Get Back on Track: 3 Small Habits That Change Your Body, Energy, and Life

Summary

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The Mel Robbins Podcast

Episode: Get Back on Track: 3 Small Habits That Change Your Body, Energy, and Life
Host: Mel Robbins
Guest: Charles Duhigg (Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist, author of "The Power of Habit")
Date: December 1, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Mel Robbins sits down with Charles Duhigg, renowned habits researcher and bestselling author, to unpack the science of lasting change. Together, they reveal the three "keystone habits" that can create a positive ripple effect through every area of your life—without relying on willpower. Duhigg shares evidence-based strategies for implementing these habits, overcoming obstacles when forming new routines, and explains why habits matter more than talent or willpower. The conversation is packed with practical tools for listeners to reconnect with their best selves, especially if they've fallen off-track.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Science of Change, Habits, and Identity

• Change is possible for anyone. "Every habit can be changed...You can become any person you want to be. You can build the habits that make you into a marathoner. You can abandon the habits of drinking or overeating that have weighed you down." – Charles Duhigg [07:00]
• Habits shape your life more than talent. Citing Aristotle: "We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act. It's a habit. So is slacking off. So is procrastination. They're all habits, and they all operate the same way in our brain." – Charles Duhigg [11:08]
• The Habit Loop: Habits consist of a cue (trigger), a routine (behavior), and a reward. About 40–45% of what we do daily is driven by habit, not conscious decisions. [12:08]

2. Keystone Habits: The "Big Three"

Habit #1: Exercise

• Why is it foundational? "For many people, exercise is a keystone habit. It changes how we think about ourselves and starts a chain reaction—in your eating habits, your productivity, even your finances. Research shows people who exercise in the morning use their credit cards less that day and procrastinate less at work." – Charles Duhigg [08:20],[09:50]
• How it rewires self-image: "When I start running, even just once a week...suddenly I start thinking of myself as the kind of person who's a runner." [13:23]
• Practical implementation: Building a solid exercise habit requires intentionally designing the three habit components:
  • Cue: Time of day, visual reminders (e.g., running shoes by bed), commitment to others (meet a friend). [21:03]
  • Routine: The physical activity itself (any form—walking, gym, even standing up regularly counts). [14:35]
  • Reward: Immediate reward after (smoothie, satisfying calendar check, a favorite coffee, or even savoring the self-discipline). [22:30]
• The mistake to avoid: Punishing yourself after exercise negates habit-forming; build in rewards and celebrate each step. [23:53]

Habit #2: Morning Routine

• ARC Framework:
  • A – Anticipation: Look forward to at least one thing in your day (e.g., lunch with a friend, special activity). [29:59]
  • R – Relaxation: Purposefully calm your nervous system, even a few minutes with tea, reading, or enjoying a shower. [30:00]
  • C – Connection: Connect with someone (a family member, a pet, or even yourself through meditation/journaling). [30:00]
• Why it matters: Morning routines set your self-image ("I'm proactive, not reactive") and help you focus, resist distractions, and approach the day intentionally. [42:46]
• Examples: Making your bed, meditating, journaling, or eating breakfast. The routine is less important than doing it intentionally with ARC elements. [32:39],[34:08]
• The reward: Take a moment to feel accomplished, proud, and enjoy the result (a tidy room, a quiet mind, a good breakfast). Savor the reward—don’t rush past it. [49:05]

Habit #3: Tracking Something

• Why tracking? "Tracking is like a small interruption that reminds us of our 'why' and brings intention to autopilot behaviors." – Charles Duhigg [60:54],[61:29]
• Examples: Water intake, meals eaten, money spent, sleep times, steps walked.
• Impact: "People who simply write down what they eat lose more weight even if they make no other changes." Tracking makes patterns visible and activates your intentions. [61:49]
• How to implement: Pick one thing you care about reframing (e.g., bedtime, snacking, spending). Use a simple journal or app. The act of tracking itself is the keystone habit. [68:03],[67:01]
• Overcoming resistance: It doesn’t have to be perfect or complete—just create a moment of reflection each day. [64:23]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On simplicity: "It is simple. That doesn't mean it's easy. But we're gonna make it easier." – Charles Duhigg [08:00]
• On identity shifts: "There's a part of your brain that pays attention not to what we think we should do, but how we actually behave." – Charles Duhigg [16:20]
• On self-reward: "The biggest mistake that we make...is not giving ourselves a reward and then not letting ourselves enjoy the reward." [48:02]
• On intentionality: "The more intentional we are, the more we achieve our goals and the happier we are." [36:17]
• On tracking: "Tracking is to remind you, 'Oh, Mel, I'm the kind of person who wants to be healthy, who wants to have a lot of energy.'...It keeps you present and intentional about what you're doing." – Charles Duhigg [64:34]
• On mental habits: "If you find yourself falling into mental patterns that you don't like, just recognize they're habits. They have cues and they have rewards. You can change them just like you started running or just like you drink four glasses of water every day." [78:50]

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Actionable Takeaways with Timestamps

Understanding & Building Habits

• [11:22] Define your target habit: "Pull out a piece of paper and write down the cue, the routine, and the reward."
• [21:03] Set intentional cues: Choose external/environmental triggers for new habits.
• [24:09] Use the dog training principle: Pair routine with clearly defined rewards.

Implementing Keystone Habits

• [22:30], [49:05] Always reward yourself for new habit behaviors. Savor the moment.
• [30:00] Morning routine ARC: Anticipation, Relaxation, Connection.
• [44:40] Key morning routine choices: make bed, organize surroundings, eat breakfast, have a moment of sociability, meditate/journal.
• [56:33] Implementation intentions: Pre-plan, in a "cold state," the precise circumstances and actions for your new habit to avoid hot-mind willpower failures.

Tracking & Disrupting Old Habits

• [65:06] Budget tracking: Once a week, review all transactions to prompt better decisions.
• [67:01] Pick something simple to track—sleep, water, money, etc.—and just jot it down daily.
• [70:04] Changing vs. breaking bad habits: Identify cue and reward, then substitute a new routine that provides a similar reward (the "golden rule").

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Practical Examples from the Episode

• Exercise Habit: Lay out clothes, commit to a workout time, set a reward (coffee, check on calendar, etc.). [21:03], [22:32]
• Morning Routine Example: Make your bed upon waking, savor a clean room, anticipate something fun, connect with a loved one or yourself. [29:59],[32:39]
• Tracking Example: Use a mason jar to monitor water intake; keep a notebook to write down bedtime or meals. [58:35], [68:03]
• Breaking a Late-Night Snack Habit: Identify boredom as the cue, need for novelty as reward, substitute calling a friend for snacking. [72:05]

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Closing Thoughts & Inspiration

• Believe you can change: "Any habit can be created, any habit can be changed. You can live the life that you want." – Charles Duhigg [77:21]
• On mental habits: Recognize thought spirals or negative talk as changeable habits. Counteract with intention and positivity. [77:35]
• The power is in the process: Focus on cue, cold-state plan, and reward for each change you wish to make. [76:39]

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For Further Reflection

If you take away just one thing:
Habits—not willpower or talent—are the foundation of who you become. By understanding and intentionally shaping your habit loops, you can create a lasting positive identity and the life you want.

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Transcript

[A]

Hey, it's your friend Mel. And welcome to the Mel Robbins Podcast. You know, right about this time of year, I get so tired of my own excuses, don't you? I mean, aren't you tired of saying, okay, this week it's gonna be different. This week I gotta get my act together. And then you try to start sticking to that budget, or you try to read more instead of looking at your phone. Or you finally are gonna try exercising every day. And look, I'm going to give you some credit because you start strong. Me too. You're excited to change. You're motivated. You're getting your act together. And then life hits you. Skip a day, you feel off, and before you know it, the whole thing falls apart. And then you're back to thinking, what's wrong with me? Why can't I get my life together like all these people I see online? Well, let me tell you something. There is nothing wrong with you. You're not lazy. You don't lack discipline or willpower. You're just going about it the wrong way. I did too. For years. Because no one taught you the truth about how change actually works. I'm talking the simple science of it all. Well, that is going to change today. And so is your life. Because today you are going to learn the formula based on research for how to create change that sticks, change that snowballs, that rewires who you are. I'm talking habits. And you want to hear something really exciting? Based on the research, there are just three simple habits. Just three. Now, these three habits, the research shows they up level everything. Your focus, your energy, your confidence. Heck, you're gonna even learn that they make you spend less money. What? And here's the best part. These three habits, they don't require willpower. And if I can do them, you can do them. After today's conversation, you will be doing them too. Because you have the world's best instructor here today to help walk you through step by step, this extraordinary and exciting research. And you're gonna know exactly what to do. Our today is the Goat of Habit research. I'm talking a Pulitzer Prize winning researcher, a three time New York Times bestselling author. I've been wanting this dude to be on the podcast since I started this thing two and a half years ago. His work has changed my life, and it's gonna change yours. Because once you understand how these three habits really work and you start using them to create positive change through every year of your life, you'll become the person you really wanna be. So let's do this thing. Introducing your new Dell PC with the Intel Core Ultra processor. It helps you handle a lot like organizing your holiday shopping and searching for great holiday deals. Plus planning the perfect holiday dinner for vegans, vegetarians and pescatarians. Luckily you can get a PC with all day battery life to help you get it all done. That's the power of a Dell PC with Intel inside, backed by Dell's Price Match guarantee. Get yours at the best price of the year by visiting Dell.com holiday terms and conditions apply. See Dell.com for details. Listen when it comes to career college, everything, you're not behind Seriously, this new year, think of Southern New Hampshire University as your next step. SNHU has over 200 online degree programs to choose from. They're flexible, affordable and designed to fit your life. So whether you're 20 years old or haven't taken classes in 20 years, no sweat, SNHU has you covered. Visit snhu. Edu Mel to learn more. That's snhu Eduml. You know how you have that one friend that you always go for relationship advice to or the mentor at work who's got your back when it comes to career moves? Well, when it comes to travel, Expedia has your back. Trying to decide between a vacation rental and a hotel, Expedia makes it simple to compare options and find the right fit for every trip. Plus, you can book flights, rental cars, cruises, hotels, vacation rentals, even activities all in one place. Bundle and save on your next trip with Expedia by adding a hotel or vacation rental to your flight. Book your next trip with Expedia today. Hey, it's your friend Melissa. And welcome to the Mel Robbins Podcast. I am so fired up that you're here. I am so fired up about the conversation today because the person that you're about to meet, this expert, he has been on my wish list since I started this podcast. And if you're new to the podcast, I want to take a moment and personally welcome you to the Mel Robbins Podcast family. I'm so thrilled that you're here and if you're here right now because somebody shared this episode with you, well, you picked a winner of a conversation to listen to. Joining you and me today is none other than Charles Duhigg. Charles is a Pulitzer Prize winning journalist, a three time New York Times bestselling author, and one of the most respected experts in the world on the science of behavior change. He is also the author of the seminal book on habits, the Power of Habit. Now this book was published in 2012 and it has sold millions of copies and has been translated into 40 languages. It has transformed how millions of people think about motivation, focus, follow through, habits. His work has been cited in more best selling books on behavior change than I can list. But there are two I know for sure and those two happen to be the ones that I wrote. The five second rule and the High five habit. Charles is lasering in on three particular habits that research say are the king and queen of all habits. And Charles will tell you that these are called keystone habits based on the research. If you just focus on these three, they will create positive ripples through your entire life. So are you ready to meet the new you? I'm sure you are. Please help me welcome Charles Duhig to the Mel Robbins Podcast.

