#1 Cybersecurity Expert: This Conversation Could Save You Thousands of Dollars

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Mel Robbins Podcast

Episode #1: "Cybersecurity Expert Reveals: 5 Ways to Protect Yourself Online (Starting Tonight)"

Guest: Caitlin Sarian (Cybersecurity Girl)
Date: February 19, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this actionable and eye-opening episode, Mel Robbins interviews Caitlin Sarian, an award-winning cybersecurity consultant known online as "Cybersecurity Girl." The episode’s main theme is empowering everyday people—parents, kids, and seniors alike—with practical, easy-to-implement strategies to protect themselves from the ever-growing threat of cyber scams and data breaches. Mel and Caitlin break down the realities of digital vulnerabilities, reveal the biggest scams happening right now (including the Venmo scam), and deliver a concrete list of five essential actions listeners should take to shield themselves online—starting immediately.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Why Everyone Needs to Care: The Scale of Cyber Threats

• [07:07] Caitlin Sarian: “The cyber scam economy is the third largest in the world. That’s how much money they’re making.”
• Mel confesses to a lax approach with notifications and updates—mirroring most listeners' habits.
• Cybersecurity isn't just for "tech people and banks" anymore; every internet user is a target.

2. Your Digital Footprint: What’s At Risk

• [10:05] Caitlin defines cybersecurity as "protecting your digital footprint," which encompasses everything you do online: apps, websites, games, and accounts.
• [10:30] She explains how incognito mode still leaves you visible to websites, only hiding activities from other users of your device—not from service providers or the sites themselves.

3. Quickfire Cyber Hygiene Tips

A. Protect Personal Information

• Never give out real birthdays, names, or phone numbers unless necessary. Use alternate personas for non-essential sign-ups.
  • [12:34] "Why do they need your name? Why do they need your phone number? My question back to you is, why do they need it?" —Caitlin
• Use a Google Voice number if an app requires a phone number.

B. Limit Online Accounts

• Avoid creating unnecessary online accounts (e.g., for reservations, newsletters) to reduce data exposure.
  • Use alternative, throwaway emails and numbers.

C. Don't Broadcast Your Whereabouts

• Never post vacation photos or current travel plans in real time; scammers can use open source intelligence to target you when you're away.
  • [15:42] "There's a lot of social engineering...they see you're at a Marriott in the Bahamas—they could call and pretend to be you."

D. Free WiFi Risks

• [17:23] "If any product or app is free, you are the product."
• Open/free WiFi is often unencrypted; avoid entering sensitive info (especially banking) on it.
• Look for "HTTPS"—the "S" means secure—when using websites (especially abroad).
• Prefer tethering or a VPN for security. Hotspot ≠ VPN.

E. Password Management

• Never save passwords/credit cards in unprotected notes or browsers.
• Use password managers (e.g., Lastpass, iPhone’s built-in manager), or at minimum, lock notes with FaceID/password.

F. Security Questions

• Avoid using factually correct answers for security questions (like your mother’s maiden name), since such info is often public.
  • Create an alternate persona for these answers.

G. Software Updates

• Always enable automatic software updates.
  • Patches usually fix vulnerabilities: "90% of software updates are to fix some type of bug or vulnerability because hackers are getting so much better." —Caitlin ([28:26])

H. Device Charging Risks

• Never use public USB charging stations (e.g., at airports or hotels) due to risk of "juice jacking".

I. Stop Thinking “Hackers Don’t Want Me”

• [30:30] "It doesn't matter who you are. They just want money. If you are an easy target, you're an easy target." —Caitlin

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4. How Cybercrime Happens and Recognizing Scams

A. Password Reuse & Account Leaks

• Hackers use leaked passwords (and all their common variations) to break into multiple accounts rapidly.

B. Phone and Phishing Scams

• Law enforcement/phishing scams: scammers call pretending to be the FBI or police, using public info to intimidate victims into sending money (often crypto).
  • [37:54] "If anyone needs you to send crypto, let's just be red flag."
• Never respond to calls from unknown numbers or set a personalized voicemail; scammers record your voice for future scams.

C. Voice Cloning and Safe Words

• Voice cloning can mimic family members, tricking relatives into sending money. Set a family "safe word" for verification.
  • [42:49] “If my mom gets on a phone with someone that says that they're me...she's gonna be like, okay, can you tell me your family safe word?”

D. Venmo Scam

• [43:58] Scammers send money from stolen cards, then ask you to send it back. When the original transaction is reversed as fraud, you lose your own legitimate funds.

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5. Responding to Data Breaches and Identity Protection

A. What To Do After a Breach

• Immediately change your passwords and enable multifactor authentication.
• If it’s a credit/financial breach, take advantage of free credit monitoring and freeze your credit to prevent identity theft.
  • “You’ll never know if someone is using your parents' information until it’s too late.” —Caitlin ([47:29])

B. Protecting Seniors & Kids

• Freeze elderly parents’ credit, set strong passwords, enable multifactor authentication.
• Open communication about scams is crucial—avoid making kids ashamed to report potential issues.
  • Kids’ phones: use children’s/child accounts, block messaging, set to private, regularly review permissions.

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6. App and Privacy Settings

• Routinely review and lock down app permissions. Only enable camera, microphone, or location access when strictly necessary.
  • [65:05] "Does it have access to your camera, to your microphone, to your location? If it doesn't need it, turn it off."
• Social, delivery, and shopping apps: set permissions to “only while using the app” or even restrict to specific photos when sharing.
• Social media apps are scanning your photo roll to build content suggestions—limit their access.

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7. Facial Recognition, Wearables, and IoT Concerns

• Wearables and IoT devices (e.g., smart rings, sleep pads) collect vast biometric data. Always review privacy policies.
  • Tip: Paste privacy policies into AI tools (e.g., ChatGPT, Copilot) for layman summaries and red flags.
• [67:16] Facial recognition/biometrics are everywhere (TSA, cameras, etc.)—not always avoidable. Consider blue light/infrared-blocking sunglasses to shield from some forms of surveillance.
• Cover laptop cameras. Use password-protected (or strong unique) passwords on ALL connected cameras (doorbell, baby monitor, etc.). Never reuse the same password on multiple devices.

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8. Spotting Sophisticated Scams & Phishing

• Don’t trust purported Mel Robbins communications unless from verified accounts.
• [76:41] "Do not click on any links. That is like a blanket statement rule I have."

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The Five Cybersecurity Essentials (Caitlin’s List)

[77:17]

1. Strong, Unique Passwords:

   • List your key accounts (banks, social, email); each must have its own strong, unique password.
   • Prefer a secure password manager or locked notes.

2. Automatic Software Updates:

   • Set all devices and apps to auto-update.

3. Freeze Your Credit:

   • Takes 5-10 minutes per bureau; essential for you and your parents/grandparents.
   • Prevents identity theft by stopping new accounts from being opened in your name ([79:12]).

4. Pause 9 Seconds Before Clicking Links:

   • This deliberate pause disrupts impulsive clicking, allows checking email senders/URLs, and shrinks scam risk.

5. Limit the Data You Provide Online:

   • Don’t overshare; provide only what’s necessary.
   • Consider using services like Incogni to automate removal of personal data from data brokers/websites.
     • For DIY: Manually remove info from databases like Whitepages, True People Search, People Finder.

Bonus: Audit app permissions. Review camera, microphone, and location access—turn off what’s unnecessary.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "If any product or app is free, you are the product." —Caitlin Sarian [17:31]
• "The S in HTTPS stands for 'secure.' If it's just HTTP, it's not secure." —Caitlin [19:33]
• "I personally use a password manager. I love it. I swear by it." —Caitlin [23:32]
• "It doesn’t matter who you are — they [hackers] just want money." —Caitlin [30:30]
• "Family safe words have saved people’s life savings." —Mel Robbins [42:46]
• "The scam now is people send you money on Venmo, and then ask for it back. And you’re the one left out the money." —Mel & Caitlin [44:02-44:55]
• "You can scrub your data. Services like Incogni scan and send out opt-out requests for you." —Caitlin [80:29]
• "Cybersecurity is not just for experts. It’s for everyone." —Caitlin [83:07]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 06:19 — Caitlin’s introduction; why most people feel behind on cybersecurity
• 07:07 — The massive global economy behind cyber scams
• 10:05 — The real extent of your digital footprint
• 15:42 — The dangers of posting live vacation images
• 17:31 — Free product/app = you are the product
• 19:22 — The meaning of "HTTPS"; secure sites vs. non-secure
• 23:32 — Password managers; why not to store passwords in notes
• 28:27 — Software updates patch hacker vulnerabilities
• 30:30 — “Hackers don’t care who you are” myth
• 37:18 — The psychology and tactics of today’s phone scams
• 42:49 — Family safe words and voice cloning scam defenses
• 43:58 — Current Venmo scam explained
• 47:29 — Why and how to freeze your (and your parents’) credit
• 49:56 — Non-negotiable child safety phone/app settings for parents
• 65:05 — How to audit and lock down app permissions
• 72:33 — Why you should cover cameras on all devices
• 77:17 — Caitlin’s “top 5” things everyone must do to secure themselves, detailed

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Final Takeaways and Tone

Mel and Caitlin keep the conversation lively, relatable, empowering, and at times humorous—even as they break down complex threats. Rather than inducing fear, the episode focuses on practical steps, doable routines, and the message that everyone can improve their security with just a few small changes. Mel openly acknowledges making every “wrong” move, making it easy for listeners to feel comfortable and motivated to act.

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What To Do Next (Tonight!)

• Audit your passwords; use unique, strong ones for every major account.
• Turn on automatic updates for all your devices.
• Freeze your credit (if not applying for loans/credit soon).
• Pause before clicking any suspicious link or giving up personal info.
• Scrub your online information via DIY or use services like Incogni.
• Review all app permissions, especially camera, microphone, and location.

Share this episode with everyone you care about. As Mel says: “This conversation might be just the thing that protects them from making a mistake they can’t undo.” [30:57]

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For more, follow Mel (@melrobbins) and Caitlin (@cybersecuritygirl) for practical security tips and updates.

