The Mel Robbins Podcast

Episode: Change Your Life This Year: How to Get From Where You Are to Where You Want to Be
Host: Mel Robbins
Guest: Dr. Katy Milkman, Professor at Wharton School of Business
Date: December 29, 2025

Episode Overview

Mel Robbins sits down with renowned behavioral scientist and author Dr. Katy Milkman to unpack the science of change—specifically, the seven hidden barriers that keep people stuck and the evidence-based strategies to overcome them. The conversation blends powerful research insights with practical tools, offering listeners an empowering blueprint to create real, lasting change as they approach a new year.

Main Theme:
Change is a skill, not just willpower. By diagnosing your unique internal barriers and applying the right research-backed strategies, you can finally get from where you are to where you want to be.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Biggest Lie About Change

• [10:12] Dr. Milkman: "The biggest lie is that you should just work harder or use your willpower... The truth is that’s not the key to change."
  • Change isn’t a personal failing—most people who struggle simply lack the right strategy, not willpower.
  • Change is a learnable skill (like Excel)—and that skill, once mastered, helps you and those you care about.

2. The Seven Hidden Barriers to Change

[15:56] Barriers Identified:

1. Getting Started – Struggling to begin
2. Impulsivity – Prioritizing what feels good now
3. Procrastination – Chronic putting-off
4. Forgetfulness – Genuinely not remembering
5. Laziness (Path of Least Resistance) – Defaulting to easiest behaviors/habits
6. Lack of Confidence – Not believing change is possible
7. Conformity – Letting norms of those around us set our limits

Mel [16:58]: “For me, it was like impulsivity—ding, ding, ding!—forgetfulness, the bane of my existence.”

Deep Dive into Each Barrier & Solutions

1. Getting Started

• Tool: The Fresh Start Effect
• Research Backstory:
  • Dr. Milkman’s work (with Hang Chen Dai) shows that temporal landmarks (New Year's, birthdays, Mondays, new school years) spark natural motivation.
  • [18:54] Dr. Milkman:

  “Those chapter breaks arise at predictable moments...we feel more separated from who we were before. That was the old me. This is the new me.”

• Practical Tip:
  • Align new goals with meaningful fresh starts—don’t wait for January; use birthdays, Mondays, a move, new projects, etc.
  • It needs to feel significant to you.
• Limitation:
  • A fresh start is just fuel to begin. You still need follow-through strategies.

2. Impulsivity

• Tool: Make it Instantly Gratifying
• Research:
  • Choosing enjoyable forms of goal pursuit increases persistence—e.g., Zumba with friends is better than the stairmaster if you love it.
  • Mary Poppins Effect: “A spoonful of sugar makes the medicine go down.”
• Example:
  • Temptation bundling—pair chores with pleasures (listen to audiobooks only while exercising).
  • [36:17] Dr. Milkman:

  “If I could combine those two things… only let myself enjoy that temptation while doing the chore... life-altering for me.”

• Further Ideas:
  • Save favorite podcasts for chores; add music to dull tasks; make a task social.

3. Procrastination

• Tools: Use “Carrots and Sticks”
• Carrots: Make tasks enjoyable (as above).
• Sticks: Impose consequences & accountability.
  • Commit to a friend, set deadlines, “fine yourself” if you don’t follow through.
  • Use public commitment, self-imposed penalties (apps like Beeminder, Stickk), or social pressure.
• [42:29] Dr. Milkman:

  "You can literally put money on the line that you agree you will forfeit if you fail to achieve a goal by a certain date..."

4. Forgetfulness

• Tools: Checklists and Cue-based Plans
  • Adopt checklists (as surgeons/pilots do).
  • Make detailed, cue-based ‘if/when-then’ plans—when/where/how you’ll act.
  • Use reminders: calendars, emails, alarms.
• [49:06] Dr. Milkman:

  "The way that we store memory is through these cues. That’s what triggers our memory."

• Pro Tip:
  • Involve others for joint plans—social planning increases accountability & success.

5. Laziness (Path of Least Resistance & Habits)

• Strategy 1: Make the good behavior the easiest thing to do (change defaults, reduce friction).
• Strategy 2: Build healthy habits using consistent cues, repeated actions, and rewards.
  • Example: Have a gym close by and your shoes ready, so going is easy (not requiring effort).
• [57:53] Dr. Milkman:

  “Think about how do you create minimal friction between you and the good things you want to do and maximize the friction... to do all the things that are bad.”

6. Lack of Confidence / Fixed Mindset

• Tools:
  • Growth Mindset: See yourself as a work in progress—setbacks are for learning, not evidence you’re broken.
  • Seek social support—a coach or group can act as a placebo to boost belief.
  • Reverse Psychology:
    • Have struggling individuals advise others (even hypothetically)—this boosts their confidence and commitment to their own goals.
    • [65:42] Dr. Milkman:

      “When we actually coach others... it boosts our competence and our confidence.”

    • Experiments show students improved grades simply by offering advice to peers.

