Ep 161. From Landscaper to Specialist: Finding the Fast-Paced Concrete Niche

Summary

The Mulder Life Podcast

Episode 161: From Landscaper to Specialist – Finding the Fast-Paced Concrete Niche

Host: Andy Mulder
Guest: Sal (Calco Partners, California)
Date: March 11, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode features Sal from Calco Partners, a concrete and excavation specialist based in California’s Bay Area. Host Andy Mulder and Sal dive deep into Sal’s journey from working in his family’s landscaping business to carving out a high-paced niche in commercial and high-end residential concrete projects. Live audience questions spark discussions on equipment choices, concrete techniques, business challenges, and strategies for sustainable long-term growth. The episode is practical, motivating, and full of actionable insights, especially for listeners looking to scale or specialize in their landscaping or construction business.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

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Sal’s Background and Business Evolution

[02:52–04:47]

• Sal comes from a second-generation landscaping family and worked for his parents before founding Calco Partners in 2021.
• Initially focused on landscaping (flagstone, pavers), he shifted into excavation and concrete work, drawn by the "fast-paced, crazy environment" of commercial concrete pours:
  • “The more and more I got involved in it, it was just such a... fast paced, crazy environment. And I was like, oh, this is my style right here.” – Sal [03:40]
• Sal started solo, self-taught in concrete, with genuine passion for machinery and heavy equipment.

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Business Structure and Growth

[05:46–08:41]

• Sal is expanding from one to two crews, splitting up to address long client wait times.
• Recent major equipment purchases: upgraded from a John Deere 50G to an 85G excavator, running a John Deere 333G track loader (“my baby”), and a regular skid steer.
• Sal’s advice: dealer support and service are as important as machine brands.

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Types of Projects and Clientele

[09:34–10:14]

• Residential projects lean toward high-end, designer-driven work (custom grill islands, outdoor kitchens, artisanal concrete countertops).
• Commercial projects are often straightforward (sidewalks, flatwork) but on a large scale.
• Strong partnerships with “crazy designers” have driven an increase in spectacular, high-budget residential jobs.

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Building Skills, Team Culture, and Trust

[12:40–14:23]

• Sal’s team started with “rough, flat work guys” who learned higher-end skills under his mentorship.
• “In this trade… if you have common sense and you really like what you do… it’s not impossible. And I feel like a lot of people can do it if they really care.” – Sal [13:15]
• He’s hands-off during pours now due to his skilled crew:
  • “They’re all better than me. So it’s like they know what they’re doing… I trust my guys.” – Sal [13:58]

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Equipment Philosophy and Financial Discipline

[15:56–16:30]; [56:03–56:27]

• Invests profits back into equipment rather than luxury purchases; extremely debt-averse.
• “I've always struggled... just, you know, we've all gone through it. I try to stay as debt free as possible. ...But it's been worth it.” – Sal [16:19]
• Paid cash for his latest excavator: “It hurt just spending all my money on equipment … but I can wake up tomorrow with no work and I don’t have to worry about that payment.” – Sal [56:03]

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Concrete Techniques, Mixes, and Challenges

[16:38–18:05]; [26:31–29:18]

• Clarification: “It's not cement. It's concrete. Cement is like the chocolate chips in a cookie...” – Sal [16:38]
• Always adds microfiber to mixes for extra strength and crack resistance.
• Most finishing done by hand unless it’s a massive pour (e.g., sports courts, shop floors).
• Finishing skill is everything: timing, patience, and knowing how weather impacts the set.
  • “The guys that help me out, my finishers…they know it more than they know their kids." – Sal [28:21]
• Contributing to concrete blotchiness: finishing too early or with a steel trowel traps moisture:
  • “I truly believe that it’s the finishers that get on it too early, ...and they seal it up. ...They trap all that moisture… and then it will dry inconsistently.” – Sal [27:06]

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Specialty Work: Retaining Walls, Countertops, and Outdoor Kitchens

[20:55–24:58]

• Focus on forming and building complex structural concrete walls with deep piers for hillside stability and earthquake compliance (some piers go 12–18 feet deep).
• Outdoor countertops and kitchens are a major niche; Sal is known for his "insane" custom work.
  • Hosted a backyard workshop that attracted contractors nationwide, demonstrating technique.
• Uses rebar cages, waterproof membranes, drainage, and precise, over-engineered methods—especially due to earthquake codes in California.

