respective support bases. John Malone's commitment to purchasing the land and supporting legal actions adds substantial weight to the opposition's efforts.

The unresolved tension underscores the broader national debate over land use, environmental conservation, and cultural preservation. The outcome in Palmer Lake could set a precedent for similar communities grappling with the allure of economic development versus the desire to maintain their traditional identities.

Notable Quotes:

• Jim Carlton: “Pretty much. Pretty much. And so Ry said that's not the way it happened. ... we're really off to the races.” [16:05]
• Andi Minoff: “We have a high noon showdown coming, Annie. High noon showdown.” [18:09]

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Conclusion

The Buc-ee’s expansion into Palmer Lake serves as a microcosm of the ongoing conflict between commercial development and the preservation of the American West's traditional landscapes and lifestyles. With influential figures like John Malone stepping into the fray, the battle encapsulates deeper questions about growth, community identity, and environmental stewardship. As Palmer Lake awaits its final decision, the outcome will likely resonate beyond its borders, reflecting the broader challenges faced by many Western communities today.

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Transcript

[Andi Minoff]

If you've driven through Texas, you may have stopped at a Buc EE's. It's a gas station chain, but it is so, so much more than that. For its super fans, Buc EE's isn't just a stop along the journey. It's the destination. Money can't buy happiness, but BUC EE's sure can. Rent it. A build your own coffee bar with literally, like, all the fixings you could ever. This was my dream. And then the barbecue. I drove four hours to a Buc EE's and it's 4am because I wanted a brisket sandwich.

[Jim Carlton]

I love Buc EE's.

[Andi Minoff]

Buc EE's are huge, with dozens of gas pumps and stores filled with food and merch featuring the chain's mascot, a smiling beaver in a red baseball cap. Our colleague Jim Carlton recently visited the BUC EE's for the first time. You know, for research. What's it look like when you first drive up?

[Jim Carlton]

I was driving by 25, and you can kind of see it from a distance. You can see the beaver logo, a grinning beaver with the big teeth. You get off, and you're usually following.

[Andi Minoff]

A lot of other people inside. Jim discovered what draws people into the cult of Buc Ees. They might come for the clean bathrooms, but they stay for the beaver nuggets, which are sweet, crunchy corn puffs. And for the brisket sandwiches. Did you try the brisket sandwich?

[Jim Carlton]

I did try the brisket sandwich. It was pretty legit. Actually. I'm from Texas. Early on, it was Texas style, and it's kind of hard to get that, so I thought they nailed it. Yeah.

[Andi Minoff]

Then there's all the beaver merch.

[Jim Carlton]

There's, like, kids with, like, beaver costumes. There's beaver dolls. Everything's like this big, happy. Like a theme park. It's like a gas station theme park.

[Andi Minoff]

Like a roadstop Chuck E. Cheese.

[Jim Carlton]

Exactly. That's a good way of putting.

[Andi Minoff]

Jim gets the beaver fever. But recently he's been talking to a lot of people who are decidedly not fans of BUC EE's. He's been reporting on a showdown, one that's pitting the rest stop and its dreams of westward expansion against one small rural town.

[Jim Carlton]

We don't want your BUC EE's. We don't need your BUC EE's. We don't desire your neighborhood.

[Andi Minoff]

Welcome to the Journal, our show about money, business and power. I'm Andi Minoff. It's Tuesday, July 22nd. Coming up on the show, a fight over Buc EE's and for the soul of the American West.

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[Andi Minoff]

Most Buc ee's locations are in Texas, where the company's based. But lately Buc ee's has been moving westward. Last year it opened its first location in Colorado, north of Denver. Now Buc EE's wants to expand to a second location in the state, and it's got its eyes on a spot along I25 between Denver and Colorado Springs. What are the plans? What would this BUC EE's look like?

