Peter Asher | The Magnificent Others with Billy Corgan

Summary

The Magnificent Others with Billy Corgan

Episode: Peter Asher
Date: August 5, 2026

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Overview

In this episode, Billy Corgan welcomes Peter Asher—iconic musician, record producer, and industry insider—for a rich, reflective conversation about his multifaceted journey through the worlds of pop stardom and record production. They discuss Asher’s experiences with Peter & Gordon, his evolution into a producer, his integral roles working with legends like James Taylor and Linda Ronstadt, his insider ties with the Beatles, and his ongoing perspective on the ever-changing landscape of music. The tone is candid, insightful, and often nostalgic, featuring lively anecdotes and deep dives into pivotal career moments.

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Key Discussion Points

1. From Peter & Gordon to Producer (00:56–08:03)

• Asher reflects on his career shift from performer to producer, noting the appeal of shaping music behind the scenes.
  • "Once I discovered what a record producer could do...that you could hire musicians vastly better than yourself and tell them what to play. I thought that was brilliant." (Peter Asher, 00:56)
• The breakup with Gordon was gradual and amicable, with no dramatic fallout—more a drifting into separate ventures than a formal split.
  • "We never had any kind of Everly Brothers style actual bust ups...We gradually started doing other things." (Peter Asher, 02:18)
• Their eventual reunion decades later was thanks to Paul Shaffer organizing a benefit concert.
• Early steps into production, working with friends like Paul Jones of Manfred Mann, led to further ambitions.

2. The Apple Records Years & Beatles Connections (07:12–15:55)

• Peter joined Apple Records as Head of A&R at Paul McCartney’s suggestion, handling a flood of global submissions.
• Narrates signing artists like Mary Hopkin (discovered via TV and a tip from Twiggy), and producing talents like Jackie Lomax.
  • "Paul already knew the song he was gonna do with her...he said, I want to do that song with Mary. Let's find the song classic." (Peter Asher, 09:47)
• Discusses the lack of standout "demo" mail-ins, but mentions George Harrison's enthusiasm for the eccentric Brute Force.
• Asher’s unique viewpoint as both a participant and observer of Beatles’ inner worlds.

3. Discovering and Managing James Taylor (11:27–20:35)

• The chance meeting orchestrated by Danny "Cooch" Korchmar led to Asher’s lifelong association with James Taylor.
  • "James called me out of the blue, introduced himself as Cooch's friend, came over... and played me a couple of songs and life changed forever." (Peter Asher, 12:31)
• On first hearing Taylor’s demo: "This guy is completely amazing...his guitar playing was extremely unusual...and then his harmonic sense..." (Peter Asher, 13:14)
• Brought Taylor to Apple, had him audition for George and Paul, and produced his debut album.
  • "James played them a couple of songs and they kind of went, yeah, sign him, produce him. And I did." (Peter Asher, 15:11)
• Transitioned to Taylor’s manager when Taylor returned to America, leading Asher into the US music scene.
• Comments on Taylor’s journey through addiction to stability, and on the public’s perception of his artistry and personality.

4. Pioneering the '70s LA Sound and Working with Legends (21:18–34:33)

• Produced and managed Linda Ronstadt, helping her break through as a solo artist, describing her as fiercely smart and talented.
  • "She had this extraordinary voice...complete pitch command." (Peter Asher, 31:35)
  • Ronstadt’s initial lack of industry respect and rumors of being “difficult” were rooted in sexism and her refusal to be managed.
  • The major breakthrough came with "You're No Good,” driven by Asher's collaboration with multi-instrumentalist Andrew Gold.
  • "We worked a couple of days on [‘You're No Good’] in the studio and you kind of go, if this isn't a hit, I don't know what is." (Peter Asher, 33:59)
• Laid the sonic template for “Yacht Rock” and the LA studio sound by assembling talent like Carole King, Russ Kunkel, and others.
• Asher’s approach: clarity, balance, and giving musicians public credit, which was unusual at the time.
  • "I really liked records where each sound and each part fit into an overall picture." (Peter Asher, 22:24)

5. Artistic Ego, Role Changes, and Reflections (23:30–26:52)

• Corgan and Asher talk about the mental shift from being in the spotlight to supporting others.
  • "It's not often that somebody will take themselves out of the spotlight and make it about somebody else." (Corgan, 24:44)
  • Asher: "I was happy to be known when I wasn't on stage...When Rolling Stone put me on the [cover] I went, yes, please." (Peter Asher, 24:39)
  • Moving from “Gordon and Peter” to “Peter and Gordon” was an EMI marketing decision, not an ego play.

6. The LA Scene, Family, and Unexpected Turns (26:52–31:04)

• Asher relishes the contrast between “gloomy old England” and the burgeoning sunshine and creative freedom of LA.
• Anecdotes of transitioning from "bicycling home in the rain" in England to "driving down Sunset Boulevard in a rented Mustang convertible, being recognized by beautiful women." (Peter Asher, 27:21)
• Touches on pursuing management roles with James Taylor and Linda Ronstadt, and navigating their early solo careers amid shifting industry perceptions.

7. Working with Unique Voices: Common Threads (39:13–42:30)

• Corgan prompts Asher about his collaborations with world-class singers (Diana Ross, Olivia Newton-John, Cher, Barbra Streisand, etc.).
• Asher pinpoints “one-of-a-kindness,” unique tonality, and instant recognizability as the linking traits of great vocalists.
  • "I find myself particularly drawn to singers who are instantly identifiable..." (Peter Asher, 39:32)
• Recounts surreal moments of hearing iconic voices firsthand in studio settings.

8. Family Background and Early Influences (42:30–47:17)

• Peter shares tidbits about his family's intellectual and artistic environment—dad was an endocrinologist and identified Munchausen syndrome; mom a music professor who taught George Martin.
• Started acting at age 8, acting with the likes of Boris Karloff and John Mills.
  • Humorous details about child acting days and his family’s red-haired “look.”

9. Beatles Proximity, Iconic Moments, and Songwriting Stories (48:46–58:42)

• The famous anecdote of Paul McCartney moving into the Asher family home and writing “I Want to Hold Your Hand” with Lennon in their basement.
  • “They sat side by side on the piano bench and hammered out...what was...written on the piano. And they played it to me and asked what I thought.” (Peter Asher, 51:56)
• On McCartney’s gift of “World Without Love” to Peter & Gordon and how the bridge was written last minute.
• The “Bernard Webb” pseudonym experiment for a McCartney-penned Peter & Gordon single; why they tried to mask Paul’s authorship.

10. Recording Techniques and 1960s Studio Culture (63:30–66:14)

• Detailed rundown of Abbey Road session routines: £9 per three-hour session, live vocals on one mic, figure-eight Neumann setup.
• Musicians’ credits, acoustic guitar work, and the roles of producers and arrangers.
• “I still think that there’s something about...singing into the same physical capsule...your voices are internally conjoined...” (Peter Asher, 64:48)

11. The Beatlemania Effect and Legacy (73:10–76:19)

• Asher discusses the whirlwind of 1960s fame: American audiences mimicking Beatlemania hysteria, unforgettable gigs like the New York World’s Fair.
• Recognition that none of the artists of that era imagined their music would have such lasting resonance.
  • “There was an absolute conviction that this had a finite timeline...nobody could have foreseen...the music [would have] a whole new respect and a whole new analytical figuring out going on.” (Peter Asher, 74:29)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Appeal of Producing:
  • "My reaction was kind of, how do I get in on that racket? And I loved the idea...you could try out different arrangement ideas." (Peter Asher, 05:56)
• On the “Peter and Gordon” Breakup:
  • "We never had any kind of Everly Brothers style actual bust ups...We just started doing other things." (Peter Asher, 02:18)
• On McCartney’s Impact and Generosity:
  • "Paul made me a demo...it was unfinished and he explained that he didn’t finish it because John didn’t like it...I said, we really want to do that song, it needs a bridge...he went into his bedroom with his guitar and came out a few minutes later..." (Peter Asher, 58:02)
• On Studio Culture in the '60s:
  • “We usually sang together on one mic...your voices are internally conjoined and that balance is the balance.” (Peter Asher, 64:35)
• On Transformation and American Success:
  • "I remember distinctly...I was driving down Sunset Boulevard in a rented Mustang convertible, being recognized by beautiful women. I kind of went, this is a little bit better. This is an improvement." (Peter Asher, 27:21)
• On Iconic Singers:
  • "It is that one-of-a-kindness that is the link...instantly identifiable..." (Peter Asher, 39:32)
• On Enduring Legacy:
  • “Somebody asks the question, what are you gonna do when this is all over? Cause it was an absolute conviction that this had a finite timeline...nobody could have foreseen...the music is a whole new respect and analytical figuring out going on.” (Peter Asher, 74:45)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Segment | Timestamp | |------------------------------------------------|-------------| | Producer Ambitions, Peter & Gordon split | 00:56–04:38 | | Apple Records, Beatles involvement | 07:12–15:55 | | Discovery & management of James Taylor | 11:27–20:35 | | LA sound & Linda Ronstadt | 21:18–34:33 | | Reflections on ego & role changes | 23:30–26:52 | | Family, acting, and formative years | 42:30–47:17 | | Beatles anecdotes, “I Want to Hold Your Hand” | 48:46–53:21 | | Abbey Road/1960s studio methods | 63:30–66:14 | | Beatlemania, '60s music legacy | 73:10–76:19 |

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Final Thoughts

This conversation is a treasure trove for music history fans, recording geeks, and anyone interested in the interplay between stardom, creativity, and the shifting roles behind great music. Asher’s stories illuminate not only pivotal moments but broader truths about artistic ego, serendipity, and the hands-on art of turning talent into legacy.