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Business Management & Operations

[32:44–34:40]; [35:38–36:40]

• Uses SynkedUp (cloud estimating/project management) – vital for understanding actual costs, including insurance, registration, and all overhead.
  • “I really, really, really did not become a profitable business until I started with that.” – Sal [33:57]
• All projects are priced with software and the rate it provides is non-negotiable.
• Two-crew model (about 7 employees), aiming for balanced commercial/residential workflow.

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Marketing, Sales, and Project Pipeline

[42:19–44:42]; [50:46–51:26]

• Gets almost all work via networking with designers and architects—no website, no branded trucks:
  • “Just making a lot of friends. ...For the most part, that's it. I don't have a website. I don't even have logos on my trucks, phone numbers, nothing.” – Sal [42:49]
• High-end residential leads come from word of mouth, designer recommendations, and guests at finished projects.
• Booked solid into fall; looks for “indoor” work (like concrete walls at a school) to keep crews working through rainy winters.

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Mindset: Motivation, Delegation, and Growth

[20:00–20:30]; [39:01–40:41]

• Constantly seeks new challenges: “If I get bored, I just, I lose interest. ...I always have to be pushing myself to do something bigger, something more challenging. It’s not just about the money.” – Sal [20:00]
• Loves seeing his team surpass him in skill; trusts them to manage highly technical work:
  • “They’re all better than you.” – [Julio to Sal, 37:51]
  • “Take the wheel. ...Now I don’t even operate. ...They just kicked me off.” – Sal [39:01]
• Focus is on maintaining quality, not runaway size: “I don’t want to get too much bigger... I think we could definitely push 5 [million]” – Sal [36:01]

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On the appeal of concrete:
  “I wanted to do something harder. …I mean, I just saw concrete guys. I’m like, man, these guys…they’re ready to go to battle every day. And I was like, man, I want that kind of team.” – Sal [19:00]

• On team empowerment:
  “The more we do it, the more we realize, like, man, just throw it in the dumpster. Don't even try to save it.” – Sal on formwork and efficiency [32:11]

• On family and legacy:
  “I'm married. I have a 14-year-old son and a 10-year-old daughter… My son wants to make some money…so we'll see this summer.” – Sal [57:23]

• On what motivates Sal:
  “[If] you train them right, and they're already smart to begin with…they can read plans, they understand grading... their math skills are just second to none.” – Sal [39:37]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 02:52 — Sal’s background and how he got started
• 04:47 — Transition from landscape to concrete niche
• 05:46 — Crew structure and equipment expansion
• 09:34 — Geographic area, project type, and clientele
• 10:53 — High-end residential countertops & kitchens
• 16:38 — Concrete mix, fibers, and technical details
• 20:55 — Retaining walls, deep pier construction, earthquake implications
• 27:06 — Why concrete turns blotchy: Sal’s theory
• 32:44 — Efficiency, formwork, and business systems
• 33:57 — Profitability and the impact of project management software
• 36:01 — 5 to 10-year business vision
• 39:01 — Delegation and empowering the crew
• 42:19 — How Sal gets his work (networking, not advertising)
• 50:46 — Booking projects and managing workload across seasons
• 55:19 — Favorite equipment/tool for the business
• 56:03 — Hard decisions that paid off long-term
• 56:52 — “If you couldn’t do this work, what else?” (Car salesman!)
• 57:23 — Family’s involvement in the business

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Notable Q&A and Listener Questions

• Job minimums:
  Prefers projects over $100k, but will take smaller “filler” projects between larger jobs. [30:44]

• Concrete mix questions:
  Pea gravel usage, six-bag mix, and fiber additives. [16:38–17:54]

• Winter work and scheduling:
  Staggers work to keep the crew busy through weather interruptions—sometimes holding back indoor projects for winter months. [51:26–54:38]

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Final Takeaways

• Sal’s story is a testament to self-driven specialization, calculated risk-taking, and the power of empowering a skilled crew.
• Strong focus on systems, financial discipline, and knowing one’s numbers—reinforced by a commitment to reinvest in equipment and personnel.
• Networking, referrals, and doing standout work for influential designers/architects can be more effective than traditional marketing.
• Trust, empowerment, and not being afraid to let the crew excel are keys to both profitability and personal satisfaction.