[B]

Thank you for having. This is such an honor for me. I really appreciate it.

[A]

Well, you know, your book the Power of Habits changed my life. It is the best and it is the seminal and it is the original incredible book about habits. The research is unreal. I cannot wait for you to unpack all that today. And I'd love to start by having you speak directly to the person who's listening. They do not have a lot of time, but they have found the time to spend it with you and me. And they cannot wait to learn about your research with habits, how to create a positive ripple effect in their life. Can you tell this person what might change about their life if they take all, everything that you're about to share today and they apply it?

[B]

Absolutely. Absolutely. So here's the thing. I would say every habit can be changed. You can create as many habits as you want. You can change that. That habit that's been driving you crazy for years, you can change it because the way that habits work is that it's a very simple thing that happens inside our brain. And once we know how to take a habit and break it apart into its components, then suddenly we can adjust anything that we want to in our life. So you can become any person you want to be. You can build the habits that make you into a marathoner. You can abandon the habits of drinking or overeating that have weighed you down. Once you understand how to change the habits.

[A]

I love that you started there because you said simple. And to me behavior change on its face seems simple, but it is so dang hard to do. And so you're seriously going to teach us how we could create habits that change who we are, make more money? That's a habit.

[B]

Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. You're exactly Right. It is simple. That doesn't mean it's easy.

[A]

Okay?

[B]

Right. There's lots of simple things, but you're gonna make it easy, but we're gonna make it easier. We're gonna tell you exactly the steps to take. Because the truth of the matter is that once we start to change our habits, it has a cascade effect and it changes the rest of our life.

[A]

So cascade, meaning what?

[B]

Meaning that there's a chain reaction that something happens that causes other habits to change without us even having to use our willpower to change them. Within the literature, this is known as a keystone habit.

[A]

Okay. What is a key? I almost called it a ski stone. But what is a keystone habit?

[B]

So a keystone habit, what we know is that some habits are more powerful than others.

[A]

Okay? So there's a hierarchy to habits.

[B]

There's a hierarchy to habits. And sometimes when you change, the right habit sets off this chain reaction in the rest of your life. One of my favorite examples of this is exercise.

[A]

Okay?

[B]

Right. So we all know that on the mornings that you go and you exercise, for some reason at lunch, you eat healthier, Right? And if you think about it, that doesn't necessarily make any sense, Right? But it's easier. For some reason, my legs are kind of sore. Suddenly I go into the cafeteria and I get a salad instead of that sandwich that I always get. But what's really interesting is that these two researchers named Otin and Chang, what they looked at is other things that change. What they found is that on the mornings when people exercise, they tend to use their credit cards less that day. What, they procrastinate less at work. They'll actually start doing the dishes, like washing the dishes 20 minutes earlier in the day than when they usually do. Now, nobody goes for a run in the morning and thinks, like, oh, I'm going to keep the Amex in my pocket today. But what's happening is that for many people, exercise is a keystone habit. When you start to exercise, it sets off this chain reaction that changes other patterns in your life. Your eating patterns, your spending patterns.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

It's really powerful.

[A]

Well, okay, so I just wanna back up a minute because I'm excited, because you're not only gonna teach us the research and science about habits and the simple things you need to understand to lock them in. But you've already said something that I wanna make sure that the person listening really captured. Okay? And that you're gonna take away. Because one of the things that struck me about your remarkable New York Times bestseller, the Power of Habit, is that being successful in life isn't about talent, that the science says that habits shape who we are and the outcomes that we achieve. More than your ability. Can you unpack what that means? Because I think it's really exciting to listen to this conversation today as an invitation to change the type of person you think you are. And if you've been telling yourself that you just don't have the talent or you don't have willpower or you're not athletic or any of these other things, the research says otherwise. Tell us what that means.

[B]

That's absolutely right. And we've known this since Aristotle. Aristotle once said we are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act. It's a habit.

[A]

And so is slacking off.

[B]

So is slacking off. So is exercising every day. So is procrastination. They're all habits, and they all operate the same way in our brain, okay? And the key to changing them is just to understand what's going on.

[A]

Okay? And is habits just a fancy researchery word for patterns? Like, these are patterns in your life or what is that?

[B]

So there's a part of our brain known as the basal ganglia that creates habits. And every animal on earth has a basal ganglia. Without it, we would not have evolved to become humans or anything else. And it exists not just to create patterns, but to create a specific kind of pattern and to explain. Let me tell you how a habit works, okay? We think of a habit as one thing, but actually, there are three parts to every habit. There's a cue, which is like a trigger for an automatic behavior to start. Then there's the routine, the habit itself, what we think of as the habit, the behavior. And then finally, every habit in our life is. Has a reward. It delivers a reward to us, whether we're aware of it or not.

[A]

Huh?

[B]

Now, about 40 to 45% of what we do every day is a habit.

[A]

45%?

[B]

Yeah. We think of it as a choice, but actually, when you're backing your car out of the driveway, you're operating on habit. When you walk into the cafeteria and you get that unhealthy lunch instead of the salad you said you were going to have this morning, that's a habit. When we get home and our kid's kind of annoying us, and we, like, are short with them, that's a habit, okay? And if we can diagnose the cue and the reward for those behaviors, for those routines, we can change that habit or build new ones.

[A]

And you're also here to teach us that there Are three, as you call them, keystone habits. These are like the Whoppers.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

These are three things that you can teach yourself to do that create the biggest ripple effect in terms of changing the way that your life is and changing who you are.

[B]

Absolutely. These are three habits that we know are keystone habits for almost everyone. And if you make this change, you can just watch the change ripple through the rest of your life.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That's exciting.

[B]

It is exciting. It is exciting.

[A]

Okay, well, let's jump into it. Let's talk about the first one, which is exercise. Why is exercise a keystone habit?

[B]

Exercise is a really, really powerful habit in many people's lives because it changes how we think about ourself right now, for folks who are already athletes, okay, if they take, let's say they have a baby, they take six months off, they go back to running, it might not be a keystone habit for them, or it might be a keystone habit that they've already built in their life. But for someone like myself, somebody who never, never exercised in high school. Right. Didn't play any sports, when I start running, even just once a week, even for just like half a mile, suddenly in part of my brain, I start thinking of myself as the kind of person who's a runner. The kind of person who's a runner, they don't use their credit card, like wastefully, they don't procrastinate at work, they don't eat unhealthily at lunch. What's happening there is that I'm actually changing my concept of self by engaging in this keystone habit. So now the next question is, how do we build an exercise habit?

[A]

Right. Well, let me ask you a question though. Does it have to be running?

[B]

It doesn't have to be running.

[A]

Okay. So when you say if you were to develop a habit of exercising, moving your body, whether it could be running, it could be going for a walk every day, it could be going to the gym three days a week, it could be any form of exercise works.

[B]

It can actually even be standing up from your chair regularly. We know. Yeah, we know that. You know how your watch sometimes buzzes and it tells you it's time to stand up? That's based on research. Research that shows if you can get yourself to a place where you're habitually standing up every 45 minutes or every 35 minutes and you're just standing and walking around for 10 seconds, that it will change your other behaviors because it changes your self concept. It changes how you think about yourself.

