Patrik Mata | The Magnificent Others with Billy Corgan

Summary

The Magnificent Others with Billy Corgan
Episode: Patrik Mata | January 28, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this compelling episode of "The Magnificent Others," host Billy Corgan sits down with Patrik Mata, influential founder of Community FK and a defining figure in LA’s early goth and death rock scene. Together, they trace Mata’s roots in Dadaism, outsider art, punk, and the intertwining of artistic expression and outsider culture. It’s a candid, deeply personal journey through Mata’s life, influences, struggles, and unexpected triumphs—including his struggles for recognition and the birth of a musical movement—punctuated by stories from the heart of LA’s underground.

Billy approaches Mata not just as a fan, but as an artist seeking to understand an original. The episode explores the genesis of Community FK, the realities of being an outsider, and the shaping of a sound and scene that proved more influential than many realize.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

I. Early Artistic Awakening & Outsider Mentality

• Compelled to Create

  • Mata describes his early conviction that he was meant to sing and perform, despite the lack of support from peers.
    • "I had this burning yearning in my heart...I have to do this. I don't care about anything else." (00:00, reiterated at 14:28)

• Dadaism as Foundational Influence

  • Billy draws parallels between Mata’s life and the principles of Dadaism—anti-art, nihilism, spontaneity.
  • Mata depicts Dada as “pre-punk," stressing its impact on punk’s attitude and fashion.
    • “Zara was this radical who kind of reset the table with how artists…should see Dadaism.” (02:12, Billy)
    • “That’s me.” (03:56, Mata)

• Meeting Dada through Visuals

  • Mata’s first brush with Dadaism came while studying journalism; he was drawn by the visuals and discovered “everything the Pistols took” was from Dada.
    • “I saw a photograph of Tristan Zara and I loved his hairstyle…I went and had my hair cut exactly like that.” (04:17, Mata)
  • Punk poetry readings and violence compared to Stravinsky’s Rites of Spring. (05:25–05:49)

II. Journey to Los Angeles & Musical Formation

• Migration from Home

  • Mata shares his decision to leave home for LA in 1975, aided by his mother (herself a musician), with no plan and hardly any money.
    • “I gotta run, you know, I got a heart to roam...She gave me like 50 bucks and I left. I took a bus to LA.” (08:59–09:15)

• Impressions on Arrival

  • First sights: Robert Plant directing traffic, encounters at iconic LA venues, and stories of meeting early LA music figures. (10:41–12:49)

• First Bands & Aesthetics

  • Early band “Orange” opened for Van Halen, included described influences (Raw Power Stooges). Mata emphasizes the role of individualism and friction in group dynamics.
    • “I wrote really good lyrics. They didn’t understand…but we just stuck with it.” (17:20)

• Brushes with Punk and Source Family

  • Tales of discovering punk fanzines, direct connection to UK punk via management, and being handed the first Sex Pistols single:
    • “He had a Factory sample…Anarchy in the UK, not released yet. He goes, here…it never left my turntable.” (19:52–20:09)

III. Genesis and Evolution of Community FK

• Roots of Community FK

  • Born out of necessity when “no one would play with me.” Mata finds bandmates in punk LA, building a lineup by recruiting outsiders and “absolute anarchics.”
  • Instinct and spontaneity over planning:
    • “I'm inspired for the moment. And then whatever happens at that moment, there it is.” (21:59, Mata)

• Early Performances and Hostility

  • Audiences and other bands regularly hostile, venues refusing to pay, early reviews dismissive.
    • “People would go, ‘I'm not going on after these guys. I don’t want these guys on our bill. They can't play. They're horrible. They look weird…’” (19:19, echoed at 26:58)
  • Mata embraces this rejection, likening it to Dada provocation and seeing it as a form of success. (28:23)

• Cult Following and Breakthrough

  • Despite pushback, Community FK gradually amass a dedicated audience through club residencies at places like the On Club. The band’s look and sound fuels a burgeoning LA gothic/outsider scene. (31:23–32:46)

IV. Artistry, Influence & the Sound of the Scene

• The First Records

  • The debut The Vision and the Voice captured their raw setlist and anti-formulaic style.
  • The importance of innocence and originality:
    • "There's always that moment of innocence where the thing you’re trying just kind of comes together...” (33:12, Billy)
  • Mata credits a lack of pretense and a will to “document the moment” for its unique sound.
    • "I just knew that I loved it and I loved doing it. ...there's so much to explore...we didn't want a keyboard player." (36:39)

• Hostility Turns to Acceptance

  • Gradually, the band’s audience grows, and formerly hostile clubs and bands come to respect or even wish to open for Community FK.

• Originality, Influence, and the LA Scene

  • Billy observes: “The LA version, I think, is a lot, lot more influential than people realize." (60:26)
  • Mata: “...when I get back to you, there's nobody before you.” (60:48, Corgan)

V. Success, MTV, and Staying True

• MTV Breakthrough with ‘Close One Sad Eye’

  • The shocking experience of being on MTV as an outsider band; Mata did not expect this and wasn’t opposed, but also wasn’t paid or courted by major labels.
    • “To be on MTV in 1985 was, like, shocking...I had no idea.” (55:43–55:57)
  • Preservation of vision: “It’s playing itself,” Mata says of the synth onstage, rebuffing advice to make the music more commercial. (50:47–50:54)

• Reflections on the 'Goth' Label

  • Discussing how what later came to be called "goth" was originally Anti-art, "death rock," and how labels only made sense after the fact.

VI. Community, Peer Recognition, and Roz Williams

• Relationships with Contemporaries

  • On Roz Williams (Christian Death): mutual respect and eventual friendship, both artists operating independently with different sounds, but similarly influential.
    • “He was so sensitive and so shy and very funny. Very smart. A great artist.” (73:49, Mata)
  • Shared admiration and stories of Roz’s unique creative process.

• Recognition, Influence, and Validation

  • Billy: “There are those artists who they are the art...but the artists themselves can’t imitate themselves because they are the art.” (41:06)
  • Mata: “Yeah, I totally agree.” (41:09)

VII. Art, Production, and Legacy

• Production Aesthetic and Creative Process

  • Mata’s recording process is minimal, instinctive, and occurs “in the moment,” with little technical fuss or afterthought.
    • “I just like it simple—four tracks, you just give me four tracks and I’ll do all kinds of things to that.” (88:27, Mata)

• Outlook on Digital Music and the Present

  • Skepticism about modern digital music’s sterility, preference for analog warmth and process:
    • “I miss the analog experience...it’s the more magical element. It’s not so sterile.” (88:27–88:40, Mata)
  • Commitment to ongoing creation: “My thing is to continue doing this, because that’s all I know how to do. ...Any way I can. Any noise that fits, I’m just going to keep doing it." (82:01, Mata)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On Dada, Punk, and Artistic Identity

• "Tristan Zara… He was my David Bowie before Bowie."
  — Patrik Mata (01:37)

• "The whole thing about the Dadaists was that it was punk rock. It was pre-punk."
  — Patrik Mata (04:17)

On the Artist as Art

• "There are those artists who they are the art, and everybody tries to figure out how to do what they do."
  — Billy Corgan (27:00, echoed at 41:06)

• "That’s me."
  — Patrik Mata (03:56 & 27:04)

On Early Struggles

• "People would go, 'I'm not going on after these guys. I don’t want these guys on our bill. They can't play. They're horrible. They look weird. What's up with these guys?'"
  — Patrik Mata (19:19, 26:58)

• "I likened it to... Rites of Spring, Stravinsky, the Dadaists...hostile reactions, nihilistic interpretation, reviews...”
  — Patrik Mata (27:00)

On Creation & Process

• "I'm inspired for the moment. And then whatever happens at that moment, there it is."
  — Patrik Mata (21:59)

• "I just like it simple. Four tracks—you just give me four tracks and I’ll do all kinds of things to that."
  — Patrik Mata (88:27)

On Legacy and Influence

• “The LA version, I think, is a lot, lot more influential than people realize.”
  — Billy Corgan (60:26)

• "When I get back to you, there's nobody before you."
  — Billy Corgan (60:48)

• "It’s a sad world. That’s even sadder now. But... it was like a fallen angel or some Nephilim...telling everybody, you’re losing hope, man."
  — Patrik Mata (56:37)

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Timestamps for Significant Segments

• 00:00 – Mata's early confidence and drive to sing, despite peer rejection.
• 03:56 – Parallels with Dadaism: “That's me.”
• 09:13 – Journey to LA, maternal support, first days.
• 13:19 – Discovering Dylan, Bowie, and the fire to perform.
• 14:57 – Formation of first bands, discovering punk aesthetics.
• 21:59 – Artistic process: “For me, I'm inspired for the moment.”
• 26:30 – Early gig experiences, hostility from audiences and peers.
• 31:15 – Turning point: On Club residency and emergence of a goth/outsider scene.
• 33:12–34:42 – Reflections on innocence, the originality of first albums.
• 41:06 – Corgan on artists who are their art.
• 47:06 – Discussion of the revolution of alternative music, “anybody could be up here.”
• 55:20–56:09 – MTV debut, “something inside me has died” video.
• 60:26 – Billy’s assertion of LA’s underestimated influence on goth.
• 73:49 – Roz Williams: friendship, influence, and stories.
• 80:08 – Mata on creating in the digital age, analog minimalism.
• 82:01 – Lifelong commitment to art: “Any way I can. Any noise that fits, I’m just going to keep doing it.”
• 88:27 – Embracing minimal, in-the-moment production.

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Episode Tone and Style

The conversation is candid, earthy, and full of affectionate irreverence. Mata is forthright and self-deprecating, while Billy Corgan is inquisitive, respectful, and often in awe. Both speak as artists to artists, disregarding industry pretense in favor of raw experience and creative truth. There is a sense of mutual admiration and deep understanding, often sharing stories that highlight both vulnerability and conviction.

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Conclusion

This episode is a must-listen for fans of underground music history or anyone interested in the life of the true outsider artist. Mata’s life story, as told here, is not only the origin story of a genre but a testimony to the power of persistence and personal vision. Billy Corgan’s thoughtful engagement ensures that Mata’s contributions are explored in depth and celebrated for their lasting influence.

Transcript

[Patrick Mata]

I knew I could sing. I just knew it. And I just had this burning yearning in my heart that this is. I have to do this. I don't care about anything else.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Like a bolt of lightning.

[Patrick Mata]

I tried to get other guys to play with me. No one would play with me.

[Interviewer]

This kind of goth, death rock, whatever people want to call this genre, which you were part of, you know, initiating

[Patrick Mata]

into the world, people would go, I'm not going on after these guys. I don't want these guys on our bill. They can't play. They're horrible. I mean, they look weird. What's up with these guys?

[Interviewer]

You know, there are those artists who they are the art, and everybody tries to figure out how to do what they do.

[Patrick Mata]

That's me.

[Interviewer]

Patrick Mata, thank you for being here. I'm so happy to talk to you today.

[Patrick Mata]

It's my pleasure.

[Interviewer]

So there isn't a ton of information out there about your life, maybe that was purposeful?

[Patrick Mata]

Some of it. Some of it. And I get yelled at about it.

[Interviewer]

Well, from the point of view of interviewing someone, you kind of start with the cursory, kind of like the life story. And one thing I saw attributed to, and I always like to ask, as opposed to assume, was this your connection to kind of Dadaism.

[Patrick Mata]

And there's a big influence on me.

[Interviewer]

Okay, great. So let me start here, and then we'll jump in, because I'm very curious for your thoughts on this, because when I saw this and then I thought of your work and your life, like, it put all these pieces together that maybe I didn't understand before.

[Patrick Mata]

Okay.

[Interviewer]

So I want to ask you how you came to it, because I came to it from my own direction, but I didn't know you'd come.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, yeah.

[Interviewer]

Okay. So. So let's start here, because I. I. Tristan Zara.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, he was. He. There you go. He was my David Bowie.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Patrick Mata]

Before Bowie.

