Chris Hayes | Daddy Issues

Summary

The Late Show Pod Show with Stephen Colbert Episode: Chris Hayes | Daddy Issues
Release Date: January 28, 2025

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Introduction and Monologue Highlights

In this episode of The Late Show Pod Show with Stephen Colbert, host Stephen Colbert delivers his signature blend of humor and sharp political commentary. While much of the initial segment features Colbert's comedic take on current events—such as the upcoming Super Bowl matchup between the Philadelphia Eagles and Kansas City Chiefs, and satirical jabs at political figures like Donald Trump—the monologue sets a lively and engaging tone for the episode. Colbert's knack for intertwining humor with pressing societal issues ensures listeners are both entertained and informed from the outset.

Interview with Chris Hayes

Trump Administration's Policies and Their Implications

The core of the episode revolves around an in-depth conversation between Stephen Colbert and his guest, Chris Hayes, a New York Times bestselling author and host of All In on MSNBC. Delving into the tumultuous developments of the Trump administration's second term, Hayes provides a critical analysis of recent controversial actions taken by President Donald Trump.

At 13:56, Hayes remarks, "We made it through week one of the second Trump administration," highlighting the relentless pace of administrative changes. He critiques Trump's handling of the January 6th prosecutions, emphasizing the lack of discernment in pardoning individuals involved in violent actions during the Capitol riot. "They could have done a little work... but instead, they said all of them are out. Jailbreak," Hayes asserts (15:18), underscoring the administration's apparent disregard for the severity of certain offenses.

Firing of Inspectors General

A significant portion of the discussion centers on Trump's recent decision to fire 18 Inspectors General across various federal agencies (16:33). These positions, established to provide independent oversight and prevent abuse of power, are crucial for maintaining accountability within the government. Hayes explains, "The statutes that protect the inspectors general exist precisely so that they will be insulated from the political pressure of new administrations," (16:56) emphasizing that the mass firings are not only unprecedented but also potentially illegal (16:36).

Hayes highlights the historical importance of Inspectors General, tracing their origins back to the Watergate era, and warns of the dangers posed by their removal. "A universe in which that is all gutted so that Donald Trump can pick whoever's in his truth," Hayes states (16:44), illustrating the potential erosion of checks and balances within the federal government.

Mobilizing Citizen Response

Addressing the broader implications of these administrative moves, Hayes poses a critical question: "What constrains him? How actual citizens, which is us, all of us together, mobilize and express their disapproval of what he's doing," (17:38). He emphasizes the necessity for collective civic engagement to counteract the diminishing oversight and safeguard democratic institutions.

Chris Hayes' New Book: The Siren's Call

Transitioning from the political discourse, the conversation shifts to Chris Hayes' latest work, The Siren's Call. Drawing parallels from Homer's Odyssey, Hayes introduces the metaphor of sirens—entities that lure individuals to perilous distractions—as a representation of modern societal challenges related to attention and information consumption.

The Metaphor of Sirens and Attention Control

Hayes explains that just as Odysseus had to physically restrain himself to resist the sirens' song, individuals today must actively manage their attention to avoid being captivated by distractions orchestrated by powerful corporations. "That condition of being on the mast, trying to regulate our own attention against forces that want to take our attention away from us to our own peril is the ubiquitous experience of modern life," Hayes elaborates (23:07).

Impact of Social Media and the Attention Economy

A central theme of The Siren's Call is the commodification of human attention. Hayes discusses how tech giants exploit attention for monetization, turning what is inherently personal and meaningful into a tradable asset. "Attention in the aggregate is extremely valuable. But your slice of it when it's being purchased is like fractions of cents," he notes (25:02), highlighting the disparity between the collective value of attention and the negligible compensation individuals receive.

He further cautions against the alienating effects of this commodification. "The experience of commodification and extraction leaves us with an intense feeling of alienation," Hayes asserts (26:17), suggesting that the loss of control over one's attention contributes to a pervasive sense of disconnection and dissatisfaction.

Hopeful Messages and Potential Solutions

Despite the bleak analysis, Hayes offers a glimmer of hope by pointing to the diverse avenues through which individuals can reclaim their attention. "People go to see Wagner's Ring cycle and they watch four-hour podcasts and they watch videos of people repairing old barns," he observes (28:00), indicating that personal interests and meaningful engagements can serve as counterbalances to the distractions imposed by the attention economy.