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Transcript

[A]

Hey, it's your friend Mel. And welcome to the Mel Robbins Podcast. Here's something I did that I'm not proud of, but I'm going to tell you anyway. So yesterday I got this pop up notification that said, update Apple Settings. And you know what I did? Click ignore. Then I got another one from Zoom, and you know what I did? Click ignore. You ever do that? I mean, why do I need to update all this stuff all the time? Maybe you're a little bit like me in that way. You kind of accept all the cookies on every website. You share your location so Uber Eats can find you no matter when you're ordering. You grant camera access to apps so that you can use them. Duh. Well, our guest today, a cybersecurity expert, told me that all these little things that I'm doing, and I know you do them too, they are making you and me an easy target for scammers. In fact, I bet you lock your door at night. But here you and I are, leaving the door wide open for hackers to just walk right into our accounts. Now, before I even get into this, I need to tell you something. I didn't think I needed to care about cybersecurity. I thought cybersecurity was something for like tech people or banks or corporations or governments. I didn't think it had anything to do with me and you. Then I met Caitlin Sarian, also known as cyber Security Girl to the millions of people that follow her online. And she told me that all these little things that you and I do, you know what we're doing? We are giving the keys to our accounts to hackers. They can get in in less than 30 seconds. And I thought, oh my gosh, this isn't just a tech person's problem. This is everyone's problem. Caitlin has worked in cybersecurity consulting for over a decade. She's an award winning CyberSecurity expert. At EY. For example, she performed global cybersecurity awareness assessments across 20 key cybersecurity sectors. At TikTok, she was the global lead of cybersecurity advocacy. And now? Well, now Caitlin travels all over the world. She works with publicly traded companies, consulting on compliance related to data, our data, and privacy laws. She's here to give you and me the step by step simple things that we need to do that you need to do with your kids, that you need to do with your grandparents and your aging parents. She's going to tell you the number one scam right now on Venmo, and it's if you don't hear about this, you're going to fall for it. She's also going to tell you the five simple things that you can do as soon as you're done listening or watching this. That will protect you from 95% of the threats online, Caitlin says. Everyone that means you, that means me is an easy target to be scammed online because we were never taught how to properly protect ourselves. Until today. On TikTok teens get over 50 built in protections from the start. But for parents, further visibility and control of content can help create the right environment. That's where family pairing comes in. With family pairing, parents can set their own screen time limits or even set restricted times based on what works best for their family. Parents can also link accounts to see their teens followers and who they follow and help restrict content that's not right for them. When safety comes first, discovery can follow. Learn [e-mail] guardiansguide you know how every January people start yelling New Year. New you? Yeah, no, the you right now. The one juggling work, kids, aging parents, your own head that you, that you is already doing a good job. And the goal this year shouldn't be to replace her, it's to support her better. That's where Ollie comes in. They make science backed supplements that fit the real lives women are living. Multivitamins, Vaginal probiotics, Libido support Ollie Probiotic Mango Gummies make taking care of yourself feel more doable. They support your gut, digestive health and immune system. Three little wins in just two gummies Whatever your goals are for 2026, Ollie makes it simple to find what you need so you can feel more grounded, more energized and more supported on your own terms. Ollie offers solutions that help you take care of yourself while you're taking care of everything else. And honestly, that should be the vibe this year. Not a new you. A more cared for you. Head to o l l y.comollie.com and start supporting your gut and overall well being with solutions that are easy and delightful. Ollie, these statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. Hey, it's your friend Mel. And welcome to the Mel Robbins Podcast. It is such an honor to be together and to spend this time with you. I am so glad you're here. And if you're a new listener or you're here because someone shared this with you, I just wanted to take a moment and personally welcome you to the Mel Robbins Podcast family. Today you and I are going to learn to protect yourself online from award winning cybersecurity expert, Caitlin Sarian. Now, Caitlin has been working in cybersecurity for a decade. At EY, she performed global cybersecurity awareness assessment across 20 key cyber sectors. She then went on to TikTok where she was the global lead of cybersecurity advocacy. And now she travels the world working with publicly traded companies, helping them with cybersecurity and compliance with privacy laws and data. And for the last three years, Caitlin has been on a mission to make cybersecurity easy. Not just to the big companies she's consulting with, but to real people like you and me. She has been recognized with multiple awards, including Cybersecurity Woman of the World, Cybersecurity Educator of the Year, top Cyber News magazine, 40 under 40 in 2024. You're gonna love her. She's brilliant down to. And she's going to teach you and me the simple, fast changes that will protect you, your money and your privacy. Please help me welcome Caitlin Sarian to the Mel Robbins Podcast.

[B]

Thank you so much for having me. I'm honored to be here.

[A]

This is one of these conversations that I am equal parts so excited for and I'm also feeling a little nervous because I know I'm going to learn that I'm doing a lot of things wrong. So do you get that a lot with people?

[B]

Yeah. But the thing is, you're not supposed to know all this. Like, we never taught this, so you shouldn't feel like, embarrassed or ashamed by it. We're gonna, like, empower you with the right things to do.

[A]

Okay, I love that. And here's where I wanna start. What could change about my life if I take everything to heart that you are about to teach us about cybersecurity, protecting ourselves, making smart decisions, especially online. What could change about my life if I apply everything you're about to teach us?

[B]

Yeah. So cyber scams are massive right now. And actually that economy is the third largest economy in the world. That's how much money they're making from these cyber scams. Wait a minute, the third largest us, China, cybersecurity scams?

[A]

What?

[B]

Yeah, it's more than, I think, Germany and Japan's economy combined. So it's not a matter of if it happens to people, it's a matter of when. And no one's talking about it. And a lot of times when people are getting scammed, they're ashamed of it. So the point of this podcast is to empower you and give you cybersecurity routines that you can do. Simple, easy, actionable tips that you can take back and start incorporating into your life so you feel safer and more protected online.

[A]

Wow. Well, you've made cybersecurity relatable for millions of people who follow you online, who watch your content in the ways that you consult. What is it the wake up call that you want people to have in terms of what we're going to talk about today?

[B]

Yeah. So if you're listening to this on a phone, an iPad or a computer, like this is for you. Because what people don't realize is they don't think they need cyber. But anytime you go online, you need to understand like these cyber tips and like really protect yourself. Because no one has taught us how to protect ourselves. We're given a phone before we can even speak and then all of a sudden we're expected to know what to do with it. But no one's ever taught us like the key things of like, hey, this is what's happening in the background. Here are some simple things you can do to protect yourself. So this is why it's so important for everyday people to be listening to this and to like learn. And again, it is not supposed to be scary. This is not scary. This is for everyone. And it's just simple things that you can start incorporating and weaving into your life.

[A]

So it's sort of like when you learn to drive a car, they teach you to put the seatbelt on.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

They teach you to look right or left, they teach you where the brake is. And so you're gonna teach us how to put the seatbelt on and be a little safer with our, with our cyber life.

[B]

Exactly. Brush your teeth and wash your face. I mean those hygiene tips were always like really hard to learn when you're a kid. Right. You think it takes extra time, like, oh, I wanna just go to bed, like, do I really have to? And those extra, you know, one or two min saves you in the future. So it's literally the exact same thing as cyber. Ultimately, cybersecurity is a risk based decision. I'm going to give you why they're collecting this data and what they do with it and how it can be used against you. And you can decide, hey, I don't think that's really a risk for me and my family. Or you can say, hey, that is a risk I'm going to start trying to implement, you know, X, Y, Z.

[A]

Well, what worries me is that we're at a point where the technology and AI in particular.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It just feels like the scams are getting worse and worse and worse. You just said it's the third largest economy.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And so while these may have been things in the past that we felt like, eh, not that big of a deal, I'm starting to feel like maybe it's becoming a bigger deal.

[B]

Yeah, it's. It is becoming a bigger deal.

[A]

Let's start with the basics.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

What exactly is cyber security?

[B]

To me, cybersecurity is protecting your digital footprint and your digital footprint is pretty much every single thing you do online.

[A]

So give me an example of what is part of your digital footprint. That might surprise you. That. Oh, that's part of my digital footprint.

[B]

Yeah. Any of the apps that you use, the games that you play on your phone, the websites you go to, the accounts that you make online. Like every single thing that you're doing builds a larger and larger digital footprint.

[A]

Everything.

[B]

Everything. So it's all being recorded in some way, shape or form.

[A]

All of it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Even when I think it's not.

[B]

Yeah. And then the incognito is actually not incognito. That is incognito for your browser. So people are like, oh, if I go on, you know, private mode, that's going to help protect. No, that is private mode for you. So you go in incognito mode when you might want to buy your husband a gift and your husband will go on your computer that you won't see that you went on that website, but that website is still able to see that you went on that website.

[A]

Okay, so hold on a second. See, already I'm like, wait a minute.

[B]

We'Ll get into this. We'll get into this.

[A]

So you were talking about incognito mode, meaning where you're like, okay, I think I'm going to be sneaky.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I'm going to put onto my browser, whatever browser you use, the incognito mode, where I think if I go to a website.

[B]

Right.

[A]

The website doesn't know that it's Mel Robbins there. But that's not what's happening. No, what's happening.

[B]

What's happening is that your computer is not saving the cookies and tags and pixels that are. Are automatically loaded. So cookies, tags and pixels. You accept cookies pretty much every time you go online.

[A]

I do. It's really annoying. And then I want. Well, we're going to get into that.

[B]

But yeah. So it, it actually just doesn't do it on your own computer, but they can technically still see who on the other side. Who's on?

[A]

Whoa.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Don't worry.

[A]

I'm feeling like I've made a lot of mistakes. Okay.

[B]

There's no such thing as mistakes. There's lessons learned.

[A]

Okay. And you have so many specific lessons and specific things that you want us to do, starting now. And so I wanna start with some quick fire questions. And so as an expert in cybersecurity, you never hand out your real birthday or name or phone number online. Why?

[B]

Correct. Before we even get into that, I wanna say one thing. Because I think we're gon through this list and people are going to be like, oh, my gosh, I do all this, all these things. At the end of this podcast, I'm going to give you the five things that are like, absolutely essential. These ones are like, a little bit more for, like, people that want more privacy, like myself. So I don't want people to get worried. Like, you know, a couple questions in, like, oh, my gosh, I. I do this all the time. I'm going to explain why and I'm also going to go through the pros and cons. Right. So back to your question with, like, why I don't give, like, my real identity out online. My question back to you is, why do they need it?

[A]

So they can ship me all the stuff I'm buying that I got.

[B]

Why do they need your name? Why do they need your phone number? Have they ever called you?

[A]

No, but it's required if you have.

[B]

A Google voice number. Google allows you to generate a number that gets forwarded to your real number.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

So I kind of usually give that. If I absolutely need to give a phone number, I don't ever give my real information. And that's because there's constantly profiles being made about you. And the more information you have online, the more it's sold to more and more people. My manager, for example, got a letter, like a handwritten letter in her. Her mail with a picture of her house saying, we're in. We know exactly where you live. We've been tracking and monitoring you. What we will take, don't worry, we'll be nice. We'll take it out. If you pay us this much money in crypto, that's because her address was online. These scams are getting more and more intense. And so if I don't have to give, like, my real information, especially to, like, places that aren't shipping to you. Right. If you're just like, signing up for an account, like, why. Why have we thought we need to be so truthful about who we are online. So I always tell people, make up an alternate Persona. Different name, different date of birth. You know, technically not a different address unless it's shipping to you. Like Amazon. You obviously have to give your right address. But, like, if it's for a movie theater, why do they need to know your address?

