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Jessica Mendoza
When you step inside Amazon's warehouse in Shreveport, Louisiana, it looks pretty normal at first.
Sebastian Herrera
You have your offices, you have people walking around, you have security. But as you get up to floor two to five, you really start to hear the buzz of machinery. If you can imagine the noises of the Zhu zhoo. Zhu z.
Jessica Mendoza
Right.
Sebastian Herrera
Those sort of noises.
Jessica Mendoza
That's our colleague Sebastian Herrera describing Amazon's Next Generation fulfillment center. The Shreveport complex is five stories high. Inside, robots zip across the floor like giant pucks and robotic arms lift, sort and pack with eerie precision.
Sebastian Herrera
There's a lot of whirring, a lot of metallic clangs. There are different wheeled droids that are in the facility.
Jessica Mendoza
Wild. You said the word droids and I immediately was like, as in Star wars, like beep, beep, beep. They're like buzzing around.
Sebastian Herrera
That's literally happening at this warehouse of the future.
Jessica Mendoza
Here, robots do most of the work. And that's the direction Amazon, the second largest private employer in the US is headed towards. In fact, just recently, the company reached a major milestone.
Sebastian Herrera
They just crossed the 1 million robot line at their facilities. And that's really significant because Amazon has reached a turning point with robotics, where soon they will have more robots than they do humans.
Jessica Mendoza
Oh my gosh.
Sebastian Herrera
Amazon is really a bellwether for the US labor economy. So when it makes any sort of move inside of its facilities, people are watching, companies are watching. And it could transform the way that companies and people think about the labor force writ large.
Jessica Mendoza
Welcome to the Journal, our show about money, business and power. I'm Jessica mendoza. It's Thursday, July 17th. Coming up on the show One Million Robots. How Amazon is transforming American Labor.
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Jessica Mendoza
For years, Amazon has been the heartbeat of local hiring in places all over America.
Sebastian Herrera
In business news tonight, Amazon is going.
Jessica Mendoza
On a hiring spree. Thousands of job seekers lined up at warehouses yesterday. Just take a look at the giant sign they've posted on a tractor trailer outside their center in Kenosha. The company would hold nationwide job fairs and billboards would advertise for warehouse openings. When a new fulfillment center opened, the whole town would hear about it.
Sebastian Herrera
You can visit both big city and small town. And it's not unlikely that Amazon is the largest employer there or one of the largest employer there, because they've long had thousands, hundreds of thousands of workers in these facilities.
Jessica Mendoza
But human workers have their limits. Amazon's warehouse employees would walk miles every day, often lifting heavy boxes to get inventory over time. The E commerce giant that pioneered two day delivery looked for ways to make that process more efficient to move products even faster. And by 2012, Amazon had its answer. Amazon agreeing to buy Kiva Systems Inc. For $775 million in cash. Buy a robot company. This is like the Jetsons. Yeah, it's so cool. Those first AMAZ robots from Kiva Systems looked like big orange roombas on steroids. They'd glide along a grid and ferry goods in warehouses. Warehouses that might be as big as 23 football fields. Those droids were able to cut down the time to fulfill a shipping request from more than an hour to just 15 minutes.
Sebastian Herrera
These robots are able to pick up shelves and move them in no time. And they can do it with multiple shelves. And. And so that was able to allow Amazon to move products across their facilities much faster than before.
Jessica Mendoza
By 2017, Amazon had scaled up its fleet of droids to 100,000 units. Amazon's robotics team touted their military precision.
Sebastian Herrera
Like a marching army of ants that can constantly change its goals based on the situation at hand. Right. So our robotics are very adaptive and reactive.
Jessica Mendoza
While Amazon was building its robot fleet, its human employees were also busy. Some of them were raising concerns about working conditions on the warehouse floor and talking about forming a union. And it's exactly why we must stand with workers everywhere.
Sebastian Herrera
I'm taking a stance against the company.
Jessica Mendoza
Amazon filed objections to the unionization effort. But the organizers did succeed at one warehouse in New York.
Sebastian Herrera
To the first union in American history.
Jessica Mendoza
As Amazon's human workers called for better labor conditions, its droids, which didn't have overtime demands or health Insurance needs kept humming. Robots don't feel, don't hurt in the same way that humans do. But also, you know, robots don't go on strike, they don't go on lunch breaks, they don't need to go to the bathroom. They robots can't sue the company, right?