He concludes with an optimistic note, "I think what we're feeling right now is a kind of rebellion that is on the precipice of breaking out against this dead end feeling we have," (28:11), encouraging listeners to seek fulfillment beyond the superficial allure of mass media and technology.

Conclusion

This episode of The Late Show Pod Show masterfully intertwines Stephen Colbert's witty commentary with Chris Hayes' incisive analysis of contemporary political and societal issues. From scrutinizing the Trump administration's undermining of governmental oversight to exploring the pervasive impact of the attention economy as depicted in Hayes' new book, the conversation offers listeners a comprehensive and thought-provoking exploration of the forces shaping modern America. Notable quotes and timely discussions ensure that even those unfamiliar with the episode's content will find the summary both informative and engaging.

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Notable Quotes:

• "They could have done a little work... but instead, they said all of them are out. Jailbreak."
  — Chris Hayes [15:18]

• "A universe in which that is all gutted so that Donald Trump can pick whoever's in his truth."
  — Chris Hayes [16:44]

• "What constrains him? How actual citizens, which is us, all of us together, mobilize and express their disapproval of what he's doing."
  — Chris Hayes [17:38]

• "Attention in the aggregate is extremely valuable. But your slice of it when it's being purchased is like fractions of cents."
  — Chris Hayes [25:02]

• "The experience of commodification and extraction leaves us with an intense feeling of alienation."
  — Chris Hayes [26:17]

• "I think what we're feeling right now is a kind of rebellion that is on the precipice of breaking out against this dead end feeling we have."
  — Chris Hayes [28:11]

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This structured summary encapsulates the key discussions, insights, and conclusions from the episode, providing a comprehensive overview for those who haven't listened to the podcast.

Transcript

[Stephen Colbert]

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[Chris Hayes]

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[Stephen Colbert]

Down here, up there, out there, all across the world. Welcome to the Late Show. I'm your host, Stephen Colbert. Folks, there is huge news. There is huge news from the world of eating dip with your dad's friends because the super bowl matchup is set. Ladies and gentlemen, it's going to be the Philadelphia Eagles facing off against the Kansas City Chiefs. Yes. Eagles vs. Chiefs. Birds vs. Man. Travis Kelce vs. Whoever plays Travis Kelce. On the Eagles, Brad Largeman and his pop star girlfriend, Tonya Velocity. These two teams have history because this is a rematch of super bowl Livy in 2023. Now, the Chiefs won that one, but this is going to be more challenging because now all of the Chiefs players have to rush to the game from their day shifts at State Farm after Philadelphia. Was this yesterday? Yesterday afternoon? After Philadelphia's win yesterday, Eagles fans demonstrated dignified sportsmanship by filing quietly out of the stadium. Psych. They celebrated with close range fireworks, surfed a cop car and climbed a bunch of greased up light poles. Yes, the greased up light pole. The greased up light pole is a sacred Philly tradition that goes all the way back to when Ben Franklin shimmied onto a lubed up Liberty Bell. It's in color. I didn't know they had color photographs back then. Well, it has been exactly one week since Trump took office and there have already. I know, but there have already been some big surprises. For instance, I did not know a week could last 10 years. As far as all the terrible, awful stuff he's been doing, I don't like it and you don't like it. And that is just what the MAGA folks really like about it. For instance, even though Trump is threatening to withhold disaster aid from California, his visit got a ringing endorsement from man skunk hybrid Mel Gibson. On Friday, mentally ill Max went on the TV and He said this. I'm glad Trump's here at the moment. You know, it's like Daddy arrived and he's taking his belt off. Okay, pretty weird to get that excited about a physically abusive father, but at least now we know this about Mel Gibson. And it explains this scene in Braveheart. Sons of Scotland. I am William Wallace. Daddy's home. And he's taking off his belt. I'm sorry, what? Daddy's gonna spank us so hard he's gonna be able to see his face in our swollen ass cheeks.

[Chris Hayes]

Did he charve at this speech?