7. Conformity / Social Influence

• Key: Who you spend time with shapes your behavior and beliefs about what's possible.
  • Your social group’s habits and limits can lift or constrain you.
• Research Example:
  • Roommates’ habits impact academic performance (Scott Carrell study, Air Force Academy).
  • Copying strategies of people you're close to is more effective than just being given random ideas.
• Pro Tip:
  • Intentionally seek out mentors, friends, or colleagues who model your desired habits; make your goals social.
• [73:49] Dr. Milkman:

  “If you seek out friendships, relationships, work companions, mentors, etc. who are achieving at a high level, that can show you what's possible. And also, of course, you can literally copy and paste the strategies...”

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Learning how to change is a skill, just like using an Excel spreadsheet is a skill, and you can master that skill…”
  —Dr. Katy Milkman ([12:03])

• “If it is painful to pursue your goal, you will quit. That is simply how we are wired… Find a way to make it enjoyable.”
  —Dr. Katy Milkman ([80:55])

• “You don’t fail because you don’t care, you fail because you forget.”
  —Mel Robbins ([47:11])

• “Make the easiest thing in your life the thing that’s good for you.”
  —Dr. Katy Milkman ([57:53])

• “If you start with the premises that the person... has a desire to change, but then everything just falls apart... There are seven barriers... that are preventing us.”
  —Mel Robbins ([15:06])

• On Social Influence:
  “The people around us have huge power over what we achieve and whether or not we get to our goals.”
  —Dr. Katy Milkman ([77:44])

Step-by-Step: Evidence-Based Framework for Change

[78:51] Dr. Katy Milkman’s Blueprint:

1. Set a concrete, measurable goal
   • E.g., "Exercise 3x a week," not "get in shape."
2. Make a specific plan (When, where, how)
   • Add social and pleasure elements if possible: "Do Zumba with Mel on Mondays."
3. Apply the right tool for your barrier:
   • If you keep forgetting, add reminders and clear cues.
   • If you lack confidence, coach someone in a similar position.
   • If you feel lazy, make the process the path of least resistance.
   • If you need accountability, add stakes or a partner.
4. Give yourself grace on setbacks.
   • Use “reserve days” for emergencies (research shows this boosts consistency).
   • Remember: “Change is hard. There is no silver bullet. You are human.”

Timestamps for Key Segments

| Time | Topic | |-----------|---------------------------------------------------| | 07:36 | Why evidence and strategy trump willpower | | 10:12 | The "biggest lie" about change | | 15:56 | The 7 hidden barriers described | | 18:54 | Science & story of the Fresh Start Effect | | 32:14 | Impulsivity & making goals instantly gratifying | | 36:17 | Temptation Bundling explained | | 42:29 | Using "sticks": accountability & self-imposed fines| | 46:22 | Forgetfulness—cue-based planning | | 57:53 | Laziness—habits & defaults | | 62:40 | Lack of confidence—growth mindset & mentoring | | 73:49 | Conformity and the power of social influence | | 78:51 | Step-by-step evidence-based plan for change | | 80:55 | The top lesson: “If it’s painful, you will quit” | | 82:15 | Final thoughts: “Grace and flexibility” |

Closing Wisdom

[82:15] Dr. Milkman:
“Give yourself grace. Recognize that setbacks are just part of the journey and have a growth mindset. None of these tools are 100%—you will always face setbacks, and it does not mean there’s anything wrong with you.”

[84:28] Mel Robbins:
"There's no doubt in my mind, if you really take to heart everything you learned today and you share this with the people you love, you will make those changes."

Summary Table: The Seven Barriers & Research-Backed Solutions

| Barrier | Solution Tool(s) | How to Apply | |-----------------------|-------------------------------------------------|--------------------------------------------------------------------------| | Getting Started | Fresh Start Effect | Begin with meaningful moments (new year, birthday, Monday, new job) | | Impulsivity | Make it Fun/Temptation Bundling | Pair difficult tasks with pleasures; choose enjoyable forms of action | | Procrastination | Commitments, Accountability, Sticks | Set deadlines, enlist referees, add penalties, make public commitments | | Forgetfulness | Cue-Based Planning, Reminders, Checklists | Make specific plans, calendar reminders, checklists | | Laziness (Habits) | Change Defaults, Build Habits | Reduce friction for good habits, increase friction for bad; build routines| | Lack of Confidence | Growth Mindset, Coach Others, Social Support | Learn from setbacks, give advice/mentor others, immerse in supportive groups| | Conformity | Social Modeling, Deliberate Social Choices | Surround yourself with people who model desired behavior; join communities|

In Mel’s words:
“It’s not that you’re broken—it’s that nobody taught you the skill of change. But now you have the tools.”

Further Resources

• Download Mel’s free year-end planning workbook (mentioned at episode’s open): melrobbins.com/bestyear
• Dr. Katy Milkman’s book: How to Change: The Science of Getting from Where You Are to Where You Want to Be

Share this episode with anyone ready for a fresh start and real change.