Starlee Kine: Radical Honesty - The Moth

Podcast Summary: The Moth – "Starlee Kine: Radical Honesty"

Introduction

In the episode titled "Radical Honesty," released on March 8, 2010, The Moth presents a gripping personal narrative by Starlee Kine. As a renowned storyteller and producer for public radio's This American Life, Starlee shares her harrowing experience attending a self-help seminar that devolved into a cult-like environment. This detailed account explores the intersection of self-improvement, personal vulnerability, and the dangers of unchecked ideologies.

Background: The Self-Help Journey

Starlee begins by discussing her project—a book critiquing the self-help industry. Her exploration into various seminars and workshops reveals her attempts to solve personal issues, which have only multiplied over time. She humorously notes, “the book itself has become my biggest problem” (03:10), highlighting the overwhelming nature of her endeavor.

Her foray into self-help deepened following a relationship with a boyfriend who was an avid follower of Eckhart Tolle’s The Power of Now. Starlee describes his daily ritual: “when we woke up he would find a shaft of sunlight to sit in, like a cat” (05:22). This practice, inspired by Tolle’s teachings, ironically became the very tool he used to end their relationship, citing her inability to “live in the moment” and her tendency to “hold on for dear life to any good moments” (07:45).

Encountering Radical Honesty

Post-breakup, Starlee discovers Brad Blanton's Radical Honesty—a seminar promising to eradicate participants' addiction to lying. Intrigued yet skeptical, she reaches out and secures a spot for September, benefiting from a journalist discount. Her initial excitement is met with discomfort as she joins Brad’s assistant, Jerry, and a die-hard fan, Ann, in Washington Dulles (12:30).

The Seminar Experience

Upon arrival, the setting belies her expectations. Brad’s house is disorganized, lacking the professional facade she anticipated. Starlee notes, “there was a dental chair and masks and, you know, fillings and stuff” (14:05), emphasizing the unorthodox environment. The lack of structure and Brad’s abrasive demeanor immediately set a foreboding tone.

As introductions begin, Brad mandates participants to disclose personal details, including financial information—“people hate talking about money” (16:50). The atmosphere quickly deteriorates as attendees reveal shocking secrets: tax evasion, murder confessions, and inappropriate behaviors. Starlee herself struggles, offering mundane admissions like overspending during shopping trips. Her honesty is met with disdain: “They were just like, who is this girl who's like, not honest with her feelings” (19:15).

Brad confronts her harshly, “What is wrong with you, Starlee?” (19:45), escalating tensions. His aggressive response culminates in verbal abuse: “fuck you, bitch. I resent you for defying me” (21:30). This confrontation marks the turning point, revealing the manipulative and authoritarian nature of the seminar.

Escape from the Cult-like Environment

Over the next five days, the seminar intensifies, with Brad continuously undermining and verbally attacking Starlee. The pressure becomes unbearable, especially when faced with the prospect of participating in “Naked Day,” a ritual intended to foster intimacy (25:00). Refusing to comply, Starlee decides to leave, initiating a frantic attempt to escape.

Her departure is fraught with logistical challenges. In a remote town with limited transportation options, she navigates unresponsive local authorities and exorbitant cab fares. Ultimately, a mix-up leads police to believe she’s in danger, complicating her escape further. Starlee recounts, “I got into the cab, and then I noticed that it was really pretty there, actually” (30:45), signifying a moment of clarity and emotional liberation.

Realization and Conclusion

As she drives away, Starlee experiences a profound realization: she has successfully extricated herself from a toxic environment. This breakthrough underscores her earlier critique of self-help’s potential pitfalls. Reflecting on her journey, she states, “it was the first time I'd really quit a situation that was bad for me... because I was finally living in the moment” (35:20). This epiphany aligns with the very principles she critiqued, highlighting the complex dynamics of self-improvement practices.