[A]

It's so true. I hadn't even thought about this, and I guess it's because I have such a hard time keeping track of the actual information. But if you have a alias, so you have a name that you use whenever you sign up for a newsletter, you have a phone number. And you just mentioned that you could get a free Google phone number. It can be forwarded your phone or not. And that's the one that you use. You have a different email address that is only for signups. And now you are limiting the information that's out there. And it didn't even occur to me that you could ship packages to your address to a different name.

[B]

Yeah, it's your house. Doesn't matter who's addressed to it.

[A]

Wow. Okay. You never create online accounts that you don't need. Why?

[B]

Well, again, more information out there. Like, again, every single website wants you to create an account because that's the marketing world that we live in. Right. It's way better for them, and we don't need to create an account. It's like, again, movie everything. Movie theaters, reservations. We went to a spa here, and they're like, please create an account. I was like, I told my boyfriend, give me your phone. I'm gonna create an account. And it's like, again, a random email. There are also sites out there where you can generate real working phone numbers and emails, and it will just all go to the one app versus, like, you know, going actually into your inbox.

[A]

Well, I'll tell you, I've changed my cell phone number probably three times in the last four years because it's ended up online.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I have changed my email. I don't know how times. And because of that reason that people find it, I end up on email lists. It's just unbelievable. You know, as a cyber security expert, you also never post vacation photos while you're still away. Why?

[B]

Yeah, so besides, like, the actual physical threat. Right. Like, everyone's like, oh, you know, people know that you're away from your house, they're going to, you know, burglarize, which is still accurate. Scammers now are getting even more specific on what they can do. So there's a lot of. It's called open source intelligence. It's anything you do online is really easy to find if you're, if you're public. Right. And so for open source intelligence, if they see you and they say, oh, you're at a Marriott hotel in the Bahamas, okay, I'm going to call the Marriott hotel, pretend I'm you and try to get more information, maybe get your credit card, do, do whatever, just cause like a mess. So there's a lot of social engineering from that perspective. And also scammers have gotten really, really smart with timing when they do scam calls. So say, for example, someone wanted to call my parents and say they're me. Right.

[A]

This scares the hell out of me.

[B]

Yeah. And they wait until I'm on a flight. So if my parents get a call from me, they can't actually get a hold of me because my phone is off. And that's actually like a real life thing. I've talked to many, many people in the cyber industry saying that that has like ramped up. So there's a lot of weird risks that you don't realize that come with it. So whenever I go anywhere, I post after, at least a week after. I don't actually post the exact location. I'm not going to post the exact hotel, I'm not going to post the flight I was on. But I am going to post like, hey, I went to the Bahamas, wherever that may be. Usually just tag the city. I don't have to tag exactly where I stayed, I don't have to tag exactly where I went. And it's fine, you're still there. I mean, what's the difference? The people that know that you're in the Bahamas at that time know that you're there and the other people that don't need to know find out a week later or two weeks later.

[A]

I mean, it makes perfect sense. As a cybersecurity expert, you also warn people about free WI fi.

[B]

Why yes. So the free WI fi is not free. I always say if there's any free product or app, you are the product.

[A]

Okay, say that again.

[B]

If there's any free product or app, you are the product. They are using your data and selling it in some way, shape or form or selling you ads. Like you are literally the product of anything that's free. Okay, so that's one thing. Free WI fi especially there's different types of free WI fi, right? There's like free WI fi in airports where you know, you have connect to the free Starbucks WI fi or there's free WI Fi in airplanes. So we're gonna go through a few different ones.

[A]

Okay. Please. Cause now I'm thinking about. Okay, what's happening?

[B]

So I wanna just let you kind of visualize how WI fi works. Right? Okay. You're connected. And let's say you go on Facebook and you send a message to your friend. That message is literally like flying through cyberspace. Just imagine your own little tunnel. It's flying through the tunnel to your friend. Right. The issue is, when you're on open free WI fi, it's usually unencrypted, which means that anyone can go in and out of that tunnel and see what you're doing if they want to, if they know how to.

[A]

Okay, so hold on. Let me just make sure. I'm tracking.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

So if you're sitting at a airport and you've logged on to the free WI fi.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Okay. And I'm texting my husband, who's back at her house, and I'm texting him something related to a bill that came in and banking information and. Hey, I forgot my credit card. Could you send me a photo of the back of the card kind of thing? You're saying that since it's not encrypted, it's just floating through the WI fi.

[B]

Right.

[A]

If there's somebody that's really smart and knows how to get into those pipes, they can see the stuff?

[B]

Yes. What, so every time you do any data, like you do anything online. Well, the good thing is you're not an idiot. You're not an idiot. The good thing is most of the US websites now are secure. So how do you know if you go to the website? The URL, the, you know, www.whatever.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

It says HTTPs. Yes, the s stands for secure.

[A]

Oh, hold on. So if it's only HTTP.

[B]

Not secure. What?

[A]

The S means it's secure.

[B]

S means it's secure.

[A]

But why do I not know this?

[B]

A lot of people don't know this. It's like a normal thing. Like, people don't know this. No one taught us this.

[A]

You're here. Caitlin, thank God you're here. Okay, so HTTPs. I'm looking for the S. Did you get that? Look for the S? If you're. If you're watching this on YouTube right now, I want you to look up at the. At the.

[B]

Confirm that I'm not BSing you and.

[A]

See if there's an S. Yeah, so.

[B]

If there's an S, and most. I would say a majority of. In the US it's pretty secure. Like almost every Single website is HTTPs. But it gets a little fishy is when you go overseas and you start connecting to random wifi. Because, you know, when we're overseas, we just don't want to use our data. It's expensive and people want to connect to WI fi. And that's where I feel like a lot of people get in a pickle.

[A]

So what do you do instead? What do you do? Like, what would be the thing that you should do if you're in a situation where you're on WI fi?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And it's not encrypted, but you need to send something.

[B]

So first I would. If you really. If you need to be on WI fi, I would just like connect to public WI fi. But I wouldn't do anything like that scare. Like no banking or like really intense stuff like scrolling Facebook, TikTok, whatever, social media.

[A]

Getting a map down so you can figure out where you're going.

[B]

Totally fine. Music, whatever. But if you're starting to do banking, that's where it gets fishy. So what I would do before connecting to public life, I would probably try to tether my phone instead and use my phone data.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

That's way more secure. Completely different. If you have to use WI fi, I would get a vpn, which is a virtual private network. Literally as it sounds, it makes your network private. It gives you your own little freeway separate from the public WI fi.

[A]

So is a VPN the same thing as when you go to your cell phone provider and you get a little like, block? That's like a mobile.

[B]

No, that's a hotspot.

[A]

Okay, see, I don't know what I'm talking about here.

[B]

So Hotspot does provide WI fi and you can use that too, but it's not necessarily secure. I don't know if there's a. I don't think there's a VPN built in. No.

[A]

Okay. All right, so let me ask you this though, because we were talking about airplanes. Yeah, yeah. What about on an airplane? Should I not be using WI fi on a plane? Like, what's happening?

[B]

I want everyone to realize anytime you log into anyone's WI fi, you are on their network. It's like on borrowed time, Right? Like you are doing things on their network. So whether you're doing things on the free Starbucks WI fi or the airplane WI fi, you are still on. Like say, for example, if you fly American, you are on American's WI Fi and they could technically have your data if. Unless you do a vpn.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Which is why a lot of, like, companies, when you travel, they're like, you have to use it. Our vpn, in order to make sure that it's safe. But when you're.

[A]

But the question that I have about plane WI fi, and I don't know why I'm asking this about planes, but for some reason, I feel like you're in a seat. The laptop's open. Is there some.

[B]

You know, do you have a privacy screen?

[A]

No.

[B]

Okay. No, we'll go through that.

[A]

Okay, well, so. So that. So you know, you're like, is there a hacker sitting near me somewhere? That's. No. Okay. That's not happening. No. Okay, good. Thank you. Thank you.

[B]

You're good. The point of this is not to ever scare you. It's just to teach you what people can do. Is it gonna happen like that frequently, this stuff? Not often.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

One other thing, as a cybersecurity expert that you never do is you never save your logins in your notes or in your browser. Why?

[B]

Well, so for iPhone, specifically, in your notes, it gets updated to icloud, right? And if your icloud gets hacked, which a lot of people have, like, hacked accounts, especially iclouds, if you're reusing your password, that means they have your passwords to every single thing. However, if you have a password for your notes, like, there's a new way now you can lock down your notes on your actual phone. Oh, you can? Yeah. You can set a password or you can use your face id and it will. It will double lock it. So I would definitely do that.

[A]

Okay. I'm making a note right now that I just put it.

[B]

Pass my notes again. See these little things? Like, once you turn that on, you don't have to worry about it. Right. Like, it's like little things where you're like, okay, I don't want people to have access to it, but I also want it easily accessible. I personally use a password manager. It.

[A]

Like, what's the password manager?

[B]

So there's like, software. Is that, like, help you create and.

[A]

Store, like, in, like, LastPass?

[B]

Yeah. Okay. LastPass1. Password Keeper Security there. And then even iPhone has a password manager on the new phone.

[A]

Oh, yeah, but that one's safe.

[B]

That one. That. That one is safe. As a cyber professional, I try to not have all my eggs in one basket. And since I use iPhone all the time, I'm like, well, if they get into my iPhone somehow, I don't want them to also have my passwords. But it's still secure.

[A]

I'd rather have you do that. So is the password safe on your iPhone unlocked by your iPhone password?

[B]

No, I think you can set a separate.

[A]

Okay, so that's how you would protect yourself.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay, got it.

[B]

I think it's a biometric thing on your phone. And then let's say like obviously if they steal your phone or they get into you, they aren't gonna have your biometric.

[A]

Why not use your browser? Well, tell me about the danger of this because I'm so lazy and the browser's not gonna kill me because I've literally not only. I feel like I'm about to get cyber attacked because I'm confessing all this stuff right now.

[B]

This is what most people, what most people do.

[A]

Well, I'm even thinking about the fact that every time I buy something they're like, you wanna save your credit? I'm like, yep. Cause I wanna make it easy for people to steal from me. Like I, I'm thinking now about how this is all saved.

