← The JOY Broadcast
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- [00:01]
A
Welcome to the Joy Broadcast with me, Ali Mortimer. I was once upon a time an IT consultant, recoding systems in the retail industry to function better. And now I'm turned a life consultant and joy coach, where I'd like to think I reprogram and recode hearts, minds, souls and lives to feel better. This podcast, the Joy Broadcast, is a way to bring joy to your life, whatever the weather, whatever you're doing. So you feel a pocket or of positivity in every single day. If, like me, you've once upon a time found yourself wondering whether you will ever be happy again or if you're just staring at the kitchen sink wondering how you'll get through the next 10 minutes, this podcast is for you. Get you a glimmer of hope, a dose of happiness, or an infusion of joy right here, right now. Welcome to the Joy Broadcast. Welcome back to the Joy Broadcast. I was thinking earlier today how I wanted to introduce my guest this evening because she has no formal bio, which I absolutely love. So I'm just going to introduce you to my wonderful guest tonight, just really by telling the story of how our worlds collided. And I think it was in 2020 when I saw this incredible photograph of a sunset and like this arc of hair. And I just thought, who the hell is this chick? Who is this woman? And I was like, I want photographs like that. I want a photograph like that of me. And what I realize is that we have so much. And the reason why I want her to come on this podcast tonight is because she, I can't tell you, she changed my life. Makes me feel very, very emotional. There aren't many people I will say about this, but she was a pivotal person. I can't look her in the eye because I'll probably cry. But when I look back at my journey over the last decade, she has been so incredibly pivotal in bringing so much joy into my life. And her work is not just photography, it is art. Like, breathtaking. Like, when I first saw that photograph, it took my breath away. It is art. It is beauty. It is. It has been truly alchemizing, transformational for me, it's healing. Her work has been one of the most radical acts of self love I have ever experienced. And I've done a lot of courses and I've done a lot of therapy and I've had a lot of training, but hers was the most profound. And I thought I was just going to learn how to take photographs of myself. You know, I am so grateful that I took the courage to start to see myself in a very, very different way. And Paula, Ivy has been that person. So that now I have thousands of photographs for my boys to see. Because ultimately what I wanted was to be able to have a box of photographs of me when I die. Because when my mum died, can't believe it, quite honestly, 10 years ago, we had no photographs of Mum because she hated the way she looked. And that was a trait that be passed down to me so that I did not like the way I looked either. I'm going to stop talking. Paula, I love you.
- [03:24]
I know. That's why I couldn't look at you.
- [03:27]
When I was speaking. I was like, if I catch your eye, I will just stop loving. But I can't tell you and I. I can't tell you how much joy you brought into my life because I wouldn't be able to do what I do without the work that we did together in 2021, 2020 23. And I'm still inspired by your photographs and the conversations that we have. And I'm so grateful to call you one of my besties online. You know, we live halfway around the world from each other, but, you know, still make time to have these conversations. And thank you for coming on the JOY broadcast. If I want to be able to share an ounce of the joy that you've given me to the listeners who are going to listen to today, I'm.
- [04:11]
B
So glad I don't have a formal bio.
- [04:16]
That was so beautiful to receive. I. Oh, my gosh, we have been.
- [04:21]
A
On a journey together and I'm sure there'll be many more to come. I keep threatening that I'm going to come to Australia.
- [04:28]
And you keep threatening that you're coming to London.
- [04:31]
B
Exactly. I know we will meet in the person one day. I feel like I already have. So I know that you said similar things about my work so many times before, but it just, it gets me every time that you say that. And.
- [04:47]
I've even had a couple of, you know, therapists and, like, psychotherapists and. And people join my programs and stuff. And I've heard that before where they're like, this is so therapeutic and this is, you know, profound and all of those things. And that's something that, you know, when you have those days where you just, like, you have a brain fart, you're like, I don't know what I do in the world. I don't know how I help people. What's the point? Like, business goes up and down. You have those days. You're like, I Do nothing. I just teach people how to take a photo. Like, it's so trivial. But then it. I guess people of all, like, genres of art feel this too. You know, I'm sure music, musicians feel this. And, you know, whatever kind of art that you create is like, you have these days where you're like, why? Like, I don't even know what I do. Just because it comes so innately to you. And I feel like, yeah, my past with photography and how it all began that.
- [05:56]
Because it was in childhood and it's something that's, you know, attached to such a traumatic event that it's so deeply ingrained in who I am that it's just.
- [06:08]
I don't know, I kind of forget how important it is, I guess, in a way, which is so. I mean, you've just. You just made me ball like a baby, so.