[A]

Now, I want to make sure that as you're listening to Charles, because this is such an important idea, because I think a lot of us think we should exercise because we know it's good for us and we think that it's something that we should do. What you're saying is something different. Just stop and think for a second as you're listening to Charles and think about the kind of person that goes to the gym five days a week. And now, even if you're not that kind of person, you probably can imagine that there are certain things about that person that you know to be true. Because they seem to have the discipline, or in your words, the habit of moving their body that regularly, that maybe they don't procrastinate. Maybe they get out of bed when the alarm rings. Maybe they have more energy during the day. Maybe they are a healthier eater. Maybe they don't bury themselves in a bottle of wine every night. I don't know. But you have assumptions about who that person is. When you see somebody doing something and you're saying that the same thing happens to yourself, that when you become the kind of person who, who doesn't drink or the kind of person who saves money regularly, or the kind of person who exercises regularly, it changes your identity. That's super cool.

[B]

It's absolutely amazing. And you're exactly right. There's a part of our brain that pays attention not to what we think we should do, but how we actually behave. And in psychology, this is known as stated versus actual preferences.

[A]

Stated versus actual preferences.

[B]

So my stated preference might be that.

[A]

I work out or stop talking and do it.

[B]

Yeah, exactly.

[A]

You want to be that person? Prove it.

[B]

There's a part of your brain that does exactly that. And they say, you know what, you got up this morning and you went for a quarter mile jog. You're kind of. You're kind of a jock, you're kind of an athlete. You're kind of awesome. And I'm going to start changing our behavior based on this concept of what you actually do. That's how habits change our life.

[A]

You know, one of the things that's incredible, and I want you to explain the science behind how just this one habit. You're going to teach us all the mechanics of how to lock in exercise, whatever your form is, as a habit. But can you explain the science? Cause you wrote about this in the book, about how exercise compounds and leads to other changes, like eating better, being more productive, even spending less money. You wrote about in your book, it's on page 109. That people who start running suddenly quit smoking or start budgeting.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Why does exercise cause a ripple of other positive change?

[B]

Well, let me ask you a question.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

On the days that you exercise, if I was to ask you, Mel, are you, are you a person who has a lot of self discipline or not? What are you more.

[A]

You better believe I do, Charles. I got up today at 6:30 and I was in an exercise class at 7am before I came to the studio.

[B]

That's pretty impressive.

[A]

And I feel like a woman that has discipline.

[B]

And you know what? Your brain is impressed with you too. And your brain is saying, well, if Mel can wake up at 6:30 and be in our exercise class by 7, well then it's gonna be easy for her to have a healthy lunch. Right. That's a simple thing. She's already proven how much self discipline she has. This is. Our brains are constantly looking for clues as to who we actually are. And when we give them the right clues.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Our brain becomes our partner in changing our behavior the way that we want it to change.

[A]

So simply doing this keystone habit that you're about to teach us, the three steps to locking in exercise as a habit will lead to a ripple of other things that you're currently not doing.

[B]

Absolutely. Now that doesn't mean that tomorrow your life is gonna change because you went for a run. But here's the thing about how habits work, is that it doesn't matter what you eat for lunch today, it matters what you eat for lunch every day. Right. So when that ripple starts, when you start to change those habits, what you'll see is slow. Slow at first, change in other patterns. But each time you do it, each time you get up to go exercise, each time you walk into the cafeteria and you get something healthy to eat, it's going to be a little bit easier than the time before. And eventually you're going to find, and this can actually happen in just a couple of weeks that you don't even think about waking up in the morning anymore. You just do it automatically. It's a habit. It feels really normal and natural and all those other changes will become stronger and stronger and stronger until you have the life that you want.

[A]

Why does the brain respond that way? Like I? Because. Because I think it's exciting. If the first keystone habit that you're recommending that we really try to implement in our life is to make it a habit to exercise to move your body.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

Why does it do that in your brain? What is, what does the research say about that?

[B]

Well, so first of all, exercise is very powerful in terms of the neurotransmitters that it helps to release. Right. There's these pleasure hormones that we end up feeling when we exercise. But the second thing that happens is that when we start to exercise, oftentimes for many people, exercise is kind of intimidating. Right. If you've never gone to the gym before, you're like, I don't want to show up. I don't want to. Like, I'm going to look stupid. I don't know.

[A]

Honestly, it's scary. Like, I literally travel a lot for work, and it took me a long time to walk into a hotel gym because I didn't know what to do do in the gym.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And so I agree with you. There's a lot of resistance. And then if you've let yourself go, you're like, oh, my God. I don't even want to confront how out of shape I am.

[B]

Right. So let's talk about how we overcome that, please.

[A]

Because I think exercise is one of those things that everybody would agree. This is something that I know is good for me and I need to do more of it, but I don't feel like it. How do we use your research to make this easier?

[B]

Absolutely. So I mentioned before the habit loop. Right. Every habit has these three components. A cue, a routine, and a reward. Okay, so if I want to start an exercise habit in my life, or if you want to start an exercise habit in your life, we got to figure out, first of all, we have to choose a cue.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

A cue usually falls into one of five categories. It's a certain place, the presence of certain other people, particular emotion, a particular time of day, or a preceding behavior that has become ritualized.

[A]

Okay, so if I want to build.

[B]

An exercise habit, I'm going to build as many cues as I. As I can. I'm going to say, okay, look, when I exercise, I'm gonna set the alarm for 7 o'. Clock. I'm gonna have my running shoes right next to my bed. I'm gonna plan on meeting my friend Jim at the corner.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Right. So here's what I've done. I've created three cues for myself. A time of day, a certain environment, a particular place.

[A]

Cause I see my shoes, that's a reminder.

[B]

And then the presence of certain other people. Right. Because Jim. Jim's gonna be pissed if I don't show up to, like, after we planned, run together.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

So now I've set some cues for my exercise routine.

[A]

And the cue, the. The important thing about the cue is. It is there to kind of go, ding, ding, ding, Charles.

[B]

That's exactly right.

[A]

This is the time to do this thing you said you were going to do.

[B]

Over time, just seeing that cue will make you automatically start exercising.

[A]

Okay, got it.

[B]

So we, we, we want them to be somewhat stable. And we're just gonna choose them. And we're just. It can be anything. We can experiment with them. Then I'm gonna go and I'm gonna do my exercise. I'm gonna run for three blocks.

[A]

Okay?

[B]

Right. And afterwards, as soon as I can. So we've done the cue, the routine. The third part is the reward. Afterwards, I'm gonna give myself a reward as quickly as I can.

[A]

And what's a what? Give me an example. Reward.

[B]

A reward. Let's say you go on a run. A reward could be you have a smoothie when you come home, right? Or a reward could be you let yourself take a nice long shower. A reward could even be that you have a little calendar and you make a check. Every day you go for an exercise and you look at it and you think, oh my Gosh, I have 313 checks this month. I'm amazing. Anything can be made into a reward. We just have to give ourselves that reward. Now compare that to how most people try to start exercising, right? Here's what they do instead. They say, I'm going to go exercising tomorrow. And then they wake up at seven and they're like tired and they're like, where are my shoes? Where's my running stuff? Then they go and they run three or four blocks and they come home and now they're running behind, right? And the kids need breakfast. And like, so they jump in the shower. They take the fastest shower that they can. Then they're rushing to get the kids to school because they're going to be late for school. Then I'm rushing to my office. And as soon as I got into my office, I wasn't able to do all those emails. What I'm doing in that case, I'm actually punishing myself for exercising that morning.

[A]

That's so true. And then the next morning when you wake up, you're like, I don't feel like doing this cause I don't have enough time. Because you're thinking about the fact that yesterday it didn't work.

[B]

Your brain pays attention to what you reward yourself for and what you punish yourself for. And if you punish yourself for exercising, even if you don't mean to punish yourself for exercising, even if just not thinking about it ahead of time makes what happens afterwards a punishment. Your brain will be like, I don't want to exercise anymore. I'm not going to make that easier.

[A]

Wow. So it sounds like the single biggest mistake that each and every one of us makes is not understanding these three components and not being intentional about what they are. Because if you don't have the three components, you're not locking in the pieces that make it automatic.

[B]

That's exactly right.

[A]

You know what I can give, I want to give two examples to see if these are accurate. So if you've ever trained a dog, like, we have this dumb thing that we always say, let's go see the puppy. That's like the verbal cue to be like, we're going outside and we're walking to the part of the lawn where I hope I'm gonna train you to go number two or number one.

[B]

Right.

[A]

The pattern I'm looking for is walk with me. After that cue, let's go see the puppy. And then when they go to the bathroom, what do we do? We give them a biscuit. And that's the reward.

[B]

That's exactly right.

[A]

Because now you're getting the dog to be trained to understand that that verbal cue leads to the biscuit.

[B]

That's exactly. And let's talk about what happens in your brain. Your brain, the basal ganglia, actually will take that cue, that routine, the behavior cue, routine, reward. It'll connect them and actually make the neural synapses between those parts of your brain that are involved with that activity make them thicker, so it's easier for an electrical impulse to run down that synapse and to actually activate that part of your brain. Your brain is designed just like our dog's brain, Just like every brain of any animal on earth, your brain is designed to build habits. Because if you didn't have habits, you wouldn't know how to stand up from your chair. If you were walking down the street and you saw an apple in a rock, you would have to stop and think, which one of those should I pick up and eat? Habits are an energy saving technique that our brain uses so that we can think about other things.

