Three Federal Workers Hit by DOGE

Summary

Summary of "The Journal" Podcast Episode: "Three Federal Workers Hit by DOGE"

Introduction

In the March 27, 2025 episode of The Journal, hosted by Kate Linebaugh and Ryan Knutson, alongside Jessica Mendoza, the discussion centers on the substantial layoffs within the federal workforce initiated by the Trump administration's Department of Government Efficiency (DOGE). These cuts, aimed at increasing efficiency and reducing federal spending by $1 trillion, have led to significant disruptions in essential government services.

Overview of Federal Workforce Cuts

Kate Linebaugh introduces Victoria Delano, Keith Kamir, and Brett Taylor—three federal employees affected by the administration's cost-cutting measures. These layoffs are part of a broader initiative under DOGE to streamline operations across various government departments, including the Department of Veterans Affairs (VA), the Internal Revenue Service (IRS), and the Department of Education.

"The federal government has been laying off workers in a way that hasn't been seen before." — Kate Linebaugh [03:37]

Impact on Department of Veterans Affairs: Brett Taylor's Story

Brett Taylor, a social work associate at the VA in Denver and a veteran himself, provides a firsthand account of the layoffs' repercussions.

• Role and Responsibilities: Brett specialized in helping homeless veterans secure permanent housing, addressing both immediate housing needs and accompanying mental health issues such as substance abuse and PTSD.

"Almost every job I've had within the VA has worked with helping veterans maintain housing." — Brett Taylor [06:31]

• Layoff Experience: As a probationary employee, Brett was among the first to be terminated. The abrupt loss of his position left numerous veterans without the support they desperately needed.

"I was in Florida on vacation... and I was terminated as well." — Brett Taylor [08:38]

• Consequences: The reduction in staff has led to increased caseloads for remaining employees, potentially endangering the well-being of veterans relying on VA services.

"Now you doubled or tripled their workload." — Brett Taylor [01:28]

Challenges at the Department of Education: Victoria Delano's Perspective

Victoria Delano, an Equal Opportunity Specialist with the Office for Civil Rights in Birmingham, Alabama, discusses the impact of layoffs on educational oversight.

• Work Scope: Victoria's office was responsible for investigating civil rights violations in over 9,500 public schools, universities, museums, and libraries across four states, staffed by only 60 employees.

"60 people doing investigations for 9,500 public K through 12 schools, plus universities, plus museums, plus libraries." — Victoria Delano [10:25]

• Case Handling: The layoffs have resulted in unresolved cases, with Victoria highlighting instances where students were unable to attend school pending complaint resolutions.

"I had at least one case where a child was not able to go to school because they were waiting on resolution of their complaint." — Victoria Delano [11:30]

• Advocacy and Response: Victoria has been actively opposing the cuts through her union, emphasizing the critical nature of her work and the need for subject matter experts in maintaining civil rights protections.

"This is my passion... we need these subject matter experts in these spaces." — Victoria Delano [12:03]

IRS and Government Efficiency: Keith Kamir's Insights

Keith Kamir, a veteran who worked with the IRS on streamlining the agency's IT budget, shares his experience regarding government efficiency efforts.

• Role in IRS: Keith was involved in managing the IT budget across seven divisions, aiming to eliminate waste and ensure responsible use of taxpayer money.

"Our job is to be able to properly protect taxpayer money and use it for the benefit of the country." — Keith Kamir [16:39]

• Political Stance: A Republican and Trump supporter, Keith initially supported the efficiency measures but grew disillusioned as DOGE's approach became more aggressive and indiscriminate.

"I do think the concept of what DOGE is set out to do... is a good thing." — Keith Kamir [17:01]

• Current Status: Following the sweeping layoffs, Keith was placed on paid administrative leave and is contemplating changing his party affiliation to independent, expressing frustration with the administration's handling of federal efficiency.

"I didn't think that DOGE was going to come in like a bull in a china shop." — Keith Kamir [17:35]

Legal Challenges and Institutional Responses

The federal layoffs have faced significant legal opposition. Two federal district judges have blocked the terminations, ordering the government to reinstate laid-off probationary employees across multiple agencies. In response, the Trump administration has sought Supreme Court intervention to uphold the layoffs.

"Earlier this month, two federal district judges blocked those terminations." — Kate Linebaugh [12:31]

Future Implications and Ongoing Concerns

Lindsay Ellis, a reporter for The Journal, emphasizes the broader impact of these layoffs on American society, noting that federal services often go unnoticed until issues arise that require governmental intervention.