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To hear Peter Asher’s deep dives into music history, including the Beatles, check out his show on SiriusXM. Asher’s passion and memory for musical details shine through every anecdote—a living testament to the era he helped shape.

Transcript

[Interviewer]

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[Peter Asher]

Once I discovered what a record producer could do, you know, that you could hire musicians vastly better than yourself and tell them what to play. I thought that was brilliant.

[Interviewer]

It's not, not often that somebody will take themselves out of the spotlight and make it about somebody else.

[Peter Asher]

That's true, I suppose. Yeah. But that's what I was determined to do.

[Interviewer]

We could literally just talk for hours about you as a producer.

[Peter Asher]

That era that we were on stage when it was all about screaming girls and stuff.

[Interviewer]

Oh, yeah, that was the last. You guys had the best era of them all.

[Peter Asher]

We did. We enjoyed ourselves.

[Interviewer]

And somewhere in your story, Paul McCartney moves into your house.

[Peter Asher]

I was driving down Sunset Boulevard in a rented Mustang convertible being recognized by beautiful women. I kind of went, this is a little bit better. This is an improvement.

[Interviewer]

Peter Asher, so nice to see you. Thank you for being here.

[Peter Asher]

Good to see you too. Thank you.

[Interviewer]

You know, we've had such an incredible, crazy life.

[Peter Asher]

We've been lucky.

[Interviewer]

Yes. But I found myself at 4 this morning as I was doing my research, like sort of, where do we begin? So I'll start here if that's okay. It's the breakup of you and your partner, Gordon. He's about 68.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

It seems like there was no sort of dramatic.

[Peter Asher]

No, there wasn't. In fact, we didn't ever break up as such.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Peter Asher]

You know, we never had any.

[Interviewer]

It just kind of stopped.

[Peter Asher]

We never had any kind of Everly Brothers style actual bust ups, let alone attacking each other on stage and all the crazy stuff they did. We gradually started doing other things. Gordon went to Australia for a while, he started acting. He was the original Joseph in Technicolor, original Pharaoh in Joseph and the King Cop. He was the one who did it like Elvis, which is always part of the part, because Gordon did a very good Elvis impersonation. And it wasn't really. It was 37 years or some ridiculous amount of time until we got back together. But as I say, we never actually said, we're never doing this again. But I admit, as the decades went by, I'd kind of naturally assumed, well, we're never doing that again. But we did. It was actually Paul Schaeffer and his wife who caused that to happen. They were doing a benefit, wanted to do a benefit for Paul Schaeffer's friend and our friend too, Mike. What's his name? Jesus. The keyboard player in The Dave Clark 5. Mike Smith, my guy who was a terrific keyboard player and had a terrible accident, fell off his roof and needed help. And Paul Schaeffer wanted to put the benefit together and Paul's wife Kathy said, you know, it would be great if you could get Peter and Gordon back together and do a 60s themed benefit. So he called me up and after a 37 year gap, it was evident to me that if we were ever going to do it, this would be the time, because Paul Schaefer could be relied upon to put a great band together. So we said yes.

[Interviewer]

So there was no sort of singular moment where you're like, okay, that's done.

[Peter Asher]

So the ending. No, the ending was very undramatic.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

We just started doing other things. Gordon wanted to be a solo act anyway, and so, no, there was no official breakout moment.

[Interviewer]

Right. You produced the guy from the Manfred Man.

[Peter Asher]

Paul Jones.

[Interviewer]

Paul Jones, right. Did that come before joining Apple as A and R, like.

[Peter Asher]

Yes, before, yeah.

[Interviewer]

Was that just something as a lark to do with a friend type of thing?

[Peter Asher]

No, no. What was interesting was, you know, I. Because people often ask how I became a record producer, how I became a manager, and they're terribly different because being a record producer was an actual concrete ambition of mine. I wanted to do that.

[Interviewer]

Oh, I didn't know that. Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

Because I'd very much enjoyed the process of making records with Peter and Gordon and gradually had gotten more and more involved in the actual production and decision making.

[Interviewer]

Who'd you work with? Who produced you guys? That's something I feel I should know, but I don't know.

[Peter Asher]

The first track, the initial big hit, World Without Love, was produced by a man called Norman Newell, who was best known as sort of middle of the road kind of productions. He produced the UK hit of Andy Williams, God, I'm Losing My Memory, I

[Interviewer]

Can't Help But Loving You.

[Peter Asher]

No, Moon River.

[Interviewer]

Oh, okay.

[Peter Asher]

Because, oddly enough, it was a person called Danny Williams who had the hit in England, not Andy Williams, but Norman produced that, and that was his first number one, I think. And he was recommended by emi, meaning not recommended. We were told by EMI that he was going to be the producer of our first record.

[Interviewer]

What was it about production that appealed to you so early on? As you know, most artists really don't care. Yes, they kind of care how it turns out, but they don't want to spend time measuring microphones.

[Peter Asher]

No, that's true, that's true. But once I discovered what a record producer could do, you know, that you could hire musicians vastly better than yourself and tell them what to play, I thought that was brilliant. My reaction was kind of, how do I get in on that racket? And. And I loved the idea of you could try out different arrangement ideas, make suggestions and things that worked and things that didn't work and stuff.

[Interviewer]

Were you a Manfred Band fan?

[Peter Asher]

Yes, I was. And a Paul Jones fan in particular. Paul was and is one of the best harmonic players in the world.

[Interviewer]

Very underrated band, I find. That's a band, maybe because in America they were known as the band that. When they were younger, obviously they were known as the. That had the hit with Quinn the Eskimo.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

So in America, the perception of man for man was almost kind of somewhat novelty. Ish.

[Peter Asher]

Well, it began, of course, with Do

[Interviewer]

I Diddy, but that's my point is the songs we heard on the radio in America were covered. The band didn't seem serious to us.

[Peter Asher]

That's right.

[Interviewer]

But they were serious, was a serious musician.

[Peter Asher]

And the various singers they've had, Mike d' Abbo and then originally Paul Jones.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

Were very good. So they all took it seriously.

[Interviewer]

So you've got one foot in production. You don't know you've broken up your band or your duo.

[Peter Asher]

Exactly. We know we're on a hiatus.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. And then you get the call from Apple, you know, do you want to come A and R. Yes. Can you walk me through that a little bit?

[Peter Asher]

Yes. Paul was aware of my ambitions as a record producer. And so the initial conversation with Paul, who I become friends with, because he was staying in our house, and that's a long story.

[Interviewer]

As you do.

[Peter Asher]

As you do.

[Interviewer]

You have a beetle living in the attic.

[Peter Asher]

And he. He asked me if I would produce some records for Apple and then subsequently adjusted that or made it a bigger offer in the sense that he said, do you want to be head of A and R? I think they'd sort of figured that the label should have somebody called head of A and R, because labels had, you know, something record labels always had. So I was very happy to take that role. And of course, you know, being offered a job by the Beatles was exciting anyway.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Was there like a meeting where you go sit in the boardroom with them, or was there.

[Peter Asher]

Yes, there were such meetings. I would try to have weekly A and R meetings with whatever we'd been sent, you know, which we were sent vast amounts of stuff.

[Interviewer]

I can't imagine. Everybody in the world probably wanted to be on Apple at that moment.

[Peter Asher]

Yes, I think so. And not only that, but we actively solicited submissions. We took an ad in the paper.

[Interviewer]

Oh, okay.

[Peter Asher]

Saying, send us your tapes, we will listen to them. And I had to have a staff of about six people to listen to.

[Interviewer]

Was there any great discovery that ever came in that way?

[Peter Asher]

No, it was disappointing. The submissions were not terribly good. George liked a guy who's called Brute Force, who sent us a tape called the King of Fur, which was a song which was I'm the King of Fur, I'm the Fur, which at the time was hilariously outrageous and got banned and everything. Yeah, of course.

[Interviewer]

Did that come out?

[Peter Asher]

That came out okay.

[Interviewer]

Brute Force was because I have some of the other. Like, it's Jackie. Jackie Lomax. That's. That's a good. That's a good record.

[Peter Asher]

Yes. You see, that didn't come in the submissions. Jackie was a friend of George's.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, but I'm saying is, there's, you know, obviously what happened with the Beatles kind of overshadows what happens with Apple as a. As a label. But there's. There was some credible stuff that came out. Apple, Yes.

[Peter Asher]

I mean, Jackie Lomax and of course, James and Mary Hopkin. Mary Hopkin, you know, which was entirely Paul's invention, was an example of Paul's extraordinary. The way his brain works is that, you know, Mary Hopkins. I don't know if you know that story of how we signed Mary Hopkins.

[Interviewer]

I know it a little bit, but I'm happy to hear it.