[Stephen Colbert]

All right, let's do it then. All right. If it'll make eggs cheaper. Thing is. Thing is, it's nice. You know what? A little something for the ladies. The thing is, Gibson isn't the only right wing personality calling Trump daddy. Lauren Boebert tweeted, daddy's home. Charlie Kirk posted dad is home. And on Fox News, Florida Congressman Byron Donalds proclaimed, daddy's back. Sweet mother of Oedipus. If Sigmund Freud were alive today, he'd say, hey, cray cray, and do you have some cocaine? It's not just politicians. Earlier this month, a Trump loving rapper put out a viral song called Daddy's Home. We want Too mad. It's done.

[Zoe Saldana]

Too bad.

[Stephen Colbert]

Boo hoo. So sad. Now, eagle eyed viewers, the cunning out there may have also noticed that this video has a cameo from former television star Roseanne Barr. Yeah. Cause nothing says hip hop like a retired TV mom. Who can forget? Who can forget when Flo Rida released his collab with Flo Rance Henderson. Yeah, Flo. Flo got low. Flo got low. Flo got low. The body jeans and the kick. Daddy Donnie is keeping his promise to round up immigrants in order to save the dogs that weren't being eaten from imaginary Mexican Hannibal Lecter. Over the weekend, his administration launched a nationwide immigration enforcement blitz. Blitz, really? Short for blitzkrieg. Just once, can we do fun German stuff? I'd love to see a headline that says, Trump administration launches nationwide strudel so far. Or even blitz so far. ICE says these roundups are going after criminals. Something like Biden tried to do. But unlike Biden, Trump's doing it in a way that pisses off our allies. Because yesterday, the President of Colombia refused to let a military transport filled with handcuffed migrants land in his country. So Trump immediately posted emergency 25% tariffs on all Colombian goods coming into the United States. To which Don Jr said, wait, not everything from Columbia, right? Dad? Dad? The State Department followed up with a document outlining the tariffs. Only problem, the documents said they sanctioned Colombia, not Colombia, the country. And that is going to anger the residents of Colombia, not to mention their neighbors, Ecuador, Panama and Vuvuzela. All of this, all of this, all of this is less than good because Colombia has been Washington's closest ally in the region for decades. Yes, closer than Brazil, closer than Argentina, closer than Chile. Even closer than Chile's too. And they have a consulate in every airport. The tariff threats have worked because Colombia agreed to let future deportation planes land. But the feud had a real world effect because coffee prices hit a record level. Oh, no. Well, if Americans can't afford coffee anymore, we're going to have to change all the mugs to don't talk to me. Trump also threatening the nation that's historically been closest to the United States. The United States because late last Friday night he went after the government's independent watchdogs, ordering a mass firing to remove 18 independent inspectors general at a series of agencies. Inspectors general date back to the Watergate era when Congress installed them inside various agencies as an independent check against mismanagement and abuse of power. Yeah, but maybe Trump is getting rid of all the oversight so no one sees him doing anything good. He's so humble. Also on Friday night, the Senate confirmed Pete Hegseth for Defense secretary. Don't worry, Mr. Secretary. They're not booing. They're saying Pete has a problem with boons. J.D. vance, sir, he's got a problem. Somebody help him. Somebody help the man. We're really worried. J.D. vance had to cast the tie breaking vote after three Republican senators voted against Hegseth, including Mitch McConnell. Well, thanks Mitch. Republic saved. Sure, you may have personally blocked the impeachment of Trump in 2021, but history will remember you as the guy who almost stopped Pete Hegseth. It'll all be in the book profiles in one group. One group that is going to do great under Trump is the super rich. They are having a moment and they want us all to know it. Take tech mogul and Yassify data. Brian Johnson. Johnson is a mega rich venture capitalist who is obsessed with living forever. And he just unveiled an unexpected new way to measure his youthful virility. Because last week he posted screenshots showing data from an overnight erection tracking machine for both himself and his 19 year old son. An overnight erection tracking machine. AI has taken all the good jobs. Could have done that, used to do that. That's what immigrants used to come to this country to do. That's. That's what immigrants used to come to this country to do. My grandfather got off the boat from the old country with just a ruler and a dream. The proud father posted the data with the worst tweet I have ever read. Nighttime erection data from my 19 year old son and me. His duration is two minutes longer than mine. Raise children to stand tall, be firm and be upright. I know, I know. Imagine this poor kid is in for a rude awakening when he tries to relate to his co workers down the line. Oh my God. Did you hear? HR is spying on our emails. What are they our dads Tracking our nighttime erections. Wait, why do I have to go to hr? The data this guy has gathered is actually pretty impressive. You can see sleep efficiency 112. That sounds like a good number. Erection quality 90. A personal best and even quote number of erection episodes. Please no spoilers. I'm only on episode four of Rich Guys Dong. We got a great show for you tonight coming up. Chris Hayes.