[Interviewer]

Okay, so let me say a couple things here. And then. And then I want to. Of course I want to hear from you. So did you read. It came out fairly recently, the book about Kiki Man Ray. Did you read that book?

[Patrick Mata]

No. No, I know who she is.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. So it's an exploration of Man Ray's relationship with Kiki, more so from the vantage point of Kiki as opposed to Man Ray, which is very interesting.

[Patrick Mata]

Did these people speak to her?

[Interviewer]

Well, no, she's long passed away.

[Patrick Mata]

I know that, but I mean, it's

[Interviewer]

kind of a reass. It's a. It's a. Let's call it a A deep dive reassessment of her place in the Dada story. Normally she gets kind of cast as a.

[Patrick Mata]

She was friends with Man Ray too, right?

[Interviewer]

Well, she know she was Man Ray's lover.

[Patrick Mata]

That's what I mean. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And really wanted to marry Man Ray. Their relationship was a lot deeper than I thought. And I, I, I've collected Man Ray photos and so I, I have a pretty good knowledge of Man Ray. But I always thought her as a kind of a character in this play of this time in Paris, this idea that she was the model muse for so many artists. But the book is a beautiful reassessment. I wish I could remember the author's name. It's called Kiki Ban Ray, and she used to sign autographs as Kiki Ban Rae. She thought of herself as his wife. And she had a lot more influence over his artistic work than people thought anyway. But they talk about Tristan Zahra in the book. And, um, in the beginning, Zara was this radical who kind of reset the table with how the artists in Paris, all these expats and stuff living in Paris, should see Dadaism. And they'd have Dada symposiums and he would lead poetry nights and stuff like this. But they do talk in the book. Over time, kind of Dadaism fell out as a sort of cause celeb. And Cesar also kind of fell out. But even to the end, he was all, he was all in on Dada. So I want to say a couple things about Zahra, because I saw a lot of reflections in your work, but I wanted to ask you. So these are just some basic definitions. Anti art, nihilism, rejecting traditional beauty and logic. Zara saw art as a tool for destruction and negation of established values, aiming to shock audiences, spontaneity and chance. He promoted chance operations like cutting words from newspapers for poetry and automatic writing to bypass conscious control and reveal authentic expression. And of course, the Great Dada Manifesto, 1918. He outlined Dada's goals, attacking bourgeois morality, logic, and the perceived complacency of art.

[Patrick Mata]

That's me.

[Interviewer]

So tell me that's. To me. It frames your story so beautifully. I think so. I'm much more interested in that part of your story than like, where'd you go to school? You know, I mean, if you want to talk about that stuff. Please. But I think this part is to be essential to your.

[Patrick Mata]

It's all relevant. Everything is reinforced of that. Of everything.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, but can you illuminate that something?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. I was studying to be a journalist. I wanted to Be like Hunter S. Thompson. And I was more into writing and interviewing people myself. And I discovered Dada by going to the art book area in the library. And I said, oh. And I loved the visuals and everything. And it was pre Pistols. You could see where they took everything from that. From Jamie Reed and all that. And I saw a photograph of Tristan Zahra and I loved his hairstyle. And I go, well, this is kind of Bowie Berlin ish, The wedge thing. So I went and had my hair cut exactly like that. No one looked like that. And then because of Bowie, I started putting makeup on and. But the whole thing about the Dadaist was that it was punk rock. It was pre punk. It was sure a little nihilistic. When they existed, There was war. It was kind of like reflective of what happened to the punk rock scene. So it's all relevant to me. Zara's Manifestos. I have all these books on Dadaism that I collected over time. I stole the one from the library, actually.

[Interviewer]

That's very Dada of you.

[Patrick Mata]

And the idea of him putting. Cutting. Doing the cutups, like pre Burroughs, putting them in a hat and then taking them out one by one at random and just reciting them pissed a lot of people off. When he would put. At the poetry readings back in that day. The poetry readings back in the day were like punk gigs. You know, they became violent because people didn't understand, like the Rites of Spring, the Stavinsky where they ride.

[Interviewer]

It walked out.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. So it was kind of like all. Like all of that. And that really interested me because you must be touching someone somehow to make them react like that. So that was part of what really attracted me was his. His. The power that he had. Yeah. And how people didn't like him because of certain ways that he acted.

[Interviewer]

Sure.

[Patrick Mata]

You know, so that really. That really turned me on. I really dug that.

[Interviewer]

Did it affect the way you listen to music?

[Patrick Mata]

Actually, it did. I'm a big believer in the outsider art and outsider artists. I think they have more to say than most people. Madness is a thing that I enjoy. Antoinetteau, he was a big thing for me. I have a lot of his collected works. Just the bravery of these people. They didn't get. It's like, this is how I feel. This is what I'm doing. And I'm going to look this way. It's the way I want to look. And the way the Daddists would put on performance. They make the costumes out of construction paper. And you've seen the photos and it's Just incredible. No one looked like that, so to me, that was anti fashion.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

You know.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. So. And of course it extends into the surrealistics. Surrealists, Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

I was in the Dadaism before I got into the surrealist.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. But there's that natural extension. Then you see, like, let's call it the wave after Cocteau, Dali, William Burroughs, Brian Geysen and Genesis.

[Patrick Mata]

And then the leader, I can't remember his name. Artigan. The guy who was the head of the surrealist party that kicked Dolly out.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

Can't remember his name.

[Interviewer]

Is it Antonio?

[Patrick Mata]

No, he was a different guy. He was completely mad. I think he was in the madhouse at that time.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. So looking back now, because you've had time to reflect on that influence, what, what person or what era most evoked for you, who you wanted to be as an artist.

[Patrick Mata]

It was again, Tristan Zara and David Bowie.

[Interviewer]

Right. Basically, it's almost kind of like bookends of like the same philosophy.

[Patrick Mata]

Yes. And at the time, because I grew up with Bowie digging him, you know, I got everything I could find and. And like with the Beatles. The Beatles were a big influence on me as a child, third grade, I saw them on Ed Sullivan when they appeared. And my mom, she managed a record store and so she was like, as a friend of mine had said, like a pipeline of all that information from Britain. And of course, everyone was looking at Britain at that time because they were so innovative, all that, just like what happened in the 90s later, you know? But what really inspired me was the fact that they. They were so all. All individualistic. And that's what I love about all that. Ah, being an individual. Yeah, that's important to me.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, it must. It must make you laugh because, you know, I kind of stumbled in the Goth around 84, 85, and where people get almost like. They get kind of stuck in a lane, like, this is goth, this is rock, this is alternative.

[Patrick Mata]

I hate all of that.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, me too. I'm always like, who cares?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, yeah.

[Interviewer]

I thought this was supposed to be the fun club.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, that's not what it's about at all. You missed the point.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, yeah. Okay, I'm glad. I'm glad because I. I get that from you, but I'm. I'm glad to hear it from you. So when did you come to LA? What, what year?

[Patrick Mata]

75.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Patrick Mata]

What happened was, it's kind of a funny story. I was like. I said I was studying journalism and I discovered Burroughs, Andy Warhol and the Factory era. All of that. And in art and in a library, this college library. And I frequented books and took them. And I said, well, you. No one's going to read this. This is. I want this, right, to take the books, you know, I take them home. I still have some of them because I'm going to get something out of this, you know? So I told my mom that I wanted. I. I'm just not happy. I gotta. I gotta run. I gotta roam, you know, I got a heart to roam. And she was the only one who was. Who was supportive of me because she, like I said, she managed a record store. She was a singer. When she was 19, she opened for Billie Holiday in this little jazz band that she had at the Monterey Jazz Festival. And I didn't know that for years. And I was stoked when she played.

[Interviewer]

Have you heard recordings of your mom's voice?

[Patrick Mata]

No, no, I did some research. I couldn't find anything. But she did say she made a record, but I don't know what happened to it. Anyway, I said, I'm out of here. So she's. My dad didn't know, and he was a working class guy and he worked really hard and keep us together and everything, but I had to leave. So she gave me like 50 bucks and I left. I took a bus to LA. And I didn't know anyone. Didn't know anyone. I had. All I had was what I was wearing. I didn't think about that. I thought I was so naive.

[Interviewer]

Tell me about the day you arrived. Like, what is that day like?

[Patrick Mata]

Well, I'm going. Well, I go, okay, here I am. Now what? I don't know anybody, you know, I kind of freaked out a little bit. Yeah, I was. But I was so excited. I was so excited. And so I kind of maintained myself. I actually walked in. There was a market on Sunset across from the Whiskey called the Sunbee. And I went in there. I had. I didn't want to spend my 50 bucks. And don't get me wrong, I'm not a thief, okay? But I went into the market and I started eating food and putting the trash down my pants and in my jacket. And I just walked out and I said, okay, I ate, I'm good, you know, And I kind of hung around, walked around and I met some girls. And like, at the record store, there was licorice pizza on the corner. Costa, no whiskey. And everyone used to hang out there. Pat Samari used to hang out there. And so I waited and then I go, I heard about the rainbow. I heard about It. Because I used to collect these magazines. Roxine Cream, Rolling Stone, when they were newspapers. I had boxes of the newspapers, the original ones. And so I said, okay, the Rainbow. I'll go there. I'll meet some people. First thing I see, and I kid you not, I see this guy directing traffic, and he's on the street divider that it's between that side and this side of the Sunset Strip. And it's Robert Plant. He's standing there directing traffic, like, probably up out of his head. Who knows? I don't know him to be much of a stoner, but I know what he did. You know, all the boys did that. And I was like, oh, my God. You know? So I went into the Rainbow and I met a couple of girls. And I remember one. She invited me to her place. So I. I ended up staying there, and it was her, and she had a bunch of other friends. So it was like these, like, rich girls, and they're all hanging out at this, like, mansion. It was right around from the Hamburger Hamlet. And I remember the Hamburger Hamlet was like Iggyland, because Iggy would stand in front of Hamburger Hamlet and beg because he was not doing well at that time. Beg for drugs, beg for food. And that's how he got arrested later, because they found him drugged out of his mind, standing in front of the hamper, helmet like this on the window, like, somebody feed me or something. You know, It's a crazy story, but that's what happened.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Patrick Mata]

First time I was there, and I met all these really cool people, really strange people, and everyone was. This was like, post glitter glam. 75. Yeah. And Bowie was. And I was so into Bowie. I was so stupid not to know that he was. He was recording Heterokee. He was doing Station to station, like, at 76. 70, late 75. 76. I would have gone there. Believe me, I would have gone there.

[Interviewer]

So your ambitions at that point, you just want to be a musician? You want to start a band?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, I wanted to be a singer and sing. I knew I had the chops. I just. No one ever taught me anything.

[Interviewer]

Had you figured out that you had a good voice or, like, where were you at in your musical?

[Patrick Mata]

Well, again, it was. I learned early Dylan stuff. Like, everyone learns Dylan because you're learning how to play acoustic, and they're easy chords. But I really loved Dylan's surrealist era. 65 to 66. I think the best three records he ever made was during those years. That year.

[Interviewer]

You know, the legend is that he was, you know, he was on tons of amphetamines during that.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. Amphetamines, heroin, opium, acid. Yeah, I know about that. Very inspiring. Very inspiring. Well, yeah, look what he did. So.

[Interviewer]

Well, there's the. You know, with the. The through line that we're already talking about is like. It's. It's that. It's that fine line between, let's say, organized chaos and madness.

[Patrick Mata]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

And music. Likes to ride the rail on that.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, yeah.

[Interviewer]

Depending on your artist in the year.

[Patrick Mata]

And I. And I. Then I discovered Sid Barrett, and I thought, okay, I thought, this. This guy's amazing, you know? And there weren't a lot out at that time. I think it was madcap. Laughs I think. And I absorbed that record. I still listen to that. But I. I knew I could sing. I just knew it. And I just had this burning yearning in my heart that this is. I have to do this.