[Jim Carlton]

So I took a walking tour of the property. It's been zone commercial since 1955, surprisingly, and nothing had ever been built on it because the developments just reached there. It's a few pine trees, some sage. There's a gate there.

[Andi Minoff]

The proposed BUC EE's would be built on 41 acres. The problem? The area is so rural it's not even part of a town. In order for the BUC EE's to get hooked up to municipal services like water, it would need to get annexed, meaning a town in the area would need to expand its limits to include the new Buc EE's in its services. So last year Buc EE's reached out to a local Mark Waller, a lawyer and political lobbyist. The company wanted to see if any local towns might be interested in he.

[Jim Carlton]

Had a meeting with the Buc ee's people, a place called Rosie's Diner, and then they took out a map. In the meeting, it was over breakfast and could see that Palmer Lake is two miles away. So that's how Palmer Lake got on the map on this story.

[Andi Minoff]

Palmer Lake is a town of 2,500 people. And unlike other nearby towns, which have embraced cookie cutter subdivisions and big box stores, Palmer Lake has preserved its rural character. Some of its roads aren't even paved.

[Jim Carlton]

It's right at the base of the Rocky Mountains. The foothills of the Rockies really start right there. I was driving around and you're in the forest. You can see out over the prairie. Starting to the east, you can see some buttes and sagebrush, that kind of thing. But it's very rugged.

[Andi Minoff]

And how did Bucky's approach city officials in Palmer Lake? What was their pitch to them?

[Jim Carlton]

So Buc EE's did a presentation to the Palmer Lake Town Board of trustees, and they basically showed how much traffic would go through that store. And they said, you'll get about a million dollars a year in extra tax revenues for this town. And that's significant. Palmer Lake has been struggling with its budget. Like a lot of other small cities, they have a water system which is outmoded. They need to upgrade it, and they need millions for that and other infrastructure work. And so the officials in Palmer Lake were very excited about this. Very excited.

[Andi Minoff]

While town officials were excited about the new Buc EE's, some locals were less than enthused. Buc EE's are huge, Texas sized, and they run 24, 7. For many, it seemed like a blight on the idyllic western landscape.

[Jonathan Flanner]

So I moved here to get away from the crowd a little bit.

[Andi Minoff]

That's Buc ee's opponent, Jonathan Flanner. Jim spoke to him and his wife Cheryl.

[Jonathan Flanner]

And so now when they put a buc EE's there at night, all I'm gonna see is this glowing white light. There's gonna be a lot of traffic. It's just gonna change the flavor of the community.

[Jim Carlton]

I mean, in their minds, it's like a very garish theme park. And then there's some residents of Palmer Lake who are also thinking, wait a second. Okay, it's gonna be two miles away, but we're going to see, like this giant alien spaceship. We're going to see the glow, the.

[Andi Minoff]

Glowing light of the BUC EE's in the distance at night.

[Jim Carlton]

Right? The glowing light of the Buckies in the distance at night. And this is the place cherished for its night stars. You know, they're worried about the traffic that's going to ruin the whole area. And it's going to bring in more stores, more development.

[Jonathan Flanner]

I just think there's some areas that should be left alone for recreation, for people to have a little more peace and get away from the city and enjoy the. The wilderness, as I think most people here enjoy the quietness and the scenery.

[Andi Minoff]

Buc EE's would eventually hire Mark Waller, that lawyer that the company met with at the diner, to represent them. Waller said that the lights at the new BUC EE's would point downward to minimize the glow.

[Jim Carlton]

So the residents kind of banded together and they actually started a resistance group. It's kind of like, hell, no, we don't want buc EE's. Move it somewhere else. And then the word spread in Palmer Lake.

[Jonathan Flanner]

Several residents in the Palmer Lake area near Monument not too happy about a new location being proposed there.

[Andi Minoff]

The Buc ee's resistance grew. People started holding protests and speaking at town hall meetings. At one meeting In December, Buc EE's developers laid out their plans for the new location. Hundreds of people came out.