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[Stephen Colbert]

Welcome back everybody. Ladies and gentlemen, my guest tonight is a New York Times bestselling author and the host of all in on msnbc. Please welcome back to the Late Show, Chris Hayes. Good to see you. Great to always fun to talk about the Trump administration. And now we've got a fresh one to unwrap.

[Chris Hayes]

Yeah.

[Stephen Colbert]

Yeah.

[Chris Hayes]

Four more years like the Advent calendar.

[Stephen Colbert]

Now each one's just a fresh turd. Now we made it through week one of the second Trump administration.

[Chris Hayes]

We did.

[Stephen Colbert]

My reaction the first time he was elected eight years ago, I was sitting right here when I found out. I think John Heilman was sitting there, was. I got this chill through my entire body and went, oh, my God. The biggest narcissist in the world now is going to be the most important person on the planet, and you can't ignore him. And the monstrosities that he's going to execute over the next four years are going to be unimaginable. And it was worse than I had feared when it finally happened. I haven't even really cranked that knob this time. I'm like, I underplayed it last time. What's been your reaction so far to the last week?

[Chris Hayes]

Yeah, I mean, I think it's worst. It's in the worst case scenario neighborhood. There's a few things he's done, I think, that are real indicators. So off the bat, I think the fact that, look, they could have done a little work and they could have a day one executive order saying, I am directing the acting attorney general to review all the cases of the 1500 people that were prosecuted for January 6th. Come back to me with recommendations distinguishing between violent offenders. They could have said, we're giving these thousand people who didn't commit acts of violence a pardon. The fact that they said all of them are out. Jailbreak. The guys that took a baton and beat a cop over the head and bear sprayed them and went on Facebook.

[Stephen Colbert]

Later and tagged into a heart attack.

[Chris Hayes]

Tased him into a heart attack. All of those people and the people convicted of seditious conspiracy against our republic, they're all getting jailbreaks. And one of them, Stuart Rhodes, is going to be at my rally the next weekends on stage. That is not. Oh, they got too lazy to distinguish. That is a very clear message about embracing and promoting political violence on his behalf and a payback for it. And it's.

[Stephen Colbert]

And now a semi, some organized some random group of violent offenders. A violent mob that owes him.

[Chris Hayes]

Correct. And who have said to my colleague Alex Wagner, who's been doing great reporting the last week, you know, one of them said, I'd die for him. And so. And keep in mind, I've mentioned I'm.

[Stephen Colbert]

Just gonna go for a couple years.

[Chris Hayes]

I know every time I come out here, I'm like, it is a comedy show, Hayes. Like, just try to keep it light.

[Stephen Colbert]

Exactly.

[Chris Hayes]

Real quiet in here.

[Stephen Colbert]

He fired all the Inspectors General, like 1815, something like that. Inspectors general, Friday Night. Okay. Is that a. He said. He said it's a very common thing to do. Is this a common thing to do?

[Chris Hayes]

No. Not only is it not common, it's not legal under the statute.

[Stephen Colbert]

So, so what are you saying? We've got him. We've got him.

[Chris Hayes]

We've got him.

[Stephen Colbert]

He's fallen.

[Chris Hayes]

Thank you.

[Stephen Colbert]

Our trap.

[Chris Hayes]

Thank you. Let's see old Donnie try to wriggle out of this one, huh?

[Stephen Colbert]

Exactly. Uh huh.

[Chris Hayes]

Uh, no, the, the, the statutes that protect the inspectors general exist precisely so that they will be insulated from the political pressure of new administrations. And in fact, Lindsey Graham said it was illegal, although he said technically illegal, which I thought was a cute way to amend it. Technically, yeah, if you want to be.

[Stephen Colbert]

Want to be all tech about it, I guess against the law.