[Interviewer]

Okay?

[Patrick Mata]

I don't care about anything else.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

And that's when I. I just. Again, I was so naive. I just split. I said, I'm out. I didn't even think to pack a bag.

[Interviewer]

So what were. Because, again, information on your musical life at different points is kind of scarce. So I would love to have heard something or seen something, but all I know is there's this period between you showing up in 75 before you start your band, the one you're known for.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Like, tell me about that period. Before Community fk, there was a band.

[Patrick Mata]

Okay, this is a crazy story. So there was a newspaper called the Recycler, and every musician looked in the classifieds, people looking for musicians, you know. Yeah. And so I found this couple, and they wanted a singer. So I went. It was in the Valley. So I came out to the Valley, and they had this warehouse thing where the door opens like that, and they were in there. It was a drummer and a keyboardist. And so I kind of tried working with them. They were into some weird stuff that's too commercial for me. I just didn't really like it, but I had no other choice, so I thought, I'll just see what happens. Yeah. And then one day they were. They said, well, let's audition another drummer because this guy wanted to move to bass and let's get a. A guitarist. So one day these people show up, and they happened to be people I knew from where I came from. I don't know if it was fate or if they knew that I was there. I had. To this day, I had no idea. But I knew them. I go, what are you doing here? They're like, what are you doing here? You know, kind of thing. Yeah. And so I knew their talents. I said, I'm out of here. And the three of us just walked.

[Interviewer]

Oh, you just split?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. And we went and formed our own band. So the band, the guitar player called it Orange had something to do with the British Parliament. I don't know, Orange something. And so we called it Orange. And I thought, well, that's cool. I like that color. And we ended up writing songs together. I wrote all the lyrics and did all the vocals, and we did a demo, but I don't have a copy of it.

[Interviewer]

Were you playing guitar at that point?

[Patrick Mata]

Just a singer. Just a front person. And in one year, we ended up opening for Van Halen. We started. We were second bill of Van Halen everywhere. They played Starwood Whiskey. We did a lot of that. And then Patti Smith's management, Warto Concern, moved to. From New York to la, and they picked me up. They. They came to saw the band and they said, could you.

[Interviewer]

Could you quantify the type of music you were making?

[Patrick Mata]

It was Raw Power Stooges. Okay. Like, pro.

[Interviewer]

You have no recordings of that?

[Patrick Mata]

No. I know who does, but I don't know how to get a hold of him.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, I'd love to hear that stuff, though. But, yeah, we were really good. And I was singing my heart off, my balls off, and performing and having a great time, and I go, this. This is what I've always wanted to do. You know, I'm Valhalla. This is it.

[Interviewer]

You know, did you feel from a aesthetic point of view, it was what you were after, or is that you still kind of figuring it out?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, I was still figuring it out. Because here's the thing about as, you know, being in a band, you kind of. You want to kind of have a bonding commonness between you, which is like a dream, you know, it does. It exists sometimes, you know, these guys, I was too intellectual for them. I. I wrote really good lyrics. They didn't understand and. But they dug it. And the melodies were good, and I was a good performer. And so we just stuck with it, you know, And I just. I just said, I could do better than this. I can. I want to. Because I was really like. We'd be backstage at the Starwood, and I'd have my little blaster with me, and I'd have Low On. I'd have the Low album on, and punk was just coming out, but. And I was really into the Pistols. I mean, when I. I was eating at a Restaurant, the Source. And there was a group called Back Source Family Restaurant. Yes, that's it. Cult, you know. And did you ever.

[Interviewer]

Sorry, because I. I had interactions with the Source Family people.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, did you? I always wanted to meet them, and

[Interviewer]

I jammed with the Yehoah 13 a few times. Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

No way.

[Interviewer]

Did you ever meet Father Yod in that?

[Patrick Mata]

I saw him, I never got. I was too intimidated to talk to him.

[Interviewer]

Big guy, right?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Menacing, big beard.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. I go, wow. You know, look at that guy.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. At their peak, I think they had 150 people living in a house.

[Patrick Mata]

Yes, I heard. Yeah. Wow. I would have been one of them. You know, I think.

[Interviewer]

I think Don Bowles, our mutual compatriot, was around the Source family back in those days.

[Patrick Mata]

I don't doubt it. I don't doubt it. Yeah, he's amazing. I love Don. But anyway, so these girls, they had a band called Backstage Pass. You ever heard of them? They're an early, like. Like Runaways. Post Runaways. None of the members but that ilk.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

And they were sitting. We were sitting on the patio, and she was reading. The very first Anarchy in UK fanzine was Sue Catwoman on the COVID with a striped dress. And her style, which was impeccable.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, I know that.

[Patrick Mata]

But it was like this big of a newspaper, and I was like, whoa. You know, and I. Can. I see that. So, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I looked at it. I mean, oh, my God, you know, who are these guys and his Pistols? So I went and tried to find everything I could, and Lisa Robinson was writing about him for Roxine and all that stuff. You could see glimpses of him was teasing enough for me. Like seeing a picture of Tristan Zara, that was rock and roll to me, you know? And I thought, oh, God, these guys. Amazing. So one day, when I was picked up by Wartok, concerned they were going to manage me, this guy named Rory Johnson comes in and he's looking for a record deal, American deal for the Pistols. And I'm like, oh, my God, he's one of them. You know, he's a British guy.

[Interviewer]

Oh, wow.

[Patrick Mata]

And he had the fanzine and he had a Factory sample, not for sale, stamped 7 inch of Anarchy in the UK, not released yet. And he goes, here. It's like a press kit. And he just gave it to me. I took that home and never took it off my turntable.

[Interviewer]

Talk about the power of intention.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. And I've had these brushes through my whole life with situations like that, and I thought, oh, my God. And so I went home, took my hair, cut it off. Just like that. Just cut it off?

[Interviewer]

Yeah, yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

And, and I just said, I, I, I'm, I'm in. I'm in. I need to do something else now.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Patrick Mata]

And so I, I, it's like a bolt of lightning. Yeah, totally. And it really happened. And I mean, it was amazing. I'll never forget it. Yeah. And then I said, okay, this is, this is my next phase. I'm going to do this, I'm gonna do something else. I'm gonna try and start a, a band, my own band this time. And so I would meet, I, I, I had a girlfriend at the time, and I tried to get other guys to play with me. No one would play with me. So she played bassi, played bass. Her name was Cece. And Zimbabwe had to find a drummer. So we went to the Catheter grand every night looking at punk bands, trying to find somebody. And we saw this drummer, a kid, and he walked off stage in the middle of the set. I think Margo X Gogos was playing bass. They had an argument on stage right during the set. And I'm like, wow. Because back in those days, it was punk rock and who cares, you know, being professional, you know. So he, he threw his drumsticks at Margo, he walks off his kit, walks out of the club. I followed him. I said, oh, I'm gonna talk to this guy.

[Interviewer]

He's my drummer.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, that's him. So I went outside and I was talking to him. I go, man, let's jam. Let's do this. Let's do something. He goes, okay, give me two weeks. I'm going to, I'm going to Tahoe or something like that. So I waited two weeks, didn't show up. And I'm like, oh, God. So anyway, that's the beginning of Community fk.

[Interviewer]

Wow. Okay. When you started, because I want to sort of try to put some of these pieces together. When you started, did you think like, okay, I know exactly what I want to do, or was it like, I want to start something new and then I'll figure it out as I go. Did you have a specific vision?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, I did, but it was instinctive, too. I just like I always do. And I had a discussion with my friend in the car on the way here. I do something for the moment, and it's hard to shake for me where, okay, I'm going to do this and it's going to sound like that. You know, it never works to me like that.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Patrick Mata]

For me, I'm inspired for the moment. And then whatever happens at that moment, there it is.

[Interviewer]

And you're all in on the moment.

[Patrick Mata]

Yes. Yeah. And then you document it and then you move on, and then the next thing doesn't sound at all like that.

[Interviewer]

I see, I see.

[Patrick Mata]

And the other thing, too, was that I didn't have access to studio or anything like that. Back in those days, there was no digital, you know, so you had to remember everything. So to write my songs, I couldn't listen to anybody else's music. I had to focus. If I had a melody or an idea, I focus on that all day until I could get to a guitar or get to something and lay the idea down.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

And then get a cassette player, you know.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Because it's. It's still from. From the point where you first start with Community FK till your first record, it's still a few years. I'm not crazy about that. Right.

[Patrick Mata]

It's like, yeah, we recorded in 82, the first album, so it's about.

[Interviewer]

There's about three plus years of gestation of the music that you're playing live before you make a record. Am I crazy about that?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So what was. What did the band sound like? If you could just kind of give it a.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, if you listen to the first album. That was our set list. That was our very first set list.

[Interviewer]

But I'm saying, what did it sound like in the beginning, though?

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, it was.

[Interviewer]

I'm just.

[Patrick Mata]

Because it was. No, it was noise. Don Bowles did our first gig. Don Bowles did our sound. And he was dressed in dragon, and he had these hot pants, Daisy Dukes on and fishnets and a wig and everything.

[Interviewer]

Knowing Don, it just makes me laugh.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, that's Don, though, you know, and he loved it. And see, he would be the person

[Interviewer]

who would get it right away.

[Patrick Mata]

And he really. He played the PA like an instrument. And I. And I heard the. I heard the live. He recorded his live, and I know he has it. I know he's got that tape. And I heard it and I thought, wow, we're not that bad. And. And I was also getting into Public Image, Keith Levine's guitar style.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

So that's.

[Interviewer]

So that. The angular.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, yeah. And more of the high strings, you know, that kind. And he had that metal guitar. It was made of metal, and I had that resonance. And so I tried to write a song like Public Image, that single. I tried to write a song like that, and I. And I couldn't. So it came out as a song called To Blame. And so it kind of has that guitar style on it, but that was me just interpreting it.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

I could never copy some person. I could never sound like someone I really liked. You know, I had to have my own voice. So I just said, well, this is how I hear it.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. What's striking to me about listening, I was listening this morning to your first album, and it strikes me, it's like, you know, the Beatles has a way of casting a shadow over everything in a weird kind of way, for better and for worse. And I love the Beatles.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, yeah, I'm sure you do, too, but.

[Interviewer]

But. But there's no Beatles on that record, if you get the joke right. You know, I mean, it sounds like you've wandered into this new zip code that's totally your zip code. And I think that's what's shocking, you know, I mean.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, it's.

[Interviewer]

I. It's. For me, it's a parlor game I like to play where I like to, like, sort of like, how far does this rabbit hole go down? Like, with few. With Dada.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, I do that.

[Interviewer]

If you start with Bowie, you can go all the way back to Zara. I'm sure there's gurus, but I'm sure you can. You can find. Even before Zara, there's this other guy or another woman. You know, there's always this other person. You're like, where's this come from?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, that's how I learned a lot of things. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So I think it's interesting, your first record. It's like. It feels like. I mean, I hear the influence, but somehow fast pass through your blender filter wherever you were in your life. It doesn't sound like you're copying anybody. And that's where the originality comes in. We all, of course, learn from other people. That's be ridiculous if we just sort of made up our own music, you know, there's not.

[Patrick Mata]

I'm Not Harry parts, you know.

[Interviewer]

Sure. That's what I'm. So what I'm saying is shocking. I think in rock and roll, where there are those moments where you're like, wow, this is something totally new. And you obviously aren't even sure if it's new. Right.

[Patrick Mata]

I'm just expressing myself in it.

[Interviewer]

Right.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So in that. In that. In that. In the buildup years, getting to that first record. I know I'm kind of jumping around, but in that. So you're playing. Like you said, that was our set list. Okay. So give me. Give me a typical reaction and a typical place you would have played before you put out your first record. You know, there's no record review. There's nothing. You can't hand somebody something. This is our album. You know what I mean?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

You're just on stage somewhere, you're opening, you're playing a gig.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

It's Wednesday night at wherever Gaza is, you know.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. I never played there, thank God.