[B]

Yeah. So the only issue with browsers is there's two things. One is it depends on your browser, right. If you have Google and you use Google Chrome and you're saving it on your browser and if anyone is able to access your Google Chrome on another computer because you reuse your password, they might be able to get your password from that.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

But most of the time browsers is actually stored locally. So the only time they're really is could be a real issue is if they actually physically steal your computer, which is not necessarily likely.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

So the browsers aren't as bad in my opinion as like an unlocked note app.

[A]

As a cybersecurity expert, you say never use your mom's maiden name for security questions.

[B]

Yeah. Why you'd be so surprised at how much data is out there on us. It is very easy now to find your like parents, full name and parents address your, your kids, your, like you can see. And if you Google me or if you used to Google me, you'd be able to see like my brother, my sister, my, my grandparents, where each of them lived, even IP addresses. So it's, it's all public knowledge. Again. OSINT is open source intelligence. And a lot of times people like, oh, I'm going to get hacked. And it's, it's not a complicated hacker. It's literally someone that's like doing their research on you and finding out the answers to your security questions. So think about all the security questions, right? Like your high school, that can easily be found out. Like your mother's maiden name. Also easily Found out. And it just the more information that you put out there online, the more information you're giving these people that it's easy for them to hack. And I want to give you a little story. So there is a company that I have been like partnering with and they really specialize in osint, which is open source intelligence. And they have been able to generate emails and try to find like basically everything about you within 20 seconds using AI. They like scrape all anything open, which is if you've ever created a wedding registry, all of your social media posts, anything that you've ever said online, and they've been able to piece together who people are in like 30 seconds from that. They even found the name of someone's dog because on their wedding registry they had a dog bow and it said like, for Archie. And it was like, their dog's name is Archie. AI is so crazy and is so easy to be able to pull information now from anything that's open. So again, Facebook posts, social media posts, TikTok, blogs, news articles, wedding registries, anything that you've ever like, sent to someone that's about you that they can read that's not like locked down can all be scanned in a matter of seconds. And so I don't need to give my mom's maiden name as a security question because it's pretty easily accessible at this point.

[A]

What, like, do you just pick a different one Persona that's a little bit.

[B]

More a separate Persona? Okay, like, again, my Persona has like the same it. I create a Persona and I have like the same four or five security questions and I have like a whole like monologue in my head about like, who this person is.

[A]

I need to do this.

[B]

And it's not, it seems a little difficult, but it's actually like, it gets fun. It's like a fun game you can play. Like, I can be a completely different person online.

[A]

So you, as a cyber security expert, you always do the automatic software updates?

[B]

Why, yes, without a doubt. The way that software updates work is usually the software has a hole in it, like a flaw, a vulnerability that hackers have been able to find. And the reason why a lot of software updates happen is to patch that hole. Say, like, hey, we just found out that someone got in doing this, so we're going to patch that. And so they can't do that anymore.

[A]

Really? I thought that they were updates because the software is getting better.

[B]

It could be both, but you can now find out what the software update's about. So I just.

[A]

When they say fix Bugs, they mean holes that hackers.

[B]

That's exactly what it is.

[A]

I'll be damned.

[B]

And most of them. I would, I don't know, I don't have the statistic, but I would. I honestly think that like 90% of software updates are to, to fix some type of bug or vulnerability because hackers are getting so much better. And like you're only as strong as your weakest link. There are always so many holes when you're building softwares and so it's just better to. I mean, what's the, what's the harm in having an auto update? It's again, another thing takes two seconds every time you download an app. Just have it on auto update. Not, not a big deal. Once you have that on, then you're good to go.

[A]

I'm the weakest link. That's what I'm realizing.

[B]

Everyone is the weakest link. People are the problem, but they're also the solution.

[A]

Okay. And you're. I know we're going to get to the solution as you're listening. If you're not panicking as much as I am, don't worry. I'm panicking for both of us because I've made every single mistake. It's true.

[B]

We're all alive right now. So that's good. Now we learn from it.

[A]

That's true. And I consider myself to be somebody who is pretty savvy around tech, but I am not savvy around cyber security is what I'm understanding. Here's one that I found fascinating as a cybersecurity expert. You never plug your phone into a random charger.

[B]

Yes. So there's this thing called juice jacking. So if you have like, you know, the USB plugs at the hotel where you can plug it in to charge your phone.

[A]

Yeah, of course.

[B]

And every time you say trust this device. Right. Cause you're like, I need it to charge my phone.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

When you trust it, it can do multiple things. It's not just charging. You can like send and receive things from that port. And so a lot of times in cyber warfare and cyber espionage, like spies would literally manipulate that in certain areas to get information out of your phone and plug. So as a spy, they never plug that in. And it's to be fair, two second fix. You don't have to plug it in the usb, just plug it into a wall. That can't happen in a wall. But usb, there's a way to actually like manipulate it where you can download and receive files from and phones or even install like bugs onto your phone so they can start seeing. Is it likely going to happen to people? No. But as a cyber professional, I don't. It's not that hard for me to plug it into a wall versus plug it into a usb.

[A]

You also refuse to think, oh, hackers aren't interested in me.

[B]

That is, like, everyone's going to be biggest downfall because it doesn't matter who you are. They just want money. Like, if you are an easy target, you're an easy target. And everyone is gonna be an easy target because we were never taught how to protect ourselves. So we're reusing the same passwords, and they're gonna be very easy passwords. And it's not that hard for hackers to, like, find one account and then get into another. It's. It's very easy. And so, again, if you're an easy target, they're gonna go after you because they want money.

[A]

My jaw is already on the floor, and I certainly didn't know a lot of what you've already shared, Caitlin. And there's so much more that we're gonna get into. And as you're listening and watching this, I'm guessing you probably didn't know a lot of this either. Do me a favor. Do not keep this information to yourself. Please share this episode with the people you love who you also wanna protect. I'm talking your partner, your parents, your kids, your coworkers. This conversation might be just the thing that protects them from making a mistake they can't undo. And don't go anywhere. After a short break and a few words from our amazing sponsors, Caitlin has so much more to teach you about how to protect yourself online. And I promise you, you do not wanna miss the number one scam on Venmo, because you and I will fall for this if you don't know about it. So stay with me. You know that feeling when your brain is fried? You have, like, 12 irritating tasks you don't care about, but you have to do them anyway. That's where I've been lately. The administrative stuff was eating up half my day. So I've been using Microsoft Copilot as my extra set of hands. It's like having your own personal assistant. That's why Microsoft Copilot is my favorite AI tool. Last week, I had to send this long, overly complicated email about scheduling and travel, the kind of thing that takes up way too much energy for what it is. I opened Copilot, talked to it out loud while I was walking around my kitchen, and Copilot turned it into a clean, professional draft. It was amazing. And because my brain wasn't fried, I had the energy to sit down and eat dinner with Chris without feeling mentally wiped. That's the whole point for me. Microsoft Copilot clears the clutter so I can be more present for the moments that matter. That's why I'm using it. If you want to try it for yourself, visit Microsoft.com Melrobbins to download the Copilot app. Get started with Copilot today for free and see how handing off the small stuff gives you more energy for the moments that matter. That's Microsoft. Relationships are hard. You know that fight you keep having? The one that starts about the dishes and ends up with you never listen to me? Yep, it's not about the dishes. Listen up, because my good friend Jay Shetty just dropped a new Audible original series called Messy Difficult Conversations for deeper connection. And the whole point is love isn't perfect, it's practice. In this series, Jay guides three couples through the kinds of conversations most people avoid. But they're so important, you're invited into real coaching sessions behind closed doors, couples working through resentment, broken trust, and the family baggage people drag into relationships. There's no script here, just real talk about real life. And what makes Messy Love powerful is you don't just hear the hard moments, you get tools you can use. How to communicate with clarity and compassion. How to break the blame and withdraw cycle. How to rebuild trust, create emotional safety and appreciate every day. It's emotional, raw, hopeful. This is Messy love. Go to audible.com messylove to start listening today. I swear, this time of year, shouldn't it count as a workout? I mean, you're hauling boxes, hosting family, chasing kids, juggling a hundred things and somehow you still feel guilty for not working out. On top of that, temptation is everywhere. Cookies in the break room, leftover pie in the fridge, drive thru dinners because you're too tired to cook. It's so easy. Oh my gosh. To let your goals slide. That's where peloton comes in. They've just released the new Peloton Cross Training Tread plus, powered by Peloton iq, their most advanced piece of equipment yet. It's not just a treadmill, it's a full cross training experience that helps you break through the busiest time of the year without losing momentum. Peloton IQ gives you real time, strength, coaching. It tracks your form, counts your reps, even suggests weights and goals as you go. This is smarter, safer training that fits your schedule. And with that swivel screen. You can go from a 45 minute run to a five minute stretch without missing a beat. It's variety that keeps you engaged in personalized plans that keep you consistent even when life tries to throw you off. So let yourself run, lift, sculpt, push and go. Explore the new peloton cross training [e-mail]. Welcome back. It's your buddy, Mel Robbins. You and I are learning how to protect yourself online, how to stay safe from award winning cybersecurity expert Caitlin Sarian. So, Caitlin, what's the number one way that people are getting hacked right now?

[B]

There's two ways, right? There's reusing passwords. So they're getting into their accounts that way. Because what people don't realize is they have a lot. A strong base password, I like to call it. So for example, let's just say your base password is let them.

[A]

It's not by the way. So anyone trying to tell I'm not that dumb.

[B]

So you say it's let them and, or let them theory. And then your next password, you're like, oh, I have to update this password again. Let them 1, let them 1, 2, 3. Let them 1, exclamation point. A lot of people use that same base password and they've had that same base password for, for God knows how many years. And what hackers can do is in seconds, they can run an algorithm that runs 10,000 variations of that base password that was leaked and in the public.

[A]

Oh my God.

[B]

And get into your accounts. And then once they're in their accounts, they'll use it to scam other people or use it to scam you. And so there's a lot of issues with reuse passwords. The main other issue that I see is like actual scams, like call scams or phishing scams on emails. So we're going to go through a lot of them. But one of the call scams that I've heard a lot is the FBI or like some police agency calling. And again, it's not them, but it's really, really obvious they know a lot of information about you because again, your information is out there for the public. It's, you can buy your information for pennies. Like you can probably buy Social Security numbers for like $2. So it's not that difficult to find. And people get calls and they're mortified. And the way that these calls work, scammers literally know exactly like the psychology behind getting you to react.

[A]

What is the scam?