[Chris Hayes]

Chuck Grassley, I think, basically said the same. You can't do it. And again, there's lots of things that you can't do that he's going to try to do. And the big question here is, what constrains him? How actual citizens, which is us, all of us together, mobilize and express their disapproval of what he's doing.

[Stephen Colbert]

The news just broke and you may know something about this. I hope the news just broke before I came out here, that he has now fired Department of Justice employees who worked on the investigations against him. Like the Jan6 or the documents cases. Those people are fired. What do we know about this?

[Chris Hayes]

Well, it's a little unclear. So in order to explain this, put 20 seconds on the clock for something sort of dry but important.

[Stephen Colbert]

Jimmy, thank you.

[Chris Hayes]

There are two types of employees, broadly in the federal government. There are political appointees who serve at the pleasure of the president, and there are career civil servants who are protected by statute from being fired for political reasons. And the reason we have that is because basically in the late 19th century, we had developed a federal government that kind of operated like the bad old urban Chicago machine. You got the job because you were someone's nephew or because you knocked on doors for this guy. We have civil servant protection so that career officials can't be fired at the whims of a president because we don't want to stuff the entirety of the federal government with essentially apparatchiks. To the extent these people were fired are career civil servants, which, it's not that clear yet which part of the line they fall on. It seems like a flagrant violation of the law and they will have a for cause lawsuit. But again, this is. He's like, who's gonna check me and.

[Stephen Colbert]

The lawsuit would be. Put me back in.

[Chris Hayes]

Yes, exactly. Reinstate me to a place where everyone will hate me and yell at me. Yes, exactly.

[Stephen Colbert]

All right. Okay.

[Chris Hayes]

Although, look, look, one of the things. I think this is a kind of earnest point, but I think it's really important. I have, over the course of my career as a journalist, had the joy to talk to civil servants in our federal government doing all kinds of things. People that work in the USDA and people that work in the public health infrastructure and people that work at the Pentagon. I mean, there are so many people that work for the federal government who just really care and really are nonpartisan and really want to serve the country and whose expertise we rely on for so much. A universe in which that is all gutted so that Donald Trump can pick whoever's in his truth. Social mentions to run. You know, who's gonna inspect your meat is a nightmare scenario. But it's also what he wants to do. Again, real quiet.

[Stephen Colbert]

Yes, I think, I think. I think they might be applauding for meat. I'm not sure. We have to take a quick break. We'll be right back with more Chris Hayes. Everybody. Stick. Hey, everybody, look at that. From MSNBC's All In. It's Chris Hayes. What's the story that is happening right now that is not getting enough coverage, you think?

[Chris Hayes]

The biggest one, I think actually, is that they put in a freeze on all grant applications and review and it appears even clinical trials that are happening at the National Institutes of Health. This lab really, which is started in the New deal in the 30s, as you know, because your father worked there, if I'm not mistaken.

[Stephen Colbert]

He was head of World Immunology and extramural affairs.

[Chris Hayes]

So what happened? They didn't really advertise this, but what happened was we started getting reports from scientists being like, I was at a. Going to go to a panel that's calendared in two weeks where we do review grant applications. It just got canceled. People with clinical trials getting canceled. It appears that they have just put a full freeze on all of the science.

[Stephen Colbert]

Was one of Trump's donors disease?

[Chris Hayes]

Yes, yes, yes. Skin cancer, you know?

[Stephen Colbert]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. It was all in crypto, but we know that's where it came from. No, it's really wild. Who does that benefit?

[Chris Hayes]

Okay, here's what's crazy about this. A, none of this was communicated. B, we sort of found out about this somewhat through reporting and because of.

[Stephen Colbert]

You mean not communicated how? Like not communicating public. There's no press release. No.

[Chris Hayes]

Right. As opposed to Say the deportations, where he's got fox riding along with ice.

[Stephen Colbert]

Dr. Phil.

[Chris Hayes]

Or Dr. Phil.

[Stephen Colbert]

Exactly.

[Chris Hayes]

Obviously you want Dr. Phil on deportations.

[Stephen Colbert]

No, no, I think that. I think that was a rookie mistake. You go with Dog the Bounty Hunter. Or Phil. Or Phil the Bounty Doctor. One of those two.