[Interviewer]

No, it's a joke.

[Patrick Mata]

I know, I know, I get it. But I'm just saying I never played there just to make that clear, you know?

[Interviewer]

No, I. That's why. That's why it's a joke. You see?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

What I'm saying is give me the atmosphere. Because I think sometimes it's always easy to look in the rearview mirror and say, well, that kind of worked out. But. But when you're in. Doesn't feel like it's working out. People are walking out. People are throwing things at you.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, yeah.

[Interviewer]

Including other bands.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, yeah.

[Interviewer]

Been there. So tell me about that.

[Patrick Mata]

Okay. To me, I likened it to, again, you know, Rites of Spring, Stravinsky, the Dadaist. You know, where the hostile reactions, nihilistic interpretation reviews, things like that about what you're doing. People would. Okay. What really, really hit the fan was when someone was brave enough to interview us for the LA Times calendar section. They gave us a full page and let us just like, here they are. Read about them. They're great. This guy thought we were great. Before that, people would go, I'm not going on after these guys. I don't want these guys on our bill. They can't play. They're horrible. I mean, they look weird. What's up with these guys? You know? And I had named the band Community. That's the original name, and we couldn't even put that on the marquee in those days. So took the UC out and, you know, there it is. So people started pronouncing nfk. And so that. That happened. Then bookers would say, I'm not going to pay you. You get 15% of zero. And they put a line through the zero because I don't like. I don't get it. I don't get it.

[Interviewer]

And 15% of zero.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, yeah. And they just didn't get it. So they refused to pay us. And. And I thought, hmm, this is kind of Dadaistic. Is this interesting? And I kind of liked.

[Interviewer]

You saw it as a version of Success.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, I kind of liked it. It was like when the bully acknowledges you and they start getting ready to throw a punch, then they stop and they go, hmm, I don't know something about this guy. He might hurt me or I don't know what he's gonna do, you know. So we just fought back. I mean, one time we were opening for Killing Joke. Our very first break gig was. I got. I was. During those days, I was trying to get a job as a paste up artist. Now everybody does, you know, Photoshop, is that.

[Interviewer]

So that's when you would like. You copy and paste the glue. Okay.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. And then you do it for a newspaper or something. So I was beaten to path. And it was August, it was hot. And I came home very disillusioned. How am I going to get a job doing this? I even went to Larry Flint's place in Century City to try to get a job for him and I didn't get the job. So. So I come home and then there's a phone call and it's the booker for the Roxy. And she goes, her name is Michonne, God bless her. And she goes, I got this band, Killing Joke, playing the Whiskey two nights. Do you. Do you want the gig? I went, I was a huge fan. First album I had it, I go, oh my God. First Joy Division album too. That came out. I mean, it was such a great. It was like 1972. All those great albums came out. Yeah, well, this was 1980, you know, 81. And this. All these great records are coming out. The Passage. Ever heard the Passage? Sure, yeah. How that Pin Drop album is unbelievable. Anyway, so I said, we'll take opening night, you know, of course. So we got opening night. We had to play two sets. They clear the room in the middle and then you had to play a second set and close the night.

[Interviewer]

I see.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, yeah, so when we got there, that gig, everyone thought that we didn't deserve it and everyone thought that we paid our way to get the gig, but we. What I didn't know. Underlying all of that, we had an audience. I had no idea because we used to get nothing but hostile reactions. And sometimes you have to fight somebody just to get your stuff in the car, you know, they're trying to. Here's my chance, you know, There he is, you know, and. And I'm, you know, and so sorry to laugh.

[Interviewer]

I've had a few of those myself.

[Patrick Mata]

I bet you have. I'm sure. You know, and that it's, it's. It's a sign of. It's a good thing, I think. Anyway, so that being said, we got a lot of bad, like letters to the editor in that Calendar section.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Patrick Mata]

Because, like, I remember this one guy, he wrote, they don't deserve this. They're not musicians. I have to show it to you. Sometimes we're better than they are, you know, I mean, just no one could figure it out. And then we had again, this underlying audience. One guy got it. His name was Howard, Howard Parr. And he now he does a lot of soundtracks for films and things like that. But he had a club called the On Club. And he was a mod, like British mod. He was here from England, so he gave the Untouchables some of their first gigs, Ska bands, things like that. But he dug what we were doing. He kind of like, thought we were kind of Joy Division. Ish. Because we were bass heavy and drum heavy, and that's what I wanted. And so I thought my guitar was just, like, spiced. It wasn't really important. So he gave us every Wednesday for one month to do whatever we wanted to do. In those days, There were no DJs, so we just brought our record collection to the club, played our favorite tracks. Two people show up first night, just two people. And we didn't know how to take that. I thought, oh, man, I don't know. So we played two songs in the band, played two songs, one song for each person, and then we just played records the rest of the night. A week later, 10 people show up. Huh? And then we see people showing because I, I wore makeup. I had long, I had a long Rosicrucian priest coat that I bought at Fiorucci. I, I, There's a lot of things going on in between. Then I got a job at Fiorucci and I was working there and because I could look any way I wanted, and I was wearing white face and all this stuff and had a Rosicrucian priest jacket that I adored. Cloth buttons that went all the way down. And so I looked like that. And then kids started showing up wearing black trench coats, an eyeliner, and I thought, oh, these are the boys. This is awesome. Things started gelling and then we started getting a big audience. Then bands wanted to open for us all of a sudden. And then we were headlining, and so things started to gel and hostility started to disappear. Interesting. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Looking back now on your first record, remind me of the title, because it's. I have it written.

[Patrick Mata]

The Vision and the Voice.

[Interviewer]

Thank you.

[Patrick Mata]

I got that from a Crowley book.

[Interviewer]

Oh, it's a beautiful record. And thank you. And I'm sure most of the focus is probably more on the second one, because that's where it all really kind of comes together in a way that is probably more easy, easier to discern for the modern ear. As far as, like, what followed. Does it make sense what I'm saying?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, I understand. Yeah, yeah, of course. But that's a development, though.

[Interviewer]

Yes, but. And, and. And that's normally where. Where I would go. In fact, recently I found a vintage press of that, the second album, Close one sat on. Yeah. But listening to the first album this morning, I was really struck by, like there was actually. It's hard to explain. There's always that moment of innocence where the thing you're trying just kind of comes together and you're not quite sure of the result. And I was really care. But I. I was really struck by the. By the. By the. By the freshness or the. Or the. How starkly sort of modern it. The first album remains. Does it make. Am I. I'm struggling for words, but. Because it's hard to define something that's groundbreaking. Maybe that's the compliment I'm trying to pay here.

[Patrick Mata]

I appreciate that.

[Interviewer]

It's so different. And that's what I mean, the joke about no Beatles. It's like songs just kind of start and stop. And there's a lack of. For something that normally gets the pretense, the label of pretension, you know, this kind of goth, death rock, whatever people want to call this genre, which you were part of, you know, initiating into the world, lacks the pretense in a way, you know, I'm saying I think people later kind of add pretense to something.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, yeah. Because they don't. They're trying to understand it.

[Interviewer]

Yes. But it. It has almost no pretense. And I think that's what's even more shocking.

[Patrick Mata]

No one's ever said that to me.

[Interviewer]

I hope that comes across as compliment.

[Patrick Mata]

I know it does, and I'm flattered.

[Interviewer]

Thank you. But tell me your version of it, because you're the author and you're also living it at the same time. So walk me through that for you, because I'll try. We can only have those watershed moments in our life once.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, yeah, I know that. And being an elder now, I get sometimes a little leclemped, you know, when I think about it.

[Interviewer]

But what makes you emotional?

[Patrick Mata]

What? How beautiful it was, what a time it was, you know, you'll never be repeated. You can't repeat things.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, that's kind of what I was trying to say in so many.

[Patrick Mata]

And if you weren't there, you missed it kind of thing.

[Interviewer]

I'm sad I missed it.

[Patrick Mata]

I wish you were there.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

But it was. Leave me for the moment. And I was cool with that. I thought, this is. I don't know what this is, but I love this. I just. I love my life right now. And, yeah, sure, it's a struggle, but that's not a problem. I'll get through it, you know, Know, I'll make the next day and as long as I can and go to that rehearsal room and just see what happens. And we had access to a Prophet 5, and they had just put those out. Sequential circuits, put that out. And a lot of, like, Bernie Worrell was using it for Punkadelic and Parliament. And we didn't use it like that. We saw it as well. Let's throw the manual away and let's just see what happens. And that's what happened. We just let it. We'd program it and preset it and then just let it go. And then we'd play over it and we slipped it.

[Interviewer]

Like a drone instrument.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, drone. And some people, like, we're trying to define our sound. Terry Atkinson's for the LA Times. He was the music editor and critic. He saw the Killing Joke show, and we're playing songs from the first album, and he said, they're gloom and doom. They're drone music. I don't know what this is, but it's awesome. I really dig and I get it, you know?

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

So that was a great thing for us. And we put that right away in our press kit. We thought, this is it. And someone else described this as brittle psychedelia, intense noise, suppressed sexuality, all kinds of really cool, cool terms. I thought, oh, okay, yeah, so people are starting to pay attention. But I thought what we were doing was unique. But then again, I didn't know what it was. I just knew that I loved it and I loved doing it. I thought, well, there's so much to explore and there's only three of us, so we didn't want a keyboard player. You know, we thought we just let it do its thing. Yeah, yeah. So that's. That's what that is. I don't know if that answers your question, but.

[Interviewer]

No, no, because it's just.

[Patrick Mata]

There's so much going on in my mind when I think about that. Because there was so much going on.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, yeah. I think it's that it's like I, at least in my own life, I find myself ruminating on things that didn't seem important at the time. And it lends a certain sort of sentimental thing of like you see yourself through the rearview mirror in a form of innocence. You knew what you were doing, but you didn't really understand the depth of what you were doing.

[Patrick Mata]

Not at all.

[Interviewer]

It's like you almost gotta be older and maybe take some drugs and go, wow, I was actually onto something.

[Patrick Mata]

But we took drugs.

[Interviewer]

But no, I don't mean that.

[Patrick Mata]

I know, I know what you mean. I know what you mean.

[Interviewer]

But I guess what I'm saying is, it's like sometimes it's like one of those old movies where, you know, a stranger stumbles into a new town and, you know, he's just looking for some gas or something, and this thing happens, you know? And I think those musical moments in our lives are. They're significant because it's like, I don't know if you have this sensation, but sometimes I think, like, gosh, I wish I'd written more songs, taken more pictures, wrote more stuff down.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, I reflect like that sometimes. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

But it's all happening so fast, and you're in it, and one day you're just, you're eating at Denny's and then you're playing a gig and it's just all going on. You're in your youth, and it's just kind of rolling through.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. Whatever happens next, you know, great to see that. You know.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. So once the, Once the record came out and you saw that something was shifting, and you were certainly on a musical journey, one that you authored. You're like, you, you feel possessive of the journey that you're having. What was your, what was your plan? Just keep going? Or do you, do you suddenly think, oh, this is working and now I want to do blank?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, no, I, I, I didn't think like that. I, I didn't. We didn't even tour. We just played San Francisco, San Diego, Louisiana. That was it. That was our, Our network.

[Interviewer]

Did no labels come sniffing around?

[Patrick Mata]

Not, not at the time, no. Not until Independent Project Records came and they said, we want to, we want to put an album out with you guys. Yeah, we thought it was crazy, but, well, we did it, and he paid for the studio time. It's funny, we recorded it at Mystic Sound, which is where Led Zeppelin recorded parts of Led Zeppelin, too. And we didn't. At that time, it wasn't cool like Led Zeppelin, you know, and now I'm a huge Led. Love Led Zeppelin, you know? Yeah, yeah, yeah. But especially when you, like, you say, you go down the rabbit hole with Jimmy Page and there's more than meets demand, and that really inspires me. And even now. Now I know more. But still, we couldn't tour. But I thought, it doesn't matter, because all that matters is the here and now. And that's how I. That's. And that's something that's maybe a problem for me. I don't. Like, some guy tells me, I always plan the year ahead. You should try to do that. Like, here's what you should. You want to do this year, I go, but I can't do that. I don't know what I'm going to do in a year.