[Jim Carlton]

People are here, coming here to get in your face and talk down to you and tell you what your community needs. Am I right?

[Andi Minoff]

Nevertheless, in May, Palmer Lake's board of trustees voted to allow the Buc EE's annexation to move forward, prompting even more backlash from residents.

[Jim Carlton]

And voting against the people is not just bad leadership, it's betrayal of our democracy. You were elected to serve us, not to serve your own special interests.

[Andi Minoff]

Things got increasingly ugly. Insults flew on social media. Some city officials alleged that their car tires had been slashed. And then there was the texting scandal. Palmer Lake Mayor Glant Havenar is resigning from her post, effective tomorrow. Palmer Lake's mayor resigned after it was discovered that she disparaged some anti Buc EE's residents over text, calling them, quote, fat ass and terrorists. Were you surprised by the level of vitriol? I mean, we're talking about a rest stop.

[Jim Carlton]

I think my jaw's on the ground. Like, I just couldn't. When I started to do this story, I knew it was gonna be controversial, but I've done a lot of stories, but this one, the level of just like, personal insults and fighting like this, you know, took the cake. I think part of it is a lot of people say things on text that aren't meant for public and, you know, this became public.

[Andi Minoff]

The fight in Palmer Lake might have gotten unusually vicious, but the issues at play aren't unique. Fights over land development have been cropping up across the West.

[Jim Carlton]

I've seen this play out in many other parts of the West. I was in Moab, Utah, earlier this year. There was a fight about development in the Colorado river floodplain, for example, the west is this storied, mythical place of grand landscapes and values. And it's getting smaller.

[Andi Minoff]

Across the west, wide open spaces that used to be devoted to ranching or farming are being developed. Between 2017 and 2022, the American west lost 6.6 million acres of farm and ranch land. That's an area the size of Massachusetts and no state has lost more of that land than Colorado.

[Jim Carlton]

This is a story about Buc Ees, a fight over Buc Ees, but it's really about land development in the American West. Colorado is one of the fastest growing states. And along the Colorado Front Range, it's just, you know, the land that used to be wide open is being covered by shopping malls, outlet malls, gas stations, homes, subdivisions. It's this urban sprawl. So yeah, I mean, what was triggered by BUC EE's is a familiar battle, but it was kind of larger than life.

[Andi Minoff]

And in this battle, anti Buc EE's residents have a local hero, someone who's vowed to fight for them. The Cable Cowboy. That's next. The Cable Cowboy is actually from Connecticut. His name is John Malone and he's a billionaire telecommunications magnate. He founded and co chairs Liberty Media, which owns SiriusXM Live Nation Entertainment and Formula One Racing. You can hear him on CNBC talking about stuff like streaming profits.

[Jonathan Flanner]

You know, streaming just isn't working for most of the players that are trying it. It's not being the successor, profitable, cash flowing service for most of the players that they were hoping it would be.

[Andi Minoff]

But Malone also has another passion. You talked to the Cable Cowboy for this story. What's he like?

[Jim Carlton]

Very folksy. I talked to him over Zoom. I was in San Francisco, in my home. He was in his, one of his homes in Ireland and he was just talking about his love of the West.

[Andi Minoff]

Malone loves the open range, so much so that he's been buying it up on a massive scale. He's currently the second largest private landowner in the country with ranches in Colorado, Wyoming and New Mexico.

[Jim Carlton]

Right now he owns 2.2 million acres in the United States. And he wants to see it preserved. He said he especially wants to preserve the western rustic lifestyle. You know, where you've got the ranch or farm and then you got the little town that depends on the ranch that sells the, you know, the John Deere tractors and the horse feed. And he just loves that part of the American Western culture.

[Jonathan Flanner]

When you go north of Denver, toward Boulder and Fort Collins, there really is no open space. Left, it's all developed, so there's not even a hint of what we moved to Colorado for.

