The Marketing Architects: "The Problem with 'Purpose'" with Nick Asbury

Release Date: September 23, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode delves into the controversial topic of "brand purpose" in marketing, questioning whether pursuing grand social missions actually delivers business results or societal good. The Marketing Architects team is joined by Nick Asbury, UK-based writer, creative, and author of The Road to Hell: How Purposeful Business Leads to Bad Marketing in a Worse World. Asbury unpacks his skepticism about brand purpose, critiques the evidence and effectiveness claims backing purpose-driven campaigns, and discusses the implications for marketers aiming for accountability, creativity, and truth in the industry.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Introduction to Nick Asbury and His Perspective

• Nick's background as a creative, copywriter, and author challenging the idea that “brand purpose” is essential for business success.
• Notable for the book Perpetual Disappointments Diary, reflecting a "frustrated optimist" mindset rather than true pessimism.
  • "Maybe there's some kind of link with, you know, clearly I'm skeptical about purpose and various other things. But I also like to think at heart I’m a kind of frustrated optimist rather than a pessimist." (01:48, Nick Asbury)

2. The Origins and Evolution of Brand Purpose

• Purpose as Post-Crisis Rebranding:
  • Following 2008’s financial crash, corporations and consultancies began pushing a narrative that business needed a “higher purpose” to rehabilitate its reputation.
  • Nick’s early exposure editing these narratives led to discomfort at overstated claims of corporate heroism:
    • "It just sounded to me like a kind of hubris... 'Hey guys, we're not the villains. We're actually the heroes who can lead societal change.'" (05:51, Nick Asbury)
• The rise of formulaic, earnest, and less entertaining ads as businesses sought to associate with social causes.

3. The (Flimsy) Evidence Behind Purpose Marketing

• Research as Backfill:
  • Marketers sought research to validate purpose-driven strategies after the trend took off, not beforehand.
  • Critique of Jim Stengel’s "Grow" book and related IPA/industry evidence, described as "thin" and "circular."
    • "It began as a kind of narrative and then it went in search of evidence… it really was extremely thin evidence, kind of non evidence really." (08:31, Nick Asbury)
• Byron Sharp and Richard Shotton’s critiques demonstrated how the cited purposeful companies weren’t out-performing due to purpose.
• The illusion created by vacuous corporate “purposes” (e.g., Moet Chandon’s supposed purpose of "turning occasions into celebrations").

4. Case Study: Dove’s "Real Beauty" Campaign

• Surface-level science:
  • Dove’s campaign built upon a shallow, PR-driven survey with selective reporting (e.g., “only 2% of women think they are beautiful”).
  • More positive and nuanced findings were downplayed, leading to a narrative about a crisis in self-esteem.
• The contradiction between Dove’s campaign aims and its business (selling beauty-enhancing products):
  • "Dove is, in the guise of trying to solve these problems... constantly prodding young women and saying, hey, you must be really worried about this. Let us sell you something that can make you feel better." (12:13, Nick Asbury)
• Commercial success does not equal social impact—if anything, issues like young women’s self-esteem have worsened.

5. Fundamental Flaws: Can For-Profits Lead Social Change?

• Division of roles is healthy:
  • For-profits are structurally not social-change leaders; their primary responsibility remains to shareholders.
• The risks of letting corporations set the agenda for which causes get attention, favoring issues that don’t threaten them (e.g., mental health vs. tax avoidance):
  • "We end up with this thing where the social issues that get elevated... are not necessarily the issues that people out there prioritize and care about." (18:09, Nick Asbury)
• Most voters are primarily motivated by economic, not cause-related, issues.

6. Award Culture, Cannes, and Industry Ethics

• Cannes "Fact Check":
  • Asbury’s prominent push for greater scrutiny and honesty about the claims made in award entries, particularly in purpose-driven campaigns.
  • The marketing community’s ambivalence: "When we have a kind of ethical issue in our own industry, which is widespread fraud in award schemes, there's a kind of rolling of the eyes... Surely there's a disconnect there." (21:09, Nick Asbury)
• Call for more evidence-based, accountable award practices.