- [06:20]
A
But I think it's so. It's so interesting, isn't it? You know, I saw the photograph of you. It is an iconic photograph of you. And you have so many iconic photographs. I mean, the most recent one is that one of you in that screen mask, which, when I saw it, I literally clapped my hands and did a little dance. I was like, she's done it again. I didn't think she'd stop me in my tracks again so quickly, but, you know, it's just so beautiful in a weird kind of way. But I. I saw those photographs of you four years ago and I was like, I want photographs like that of me. I just thought it was going to be a very practical. Let me hop into this group. I'm going to learn. And I'm, you know, I am an A grade student in any, any course I go into. It's like, right, let me follow it. And the first one I jumped into is the self ography 30 that you were running at the time. And it was like, day one, find a square and go and put yourself in front of the square and start to dance in front of the square and take photographs of yourself. And I was like, okay, you know, and off I go. And I took myself through every single day doing it. But it was then going into selfie queens to really understand the angles and how you could see light and imagery. And it was then how I learned how to angle my body in ways that put myself into different shapes to make photographs interesting. They weren't just a selfie, as in look down my arm and look up above, you know, the ones that everybody always does. It was like, suddenly it was. It became art. And I Started to see my body and my reflection more than just what my mum had put into my mind, which was I had a fat bottom and I was overweight and, you know, I was never going to be blah, blah, blah. And I started to see that I had arms and legs that made shapes and images and I, you know, do you know, all of it. I just suddenly started to see myself almost objectively. And then. Then going through that whole process of then going through the. The filtering and the editing, I just found it so incredibly healing and cathartic. Oh, I look better that way, or I look better in that angle, or if I change that color, then that looks slightly better. So next time I take a photograph, I can do that. It was just. Yes, it was. It was strategic and a tool and a skill to learn how to do it. But through seeing you taught me how to see myself differently, which is what I knew I had to do. The words of Wayne Dyer, I knew, you know, when you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change, and I could not. That was what you taught me how to do. I had been so ingrained in my mind to see myself as ugly. In fact, what do we call ourselves? Fugly. That was a word I got from you. I was fugly. I was so fricking ugly. And that was how I'd seen myself for so long. And then there was that episode when Willy was standing in front of the mirror dancing, going, I love yourself. You know, I look good, I look hot. And then I was like, oh, my God, Paul is teaching me how to do that. And I was like, oh, that's what's happening. I'm reprogramming myself. So when I say you're alchemizing and transformational, Yes, I came in to learn how to take photographs of myself, but your work goes so much deeper than that. As I said, art photography has now become a radical act of self love. Because I look the mirror and I go, oh, my God, you look great today. You look really hot. Oh, my God. Who is this person looking at me in the mirror?
- [09:19]
B
You know, it's so funny because it's like a. It's simply like a light switch that gets flipped on all of a sudden. And I've seen this happen, like, with everybody that I've worked with. Everybody's journey with this is so different. And people join for so many different reasons, but it's so predictable because all of a sudden this light switch event happens where it's just like, you lean in closer and you're like holy shit, I am beautiful. Like I can see it. It's not, you know, people compliment you and say you know all the things but you never truly take it on because you're like, yeah, but I know my inner voice and it says that I'm fugly, I'm fat, I'm ugly, I'm. All the things that you tell yourself repeatedly, whatever those things are. Because it's, you know, it's different for all of us because we take it all on from, you know, parents, friends, experiences, ex boyfriends, whatever. And it's all their projection on us.
- [10:20]
And it's almost, to use a photography term, it's like, it's like you've got all these filters of the way that you see yourself that have been slapped on top of the mirror when you look inside because you're like, okay, I can see those wrinkles, I can see my fat butt. I can see, you know, those rolls in the places, the gray hair, the wrinkles, the, all the, the rolls in the wrong places. And when you start to, you know, using self self portrait photography as a way to remove those filters one by one and then all of a sudden you're like, oh, I see me like you. And you see yourself in a completely new light. It's so fat. Because it happened to me too. It was like all of a sudden I'm like, oh, I see that thing that people get magnetized towards me and I didn't understand why before, but now I can see it. It's like there's that sounding cheesy, but there is that inner light that comes through and it's like, that's like your life force that comes through and when that's turned on and it's not being filtered by. I need to position my body in this way for you to perceive me in this way. Or I need to dress myself in a certain way to, for you to see me in a certain way. Not because I want to dress like this, but I, but I'm dressing like this for you rather than I'm dressing for my own self expression, so to speak. Like there's so many different things that we do to present ourselves in ways because we think that's what other people find attractive in us. We think that's what other people want to see in us. We think that that's how we're going to be accepted