"From a kid who can't get into a classroom to individuals who are trying to find an apartment and they've served their country." — Lindsay Ellis [18:26]

Looking ahead, Ellis is monitoring:

• Future Reduction Plans: Potential further cuts across additional departments and the strategies for their implementation.
• Court Rulings: Outcomes of ongoing litigation and the prospects for reinstating affected employees.
• Agency Adaptations: How departments like the Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) plan to manage their responsibilities with reduced staffing.

"We have a close eye on trying to figure out these future reduction in force plans." — Lindsay Ellis [19:09]

Conclusion

The episode underscores the profound and often unintended consequences of aggressive federal workforce reductions. As departments critical to public welfare—ranging from veterans' services to education and tax administration—navigate these cuts, the strain on remaining employees and the potential decline in service quality pose significant challenges. Legal battles continue to shape the landscape, but the immediate impacts on both federal workers and the citizens they serve highlight the delicate balance between efficiency and efficacy in government operations.

Notable Quotes

• "This is my passion... we need these subject matter experts in these spaces." — Victoria Delano [12:03]
• "Our job is to be able to properly protect taxpayer money and use it for the benefit of the country." — Keith Kamir [16:39]
• "From a kid who can't get into a classroom to individuals who are trying to find an apartment and they've served their country." — Lindsay Ellis [18:26]

Key Takeaways

• Broad Impact of Layoffs: Federal workforce reductions under DOGE have widespread effects across various government services, potentially undermining their effectiveness.
• Employee Perspectives: Frontline workers like Brett Taylor, Victoria Delano, and Keith Kamir highlight both personal and systemic challenges arising from the cuts.
• Legal and Political Ramifications: Court interventions are challenging the administration's policies, while employees grapple with job insecurity and evolving political landscapes.
• Future Monitoring: Ongoing scrutiny is necessary to evaluate the long-term consequences of these efficiency measures on government functionality and public trust.

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This summary is based on the transcript of "The Journal" podcast episode "Three Federal Workers Hit by DOGE," released on March 27, 2025.

Transcript

[Victoria Delano]

My name is Victoria Delano.

[Keith Kamir]

My name is Keith Kamir.

[Brett Taylor]

My name is Brett Taylor.

[Victoria Delano]

I live in Birmingham, Alabama.

[Keith Kamir]

I'm located in Milford, Pennsylvania.

[Brett Taylor]

I was a social work associate with the Rocky Mountain va. And I worked.

[Victoria Delano]

For the US Department of Education Office for Civil Rights as an equal opportunity specialist.

[Keith Kamir]

I was actually working for the Internal Revenue Service, the infamous irs.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Victoria, Keith, and Brett are among thousands of government employees who've been laid off as the Trump administration slashes the federal workforce in the name of efficiency. They say that the work they used to do could be at risk of falling through the cracks, like Victoria's job of investigating alleged civil rights violations in local schools.

[Victoria Delano]

My co workers who were terminated were immediately, like me, cut out of the system, cut out of having any ability to get into the case management system and assist with any transfer of those cases. Those cases are just lost in the abyss. Now.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Brett, who worked at the Department of Veterans affairs, worries about a VA with fewer hands to help homeless vets.

[Brett Taylor]

Not only would the veteran be in crisis, but of course the workers would feel like they're in crisis too, because now you doubled or tripled their workload.

[Kate Linebaugh]

And Keith, who was at the irs, says productivity is suffering.

[Keith Kamir]

I communicated with one of my colleagues just a couple days ago and I said, how's things going? He says, we're just trying to figure it all out. Picking up where you guys left off. So they're all scrambling.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Trump's cuts, three workers and the reach of government efficiency. Welcome to the Journal, our show about money, business and power. I'm Kate LINEBAUGH. It's Thursday, March 27th. Coming up on the show, the collateral damage of the federal layoffs.

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[Kate Linebaugh]

The federal government has been laying off workers in a way that hasn't been seen before. Under the guidance of Elon Musk's Department of Government Efficiency, tens of thousands of employees have been laid off or left their jobs. The Social Security Administration, the Federal Aviation Administration is. The cuts have hit departments department after department.

[Lindsay Ellis]

The Department of Veterans Affairs, Treasury, Energy and Homeland Security, the cdc, the nih.

[Keith Kamir]

And the Education Department.

[Unknown]

These are agencies that Americans either rely.

[Lindsay Ellis]

On or interact with.

[Kate Linebaugh]

President Trump says the federal workforce includes many people who aren't doing their jobs. He also wants to reduce federal spending by $1 trillion this fiscal year. Now, in many cases, these agencies are figuring out how to do their work with fewer employees.

[Lindsay Ellis]

It was really notable to me that we are just a few months into the Trump administration and there were all of these examples of concrete changes based on staff cuts.

[Kate Linebaugh]

That's our colleague Lindsay Ellis. She spoke with over 60 federal workers across the country who do all kinds of jobs for the government.