[B]

They call and they say, oh my gosh you missed either like a hearing, a court hearing, or you got a ticket and you never paid, or you missed jury duty. Oh, you have to pay us or we're going to come and arrest you. Like, what? Yeah, it's a whole thing. And they know exactly where you live. They're like, we know that your, you know, parents address is here. You're, you're here. You've lived at this address for how many years? Like, they go through the whole thing and people are mortified, they're going to get arrested and they're like, we need you to go send crypto. First of all, if anyone needs you to send crypto, let's just be red flag. But again, you're in the situation if.

[A]

Somebody'S asking you to send or wire crypto. It's a scam.

[B]

It's a scam. But like, you're, when you're in the situation, it really feels real. Like they're calling your personal phone. They know exactly who you are. They know who you're like, married to. They know everything. And so these scammers are so, so good at just getting you to react. And so a lot of it is like phone calls or even like just regular phishing scams that we've seen, but they've gotten so much more enhanced. Wow.

[A]

How do you know if you've been hacked?

[B]

So this is, I mean, it just depends on like, what, like if you're talking about your phone or your computer.

[A]

Or let's go through each one. How do you know if your phone's been hacked? How do you know if your bank account's been hacked? How do you know, like, how do you know if your Amazon account's been hacked?

[B]

So a lot of times with pretty much any account, you can see who's logged in. Like if you go on WhatsApp, you can see like the last session that it was really. And where it's. Yeah, even on your phone right now, if you pull out your phone, you can see who's logged into your like, iPhone and where, where they're located.

[A]

Okay, I got to go do that.

[B]

It's not, yeah, that's not that hard to do. But I always kind of look, every couple like months I'm like, who has been logged in on my account or like on my WhatsApp or on my iPhone or on my Gmail. You can see like, you can go to your Gmail account history, you can go to like my activity and you can see all of the logged in sessions and where they're located. And you can do that with Instagram and you can do that with social media. For me, that's the easiest way to tell if someone's in there, because there's like a history of who is there and where they're logged in from.

[A]

And what about, like, banking? Like, I've heard, like, if you get a weird, like, hit on your account for like A dollar or $2, that's somebody now penetrating a charge before they're gonna hit you big.

[B]

It's harder to do banking because there's so many banking frauds out there. Like, I don't wanna tell you to do one thing when, like, you know, they do another thing. So, for example, I don't wanna say, hey, you're never gonna get a text from the bank. Cause a lot of people get text messages. So if you're getting a weird message that you didn't anticipate. Every single time I've ever gotten that, which hasn't happened a lot, it's happened once. I immediately call my bank. I like, go to my bank card, look at the back on the phone number and get the phone number for my bank. And I call them immediately and say, hey, I don't know what's going on. I just want to make sure. Because even the. The fake text messages. Right, right.

[A]

That you think through into something look real.

[B]

They look real. So anytime. First of all, this is a separate thing. I never answer phone calls from people I don't know. And I. My voicemail has. Does not have my name. It does not have a greeting. Because if people are calling me, they know it's me. Hackers use that same thing. And they say, one, okay, we're confirming that that's her number now. Oh, and two, they're getting your voice to potentially use for voice scams, or getting your voice to potentially use to authenticate you into banks. So they can record your greeting saying yes or no. Right. A lot of times if you answer the phone and you're like. They say, hey, is this Caitlin? And I say, yes, that yes can be used to authenticate into a banking phone. So these sound scary again. But if you don't answer the phone for people that you don't know, and if you don't, like, have a voicemail, you're avoiding it.

[A]

It's so true. You know, there's so many of us. I'll speak for myself. And I'm sure as you're listening or you're watching this on YouTube right now, that you're doing nothing to protect yourself online. Like you think you are right. But as I'm listening to this, I'm just thinking of the huge digital footprint of all the information and the fact that they can then probably spider it to my son's information and my daughter's information and my husband's information and my parents information and just like one giant family tree, it's now one giant digital footprint. What do you say to someone like me and the person who's listening right now who feels so overwhelmed by the idea of needing to protect themselves online?

[B]

I would just say, like, again, if you start implementing these simple routines, you'll feel so much more empowered in the future. Like, it seems very difficult, but like I said, okay, so don't answer the phone and don't have a voicemail. That's that solves your problem right there. Done. Check that out. Do that for the one thing for the week and then you're move next week, you can do something else. But it's just simple little things that you now know that you're empowered with like that information to go out and do it for yourself. Or if you want to keep your voicemail, that's totally fine. Is it likely that like a hacker is really going to use your name? I don't know, but I'm just trying to tell you what it is and tell you how you can protect yourself.

[A]

I hear a lot about voice cloning scams. And as a family, we have a password, which I am not gonna say what it is for the inevitable moment when there is a voice cloning scam that happens so that you can say, what's the password? If you feel like something's weird and we have this weird random word. Yeah, that's how you know if it's family member who's talking about.

[B]

Right. So we call it a safe word. Because you can call a password too.

[A]

A safe word. I like safeword better.

[B]

So we call it a safe word. So what happens is these scammers are getting so elaborate and they're literally using our voice from public podcast episodes, TV shows, whatever.

[A]

Or your social media account.

[B]

Yeah, social media. It's not that hard to stitch together a few words and try to scam your loved ones. And they pretend to be you and say, oh my gosh, I'm stranded on the side of a road. Can you please venmo me a certain amount of money? I just need it to like, I left my wallet. Can you just send it to me? And the only way they can tell, like your family member can tell it's you is if you use that safe word. Right. So let's just say your safe word is green bananas. If my mom gets on a phone with someone that says that they're me, she's gonna be like, okay, if this is really Caitlin, can you please tell me your family safe word? And if I say green banana, she knows it's like, this is a big threat.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And so I would rather it's again, two seconds. The only way you can really tell with these is to have a family safe word. Or it doesn't have to just be family, but like, a loved one safe word.

[A]

Wow. Yeah, I know. So many people are falling for Venmo scams.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And can you explain what they are, why these are so dangerous, and how you can protect yourself?

[B]

Yes. So what happens is that scammers literally send you money. Money.

[A]

Send you money?

[B]

Yeah, send you money on Venmo. But they're from stolen cards. So they send you money and they say, oh, my gosh, I'm so sorry. I sent it to the wrong person. Can you please send the money back? And you're like, okay, well, I mean.

[A]

That sounds reasonable, right?

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

So all of a sudden, you get a Venmo transfer from someone.

[B]

200.

[A]

Oh, wow. Okay. And you're like, whoa, who's this? I don't know this person. Then all of a sudden, you get a message like, oh, my God, I sent it to the wrong person. Can you please, please, please send it back? Oh, my God. Yeah, this is a scam.

[B]

This is a scam, and it's working.

[A]

And so what happens?

[B]

So then people send it back because they feel bad. And then what happens is, because it's a stolen card, those charges get reversed, but you don't get reversed because you willingly sent them the money. So you're stuck paying these scammers the $200 because the stolen credit card gets reversed. So you actually didn't get the money.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So they're advancing you money from a card that's about to get declined, and now you're out the 200. That's incredible.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Wow. I'm sorry. I'm just sitting here like, holy cow, is Zelle more secure than Venmo? Since it's embedded in a lot of.

[B]

Banks, I try to avoid Venmo and Zelle at all costs, unless I have to. And then I always try to use a credit card wherever possible. Credit card over debit card. Because debit cards, it's the same as, like, Venmo, right? It's like money in, money out. Credit card. They can actually. They're better about reversing charges.

[A]

Okay. Now I have a question.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So you know how you hear on the news all the time, oh, there was a huge cyber breach at this store, that store, the other store, this one, and all this customer data. I hear that. I think, oh, I shop there and then I do nothing.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

What should I do if I hear that there's been a big data breach? Credit card information at a massive retailer. It seems to be happening every other day now.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

What do you do as a customer?

[B]

The first thing I would do is update your password immediately. And if it's a really key account, I would turn on multifactor authentication, which means that you are signing in not just with a password, but like a code that's sent to your phone or your email or your authenticator app. I'd prefer authenticator app, but we'll get back to that. Okay, then if it's like an Experian or type of, like, you know, any type of financial bank situation, they are going to be sending you something in the mail to teach you what to do. And they also offer free credit monitoring for you. Sign up for that. It's free. Why not? The, the main thing I tell people, freeze your credit. Because the issue with those like breaches is identity theft. That's what most people are concerned about is, oh my gosh, I'm going to have identity theft if my Social Security number and my name and all my information's out there. But they can't commit identity theft if they can't open any accounts in your name. And they won't be able to open accounts in your name if you freeze your credit.

[A]

So hold on a second.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So if you don't need to take out a loan and if you don't need to open a credit card, open a new credit card, then you don't need open credit. You can freeze it.

[B]

Yeah. And it's very easy.

[A]

It takes like credit card companies don't ding you if you do that.

[B]

No, no.

[A]

Really?

[B]

No.

[A]

Oh, I didn't know that was a thing.

[B]

There's three credit bureaus. It takes maybe five to 10 minutes for each bureau. Call them or email them. You can freeze your credit and then you just open it when you need it. And I tell people to do that with their grandparents or parents all the time. That's a great idea because you'll never know if someone is, you know, using your parents information to create accounts until it's too late.

[A]

Let's talk about seniors because there's so many listeners that have elderly parents or concerned about their grandparents. And we recently had a very scary issue with scamming related to my mother in law. And they almost got in. Almost.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And she would have been all of it gone, all of her savings gone, all of her retirement gone, everything. How can the person listening help protect their parents from online scams?

[B]

Yeah, so I would first start with freezing their credit and I would also start again a similar communicating. Right. Like there are these scams out there. Like I go to my grandma and I say, grandma, these are the most recent scams, right. Like someone's calling and pretending they're the police, they're going to try to call you. Someone's calling and pretending to be X, Y, Z. If they ever ask you to send money, immediately hang up. And even if they think, if you think, oh, this could be true, I want you to hang up and call this fraud helpline number. So there's actually a fraud helpline number that can walk you through. You could technically have two phones if you want to, and you can be on the phone with the fraud helpline number and they can walk you through what you need to do.

[A]

But I think we should go to their house and sit on their laptop and their computer and do the settings.

[B]

That you've talked about, multi factor authentication, make sure their passwords are updated. Like specifically banks, you know, 401k, all their like retirement savings, all that, like make sure that is a very strong and unique password. And then turn on multi factor authentication. And if you're a caretaker taker for maybe have it go to your phone. Don't have it go to her phone. Cause if you're getting an authentication code, you can call your mom and say, why are you trying to get into your bank?

[A]

Great. I know that there's a person listening or watching right now who is thinking, I gotta protect my kids. So what are the non negotiable settings? Every single parent, every grandparent, everyone who, if you're listening right now and you have friends who have kids, send this episode to them. What are the non negotiables that every parent needs to check on their phone and their child's phone tonight?