[Peter Asher]

She was on a talent show called Opportunity Knocks, a bit like, you know, American Idol or whatever, and she got voted on and survived week after week and became the sort of winner. And. And Paul, Twiggy, actually our friend Twiggy, the supermodel at the time when there were really Only one supermodel. And was only one supermodel. And it was her. And she called Paul to tell him that you should turn on his television to watch this girl. Paul called me. We all watched her. We loved her. And I think Derek Taylor and I and somebody else were dispatched to Wales to sign Mary, where she lived. And we had to convince her father, I think we weren't in the white slave trade, that we were respectable. And so we signed Mary. And at that time, Paul already knew the song he was gonna do with her. Wow. He'd heard the song those Were the Days. He'd heard by an American duo sung in a nightclub called the Blue angel some months previously.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Peter Asher]

And made a mental note of it as a terrific song. And he said, I want to do that song with Mary. Let's find the song classic. And that was all his idea. And then he had an arrangement done by this guy, Richard Hewson, who I recommended to do the James Taylor album, who was a friend of mine who was a jazz musician and classical conductor. And so he wrote the arrangement for those Were the Days and Paul produced the record. And it was a huge hit.

[Interviewer]

Huge hit. James Taylor kind of found you through somebody that knew you kind of thing.

[Peter Asher]

Cooch. Danny Korchmar.

[Interviewer]

Yes.

[Peter Asher]

Or Cooch, as we called him at the time, and still do. I was in a band. Well, when Gordon and I toured America, we were given a backup band, Often a different band in different territories. Somebody was booking the Northeast.

[Interviewer]

Was he in one of your backup bands?

[Peter Asher]

He was in one of our backups called the King Bees. And the King Bees were good. Cooch was great. He was a big Steve Cropper fan. I loved his guitar playing. And he and I became great friends. And that friendship extended beyond the Peter and Gordon era.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Peter Asher]

We stayed in touch. So Cooch was subsequently in a band called the Flying Machine in New York with his childhood friend James Taylor.

[Interviewer]

Smile. A little smile for me.

[Peter Asher]

Exactly. They were friends going all the way back to Martha's Vineyard when they were 13, 14. So when the Flying Machine broke up, that's the Flying Machine in pieces on the ground. As in the song.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

Cooch said to James, well, if you're going to London, James intended to go to London because he had a girlfriend over there he thought he could stay with. Turned out he couldn't. That was another story. But so Cooch gave him my phone number and said, is my friend in England? He's okay. We were friends. We are friends. Give him a call. So James called me out of the Blue introduced himself as Cooch's fan friend, Came over to my flat the following evening and played me a couple of songs and life changed forever.

[Interviewer]

Wow. Did you. I love those moments in history because, like, okay, you're sitting there now. Of course, we all know who James Taylor is. Such an incredible artist. But did you. Did you think, oh my God, this guy's a world class talent?

[Peter Asher]

I did, I did. I was. I was entirely convinced quite straight away. I mean, he had a tape. He'd gone in the studio for like 20 minutes of studio time or something and recorded two or three songs. But something in the Way She Moves and Something's Wrong were among them. And I kind of went, this guy is completely amazing. Cause what's extraordinary is that I loved each separate element of him, you know, because his guitar playing was extremely unusual. He had clearly been listening to Segovia and Julian Bream as much as he'd been listening to Woody Guthrie. Yeah. You know, and he. Somebody combined the folk thing with immaculate and complicated guitar playing. And. And then his. His harmonic sense was like, owed a lot to the Manhattans and. And great American vocal bands and stuff.

[Interviewer]

But also he had no, like, Dylan damage where a lot of people around that time were so affected by the shadow of Dylan.

[Peter Asher]

Right. And then the. By Woody Guthrie secondhand.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

It took me a while to like Bob Dylan because I thought, who is this guy who wants to sound like Woody Guthrie? Because I was a big Woody Guthrie fan. Y and I first saw Dylan in that light. And later it dawned on me that songs he was writing were of a different caliber. But his singing put me off for a while.

[Interviewer]

So walk me through. You bring James Taylor into Apple and say, okay, I think we should put an album by this guy. Which you guys did.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

What was their first impression of him as an artist?

[Peter Asher]

Well, first I had James play them a couple of songs live. I went into.

[Interviewer]

Not too intimidating.

[Peter Asher]

Exactly. It didn't really occur to me at the time how scary that would have been.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, it's like, hey, here's the Beatles and I'll play them some of your story.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah, exactly. Here's two Beatles.

[Interviewer]

Oh, two Beatles. Two Beatles. Still be pretty interesting.

[Peter Asher]

It's a quorum. Yes.

[Interviewer]

So who was present?

[Peter Asher]

George and Paul.

[Interviewer]

Okay, good.

[Peter Asher]

And James played them a couple of songs and they kind of went, yeah, sign them, you know, produce them. And I did. And we went in the studio. Shortly thereafter, we put a little band together advertising the Melody Maker for musicians and chose a keyboard player and a bass player. Don Shinn and Louis Cinamo. I haven't seen them for 100,000 years. And James friend Joel O', Brien, who is a New York drummer who's one of James best friends, who we knew he wanted to use. And we embarked on the production of the first James Taylor album at Trident Studios.

[Interviewer]

Okay, so it's because it has something to do with the story. I'm not asking for the salacious part, but he had a drug habit or was kind of back and forth. Were you aware of the drug habit? Because that kind of feeds into the story how it all kind of goes wrong there for a minute.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. Not really aware. No. I knew very little about drug addiction and, you know, it just sort of dawned on me there was something was amiss. I just thought he was extremely moody and, you know, and late and stuff. But eventually I realized these were all the symptoms of a major disease.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. So because the cause, the album doesn't necessarily connect with, you know, it didn't sell, per se. Right. He's not. He's not. He's not a sensation.

[Peter Asher]

No.

[Interviewer]

He ends up going back to America and somehow that leads you to America.

[Peter Asher]

He got some respectful reviews and stuff and then decided to go back to. To America.

[Interviewer]

Right. So how do you end up going?

[Peter Asher]

Because we discussed, you know, who we thought should manage him and how his career should take place. It was clear to me that his career should be American based. He wanted to go back anyway.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

And the people we admired, Joni Mitchell and Neil Young and so on, were all based in the U.S. even though the Canadian in some cases. And so, you know, we agreed that I would go to New York as his manager.

[Interviewer]

Oh, wow.

[Peter Asher]

I kind of thinking, how hard can it be? You know? And the answer is, if you've got James Taylor, it's not that hard.

[Interviewer]

So funny. Sorry. You know. You know, for a short time, Elliot Roberts managed me.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

And Elliot used to, you know, as, you know, because you knew Elliot, he'd make these massive proclamations, you know, and I go, yeah, if you've got Neil Young, you know, it kind of works.

[Peter Asher]

Exactly.

[Interviewer]

You know.

[Peter Asher]

Exactly. I mean, I got to induct the first two managers into the Rock and Roll hall of Fame, which were Brian Epstein and Andrew Lou Goldham, the Beatles and the Stones. So it's like, duh, you know, how hard can that be? So the secret of great management is a great client.

[Interviewer]

Had you, had you guys developed a personal friendship as well? Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

Yes. Yeah. We liked each other. We still do, fortunately. And talked to James the Other day, and he's, you know, happily on the road, sounding as wonderful as ever.

[Interviewer]

I guess I ask because my stepmother was a huge fan of James. So I grew up hearing James's music in the house and I became a fan. And over time then, I certainly grew to appreciate what a great artist he is. And I even like 80s James Taylor, where like maybe the 70s fans didn't necessarily like that. I sort of thought he made a cool pivot. I thought he's one of those guys who somehow gracefully went into the 80s.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

And I don't know how much you had to do with that, per se.

[Peter Asher]

Which albums are we thinking about?

[Interviewer]

It was one. There's. When there were hits there, you know, sort of late 70s, early 80s. There was like. He kind of. I was like. I don't want to say he sounded like Jimmy Buffett, but like everybody started kind of making those types of records.

[Peter Asher]

He kind of. Yeah, a little bit. Yes. Yeah, yeah.

[Interviewer]

You know, kind of. I don't know, it felt like Endless Sunrises or something. Sunsets.

[Peter Asher]

Yes. Some of those songs were more depressing than that, but. Yes.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, but I'm saying he. He somehow he maintained who he was through that transition where some people felt it got a little schmaltzy.

[Peter Asher]

Yes, they did.

[Interviewer]

Right. We don't have to say who they are, but we know who they are. Anyway, I got lost in my reverie for James. I guess what I'm saying is because, you know the man, and I am interested in him as an artist. The fact that he was this moody and unfortunately drug addicted artist when he was young, and that became part of his story. But he went on to have, obviously a long and successful and very respectful career.

[Peter Asher]

Absolutely. Well, of course. And the key point is he's been sober now for decades. And all that is in the.

[Interviewer]

What I'm saying is I feel like for somebody that I've listened to for. For over 40 years of my life, I don't really know him as a person. Is that this because he's a private person or.

[Peter Asher]

He's quite private. He's very funny. I mean, he's always funnier than people expect.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

And extremely smart, obviously.

[Interviewer]

Well, yeah, definitely smart.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. No, I consider myself fortunate to count him as a very close friend and still a great musician. He does that working and sounding great.