7. Debunking the Gen Z Purpose Myth

• Marketers want to believe Gen Z is uniquely purpose-driven, but elections and buyer behavior suggest otherwise:
  • "You can't on that basis say that therefore Gen Z is somehow this uniquely progressive generation..." (25:55, Nick Asbury)
• Survey responses don’t predict actual buying behavior; intention is not action.
• The industry repeats the same myth with each new generation (Gen Alpha is already next in line).

8. A Better Path: What Should Marketers Do?

• Respect your audience’s intelligence and diversity of perspectives.
  • Great marketing is about making customers’ lives easier, not lecturing them.
  • Aim for uniting, entertaining, or useful advertising—not polarizing, sanctimonious campaigns.
  • "One aspect of respecting your customers is respecting the fact that they have a very wide range of political views... You play a fairly small role in their lives." (28:42, Nick Asbury)
• Internal business practices (fair wages, taxes, work environment) matter more than virtue signaling.

9. Reception and Shocks from Raising the Issue

• Mostly positive responses, including from silent skeptics in agencies.
• Some backlash in the US, even attempts to disinvite him from speaking:
  • "There were a couple of moments where I felt people were actually questioning my right to even say some of this stuff, which I don't think is very controversial." (31:22, Nick Asbury)
• The conversation is more heated in the US than the UK.

10. Are We "Post-Purpose" Yet?

• 2008–2024 may be remembered as the era of purpose’s dominance, but the shift away is gradual.
• New forms of politicization in marketing (Cracker Barrel, American Eagle), possibly a hangover effect.
• "Is this Post purpose or is this purpose moving into some new form? I'm not sure the answer yet." (34:51, Nick Asbury)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "You partly become a successful marketer by respecting your customers... Respect the fact they have a very wide range of political views... and you play a fairly small role in their lives." (28:42, Nick Asbury)
• "Purpose doesn't respect people's intelligence very much." (28:42, Nick Asbury)
• "Purpose should be for charities and for profit should be for profit." (36:06, Nick Asbury)
• "I'm not the bloody contrarian here, it's everyone else!" (36:06, Nick Asbury)
• On recurring tropes: "The word 'democratizing.' Usually what it means is we're making something cheaper... it sounds much more notable to say we're democratizing it." (37:08, Nick Asbury)
• Elena Jasifer on holiday posts: "No one's waiting, 'Ooh, I wonder what Marketing Architects thinks about this.' No one really cares." (39:39, Elena Jasifer)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 01:48 — Nick Asbury introduces his contrarian optimism and humor roots
• 03:31 — Asbury recounts the rise of brand purpose and the problematic Pepsi ad
• 05:51 — The link between 2008 financial crisis and the advent of purpose marketing
• 08:31 — Critique of the evidence supporting brand purpose; roots of shaky research
• 12:13 — Deep dive into Dove’s Real Beauty campaign and its dubious data
• 18:09 — Why for-profits shouldn't lead on social issues; structural and ethical divide
• 21:09 — Cannes awards controversies and the call for evidence-based recognition
• 25:55 — Debunking the Gen Z purpose myth in marketing
• 28:42 — A call for marketers to return to respecting consumers' intelligence and normal lives
• 31:22 — Nick reflects on backlash and culture wars in the response to his work
• 33:22 — Are we post-purpose marketing? Reflections on political cycles and marketing
• 36:06 — Nick’s meta-contrarian take: wanting basic principles to be standard, not rebellious
• 37:08 — Panel shares "cringe" brand purpose tropes
• 40:46 — Advice for brands: be braver, ride out minor backlash over non-participation in every cause

Conclusion & Where to Find Nick Asbury

Nick Asbury remains an influential, research-driven skeptic of brand purpose trending in the industry. For more of his work:

• LinkedIn: Nick Asbury
• Substack: nickasbury.substack.com

Recommended for listeners interested in evidence-based marketing, brand strategy, and the ethics of corporate communication.