[B]

Yes. So for your child's phone, I would make sure that you're on the child, a child account. Like Instagram, YouTube, they all have children's accounts. Right. So if you're under certain age. They do, yeah. If you're under a certain age, you can turn on that child's account. You can also block messages I would immediately block messages.

[A]

Okay, so block messages.

[B]

Yeah. If you're on a child's account, it doesn't, I don't think you can get messages from most of the accounts.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

But to me the thing is open communication and it sounds really, really lame, but if your child knows like, hey, there are a lot of scammers out there and like, don't worry, but if something feels off, just come to me and talk to me. Because this happens to so many people. Like they're not going to come to you if you make this seem dark and scary and that they think they did something bad. But they will come to you if you have an open line of communication saying, I want to protect you, I want you to have fun online. But I also want you to know that these things are happening.

[A]

So when you are the parent and you're checking the phone and you're looking at the apps, what are we turning off on the apps?

[B]

Yeah, make sure their apps are locked down on private mode. Like no kid should have an open Instagram account. You should only be adding your friends and friends that you have actually physically met in person, that you go to school with or you met at a party or whatever it is. Then I would make sure that you can't message. There's a lot of issues with like Roblox and like kids gaming too that like people are messaging that are like adults that are like grooming children. And so I would just make sure that you, you can't message. You turn on private, private mode and you turn on kids settings. I personally wouldn't allow kids to have like Snapchat because they think that message disappears. Nothing disappears on the Internet. Nothing goes away. Even if it disappears, it doesn't go away and people can screenshot it. Don't ever send anything that you wouldn't want like me as your parent to see or your grandparents or whoever else. I had a friend who is really into cyber, obviously and her nephew was like going to the Olympics, like world class athlete in high school, like went to the junior Olympics, met someone online that you know a cute girl that added him on social media. She said that she went to a town across. She like had a mutual friends because she had added his other friends so she thought it was mutual. And they just start talking. They never had a call with each other, but they were talking for like three or four months and she sent him a photo of herself and he then shared a photo because they thought she, he really thought he was, was with her and it sextortion. Scams are on the rise and, and it's really, really rampant in, in teenage boys or younger. And they specifically target boys because they know that they're a little bit more willy nilly when it comes to private photos. But there's two reasons why they do that, right? The first is they want money. So they were basically extorting him for money, saying, I'm gonna leak all these photos of you and you're never gonna have a career and or be an Olympian because I have all these private photos of you and I want money. Or they say continue to give me more photos because those photos will then be used for another scam. After a little bit of time, he shared it with his aunt who is in cyber and was able to fix it. But there is a really good resource.

[A]

What she do call the police.

[B]

She knew a lot of people in the FBI. But there is an FBI research that is free for everyone. So it's called the Internet Crimes complaint center. So ic3.gov ic3 the number3.gov and it is help, like it can help anyone for any Internet crime.

[A]

I just love how clear and practical you are, Caitlin. And I'm willing to admit publicly that I'm making a lot of mistakes here, but I'm also starting to feel very empowered that I can fix this. And I have so many more questions about how you can protect yourself online. But let's take a short break so we can hear a word from our amazing sponsors. And I also wanna give you a chance to share this extraordinary information from Caitlin with the people that you care about. We haven't even covered the five things that she wants you to do. As soon as you're done listening or watching this episode that's coming up a little bit later, we have so many more things to learn from her and to dig into. So don't go anywhere. We'll be right back. As a parent, you give endlessly to everyone around you. Your kids, your spouse, your neighbors. So it's okay to do something that helps you take a little time back for yourself, like delivery through DoorDash. DoorDash shows up when you need it most. You can get everyday essentials delivered like medicines, diapers, groceries and supplies. And if the idea of cooking dinner after the day you just had feels like too much, you can still open DoorDash and get your family's favorite restaurant meals delivered too. There to help when you need a little breather. You know, we were in the studio yesterday taping an episode and we realized, holy cow, we need some marbles we need lunch. We need something else for a different podcast. So what do we do? We didn't send anybody else. We doordash lunch. We doordash the marbles we needed. Trust me, you're going to love it. It's for a little visual experiment we're doing on an upcoming podcast. It's incredible. Whenever I use doordash, whether it's dinner, it's essentials here at work. It's essentials that I need, like hair products, toiletries. It just shows up right at your door, whether that's home, your hotel or work. Order doordash right now to get a little bit of order delivered. It's a new year, which means kind of feels like you got a clean slate. So let me ask you something. Why are you still waking up stiff, sore and exhausted if the first thing you feel every morning is pain? Your body is telling you something needs to change. It's probably your mattress. That's where Mattress Firm comes in. Mattress Firm sleep experts will match you with a more supportive mattress like the Tempur Pedic Adaptation. Its unique tempur material absorbs motion and delivers pressure, relieving support to help alleviate aches and pains. Upgrade to a Tempur Pedic and get next day delivery. Mattress Firm knows the importance of undisturbed quality sleep and can match you with the right Tempur Pedic mattress for your best rest. Shop Mattress Firm's President's Day Sale and save up to $500 on select Tempur Pedic adjustable mattress sets. Restrictions apply next day delivery. Available on select mattresses and subject to locations. See Store for details. In those cold winter months, especially at the start of a new year, one of my favorite things to do is pick a spot in my home and just make it better. And it doesn't have to be big or expensive in terms of what you're going to do to change it. Little changes like organizing your kitchen cabinets, swapping out your bathroom towels. Get a better desk lamp. It can make your space feel totally new. That's why I love Wayfair. From cozy bedding and bath basics to smart storage for every room, Wayfair is a one stop shop for a home refresh no matter what your style is. For me, I wanted to upgrade my office setup. I'm in there all the time and I realized the space felt so bare because there was nothing green. But I also wanted something that I didn't have to water. So I went to Wayfair and found a gorgeous faux olive tree.

[B]

Faux.

[A]

That's a Fancy word for fake meaning you don't have to water it. It completely changed the space, and it looks real. Get organized, refreshed, and back on track this new year. For way less, head to Wayfair.com right now to shop all things home. That's W-A-Y-F-A-I-R.com Wayfair. Every style, every home. Welcome back. It's your buddy, Mel Robbins. First of all, thank you for being here and listening to this and sharing this with the people that you care about. I hope that you're feeling what I'm feeling, which is a little bit like, oh, my gosh, I got work to do. I'm taking notes. There's things I'm gonna do as soon as we're done with this conversation. To protect myself, I hope you're gonna do it, too. Thank you for sharing this information with the people that you care about. And let's jump right back in because I've got so many more questions. Caitlin, what is the first thing you should do the moment your phone is lost or stolen?

[B]

So I would actually preface that you should do this before you lose your phone.

[A]

Okay. What am I doing?

[B]

So I would turn off the ability to turn on airplane mode when you swipe down.

[A]

Wait, what?

[B]

So you know how you can turn on airplane mode and there's, like, an. You can easily do it if you, like, swipe down.

[A]

Oh, yeah, you swipe down. Okay.

[B]

Because the first thing that, like, robbers do is they immediately put on airplane mode so you can't track the phone. But if they can't do that because your phone's locked, then the only way they can do anything is to just turn it off, and they're gonna have to eventually turn it back on. So I don't have the airplane mode so easily available on my phone.

[A]

Where do you go to do that?

[B]

You can, if you, like, scroll down to the control center, you hold it down, and it, like, starts moving. Similar to, like, when you move apps.

[A]

Oh, yeah.

[B]

You can do the same thing on your control center.

[A]

You can?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then you can just delete it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And now that way you have to go and manually do it. Okay.

[B]

Then you just go to settings. Like, next time you're on a plane, you just go to settings, airplane mode, and turn it.

[A]

I can do this.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I'm going to do this. I personally feel that this is an issue whether somebody has lost their phone, whether somebody has had their phone stolen, whether, like, they left it somewhere and just feeling like you've got all of this information on your phone.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You probably have 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 as your unlock screen.

[B]

I hope they don't. But most likely, you know, that's still like one of the most popular passwords outside of password is 1, 2, 3, 4, 5.

[A]

Password.

[B]

Password is the number one most popular password that is still used to this day.

[A]

Password.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, password. I wish I was joking, but I'm not.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

So it makes you feel a little better, right?

[A]

Slightly. What do you, as a cybersecurity expert, what do you think about wearable technology?

[B]

So this is definitely like everything is a risk, right? Online, everything that you do is a risk and you have to choose whether you want that risk or not. And I'm going to give you a little bit of an example of how AI is working out right now with all the data. So we have a ton of data on everyone, right? And by we, I mean like the government, any of the apps that you use. Like I used to use a wearable ring that was tracking, you know, my fertility, my sleep patterns, my stress levels. But can you imagine plugging all that into an AI and how much that would actually know about me? I personally don't feel comfortable giving that information to other people. However, my boyfriend swears by his ring and he doesn't care. So again, this is a risk based approach. Every company has a privacy policy legally. And that privacy policy states what data they're collecting from you, who they're sharing it with, what they're using it for and why they're collecting it. So what I usually do is I take that privacy policy, I actually throw it into ChatGPT or Gemini or Perplexity or whatever, and I say, hey, can you please tell me like, the high level issues that like might come about, like, what are they collecting? Because it's a very legal policy, so it's hard to read. It's like made by lawyers. It's. And it's meant honestly to confuse you. It is meant to confuse you. They don't want you to know all the stuff that they're doing with your data. So I just throw it in and then I'm like, okay, they're only collecting this, this and this. I feel more comfortable. But with wearables, they're really collecting a lot about you as a human being. And sometimes I just don't want that.

[A]

So if I take a privacy statement, which I think I'm probably like 99.9% of people, it's like, except all, okay, move on. I didn't do the thing I was here for.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And I were to throw it into Microsoft Copilot.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And that's the platform I trust. And it gives me a summary of what this is, what I'm giving permission for this company to do. What are the things I'm looking for? Because I would imagine there's language. As a former lawyer, I know there's language that's like, blah, blah, blah, third party, blah, blah, blah, and then it's just sort of buried in there. What are you looking for? That is a red flag as a cybersecurity expert.

[B]

Yeah. So I'm looking at the types of data that they're collecting. So if they're taking, like, biometric data or they're taking, like, really specific. If it's just like a name and an email, go for it, you know? But if they're taking, because it's fake.

[A]

The one that you gave them, because you're no dummy.

[B]

Like, I am.

[A]

Okay. You're like, you can have my aliens go for it.