[Interviewer]

He does cool stuff on YouTube where he shows, like, kind of how he plays. I'm like, studying. Like, he's like my teacher. Like, how do you do some of that?

[Peter Asher]

I know. Well, it's incredible. So there's some folk technique, you know, pulling off and hammering on stuff, but. But applied to really jazzy chords, which is so cool.

[Interviewer]

So, speaking of the 70s, so, you know, you guys end up in LA Sunset Sound. And I'm looking at this, you know, which becomes the big record, but in. You know, with massive hits. But what I see when I look at that. And I was just at Sunset Sound not long ago, recording myself, it's basically the birth of yacht rock or 70s rock or whatever.

[Peter Asher]

Like, you haven't quite got a handle on yacht rock.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, it's. It's meant to be respectful, but it's. It's a. It's a. It's a particular form of recording. It's very dry, it's very, you know, very present. A lot of natural, beautiful tones.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

But you're there kind of basically first. And when I looked at who was playing on the thing, you know, it's like Kunkel, Randy Misner. Carole King's in the session.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. Carol King was James's piano player for a while.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. And Mask Uncle. That was the first session he ever did. He'd never. He'd never recorded it.

[Interviewer]

So I'm saying you're basically putting together, let's call it the new form of the LA Wrecking Crew.

[Peter Asher]

Yes, in a way.

[Interviewer]

And there they are. And it's on that album.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

And that sort of sets the template for about the next seven or eight years of music making.

[Peter Asher]

And also I was surprised when I credited the musicians, which was my determination to do it. Turned out that was unusual as well.

[Interviewer]

Really.

[Peter Asher]

There was a time before that they didn't get their names on records.

[Interviewer]

Did you have a particular sonic vision that you were after, or was it, what you were just attracted to?

[Peter Asher]

Clarity. I think I really. If anything, you know, which later on I was accused of being too neat and neat and tidy, but I really liked records where each sound and each part fit into an overall picture.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

And you didn't have to listen.

[Interviewer]

Kathy, was there something that had influenced you to, like. Did you listen to somebody else and thought, oh, I'd like that?

[Peter Asher]

It's a very good question. I don't know. I think there's some R and B records that you feel like that to me, where each part, even the horn parts, have a very.

[Interviewer]

Are you thinking like. Like stacks type stuff?

[Peter Asher]

Yes, exactly.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

That beautiful, kind of. It's all there. You're in the room.

[Peter Asher]

Maybe Steve Crawford will play one note and make it mean a lot.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, beautiful. I. I thought as. As. As I do sometimes I find myself trying to put myself in your shoes at that moment. Now you're a successful record producer. You've had a very successful pop career.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah, right.

[Interviewer]

It's not a dirty word. No, but, but, but suddenly now you're a producer. Were you. Were you okay with now being the guy behind the scenes?

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

Did you like that part of it?

[Peter Asher]

I liked that very much.

[Interviewer]

Did you like that you didn't have to go out and perform? Like, what part of it was appealing to you?

[Peter Asher]

I think, yeah, I enjoyed not having to perform. I didn't do it for a long time, but at the same time, there was part about being on stage I always liked. Of course, especially that era that we were on stage when it was all about screaming girls and stuff. That was a lot of fun.

[Interviewer]

You guys had the best era of them all.

[Peter Asher]

We did. We enjoyed ourselves. And so the idea of returning to live singing appealed to me as well. And I did sing on a lot of the records. I made a lot of backup vocals that I went, well, I'll do that.

[Interviewer]

What I'm saying is most people would have a hard time sublimating their ego if they've had success as a performer.

[Peter Asher]

Yes, I suppose so.

[Interviewer]

It's not common, as, you know, but, yeah, my.

[Peter Asher]

I have a healthy ego, I think. I mean.

[Interviewer]

You do, yeah. And I don't think that's a bad thing. When I was a talented person, I

[Peter Asher]

was happy to be known when I wasn't on stage. You know, when.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

When Rolling Stone put me on the COVID I went, yes, please.

[Interviewer]

But you understand, it's like, it's not. Not often that somebody will take themselves out of the spotlight and make it about somebody else.

[Peter Asher]

That's true, I suppose. Yeah. But that's what I was determined to do.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Because I had a moment when I was in my early 30s, I was out of a record deal, and a friend of mine from a record label called me, and he said, what are you going to do? And I said, well, I'm trying to get a new record deal. And he said, I think you should go into production. He said, you'd be a perfect person for it. You know what you're doing, you know how to write.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And he said, think about it. You won't have to tour anymore. You can have a normal schedule. You'll make the same amount of money that you're making now. And I thought. I said. I thought I said, you're crazy. I'm not. I'm not done. I'M a star, I'm a star, baby. I mean, I got more to. But it would have been. And you were at. I think in this point, you were maybe 25, 26 years old, somewhere around there.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. See, the thing is, I think part of it is that I was always the harmony singer. I mean, I wasn't the star. I mean, collectively, I suppose, as a duo, we were stars. But I still think it's not irrelevant to consider that, you know, I.

[Interviewer]

But your name was first on the marquee.

[Peter Asher]

Oddly enough, that was a change. We were Gordon and Peter, really. When Gordon and I got together at school, we were Gordon and Peter because he was the lead singer.

[Interviewer]

He was the lead singer.

[Peter Asher]

He was the tall, handsome one. But there was the obvious solution. It was when we had a record deal. EMI came to us one day and said, we've done some research. Peter and Gordon sounds better. We're changing it to Peter and Gordon, and who was I to complain?

[Interviewer]

So I was gonna say, you're like, so.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. Think of me as second willing.

[Interviewer]

So now that you're okay, because it's. As you. As we all know now, you know, this is a romantic time in music history, L.A. yeah. Laurel Canyon. You got this whole crowd out here. Neil Young's out here, Joni Mitchell. You know, you talked about these people before. The Beach Boys are sort of finding their 70s way. It's a fecund period in LA.

[Peter Asher]

Absolutely.

[Interviewer]

Music history. A lot of great musicians, a lot of great singers, songwriters, and you're in your mid-20s. You're living the California dream. As you know, it's perpetually sunny out here.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

Coming out of gloomy old England, did you. I. I guess what I'm saying. And you take it however you want. Like, is it what you wanted? Like, you're like, did you look around and go, ah, this is all right?

[Peter Asher]

This is all right? Yes, I think so. Because I visited LA before, of course, on the road with Gordon.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

And I remember distinctly, I mean, there was a point where a year earlier, I'd been bicycling home from university on a winter's afternoon, bicycling in the rain. And almost exactly a year later, I was driving down Sunset Boulevard in a rented Mustang convertible, being recognized by beautiful women. I kind of went, this is a little bit better. This is an improvement.

[Interviewer]

So sticking with the production side of the.

[Peter Asher]

So I knew I'd lucked out.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So. And so Linda Ronstadt had had success with stone ponies and hits. And I think when you. You Came in because there was something with an album. There was. You. You came in where an album was struggling.

[Peter Asher]

That was done. Yeah. And. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Can you walk me through that a little bit?

[Peter Asher]

It was partly produced by John Boylan, partly by John David Souder, both of whom were boyfriends at the time. And it was complicated.

[Interviewer]

Sounds messy.

[Peter Asher]

And it couldn't get finished somehow. So I helped her finish it.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

And in the course of all that, I think it was John that suggested that maybe I would be interested in managing her as well.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

Because John Boylan. It didn't make sense. And John played a key role in that. And so initially, when Linda approached me about management, first of all, I asked James because at that point I was a one client manager. This represented a potential change, but he was okay with that. After thinking about it, I mean, it wasn't an instant decision.

[Interviewer]

I'd have to think about it, too.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. So where was I?

[Interviewer]

Well, you talked about how you worked with her on her album. Exactly.

[Peter Asher]

So that impelled her. And at the same time, also, I'd started managing James sister Kate, and. And I thought, well, that would be weird to be trying to break two girl singers at the same time. So I wasn't sure that I could say yes to Linda and be effective. So I said no initially. And then Kate decided that show business was not for her, and she made one album for Atlantic, which is a very good album, I think. But the Road didn't agree with her.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Because in doing the research on you, I didn't even know that James had a sister that had recorded.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

I was sort of like, huh? Like, in all these years of, like, digging around in record piles, I wasn't aware that there was the sister that sang.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah, they all sing. All the brothers and the sister.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Peter Asher]

So Kiss, Kate, Alex Livingston, Hugh, the whole Taylor family sing.

[Interviewer]

So tell me if this perception is right. Cause, you know, I was too young But I kind of remember the times. But there was. There seems to be a historical sense that after Stone Pony, she was just another girl singer from a band that had kind of broken up. And she was kind of. She had a deal, but nobody really thought she had a big upside. Is that generally inaccurate?

[Peter Asher]

I think that's accurate. And also I think she had a slight reputation for being difficult. Totally unjustified, because she was and is incredibly smart and has incredibly good ideas of her own.

[Interviewer]

You think it was just a headstrong type of thing?

[Peter Asher]

I think it was. You know, the people were telling her, don't you worry, you're pretty little ahead about that and thinking that they could tell her what to do.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

I think people honestly did have a hard time realizing that somebody who had that voice, miraculous voice, and was incredibly good looking and could also be a seriously thoughtful, well read, intelligent person, and they had a hard time understanding all that and became clear to me that all you had to do with Linda was listen and help her, affect her.