[Interviewer]

Well, in talking to our mutual friend Josh.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, lovely guy.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. He's close. In our world. And Josh Richmond, for those interested. I was trying to. In order to talk to you today, I was trying to get to know you as a person a little bit, even though we hadn't met, because I certainly want to respectfully kind of approach your work, because that's what we're here to talk about.

[Patrick Mata]

Thanks.

[Interviewer]

And he was saying something. I don't remember what he was saying. And I said, oh, that makes kind of what you're saying about how you're just kind of in the moment. And I said, oh, that makes total sense to me. Why? And again, I don't know you, right? So I'm like, I'm telling somebody who knows you my impression of you, right? And I said, it makes sense to me because he's an og. And what I mean by that is there are those artists who they are the art. And everybody tries to figure out how to do what they do in a form of imitation, but the artists themselves can't imitate themselves because they are the art. Does that make sense?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, it does. Yeah. And I totally agree. I agree.

[Interviewer]

I've always been in awe of people like you, and I'm also in awe of you. But the reason is because I'm not that type of personality.

[Patrick Mata]

Come on.

[Interviewer]

No, I'm serious. I'm more of a studier, like a. Like an architect, you know? I mean, I study a lot of things, and I got to put things carefully together to get what I'm after, okay? And everybody around me. Everybody around me is like, jesus, how long is this going to take? And why is this so complicated? And it's like, there's a blueprint in my mind is always better than what I'm able to achieve, but I'm always chasing this kind of blueprint into my mind, okay? But I've always been in awe. And I knew people in Chicago back in the day, like yourself, who Just seem to kind of embody the work. Like they, they're a work of art. And then their, their music seems to be the soundtrack for the, the work of art that they are.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, they're expressing it.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. So I see you in that, in that. I don't know if that, that sort of, it's, I don't even know the word for it. It's just like some people just, they are the thing. Does that resonate with you?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, it does.

[Interviewer]

Because even everything you're talking about, like, whether it's Bowie or Zeppelin, and I can hear moments where I think, okay, I can hear the influence, but somehow it still comes out sounding like you.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, because I don't imitate anybody. Like I said, when I was younger, I tried to emulate Bowie and all that kind of stuff. That just wasn't me. And then eventually me comes out like the vocals. I was really into the girl groups of the 60s, and my mom tell

[Interviewer]

me, because I'm obsessed with girl groups from the 60s.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, I love the Shangri La's.

[Interviewer]

The Shangri Las, you know. Right.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And her voice. Imagine she was singing those songs when she was 16.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. Yeah. That's what I mean.

[Interviewer]

What an incredible voice.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

She just passed away not too long

[Patrick Mata]

ago, God bless her. That bummed me out.

[Interviewer]

What a voice.

[Patrick Mata]

I played her records that day on her honor and. But the double tracking also blew my mind. Like when I heard Lennon double tracking in the Beatles records, I thought, oh, man, it's so amazing. It sounds like a third instrument, you know? Yeah. And so they did that. Everyone double tracked at one point during those days, the Brillo recording people and all that. But I don't know, I, I, I know that there's not another person like me. And it's not an ego trip. It's just, I, I don't know, I can't really explain. Yeah. You know, because like, again, I'm, I'm living this in this body and there's things going on in here. If I had more chances to express what's up in here, I would probably have 50 records out at this point.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

Like psychic TV. I really love the fact that they could, they put a record out every day for a while. They put an album out every day. Did you know that I didn't put out 23 records?

[Interviewer]

Yeah. A good friend of mine was, was close to Genesis.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. I interviewed him once.

[Interviewer]

Oh, how was that?

[Patrick Mata]

That was amazing. He dosed me. I got dosed.

[Interviewer]

Sorry to laugh.

[Patrick Mata]

No, no, it was, it was a Trip. No pun intended. Yeah, but he was. He was. That's when he was exiled over here and. Cause something happened to him in England and he had a school bus. He was trying to do the Further Mary Paxter's kind of thing. And he was with Paula and two of the children. And so for Flipside asked me to interview him. I said, yeah, no problem. Then they played the Stardust Ballroom. I went in there. He wanted to hold my hand. So we held hands and we walked around and we talked. It's like we're talking now, but we're holding hands and walking around. And then someone just goes, here. Here's some water. And I'm like, oh, okay. Like this. Take the water. And then about two hours later, there's this feeling in the back of my neck. And I'm going, oh, God. I think I know what's going on. And I've started coming on to acid psychedelics.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

But I watched the show and we talked about Burroughs and we talked about Guyson. And I could see all that in what he does. But he was doing the house stuff. He misinterpreted Acid House as Acid House, you know, and. Which it wasn't. It was something else. Yeah. And. But what. How he interpreted it, I thought, well, that's like me, I interpret something, and I don't know if it's misinterpreting it. Yeah. But either way, you come out with something original.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

Trying to interpret something.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

You don't imitate it. You let it inspire you, and then you throw it up, you know, and then it comes out as such to

[Interviewer]

give you a different take on that. So I. I saw psychic TV, Genesis band, probably somewhere around 87.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. It was around those times, and they were really peaking.

[Interviewer]

So I saw him at the Cabaret Metro in Chicago. And, you know, they come shuffling out. Like they're like they just woke up from a nap. Right?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Like, no. Like. No. Like waving. No showbiz to the side. Just come out, like about 11 people on stage.

[Patrick Mata]

Wow.

[Interviewer]

And I thought, what am I watching? I was bored by it. And at the same time, I was interested in it. Right.

[Patrick Mata]

It was probably a bad night.

[Interviewer]

No, I think. And it was interesting because the addendum to the story was. I was telling you about. I had a friend who was friends with Genesis. So at some point I told her that I'd seen Genesis play live. And she started saying, oh, I think Genesis would really like you. And this is. I think, when he was towards the end of his life, he was Getting sick. So it wasn't like a thing. You pick up the phone and call him.

[Patrick Mata]

Okay.

[Interviewer]

So we started passing messages through the mutual friend. So Genesis would send a message to me.

[Patrick Mata]

How fun.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. And then since he's passed, I've spent some time trying to understand his life and his work. But I always go back to that gig, Right? Because here's this moment of innocence. I'm just 20 years old, whatever. I'm standing in a club and here's just another band, you know, And I've seen them all. And I'm sure you saw them all, you know, like they all came through town and you go to the gig and there'd be a hundred people. Yeah, right.

[Patrick Mata]

It was a good gig, too, that way. A small audience.

[Interviewer]

Yes. There was this beautiful moment with alternative music where it wasn't what it became. And I'm not saying it was bad. It paid the bills. But there was this beautiful moment where there really weren't that many punks. There weren't that many goths. You know, There were like six Goths in Chicago, and I happened to be the 14th of them. Know what I mean? It was one of those. And the originals didn't like me because I was three years younger than them. And I showed up in 84 instead of 81, you know, anyway, Right. So I always go back to this gig. And I'm saying all this because I think it relates to you as well. There's that moment when you're in the audience and you're watching, and you're actually watching something quite brilliant. As a musician. I'm focused on. The guitar is out of tune. Why has he got three standup drummers? He can't really sing. But the revolution of it is, it's the Velvet Underground, it's Iggy Pop, it's Bowie, it's. No, no. This is the soundtrack of something that's happening. But the real revolution is the fact that we're not playing this showbiz game. We're not. We're living a different type of rule.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

The revolution is anybody could be up here. That's the great revolution of alternative music.

[Patrick Mata]

That's what I loved about punk, early punk.

[Interviewer]

Right. So it's been beautiful to talk to you about the innocence of it. Because, you know, I stumbled upon it in around 84, you know, with what was going on out here. And I could talk about that in a second. But from your vantage point, you've started something. And of course, now there's labels and names for it back then, it probably didn't have much of a name other than doom and Gloom. But looking around the atmosphere, you know, you got. Whether it's Christian Death over here, Alien Sex, Pheny or whatever, there's these artists, Specimen, I supported them. Yeah,

[Patrick Mata]

but.

[Interviewer]

But what I'm after is when you see this start to congeal into something that looks a little bit more organized or a little bit more like there's an audience, you know what I mean? It's not a cult of one, it's a cult of a few. But it's like something is happening. It's not even popular. And you.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, I saw that happen.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, right. But you're there, you're like, well, something's happening. Some people are getting signed. Specimen had Kiss Kiss, Bang Bang, which was an MTV song. Like, something's happening. What's your impression when it starts to happen?

[Patrick Mata]

Becomes slightly diluted, misinterpreted, like anything else. Look what happened to punk. And Josh was telling me the other day, would you even believe 50 years later, it would be huge. This whole alternative thing would be as huge as it is as a commodity now and all that. In my day it wasn't. We were the anti heart. And that's what I was trying to do.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

You know, I said, you know, you, you, you're cool. Come on, you know, and that's what we did.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

And then those people that we said, come on, they came and the other ones, they off and they went and did whatever they're going to do and they got signed, whatever, you know. But the thing about it is, I didn't chase that. I didn't chase, I'm gonna get a record deal. You know, I never thought like that it happened usually accidentally. I didn't ask, independent project, here I am, Come and sign me. They just said, we want to do a record with you.

[Interviewer]

But were there people in your orbit that were saying, I think you can do more with this? Or, oh, yeah, let me get a keyboard player. Okay, tell me, tell me.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, People like, you got a synthesizer up there. Why isn't anyone playing it? I said, it's playing itself. It's playing itself.

[Interviewer]

Yes.

[Patrick Mata]

They're like, I don't get it. It's like, exactly, you don't get it. You know, we're gonna keep doing this, this way, my way, that's way.

[Interviewer]

I mean, I mean, you're. This is LA, right? This 80s. There must have been somebody like, if you guys got. I mean, it was. Was there some record guy in your ear? Was there some.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, I'VE met them Heiress this Chrysalis Records.

[Interviewer]

Okay, okay.

[Patrick Mata]

During the Clothesman Sad Eye era. It was before we actually recorded that record. Some guy from Chrysalis was courting us at the shows and all this stuff and he's like, ah, come on. So we went up to his office and this guy was a total douche. And I just like, I thought, I'm not gonna sign to this guy. I don't care what, what's going on here? And I didn't hear anything that I wanted to hear. He's just like, yeah, we're gonna, you know.

[Interviewer]

So there was some percolating.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, yeah, there was some of that. Some people were trying to be brave.

[Interviewer]

Did you see it as put a

[Patrick Mata]

foot in, you know.

[Interviewer]

Sure. Did you see it as a lack or in hindsight, do you see it as a lack of ambition or your just. Brain was not organized that way? I'm just gonna do art and whatever's gonna come of it's gonna come up.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, it was either like, like if someone like you comes up and says, you know, I really want, let's do something, you know, I go, well, I would with you, but when someone like that comes up to me, I'm going, no, I'm not going to do anything with you. I see you, you know.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. We had a funny thing once where we were, we were, we were playing a gig. Some guy had flown in from LA to possibly sign us. This would have been 89, 90, something like that. And so I told the band, like, you know, don't say anything stupid.

[Patrick Mata]

Of course. Yeah, yeah. Like you don't do the interviews. I do, you know.

[Interviewer]

Well, it was one of those things like, just don't say anything stupid.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And this guy was notorious because he, he, I think he. In order to sign Green Day, he dyed his hair green. And he was one of those guys. It was like something out of Spinal Tap.

[Patrick Mata]

There you go.