[A]

You know, what's interesting is that as I think about the example of training a dog, the second I say, let's go see the puppy, I know the dog is not thinking about peeing. The dog is thinking about a treat. And, you know, if I think back to a period in my life where I had a rock solid, I'm talking keystone made of granite, thick, amazing habit of exercising every day. It was when I was a young mom and there was a particular yoga studio that I loved, and I would always go to this particular class. So I would set my alarm and I would put my yoga outfit on the floor at night so that when I woke up, it was right there. I had to see it. I typically met a friend there. And afterwards, there was a great bakery across the street where I could get a latte. And if I had the kids in tow and they were reading a book, they could get like a chocolate chip muffin. And what's interesting, and maybe you can explain this, is that the second the alarm went off once, I had done this several weeks in a row, and I saw the yoga clothes, which in your language is a cue. This is the cue. We're going to yoga and we're doing the walk now. We're gonna go, you know, do our stretches now. Whatever your form of exercises is, you've got the cue. Okay, I'm doing it. The second I saw those clues, do you know what I thought about the latte? I literally could feel the taste of this iced latte. What is happening in your brain that makes you not think about the exercise, but actually makes you start to think about the biscuit if you're a dog, or the latte if you're Melrose?

[B]

The reward you're gonna get at the end of it. So I mentioned before that habits exist to help our brain save energy. And our brains always wanna save energy. That's one of our brains big goals. And so it wants to take as many decisions out of your life as possible. And so one of the things that your brain is doing is it's saying, okay, if X happens, if I see X, if this Q emerges in my life, I want to make this behavior that I know delivers a reward to me as simple and easy and automatic as possible. I don't want to have to think about it. I don't have to work at it. I don't have to want to use my willpower to make it happen. And the way that I do that is I actually power down the brain, the basal ganglia. When you're in the grip of a habit, you are actually thinking less. You're actually not making decisions. You're just acting automatically. And we've all felt that before, right? We've all felt that. It feels kind of relaxing. Like when you're driving to the store and you get onto the road that usually takes you home, and suddenly you find yourself home and you're like, oh, I didn't Mean to come home. I meant to go to the store.

[A]

Or how did I even get here? I don't remember driving.

[B]

Right. It's because you're relaxed, because you're not having to think about it. So what's happening? When you would wake up in the morning and you would see those workout cloth and you started imagining the latte, your brain was saying the best way to make it easy for Mel to go do yoga, because I know that yoga is good for her because it delivers a latte. I know it's something that she wants because it's something that's important to her. The best way I can help her is I can actually take away all the need for willpower. I'm going to make it automatic for her. And the thing is, once it's automatic, we hardly even have to think about it. We just do it. Wow.

[A]

All right, well, let's move on to keystone habit number two. So the first one, if you want a ripple effect exercise.

[B]

Absolutely.

[A]

What is the second keystone habit?

[B]

So the second keystone habit is to have a morning routine. And morning routines are really, really powerful. Folks who are listening, they might have heard about these speeches that were given about making your bed right. That a number of commencement speeches. The speakers have said, the most important thing you can do as a college graduate is make your bed in the morning. Now, why? What is it about making your bed in the morning? Well, a morning routine oftentimes determines how we feel about the rest of our day. And how we feel about our day influences the choices that we make and the habits that come out during that day. Now, a morning routine, every morning routine should have three components, and it's easy to remember. It's arc. Arc. A morning routine should, first of all create anticipation for the day. Right? And anticipation means maybe I'm choosing maybe I'm just thinking about one thing I'm excited about. Today. I'm just going to take 30 seconds, and I'm just going to imagine, like, you know, I'm going to lunch with Mel. I'm really looking forward to that. I've got anticipation for the day. The second thing r is relaxation.

[A]

When I Relaxation.

[B]

Relaxation. Now, that doesn't mean it has to be a lot of relaxation, but I'm going to let my nervous system calm down a little bit. That might mean, literally, I just have a nice cup of tea and, like, do the wordle. It might mean I take a shower and then. And I just let myself kind of like, relax in the shower for 10 or 15 seconds. Right? So arc anticipation. Relaxation. And then the third thing that a morning routine ought to have to be really powerful is to have connection that you want to connect with at least one other person sometime in the morning. Now, that might mean that it's your husband, it might mean it's your kids, it might mean it's your dog, it might mean that you feed the fish, but that sense of connection is going to wake something up in you. That means you will seek out connection during the day. And we are happiest when we're socializing with other people.

[A]

So those are the three components.

[B]

Those are the three components of building a morning routine.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

And they're really simple. It's very straightforward. So let's take making your bed as an example. Right? So it's not actually just the making the bed that matters.

[A]

What matters.

[B]

What matters is that when I'm making that bed, I'm saying to myself, you know what? I'm going to start by making like, today's going to be a good day. I'm doing the anticipation. Today's going to be a good day. I started, I woke up, I'm going to my room. Looks really nice. The comforter is all smooth. This is going to be a good day. Anticipation, relaxation. Actually, when you're making that bed, like, oftentimes, one of the things that happens is you kind of just like, feel like I have time this morning. You have to have a schedule that gives you the time to make your true. You have to. You have to have time to relax, right? If you wake up at the last minute, you can't make your bed. So if you set your alarm a little bit earlier so that you can make your bed now, suddenly you've got time to have that cup of coffee, to read the paper, to do the wordle. So you've got the anticipation, you got the relaxation, the connection. Most of the time, when I make that bed, it's also, I'm making my wife's bed, right? My wife and I, we sleep in the same bed. And so when I make that bed, I'm doing something nice for her. I'm connecting to her. Now, she might have already left for the day, but simply reminding myself, I'm going to make this bed look nice for Liz when she comes home, that gives me that connection. So something as simple as making a bed which takes what, 15, 20 seconds, that is enough to build a morning routine that can change the rest of your day.

[A]

So that's the way that you can start to lock in this keystone habit is when you get out of bed. Make the bed. But take a little bit of time and be present as you're doing it to get all of that goodness that the research says. And then you can add on from there.

[B]

You can add on from there. And the thing that you might have noticed is that we're giving ourself a reward. Right.

[A]

What is the reward?

[B]

Well, the cue is that I'm waking up. I look at the. At the unmade bed, and I'm gonna go make the bed. Right.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

There's the cue. There's the routine. I'm making the bed. The reward is that I'm giving myself a little bit of. A little bit of, like, props. Right. I did something nice for my wife. I should feel pretty good about myself. That's cool.

[A]

My room's clean. I don't have to do this later.

[B]

I look at my room, and it looks amazing. That's kind of a reward.

[A]

Now, are there other examples of things you could do in the morning that check off the arc?

[B]

Absolutely.

[A]

What are they?

[B]

They can be anything. The key isn't that there are some behaviors that are more powerful than others. The key is to take the behavior you want and to give it that anticipation, that relaxation, and that connection.

[A]

Okay. So because I know that the person listening is like, me, and they're like, just tell me what to do.

[B]

Right.

[A]

So you're basically saying that it's not that there's particular things in the morning routine that are more important than others. It's that you need to create this keystone habit of having your routine of something you do in the morning, every morning, simply for the sake of creating anticipation, Relaxing a little, which means just actually slowing yourself down so your morning doesn't start like a tornado. And what was the c. Connection. Connection. Yeah, some connection either to yourself, to another person, to being present in the moment. So are examples like meditation?

[B]

Absolutely. Meditation is a great example. Right. Because when you're meditating, usually what you're doing is you're, like, anticipating a little bit the rest of the day. Right. I. I really want to, like, get centered because I have that meeting coming up, and I'm looking forward to it, But I don't want to be too excited. Right. I'm relaxing because meditation is relax, relaxation, and I'm connecting with myself. Connection doesn't have to be with another person. I can connect with myself. Or let's take morning journaling or saying a prayer every morning. There's a number of people who find that a keystone habit in their life that's really powerful. Their morning routine is that they wake up and they say a prayer. Why would that be powerful? Well, it's because, first of all, as I'm saying that prayer, I'm oftentimes thinking about the people I want to help, the people that I'm going to see my son tonight. I want him to be safe, but I'm excited to see him. There's that anticipation. I'm in a moment of contemplation, and that's relaxing and I'm connecting to whoever you're praying to. The connection doesn't have to be with another person. It can be with ourself, it can be with a spirit. But that connection reminds us how much value we get from socializing with other people, with spending time being part of a community.

[A]

You talked about how exercise creates this ripple effect. And there's all this research that shows that people that exercise stop smoking, they spend less money during the day, they make other healthy choices. How does creating a habit of a morning routine that has this anticipation, this slowing down and relaxing and being in the moment and the connection to self or connection to nature or connection to another person, how is it that having something you do every morning that has those three things, how does that ripple.

[B]

Through your day in two ways? Well, one of them is when you have that morning routine, you actually have to kind of plan for it.

[A]

It.

[B]

Right. If I know that I'm going to start making my bed in the morning, I figured out yesterday that, like, I tried to make my bed and it was just I ran out of time. So today I'm going to set my alarm five minutes earlier, right. So I have time to make my bed.

[A]

And also you're thinking, I'm just the kind of person that makes my bed, which means I'm orderly and organized.

[B]

I'm disciplined. I'm the kind of person who can go do other great stuff because I woke up this morning and I made my bed. So that's a really important part of it is I'm changing my self image. I'm forcing myself to plan a little bit. But most of all, what I'm really doing is I'm reminding myself to be intentional. Think about all the times in your life when you've been most intentional, right? When you. The gifts you get for your husband that you really think about, the party that you plan, the thing you're going to say to your kid that really is something meaningful. The more intentional we are, the more. The more we achieve our goals and the happier we are. And there's something about building a morning routine, a morning ritual that allows us to be intentional about it. And when we are intentional, what we're doing is we're giving ourselves the gift of being able to think about the rest of our day, the rest of our week. All the things we want to accomplish that now feel like they're within grasp.