by the world. When in actual fact people get drawn to you and want to be a part of your world, so to speak, is when that life force energy gets Switched on, and there's, like, this glow that happens that there's this, like, when you look at photos and somebody's exuding that, like what you said, like, people look at it and go, holy shit, who is this person? Like, what's going on here? Like, the photo you were talking about with the arc of hair, like, I, it is iconic, but I was literally wearing my pajamas at the beach. Like, I don't think I've ever shared that, but I, I, I know exactly the photo you were talking about. And it was at sunrise, and I was at the beach, and I was wearing, like, little shorts and a T shirt that I'd worn to bed because I'd gotten up early. And I'm like, I'm just going to walk to the sunrise. And the, the photo itself is of a silhouette. So, I mean, you can't really tell what I'm wearing, but it doesn't matter because my energy was on point. I. That's one of my. It's now iconic because I do it all the time. But those hair flicks that I do is me shaking up my energy, is me shaking out the cobwebs of feeling awkward, putting myself in front of the camera, because I still feel that. And me going, okay, we're going to shake this off. And I just want to experience a really present moment right now of me feeling good in my body and, and me feeling alive. That's just what I want to experience right now. And flicking my hair around, doing cartwheels, that's also iconic for me, you know, dancing around like a bit of a Looney Tune. Like, all those things I do because I'm like, all right, I'm having a bit of a dense moment. Energy's sort of sticky. Kind of woke up feeling a bit like, what the hell am I going to do today? How the hell do I help people? Like, what's going on? I don't know who I am. And then I shake my energy up and I flick my hair around. I do my cartwheels. I remember who the fuck I am. I'm sorry. Can I swear on this podcast, please.
- [14:15]
A
I'm probably the biggest potty mouth around.
- [14:17]
B
I know you are, but I was like, the podcast anyway. Yeah, so it's like a ritual for me to get into my body. And that's one of the funnest things I love to teach people, is like, okay, how do you want to move your body so that you have that moment? And that's, you know, like what you said at the beginning of the Self Autography 30 creative mission. Like the first prompt is feel good. It's like get yourself actually feeling good. This is how this whole thing works. If you're not feeling good, you're not going to like the photos. If you're not feeling good, you're not going to allow yourself to go there with your self expression. For you to be able to actually see that life force energy come alive in you. And that's where that switch is going to be flicked.
- [15:03]
A
And it's interesting. Is it? We talk about life force energy and joy. You know, it's the lit up sacral. You and I both also have this passion for human design and it's. So many people don't want to be seen. They fear what other people are going to think when they have a photograph. They worry about looking arrogant because they've taken a photograph of themselves. And I think there's this element of. I love what you've said. There's a difference between confidence and arrogance. There's a fine line, isn't there? There's. And I think I can relate it back to what you were just saying earlier. And it's. The difference is confidence is. I almost. It is. I love me. I'm doing this for me. I'm taking this photograph for me. I want the photograph. I like what I'm wearing. I want to take a photograph. I think I want to capture the moment, I want to capture the image. I want to feel alive. I want to commemorate the fact that I'm alive and I'm feeling good and I'm feeling well. And this is the most amazing day to be alive. Look at the sunset or look at the snow. Some of my favorite photographs I ever took of myself. Well, one day when I looked out of the window and it was snowing, I was like, I've got to go and take a photograph. I'm going to put on my sparkliest dress. I'm going to run down to the, to the garages which have got beautiful wooden front doors and I just started dancing in front of them. I had like a five minute selfie photograph session, ran back up and did a client session and then edited them later. But I felt so alive in that moment of just dancing in the snow in a sparkly dress. I think my client thought I was bonkers. Sat there in like one of my. But there's this element. I did that for me because I wanted to honor myself in that moment and I was confident enough and the act gave me the confidence. Whereas the arrogance that we can see Sometimes in photographs and you talk about that glow. The arrogance is people putting photographs out there for people needing them to tell them that they look great. Whereas your magnetism, and I get so many people saying the same thing for my photographs as well because of you, is that I don't need them to tell me I look great. I fucking know I look great because I'm alive and I'm loving it. And I think that is the. That's the glow. You're doing it because you wanted to capture the sunset, not because you were going to take a photograph of the sunset to put on social media to get the likes. You were like, I want to go and capture this moment to commemorate the fact that I'm alive. And I think what's so beautiful is that we come right back to, you know, your love of photography was born from a traumatic moment of grief, of losing the aliveness. I lost my mum and that made me want to take photographs to remind myself that I was alive. Are you happy to share the story of why and how you got into photography initially?
- [17:35]
B
Yeah, I don't share this often. I guess like anything traumatic, it's hard to talk about. But I'm more than happy to talk about it today. And I do share. I have shared about this, like inside of programs and things like that before in more detail. But.