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Follow Sal: Instagram @calco_partners
Host: Andy Mulder – Instagram @MulderOutdoors

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“Like they said in the chat, I’m the pope of concrete and the pope of the West Coast.” – Sal [60:20]

Transcript

[A]

Welcome to this week's episode of the Molded Life podcast, a live show featuring your questions about all things landscaping, equipment, business and life. Join our live show weekly on Instagram Older outdoors, Monday nights, 8:30pm Central Standard Time to ask your questions or tune in here for the replay.

[B]

And now from the Incon Studios Incon, a world leading manufacturer of tilt rotators and attachments enhancing your business. Here's your host, Andy Mulder.

[A]

What's up guys? Welcome back to the Motorlife podcast. We are live here Monday night, March 9, here in the Ncon Studios. Excited for this episode, we have a special guest all the way from California and we are going to talk about his business and what he does and whatever else wants to come up. We'll take questions live like we do about anything. It doesn't have to be what we're talking about. It can be something that you want to, that you want to ask, just like we normally do before we get started with that. Big thanks to CMP Attachments. CMP attachments.com go check them out for Hydra buckets, grapples, side dumping buckets, all kinds of stuff like that. Also Pave Tool Innovators, pavetool.com you can go check them out. We today we just started using their new screed poles that they just came out with. So go check that out. They dropped a lot of new products this spring that are really, really great and you can use the Coupon code molder outdoors 50 and you can save 50 bucks off of $500, I believe, or more. So go check that out. So this week we have a special guest, Sal from Calco Partners, all the way from California. And Sal, I'm excited to have you here.

[C]

Thanks for having me, man. I really appreciate it.

[A]

Yeah, we've been, me and Sal have been talking on Instagram for, I don't even know, a long time.

[C]

It's been a while, man. Yeah, at least eight years.

[A]

At least. And we've talked about having you on the podcast a long time. And now that I'm trying to regularly have guests on the show, you were definitely at the top of my list and I'm glad we're making this work, man. So I really appreciate you being on.

[C]

No, thanks for having me, man.

[A]

Yeah. So Sal, I, I, you know, selfishly would love to hear a little bit about your background. What is your business, where is it? What does it specialize in? You know, how did you get to where you're at today? Whatever you really want to talk about is totally cool and we can Go from there. And then again, anybody that's listening, if you have questions or whatever, feel free to drop them in the comments and we'll, we'll try and get at them. So.

[C]

Yeah, well, I've been a landscaper pretty much my whole life. I mean, I'm second generation. My parents own a landscape company that I worked for for forever. And when the pandemic started, I don't know, I just started doing a little bit more and more concrete, and that's when I kind of just started on my own. It was like 2021 when I started calco, just me.

[A]

Oh, really? I thought it was longer than that.

[C]

No, it wasn't.

[A]

Oh, wow.

[C]

When I started my Instagram, I. I was still working for my parents.

[A]

Okay, okay.

[C]

And 2021, that was when I really just broke off and said, I'm just gonna do excavating and concrete.

[A]

Gotcha. And why, why did you, why did you push towards that?

[C]

I just, I like machines. I like. I'm like you, man. I like big machines. I like digging. And, and I just. Concrete was new to me. It's not like I've never. I've been around in my whole life, but it was just a small portion of the work we did. And the more and more I got involved in it, it was just such a. I just thought it was so cool. I thought it was just such a fast paced, crazy environment. And I was like, oh, this is my style right here.

[A]

Yeah. And so you hadn't, you had not done a ton of concrete before that?

[C]

No. When I worked for my parents, we just did. It was just a lot of landscaping, a lot of flagstone and pavers and stuff like that. Concrete crazy wasn't so popular around here.

[A]

Well, that's crazy. You just started doing it?

[C]

Yeah, I started. I started again. I started getting on commercial projects and I just see just these massive pores and I'm like, man, that looks crazy. I mean, you guys are just out there getting it. And I was like, I want to, I want to. I want to dip into that one. And little by little, you know, we got offered, you know, the chance to do a little here, a little there. And then from there I was like, this is what I want to do.

[A]

And so you do, you do mostly commercial work, right?

[C]

We do. Sometimes it'll. It'll vary. There's times where we're like stuck on commercial for three, four months at a time, and there's times where we'll go six months without even touching a commercial project. But I like Have a balance maybe like, 50. 50, if possible.