Notable Quotes

“The book itself has become my biggest problem” – Starlee Kine (03:10)
“He would find a shaft of sunlight to sit in, like a cat” – Starlee Kine (05:22)
“People hate talking about money” – Starlee Kine (16:50)
“What is wrong with you, Starlee?” – Brad Blanton (19:45)
“Fuck you, bitch. I resent you for defying me” – Brad Blanton (21:30)
“It was the first time I'd really quit a situation that was bad for me” – Starlee Kine (35:20)

Conclusion

Starlee Kine’s narrative in "Radical Honesty" serves as a cautionary tale about the allure and dangers of self-help movements. Her firsthand experience exposes the potential for manipulation and psychological distress within seemingly benign self-improvement practices. This compelling story not only entertains but also invites listeners to critically evaluate the methodologies and intentions behind self-help seminars.

Additional Information

Starlee Kine is recognized for her insightful contributions to storytelling and journalism. Her work, including her ongoing book titled It Is Your Fault, delves deep into the self-help industry's intricacies and its impact on individuals’ lives.

For more stories like this and to support The Moth, visit themoth.org.

Timestamps

03:10 – Starlee’s realization about her book becoming a problem
05:22 – Description of her ex-boyfriend’s self-help routine
07:45 – Breakup influenced by self-help philosophy
12:30 – Arrival at Brad Blanton’s seminar
14:05 – Observations about the unorthodox seminar environment
16:50 – Requirement to disclose personal financial information
19:15 – Starlee’s struggle with honesty about mundane issues
19:45 – Brad’s confrontation: “What is wrong with you, Starlee?”
21:30 – Brad’s verbal abuse: “Fuck you, bitch.”
25:00 – Introduction to the challenge of “Naked Day”
30:45 – Realization during her escape journey
35:20 – Epiphany about truly living in the moment

Transcript

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Dan Kennedy (1:08)

Welcome to the Moth Podcast. I'm Dan Kennedy and the Moth features true stories told live without notes. All stories from the podcast are taken from our ongoing storytelling series in New York, Los Angeles and from our tour shows across the country. Visit themoth.org the story you're about to hear by Starley Klein was recorded live at the Moth main stage in 2009 at the Metropolitan Museum of Art. The theme of the night was American Stories.

Starlee Klein (1:43)