[Chris Hayes]

So what was weird about this is they didn't seem to publicize it. We haven't gotten a great explanation. The best that we can tell, again, no one's really been particularly upfront about this. What we think is happening. And again, this is not definitive, but the best that we can piece it together is there is a lot of health equity work being done by the National Institutes of Health. And what we think might be a plausible thing happening is a frozen all grants because they want to go through and they want to take out all grants that have to do with health equity, which means, like dispersant.

[Stephen Colbert]

How does it affect this part of the population as opposed to that part of the population. Wow. So they'd like just to know less.

[Chris Hayes]

They want us to know less. They definitely want the federal government to be worse, more incompetent and stupider in the main.

[Stephen Colbert]

Well, okay, let's talk about your new book.

[Chris Hayes]

Yeah, thank you, thank you.

[Stephen Colbert]

That's a good transition. Yeah, we in the business.

[Chris Hayes]

Yeah, well done.

[Stephen Colbert]

Speaking of worse and stupider, you have a new book. It's called the Siren's Call. What is the Siren's call?

[Chris Hayes]

In the Homeric epic the Odyssey, Odysseus is taking his leave of Circe and she warns him about the sirens, which are these mysterious creatures, women that will lure you to death with their song.

[Stephen Colbert]

Oh, they sing from the rocks.

[Chris Hayes]

They sing from the rocks. And your ship will run to the rocks and they will warble you to death. And she instructs him that if you want to avoid that fate, what you have to do is bind yourself to the mast of your ship, stuff wax in the ears of your crew so that they will not listen to you when you beg for them to follow the sound of the siren. And that is to me, that condition of being on the mast, trying to regulate our own attention against forces that want to take our attention away from us to our own peril is the ubiquitous experience of modern life in this moment.

[Stephen Colbert]

Social media, the Internet, all of it doom scrolling, all of the constant, the.

[Chris Hayes]

Constant competition done at scale by the world's largest and most powerful corporations, many of whom CEOs were up on the right next to the incoming president and his inauguration, all of whom I think.

[Stephen Colbert]

Basically all of them, yes.

[Chris Hayes]

Who operate at the scale of billions of users, extracting our attention and monetizing that attention.

[Stephen Colbert]

We're gonna take a quick break here. We'll be right back with more Chris Hayes, everybody. Hey, everybody. We're back with the author of the new book the sirens call, Mr. Chris Hayes. You call attention like human attention, the attention span itself, a resource that we have. The value of that resource for them is what? Like what? Like, I understand you take my oil, you get to burn it, you take my gold, you make electronics or jewelry. What are they doing with our attention? Just selling it to other people?

[Chris Hayes]

Yes, they're selling it to other people that want to get us to buy stuff, largely. Much of the Internet runs off of ad tech that Google, for instance, is a main platform of Facebook. I mean, they're printing money. One of the weird things about the way this works when you talk about the value is that attention in the aggregate is extremely valuable. Right. But your slice of it when it's being purchased is like fractions of cents. So you got this weird thing where in the aggregate is very valuable. The amount being paid for your attention at any given moment is nothing but what it costs you to be distracted. All you have in your life, all you have, the substance of your life, is from moment to moment, what you pay attention to. Whether it's your child sleeping in your arms, whether it's a conversation with a loved one that is gonna be one of the last conversations you have because they're aging or infirm. That's all you have.

[Stephen Colbert]

Keep it light.

[Chris Hayes]

Keep it light, Hayes.

[Stephen Colbert]

Keep it light. Thank you.

[Chris Hayes]

I appreciate that information.

[Stephen Colbert]

Or the first conversation you have with a loved one. Exactly. Go ahead. Because they're so healthy. Go on. Oh, and you're in the glow of fresh love, for instance, because that's fun and that is commodified. And it's sold like corn at the exchange here.

[Chris Hayes]

Correct.

[Stephen Colbert]

Our attention is sold.

[Chris Hayes]

And that experience of commodification and extraction leaves us with an intense feeling of alienation. A thing that should be proper to us and within us, part of the integrated whole, that is who we are is taken and put outside of us. And that feeling of outsideness, I really do think, is a kind of pernicious, ubiquitous sensation of the times we live in, that alienation.

[Stephen Colbert]

What is the equivalent, in this case, in your metaphor, of stuffing the wax in our ears?