[A]

That makes so much sense. This feels like a great moment to hit the pause button. Give our amazing sponsors a chance to share a few words. And as you've been listening and learning from Charles, I am sure, just like me, you are thinking about all kinds of habits that you would love to create in your life. And you're probably also thinking about people in your life who need better habits. You know what they need? They need a little Charles Duhig in their life. So share this conversation with them. Better it comes from him than you and me. You know what I'm saying? Share this conversation. Don't go anywhere. Charles has so much more to teach you about making habits in easier when we return. So stay with us. The Let Them Theory is the best gift you can give this holiday season. It's the gift you give to someone who's overwhelmed, to the people pleaser, to the friend who carries way too much, to the sibling who's exhausted from dealing with everyone else's emotions, to the coworker who needs a break. It's meaningful, it's practical, it's hilarious, and it's life changing. The Let Them Theory for everyone on your list. Available at letthem.com and wherever books are sold. Today's show is brought to you by Apple Watch. You've heard me say this before on the Mel Robbins podcast. If you want to improve something, you gotta track it. So if you're not sleeping well, tracking it is gonna help you get better quality sleep. But how do you track your sleep? Apple knows the Apple Watch Series 11 gives you real insight. With the Sleep Score. You'll learn about your sleep duration, bedtime, consistency, how often you're waking up, and how much time you're spending in each sleep stage. 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Select locations only while supplies last. See lowe's.com for more details. So we have a tradition here at the Robins household. On Christmas Eve, everyone gets a present. Only they know what it is. It's a new set of pajamas, but this year I'm upgrading the tradition because I'm buying Soft Lounge Sleep Set pajamas from Skims. They're lightweight. They're beyond comfortable. They look cute. They feel great. I love them so much. My husband Chris says, oh my gosh, do you ever take those things off? Skims also has PJs for men, women, kids, even pets. This year YOLO and Homie and Mr. Noodle are going to get PJs too. So if matching PJs are your thing, because they're my thing, Skims is your go to this season. Grab your new favorite [e-mail] after you place your order. Be sure to let them know we sent you select podcast in the survey and be sure to select the Mel Robbins podcast in the dropdown menu that Follows. And if you're looking for the perfect gifts for everyone on your list, the Skims Holiday shop is now [e-mail]. Welcome back. It's your buddy, Mel Robbins. Today we are talking all things habits, in particular, three keystone habits that create positive change through your life and what the research says about what you can do to make forming new habits easier. What does the research say about the difference between a person that has a habit of having a morning routine that creates anticipation, relaxation, meaning we're slowing down, we're not running through the morning like a freaking tornado, and connection to something like yourself or other people or something important to you? What's the difference between that person, even if it's just making your bed, and somebody who doesn't have a morning routine? What's the research say?

[B]

Well, what the research says is that when you have that morning routine, you tend to make much better decisions. And in particular, you tend to make better decisions on what to focus on. Right. So if you think about the challenges that we all face every day in life, a lot of them are there's some things that I want to be able to focus on, but I get distracted. I get distracted by someone bringing me a problem. I have to react to my kids. I get distracted by my phone. I get distracted by this email that just came on, and I'm suddenly worrying about something. Yeah, we want to accomplish the things that we care about, and those distractions are the things that draw us away from it. And when we start with a morning routine because of that intentionality, what we're saying is we're saying I'm the kind of person who doesn't react. I'm the kind of person who is proactive, who makes choices about where to focus my attention. And that's really, really powerful because as we start defining ourselves as a person who makes proactive choices rather than reacting to the chaos of life, then suddenly we start seeing ourselves in that light. And when that notification pops up on your phone, you say, whatever, I'll wait until later to deal with it. I'm focused on what I want to be focused on right now.

[A]

Wow. So knowing that the person listening is probably a lot like me, and they're like, okay, but what's the list of things that should be in the morning routine? I mean, clearly you can exercise because that's another keystone habit. So now you're powering up two things. But if you had to give somebody, like, a menu of things to choose from if they're building a morning routine based on the research, what are kind of the top five things that you would want somebody to think about? And obviously, we gotta bring the ARC framework to it, right? Where we're actually infusing what we're doing with it. But what are, like, the actual things to do that based on the research are kind of the big ones.

[B]

So there's a couple of things that we know consistently have a powerful effect on people when they do them in the morning.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

In addition to making your bed, if you do something that has an organizational element, it makes you feel settled, it brings that relaxation. It usually gives you a chance, as you're organizing, to think about the day. And oftentimes, when we're organizing, we're doing it for other people.

[A]

Like what? Give me an example.

[B]

I wake up every morning and I go through the house and I pick up all the stuff that my kids have left. They leave cups everywhere. There's cups on every single surface. I pick up all the cups and I bring them to the sink and I put them in the sink. That's one of my morning rituals. Another one is eating breakfast right when we sit down and we eat breakfast with our family, or even if we eat breakfast by ourselves. That is a morning ritual that we know has huge impacts. In fact, the National Weight Loss Registry, the largest database of people who have lost weight on Earth, say that there are two major things that determine if you lose weight, and one of them is eating breakfast.

[A]

Really?

[B]

Now, why is eating breakfast so powerful in helping me lose weight? Because I'm eating well for two things. Number one, I'm not hungry later in the day. It helps me regulate my meals. I feel a sense of discipline. But number two, if I have a breakfast routine, it means that I have created space in my life for having breakfast. I'll bet you I'm like, look, I have to have breakfast every single morning. It's going to take 10 minutes to eat that bowl of cereal. I need to set my alarm 10 minutes earlier. Now, suddenly I'm being intentional. Now suddenly, I'm planning what my day is going to be like. So if you can do something that has an organizational element, that's going to be powerful. If you eat breakfast, that's going to be powerful. Number three is if you get a chance to spend time with other people. Now, that might mean spending time with your kids at the breakfast table. It might mean that you walk to work with your friend, and you guys meet up and you walk over together. It might mean that you're taking your dog for a walk or you're giving him a cuddle, right? When I find a habit that has some sociability to it, that's going to be a powerful morning routine. And then from there, it can be almost anything you want it to be. As long as you decide. This is a behavior I want to do every morning as part of my morning routine. I'm going to journal every morning. I'm going to say a prayer every morning. I'm going to meditate every morning. Whatever it is, I'm going to call up a friend. I'm going to listen to this comedian that I like. Whatever it is, as long as you're planning around it, you have a sense of anticipation for the event. It creates anticipation for the day. You're relaxing because it's something you enjoy and you feel connected to something, then it's going to be powerful.

[A]

I love that. I absolutely love that. Is there any mistake that you see people making in terms of not being able to lock in the habit of a morning routine that has these elements?

[B]

The mistake that we sometimes make is that we don't allow ourselves to enjoy the reward.

[A]

What is the reward?

[B]

Well, okay, let's talk about exercise for a minute. Think about how many people will say, like, you know, I went for a run this morning, and then I let myself have a really good kale smoothie. That is not a reward. Nobody likes a kale smoothie, Right. We drink them because it feels virtuous to us. But the people who are going to continue exercising are the ones who say, I had a kale smoothie and then I added some fruit to it and I put a little bit of sugar in it. Or I had a strawberry smoothie, which is a little bit less healthy than a kale smoothie. But you know what? I really like it oftentimes, particularly in America, because we are stoics, Right. We don't like to reward ourselves.

[A]

Speak for yourselves. But. Okay, go ahead.

[B]

Oftentimes we try and punish ourselves for doing the right thing.

[A]

Right.

[B]

I just went on that long run, and now instead of just like lazing in front of the tv, now I'm going to go lift some weights. So the biggest mistake that we make when it comes to morning rituals or when it comes to any other habit that we're building is not giving ourself a reward and then not letting ourselves enjoy the reward.

[A]

Well, I don't know what the reward is in the morning routine.

[B]

Okay, so which. Which routine are we talking about?

[A]

Let's just say I'm meditating.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Which I don't have as a habit. So I don't know why I'm picking that one. But that's what.

[B]

So what's. When you do meditate, how do you usually feel afterwards?

[A]

Well, when I have meditated in the past, I feel accomplished, I feel more present, I feel proud of myself that I did it, that I'm the kind of person that meditates because I'm married to somebody who is that kind of person.

[B]

And so those are all the beginnings of rewards. The question is, how do we make them into a reward? Because if you feel accomplished, if you feel proud of yourself, that's a reward. It's a reward you're giving yourself. So how do we make it into something tangible?

[A]

I don't know.

[B]

We turn and we write it down. We keep a calendar where we say, oh, I meditated today. I'm gonna check off that thing.

[A]

And what about the cups? So how does the cups like you picking up? Because I love that example. I can visualize it because I have people that our kids just visited. There's stuff everywhere.

[B]

You know what the reward is? There's two of them. First of all, once I'm done collecting all the cups and I put them in the sink, I walk through the house and I just look and go. I let myself enjoy a clean house.

[A]

I think this is super important because what I'm gathering from this, and we'll get to the third keystone habit in just a second, is that if you really do just embrace, it's the cue which signals that we're about to do this thing right. And for me, I do make my bed every morning. And one of the cues is that I've got all these throw pillows. I'm psycho about pillows. When I get up, it's not the unmade bed. It's the fact that the pillows are on the floor.

[B]

I love it.

[A]

That actually trigger me to turn around and do it immediately. And then I also do this thing where I karate chop the pillow to give it that nice interior design looking thing. And there's something so satisfying about that. But what I realize is that I rush past it once it's done. And I don't often take that moment to savor what I just did. Now, in the exercise example, I definitely, oh, this latte tastes so good.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And so I'm locking in the habit by actually enjoying the aftermath of the reward.