[Interviewer]

Before you worked with her, what was your perception of her voice?

[Peter Asher]

I saw her first at the Bitter End in New York, Paul Colby's Bitter End, and was blown away. Completely blown away. This is when she had the backup band that turned into the Eagles.

[Interviewer]

Ah, that's right.

[Peter Asher]

Randy Meisner, Don Henley, Glenn Fry.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

Good band. And not bad, not bad. Forecast a bright future for them. And so. And she was amazing. I mean, I'd never had anything like it in my life. She had this extraordinary voice, you know.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. It's a kind of a one of a kind voice.

[Peter Asher]

Totally is.

[Interviewer]

And could. And total pitch command.

[Peter Asher]

Control command. Yeah. That's, of course, what. Tragically, when she figured out she had Parkinson's, that's what she lost was the control. Because sometime before she even realized that there was an illness involved, she was kind of going, my voice won't do what it feels like it should. And I couldn't hear the difference, but she could feel the difference. Ah, I bet it was the control.

[Interviewer]

Well, when you're like a gifted.

[Peter Asher]

Her pitch is insane, you know?

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

A lot of those vocals on those albums are live vocals, I bet. You know, and obviously not some singers,

[Interviewer]

they just open their mouth and it just sounds right.

[Peter Asher]

Exactly, exactly.

[Interviewer]

You were instrumental in helping the public find her gift as a solo artist. And we know that that translation doesn't always work, you know, that the idea that you. You're a standalone singer.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

You know, not everybody makes that translation. I've even had. I've even struggled to get the public to understand me out of my band, even though I'm the writer and the singer. So I understand that that's a difficult leap for people to make. What was it that you think that you all discovered together? You know, you're no Good, I think, was the first big hit that sort of cracked it open, right?

[Peter Asher]

Yes, it did. Yeah. That was the big number one record that changed people's perception.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

And a lot of the credit for the brilliance of that record, which should go to Andrew Gold as well, who's an extraordinary musician who played all the. Played most of the instruments. I didn't know that yeah, all the guitar stuff in the middle is all him.

[Interviewer]

Oh, yeah, Cool, cool stuff.

[Peter Asher]

He played. Comfrey played the drums as well. Kenny Edwards played the bass, but Andrew played most of the instruments and had a lot of the ideas. So I worked with Andrew on that record.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, but what did you. I mean, maybe this is too esoteric a question, but what do you think it was that suddenly was there and so obvious to the public that wasn't there for the previous, you know, three, four years?

[Peter Asher]

I don't know. I mean, we lucked out. We had the right song. Linda sang it brilliantly, but it was just, it was one of those cases where you work a couple of days on a record in the studio and you kind of go, if this isn't a hit, I don't know what is. You know, it's just everyone you would play it to likes it. Yeah, except Linda, who initially didn't like the guitar stuff in the middle. Oh, the weird, all the multiple guitar parts and stuff. She went, oh, it sounds like the Beatles. I don't know. And I went, yeah, it does sound a bit like the Beatles, but that's why it's so cool, you know, that's

[Interviewer]

where you go, I know the Beatles.

[Peter Asher]

And let me tell you, she changed her mind.

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[Interviewer]

You've worked with so many great artists and you know, we could literally just talk for hours about you as a producer. Anyway, I just, here's a short list of people I thought was interesting you work with and you worked with more people than this, but Diana Ross, Tony Jo White, who I love, Cherry Ringo, Livia Newton, John Barbra Streisand.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And I thought, wow, you've worked with a lot of incredible singers.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

And even with your relationship with the Beatles, you've been around great singers and I thought you would be one of the only people that could answer a question like this, which is, is there a common link between such one of a kind singers?

[Peter Asher]

But it is that one of a kindness that is, is the link, I think. I mean, I, I, I find myself particularly drawn to singers who are instantly identifiable among whom I number you because I mean, your voice is another one where you're going to go, oh, I know who that is.

[Interviewer]

Sometimes that's a good thing.

[Peter Asher]

No one else could do that, you know.

[Interviewer]

You know, when I was young though, I thought it was a bad thing because everyone was always telling me my voice was wrong.

[Peter Asher]

Right. Well, distinctive can be wrong. Can be right. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

I had to find my own song, which was my, my journey. But yeah, but I appreciate that because when you, when you like everybody I named even Ringo. I mean, there's only one person who sings like Ringo.

[Peter Asher]

You only need a bar to know who it is. Yeah, yeah, that's, that's certainly true because I mean, the people that always make me nervous when, when they come out to me and start talking about, you know, will you produce a record with me? Or is the, I can do anything people, you know, look, I can sing like maybe I should do a bit of country, maybe. But what do you think? You know, as most of the people I've had the privilege of working with, Natalie Merchant, you know, everyone, you know, Natalie, cool singer. Exactly. You just kind of go, oh, that's great singing, you know, it's inimitable and as I say, instantly recognizable.

[Interviewer]

Even somebody like Natalie, who I got to meet one time through your work with her, you know, it's like I had to imagine this whole world around her voice. When I met her, I realized I'd created this whole personality that wasn't her personality. She's a lovely person, but I'm saying I almost created a personality for her that wasn't hers based strictly on the sound of her voice.

[Peter Asher]

Right, right. Her voice is, it's hard to say what's so special about a case like her, because you just know it's a particular tonality. It's not even just the phrasing. It's the tone.

[Interviewer]

So looking back on your production career, what do you most. I don't know if most proud of isn't the way.

[Peter Asher]

I don't know. I mean, it's been so miraculously surprising to me. I mean, I remember the first time I worked with Diana Ross, for example. You know, I remember being in the studio and she went out there to sing on the first song we were doing. And, you know, I'm somebody who had every Supremes record in the book, you know, and knew them all by heart. So she opens her mouth and I found myself going, jesus Christ, she sounds exactly like Diana Ross. That's too weird.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

The same with Cher, you know, Cher's big foghorn of her voice, which is so exciting, you know, And I consider myself incredibly lucky. And then again last year with Barbara, with whom I'd never worked before, and I knew her socially a bit, but I mean, again, the miraculous moment. They first step up to the mic and you go, it's Bob. It's very amazing. And then I'm very lucky to have experienced all that.

[Interviewer]

So let's go back a little bit to the beginning. I probably have this wrong, but I'm paraphrasing here. Your dad worked in the medical field with blood and mental health issues. Is that.

[Peter Asher]

Is that not particularly blood? He was an endocrinologist, which is glands. And he was also very interested in mental health and was in charge of the mental observation ward of the hospital. Though he was not actually qualified psychiatrically, but he just had a real knack with dealing with people with mental illnesses, even those extremely, extremely crazy people.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

He would go in the room and lie on the floor, you know, because he found he never got attacked. If he lied on the floor, however crazy they were.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Peter Asher]

So. And he. He. In some of. Some of what he talked about, you know, it's all evidence based and, you know, what do they call it now, the. When you just. It's just talking therapy, mostly.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, they call it talk therapy.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah, that kind of thing. Which he did. He used hypnosis as well, too. Before its time.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Peter Asher]

And he's also known, if you look him up now, it's largely because he was the person who identified and named Munchausen syndrome.

[Interviewer]

Oh, wow. That's kind of a cool.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. Well, you know, also. It's also an example of his eccentricity because doctors normally, if they identify a particular syndrome, name it after themselves.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

So you still get people who go, who is Dr. Munchausen?

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

Because there is no Dr. Munchausen it was Baron Munchausen. Who's the legendary fictional character. Terry Gilliam made a movie about him. There was Baron Munchausen. So my father.

[Interviewer]

There's a little bit of wink and a humor in there.

[Peter Asher]

Absolutely.

[Interviewer]

And then your mom was a professor at a music school. George Martin was a pupil.

[Peter Asher]

Correct. Yeah. So by coincidence, before. Before we met any Beatles, and here

[Interviewer]

we are talking on Mother's Day. But yes, I guess what I'm saying is, you know, not everybody grows up in such a learned environment.

[Peter Asher]

No, I was lucky in that regard, too.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. And then you've got two sisters. That one was doing voice acting. Is that accurate?

[Peter Asher]

Claire didn't. Claire was the cleverest of us all, probably. She's the one who actually went to Oxford and got an organ scholarship to Oxford. And. And it's the most skilled musician out of the three of us. But Jane became a successful actress.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. And then you started acting when you were young?

[Peter Asher]

Yeah, when I was 8.

[Interviewer]

Was that something you wanted to do?

[Peter Asher]

I don't know. Well, what happened was we were spotted by an agent who liked the look of us and told our mother that she thought she could get work for us and would we be interested. And I think it was largely based on the fact that we all three had red hair, bright red hair at the time. It's changed in the interim. So I think that. So that we all got signed up. We never did get anything, all three of us together. But Jane and I did an episode of Robin Hood together as a pair of peasant children.

[Interviewer]

But I love. Cause I saw this story. You acted with John Mills and Alistair Simm. Yes, and even Boris Karloff at some point.