[B]

Exactly. But if they're taking, like, you know, my, like, menstruation data and my sleep data or, like, for biometrics or anything like that, I'm like, okay, why are you taking it? And so I ask, what data are you collecting, why are you taking it and who are you sharing it with? That is a big thing. So I'm very concerned with who they're sharing it with. Why do they need to share it with these people? I don't know. Maybe it's for, like, you know, metrics, statistics. I have no idea. But some of the, like, recent, like, wearables have been sharing with companies that I don't want to be shared with. So if it's really sensitive data, like your health history, nationalities, I would just prefer not to have it. And then if they're sharing it with interesting companies, like, why are they sharing it with X, Y, Z?

[A]

Well, I'm sitting here thinking about the fact that just about everything that I use is now somehow connected to the Internet.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Whether it is the pad that I'm sleeping on and cooling me down at night, whether it's the alarm clock sunrise that I'm waking up to.

[B]

I do love that, though.

[A]

But what I'm wondering is, for some of these things, is there an option you can look for that allows you to enjoy the benefit of some of this wearable stuff, but that limits what you're sharing back to their general data pool? Do you see what I'm saying? Yes.

[B]

Yeah. So a lot of times there are Options to look and see, I'm turning this on or this on. Like, there are options of saying, hey, don't share my sleep data. Usually those options come at the very beginning. And so a lot of people just blindly accept and say yes because, like, you're. We're excited. We want to use a product, we want to use the platform, whatever it is, we want to use the app. And we're like, yes, yes, yes. But I would go back. Usually they have privacy settings or settings in general, like data privacy settings. And I would start seeing what they do. And there's some toggles, like on LinkedIn, they're starting to use everything that you've posted for their generative AI. So, like, they're training their AI platform based off the stuff that you post.

[A]

Well, that's sort of like what happened with Instagram. Instagram did that update where all of a sudden everybody's locations were live and there was a flurry of texting all day long. And if you don't know about this, please check your Instagram right now. Where it just suddenly opted us all in.

[B]

And it was crazy because it was. Every time you opened up Instagram, it was resharing exactly where you were to the precise location. If you had precise location turned on on Instagram, which I would say probably 90% of the people do 90% of.

[A]

People have precise location turned on.

[B]

Well, it's automatic. When you download Instagram, it's automatically on.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Unless you go into the settings, which I made a few videos like to say, like, hey, only, like limit, limit access or don't allow at all.

[A]

So is one of the things that we should do is to take a day and go through every app that we've downloaded and all the settings and look at the privacy and the data settings on those things?

[B]

Yes. There's three things that you want to look at. Does it have access to your camera, does it have access to your microphone, and does it have access to your location? All three of those things. If it doesn't need it, turn it off.

[A]

And I again, why would it need it?

[B]

Well, you'd be surprised.

[A]

If you're using it, yes. But if not, no. So what should the setting be? Only while using the app. Never once.

[B]

It just depends on what your preference is. Right. For example, I ordered Uber Eats last night and they delivered the wrong thing. And my manager got my phone, was like, don't worry, I'm going to return it for you. And she went, and you have to take a picture of the wrong thing. Right. And she's like, oh, you don't have. You didn't give it access? Because I don't need Uber Eats to have access to my camera roll or my pictures or my camera. Right. Or my microphone. So she allowed. She limited access to the one photo that she took, and she put that photo on and she took a picture and we went off. But for me, I'm like, I don't think Uber Eats needs to have access to any of the ever. And if I need to add a picture randomly, you can allow access to one photo.

[A]

Wait, so are you saying that if you have an app on your phone. Yeah, and, like, I have. Where I've given Instagram or whatever access to, like, my photo library, that it can be in the background scanning my photos.

[B]

Oh, it's not. Can be. It is. Instagram, Facebook, and TikTok have new features in the last, like, two months where they are scanning the camera roll that you have not posted to give you ideas on how to generate fun reel or post ideas. Because they're trying to get you on the platform to post more. Right. So they're literally. If you gave them access to your whole camera roll, they're scanning it, and they're putting together their own version of a potential reel that you might want to post after your trip to Boston.

[A]

Whoa.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So we prevent that by saying, limit access. Limit access.

[B]

Yeah. So, like, for social media, I limit access. I don't say never, because obviously I have to post and I have to put photos on and I have to go through the app, but I limit access to the photo that I'm actually uploading onto the app.

[A]

What about facial recognition software? As a cybersecurity expert, what do we need to know about facial recognition software?

[B]

Yes. So unfortunately, a lot of facial recognition software is unavoidable nowadays. Like, you're walking through the airport and they're scanning your face. I mean, you have to go, they are tsa.

[A]

They are. Okay.

[B]

And even in, like, where are they? Well, actually, every one of them.

[A]

Because, like, you know, I'm looking up. I don't have them in here, but I'm looking up and there's security cameras everywhere. Yeah, you go.

[B]

So there's biometric tracking and facial scanning pretty much everywhere. And I have a concern. One, because biometric is, like, very unique to you. Right. Like, your eyes are. It's like a fingerprint. Your eyes and fingerprint. Your face shape is very, very unique to you. And you can't fix it. Right. I mean, you might be able to fix face shape. With certain things. But you can't change your eyes that much. Definitely can't change your fingerprint. And so my concern is TSA has our biometric ID right. Global Entry has our biometric ID right. Anything is hackable. In my head, anything is hackable. So what happens when people start getting that information? And then the other thing is our phones, from a marketing perspective, are going to start tracking our eye placements. So my concern is, you know how smart AI is, right? Like if you, if you've been using AI, if anyone here has used AI, if you type in like, hey, what do you know about me? It gives like a whole summary of exactly who you are to a T. Now I want you to imagine like someone on the other side of the screen when you're like doom scrolling and late at night and you're watching what you preferably like to watch. It's analyzing every single thing about you. It's analyzing where you're looking, who you're looking at, how long you're staying on this video. It's analyzing the psychology behind what you're watching and understanding who you are as an individual. Hopefully it's gonna start doing better ads. That's what they're saying. Right. But who knows what that information can be used for? And so I recently, you know, it sounds a little scary. I recently partnered with a company that has. It kind of shields you from biometric and surveillance. And it, it's UVA and UVB and blue light blocking. But it.

[A]

Okay, so wait, these are blue blocker, red? Like, well, these kind of have like a pink thing.

[B]

Yeah, they're like also like, it's, it's an infrared screen. So the way that surveillance works is, is usually through infrared technology. So. Because there's like an infrared kind of shield.

[A]

I even had these made for my prescription. This is pretty cool.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Because there's like a kind of shielding on it when you walk through, like the airport or sometimes like when I wear mine, my phone doesn't even register that it's me. Like, it can't even see because it can't really tell where my eyes are. So it's not like, you know, the end all, be all. But it does make me feel a little bit better when I'm like walking through security. You're gonna have to take that off through airport security. But when you're walking just in general.

[A]

Because it wouldn't be able to scan my eyeballs.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

It prevents it a little bit from scanning your eyeballs.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That's really Cool.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So the question that I have about biometric scanning though is that if we're using it for global entry or you're using it for clear or you're using it for one purchase, whether you want to purchase with your fingerprint, do you want to purchase log into your Gmail with your finger, is that a good thing to use or would you not recommend we use it?

[B]

So again, risk based approach, right. For me, I have TSA PreCheck because I travel every week and if I only traveled twice a year, I would opt out of my biometric tracking because it's not that hard for me to wait an extra five minutes for them to like, check who I am, right?

[A]

Yep.

[B]

But unfortunately I travel four or five times a week and that is just not likely. So my risk, yeah, I do not want it. But is it worth me to spend all that extra time to try to fight it? I don't think so. But some people don't, like my sister, my manager, they opt out every time. Everything is a risk based approach on surveillance. And I just, again, I do my best wherever I think I, I can help. I try to fix things and then if not, I've let it go.

[A]

Amazing. You have some shocking news about cameras. Cameras on your laptop, Doorbell cameras. Baby cameras.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Uh, oh.

[B]

So this is not to scare you, it's to empower you. So there are two ways that people get into these cameras. Right. One is again, if you're reusing passwords, which everyone does, so don't be a bit embarrassed by it, but take this as their sign to be like, okay, maybe I shouldn't have the same password for my baby monitor as my Facebook account. Because if you're reusing passwords, they just have to get in and they just mess with you and they can like talk through the camera. They can watch the camera.

[A]

Oh my God.

[B]

Yeah, they can watch. There's also a site, there's multiple sites actually that show every single camera that's on an open network.

[A]

Wait, what does that mean?

[B]

They can literally log into cameras that are like on open unsecure WI fi. So, so if you have a camera and you're on an open WI fi and they like somehow decide to connect to the one like, like the IP address that you're sitting on, they will be able to turn on your camera.

[A]

Whoa.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Just trying to like, process processes. Because you're saying that somebody can hack into my laptop if I'm on an open network and they can turn on, turn on my camera on my laptop and Be watching me.

[B]

I had an old boss that literally had. He didn't have a camera cover on his camera. This was like, like five years ago. And someone had taken pictures. Like, he changed in front of his computer and someone had taken pictures of him and, like, sent him an email being like, we know, like, we have some really vulgar pictures of you that we're going to release. And he was, like, pretty high up in the company that I was working for, and he didn't care. He was like, whatever, release him. But, like, people can turn it on and off your camera if they want to. I just would be. I just put on a camera cover.

[A]

What is a camera cover?

[B]

There's like, little covers that you can buy literally $3 on Amazon. And you just like, cover it when you're not using it. That prevents it, obviously, they won't be able to see anything. And also, just be mindful of where you're connecting. He traveled a lot for work too, so he.

[A]

And so this can happen to your doorbell, it can happen to your baby monitor. It can happen to any camera you have.

[B]

Yeah, there was someone that follows me that someone hacked into their baby monitor, but it was because they reused an old password that was leaked. They heard voices in the baby monitor of some random guy talking to the baby.

[A]

That's terrifying.

[B]

Yeah, it was awful. But again, passwords, passwords.

[A]

Okay, passwords, everybody. I have a stack of emails right here from listeners of the Mel Robbins podcast. These emails have come in from around the world, and they cover all kinds of scams that people have fallen for. One scam is that people buy a copy of the let them theory that is counterfeit. It looks nothing like the COVID Or it's being sold on Etsy or even Shen, the fast fashion site. Or it's spiral bound, or it's paperback, and there's not a paperback version available in the United States. Like, it's just not written by me. Misspelled. But they're falling for it. Lots of emails from people who sadly are getting emails from scammers posing as employees of my company. And basically they're getting more and more sophisticated. The old scam used to be, hey, if you pay $10,000, we'd love to book you. We never pay anybody. We also don't require somebody to pay to be on this show. And now they've updated the scam to say, hey, we never ask anybody to pay. So they're knowing that we're. They know that we put language up on our website about scams and they're Posing as employees. Can you talk to me about the rise of these kinds of things that are happening?