[Andi Minoff]

Malone owns 17,000 acres near Palmer Lake, the town debating the new Buc Ees. His land is flush with greenery and wildlife and still managed by cowboys. Jim made a visit.

[Jim Carlton]

I rode with a cowboy named Josh.

[Andi Minoff]

You got on a horse for this story?

[Jim Carlton]

No, I was in his pickup truck. But we were on the range. We saw a herd of elk. There are bighorn sheep here. They actually have big game hunting. You could go big game hunting on this ranch. So Malone really wanted to preserve all this. And as we drove to the side of the ranch where you could see BUC EE's, you could see the place where it would be. And so Malone's people were saying, now just imagine a spaceship there, just this giant mall right there. It's just going to ruin the whole look and feel of this place.

[Andi Minoff]

It is really like these two visions of the west are just cheek by jowl here. The part of it that's developing and growing and the part of it that wants that kind of old feel, that old west to remain, they're right up next to each other.

[Jim Carlton]

Exactly. And that's the problem. That's the problem. We have two competing views of the Old West.

[Andi Minoff]

Malone really didn't want the new Buc EE's. He co wrote a newspaper editorial which called the buc EE's beaver, quote, an invasive species from Texas. And he didn't stop there.

[Jim Carlton]

Malone, he's got a guy named Rye Austin as his head of land preservation. And Rye called actually Mark Waller Waller.

[Andi Minoff]

The lawyer hired by Bucky's and said.

[Jim Carlton]

We want to let you know that Mr. Malone doesn't like the development. There's some dispute about exactly what happened next. Walter says that Ry kind of semi threatens it and he's prepared to use his vast resources to stop it.

[Andi Minoff]

In other words, this town ain't big enough for the both of us.

[Jim Carlton]

Pretty much. Pretty much. And so Ry said that's not the way it happened. You know, he did convey Malone's displeasure, but he didn't say there was any threat. So anyway, that's in dispute right now. So anyway, now we got John Malone, the cable cowboy, involved in the fight. So now we're really off to the races.

[Andi Minoff]

How could Malone prevent this development? I mean, what can he kind of tangibly do to support the anti Buc EE's effort?

[Jim Carlton]

Well, what he told me is that he's already offered to buy that land. So the land, the 41 acres under contract of BUC EE's. Buckeyes doesn't actually own it yet. It's under contract. And so Malone said, I'll buy it. And he said, and I'm prepared to help back a legal battle. He'll help support a lawsuit.

[Andi Minoff]

Is the anti Buc ee's camp kind of fighting the inevitable? I mean, places change. You know, more people want to live out west. The population is growing. Can you roll that back?

[Jim Carlton]

I was actually surprised at the intensity of opposition because you're right. I mean, the interesting thing about this fight is this is on Interstate 25. There's so many people, millions of people on that highway. If you're going towards Colorado Springs, the very next exit is like a strip shopping center. There's a McDonald's. Suburbia is right there. It's right around the corner.

[Andi Minoff]

After Palmer Lake's board of trustees voted to move forward with annexation last May, the town's planning commission began preparing a report on what it would take to build the new BUC EE's. Officials are now waiting for that report and expect to vote later this summer on whether or not to move forward.

[Jim Carlton]

The new mayor said they plan to probably take a vote fairly quickly after that report. So things are kind of coming to a head on Bucky's. But with all the guns in this fight, I have no idea whether it's going to be built or not.

[Andi Minoff]

I have this mental image of, like, you know, the cowboys, like, emerging from all the saloons, guns drawn, and who's going to be left standing at the end of the shootout?

[Jim Carlton]

We have a high noon showdown coming, Annie. High noon showdown.

[Andi Minoff]

That's all for today. Tuesday, July 22nd. The Journal is a co production of Spotify and the Wall Street Journal. If you like our show, follow us on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. We're out every weekday afternoon. Thanks for listening. See you tomorrow.