[Peter Asher]

Yes. In fact, I did an interview the other day and I was going, this is weird. They would want me. But I think it was a Boris Karloff documentary. And I think I'm the only living actor they could find who actually worked with Boris Karloff. Because when he. After his whole career in America, he moved to England and was in a series called Colonel March of Scotland Yard. And I was in one of the episodes.

[Interviewer]

Oh, my goodness.

[Peter Asher]

And Boris Karloff had a couple of scenes with Boris.

[Interviewer]

Do you have a good memory of that?

[Peter Asher]

Yes, very. He was charming. And he had a scene where somebody was trying to poison me and he had to, with his walking stick, smash a glass of milk out of my hands so that I didn't drink it. So it was very dramatic.

[Interviewer]

Is there video of this? Have you seen? Yes, I have to find the video of that.

[Peter Asher]

It's called the Talking head or something, oddly enough.

[Interviewer]

But I'm a huge Boris Karloff fan, which I couldn't resist.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah, no, he was very nice to me.

[Interviewer]

Such a. It's like, that's the beauty of America. It's like somehow we find the Boris Karloff's of the world, you know?

[Peter Asher]

Yes, that's right.

[Interviewer]

And turn them into kind of like living legends.

[Peter Asher]

Yes, but he lived up to it. He was really a gentleman.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. So you meet Gordon at school and.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

What. What musically was going on in the atmosphere that made you want to be a pop musician? I know it didn't happen overnight, but

[Peter Asher]

I. Yeah, no, it didn't happen overnight, but yeah, Gordon and I found out we liked a lot of the same things. I was more of a folkie. I was already Woody Guthrie crazy.

[Interviewer]

Were you a purist type? You know, like. Because there's. People get very purist.

[Peter Asher]

No, I wasn't, I wasn't, but. And then we were both fans of Cliff and the Shadows, you know, in England, as you know, are very important in America.

[Interviewer]

It's a shame because that really hasn't translated over here.

[Peter Asher]

Not at all. I mean, it's very odd, you know, when they interview British guitar players, they invariably give credit to Hank B. Marvin and American, without doubt, without question, go who? You know. Yeah, it takes them. Oh, the Shadows. That's right.

[Interviewer]

Even I had to go kind of go back. And they're not easy to find in America. Like old Shadows records, like, no Monopressings on EMI or whatever they were on. And amazing sound. And I can see the influence when you listen. But in American culture, there's no representation of the Shadows at all.

[Peter Asher]

No, exactly.

[Interviewer]

None other than maybe there's like Cherokee

[Peter Asher]

or something, like one of their Apache.

[Interviewer]

Thank you. Close. So it's oft told. So you. You could take it however you like. But, you know, in. Somewhere in your story, Paul McCartney moves into your house.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

Dating your sister.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

Let me ask this. How does. How does that work where your sister goes to your. Your mom and your dad and says, hey, by the way, the. The beetle wants to move in.

[Peter Asher]

Well, because my mother actually offered him the guest room because he was hanging around a lot. I mean, he would come to dinner, you know, and hang out and you seem.

[Interviewer]

This is early, like 63, 64.

[Peter Asher]

I'm bad at dates, but.

[Interviewer]

Yes, but early, like this isn't like they're getting there, but they're not like what they became.

[Peter Asher]

It's sort of love me, do time, I guess, or something like that.

[Interviewer]

Wow. Wow.

[Peter Asher]

Yes. So, yeah, you know, Jane met them when she was asked by the Radio Times, the magazine, the equivalent of TV Guide, I guess, in. And they asked her if she would go and see the Beatles when they came down to London for the first time to play in an NME poll winners concert where they just did a few songs. They wanted her to go. She was known for her affection for music. She was also known for being on a TV show called Jukebox Jewelry, where various celebrities would rate the hits, hits, hit or miss. So they knew she liked music. They wanted her to write a piece about the Beatles and see what all the fuss was about. So she went and she was taken backstage to meet them as the visiting celebrity. And she met all the Beatles and found them all to be charming and funny. And she liked them. They liked her. One of them liked her in particular and invited her out. And that's how she ended up going with Paul. And that meant Paul was around our house a lot and we all liked him. So at some point he was there a lot. He stayed in the guest room from time to time. And our mother said, you know, that if you wanted to use the guest room as a pied a terre when they were in London, that was okay. So he was there a lot and eventually moved in.

[Interviewer]

So when he's living three years, I guess. Where were you at musically, you know, with Gordon?

[Peter Asher]

We were playing a lot. We had a gig and a regular gig by this time in a place called the Pickwick Club, where we played every night, was just the two of us, Acoustic guitars. No pa. Mostly doing folk.

[Interviewer]

Folk.

[Peter Asher]

Folk classics. No, we were doing rock classics as well. A lot of Buddy Holly.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Peter Asher]

Probably all of Buddy Holly, I would say most of the catalog and some folks. A lot of folk stuff, too. It was that mixture.

[Interviewer]

It's funny, I just interviewed Paul Anka.

[Peter Asher]

Oh, great.

[Interviewer]

Who wrote a song for Buddy because Buddy was trying to cross over.

[Peter Asher]

Guess it doesn't matter Anymore.

[Interviewer]

Yes. Yeah. So. So, like a weird.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. No, exactly.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Because Buddy Holly was such a great songwriter. It's like, funny that he absolutely.

[Peter Asher]

And Paul Anka captured it perfectly, including the weird Paul Anchor actually put Golly G and Whoops a daisy into the lyrics to Guess it doesn't matter anymore, which is something only Buddy Hollywood dared to do.

[Interviewer]

So one Beatles story, if you don't mind. It's. It's the. It's where they wrote. Or you got to hear I want to hold your hand or they wrote it in your basement, or. Yes, just walk me through that. Story.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah, and my mother, when Paul moved in, my mother had a music room in the basement that she occasionally used for giving private oboe lessons, but didn't use much because she was very busy at her main gig, which was being oboe professor at the Royal Academy of Music. So that room was pretty empty. And she said to Paul if he ever needed a piano, he could use the piano in that room, which was a small upright piano. And. And he did quite often. And this particular day, John Leonard came over, who he'd met by this time, and they went down to this basement room and after a couple of hours, I guess, called upstairs to see who was around and asked if I wanted to come hear the song they had just finished. So I said yes, came down, I sat on this little sofa, two person sofa. They sat side by side on the piano bench and hammered out curiously what was. Because it's odd that I won't hold it down was written on the piano in some respects, because it's so much a guitar song, but it was written on the piano. And they played it to me and asked me what I thought.

[Interviewer]

And you said.

[Peter Asher]

I said it sounds great, it's amazing. And of course, the ultimate clue is that what you says, that's amazing, could you play it again? And then the second clue is that they were very happy to play it again. So they knew exactly what they'd got.

[Interviewer]

Wow. One question about John Lennon. Paul McCartney. If you watch interviews in 1963 to today, he seems like a fairly consistent personality. And I'm not saying John Lennon was a chameleon. He obviously went through a lot of inner changes. But what were your impressions of him at that point?

[Peter Asher]

I never got to know John terribly well. I mean, people, you know, I obviously spent more time with Paul than. But he could be quite grumpy, he could be opinionated. But he was also fascinating and articulate.

[Interviewer]

Did you see him as a magnetic personality at that point? Can you at least try to quantify that a bit? Because every generation has these. It's easy to look back and say, well, now we see what they did. And he did so much great work in his life. But oftentimes, and there's people in my generation where I remember meeting them early on, you would hear the rumble about somebody.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

You know, and you go, okay, I'm gonna see for myself what all this rumble is about. And then you see it and you go, well, I don't know what that is, but there's something there.

[Peter Asher]

Exactly. I think that's exactly what it was. And yeah. It became clear that he was an interesting person and a changeable person and the person capable of being quite grumpy. I've seen him sort of shut people down quite readily, you know, to the point where it might even seem hurtful. But I've also seen him be very funny. The Lewis Carroll connection was one. You know, we were all Lewis Carroll fans. My sister Jane, There's a record version of Alice that she did.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

Which is interesting, which you'd find fascinating too, because it was one of the first live stereo recordings that Argos Records ever did. Then it was full on live stereo to the point where when they fall into the pool of tears, they shot it all, they filmed, recorded it all at a swimming pool, and they had the cast fall into the water, as Lewis Carroll prescribes.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. One last thing on them, even on a song like I Wanna hold, you'd hand. You hear the brilliance of their sort of melodic. You know, there's almost like a Bach thing going on with them.

[Peter Asher]

Totally.

[Interviewer]

Did you recognize that there was a harmonic complexity in them early on?

[Peter Asher]

Yes. Yes, it was. You know, you couldn't. And all the da da, da, da, da in the left hand of the piano or the guitar, which became the guitar part. Just brilliantly written.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

Brilliantly arranged.

[Interviewer]

So back to Peter and Gordon, you know. Paul offers you a tape. I think there was three songs on it. Is that accurate?

[Peter Asher]

Well, Without Love. Yeah. No, no, the one. I. I don't think there were three songs on it.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. The story. The story I read. So you were there. But he. There was a tape where it had World without Love, Nobody I know and I don't want to see you again.