[B]

Yeah. So, funny story. When we first got ahold of your booker, your booker found us. My manager called me and I was like, this, this is probably a scam. I would love it if it's not a scam. But, like, you need to get on the phone with this person, like, and see their face and make sure this is, like, legitimate. Because I don't trust an email. So the first thing is if it's not from a verified source, like your Instagram, Right. Like, if you are not messaging them directly from your verified Instagram, it's not you.

[A]

Well, one of the things that I've also noticed in a lot of scam emails that I get is that people will ask me to click through to schedule a conversation with somebody. And I never, ever, ever do that.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And a lot of these, in terms of the scams that people are receiving, as you know, because they're very convincing, I'm like, wait a minute. That's the name of a person who actually worked here.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Wait a minute. They're saying that we don't pay people to come on this show and you don't have. There's never a fee for you to be on this show. Like, what. How are. They've changed this thing.

[B]

They're saying everything, right?

[A]

But now they're saying. And they're linking to all the prior experts so it looks like really legit. And then they're like, but Mel will give you a private strategy session. We'll build you custom stuff. Like, we don't do any of this stuff. Click here to schedule a call.

[B]

Right? Yeah.

[A]

So you're basically saying, no, no, no, no. Pick up the phone and call.

[B]

Yes. Got it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I don't click. My manager knows do not click on any links.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

That is like a blanket statement rule I have if I need to get a hold of anything. Like, again, if I need to click on a link for a bank, I call them and I only am clicking on it when I'm on the phone with the bank. If you have to click on something, call the person and just say, hey, like, what is this about? Or hover over the link and see where it's going because it will show you the URL. Oh, yeah. So unless it's coming, like melrobbins.com you know, in person interview, I'm not gonna trust wherever it's sending me.

[A]

You mentioned that there are five things that you want us to really focus on. Five things that. If we just focus on these five things, even though you may feel overwhelmed right now, these are the five things that really will protect you online. What are those five things?

[B]

Passwords. We've talked about that a lot tonight. Go and write down. These are accounts that I don't want anyone getting access to. These are my key accounts. And you'll start thinking about more and more as you move on throughout your day. What apps do you not want people have access to? What banks, social media, all of that. So identify your key accounts and make sure that you have strong and unique passwords for all of them. No reusing of the same passwords. No reusing of the same base password. Have. Have strong passwords. Okay, so for those of you guys that aren't like myself or Mel, because you're traveling all the time, probably too. I would. If you're at home using a desktop for, like, my parents. Right. I'm like, please, mom, I'm gonna get you a book.

[A]

We'll.

[B]

We'll put it in the log cabinet right next to your computer. You just pull it out when you're on a computer and you can use it. That way you can actually remember and write down your strong passwords for the people that are always on the go. Yeah. Like, have a unique passphrase or whatever you think you need to remember that, like, longer password. When it says, oh, remember this. Usually it's on a phone and that's. Just remember it's a password manager on the iPhone.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

So you can do that. That's still a password manager. I use a password manager myself. I love it. I swear by it. Or on your notes and just lock it.

[A]

So that's number one. So once we got the password set, what's the second thing?

[B]

We're doing software updates automatically. Right. When you download the app, just turn it on.

[A]

Okay. Because software updates, as a cybersecurity expert, you're saying when it says, ooh, fix bugs, make more optimized, they're actually solving and fixing where the hackers broke in.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

So automatic software updates on all apps. I got that. What's the third thing I'm doing?

[B]

The third thing you are going to do is freeze your credit.

[A]

Freeze your credit.

[B]

Super simple. That's like a one and done thing. You can do that tonight.

[A]

Okay. Because then if you've frozen your credit because you're not taking out any loans, you're not opening up new credits, that means nobody else can either.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Oh, I love that. Okay.

[B]

Can't have identity theft unless you give them, like, extra passwords and stuff, but it's a separate thing.

[A]

Okay, so fourth thing I'm doing.

[B]

The fourth thing you are doing is taking nine seconds before you click on any link.

[A]

Ooh, nine seconds.

[B]

Yeah. There's psychology about the nine seconds of. It's just enough time for you to, like, take a deep breath, think, and realize, like, where you are.

[A]

Got it.

[B]

I didn't do the psychology aspect of it, but that's the nonprofit did. So take nine seconds. And I always just say, just don't click on links. I know that that is not like, as easy for most people, but take nine seconds before you click on any link. And if there's an option for you to just call, I would call.

[A]

Well, and also in those nine seconds, you can look at the email address.

[B]

Exactly. You can look at a lot of things.

[A]

What's the final thing that we're gonna do to protect ourselves?

[B]

Limit the amount of data online. There's multiple ways to do this, right?

[A]

How?

[B]

There's deletion services out there that like every month go through and manually delete all the information that keeps popping up.

[A]

Are you kidding me?

[B]

No.

[A]

This was what I was gonna ask you.

[B]

Yeah. There's multiple services, but I use this one and I'm obsessed with it. It's called Incogni. It's like the best thing ever.

[A]

What's it called?

[B]

It's called Incogni. Like, it's supposed to be, like, incognito, but incogni. Yeah.

[A]

As I was sitting here listening, I was thinking, like, how am I getting my old addresses, my mother's maiden name, and my dogs that have died and everything else? And how am I. How am I going. You can actually scrub your stuff.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You're kidding me.

[B]

No.

[A]

I thought once it was out there, you can't get, like, it's out there.

[B]

I'm very excited for you to try it. It even tells you, like, within 10 seconds it'll say. It'll start scanning and saying, hey, we found all this information, we're automatically sending out opt out requests on your behalf for you. So it's. Yeah. And it's international too.

[A]

So the software is certainly something that if it's within your reach to look at, to potentially, you know, get a subscription to. But if you want to try to do this manually, what are the big websites you go to and how do you do this?

[B]

Yeah, there's like white pages, true people search people, finder. I have an entire series on how to delete it. So usually you have to go and you have to search your own name. Then you have to like scroll all the way down and they make it hard to opt out. But there's like an opt out page. Usually you can find it on their privacy policy. And then you have to have a separate request on that opt out page saying, this is me, please remove my data. I want you to remove it. And then this is bonus points, which we talked about. The sixth one is probably going through your apps and your app settings and seeing what they have access to. Again, it seems like it's a lot, but again the apps, once you set it, it's one and done. Once you have the auto updates, one and done set your password, you don't have to change it for like at least another year unless there is a breach for that account. So all these things, it's just you're building routines. It's like brushing your teeth, right? Like brushing your teeth, washing your face. Did you like doing it? It took extra time. When you were a little kid, you just wanted to sleep, but you learned that that was what's best. It's like any wellness routine too. Like, do I want to spend an hour at the gym? No, it's annoying, but it's going to be better for me in the long run. This is exactly that.

[A]

What's the one thing out of everything you've taught us today that you think is the most important thing for the person who is listening to do as soon as they are done listening? Other than send this to everybody in your family? Because we all need this information and we all need to be smarter about protecting ourselves. And so what's though the one thing to do tonight?

[B]

Yeah, I would do passwords for sure. Get your key accounts, turn on multi factor authentication and make sure you have an updated, strong like long password.

[A]

Okay, Yeah, I can do that.

[B]

You can do that.

[A]

Caitlin, what are your parting words?

[B]

Cybersecurity is not for experts. It's literally for everyone. We use it every day. And it's not supposed to be a scary word. Like I. That's why I don't even like saying cybersecurity because people get so detached from it. They're like, I can't do this. It's way too out of my comfort zone. I have no idea what you're even talking about. Cybersecurity is very simple things that you can do to empower yourself and your family and your loved ones to be safe. Because we are all online now. Don't be afraid. It's very simple things that you can do. And it's not supposed to be scary. It's supposed to be something that you can feel empowered to and then share this with other people.

[A]

I really appreciate everything that you taught me and the person that's here with us today. I have to admit, as we were starting the conversation, I had this really, like, heavy feeling. I have completely screwed this up. The cat is already out of the bag. There's no way that I'm getting in control of this. Everything's out there. There's no way to get it deleted. There's no way to protect myself. I've already screwed up, so why even bother? On the advice, I feel completely different. I feel the opposite now. I feel very hopeful around both the deletion service and the fact that you can go to the websites and manually get yourself removed. So that does something. And I think all five of these things that you talked about, the password, the software updates, freezing your credit nine seconds, and really limiting the amount of information that you are giving online. Because why do they need your phone number? Why do they need all that information you're just pouring out online? And so I feel very empowered and excited to do everything that you just explained. And I feel a little bit smarter. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for hopping on a plane and being here.

[B]

Yeah. Thanks so much for having me. I appreciate it.

[A]

Oh, of course. And I also wanna thank you. Thank you for spending time listening to this and getting smarter and empowering yourself. And didn't you just love the very specific things that you can do? I have a feeling this is one of those resource pages that. That everybody's going like, link, link, link. Tell me what to do. Also, thank you for sharing this with people that you care about, because we all need the facts and we need to know specifically how to solve these issues and protect ourselves. And one more thing. In case no one else tells you, I wanted to be sure to tell you as your friend that I love you and I believe in you and I believe in your ability to create a better life. And there's no doubt in my mind after listening to everything that Caitlin taught us today about protecting yourself online, that feeling safe as you're online, protecting yourself and your family by doing these simple things that she taught us today will help you create and live a better life. All righty. I'll see you in the next episode. I'll be there waiting to welcome you in the moment you hit play. I would like to do it. We're doing it all. Okay. Do it all. Enjoy. Hold on a second. Here comes dinner. Not good on the repeat, everybody. Oh, my God. Okay. That was probably the mashed potatoes bringing up the fish. Okay. I'm so excited for this. I'm so glad you're here.

[B]

I'm ecstatic. I'm here. So honored. Awesome.

[A]

Screwed up. I screwed up.

[B]

I told him that on the first. I was like, this is a red flag. You are from Ohio. But I've learned that there are a lot of really cool people from Ohio.

[A]

There's a lot of really cool. Yep, you're all set. Okay, great. Fantastic job.

[B]

Thanks for having me. This is amazing.

[A]

Really, really fantastic job. Oh, and one more thing. And no, this is not a blooper. This is the legal language. You know what the lawyers write and what I need to read to you. This podcast is presented solely for educational and entertainment purposes. I'm just your friend. I am not a licensed therapist. And this podcast is not intended as a substitute for the advice of a physician, professional coach, psychotherapist, or other qualified professional. Got it? Good. I'll see you in the next episode.

[B]

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[A]

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