[B]

I'm starting to realize that's exactly right. And what if when you made that bed, what if you literally took four seconds to look at those pillows? That you just put that dent in that looks perfect and say like, you know, this bed looks great. I am the kind of person who has an amazing bed like this. That's a reward you can give yourself. But you're right, you have to let yourself savor it. The other reward that I get from clearing up all those cups is that my wife comes down and she looks around and she says, oh, looks nice down here.

[A]

I can see why you're the number one habit researcher, Charles. Let's take a quick pause because I want to give the person listening a chance to just really marinate on what you've just said. And I also want to give them a chance to share this research and science with the people that they care about. Because I believe you. I believe that you can become a completely different person based on locking in new habits. And we've got so much more to uncover. There are three keystone habits that we're digging into. Don't go anywhere. Charles Duhig and I will be waiting for you after a short break. This holiday season we're hosting, which means I'm last minute shopping for guest room decor, bedding, bath towels, paper plates, decorations. You know the drill. The nightstand I've been putting off for way too long. Oh my God, I need it now. Wayfair. From linens and bedding to decor for every room in the house, Wayfair is your one stop shop. There's something for every style in every home, no matter your space or budget. Wayfair makes it easy to tackle your home goals and gift list with fast and easy delivery, even on the big stuff so you can get what you need when you need it. I've scored gorgeous linen sheets, fluffy cotton towels and beautiful oak nightstands all just in time for the holidays. So whether you're hosting this season or just holiday shopping, Wayfair got you covered. Get last minute hosting essentials, gifts for all your loved ones and decor to celebrate the holidays. For way less, head to Wayfair.com right now to shop all things home. That's W A y f a iir.com, wayfair every style, every home. I know you've spent the holiday season pouring into everybody else. You're wrapping the gifts, hosting family, running around like it's a part time job. Now it's time to take a breath and put the focus back on you. Macy's has everything you need. Grab that thing you really wanted but didn't get. Restock your home and wellness essentials or kick off the new year in A sparkly dress that makes you ooze confidence every time you walk into the room. And definitely do not miss. Macy's after Christmas sale, happening now through January 1st. Visit Macy's.com I feel like this should be a public service announcement because you want to get a head start on the holiday shopping, right? Well, here's your friendly reminder. Right now is the time to start Black Fridays here. And Pandora Jewelry is giving you up to 40% off storewide and site wide now through December 2nd. You could get their timeless charms or maybe pick up some modern rings or elegant bracelets that look gorgeous in any season. This is your chance to get going and find something special now so you can enjoy the holidays later. Save up to 40% on the jewelry you love. [e-mail] or your local Pandora store. Exclusions apply. Welcome back. It's your friend, Mel Robbins. Today you and I are learning from Pulitzer Prize winning researcher and bestselling author Charles Duhig. We are talking about the power of habits. And in particular, Charles is teaching us the amazing research and science around three keystone habits that create a ripple effect of positive change through your life. So, Charles, the next question I have is if you are having trouble locking in a new behavior and making something, a habit, right? And it could be anything, balancing your checkbook. It could be, I don't know, making healthy dinners. It could be meditating. It could be not spending money on frivolous things. Is it fair to say that one of the things that you should probably do is take a look at the thing you're trying to make a habit and go, okay, do I even have a cue?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Do I know what the repeatable behavior is? Because one of the things for me with exercise that it sounds dumb, but unless I actually plan ahead, what I'm going to do, like I know this class I'm gonna stream or I know the thing that I'm going to go to, it all falls apart because even though I might have the time, I'm doing it now, I have to stop and think about what I'm actually doing.

[B]

And there's a reason why it falls apart from science. Why it's what's known as hot mind and cold mind.

[A]

Hot mind and cold mind.

[B]

Ye. So let me ask you this. Is it easier to eat healthy when you walk past an ice cream store and you just had dinner or when you're starving?

[A]

Well, it's easier to eat healthy when I've just had dinner.

[B]

Okay, Right. Exactly. You don't stop at the ice cream store, right?

[A]

If I'm starving, we're making a U turn.

[B]

Because when you're starving, your mind is in a hot mind place.

[A]

Oh.

[B]

You're at the moment where you have to make a decision. And our brain hates making decisions. So what it does is it makes the first, easiest decision that it can. So how do we overcome this instinct? We make decisions when we're in a cold mind state. Oh, I. I'm gonna exercise tomorrow morning. You know what? I'm gonna decide what class I'm gonna do right now before I go to bed. Cause it's not that hard to decide right now. I'm just gonna do this one class. I know that I like it. I'll just queue it up. Now. If you wake up that morning and you're like, I'm tired. I'm overwhelmed. I gotta get to work. You're in a hot mind state. You can't make a decision about what class to do. Your brain's gonna say, like, I'm, I. I feel too overwhelmed. This is too much. It's too much anxiety. I'm just gonna. I'm just gonna say, skip exercise today. Let's go to the next thing.

[A]

A thousand percent. That happens all the time.

[B]

So the key is you make a decision before you have to make the decision. And this is known within science as implementation intentions.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

An implementation intention is when I say from a cold state, I say, tomorrow morning when I see X, I'm going to do Y. Tomorrow morning when I wake up, I see the alarm clock going off and I see my workout clothes that I left on the ground. I'm going to go do that class. I've already decided what class I'm going to take. I don't have to decide in the morning because deciding is too much hard work. My brain wants to avoid it.

[A]

I love this because you're making it easier. Like when I think about exercise, I exercise consistently when I'm in Boston recording episodes. Cause I know the class I'm gonna go to. I meet my buddy Lynn before the class. It's the same time every time. And I have a latte afterwards.

[B]

It's perfect.

[A]

So those are the conditions that I need to put in place in order to make it easier when I'm in my normal life. Because I am deciding what to do with a hot, emotional, I don't wanna exercise mind.

[B]

Right. That's exactly.

[A]

Boom.

[B]

And you asked, is it worth actually, like, sitting down and figuring out these components? Here's what I do when I wanna build a new habit or when I Wanna change a habit? I pull out a piece of paper and I write down the cue, the routine and the reward. I literally will say like, okay, my cue for running is I'm gonna call Greg right now and ask him to meet me tomorrow morning at 9:30 at this corner. Right. My plan, I'm not gonna just run wherever. I'm not gonna decide, wait until I'm running to decide where to go. I'm gonna plan out my route. Here's my routine. And you know what? When I'm done, we're gonna be near that one cafe and they have that almond croissant that I love. I'm gonna let myself have an almond croissant. I'm gon almond croissant. Literally. It takes again 20 seconds to plot out what the habit loop for exercise is. But I'm doing it in a frame of mind where it's going to be so much easier to do it tomorrow because it's just going to be automatic.

[A]

I love that. Cold versus a hot mind.

[B]

Boom.

[A]

Let's move on to keystone habit number three. Yeah, what is it?

[B]

Keystone habit number three is to track something in your life.

[A]

What?

[B]

Yeah, I know.

[A]

It sounds like the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Something in my life.

[B]

So here's a good example. Here's an example. I know that you drink water.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Okay, so do you, do you know how much water you had to drink today?

[A]

Yes, I have had one and a half of these. I've got. And if you're not watching on YouTube, this is a mace, one of these big wide mouth mason jars. I love these because this is four cups of water. You know, it's surprisingly hard to track how much water you're drinking.

[B]

That's exactly right. Why would we track how much we drink when we're thirsty and we don't drink when we're not thirsty? But let me ask you this.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Why, why do you use that Mason jar? Why do you track?

[A]

Well, because I'm trying to drink. I'm gonna like completely blow it on the math. I try to drink four of these a day because I wanna make it a habit to be very hydrated and to drink a lot of water because I just feel better. I have more energy. Health wise. I feel better and I can't remember what the. Four cups, 16 cups of water. I don't know how much water that is, but that's what I'm trying to do. So I know I need four of these to get that done.

[B]

So what you just told me is you Told me the why for this behavior, which is really powerful. You said, I want to drink more water. I want to be hydrated because it gives me more energy. It makes me happier. It feels healthy to me. You're telling yourself the why now? Drinking water. You're gonna drink plenty of water. You'll drink water when you're thirsty, right? But when you start tracking how much water you're drinking, you're reminding yourself of the why that matters to you. You're giving that activity meaning and purpose. When you pick up that glass and you take a sip, yes, part of your brain is saying, you know what? I'm taking care of myself.

[A]

But you know what I said now is I said, shoot, I'm behind. I gotta get going on the drinking because I only had one and a half of these suckers. I've been busy talking to my friend Charles. I need to get going with the water.

[B]

Well, and the best thing is it's super easy to drink more water, right? Like, literally, you just pick up the cup and you put it to your lips. You can accomplish that goal in seconds.

[A]

But why is learning to track things? Like, what does the research say about, let's say, I don't know, tracking what you eat, tracking the number of steps that you have, tracking the spending that you're. I don't want to track this stuff, Charl. I mean, that's. It's actually hard to track what you're doing.

[B]

It can be hard, and you have to choose the right thing. Right?

[A]

Okay, so what does the research say?

[B]

Like, so what the research says is think about how much of your day you spend on autopilot. Right? The great thing about a habit is that it feels like it's autopilot. You don't have to think about the thing you're doing. What's the drawback to that? The drawback to that is that you stop making choices, right? You start reacting instead of proacting. But equally, there's nothing there to remind you of your purpose. There's nothing to remind you of why this activity has meaning. If I'm on autopilot, I'm just doing things without even thinking about it. Tracking something is like a small interruption that causes us to remember the why in our life.