[A]

Yeah. And where. I. I don't know if you said it, but where somebody said they can't. They can't hear you. Why can't they hear you? I can hear you perfectly. Fluorescent Landscaping said sale has a girly voice. Maybe that's why. So I don't know.

[C]

Whoa, Fluorescent. That's one of my enemies there.

[A]

Now. They can hear you now. I don't know why.

[C]

All right, all right. How far back? We have to backtrack.

[A]

We don't have to because it's still recording. I have it recorded from before. It's all good, so.

[C]

Oh, okay, Perfect.

[A]

So you do a little bit of commercial, a little bit of residential. And how you have multiple crews going or what do you have?

[C]

Yeah, I just split them up into two. We're running one bigger crew. But then it's like there's too much work going around where I can't. The line. The line for these clients is getting too long, so I just had to. I'm in the works of it all right. Now just to split them up, I gotta have two at the same time, right?

[A]

So does that mean you need double of a lot of things?

[C]

That's why I bought the new machine.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. What? So what did you get for those

[C]

that don't follow John Deere?

[A]

Yeah, it was a. What is it?

[C]

Yeah, I bought it. 85G.

[A]

85. Oh, how did I miss that?

[C]

Yeah, she's got some hips on her. Yeah.

[A]

Is it brand new?

[C]

No, no, I got it used. They're really expensive. I didn't realize how expensive they were. And I saw one online. Used. It was a killer deal. And I sold a kidney, and I had to go get it.

[A]

Well, that's awesome. What other. What other machines do you have?

[C]

I had a 50G I sold to my buddy. Just. I don't know. I just didn't think we needed it at the time. But I do have a track loader. A 333G. That's my baby. That thing's just like. It's like one of your Kubotas. The thing's just a tank.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And I have.

[A]

It's funny.

[C]

Regular skid steer.

[A]

That's funny you bring that up, because I'm actually supposed to get a demo on a 333. John Deere really wants me to try it, so they're supposed to bring one out by the end of this week, I think, actually.

[C]

Oh, man. Once you start running gears, you're never gonna go back.

[A]

We'll see. I really like my Kubota 97 3. I love that machine. But I'm interested to see, like, how it does Compare to the 333. Because people, I mean, I've heard that machine is quite a beast. So.

[C]

Yeah, I mean, honestly, nowadays, I think it's just. I think every machine is good. I, you know, people could say, oh, this is junk or whatnot, but I think at this point everything's going to be good and it comes down to, you know, your local dealers and the service you're going to get.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, I would agree. And I have a really good relationship with my Kubota dealer, but I also have a really good John Deere dealer. And so we're renting that 135 right now. And they had brought me a demo on a mini loader or what was that? A 3,324pmini loader. And anyways, they, they. I would. When I was at Con Expo, I was talking to him and, and he was showing me the 333 and he's like, well, why don't I just bring one out and you could try it. I'm like, dude, that's fine. So anyways, they're gonna do that. So.

[C]

Yeah, they came out with a new one, right? It's a. I, I don't know. I don't think it's a 333. They came up with a bigger one.

[A]

I think it's. Man, when I was. I thought it said 330. What did it say? 335. And I didn't see it, I think.

[C]

So the thing, the thing is huge. Like it's like an extra, like £2,000, I think. It's.

[A]

So that would be like £14,000 track machine.

[C]

Yeah, mine's about 12,000. And I mean, it's, it's tough, you know, because there's times where it's like, oh, man, I wish I had a smaller machine.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

But when it's open field, like you guys have a lot of open fields.

[A]

Yeah, we have a lot of space back there.

[C]

It's just this. The power they have is just insane. The pushing power, the lifting power, and they have this reach where they can load any truck, whatever truck it's in front of, they'll load that thing to the top.

[A]

Yeah, for sure. Amborn stone says John Deere 333 will be smoother than the Kubota, but you'll miss the Kubota's door. But he is saying, yeah, it's a 335. That's crazy. HNH Landscaping. We have sale from Calco Partners. He's asking who's on Sal from Calco Partners. He's from California. Did you say exactly what part of California you're from? Sale or where do you operate on?

[C]

Yeah, I'm from the bay area, about 30 miles east of San Francisco.

[A]

Okay, gotcha.

[C]

From the cool part of the Bay Area. So the craziness on my end.

[A]

Do you, do you do a lot of. Is it mostly high end work or what would you say?