- [17:53]
So I. For. For Christmas one year, Santa gave me one of those little point and shoot cameras. And it was film, obviously, back in the day. And so I got this little point and shoot camera, just had one button on it and a flash and that was it. And I got a roll of film and I was like, oh, what's this? This is, this is kind of fun because my dad has always been into photography. His dad was always into photo. Like, it's. I've got cousins on both sides of my family that are photographers too. It's like it's in our blood. It's like that obsession with photos is in our blood already. So I think I had that already going for me. And so Santa had bought me this camera and I was like, oh my God, best thing ever. And yeah, it didn't leave my hand. I took it everywhere. I took photos of everything and nothing all at the same time. And, you know, within the day I was like, okay, mom, can you take this to get developed and buy me a new roll of film? And she was like, oh, already? Okay. And then after, you know, the first couple of weeks, she was like.
- [19:01]
Okay, you need to make sure that you know what you're taking Photos of. Before you take the photo. Like, I can't keep supply. I don't think they thought it would, like, escalate so quickly. And I remember her saying, like, just like. And it stuck with me. Like, know what you're taking a photo of and why you're taking it? Like, put some intentionality behind it. Don't just take these seemingly ridiculous, frivolous photos. Because she'd look at them after they come back, and she's like, what? Why did she take. What. What is this? Like, she didn't understand.
- [19:35]
A
And it wasn't cheap at the time, was it? You know, roll of film and then to get them developed, you know, it was not cheap. It's not like we are today, where it's like, oh, take hundreds of thousands of crap photos that just stay on your. Yeah, phone.
- [19:47]
B
I know. But also, I do believe.
- [19:51]
I do believe actually learning on film is. Is so cool because you don't know what's happening in camera. Kind of forces you to start to see, like, a camera when you got digital, you just rely on. On it. That. That didn't work. Try again. And I feel like it's a much more intense process because you have to wait for the film to come back and you're like, oh, that didn't work. Okay, try something else next time. And it was very much trial and error. And I did take a lot of really crap photos. I will admit. A lot of them are just like, I don't even know what that is. But my younger brother was.
- [20:26]
Like, one thing that people always said about my brother was he was just so full of life. And he was. He was like this kid that just wouldn't sit still. He'd be like, let's go play cricket now. Let's go play football now. Let's go into the. Like, we had this huge bush in the back of our yard. He's like, let's go into the bush and just, like, find stuff and, like, run around. And, like, he was constantly moving, had a lot of energy, was always the kid. Like, my older brother and I always fought. And so he was like the mediator between us, even though I was the middle child. And so he was always up for, let's go take some photos. Because I'll be like, hey, let's go take some photos. And he'd be like, okay, take a photo of me doing this. Take a photo of me doing this. Take a photo. Like, just that playful energy of just, like, no inhibition being complete. Like, just. Just putting it all out there. Basically. We Took somebody.
- [21:21]
A
It was alive. Being alive. Joyfully alive.
- [21:23]
B
Exactly. And that's. That's part of, like.
- [21:28]
Why these photos? So that was probably when I was about 7 or 8. And then when I was 12, he passed away suddenly via an accident. And he. Like those photos that we. We'd taken. I remember my mom came to me and she's like, give me all the photos you have of him. Because she had photos, but they were like the. Sit there in front of the birthday. Yeah, sit there with the birthday cake and smile. Everybody smile now. Okay, Stand in front of that lookout we just climbed to. And everybody smile now. Like, there were a lot of posed family photos. And so these photos were just like, they're beautiful because they're just so full of life. They're just like, you look at them and you're like, that was him. You know, you look at the smiley photos and you're like, yeah, that's him. But like, you can feel the moment. And I can remember being in that moment when I look at those photos. And that, for me, is my intention now still when I take photos, whether I take photos of clients for. You know, I was doing wedding photography for ages. I was doing family portraits, I do branding photography, and now teaching people how to do self portraits. You know, a lot of women that I work with are mothers and they're like, I want to take some more photos with my kids. Because I've got photos of my kids. I've got photos of my husband with my kids or my partner with my kids, but I don't have any of me because I am always the one thinking about, oh, I'd love to have a photo of this moment. And like what you said, it's so easy to take photos now. We've all got a phone and we're like, oh, take a photo of this. And I feel like.
- [23:02]
One of the things that people say about photography now is that I didn't want to take. They might say things like, I didn't take any photos because I wanted to be in the moment. And I'm like, ah, that is different to how I take photos and how I see photography. I'm like, when I take photos, it brings me into the moment even more, makes me feel so present, so connected to life. It's almost like a vortex where everything else just sort or liken it to a portal. It kind of takes you to the present moment and everything else falls away and you get to focus on what's really important about right now. And it's like, how am I feeling? And how do I want to remember this? Or how do I want to not even. Just not even remember it, but, like, how do I just want to have this experience right here, right now? Like, that's the case. Like, how do I want to experience me in this moment right here, right now? Because.