[A]

You know, one of the things that you write about, one of my favorite stories in your book, it's on page 120, is about how the research says that when someone is trying to lose weight, that the biggest change came from simply writing down what they ate. Can you unpack that research for us.

[B]

Absolutely. And this comes from, we mentioned before, the National Weight Loss Registry, the largest database of how people have lost weight. One of the big important things is eating breakfast. The second, and actually even more important, is simply tracking some aspect of either eating or your weight. And the reason why is because two things happen when you're tracking. Number one, you start to notice patterns that you might have missed before, right? Suddenly you're like, I'm gonna write down every day what I have for breakfast. And you're like, you know, I ate that unhealthy cereal, like, four times this week and the healthy cereal only three times. Like, I didn't realize I was eating that much unhealthy cereal. I'm just gonna change it. I'm gonna do. I'm gonna do five healthy, two unhealthy, right? Suddenly, I am noticing the patterns that are otherwise invisible in my life. But the second thing is every time I pull up my pen and I write down what I had for breakfast, I'm reminding myself of the why, of eating more healthily. I'm saying in my head, this matters. This matters. I'm tracking this because you know what? I want to be healthy, and I can be healthy. And I've proven to myself that I can. There's a professor I know who. He told me he hated grading paper. Papers like, it was. It's boring. It's just like, it's the worst part of his job. And he told me this is what he does every time he sits down to grade a paper, is he says, if I grade this paper, then the student's going to pay tuition. And if they pay tuition, they're going to fund my laboratory. And in my laboratory, I'm trying to cure cancer. So by grading this paper, I am helping to cure cancer. And he said as soon as he does that, it makes grading so much easier because he reminded himself of the why. When we track something, we are reminding ourselves why we're doing it, of our purpose, of our mission. We are helping ourselves see the best side of ourselves.

[A]

So how does that connect to the people that track what they eat actually lose more weight?

[B]

Because all of a sudden, they're reminding themselves why they're trying to eat healthily, right? I walk past that donut place this morning, and, like, it'd be so easy to stop and get a donut, but I'm gonna have to write it down in this little book.

[A]

And, like, it's so true.

[B]

It's gonna be so disappointing to me to write it down. So I'm Just gonna skip. I'm just gonna walk past it right now. The thing is this tracking, it doesn't have to be really cumbersome. It doesn't even have to be complete. Sometimes just writing down what you had for one meal matters. Sometimes tracking how much water you're drinking. Now, my guess is if I asked you how much water you drank yesterday, you'd say, I don't know. I think I drank three. I think I drank four.

[A]

Right? Yeah, I think so, yeah.

[B]

Yeah. So achieving the goal that you're looking for is not the point of the tracking. The tracking is to remind you, oh, Mel, I'm the kind of person who wants to be healthy, who wants to have a lot of energy.

[A]

It's keeping you present and intentional about what you're doing.

[B]

Exactly right. That's what the tracking does.

[A]

Well, I could see how that absolutely helps if, like, I think most of us probably don't even realize how much money we're spending.

[B]

That's exactly right.

[A]

Because we're shopping online or we're like double clicking, or we're scanning with our phone or we're using a credit card.

[B]

So I'll tell you what I do for money. I use a pro. I have a website that downloads all of my transactions. And once a week I set aside 15 minutes and I go through and I just look at them. Wow, that's my tracking. My tracking is. It only takes 15 minutes a week. But you know what? I sometimes.

[A]

What changed by you doing that?

[B]

Well, what changed is that a couple things. Number one, if I do that 15 minutes a week, I suddenly say, like, you know what? This one charge keeps coming up. I think that's a subscription that I got like two years ago that I totally forgot about. I'm gonna go cancel that subscription. So I'm actually saving money. But the other thing that's happening is that sometimes when I pull out my credit card, I'm thinking to myself, okay, I know that I'm tracking what I'm spending, right? Like, this is gonna show up when I'm. That 15 minute review. Do I really need this thing? Like, do I really need to hit buy on Amazon or can I wait a day to get this thing? That's what tracking gives us. And it doesn't have to be time consuming. It doesn't have to be exhaustive. It doesn't even have to be complete. It's just that intentionality that you mentioned that makes all the difference.

[A]

So for someone who's listening right now and they're like, I don't even know what to track. I don't even know what this means. So I can understand how the keystone habit of exercise has this massive ripple effect. I understand the cue, the exercise planning. So do it with a cold mind so you know what you're gonna do. And I understand the importance of the reward in savoring. I also can understand keystone habit number two. So the morning routine and being able to anticipate a great day ahead, being able to slow yourself down and relax into the day, being able to create connection through all the different things that we could try, Whether it's making your bed or meditating, I can see how that could make me more productive. I could see how that could set the tone for my day. I can see how that has a positive ripple effect. But when we get to number three, and it's like tracking, I'm like, charles, this says, like, wa, wa, wa. But I can see that it's actually a habit of being intentional in the moment.

[B]

That's exactly right.

[A]

So. So how could you implement this? And maybe, like, is there a good way or a particular thing to start with? Or should we combine it with exercise? Or what should we do?

[B]

Let's do it with you. Let's build. Let's build a new. A new thing that you're tracking. Okay, so let me just ask if there's something that you wish you did more of or less of anything in life, like, take more steps, Take fewer steps. Oh, maybe eat more breakfast with your husband. Eat more blueberries in the morning. Anything at all? If there's something that. What. What do you wish you could do more of or less of?

[A]

I wish I was consistently going to bed earlier.

[B]

Perfect. Perfect. Okay.

[A]

I mean, I'm pretty good, but I definitely. In those hot moments, Charles.

[B]

Absolutely. I watched myself.

[A]

I find myself, like, why did I stay up two extra hours? Why did I. Yeah, you know what I mean?

[B]

Was that television show really that compelling?

[A]

Yeah. Did I really? Like, how did I just waste an hour on my phone?

[B]

Did I actually have to send that email or read what's happening?

[A]

Yes. So how do I do this?

[B]

So, okay, so we're gonna build a habit around going to bed early.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Before we do that, we're gonna talk about how you're gonna track it.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

So every night when you go, I want you to have a little book next to your bed.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Before you get under the covers, just take out your pen and just write down the date and what time it says on the clock.

[A]

Oh, my God. I'm already feeling nervous.

[B]

It's gonna take 10 seconds.

[A]

I know, but I'm feeling like, oh, my God, I'm about to find out that I have a point of view about myself. That is not true.

[B]

Now here's what's interesting.

[A]

Cause I'm sitting here telling you on my own podcast, Charles, that I go to bed early every night like my husband does, and I think I'm gonna find out Mel Robbins is a liar. Actually, it's like, 10:30, Mel. It's not 9:30.

[B]

And here's the dirty secret is that Mel Robbins already knows that she's a liar.

[A]

Oh, my God, no.

[B]

And you feel bad about it. You're not admitting it to yourself, but you feel bad that you're going to. When you. Every night when you go to bed late, you still feel a little bit bad about it, but now, now you're taking a step to get better at it.

[A]

Oh, my gosh.

[B]

Now you're moving in the right direction. You don't have to feel bad anymore. And let's say tonight you go to bed at 10:30 and you write down 10:30 in your book. That's okay.

[A]

It's just data.

[B]

It's just data because you're running an experiment.

[A]

You know what else I'm realizing is there's so many things like this in my life. Like, for example, I am the world's best, cleanest, most like, whole food eater. I would get a A from any expert that comes in here and talks about health and nutrition. I'm pretty good about getting my walk in every day or moving my body. Dude, the wheels are off at 8pm There is something about that time period where I realize now I have a habit. I stand in front of our pantry and I pull open the drawer, and my latest, like, just is Khloe Kardashian's new protein popcorn. Damn it. Is it good? And I stand there with the bag open, stick my mitt in there, and I'm just, like, eating from the bag.

[B]

You've gotten into that habit.

[A]

And then I roll it up and I put the clip on, and I go back into the TV room like nothing ever happened.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So how do I use tracking to stop myself from doing that?

[B]

So, okay, so tracking can definitely. What I'm hearing you say in that moment is, I have a habit. I want to change.

[A]

Yes. I don't want to be like, if I've gone all day, you know how you have a good day? You're like, we got a winner here. I have had a good day. I've checked the boxes. I've drank the water. I've had all the good foods. I've connected with my people. I planned my morning, I made my bed, I moved my body. Then I'm pouring a Manhattan and eating popcorn all over.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

What is happening?

[B]

So let's talk about. Because there's the difference between creating a new habit and changing an old habit.

[A]

Oh.

[B]

Oftentimes when we talk about changing a habit, we refer to it as breaking a habit. I'm going to stop doing that thing. And what we know is, we know that that's not enough. We have to use what's called the golden rule, which says don't try and extinguish a habit. Rather figure out what the cue and the reward are and then change the behavior so that it's something that's related to the old cue and that delivers something similar to the old reward. So let's take your popcorn habit.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Okay. So let me ask you. What is the cue?

[A]

That's like the healthy version? I mean, sometimes it's the ice cream standing with the freezer open and the spoon right in the pint.

[B]

So what is the cue when you're standing in front of the pantry, Your fan is standing in front of the freezer?