[Lindsay Ellis]

And the question kept coming up for me, well, what's happening to the work that so many of these people are doing? And it was really striking to me that these cuts have spawned collateral damage to the services that, that Americans can access and in some cases rely on.

[Kate Linebaugh]

One agency that's been hit hard is the Department of Veterans affairs, or the VA. It says it has already laid off more than 2,000 workers and is planning to cut about 70,000 positions. Lindsay spoke to some of the laid off VA employees. One of them was Brett Taylor.

[Lindsay Ellis]

Brett works in Denver at a VA facility and he is a social work associate. He's worked at VA facilities for the last several years. So he's no stranger to, you know, working for the va.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Brett is a vet himself. He served in the Army. How long were you in the military? What'd you do?

[Brett Taylor]

So I only did three years. I only signed up for one contract. I did one year in Iraq, and I knew then that I wasn't going to do 20.

[Kate Linebaugh]

After coming home, Brett went to graduate school and got a master's degree in social work. He says he started at the VA in 2019.

[Brett Taylor]

Almost every job I've had within the VA has worked with helping veterans maintain housing. While there's also a clinical component added to it, like they may have substance abuse issues or there may be some mental health. So not only are we housing, we're also assisting veterans with whatever other issues they may have.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Last summer, Brett moved to Colorado for a new job at the va. In his role, he helps vets without housing find a permanent place to live. One of his last cases, he says, involved a veteran and his family who needed housing that would accommodate the man's disability.

[Brett Taylor]

The house needed to be special for him, like ramps, doors wide enough to get his wheelchair in. So they had to get housed in January, and it took us a while, but it happened.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Why can't the veterans do this on their own?

[Brett Taylor]

Well, some of them have barriers. Some of them are older. Some of them may have mental barriers, like post traumatic stress.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Once Donald Trump took office and created doge, were you concerned for your job?

[Brett Taylor]

I was like, there's no way this. There's no way America would allow something like this to happen.

[Kate Linebaugh]

But I was wrong, because Brett had recently started that new role. He was classified as a probationary employee. Those are workers who were recently hired or promoted in the last year or two. And when the Trump administration started making cuts, probationary employees were among the first targets. So Brett was laid off. How did you find out?

[Brett Taylor]

I was in Florida on vacation with my parents and was in Lowe's getting something from my pops, and I got a call from my co workers that they were terminated. So I went home and I checked my phone and I was terminated as well.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Immediately or was there?

[Brett Taylor]

Yeah, it was immediately.

[Kate Linebaugh]

When you were laid off, how many cases did you have open?

[Brett Taylor]

I think about 16, but because we rapidly house, like, if I get rid of five, there might be five coming in. So within that month, I could see probably 30 or 40 veterans.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Brett's Field office is still open. He worries that the remaining workers are having to handle higher caseloads. And when you think about the sort of policy objective of doge, does any of it ring true? Like, are there inefficiencies at the va?

[Brett Taylor]

Oh, of course. That's not a lie. That's not a lie at all. I'll say from my own experience, I've definitely dealt with people that knew, because this was a federal job and it was a safety net that they can do and say and treat veterans any type of way. But I've also dealt with individuals that work for the va, that love, enjoy, and honor the fact that this is her duties, to serve veterans and to serve America. When it comes down to it.

[Kate Linebaugh]

A VA spokesperson said the probationary employees who've been laid off amount to half of 1% of its workforce, saying, quote, the notion that these layoffs are causing issues across the department is false. Over at The Department of Education. Victoria, who's in Birmingham, Alabama, is also sympathetic to a broad goal of government efficiency.

[Victoria Delano]

I understand the need to cut fraud, waste and abuse. However, when I joined the Office for Civil Rights and I saw there were only 60 people out of my office, which covered four states. So that's 60 people doing investigations for 9,500 public K through 12 schools, plus universities, plus museums, plus libraries. 60 people to do that much work out of my regional office. I thought, okay, the math isn't going to math here if we have fewer people. Logically, I was thinking, if anything, that needs to be expanded. Surely with this being a congressionally mandated program funded by Congress, surely this is one program that won't be cut because there is no, there's no waste in there to cut.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Victoria had a number of ongoing cases at the Office for Civil Rights, ones she says she wasn't able to hand off.

[Victoria Delano]

And that's terribly concerning because I for one had at least one case where a child was not able to go to school because they were waiting on resolution of their complaint. So you multiply that over and over and over. I don't know what's happening to those cases. Nothing as far as I've heard.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Victoria has been advocating against the cuts with her union. She says she's fighting for her job because it's something she really believes in.