- [24:03]
That'S all that life is. Like, it might sound selfish to be like, what do I want my experience to me, But I can't have an experience for anybody else but myself. Like, I literally can't be. Like, I want this moment to be for this person as much as you want that in, you know, and. And we can do thoughtful things and we can, you know, be there for people and care for them, but ultimately it's like, you do have to focus on how you want this moment to feel and be for you so that you can be, you know, a light, a ray of sunshine, a lightning bolt of energy or aliveness for somebody else in whatever way, you know, you want to give to them. So for a while after he passed away, though I didn't touch my camera. It felt too hard. But then when I picked it up again, like, I'm going to cry.
- [25:00]
A
You were allowed.
- [25:00]
B
I was doing so well.
- [25:03]
But then when. But then when I did, like, that presence in a moment was all I could think about. I was like this. He was only nine when he passed away. I'm like.
- [25:19]
Life can be so fucking short. Oh, God, I can't look at you. They're like, you just gotta live like that.
- [25:28]
A
I always remember thinking, when my mum died and, you know, she had a great life. It wasn't in any way like your brother, but I remember she died too young, and she hadn't really lived for the final decade of her life. And I remember the day that she passed. I remember just thinking, the gift that you've left me is to live. Because she made me realize that life is short. And I was. Well, that was the day I started giving. No, I was like, you know what? Like, you just said something again a minute ago that sparked a memory in me. It's the fact that we come into this world alone, right, on our own, and we leave it on our own. And I remember thinking, when my mum was dying, you know, she took seven days to die, bless her. She was incredibly stubborn. She wanted to wait for her 43rd wedding anniversary before she passed. And she did. She. She got 90 minutes into that, that day.
- [26:27]
But I remember the seven days we were sat there, my dad, my sister and I, and friends and family came in and we told the story of her life and we had the album of memories, not many of my mum. There were so few photographs of her, but we told the stories of her life and she couldn't partake in it at all. She wasn't there at all. But I thought, that's what I want at the end of my life. I want people to come in and tell the stories of my life and I want to be there listening to them and I want to be there with the ones of them in my mind. And when I think about photography and what you've just said, you taught me how to be in the present moment by taking photographs. Like you. If I want to be in the moment, I get my camera out because it makes me look at the details that I'm surrounded by. It makes me look at the light. You know, I see snow in a whole different way. I see the sea in a different way. I see the mountains in a different way. I see people's faces in a very, very different way because you taught me how to see them so differently. So if I want to be in the moment, I get my camera out, I don't put it away.
- [27:30]
B
Yeah, I think there's something to. When you put a frame up, like whether you're using your phone or whether you're looking through the viewfinder of a camera, there's something to that focusing in on this is the moment. Because there's so much happening at any one time. There's so much information. And I did know the specific numbers of this, but it's something like.
- [27:57]
There's like millions of bits of information flooding, like, that's around you all of the time. But your brain literally can't process all of it. So it filters things and it filters things so you only have like, I don't know, like a tenth of what or not even that of information that's available to you actually gets processed by your brain. And that's where you know the saying, like what you focus on amplifies and all that sort of stuff is so true. Like your reality is shaped by what you deem important because that's what your brain is filtering for you to see right now. Because it thinks this is important to you, this is important to you. I better put this into your awareness. Everything else can just be filtered out because that's not what your, your deeming is important or what you're thinking about. So you know, the thoughts you think and what you say really matter because it does shape your reality. Because your brain is auto filtering for you going, okay? She thinks this is it. Doesn't care if it's like you're thinking about the worst possible situations or you think about the best. It's like, oh, she just thinks this is important. I'll show it to her. So for me, when I put that frame up and I look through the viewfinder, it. It's almost like I'm telling my brain that this is what's important right now. Like, even if I've gone off on a tangent in the past few days or weeks or months, or I've gone down a spiral about something, at least in this moment, I'm like, no, no, no, no. This is what's important, what's in the frame right here. And it gets you to focus on the details that you otherwise would have missed. And like what you said, you know, you look at the beach a different way. The snow, the mountains. It's like you notice the. The way the petals are shaped on a flower. You notice the way the. The light is falling on the blades of grass. And you notice these little details that otherwise just would have not even entered your consciousness. Because your brain's like, well, that's not life or death for her. This isn't life or death for her. Like, this isn't important. Doesn't need to know that's not going to kill us. It's. It's fine. She doesn't need to know that, you know, So I feel like having. I don't know if that's more of a me liking to be in control in a moment for some reason, because life does feel so out of control, especially when you have a loved one who dies all of a sudden. Like, life just feels like, well, anything can freaking happen now. Like, whoa, did not see that coming at all. So. But I think that.