[A]

You know what it is? It's like I'm somewhere else in my house, and it's sort of that zone where dinner's done and the kids aren't home anymore. The dogs are kind of laying down. Cause they're now tired. And I'm trying to decide, am I gonna watch something? Am I gonna read something? Am I going to log back onto my computer? Am I going to have a glass of wine? Am I going to. And there's something about that zone. Or if I'm watching a program and the program is, like, halfway done, I just find myself floating toward the kitchen.

[B]

Right.

[A]

There's something about filling that time that leads me to make the choices that aren't that, like, seem to cancel everything. It's like your chocolate croissant after the run.

[B]

Josh, let me suggest to you what I think the cue is, please. You're bored.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

You're bored and lonely. Yeah, you're bored and lonely. You're halfway through an episode, and you're like, what's gonna happen next? This is kind of the most boring part of the episode. And you're trying to decide whether you should read a book or watch a show or do emails. It's kind of a boring question. You're bored. So that's your cue. That moment of Boring is the way.

[A]

I'm just realizing is also what happens that makes me stay up too late because I then do something that then makes me stay up a little bit later. And the next thing you know, I'm writing 11:30 down in that damn notebook next to the bed that you told me to put there.

[B]

You want to fight that boredom? So, okay, we know the cue. The cue is that you just have a. And that's totally natural. Everyone has moments of boredom during their day. We're gonna. We're gonna respect that cue.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Now we're gonna talk about the reward. What reward are you getting when you eat that popcorn or you eat that ice cream?

[A]

Oh, I'm no longer bored. Cause I'm distracting myself. Okay, yes. Like, and I. That's also why I pick up my phone. Like. Cause now instead of being lonely or bored, I'm now distracting myself, and I'm, like, thinking about something else. So I've occupied my mind.

[B]

And you know what I love about your answer is you're exactly right. And you didn't say, oh, it's because the ice cream tastes so good, or, oh, it's because the popcorn tastes so good. That is. It does. But you recognize the reward is that you need something. Distraction. You need novelty. Right? That's what oftentimes when we eat something sweet, when we pick up our phone, what we're seeking is. We're seeking novelty because novelty is the only opposite of boredom. So now we know the cue is boredom. The reward that you are craving is novelty is something that's distracting. What's a new behavior that we could stick into that habit loop?

[A]

Dear God, I don't know. What does the research tell me to do? What could I do?

[B]

Well, I don't know. Let's brainstorm a little bit. Right?

[A]

Because.

[B]

Because we need it. We just need a behavior that gives you some sense of novelty.

[A]

You know what I think I should do? I think I should go find Chris.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Or I should call Chris.

[B]

That's perfect.

[A]

Yes. Before I go to the kitchen, I'm going to pick up the phone and call somebody versus looking at something online.

[B]

That's exactly right. So here's what you've done. You have reprogrammed that habit. You have changed that habit by observing the golden rule, by respecting the cue and the reward, and just finding a new behavior, new routine that corresponds to that old cue and that old reward. And now. Now when you get bored tonight and you're standing in front of the pantry, you're gonna think to yourself, I'm just gonna call Chris. And as soon as you call Chris, you're not even gonna give a second thought to going either.

[A]

That's so true.

[B]

Right?

[A]

It's true.

[B]

Because you understand. You've diagnosed the cue and the reward that's driving your behaviors, and now you're in control of them. Now you're deciding what behaviors you want and which behaviors you don't want.

[A]

I love this. I'm about to go on a hunt for the cue. I'm gonna do the cold, like, prediction and planning. If this happens, then I'm gonna do that, and then I'm gonna savor the reward. I love this.

[B]

Well, and the best part is we can teach our kids to do this. I do this all the time with my kids. When my kids say, hey, Dad, I wanna. I wanna go ride my bike tomorrow to school, is that okay? We sit down and we say, okay. What's the cue? What's the cue for, like, waking up and remembering to ride your bike? Okay, you're gonna have to leave a little bit early, right? Cause it takes longer to ride your bike. So let's set the alarm clock 10 minutes early.

[A]

And put the helmet right next to it.

[B]

Yeah, and put the helmet right next to it so that you remember your helmet. You don't have to look for it. And then the routine is riding your bike. And what's the reward? I ask my kids, and they say, oh, well, you know, after school, I'm going to get to go hang out with my friends because now we can ride our bike all over town. So now he's reminding himself of the reward. He's giving himself the reward. He's savoring the reward. When we teach our kids to do this, we are giving them one of the strongest tools they can have to be successful in life.

[A]

Well, and I also love the visual of take out a piece of paper, draw three columns. What's the cue? What are all the different cues I could use? What is the cold pattern I'm gonna do, and what is the reward? And make sure to savor it. Charles, you're a genius. This is the best book on habits. I love that there are super habits and that the benefit of exercising, the benefit of getting intentional about your morning routine and the anticipation and the slowing down and relaxing and then that connection that you create, and then this notion of a habit of tracking something so that you snap yourself into intentional behavior. Even just listening to you, I'm literally like, I'm the kind of person that has good habits because I know Charles, if the person listening takes just one thing from this.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

What is it that you want them to do?

[B]

What I want them to do is I want you to believe that you can change any habit. There is someone in this world who has smoked their last cigarette today. There is someone who went and exercised for the first time today. And in a year from now, they're going to run a marathon. Any habit can be changed. We have the power to be the people we want to be, and there's techniques, there's lessons that we can learn to make it easier. But the science says that this is true. We can be the person we. We want to be by changing our habits. And any habit can be created, Any habit can be changed. You can live the life that you want.

[A]

I love that. And I believe you that if we focus on these three things, the cue, the cold pattern, and the reward, then we're using science to help us do it. Charles Duhigg, what are your parting words?

[B]

You know, my parting words are it's really easy to get down on ourselves, and there's a type of habit that we haven't really talked about, which are mental habits, right? And sometimes we don't think of them as habits. We, we get down on ourselves because we start thinking about, like, all the things that we should have done better, right? We get angry because, you know, we think about, like, that, that call that we got from our dad and sort of riles us up. Those are mental habits. Those are habits that happen automatically. There's a cue and there's a reward. And once we recognize them as habits, we get to interrupt them. So one of the things that I do is whenever I get into one of those spirals where I start thinking about all the things I've done wrong. Here's all the mistakes I've made. I force myself. I take a. That's my cue. I take a second. I think I'm going to think of four things that I've done really well in the last month, right? And. And I'm going to let myself actually enjoy feeling that, because there's part of us that says, like, yeah, yeah, yeah, but you, Those aren't important. Nope, nope. I'm going to take a second. I'm going to let myself savor that. You know, like, my wife needed me to come pick her up at something, and I showed up and I did it. And I, and my son was having trouble at school, and we had a, we had a real conversation about it. And, like, instead of telling him how to fix the Problem. I just asked him questions. So he figured out the solution on his own. I'm going to feel good about that. That's the reward I'm going to give myself. When I start taking control of my mental habits, that's when suddenly I am in control of how happy I am. And so that's the one parting thing that I would leave people with, is if you find yourself falling into mental patterns that you don't like, just recognize they're habits. They have cues, and they have rewards. You can change them just like you started running or just like you drink four glasses of water every day.

[A]

You're amazing. I think that should be your next book. Habits of Happiness. Fabulous. Charles Duhig. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

[B]

Thank you for having me, Mel. This is such a treat.

[A]

I just love, love this. Thank you, thank you, thank you for being here. I feel smarter. I kind of feel. I don't know how you feel as you've been listening to us, like, let's go make some habits. I mean, let's go run. Let's go drink more water. Let's have a morning routine. And if you can make us feel that way about habits, Charles, you absolutely nailed this. So thank you, thank you, thank you. Because I'm empowered. And I know as you're listening and you're sharing this with people that you care about, you're empowered too. And that's exactly what I hoped would happen. And one more thing I wanna make sure, in case no one else tells you, I make this a habit. I really do. I make it a habit to tell you that I love you and I believe in you. And I believe in your ability to create a better life. And this entire conversation today taught you the science and the research that shows that habits are the foundation of your life. That if you wanna change who you are, you heard Charles say it. Take a look at the habits of the kind of person that you want to be. And then use the science that you learned today. Find the cue, the cold pattern, and the reward. And now you have the simple secret to making that behavior who you are. I love this. Alrighty. I can't wait to see how this conversation changes your life and the people that you shared it with. And I will also be waiting for you in the very next episode. I'll welcome you in the moment you hit play. I'll see you there.

[B]

Really?

[A]

Yeah. Oh, yeah. I don't. It's. It's crazy.

[B]

That sounds like fun.

[A]

That's interesting. I get consumed by what everybody else is doing.

[B]

Yeah, Comparison is the thief of joy.

[A]

Th percent all right, we ready? All right, cool. Here we go. You like, give me a compliment?

[B]

Is that what you say?

[A]

That's not it. That'll get you slapped in the face.

[B]

Yes. That's not. That's not the way to do it. And I will also say my wife usually wakes up before I do. Cuz she runs. She's a crazy runner. And she runs way more than I do.

[A]

Which means we know she doesn't use her credit card as much as she does.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

And I'll be waiting for you. And I know you're. And I also want to say thank you for watching all the way to the end. Thank you for coming. You're dynamite. Oh, and one more thing. And no, this is not a blooper. This is the legal language. You know what the lawyers write and what I need to read to you. This podcast is presented solely for educational and entertainment purposes. I'm just your friend. I am not a licensed therapist. And this podcast is not intended as a substitute for the advice of a physician, professional coach, psychotherapist, or other qualified professional. Got it? Good. I'll see you in the next episode.

[B]

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