I am writing a book about the self help industry and I've been writing it for a while and and the point of the book is that I kind of go to different seminars and workshops and I try to have them fix very specific problems in my life which are numerous and actually they're getting more numerous the longer I write the book to the point where the book itself has become my biggest problem and it's just become this horrible albatross and I'm never going to get out or get fixed and the longer I've written this book the more self help begins to kind of show itself everywhere. Like I never was into self help before and then it just kind of started to pop out. And the boyfriend I was dating when I started writing this book turned out to be kind of a secret self help junkie. Like I thought he was just like tall and skinny and had like shiny hair but he was like a self help fanatic and he used to when we woke up he would Find a shaft of sunlight to sit in. Like. Like a cat. He would kind of chase the sunlight, and wherever it was, he would sit in it. And then I later read the Power of Now by Eckhart Tolle, and it tells you to find a shaft of sunlight and sit in it and every day. So my boyfriend was, like, following Eckhart Tolle's weird sunlight advice and finding it, and then he ended up using the Power of Now to break up with me. So, like, it had turned against me. And, like, when he broke up with me, I remember being like, but this morning we had such a good time, and we ate breakfast, and what about that? And he told me that I didn't live in the moment enough and I had to stop dwelling on the past. And as ridiculous as I find that there is a tendency I have to kind of, you know, in bad situations, like, kind of. I'm not a positive person. I'm very negative. But I do tend to, like, hold on for dear life to any good moments and try to make them work. Not, like. Not in a positive way, but, like, in a backward survival way. And I told them, I've actually. I've actually never broken up with anyone myself. I always get dumped every single time. And when he was dumping me, I was just crying and saying, why do I always get left? Why am I the one who always gets left? And he just looked at me and was so confused. And he was like, because you never leave first. And this same boyfriend ended up. He told me before we broke up about this guy named Brad Planton who made something called Radical Honesty that my boyfriend was really into. And there's books, and there's also, like, these seminars that you can go to that are eight days long. And the idea of. Brad said he's going to cure us of our addiction to lying. And I did like the idea of being radically honest, because I kind of feel like I am radically honest. But to me, I just thought it was always. I'm just inappropriate. Like, chronically inappropriate. And I just can't tell. I can't lie even when it's gonna save me. Like, I. Even when it would do me good. Like, this same boyfriend, we broke up. And like, two months later, I saw him on the subway and he told. Asked me how I was doing. And I was like, I'm awful. You meant everything to me. I'm a wreck without you. And, like, obviously I was supposed to be like, I am doing awesome. And I have so many boyfriends now, and I've never. Who are You, I don't even know who you are to be met. But instead, I just told him, Pathologically told him the truth. So then after we broke up, I was like, I should go to radical honesty. And at the very least, it would kind of be like a nice vacation where there's other inappropriate people and we're walking around and no one's rolling their eyes at me or sighing or getting mad at me or writing passive aggressive notes to me. And so I found Brad Blanton's email, and I emailed him, and I was like, can you squeeze me into your September session? Is there any room for me? And he said, yes. He wrote me back from Switzerland or something, and he was like, yes, and I'll even give you a journalist discount instead of $2,700. You can only have to pay $2,000. And I was like, score. Awesome. And I booked a flight to Washington Dulles airport, where Brad's assistant Jerry picked me up with Brad's number one fan, this woman named Ann, who'd been 35 times to these seminars. And the two of them picked me up, and they immediately just wanted to ask me all these questions and be super stary and touchy feely to me. And I have kind of this love hate relationship to attention, like, certain kind of attention. This kind of attention I love. This is great. But I don't like when it's one on one and someone's looking at me too much and wants to ask me lots of questions. And I've just gotten off a plane and I want to just, like, stare out the window and not talk to anybody. And they just had all these, like, questions for me, and I just was very grumpy. And then I thought they would kind of like that because I thought it was radically honest. But they didn't like it and they didn't like me, and they kind of formed a little clique with each other. And, like, I was clearly, like, not very popular in that car. And I was just very confused about what kind of radically honest I was supposed to be. And then we were also driving forever. Like, ever. I couldn't believe how long we were in the car. Like, the radio station kept changing, kept getting staticky and going to a new thing, and we left. We ended up driving to Virginia, to this little town, Stanley, Virginia, population 1379. And we pulled up this driveway, and that's when I realized that radical honesty headquarters that I just paid $2,000 to attend was actually Brad Blanton's house. Like, his house where he lives. And not, like, my dentist works out of his house in Orange County, California. But it's like, there's a dental chair and masks and, you know, fillings and stuff. And his. It's not like his TV and bed are not in there. Like, it's a separate part. But radical honesty was, like, in his house, like, there was no separation. Like, the bathroom I used was Brad's bathroom. And