- [30:34]
When you allow yourself pockets of time to focus in on just what do I see and how do I feel and how do I want to experience living right now? Like, the more that I do that, the more it helps my mental health, the more it helps me to fall in love with life.
- [30:54]
A
I was going to say taking the. Taking the photographs helps you appreciate your surroundings and find the beauty in it. That's how I see it. What's the beauty here? How can I capture it?
- [31:05]
B
Absolutely. Because it can be so hard sometimes living where you're living. Because I know I've had this feeling many times before and I feel it. I don't know. I live in Sydney, Australia. I live on the Northern beaches, which is a beautiful, beautiful part of Australia. Absolutely. I mean, we traveled around Australia. But I feel like.
- [31:25]
Sometimes when you live in a place that just feels the same all the time. I don't know if this is part of, you know, my human design child or something that, like, I need my energy around me to shift and change for me to like, you know, feel connected to life, I guess. But that does, you know, the monotonous, mundane, routine life. Sometimes we can take our surroundings for granted and you kind of fall out of love with where you're at and you wish that you were somewhere else. You know, it might be. It might not be like where you live, for example. It might be, you know, where you're at with certain relationships. It might be where you're at with your career or your, you know, your finances or whatever it is when you're having those moments of like, oh, the same thing. I just wish I wasn't right here right now. I want to be there. I want to be when I've achieved this or when this is different. But I mean, you and I know that that's not how this works, that.
- [32:25]
A
You know, it doesn't. And, you know, that takes me right back to that photograph. And when, you know, on the beach, I was like, well, how am I going to actually recreate that? I live in North Yorkshire, miles and miles away from the sea. You were in the middle of the summer, I was in the midd of the winter. And I was like, right, what are we gonna play with here? And I think I went out in my bubble hat and just like, just started doing silly pirouettes in the middle of a field in the rain. I, you know, I was just like, do you remember the photographs? And I came out in my big blue dry robe and I was just splashing in the puddles. This is like, this is my Paula Ivy moment. But I'm in a puddle in North Yorkshire in a dry rope.
- [33:06]
This is like, I'll work with what I've got.
- [33:08]
B
That's the thing though. And I looked at like there was. There's quite a few women that are on the opposite side of the world to me inside of, you know, this the creative mission and selfie queens and stuff. And whenever we'd take photos and then we'd all share them, I would get that envy too. I'd be like, she's in the snow. I don't ever get to go to the snow. I want to take photos in the snow. It's so pretty. Look at it. Whereas, like, you know, people like, well, it's snowing. So I don't know what I'm going to do today. But it's like that shift of perspective of like, how do you find just the fun in this moment?
- [33:44]
A
And even if there isn't any, how do I create it? That's what you help me see. Just like, right the way. Go back to the bit where you have us dancing and just like, go and shake it off. Just go and move your body, go and shift your energy, go and feel alive. And then turn your camera on and just see what happens.
- [34:00]
B
Yeah, because even if it's been raining for days on end and you're like, oh, it's raining. Can't really go take photos. You can still go take photos. You can. It's just like, how are you going to. I don't know. How are you going to, you know, put that frame up and focus on this moment right now? Like, what's, what's really going to help you feel alive? Dancing out in the rain, Is that going to make you feel alive? In my membership the other week where we do work, live workshops every week inside of there where we all jump on zoom and we're all taking photos together. And one of the women who, opposite side of the world to me, she's in France and she was like, it's raining today. And she's like, I think actually I might do some like, with the water on the, the window, because she was sitting there and she was like, I can see the water drops on the, on the window, though, and they're really pretty. But it was just this moment of shifting her from like, well, it's raining. I don't know what I'm gonna do to like actually focusing in and going, oh, well, that's beautiful. How can I take photos? And then I helped her. I was like, well, you know, set your camera up here. You go here. And then just see what happens, See what they, how they turn out. And she tried it and they're stunning.
- [35:15]
A
They're absolutely beautiful. But again, you know, that's what you say. It's how you see. You see everything through a different lens. Whether that's through a camera lens or not. You, whether you've got your camera with you, you just start to notice things in a. You open my eyes to so much more than just my body, but to see everything. Like whenever I'm on holiday now, I'm like, oh, look at that square window. I'm going to go come back when my family are not watching me and I'm going to go and sit myself in It. And take a photograph, you know, and you walk around, you're like, oh, those windows. Flowers are beautiful. Or those shadows are wonderful. Gosh, isn't that an interesting, you know, archway. And you just start to. You notice, you. You know, the aliveness comes through the way you see everything.
- [35:58]
B
Yes.
- [35:59]
A
Very, very differently, including yourself. Right. And that is the epitome of being alive.
- [36:03]
B
Yes.
- [36:04]
A
In my opinion.