[Interviewer]

Anyway, so the guy comes backstage and it's like, you know, it's like this big. We're all kind of sitting, getting ready to play and the guy goes to us, we're just talking and somebody said something about doing drugs or something and he goes, do you guys do drugs? You know. And it was one of those moments where it's like, I didn't want anyone to say anything. Yeah, yeah, because, because, you know, we might blow our chance at a record deal. And Jimmy Chamberlain, the drummer of the Pumpkins, goes. Does a One legged duck swim in a circle.

[Patrick Mata]

No way. Are you serious?

[Interviewer]

And then the Guy got freaked out and went away because we, quote, unquote, did drugs. And we were like, everybody? Everybody?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. Where have you been, bro?

[Interviewer]

This is the 80s, bro. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What are you talking about?

[Patrick Mata]

Well, then again, we would attract all kinds of outsiders to our early shows. We play a place called Alsbar, which is downtown. And there was an art scene there because of the people going to Otis Institute and things like that, and. And design schools are down there. And so we would play warehouse parties sometimes. But Al's bar was great because it was so small. Such small real estate, but packed with people. I mean, there was more room for people. There's a bar, you know, but it was like a beatnik bar, and it was perfect setting for us back in early days. And so one time this guy shows up and he's gapped to the gills, and he's. He's like, I have something for you. I got something for you. And we're like, who is this guy?

[Interviewer]

I don't know.

[Patrick Mata]

Let him in. You know, we got him backstage. He brings this newspaper, like it's like a bushel, and he lays it on the floor. He goes, I made this for you. It's all this cocaine. And it was just. I don't know how he made it. I said, I don't know about that. I don't know if I'm gonna take what you made, dude. You know, make you a bathtub or something. But we attracted all kinds of strange, really interesting people. I found out he was a painter, and he'd been up for two weeks. I thought, I'd like to know this guy, you know? But, yeah, we had similar things like that happen. And then some guys record guys offering us drugs, you know. Okay. Nah, I want to. It just show busy.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, yeah, I get me so close. One eye is the. Is the apocryphal moment where it all congeals, you know, it's. It's still early days of what's now called goth or death rock or whatever.

[Patrick Mata]

It was goth. That's when goth happened.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Patrick Mata]

83, 84.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Patrick Mata]

Right.

[Interviewer]

And, you know, there's other things going on. You got the Cure over here. You got Susan, the Banshees over here. Then, of course, some of the other bands that we talked about. It's a beautiful record for people having heard the record, so I appreciate that. I recommend listening to it. But. And at the. At the moment we're having the interview, some of that stuff's not even online, so hopefully that's. I know that's going to get rectified soon, because it should be.

[Patrick Mata]

We're going to reissue it.

[Interviewer]

Okay, fantastic. So hopefully by the time this airs, it's. It's. It's out. But I hope so you can find it if you dig around enough. So close one Sat Eye. Right? I got the title right.

[Patrick Mata]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

Okay, perfect. So it's Community fk and. And then here comes mtv. Like, so everything you've said, it's like, you make this video, but you're. I'm probably. You're not thinking you're gonna end up on mtv.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, not at all.

[Interviewer]

And there you are in mtv. And by the way, being an alternative artist, which we now call alternative, there wasn't even a word back then. But being an outsider artist, to be on MTV in 1985 was, like, shocking.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Must have been shocking to you.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, yeah, because I had no idea that was going to happen. I had no idea. I wasn't against it, mind you. Yeah. You know, I'm not getting paid, but it doesn't matter.

[Interviewer]

What better way to.

[Patrick Mata]

I thought it was a beautiful video.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. You know, it holds up quite nicely, and it's cool.

[Patrick Mata]

I'm glad you feel that. Yeah. I'm just saying, though, when we filmed it, Josh was there. Of course he was there. And he's been through the whole thread. Pardon me. He's been through the whole thread. But when we did that, the. I had nothing to do with the storyboard, but I thought, this is interesting. Maybe this person is trying to say something that I've been trying to say.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

You know, and so the message was that something. It was like a funeral. That something had died inside of me.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

The way I see the world and

[Interviewer]

the way this is for the song. Something inside me is died.

[Patrick Mata]

Something inside me has died. Yeah. And I just, you know, it's just. There's sadness and. And so I named the album Close one, said I, because you have to have one eye open at all times. So that's what that means. But. And it's a sad world. That's even sadder now. But I thought she got it. I thought this. She wrote a storyboard. And I thought, well, this is really interesting. It's like a fallen angel or some nephilim or something like that coming down to tell everybody. You know, there's. You're losing hope, man.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

You're losing it, you know, kind of thing.

[Interviewer]

I thought so.

[Patrick Mata]

And it was gothy. It was. Got kind of vibe.

[Interviewer]

It's a beautiful. I, I, I. It's. It's amazing.

[Patrick Mata]

That's when goth started to come across again. 81 80, 81, 82. Death Rock. Okay. That's what we were called. And I didn't. I never called myself that. But so then things get a little more shinier, a little more prettier looking. And I'm learning to do song structure just by nature. This is starting. I didn't say, I'm going to do this chord and do that chord. It's just how it came out. And then working with other individuals was something I had never really thought of doing.

[Interviewer]

I see.

[Patrick Mata]

So I started working with two other people in the band. The drummer was still my drummer from the first album. He'd been through Baptism Fire with me and he stayed with me, and I was so proud of that. And so the first lineup, the girl leaves, the bass player, she leaves. And then I thought, well, I'm going to break up the band. I. I can't do this anymore. Then. Then the bass player comes up and goes, no, no, no. You got to be like the Damned. They have a family tree that's like this long. Is this Lemmy's played with them? I mean.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

You know, just keep going, man. You know? So I gave him a chance, and we just started doing the next level. And that's where the material came from.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Patrick Mata]

Was working like that because I had changed. I was seeing things a little further.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

Differently. But I hadn't. Didn't plan any of that.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. When. When the MTV video happens, is there now real interest from record labels or is it still kind of.

[Patrick Mata]

No.

[Interviewer]

That's really interesting.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. I don't know. I'm still the. I'm still outside.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Patrick Mata]

I'd like to reach more people, believe me, because at this, especially this. This point in. In the world, there's more people. And because of the. Becoming a commodity, people are curious and more interested, and I think they see the beauty of what it was like. You say, you know, they can't live it, they missed it, but they want to feel that. And because of the way I looked and all that stuff, that helped inspire some fashion, anti fashion now Kardashians dress like this, you know, I mean, who saw that?

[Interviewer]

Well, when Lady Gaga, who's obviously one of the biggest pop artists in the world, is doing goth, I had no idea. Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, wow.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

Huh.

[Interviewer]

Well, then she's been working lately. Not exclusively, but she works with this fashion. I guess they're like a fashion duo called Fecal Matter.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, I've seen them on Instagram. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

But they've Been doing Lady Gaga's stage wear.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, okay.

[Interviewer]

So imagine you get the biggest pop star in the world working with truly outsider fashion people in fecal matter. You have this marriage now of like the true outsider culture meeting the true insider culture. And everybody has opinions on both. You know, obviously, insider art world is always going to dominate just by numbers.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

There's always going to be an opposition party just because people like us go, well, I'm not going to do that. I want to do my own deal. But I think it's a sort of a beautiful marriage. But, you know, here we are, you know, 40 years after the release of this moment where, you know, you hit this kind of peak apotheosis of there's the video, there's you, there's the song, there's this burgeoning kind of form of music which we now would generally call goth.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And your version of it, not to overly personalize it, but your version of it, the LA version, I think, is a lot, lot more influential than people realize, which is one of the reasons I wanted to talk to you, because I think. I think it's easy. Easier for me now as a fan of music, to look back and I could see the through thread all the way back to you. And then when I get back to you, there's nobody before you.

[Patrick Mata]

Exactly. Yeah, I know that. And it's not an ego trip. Again, it's a fact.

[Interviewer]

That's a fact. So that's what I want people, not only to hear your music, but also understand your contribution here because the wellspring of that is pretty vast at this point.

[Patrick Mata]

Thank you.

[Interviewer]

Because I think it's easier, and maybe it's because of America's Anglophile issues, we tend to sort of lean into people with British accents and not always understand what we've created in our own.

[Patrick Mata]

That's an interesting thing to say.

[Interviewer]

Like, in my. In my musical life, we were certainly influenced by UK shoegaze.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, okay.

[Interviewer]

But we did it. A very American version of it, which in many ways turned out to be just as influential in a different way because we grew up listening to, I don't know, American rock.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Where people in the. In the UK and. Do you ever listen to My Bloody Balance on. You know.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

I just was. It didn't touch me much. I'm not. You guys in.

[Interviewer]

But it was. But it's just who they are. Yeah. But as a quick aside, Kevin Shields, the guitar player.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. He's amazing.

[Interviewer]

Right.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, like we did with Bobby Gillespie and Primal Scream, I Love the remixes.

[Interviewer]

Fantastic. So. So my point of telling you this is just like, we're sitting around listening to records. When I got to know Kevin, I couldn't understand why I was more attracted to My Bloody Valentine than, say, some of the other great uk. Sure. Well, Kevin had grown up in America.

[Patrick Mata]

I didn't know that.

[Interviewer]

Born in England, spent 16 years or so of his life living in, like, New Jersey and then moved back. So he. Like, we had been influenced by, you know, Rick Derringer, you know. You know, riffy rock.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. But for me. Interject.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, please.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. My influences were all UK rock. I was totally Anglophile. I was a major Anglophile because of the Beatles.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

And the British Invasion.

[Interviewer]

Sure.

[Patrick Mata]

I collected all that stuff. Like I said, my mom managed the records store, and when the releases came out, she would bring the promos home. Yeah. Like, I heard the first who album that way.

[Interviewer]

Right.

[Patrick Mata]

I skipped school to skip school, and I was a child. And the who were on the Today show. They were broadcasting from England because it was a big deal then.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. So they played in the park. They did the kids. All right. And I went, oh, my God, this is amazing. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

To this day, true pop art, too.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. It's total art. Because Townsend was an artist. Yeah. That without him, they would have been nothing. It would have been another, like, Trogs or something.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

But that. That was my inspiration was UK rock.

[Interviewer]

But. But again, similar story. It's like, it's. It's. Yes, there's an influence, but somehow the American take on it takes it into a different direction.

[Patrick Mata]

Development.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

Interpretation.

[Interviewer]

I'm just riffing here, but do you think there's this sort of. Is it something about the American ethos that Cyrus sort of takes into a different direction?

[Patrick Mata]

I think so.

[Interviewer]

Can you. Can you define maybe how that influenced you?

[Patrick Mata]

Well, again, you reminded me of things that I hadn't thought of for a while. Other influences. Harry Parts created his own scale, his own instruments. I mean, I thought, that's incredible. You know, I didn't want to do that. I wouldn't know where to start, you know, But. But noise as background is something that interests me.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

So that's why we just let the synthesizer do its thing.

[Interviewer]

Sure.

[Patrick Mata]

And. And we would really, at random, just. Just do things, and we couldn't repeat it, you know, so we. The next show we do now, to repeat it, you sample it and then you play.

[Interviewer]

Right, right.

[Patrick Mata]

And there it is. It sounds just like the record, you know, kind of thing. But I don't know. I I don't know what to say about that. Go ahead.

[Interviewer]

No, I just. Because I. I do say.

[Patrick Mata]

I understand. Please. American ethos. Yeah, yeah. But again, I think it's all interpretation, how you see it as an individual. Again, it's individualism. You. You interpret that. How could anyone else.

[Interviewer]

Let me give you. Let me give you.

[Patrick Mata]

How could there be another Billy Corgan? There couldn't be. Sure.

[Interviewer]

But let me give you one take. Because I've had a lot of discussions through the years with my British counterparts. They would sometimes come see us play, or we talk to them after a gig or something, and they'd say, why? Like, you guys are so aggressive or you guys are so much bolder? Because it makes cultural differences. Yeah. Like, they'd almost be shocked at, like, the guitar aggression or.