[Chris Hayes]

Well, there's a few things. I mean, one is managing how you interact with your phone. Impossible, right? Well, that's cause I'm not In charge.

[Stephen Colbert]

My phone is.

[Chris Hayes]

That's right.

[Stephen Colbert]

And I got this thing on my wrist that tells me my phone wants to talk to me.

[Chris Hayes]

I remember going out on the water with some friends one summer, and I had just gotten this watch. And I was like, I'm gonna leave my phone at home. And they're like, oh, good, yeah, we're.

[Stephen Colbert]

Going on the water 100%, yeah.

[Chris Hayes]

And they're like, are you bringing your watch? I was like, well, yeah, you gotta bring the watch. I mean, someone might need me.

[Stephen Colbert]

Hi, this is Chris's watch. His phone isn't here, Right. Leave me a message and I'll make sure it gets it.

[Chris Hayes]

Exactly. No, I mean, I'm bad about this one thing, one way to stuff wax in our ears. And I think, actually part of the way I talk about this in the end of this book is we have to think this in more holistic terms than just our individual actions, right? It's the way we talk about our relationship to food, which has to do with who we are individually and what our biological predilections are, but also has to do with an enormous industrial food system that produces the environment in which we consume food and produces the ailments that come from that.

[Stephen Colbert]

You're making me hungry, man. Crispy salty fatties. Yeah, crispy salty, fatty salty crispies.

[Chris Hayes]

We love them everywhere. Yeah, you can sell that anywhere in the world. That is what's happening to our attention.

[Stephen Colbert]

So the phone is kind of at the bliss point.

[Chris Hayes]

The phone is the bliss point. That's exactly right.

[Stephen Colbert]

Yeah.

[Chris Hayes]

In fact, I cite that research in the book.

[Stephen Colbert]

So you stole that from me and put it in your book just now.

[Chris Hayes]

I time travel.

[Stephen Colbert]

Okay, thank you very much. Thank you very much.

[Chris Hayes]

And let me say one more thing about that that I think is a hopeful message. Keep it light. Is that in the same way human appetites both have a kind of predictability that can be exploited, right? Salt, sugar, fat. The bliss point. They're also unbelievably varied. And people eat all kinds of stuff and love all kinds of stuff. And the same is true of attention. Yes, Competitive attention, markets. They drive towards the slot machine, the casino, Times Square billboards, the tabloid. Right, the scroll. But also people go to see Wagner's Ring cycle and they watch four hour podcasts and they watch videos of people repairing old barns. And there's all kinds of stuff that we as humans can put our attention on. And I think what we're feeling right now is a kind of rebellion that is on the precipice of breaking out against this dead end feeling we have that we have been pinned into a way of paying attention we don't like.

[Stephen Colbert]

I hope you're right.

[Chris Hayes]

They like it.

[Stephen Colbert]

Chris, good to see you. It's great to see you too. The sirens call is out now. Chris Hayes, everybody. Thank you for listening to the late show pod show with Stephen Colbert. Just one more thing. If you want to see more of me, come to The Late Show YouTube channel for more clips and exclusives.

[Zoe Saldana]

Now streaming on Paramount plus, what's your job? When people go missing, I get hired.

[Stephen Colbert]

To help find them.

[Zoe Saldana]

Catch up now on tracker. I'm here to help the CBS original series that critics are calling a breakout hit. Nothing good comes without risks.

[Stephen Colbert]

I will drink to that.

[Zoe Saldana]

Justin Hartley stars.

[Chris Hayes]

Hold on. Did you say arrow run?

[Stephen Colbert]

That's a new one.

[Zoe Saldana]

Coulter in the CBS original tracker. Catch up on the latest episodes now on paramount plus, welcome to the oil business. Billy Bob Thornton, Demi Moore and Jon Hamm star in a new paramount plus original series.

[Stephen Colbert]

The world has already convinced itself that you are evil and I am evil for providing them the one thing they interact with every day. You're all right. Here we go.

[Zoe Saldana]

From Taylor Sheridan, executive producer of Yellowstone.

[Stephen Colbert]

Get everybody back. You just put a giant bullseye on this place. We rolled the dice one last time, Landman.

[Zoe Saldana]

New series now streaming exclusively on paramount plus.