[Victoria Delano]

This is a job that I took because I wanted to do this work, not because I had to do this work to pay my bills. This is my passion. So part of me holds out hope that the administration will backtrack and realize, wait a minute, we need these subject matter experts in these spaces and that this absolutely is essential.

[Kate Linebaugh]

A Department of Education spokesperson said the Office for Civil Rights plans to use more mediation and and a faster case processing approach to address disability related and other harassment complaints, noting that the agency will, quote, deliver on its statutory responsibilities. The layoffs of probationary federal employees like Victoria and Brett were quickly challenged in court. Earlier this month, two federal district judges block those terminations. One judge in San Francisco ordered the government to reinstate laid off probationary employees at a half dozen agencies. This week, the Trump administration asked the Supreme Court to intervene on its behalf. As the litigation works through the courts, Victoria and Brett have been in limbo. They were both reinstated but put immediately on administrative leave. Then this week, Brett says he was told to return to work and is in the process of getting onboarded again. After the break, we talked to another laid off worker, someone who was already working in government efficiency. Foreign.

[Unknown]

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[Kate Linebaugh]

Keith Kamir has worked in the government for a number of years. He's worked for the Census and the Small Business Administration. Why have you been drawn to government work?

[Keith Kamir]

Well, I'm a veteran and I love to be able to serve my country. So as an Air Force veteran, I swore an oath to uphold and defend the Constitution. I fell in love with the idea and the notion of serving in a greater capacity because it's not about me. It's about what does this program or this service offer the country as a whole.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Last year, Keith joined the irs. He was on a team charged with streamlining the process to manage the agency's IT budget.

[Keith Kamir]

There's seven IT divisions within the agency altogether.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Seven IT divisions?

[Keith Kamir]

Yeah.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Why so many?

[Keith Kamir]

Because there's so many different divisions. They all support different functions within the agency.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Keith says a big part of his job was government efficiency. Is the objective to cut waste?

[Keith Kamir]

Yes. What are we spending on? How much are we spending here? Do we need to spend money over here? Why are you spending it this way? So it allows for people who are actually in charge of the IT budget to be able to identify where they're spending their money and if it makes sense.

[Kate Linebaugh]

The IRS didn't respond to a request for comment. What's your view of government waste?

[Keith Kamir]

It's upsetting. It's very upsetting. We are supposed to have, in my opinion, a fiduciary responsibility to the taxpayers. Right. So our job is to be able to properly protect taxpayer money and use it for the benefit of the country.

[Kate Linebaugh]

How would you describe your politics?

[Keith Kamir]

Well, I mean, politically I've supported traditionally Republicans. I voted for Trump three times. Full disclosure. And I think it's important that you don't have a bloated government. And I do think it's important that you have accountability and that you identify what's working, what's not working. And so, yes, I think the concept of what Doge is set out to do and was set up to do is a good thing and it falls in line with what my job is about.

[Kate Linebaugh]

So Trump comes into the White House, establishes Doge. Did you think your job would be affected?

[Keith Kamir]

I was under the impression that it would mean that we would be sticking around to help the IRS support and implement what Doge is looking to do. Now. I didn't think that Doge was going to come in like a bull in a china shop and just start like throwing everything out. I figured it was a matter of, okay, we're going to go in and figure out what's working, what's not working. And in the process, if they uncover some sort of fraud, waste and abuse, they would identify it and nip it in the butt. But instead it was more, let's just go ahead and just throw the baby out with the bathwater.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Keith says he's now on paid administrative leave but not allowed to go back to work. And he told us he's considering changing his party affiliation from Republican to independent. The sweep of these cuts is just beginning to be felt across the country.

[Lindsay Ellis]

The US Government touches so much of Americans daily lives. There are so many examples of work that federal employees do every day that might fade into the background until you need to make that call or submit that complaint. I mean, from a kid who can't get into a classroom to individuals who are trying to find an apartment and they've served their country.

[Kate Linebaugh]

What are you watching for going forward?

[Lindsay Ellis]

We have a close eye on trying to figure out these future reduction in force plans, what departments or areas will be subject to the cuts, the timeline of them, and how those are going to be rolled out. And I also have my eye on those court rulings, trying to understand what happens from here, how and if people are fully reinstated into their roles and where the appeals processes go.

[Kate Linebaugh]

Today, more cuts were announced. The Department of Health and Human Services said it plans to cut 10,000 full time employees. Those employees work in departments that are tasked with responding to disease outbreaks, approving new drugs and providing insurance for the poorest Americans. HHS said Essential health services won't be affected. That's all for today. Thursday, March 27. The Journal is a co production of Spotify and the Wall Street Journal. Additional reporting in this episode by Matt Barnum, Allison Polley and Liz Eslie White. Thanks for listening. See you tomorrow.