there was, like. Like, dental floss and, like, rubber bands with, like, hair on them and grime in there. And, like, I had to stay in his kid's room. And he was right down the hall, and everyone else was kind of, like, sleeping on sleeping bags. And there was, like, it was no order or structure and definitely no room service. And I. My room at least had tv. And I, like, immediately. It was like an old tv, and I, like, immediately found the channel that plays Law and Order all the time and just kind of put it on that. And. And then I went downstairs. I was like, I guess I'll try to. I gotta go be radically honest. And I went downstairs, and I met Brad. And he just was disgusting. Like, he was horrible. Honestly, he was horrible. Like, if he was like a cartoon character version of himself, he'd be a toad. Like, absolutely. Like, his face was all, like, Mouth was all wide, and he had no shirt on half the time, and he was barefoot. And he gave me a huge clammy hug, and he told me he was really happy to meet me. And he led me into the living room and told me we should all get acquainted. And there were only seven other people in the living room, including Jerry and Ann. And every single person there had been to a radical honesty seminar before. It was Just Get Acquainted with Starlie. These people knew each other and seemed to live in Brad's house almost. One of them actually had a tent in his yard. And so it was just me there hanging out. And we sat down, and Brad was like, the first thing. The first rule honesty, is you have to, like, tell everyone who you really are. And so we had to go around and say, like, our name, our job, what we made. Like, how much money we made. Because he was all, like, people hate talking about money. We had to do that. And then that crafty Brad, always throwing the zingers at us. And then we had to say a secret. And so we slowly went around the room. And, like, the first guy was kind of this outsider thing, therapist. And he said he hadn't paid taxes in 10 years. And then another guy said that he'd murdered a Man, like murdered, really. He was in a truck with this man and punched his in the head and then threw him out the window. And the guy was dead. And then another car came and ran him over. And then he didn't go to jail and he never told anybody except for these people and was confessing to murder. And then Brad was like, next. Great. And then. And so then. And he went to Ann, and Ann's the number one fan. And she was like, I don't know, my secrets are so boring. She's like, I guess I can talk again about having sex with my cat on a regular basis. And I was just like. And honestly, I'm such. I know I'm not a very good journalist because I didn't like, do any follow up questions. I didn't ask logistically how it was possible and like, who did what to who and why you would do that and whether there'd be like peanut butter involved or like, I didn't ask anything. And then. And then the man who the murderer, like, looked really put out that she maybe was trumping his. And he like, raised his hand again and he was like, also, I've totally felt up my cat. And like, it was just like this crazy thing. And then it got to me and like the spotlight was on me and I was just like sitting there on the couch and I was like, well, I totally sometimes buy stuff that aren't on sale and I like shop too much and sometimes I'll be meeting someone for coffee and I'll say that the train broke down, but actually it's because I went into a store and bought a dress. And they. There was like, silence. They were just like. And they just like, I was the freak. Like, totally. It didn't matter what anyone else said. They were just like, who is this girl who's like, not honest with her feelings and also covering things up and has all these boring problems? And Brad just looked at me and he was like, starlie, what is wrong with you? And I was just like, there was not even anyone to like, gesture to. Like, no one. Like, it didn't matter. The murder and the cat, they were just like. He's like, what is wrong with you, Starlee? And I was like, nothing, I'm fine. And. And he was like, I want you to sign. He pulled out this contract and he's like, starley, you clearly are too in your head, like, you think too much. And he's like, so in order to relieve you of that, I need you to sign this contract that says you will do whatever I tell you for the next eight days. And I was like, no, I will not. Already I'm saying no. And he was like. And then he just, like, had the contract. And he looked around the room, and he couldn't believe me. And then he just stared at me and was like, fuck you, bitch. I resent you for defying me. And again, it was like this. Like, I couldn't. There was no one to, like, make connection. Like, eye contact with. I was looking, and I was just like, what did you just call me a bitch? And he was like, fuck you. Cut. I resent you for getting mad at me for calling you a bitch. And it was, like, this crazy thing. And then I was like, what are you talking about? And he told me he was at war with my mind. And I was like, I like my mind. And he's like, fuck you, bitch. I resent you for liking your mind. And it just turned into this crazy thing where he just kept telling me to fuck off. And I was just sitting there, and I really think it's because I had no one, because I had just heard about the cat and the murder and the cat again. And, like, no one was activated. And within minutes, I totally turned into a cult member. And I was just like, okay. And I thought I was crazy, and I started to cry. And then Brad Blanton started making fun of me when I cried. He literally was like, look at the baby crying. Like, honestly, I'm not kidding. He did that. And then I just. Like, when he did that, I lost it. And I ran upstairs to my room, and I was throwing stuff into my bag and turning off the tv, and I was like, I have to get out of here. I have to get out of here. But then as soon as I did that, I picked up my bag and I