- [36:05]
B
I'm really loving the word linger at the moment. It's like you just linger in a. In a moment and it's like kind of like I'm just gonna linger around and see what happens. Like, it seems kind of a bit like, creepy, but like, at the same time, I creep on that moment, like, see what's there. Have it, like, deep. Have a deeper look.
- [36:25]
A
Now I want to go ask you a question, because one of my favorite posts you talked about recently were all these photographs that are being done by AI. Oh, yeah. Tell me your perspective. Talk me through that. Because I love that.
- [36:36]
B
I think it's dumb. And it's not that I. It's dumb.
- [36:40]
A
AI photography, full stop. It's done.
- [36:43]
B
I'm not against AI. I think that it's really helpful. Like, I'm studying at the moment. I have a double life. I'm also a coach at a gym, and I'm doing some study for that. And there was a part of one of the assignments that I was just reading, and I'm like, I don't understand what the hell I'm supposed to do here. So I was like, okay, chat, can you read this and tell me what I need to do? And then I was like, oh, I get it now.
- [37:11]
A
Thank you very much for the summary.
- [37:12]
B
Thank you. Yeah, so I love it. I do use it for certain things, and I have nothing against AI imagery either. I feel like when you're taking someone's likeness and creating stuff, I think that's like, no, I don't agree with that. But even if it's you taking your likeness to create images, there's. What I have beef with is not necessarily that if you want to do that, go for it. But it's when people call it a photograph and they say they're doing an AI photo shoot, I'm like, that's not a thing. Like, you're just making digital art. You're not. Actually. The whole definition of a photo shoot is to create pictures with a camera, and you're not doing that in a.
- [38:00]
A
Location for a specific reason. Yeah. And the whole. I mean, the photo shoot is the enjoyment of the experience by Being outside and being alive.
- [38:09]
B
Exactly. So I'm like, if you want to go make AI art and use that, like, this is more in a entrepreneurial setting. Because a lot of people, like, I've got my business, I need photos for content and marketing. But I don't, you know, it's the same excuses that people used, like since forever. It's like, I don't have the time, I don't have the resource, like the money. I don't have the space to do a photo shoot right now. I just need the images like yesterday because I'm launching this thing. And I totally get that. But there's people that are like, okay, I'm going to teach you how to do AI photo shoots so you don't need a photographer anymore. And I'm not sour because people are taking away from the photography industry because I feel like I've already done that by teaching people how to take photos themselves. I'm like, photographers do hate me.
- [38:56]
But my argument is I'm like, I'm actually making them better clients for you because there will come a day where they're like, like, I want to create this image and I can't do that myself. So I'm going to hire a photographer to do it for me. And I already know how to position myself in front of the camera. I already know how to, you know, turn it on so that we're not spending the first 30 minutes of our session me feeling really self conscious and, you know, you freaking out because you're like, oh, she's not loosening up, she's not warming up. I could take better photos than this. She's really like, you know, stiff and awkward and, and all of the things. And like, I'm making them better clients for you because they will come on and rock that photo shoot and make you look even better. Because they know what they're doing and they're comfortable already. Anyway, that's a whole other story. But with the AI stuff, I'm like, but it's not a photo shoot and it's not a photo. And I think that using that wording is a slippery slope because people.
- [39:59]
Present.
- [39:59]
A
It as there's no camera involved.
- [40:01]
B
Exactly.
- [40:01]
A
There's no camera involved.
- [40:02]
B
And it's also not you who's been like, that was in front of the camera in a scene or a setting that actually exists. It was just something that you've created. And I, and I. There is the argument that like, well, some photographers do set up a scene that doesn't exist for you to have like there's those fantasy type photo shoots and like you can do a whole set and all of that sort of stuff which I do get. Like that's.
- [40:34]
Creating a reality that you're wanting to create. But I, I. There just needs to be a different term for it because it's not the same thing.
- [40:43]
A
And it's a separation. It's not a truth. Yeah.
- [40:47]
B
And I feel like, Well, I feel like photography is a contradiction because it's truth and it's not truth at the same time. Like you are creating a 2D image still image of like reality. So there is always going to be distortion there, but the essence of it isn't true. Like that to me is the, the magic behind photography. Is that like what we said? Like that aliveness, that glow, that glow, that lick. It's like an electricity, like a bolt of electricity that comes through when you witness a photo and people can still feel that. I know AI is getting really good now and people like, which photos AI and people like, I don't know anymore. But I do feel like that when you do come across a photo that is real, like there is something that comes through you that you're just like, what is this? And I feel like even if that happens with an AI image, I feel like there's just something sacred about that human to human connection that happens. And I feel like that's going to get even more important. Important and hard to find. Yeah.