[Peter Asher]

No.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Peter Asher]

They were all written at different times. The World I Love tape was a demo he made in my bedroom upon request. And he played me the song, which didn't have a bridge, by the way. It was unfinished. And he explained that he didn't finish it because John didn't like it. John thought it was a lame song and John thought that the lyric was ridiculous, that Please lock me away was an incredibly stupid way to start a song. So it didn't have a bridge at all. And Paul made me a demo first. He showed me the song, wrote out the lyrics and the chords, which I have.

[Interviewer]

I was gonna. That was my next question.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah, they're safely locked in a fireproof safe. And. And. But again, no bridge. But so. And he made the demo again, just one verse, so we'd have the melody correct. And the bridge came in response to me. Nagging him in time for the session because Norman Newell had said, you know. Norman Newell had chosen two or three songs from our set that he'd overheard at the Big Beat Club when he came to see us. But he said, if you know any other new songs, you know, be sure to bring them along. And that's when I went, maybe I do. And so I said to Paul, that unfinished song you played us, is that anything happened with that? You know, the Beatles changing their minds and doing it? He said, no, and can we have it? And he said, yes.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Peter Asher]

A simple yes.

[Interviewer]

So when did he write the bridge? Just kind of knock one out.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. He said, I think it was like a week before the session or something. I said, we really want to do that song. You know, it really needs a bridge. And so he went into his bedroom with his guitar and came out a few minutes later with the. So I wait and in a while I will see my true love smile she may come, I know not when, and so on, and we went, that'll do. Wow. Thank you very much.

[Interviewer]

So now you're doing a.

[Peter Asher]

Didn't realize how momentous that was.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, but, I mean, that's the beauty of it.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

You know, because it changes the course of your musical life.

[Peter Asher]

Exactly.

[Interviewer]

I love looking at discographies because it tells such a beautiful story, if you're able to, like, sort of look linearly. So, first single, World Without Love.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Second song, a second single. Paul also wrote Nobody I Know.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

And then the third single is I Don't Want To See youe Again, also a Paul composition. And then the fourth is I Go To Pieces with Del Shannon, which is another incredible writer.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

Is it true that he showed you the song or something in one of those cavalcade type gigs in Australia?

[Peter Asher]

We were in Australia on a bill with Del Shannon ourselves, the Searchers, another great band. Eden Cain, an obscure British artist, and some New Zealand girl singer, and Dinah Lee, and we were all on the road together. What I discovered later was that he'd actually written the song in America and had tried to find a home for it before leaving for Australia. Not successfully, but in Australia, he played it to the Searchers. He thought it would be great for the Searchers. And to be honest, I think he was right. The Searchers, with their jangly electric troll string sound, could have made a killer record of I Could have Been.

[Interviewer]

Searchers are basically like power pop 10 years early.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

If you listen. If you really. I really love the Searchers, and if you really listen, it's like, they sound like Cheap Trick, but they're like cheap

[Peter Asher]

trick in 65, but all with the Rick and Bracket.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, Cool stuff.

[Peter Asher]

Exactly. And the Searchers turned it down. And I'd overheard that and said, can we have a go at that? And so we worked it out at sound checks and stuff.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Peter Asher]

And said, please don't give it to anybody else. When we get back to London, we will record this. We think it's a hit. And it was.

[Interviewer]

That's one of my favorite songs that you guys did such a. Cool. Because something about the Mercy Beat vibe with Del Shannon.

[Peter Asher]

I know. I, I, I, I agree. I, I On stage, I always tell the story that if, you know, if I'm listening to the 60 station as I drive up and down PCH or something, if I Go to Pieces comes on, it's the one I'm most likely to open the window and crank the volume and go, that's me. Yeah. Because I'm, I'm, I'm proud of that.

[Interviewer]

A beautiful, beautiful recording. Fifth single, True Love Ways by none other than Bob. And then the sixth single is To Know you is to love you.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

I mean, good start for a.

[Peter Asher]

We changed the title because.

[Interviewer]

Well, these days you wouldn't. But.

[Peter Asher]

Right, right. But we wanted to sing to the girls.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

We weren't interested in reporting on a third party situation.

[Interviewer]

So now you're in this heady time of success.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

You're doing these. You guys were probably doing those package tours, right? I think I wrote down some of the people you played with. It's just.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah, we did one tour with the Shirells.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Amazing package tours. Like.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. Tom Jones.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Is this where you'd only get up and play like two, three songs type thing?

[Sponsor/Advertisement Voice]

Yes.

[Peter Asher]

Brian Hyland.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Wow.

[Peter Asher]

Ronnie Dove.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Peter Asher]

Who else was there? Mel Carter.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Peter Asher]

Do you remember Mel Carter?

[Interviewer]

Oh, Hold Me, Kiss Me, Thrill Me. Yeah. Amazing song.

[Peter Asher]

Fantastic singer, too. He was amazing live.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

And then we toured in the UK with people like. Gene Pitney was huge in England.

[Interviewer]

Did you like his voice?

[Peter Asher]

Yes. Terrific.

[Interviewer]

Cool.

[Peter Asher]

Terrific. Always a little bit sharp, but it

[Interviewer]

worked, says the producer. Well, I'm always sharp too, so. In fact, I had an argument once with a friend of mine who was producing a vocal session for me. And I would come in and I'd say, it's too sharp. And he says, no, it sounds good. It sounds like you.

[Peter Asher]

Yes, exactly.

[Interviewer]

And I go, but no, but I don't. It's too sharp for me. So I would go back in, I'd sing It in tune. And I came back in and I go to the guy, what do you think? He goes, doesn't sound exciting.

[Peter Asher]

Exactly. Well, he and Gene Pitney have something in common.

[Interviewer]

Well, me and Gene.

[Peter Asher]

You and gene. Right.

[Interviewer]

7 single baby, I'm Yours.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. Well, you know, when we toured America, I heard that on the radio all the time and loved the song and realized that it could be a duet. And when it. By the time we got back to England, its opportunity to be a hit had gone. I don't know if they didn't put it out or it didn't work or they didn't promote it.

[Interviewer]

Well, the thing I read is they wouldn't release it in the US because of the.

[Peter Asher]

Right, so. But when we were recording it as an English single.

[Interviewer]

Right.

[Peter Asher]

I knew that because it would have been a big hit in America. I didn't think we'd have a hit with the single.

[Interviewer]

Oh, I see, I see. I misunderstood you.

[Peter Asher]

So we covered it for. For England. And it was a hit in England. Yeah, Our version. But because Barbara, strangely, wasn't. I love that record.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. So most of your stuff, correct me if I'm wrong, was mostly done at Abbey Road.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

Can you walk me through, like, a typical session? Because I love this era of recording.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. I mean, so our producer at the time, after Norman Newell, was John Burgess, by the way, to follow up on that conversation. He produced our later records and he would book the musicians. They made the choice. It was people like Jim Sullivan and Vic Flick.

[Interviewer]

So would you tell them before the session, we're gonna record the song? So is there a demo or how they do chart it out for the musicians?

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. Jeff Love was the arranger officially, and he would write a chord chart.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Peter Asher]

And they would do the booking and everything. It was £9 a session those studio musicians made.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Peter Asher]

For a three hour session.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. So three hours. Three hours and you guys are present. Are you singing live or. Okay.

[Peter Asher]

Yes, we usually sang live.

[Interviewer]

Were you playing acoustics live with the band?

[Peter Asher]

No, usually not.

[Interviewer]

Because you probably don't want the bleed into the.

[Peter Asher]

Yes, exactly. And we'd always sing together on one mic.

[Interviewer]

Like this way.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah, figure eight.

[Interviewer]

Like the Neumann.

[Peter Asher]

The Neumann, figure eight configuration.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. There's even cool shots of the Beatles. Like, same thing, like thinking this way up.

[Peter Asher]

Which is cool because you're balancing yourself.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. You're probably doing it this way. Right.

[Peter Asher]

I still think that there's a way. There's something about the fact that you're not just singing at the same time, but you're singing into the same physical capsule, you know, so your voices are internally conjoined and that balance is the balance.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Roy Thomas Baker, the great. Yeah. Obviously he did a lot of things. Queen.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

He. He was a firm believer on putting voices together into the same thing and

[Peter Asher]

getting that sound into the same capsule.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

Same microphone. Yeah, yeah.

[Interviewer]

He said that he thought that was the key to that.

[Peter Asher]

What makes the difference?

[Interviewer]

Whatever that feeling is.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah, yeah.

[Interviewer]

So you doing. You're doing as many takes as you need to do to get the record right or.

[Peter Asher]

Yes. And then fix the vocal if you had to.

[Interviewer]

Okay. Yeah. Interesting. Wow.

[Peter Asher]

Do another take, punch in some stuff and.

[Interviewer]

Three sessions, three hours. You're looking for one song.

[Peter Asher]

No. You usually be able to put more than one song.

[Interviewer]

Okay.

[Peter Asher]

A couple and two or three.

[Interviewer]

Wow. Okay.

[Peter Asher]

I mean, in the day, you know, if you did a double session.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

You get like five songs.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. And who would pick the takes?

[Peter Asher]

The producer.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Did you. Were you okay with that or.

[Peter Asher]

I think so. Best I can remember. I mean, when you're trying to sing something, you know, I mean, obviously, if. If at the. If at the end of the take it felt particularly good, you'll say so.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

But I guess the production. The producer was making the final choice.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Because sometimes artists of the era talk about how they felt disempowered by the way things would work, you know, that the producer had sort of the.