[Patrick Mata]

I've heard that, like.

[Interviewer]

Like, it. Like, they. There was always some magical line for them. Like, you wouldn't, like, cross a certain line.

[Patrick Mata]

I've heard that. You know. Yeah. Why are you guys so aggro? You know, I've heard that.

[Interviewer]

Like, I remember when I. When I. The first time I met Daniel Ash from Bauhaus and leave.

[Patrick Mata]

And I met him. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Beautiful guy. And. And I was trying to understand his guitar sound, and he was looking at me like. Like, no one's ever asked me that question. And it's like, I'm. I'm like, you know, I grew up in the Midwest. It's like, how do you. How do you make that sound? You know what I mean? I wanted to know what amp he was using, what guitar? And he was like, I always just use this amp, you know, this Vox amp that I've had.

[Patrick Mata]

Wow.

[Interviewer]

And I. And I go, even, like, Bauhaus and Love and Rockets. He goes, yeah, it's the same transistor amp that I used all along. And I go, do you take that amp on tour? He goes, yeah. Like, why wouldn't I go? I go, like that amp. You take that amp on tour? Like, you don't leave it at home. He's like, no, it's just a stupid amp. But in my mind, the American ethos would be like, oh, my God. You know, it's this precious thing.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. Well, let me tell you. I have a story for you.

[Interviewer]

Please share.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. In 84, I was invited to go to England. We were touring with Sex Gang Children, which were a great band. And so I got to see Sex Gang Children every night when we played with them. They were amazing then. And the road manager goes, you gotta come to England, man. You know, yeah, we don't want the band. We want you.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Patrick Mata]

So I. I thought about it, and there was some turmoil in the band between members going on, and I was kind of getting unhappy, and I was frustrated, and they didn't know things that I knew that was going on and said, I. It really hurt me. And so I thought, you know what? These guys. I'm gonna. I'm gonna go to England for a little while. So I went to Northampton, where Bauhaus is from, and this guy discovered Bauhaus. I did not know that. He took their very first video at the White Elephant Pub, and he showed it to me. It's all VHS days. And so he showed it to me at all these films of Bauhaus in the early days that he shot himself in black and white. I'm like, oh, my God. You know? And so one night, I'm living with him, his family, at this house in Northampton, and it's raining and all this stuff. It's beautiful English weather. I love the rain. And there's a knock at the door, and it's Kevin Haskins and Danny. And so they come in. They go, we want to meet your friend. Yeah. So I go, cool. You know? And so they come in, yeah. And we shake hands. We do all the things. And then he goes, I saw you. I heard you have this guitar. Can I see your guitar? And I thought, oh, God, he doesn't

[Interviewer]

want to meet me.

[Patrick Mata]

He doesn't see my guitar. So I bring out my Fender. I had a Fender 6512, original stock with the headstock that goes bent like this kind of beautiful guitar.

[Interviewer]

I was gonna ask you that question because I want to know what you played.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, that's what I played for years. And I had it since I was 19. And so I show it to him and can I play it? Yeah, yeah. So he picks it up, he plays it. He goes, oh, this is beautiful. Great action. I love this guitar. He pulls out a wad of money and goes, I'd love to buy this. Will you please sell me your guitar? I said, no, I'm not gonna say my guitar. I don't care who you are, you know, I told him this, you know, and he respected me for. Yeah. You know, I go, okay. You know, And I said, what are you doing? Because. Well, we're starting a new band. It's called Love and Rockets. That's the name we have right now.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

I said, well, okay. So he tried to buy my guitar off me, that guy. And I said, no way. You know. So eventually, though, it was stolen, so.

[Interviewer]

Really?

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. Some junkie girl found out where my guitar was, and then I come looking for it, and it was gone.

[Interviewer]

Oh.

[Patrick Mata]

To this day, I don't know where that.

[Interviewer]

And if you hear this story, I had a guitar stolen that was gone for 27 years, and it came resurfaced.

[Patrick Mata]

I heard about that. What'd you do? What'd you think?

[Interviewer]

It was like a dream. I couldn't. And the guy got it for me, and he didn't want anything.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, how did he feel about it?

[Interviewer]

He gave me a story, and I don't. Let's just say I choose to believe his story, but I don't know if his story's true.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

I mean, forever in the guy's debt because he's a beautiful man and he gave me my guitar back.

[Patrick Mata]

There you go.

[Interviewer]

It was like finding a sword or something, you know? It was like the original this is

[Patrick Mata]

Made for Me by Samurai.

[Interviewer]

It was like, there's my. There's my. Like, if you. If you said pick one guitar to bury you with, that would be the guitar.

[Patrick Mata]

That would have been my guitar.

[Interviewer]

That's the one in my mind. That's like, my guitar got it all. I love all the other ones, but that's my guitar. Right?

[Patrick Mata]

I do.

[Interviewer]

So when you say that, it, like, hurts my heart. And I hope that day will come when you do it.

[Patrick Mata]

I hope so. I hope you're right, my friend. I hope so, man.

[Interviewer]

God bless. I'll look out there for it.

[Patrick Mata]

Please send me some vibes.

[Interviewer]

What was the color? What was the color?

[Patrick Mata]

It was Sunburst.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Patrick Mata]

Beautiful. It's the same one that Johnny Winter used at Woodstock. The same one Townsend used on Tommy. I've seen the photos of these guys playing exactly 65. 65. And it was all. I didn't do anything to it. I didn't know to do anything to it. You know, I just played it the way it was. An amazing tone.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Well, I love that sound. That's why the nerd in me wanted to ask just a quick. A few other things, and then I want to sort of talk about the present. First time I heard Christian Death, I was friends with this kid who was an early. Early kind of death rock kid, dressed amazingly, always wore suits. At 14 years old, this kid just happened to be listening all this stuff out la. And I remember being in his bedroom hearing Christian Death. And it was like that thing of, like, first album. Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

You know, classic.

[Interviewer]

And you're just like, what is. What is this?

[Patrick Mata]

You know, Ras, man, I miss that guy.

[Interviewer]

Talk a little bit about Roz, because Roz is one of those guys who gets a little lost in history. I mean, people know if you know music, you know Ras. But I'm saying, until people don't know about Christian, early Christian death in Roz, please talk about him.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, here's the funny thing. We never played the same shows together. We were too proud. And one day, one. One weekend, Josh was there. We were all in San Francisco. We played amazing show. I remember driving up to this. We were looking for the club that we were playing at, and we drove up, and there's this line going all the way around the block, and we're like, wonder what's going on there. And then we park and we go, dude, you're playing there. I'm like, what? The place was packed. I'm like, wow. We had to walk through the crowd to get to the stage. And the next day after the show, we're looking for somewhere to eat on the opposite side of the street. Like a black caterpillar. Roz and his friends and his entourage were going the opposite direction. And we look at each other. Hey. I had no idea he was in town. He had no idea I was in town. If we had known, we would have played the same show, you know, that would have been amazing. But Roz and I, he was really shy, and we weren't really friends at first. Again, it's two artists entree artists, doing our own thing, our own sound and all that stuff, you know, and he didn't plan anything. I didn't plan anything. It just was happening. But we respected each other from afar, and I heard that through the grapevine, like you probably had in your time, where people go, that Bill, Billy's really great. I mean, Patrick's really great. Roz is awesome, you know, and it's cool to be liked by your peers. Yeah. So we later became friends in the 90s. It took that long for us to become friends. And so we started hanging out. And he was so sensitive and so shy and very funny. Very funny guy. Very smart. A great artist. He did. Because of the daddess, I really got into collagen and, you know, Sophie Tauber and Hannah Hawk, you know, there were some of my inspirations, and he. His too. I had no idea. And he had some beautiful pieces, and he wanted to give me one. I couldn't take it. So, you know, he said, well, when you wanted, you can have it. And. But the way that he did his thing was incredible because he would write the music in his head and he would say it to people. This is what I had discovered.

[Interviewer]

Oh, okay.

[Patrick Mata]

Someone probably tell me that wasn't the way it was, because I'm sure there are a lot of instances where he wasn't that way. Yeah, but there were some ways where he would do that. Like Captain Beefheart used to do that.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Patrick Mata]

Trout Mask was told to all the musicians. They. They didn't contribute anything. It was all him. His ideas, Captain Be Part's ideas for Trout Mass Replica. Yeah, that's how that record was made. You know, I thought, wow, so there's another inspiration. But finally, later on, something started to happen with him. I could see he wasn't very happy and things were going on. His career was. Was weird. So one Christmas day, I think it was on Christmas, he got kicked out of his house. He was with Eva O at the time. You know, Eva O, The Superheroes. And they were married for a while, and so they needed a place to crash. I said, we can stay in my flat, you know. So he goes, well, I can't pay you any rent or anything. I said, well, yeah, you don't have to. He goes, I'll give you a tattoo. I said, well, I was willing to give me a tattoo.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Patrick Mata]

You know, so he gave me a jailhouse tattoo. It's Indian ink and a needle, a pen. Just did a tattoo. I mean, I obviously still have it, but people always want to know about it. They want to talk about it. And so that gives me a chance to tell Ross's story a little bit. And I loved him. I thought he was a great man. A great.

[Interviewer]

I'm so happy to hear that, because I saw Roz play once. It was when he was out of Christian Death. Yeah, he come. He'd come to.

[Patrick Mata]

Did you like that work solo stuff?

[Interviewer]

You know, I. To be honest, I haven't spent as much time listening to it as I should. I can be a little slow sometimes, but you're busy. It's not that. It's just. It's almost like a form of stubbornness.

[Patrick Mata]

Really?

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

Why?

[Interviewer]

That's a fantastic question. I think sometimes it's a sense of like, I've gotten enough from you, and I'm. I don't want to be. I don't want to get more influenced by it. I went back, okay. It's kind of like. It's not so much like that I got what I needed. It's like. It's almost like I don't want to get too close to that Sun, I understand.

[Patrick Mata]

I'm the same way. I'm the same. But remember I told you before, back in the pre digital days, I couldn't listen to any records if I had a song idea.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

I had to log.

[Interviewer]

If you think about. It's actually a reverse form of respect, right. It's like. It's like, I don't want to fall under your thrall.

[Patrick Mata]

Understood.

[Interviewer]

Because I get what makes you who you are. And maybe the rest of the world doesn't understand, but I understand because I love to talk with musicians about who we really know is the real deal, the real gangsters.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, yeah.

[Interviewer]

Oh, yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

I've met a few, right?

[Interviewer]

And we all sit backstage at some point, we go, well, that one's a fraud and that one's pretender.

[Patrick Mata]

But that mother, huh?

[Interviewer]

And Roz was one of those.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, he's one of those, mother. No doubt about it.

[Interviewer]

So just to tell you the story, because it'll make you laugh. I hope so. It's. It's some club and it's like, you know, I go in, I got my ticket, whatever, and it's like, there's like 80 people there. So my heart breaks already because I. I'm aware that Roz is a significant artist, but, like, it's 80 people in some club in Chicago.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. He deserved better.

[Interviewer]

Absolutely. So there's Roz's horn.

[Patrick Mata]

He's saying, hey, man, I'm here.

[Interviewer]

God bless.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Anyway, so he's. He's. He's, you know, he's. He. I mean, to those who don't know Roz Williams, please look up Roz Williams, Music and Life. But it's weird when you see somebody in a club with 80 people and you're like, why isn't this guy playing an arena? His charisma and his magnetism was, like, bigger than the room. Like, you go, like, that guy's a star. Why is he playing in the club?

[Patrick Mata]

I totally get it, man.

[Interviewer]

Okay, Right. So I'm watching. The show's decent. His backing band's kind of okay. And he goes, I can't do a good imitation. He goes, I want to play a song by David Bowie from when he was good. This is Dodo.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, I love that song.