Sebastian Herrera
You won't have to deal with the issues that a human worker might have. So robots don't complain, for example, or, and these are the sort of underpinning issues of why some Amazon employees have chosen to unionize, because they complain about how physically demanding these jobs are and that they get little break times. And so for Amazon, robot solves a lot of problems for them. And over time, it's actually more cost efficient in that way too, because it's expensive to train employees to start jobs or to hire them.
Jessica Mendoza
Those orange Kiva droids could only do one thing, which was move shelves. But over the last five years, Amazon has introduced new models, ones that could sort and pack. This year, the company introduced a touch sensitive robot it calls Vulcan.
Sebastian Herrera
This robot also has that sort of pressure sense that a human does, and so it's able to be very gentle when it's grabbing items. Something like a bar soap as small as that, or a notebook.
Jessica Mendoza
And now the bots don't just work independently. One robot carts stuff for loading onto trucks. Another helps sort items. Another helps package bags.
Sebastian Herrera
AI systems have evolved in these past five years. And part of the innovation with Amazon is not necessarily that they have the most advanced robotics in the world, but that they've been able to connect all the robots together. There's more and more of what they call touch points are being handled by robots. So there's different touch points within an Amazon facility, whether it's packaging, whether it's moving items from a truck, and as time has passed, more of those touch points have been handled by robots.
Jessica Mendoza
Amazon's bet on bots has been good for business. The company says workplace injury rates have dropped, though labor unions say they remain high. Amazon also says that about 75% of its global deliveries now involve robots in some way. And yearly productivity has skyrocketed as more machines work in tandem with humans.
Sebastian Herrera
So, for example, Amazon years ago shipped about 175 packages per employee. So the packages that it handled itself end to end without the help of UPS or USPS. And that has gone up to about 3,800 or so per employee.
Jessica Mendoza
Dang.
Sebastian Herrera
So that's a tremendous productivity gain.
Jessica Mendoza
So it does sound like the robotics push has brought Amazon's business like major efficiency gains. What does it mean for the people who are working alongside those machines? How is it affecting them?
Sebastian Herrera
The jobs at Amazon are changing really rapidly. I talked with one employee named Naysha Cruz. Naysha, Am I pronouncing that correctly?
Jessica Mendoza
Naysha, Like Geisha Naysha.
Sebastian Herrera
Okay, got it. Thank you. And she had a very interesting story because she started out as a average Amazon worker. She started out as a picker.
Jessica Mendoza
I was like, sure, no problem. I'm gonna go. I'm gonna go work at a warehouse as a picker. And actually stayed entry level for.
Sebastian Herrera
But she had bigger goals for herself. She wanted to have more of a technical job. And so she sought out training that Amazon has to have a more advanced role within the company.
Jessica Mendoza
And then from there, there was an opportunity in Tempe, Arizona, and she was.
Sebastian Herrera
Able to be trained in how to oversee and manage robotics. And she was able to move from her picking job to a desk job. And she sits in front of a computer screen making sure that robots around the world that Amazon has are working properly.
Jessica Mendoza
I currently don't have a degree, so the fact that I can come from a factory work setting to an office job, it's amazing to me. Naysha's pay has also more than doubled from what she earned walking the warehouse floor.
Sebastian Herrera
Her story exemplifies what Amazon says it's trying to achieve, which is to have more technical roles for workers and less physically demanding roles. They say that they've trained more than 700,000 people around the world with these sort of more technical tasks.
Jessica Mendoza
Fewer pickers, more technicians. That's part of Amazon's vision. But for the company's roughly 1.5 million workers around the world, most of whom are on the warehouse floor, the Naysha's path might not be the norm. Not every picker will go on to manage a fleet of robots. Already, Amazon has slowed down hiring at its facilities. Staffing is now at an average of 670 people per facility, according to a journal analysis. That's the lowest it's been in 16 years.
Sebastian Herrera
For every Naysha cruise, there could be another person whose job is replaced entirely, right? So jobs like Naysha had as a picker might not exist one day.
Jessica Mendoza
In a statement, Amazon says it's hired hundreds of thousands of employees in the last decade. It also acknowledges that headcount is down, noting that their new sites have, quote, smaller employee footprints and help us deliver with greater speed. Amazon CEO Andy Jassy has also said publicly that the company anticipates its entire workforce will shrink due to AI.
Sebastian Herrera
There will Be a day where we might not see many people inside of these facilities. And as time passes, we could start to think of Amazon and see Amazon in a completely different way because of what they're doing with robotics.
Jessica Mendoza
Right. Will they still even be the second largest private employer in the U.S. right?