[Peter Asher]

I trusted John Burgess. I mean, he was a good producer. And.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

I mean, I think if I seriously disagreed, we'd listen and argue, but I don't remember any such arguments.

[Interviewer]

Back to Paul McCartney here for a second. Well, yeah. Don't Pity Me was the eighth single.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. That wasn't a hit.

[Interviewer]

It was not a hit. I don't know that one. And then the curious choice of you do a really cool Paul McCartney song, which I love. Incredible. It's a really cool.

[Peter Asher]

We cut it two different ways. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. But this idea where you didn't want people to know that it was his song.

[Peter Asher]

He didn't.

[Interviewer]

Okay. He didn't. So tell me that a little bit. Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

He gave us the song and gave us a potential arrangement which ended up in a discussion between him and John Burgess about which way to do it, which I'll get to. But he also said that he wanted to try an experiment, which is to put the song out under a pseudonym because people were saying that anything with the Beatles name on it or any of their. Would automatically be a hit. And he was been insulted about that or annoyed by it or something.

[Interviewer]

So he said, there's an embarrassment of riches.

[Peter Asher]

Let's put it out under someone else's name. So he invented this character called Bernard Webb, but the whole thing got screwed up. I mean, in America, some came out as Smith.

[Interviewer]

Such an odd choice, you know.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah, exactly. Somebody sent some message saying, oh, don't put Paul's name on it, put another name. They obviously hadn't got this Bernard Webb story. And everyone realized that the thing was published by Northern Songs and it was very ineptly organized Deception. But he proved his point because it got lots of. Airplane jumped into the charts while the deception was still in place. And then it all fell apart.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. The first time I got to meet you, the first thing I sailed for you with as a fan was, I love this record Hurt and Is Lovin'.

[Peter Asher]

Oh, thank you.

[Interviewer]

I'm sure you don't remember the conversation, but.

[Peter Asher]

I don't. But.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, but you kind of did this.

[Peter Asher]

What was it that we first met? Do you remember?

[Interviewer]

I don't. It's somewhere, I feel here in la, we just. We cross paths.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And the first thing I said to you is like, I'm obsessed with the song that you did Hurt and Is Loving. And you kind of gave me that look like. Oh, you know, that one. Because it wasn't a hit, it wasn't a single, but such a. Cool, cool.

[Peter Asher]

Thank you. I think Gordon wrote that mostly.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

I contributed to it, but.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, you're on the credits.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah. I think it was pretty much his song.

[Interviewer]

It has that for people that maybe would be interested in listening to the song. It's kind of got that James Bond.

[Peter Asher]

Yes. A little bit. Vibe.

[Interviewer]

But it's such a cool production.

[Peter Asher]

Well, brilliant. I'll go and listen to it.

[Interviewer]

It's. What I love about you guys together is even though at your core you're kind of a folk do, your production with sort of goes past that.

[Peter Asher]

It got bigger and bigger and Gordon voice got more and more. Yeah, exactly. More like that.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, exactly. In my poking around, I found a cool version of Billy Fury doing Hurt and His Lovin. Have you ever heard that?

[Peter Asher]

No.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, it's live at the BBC thing.

[Peter Asher]

Wow.

[Interviewer]

I found it on YouTube.

[Peter Asher]

We were friends with Billy. Gordon, particularly, was good friends with him. So.

[Interviewer]

And so. There he is. There he is doing Hurting His Loving.

[Peter Asher]

I had no idea. Fantastic.

[Interviewer]

I felt like I'd found like a. Like a little chestnut.

[Peter Asher]

That's a gem. Yes.

[Interviewer]

You were probably one of the only people in the world who was invited to a Beatles session, generally speaking, nobody was really welcome there, right?

[Peter Asher]

Correct.

[Interviewer]

I mean, they ran a pretty tight

[Peter Asher]

ship and I was only there very rarely.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

You know, people say, were we there for that one? Yeah, I was there two or three times, max.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. And I know you've. I mean, you do a show about the Beatles, but, you know, I guess if I was going to ask any fanboy question, it would be, could you see the chemistry with them in working in the studio? Was it. Was it apparent? You know what I mean? Did you see something that was unusual, say, outside of your normal experiences with recording?

[Peter Asher]

Not really, no. Because I'd never seen bands recording before, so I suppose it would. You know, I just assumed that that was how it's done. But. But, yeah, there was discussions and arguments and a lot of tea breaks and stuff. I remember.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

I remember thinking it was very casual compared to the way we did it, because we had studio musicians who were paid by the minute, even though they were paid very little. But I think, if anything, I just assume bands did that.

[Interviewer]

I think it might have been in Jeff Emmerich's book, which is really a great book about them recording.

[Peter Asher]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

It might have been in there where I read. But he was saying that the one thing that he found interesting is they would listen to every take. If they did, like, four takes of a song, they would all come in and they listen to every take, good or bad, and they kind of make mental notes and then go back out.

[Peter Asher]

I didn't know that.

[Interviewer]

It's very interesting.

[Peter Asher]

You know, that makes sense, though, because,

[Interviewer]

you know, when you think of these great. There's so many moments that you can't even just picked a dozen. You would fall short. But their ability to go in, and obviously Paul McCartney is. Was a visionary in the way that he produced the records. That was more so him than the other guys. But their ability to kind of create a mini movie, even as early as sort of Rubber Soul, it starts to form into this holographic thing that they're able to do and do it quickly.

[Peter Asher]

Yes. Amazing. I know. And the thing is, when now a lot of those outtakes have been released.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

And you listen to them, they kind of go, well, I get it. That wasn't as good as the master, you know.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

They picked the right one in every case.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

There's none where you go, this is a way more exciting.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Why did they Definitely reached kind of the end of the particular barrel on that. I. Yes. I loved the band and I loved the history, and I got all the bootlegs. But there comes a point where you're like, okay, I've. Right. I feel like I've heard it.

[Peter Asher]

I know why they didn't put this one.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. And God bless, you know.

[Peter Asher]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Just. Just one last thing here, because we talked. We talked on it briefly, I guess, more. It's. It's more atmosphere. I think it's a beautiful way to end because like we said before, you played at a time where there was this hurricane going on with the gigs with young fans. Basically the discovery of what we would now call the modern rock and roll. Yes, there had been Elvis, but this was something different. It extended now beyond just the personality of one artist, where, you know, hermits. Hermits were getting, you know, run over by teen fans.

[Peter Asher]

Right, exactly.

[Interviewer]

There was this incredible hue and cry of enthusiasm.

[Peter Asher]

Yes. Well, I think American audiences particularly, they'd read about all this Beatle mania and they'd seen it in the movie, so they kind of went, well, now we know how it's supposed to behave. And, you know, our first taste of that was when we. Our first gig in America, or one of the very first gigs was we played the World's Fair in New York.

[Interviewer]

64.

[Peter Asher]

64. Played the Unisphere, or whatever they called it, that thing that's on the way out to the airport. And each had a moat filled with water around the stage. And the police were going, oh, don't worry. We got the silhouette control. And of course, the minute we came on, all the screaming girls jumped in the moat and swam across to the stage and jumped out from the stage. So it was incredibly exciting. It was like an early version of a wet T shirt contest. And Gordon and I were immediately enthralled and kind of went, this is the place for us. You know, audiences are insane. And they learned that from the Beatles.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Are you. I don't know if wistful is the right word. I mean, how do you view those times now? You know, with knowing what happened, knowing that so much of the music has survived, meaning people are still listening, interested.

[Peter Asher]

Well, it's extraordinary. I mean, that. That. That's what I suppose that would. Is what would strike me most is that at the time, every interview you ever did or the Beatles ever did, if you. If you go and look at any of them, somebody asks the question, what are you gonna do when this is all over?

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Peter Asher]

Cause it was an absolute conviction that this had a finite timeline to run. And then, you know, and Paul and John, interestingly, their answer to that question was, we will be songwriters because they admired Goffin and King as much as they admired Elvis. They knew that was respectable career. Ringo, I think, said he wanted to open a hairdressing saloon, but there was no question. Or Freddie Garrity, Freddie and the Dreamers would go back to being a postman, whatever it was. But there was no question it was going to end. So nobody could have foreseen the fact that all these decades later, the music is a whole new respect and a whole new analytical figuring out going on.

[Interviewer]

So let's give a little plug to your great show. I listened to it, your serious show, if you don't mind.

[Peter Asher]

Thank you very much. No, by all means. No, I enjoy doing it. You'd think that again, we'd run out of time and ideas because, you know, the Beatles only recorded a certain finite number of songs. The Beatles channels played them all endlessly, but they all still sound good when I do my show. One of the pleasures of the show, oddly enough, is getting to put on headphones and listen to the track as we're playing it live on the air. Because every time you listen to those things on headphones, carefully, you hear. Find something new or something you'd forgotten. You think you know the track in your head and you. Oh, listen, what's that cowbell doing there? That's something different. It's more.

[Interviewer]

God bless. Thank you, Peter, and great talking to you.

[Peter Asher]

Thank you very much. My pleasure. It's an honor and a pleasure.