- [41:59]
A
And I think, you know, when we're talking about what we're talking about in terms of commemoration, commemorating the people that we love and commemorating ourselves for the future, for other people who love us when we're gone, that can't be done with AI because that's not going to capture the reality of.
- [42:14]
B
Yes.
- [42:15]
A
Our aliveness in the moment or surrounded by people either.
- [42:19]
B
I was thinking about that the other day. I was like, there's so many things that are happening, like with Sora and people are creating these videos of like, you know, what was the one that I saw? And it was like, I have no.
- [42:34]
A
Idea what you're talking about.
- [42:36]
B
What is Sora is like the, the video AI app. And people are making videos of like Tupac having conversations with Bob Ross and like stuff like that, like stuff that never happened. But it looks so real, so real that.
- [42:49]
A
Okay, I've got you.
- [42:50]
B
There's this shift in real, like this, this shift in reality that's happening because of it. But also people are changing the timeline and changing history through creating these, these videos. And there are people that are actually Changing historical things and making it look like this actually happened, but when it didn't and things are getting doctored and all of that sort of stuff that I feel like photography is becoming even more important because especially printed photographs, like going back to actually printing out your photos and leaving them behind, not just a disc full of digital images, too. That is that truth almost of like, this is the history, this is the past that I've had or that you've had, and it's here. And that can't be messed with because it's already a photo, a tactile.
- [43:44]
A
It's printed. It's the thing.
- [43:46]
B
My hands thing. It's printed. It's the. Yeah. I mean, I feel like that will become like it will come full circle again and be like, everybody will start to print more because it feels real.
- [44:00]
A
You've inspired me to do that. You've inspired me to do that. I'm just thinking, you're so right. I used to print out all my photographs. I used to create digital books and I haven't done them forever. I'm just looking at the picture above me as well. That's like a big photo of Wells and I years and years ago. I need to print more photos out. Paula, I think, you know, this, this topic of conversation is beautiful. It's come full circle. I'm going to bring us back to the festive season just because we need to bring it back to the festive season. So clearly, will you be on the beach taking photographs of everybody on the beach at sun, sunrise or sunset? What will you be doing? What does Christmas Day look like to you? How will you feel truly alive?
- [44:43]
B
So I love that we have such contrasting experiences at Christmas Day and, like, what that means because so, so many of my clients are overseas and they're like, I don't understand how Christmas can be anything but cold. And I'm like, well, I don't understand how Christmas can be anything than bloody hot. And, like, walking around going.
- [45:02]
Like, that's literally Christmas Day. We always go to the beach in the morning and then we usually do like a late Christmas lunch versus a dinner and we eat just a ridiculous amount of food and drink cocktails, drink copious amounts of alcohol, usually eat copious amounts of food, and then just sit around bloated, half tipsy, going, it's hot.
- [45:33]
A
And go back and get in the sea. And there's. I mean, it's very similar, but ours is like, oh, my God. It's either very cold, although it's been very warm and wet, the last few years, so I'm looking forward to when it's like crisp and snowy again.
- [45:45]
B
Yeah, hopefully this year. I don't know, I feel like the past couple of years the weather has been slightly different here, but it. It feels like an actual Australian springtime at the moment. Like where it goes bananas. Like it goes from. It'll start to get warm and then it drops off and it gets really cold again. And then it will do this. It'll be like, hot, cold, hot, cold, hot, cold. And my hay fever goes ridiculous. And then when it hits summer, it.
- [46:10]
A
Just goes hot and stays hot and stays hot. Yeah, no, it's just warm and wet here at the moment. Paula, I adore you. Thank you for bringing all the aliveness, bringing all the joy, and I'm sure our topic of conversation, I think, you know, if. If anyone has lost someone that they love recently or even a long time ago, like we have, you know, the photographs, I mean, I always get the photographs out of my mum on any special event, you know, whether that be birthday or whether that be a Christmas day or mine or hers. And you know what? One of the biggest things I always do, she always leaves me a gift under the Christmas tree. And it's always something that I want.
- [46:49]
B
Oh, I love that.
- [46:50]
A
Always. And you know what? I always buy her a gift. And it just so happens that I also want that too.
- [46:57]
B
That is brilliant. I love that.
- [47:00]
A
Yeah, that's. That's one of my little Mitchells for her. Thank you.
- [47:04]
B
Thank you, Ali.
- [47:05]
A
Thank you, my darling. Thank you so much. My mission is to spread love, joy, peace and abundance to as much of the world as I possibly can, so that every person knows that they don't have to walk alone in their darkness. So if you've enjoyed today's podcast and this episode, I'll be so honored and happy if you would support my mission and share this with your network, your friends and your family, please feel free to leave me an honest review on Apple or Spotify. And until next time, remember, the ripple of joy starts with you.