Sebastian Herrera
That's a huge question. Will they still be the second largest private employer in the U.S. 5, 10, 15 years from now? Maybe not.
Jessica Mendoza
But someday, experts say Amazon's warehouses could literally go dark. Why is after the break, during his time covering Amazon, my colleague Sebastian Herrera has heard experts and insiders kick around a term, one they use to describe what the company's warehouses could look like in the not so distant future.
Sebastian Herrera
Amazon years ago had this concept of a lights out facility. You don't have to turn on the lights because it's all robots, and robots don't need lights to work because robots.
Jessica Mendoza
Don'T need to see. Aren't there cameras, though?
Sebastian Herrera
They do have cameras, but those cameras can see in the dark.
Jessica Mendoza
Oh, that's so creepy.
Sebastian Herrera
According to my reporting and the experts I talked to, Amazon would love to have that sort of a facility where they don't need humans to be there. Or they might just need one or two humans to come and repair the robots when they break down. But it is not sci fi to say that years from now you could walk into an Amazon facility and most, if not all the lights are off and you're in the dark just hearing whirring and buzzing around you.
Jessica Mendoza
Oh, my goodness.
Sebastian Herrera
If we look 20 years into the future, the lights out facility could be something that is very realistic in that time frame, according to experts that I've talked to.
Jessica Mendoza
Wow, 20 years. That's really not that long if you think about it. Although, you know, even in Star wars, there were still people, right? It wasn't like they were gone completely. Somebody still had to fix the robots when they broke down, right, uncle owen?
Sebastian Herrera
Yeah, the R2 unit has a bad motivator.
Jessica Mendoza
Look. Hey, what are you trying to push on us? Amazon told us that its robotics leadership does not believe in a fully lights out concept, nor does it think lights out is the, quote, optimal approach to serve our customers. The company also said that, quote, people will continue to be at the center of how we operate effectively.
Sebastian Herrera
If you talk to Amazon, they're very big on the idea that humans will need to continue to exist inside their facilities. But there's plenty of tasks that Amazon is replacing its high office facilities with robots.
Jessica Mendoza
And that means that for some warehouse employees, the room is already looking Dim.
Sebastian Herrera
The workers that I've talked to and the unions that I've talked to remain very concerned that Amazon, as it's deploying these robots, it's not thinking about how it's affecting its humans. So for Amazon, they will say that these robots are all positive because it's making the jobs of human workers safer. However, Amazon critics say that it is the human workers there that are the guinea pigs for these robotic systems. Whether they break down, whether an accident happens, it's the human workers that have to deal with these situations.
Jessica Mendoza
A spokesperson for Amazon told us that, quote, innovation has been a core driver to creating a safer workplace for us. It's interesting. If you look at Amazon's corporate website right now, they have this statement, like in really big font at the top. It says, in the past decade, Amazon has created more jobs than any other US Company. If Amazon led the last great hiring boom, could that be coming to an end?
Sebastian Herrera
That is a good question. Amazon employs so many people throughout the US and that means that it's responsible for a lot of the labor force in America. And as Amazon replaces humans with robots, it could have a tremendous impact on our labor economy, on the economy as a whole. My reporting has shown before that when Amazon raises pay in their warehouses, for example, other companies follow suit. When Amazon has layoffs, other companies tend to follow suit. Amazon recently announced return to work five days a week. And a lot of companies follow suit after that.
Jessica Mendoza
So if Amazon says robots are the.
Sebastian Herrera
Future, if Amazon says robots are the future, then that could mean that a lot of other companies start saying similar things. We don't need as many employees in our offices anymore or in our warehouses anymore. Because if Amazon is doing it, it means that we can too.
Jessica Mendoza
That's all for today. Thursday, July 17 the Journal is a co production of Spotify and the Wall Street Journal. Special thanks to Julie Chang and Desiree Rios. Thanks for listening. See you tomorrow.
In the July 17, 2025 episode of The Journal, hosted by Ryan Knutson and Jessica Mendoza, the Wall Street Journal and Spotify Studios delve into Amazon's extensive integration of robotics within its warehouses. Titled "How 1 Million Robots Are Taking Over Amazon Warehouses," the episode explores the profound implications of Amazon's robotic advancements on business operations and the broader U.S. labor economy.