zipped it up. And then the thing that happened to me was what always happens to me, like, in bad situations, right? I start to, like, falsely romanticize the situation and think that I have it all wrong and that it can't be as bad as I think it is. And I began to feel, like, nostalgia for the car ride with Ann and Jerry and, like, attached, like, strangely attached to, like, the bathroom and my new room and stuff. And then, like I said, it's not like I'm not being positive. I'm just, like. I get so attached, and I just begin to doubt so much that I'm making the right decision, and I don't want to live with that regret. So I just make really, really bad choices in these Situations. So what happened was I just didn't leave. Like, I unpacked my bag and I kind of sat down and was like, it's not so bad here. It's actually pretty great. I totally want to be here. It's my fault. Like, I shouldn't have not killed somebody and set myself up for that kind of treatment. And so I went downstairs and I apologized, and Brad told me to fuck off for, like, eight more hours that night. And then that was pretty much, like, how it went for the next five days. Like, we would, like, get up, we would do yoga, we would break for lunch, which was, like, these disgusting, like, cheddar cheese slices that everyone was touching. And then Brad would tell me to fuck off for, like, the whole night. And I don't even know what these people did before I got there, because the whole thing was about me. They weren't doing anything else except for watching Brad tell me to fuck off. And finally, on the fifth day, I went downstairs, totally beaten down. And Brad was like, starlie, I have a surprise for you. And I was like, oh, good. I can't wait to hear. And he said that normally at the end of radical honesty sessions, everyone gets totally naked because they're so in love with each other and they have such a good time. And it's usually this big surprise at the end, but because they didn't trust me to be a member of the group, they were moving Naked Day up to that morning. And I had to decide whether I was going to participate in Naked Day or not. And I was like, no, I am not going to get naked. And he was like, are you sure? It's awesome. And fuck you, cunt. Fuck you, bitch. But also, it's this great loving thing. And I was like, I'm not getting naked with you freaks. I'm leaving. I'm out of here. And I turned around and went upstairs and packed my bag and made sure not to look at anything or think about anything. And I turned my mind off, and I was like, I am leaving. And then once I decided to leave, I realized I had to still figure out how to get out of there because I was two hours from civilization. And it turns out it's very hard to flee a cult when you've decided to when you don't have, like, a car, a rental car of your own. And so then I had to, like, actually logistically figure out how to leave. And I, like, the Internet was all spotty, but I ended up getting, like, some sort of. There was no cabs in the Little town. And I ended up getting, like, the city council on the phone and being like, do you guys have, like, a car service of some sort for me? And they're like, no, we all know what you're talking about. Those words don't make any sense. And I was like, well, the thing is, I'm in this guy's house, and he wants me to get naked, and I really just need a car now. And they were like, we'll see what we can do. And they, like, hung up. And I ended up having to call a town, like, two hours away and being like, do you have any cabs that you can send to me? And they're like, yes, but it'll cost $200. And I was like, it is very expensive to flee a cult, it turns out, but I guess I will have to do this. And so I signed up for the $200 cab ride, and I waited, and I steeled myself, and I was not going to back down. And then, like, an hour later, one of the cult people called upstairs, and they're like, starly, your ride is here. And I, like, ran downstairs with my bag. And it was actually the cops, because the first person at the city council who I'd said I had to get naked had thought I was, like, a hostage in a house. And she had called the cops, and the cops were, like, there outside, like, these two cops, and they, like, their hand on the gun, and they were all like, we. Don't worry, miss. We've got you. It's okay. And they thought I was, like, Elizabeth Smart. They really thought they were, like, rescuing me. And I was like, no, he wants me to get naked. And they would, like, try. They really wanted to arrest Brad, but I had to explain that it wasn't, like, a legal kind of naked. It was just gross, creepy kind of naked. And he wasn't actually breaking any laws. And they were like, don't worry. We'll take you. We're gonna take you to a woman's shelter. It's gonna be okay. And I was about to get in the car, but then the cab pulled up, and then I had to, like, make. And then not only. So I went from having no rides to, like, too many rides. I had to choose between the cops and. And this cab driver who was so sweet. And then I had to get in the cab because he'd driven so far. And the cops really didn't want to leave me. Like, they really, really, really wanted to arrest somebody there. But I got into the cab, and the cab driver's name was James Taylor for some reason, and it wasn't. And then I was we started driving away and I started to suddenly notice that it was really pretty there, actually. Like I could see out the windows and I hadn't even looked at the windows before, and I'd been so distracted by Jerry and Ann and ignoring them and avoiding them and where I was going. And it was actually this really Virginia and it was so nice. And I realized that it was the first time I'd really quit a situation that was bad for me. Like it was a cult. And it may be obvious to a lot of people, but to me this was like a breakthrough and like a really big move. And I think the reason I was able to see everything that day because I was finally living in the moment.