[Interviewer]

And they did Donut. I'll never forget the introduction. I want to play a song by David Bowie when he was good.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, I understand, though, because I've always thought that Diamond Dogs was like a first Death Rock record. It was very apocalypse.

[Interviewer]

That's a very interesting point.

[Patrick Mata]

I've always thought That I thought, well, why doesn't anyone say that about this record now?

[Interviewer]

So you're going to send me back to that record.

[Patrick Mata]

It's dark, it's apocalyptic, it's Barosian, you know, it's a perfect record. And he did most of the things himself.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

Because he had just split from the

[Interviewer]

Spiders and even playing the guitar.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, he's doing the guitar. He hired Alan Parker to do the Funky stuff for 1984.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

Because it was the. The time. It was the Spice.

[Interviewer]

Have you ever met Mike Carson, Bowie's penis?

[Patrick Mata]

No, I. I wrote him once when I was working with Martin Atkins and I wanted him to play on one of my tracks. And he goes, well, 800, I'll do it. They wouldn't. They wouldn't give him the money.

[Interviewer]

So this is. Who knows when this airs, but Mike's 80th birthday from when we're taping is coming up soon.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, wow.

[Interviewer]

And I think it's somewhere in January. And I'm gonna go play, so.

[Patrick Mata]

No way.

[Interviewer]

Maybe if you want to come in, I'll introduce you to Mike. I'd love to. Mike's amazing.

[Patrick Mata]

Sure.

[Interviewer]

I met Mike when he was touring with bowie in the 90s, and we've been friends, and Mike played with the Pumpkins for a while. And really, Mike is unbelievable.

[Patrick Mata]

Wow.

[Interviewer]

I know.

[Patrick Mata]

He was a Scientologist for a while.

[Interviewer]

He was. He got out. But, you know, he was playing Genoanette Peacock.

[Patrick Mata]

Of course. I have a first album.

[Interviewer]

Okay. So Mike played on that record.

[Patrick Mata]

That's right.

[Interviewer]

And that's how Bowie found Mike and said, I want that.

[Patrick Mata]

Yes. He was very experimental.

[Interviewer]

And Bowie also lifted a lot from Annette Peacock, if anybody wants to go down that rabbit hole. Right.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Right.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, I never thought of that.

[Interviewer]

So he was like, oh, I'll take Mike. So then suddenly Mike's playing in the Spiders from Mars.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, yeah, I remember all of that.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

I used to read the magazines and stuff and collect all the records.

[Interviewer]

Mike's 80 years about to turn 80, and his musicality is completely intact.

[Patrick Mata]

Wow. He's still.

[Interviewer]

And he's a total improvisational pianist. I don't know if you know that about.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, I do.

[Interviewer]

He literally can't play the same thing twice. I mean, he can sight read something, but if you just say, play that song again. He can't. He. He's so. He's lived in that brain so long, he literally can't play the same thing.

[Patrick Mata]

I understand. I totally get that.

[Interviewer]

And him and David, he played. He's the Musician that played the most with David.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And their connection was very, very deep. And that musical connection. And what did. What did Mike bring that chaos. That's where literally he'd throw. He'd throw at a singer of David's level. Here's a little Gershwin, Here's a little Liberace. Here's a little bit of Beethoven. And David could surf that wave with Mike. It's a beautif. So I would love to introduce you to Mike.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, I'd love to meet him.

[Interviewer]

Okay. Let's bring this beautiful story to a close. Not because there isn't more. Because my point here would be, if I have any self interest, would be to introduce you to people who don't know your work so that your future continues to be vibrant. Because I know you're still making music.

[Patrick Mata]

Oh, yeah.

[Interviewer]

So two questions. Where's your brain at now for performance? How you fit into this new crazy world that we're in? You know, let's call it the digital sphere. You know, how do you. How do you interrelate with that?

[Patrick Mata]

Well, sure, I have my own studio at home out of the box kind of thing. I can't really afford a big studio and all that stuff, but I'm okay with that. I like the minimalism of it and the minimalism of it. I like it and I don't like it. I'm more of an analog type person. If I had more opportunity to go into a studio and do 2 inch tape, I would do that tomorrow. I mean, one of the things I'd love to do is just go in the studio because I have all these ideas and I've got stuff in the cans and just throw it out there as a basic. And then at that moment, just do whatever happens. I don't have that opportunity, but everyone else does. And that's why I think music sucks now. A lot of it sucks to me. I'm not that, you know, whatever. Keith, you don't like that. I'm serious. I. I really feel that way.

[Interviewer]

Once a punk, always a punk.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, I don't know. I'm not trying to be a punk. That's just the way I feel.

[Interviewer]

I'm just laughing.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, listen to. Listen to, you know, what's going on.

[Interviewer]

I think we all have. I. I can't speak for everybody, but there seems.

[Patrick Mata]

No, I don't mean that. No.

[Interviewer]

But I'm saying there seems to be a general consensus that something has happened in music in the digital age that's not always good for music. Maybe that's A nice way to put it.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. Yeah. Well, yeah. Okay. Nicely. There's some people still trying to do what we do, what I do, what you do. God bless them and I'm for them. But what gets to the top and to your face is it sucks. Like, you still have Iggy and he did his thing. Okay, I get it. Now he's doing. You know, he's repeating it for people that missed it. I get that. God bless him. But there's gotta be another one somewhere. Someone like that in the Midwest, maybe somewhere doing his thing to 80 people, maybe less, who's got something to say.

[Interviewer]

Well, there's always going to be that person.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I champion those people. I haven't seen them yet, and I haven't seen anyone who does what we're doing like that. But my thing is to continue doing this because that's all I know how to do.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

Not a shoe salesman. You know, I'm not a hair stylist. I mean, this is what I do. So I'm going to just keep doing the way. Any way I can. Any way I can. Any noise that fits, I'm just going to keep doing it.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. You know, and the other question I

[Patrick Mata]

had, no matter what time it is, what era it is.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Well, I think that's if the digital. The one thing I've noticed and see if you've noticed it too, and I'm trying to give it a visual image, but I feel like we're in this new era where music is almost kind of feeding back into itself, maybe because in the old days you'd have to go to the record store and get the record or your cousin would have the record. But now, because of. Of anybody can access anything. It's almost like you see kids being influenced by stuff from so many different eras. Like, it's not linear like it used to be.

[Patrick Mata]

I understand. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So I think if there's any advantage, it's like. Like currently right now, my audience or the band's audience is. Is. Is half of. It's under 35. So they're finding us somehow.

[Patrick Mata]

How do you know that?

[Interviewer]

Because you get the statistics from the streaming service.

[Patrick Mata]

I've never thought about statistics.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, you can literally get the. Now, I don't want to look at them because I don't want to think about that. But somebody writes me an email and says, can you believe this? And it's like. And I tell them I don't want to hear any bad news. So they only reach out if they got something good. To say. And I thought, well, now that's an interesting thing because for many years I saw where the audience was just aging, as you would expect, and all of a sudden, boom. There's just all these young people.

[Patrick Mata]

What about in the 90s for you, though? I mean, do you know the stats about that, what your audience was in the 90s?

[Interviewer]

Well, I could. When you were making your records empirically, I mean, just from looking at it, it was, you know, let's say at the band's peak in the mid-90s, you're probably looking at 14 to 25. Would have been 80% of the audience. And you got some people who were like older or your generation, ish, would come around because they just, they like, you know, there are people as they age, they still want to hear new music.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, well, I do too, you know.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Mata]

Don't get me wrong.

[Interviewer]

No, no, I don't mean it like that. I'm saying is, it's, it's just. It was a natural extension, but it was very heavily youth at the time. Driven by mtv.

[Patrick Mata]

That's right.

[Interviewer]

And what became alternative radio. One interesting statistic. In 1991, when our first album came out, there were only seven alternative stations in America. And by the peak of the 90s, I think it was over 160, 180 alternative stations.

[Patrick Mata]

Wow.

[Interviewer]

Just in that short amount of time, they literally had to build a new infrastructure to take advantage of rock. Yeah, sorry, alternative rock or whatever, going mainstream.

[Patrick Mata]

So.

[Interviewer]

Last thing I want to ask you, and I so appreciate you talking to me, feelings mutual. Thank you. If you could define your, your, Your production style. Because I, I feel, you know, because I, I've listened to, you know, recent records as well, and it's. It strikes me that you have a particular approach to production. Could she, could you quantify that for me?

[Patrick Mata]

It's not very good. It could be better, actually.

[Interviewer]

I would argue, I would say technically. Yeah, as a nerd, I can certainly see where, you know, this could have been a better recorded. But, but, but somehow I think your, your, your foundational base, the database. It also lends opportunities that someone that's more organized in that. In that realm would never do because I would sort of overthink it. So I, I do you do stuff fast or like, is there a production aesthetic? I know that's a weird way to put it, but I, but I also think that's part of your story.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, here's the thing. I was asked recently to co write a song with a band called Beauty and Chaos. And they're like a studio band. And the last record they made, they had different vocalists contribute co compositions for this one album. And so when they sent me this instrumental with my minimal out of the box recording studio, I laid down all the vocals, I wrote the lyrics, I did the melodies, and I did one pass and they said, okay, okay, almost there. Did a second pass and it was perfect. And I did that just on my own and didn't think about production value or anything like that. And it came out great. So again, it's that thing where sometimes it's a happenstance. Oh, it came out great. Oh, this one didn't come out so good. I wonder why. You know, maybe I didn't pay enough attention to it or maybe I wasn't thinking about. I wanted to do this thing that Bowie did on an album on my voice or something like that, I think. Like that. I think, well, that's a great technique. Now, I'm not going to steal it, but I'd sure like to figure out how to do it. Like phasing. I wish I could do phasing. I love that sound.

[Interviewer]

Well, you could do programs in the box now. I don't know if you know about that, if you're against the box, but,

[Patrick Mata]

yeah, I wouldn't know. I wouldn't know.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, they have. Literally have every program now.

[Patrick Mata]

Okay.

[Interviewer]

They have. This is how crazy it's gotten. You can. You can. If you do plugins on in, say, Pro Tools, you can get not only the reverb chambers that the Beatles used, you can move the mics around in the room. So they have Capitol Records. So you can get the Beach Boys, you can get the Beach Boy, but you can get all the reverbs, all the effects that they used. You can get them all. And they're digital copies, obviously, but they're digital copies of all the effects that they used. So you can get Lennon's vocal doubling thing, the adt. Yeah, there's a program and it sounds just like it. I mean, Is it exactly 100%? No, but it's probably 94%. So you have access to all this new technology. But what blew my mind was using some of the Abbey Road and some of the Capitol Records reverbs. Because I was like, well, there's the God only knows reverb. I've been looking for that reverb my whole life. And there it is. Punch a button and there it is.

[Patrick Mata]

Yeah, I know what you're talking about.

[Interviewer]

So you're like magic, okay? That's the magical stuff. So for me. That's what I like about the digital realm. But, but I also love that there's a part of you that doesn't get stuck in process. Yeah, I don't, but I like that because I, that. See, I'm saying I wish I was more like that.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, you're like you said, you're an architect. You think a lot.

[Interviewer]

A nerd, I call it.

[Patrick Mata]

Well, that's fine, you know, that's fine. Some of my friends are nerds. But, but I, I'm more, I'm more naked. I'm more minimal. I, I, I don't know why that is. It's just the way I am. And I just like it simple. I just like it simple. Four tracks. You just give me four tracks and I'll do all kinds of things to that.

[Interviewer]

I love it.

[Patrick Mata]

So I don't know that I'm fine with the new world and fine with the digital and all that stuff. I just miss the analog experience. It's more feeling and it's more, it's the more magical element. It's not so sterile. It's kind of sterile to me.

[Interviewer]

I get it. I get it.

[Patrick Mata]

So thank you. Thank you, sir. Appreciate you.