The episode opens with a vivid description of Amazon's fulfillment center in Shreveport, Louisiana. Jessica Mendoza sets the scene:
"When you step inside Amazon's warehouse in Shreveport, Louisiana, it looks pretty normal at first. You have your offices, you have people walking around, you have security. But as you get up to floor two to five, you really start to hear the buzz of machinery." (00:05)
Sebastian Herrera elaborates on the auditory landscape, comparing the sounds to the futuristic noises of "Zhu zhoo. Zhu z," emphasizing the pervasive presence of machinery:
"Those sort of noises. That's our colleague Sebastian Herrera describing Amazon's Next Generation fulfillment center." (00:37)
The five-story complex is abuzz with robots that move with "eerie precision," handling tasks ranging from lifting and sorting to packing goods. These robots, described as "giant pucks," exemplify Amazon's commitment to automation.
A pivotal moment highlighted in the episode is Amazon's achievement of deploying over 1 million robots across its facilities. Sebastian Herrera underscores the significance of this milestone:
"They just crossed the 1 million robot line at their facilities. And that's really significant because Amazon has reached a turning point with robotics, where soon they will have more robots than they do humans." (01:27)
This surge positions Amazon as a bellwether for the U.S. labor economy. Moves within Amazon are meticulously observed by other companies and policymakers, signaling potential widespread transformations in workforce management.
Amazon's journey into robotics began earnestly in 2012 with the acquisition of Kiva Systems Inc. for $775 million in cash. This strategic move introduced the first generation of Amazon's robots—resembling "big orange Roombas on steroids." These initial droids revolutionized warehouse operations by reducing order fulfillment times from over an hour to just 15 minutes.
By 2017, Amazon had scaled its robotic fleet to 100,000 units. Herrera likens the coordinated movement of these robots to "a marching army of ants," highlighting their adaptability and efficiency:
"Like a marching army of ants that can constantly change its goals based on the situation at hand." (05:39)
The subsequent years saw continuous innovation, with the introduction of advanced models like Vulcan, equipped with touch-sensitive technology enabling delicate handling of items. This evolution represents not just the proliferation of robots but also the enhancement of their capabilities.
Amazon's investment in robotics has yielded substantial productivity gains. The number of packages handled per employee has surged from approximately 175 to an astonishing 3,800 annually:
"Amazon years ago shipped about 175 packages per employee... And that has gone up to about 3,800 or so per employee." (08:55)
This leap underscores the transformative impact of automation on operational efficiency. Additionally, Amazon claims a reduction in workplace injury rates attributable to the deployment of robots, although labor unions contest these figures, arguing that injuries remain prevalent.
While Amazon touts the benefits of automation, the human workforce faces significant shifts. The episode features the story of Naysha Cruz, an Amazon employee who transitioned from a picker to a robotics manager without holding a formal degree:
"I currently don't have a degree, so the fact that I can come from a factory work setting to an office job, it's amazing to me." (10:19)
Naysha's journey exemplifies Amazon's efforts to create more technical roles, offering training to employees to manage and oversee the burgeoning robotic fleet. However, this pathway is not universally accessible. With Amazon's workforce shrinking to an average of 670 employees per facility—the lowest in 16 years—many workers face potential job displacement as robots assume more roles.
A recurring theme in the episode is the concept of "lights out" facilities—warehouses operating with minimal to no human presence. Sebastian Herrera discusses the feasibility of such a scenario:
"Amazon's warehouses could literally go dark." (12:32)
While Amazon's spokesperson maintains that humans will remain central to operations, primarily for maintenance and oversight, experts foresee a future where robots dominate virtually all tasks. This vision, projected 20 years into the future, suggests a significant transformation in how warehouses function, potentially rendering traditional human roles obsolete.
Amazon's advancements in robotics extend beyond its warehouses, serving as a catalyst for other companies to adopt similar automation strategies. The episode posits that:
"If Amazon is doing it, it means that we can too." (17:12)
This domino effect could reshape the broader labor market, influencing employment patterns, wage structures, and economic dynamics across various industries. As Amazon anticipates its workforce will continue to shrink due to AI integration, the ripple effects on the U.S. economy could be profound.
The episode concludes by reflecting on Amazon's dual role as an innovator and disruptor. While robotics have enhanced operational efficiency and productivity, they also pose challenges for the human workforce, including job displacement and evolving labor dynamics. Amazon's journey underscores a critical juncture in the interplay between technology and employment, with far-reaching implications for the future of work in America.
"When Amazon replaces humans with robots, it could have a tremendous impact on our labor economy, on the economy as a whole." (16:30)
As the company continues to push the boundaries of automation, society grapples with balancing technological advancement with sustainable and inclusive labor practices.
Note: Timestamps correspond to the transcript provided for accurate attribution of quotes.