[C]

Yeah, we used to just do whatever. Our commercial works, you know, whatever kind of gets thrown at us. That's just a lot of the. Just sidewalks and just flat work. Just nothing crazy. Nothing too special. Yeah, but our residential, yeah, it's, it's super high end. We started working with some crazy designers and I just, I see the stuff that we get, you know, thrown at us and it's like, wow, this is crazy. Like, it's pretty cool. So it's definitely high end stuff.

[A]

That's super cool. VB Landscaping says sales known as the Pope of the state of California.

[C]

Hope of the west coast, man. I just. California, Oregon and Washington too.

[A]

I love sale. I'd love for you to. So you've done a bunch of concrete. I mean, they're more than concrete countertops, right? I mean, they're like grill islands and like, I, I don't know. Whenever I see you doing that stuff, it's, it's crazy. I'd love to hear you talk about that or like, how did you get into that? Or do you know what I'm talking about?

[C]

Yeah, yeah, we. I'm trying to think. When I did my first countertop. Oh, yeah, I remember. We. It was, it's on my page, maybe 30 pictures down. They just asked us to. And I was like, well, let me watch a YouTube video. But we're, I mean, we're really good at. Concrete's not the same, though. It's like, I, I, there's guys that do sidewalks, and you can't just grab those guys and tell them to do countertops.

[A]

It's different, okay?

[C]

There's a different. It's, it's just so, so it's just got to be smooth. And I, I had never really done one, and I was like, well, there's only one way to find out. You know, I have all the faith in the world in my guys, and I know they can do it. So let's give it a shot and worst case scenario, we just rip it out, right?

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And we did one and I was like, oh, we could do this. We got this. And from there, I mean, it's just a little bit more patience, you know, A little bit. The forms have to be real precise. I'd held an event at my house and that's when everybody in my backyard watching it live.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Go down.

[A]

You did, when did you do that? Last year?

[C]

No, that event was like three years ago already.

[A]

Oh, geez. Holy cow.

[C]

We're getting old, man.

[A]

I know. Yeah. So you did like a class kind of how to do it, right?

[C]

Yeah, just how to build an outdoor, outdoor kitchen. And I just had, it was, you know, just, just an idea I had. I didn't think it would blow up like that, but I had people from Tennessee, Michigan fly out.

[A]

Wow.

[C]

Just in my little backyard. I was like, holy smokes.

[A]

Yeah, that's awesome. And so it's, it sounds like everything you've done, I mean, you, you went from landscaping into all kinds of awesome concrete work and all ultimately it's all self taught. And I mean, you have obviously, I'm sure you have a great crew. And were they all experienced when you hired them or how has that gone?

[C]

Well, when I first started, I mean, I started with no employees. I, you know, I started from scratch. I didn't want anybody from any. I didn't want anybody. I just like, you know what I'm gonna start from zero. And I was on a job, on a commercial job and, and I was still, you know, trying to figure this out. And I just would meet, I would just meet people and some of the guys, I asked them, I was like, hey man, you know, it was summertime, so like, would you help me from like three to six? And they're like, yeah, sure. And they started helping me after work and next, you know, they're like, hey, dude, you seem pretty cool. Can we work for you full time? I was like, yeah, sure.

[A]

Wow, that's awesome.

[C]

But they were just, they were, they were just flat work guys. Like, these guys were just, you know, rough, rough concrete guys. But it's, it's one of those things where like in this trade or any, any outdoor trade, I guess it's just if you have common sense and you really like what you do and you, you want to do good work, I mean, you can, I mean, it's, it's, it's not impossible. And I feel like a lot of people can do it if they really care.

[A]

Yeah, well, I don't know how you do concrete. So like, I'm sure it's I don't. To me, it's the most stressful thing I've ever done in my life.

[C]

It used to be like that. I used to just sweat, like the days of concrete pours and I'd get like little mini anxiety attacks.

[A]

That sounds about right.

[C]

The last guy there. I'm late to some of the poorest. I just know my guys are just. They just. They're just so well trained and they're so good at what they do that I'm just like, what am. How am I going to help these guys if something goes wrong? It's not because of me. They're better than me. They're all better than me. So it's like they know what they're doing. And then this is that, you know, I trust my guys and, you know, I expect them to be leaders and to just run the projects.

[B]

The Molder Life podcast continues. In just a moment, Andy asked me to highlight a company that enables you to truly work smarter with their hydraulics over hands philosophy, enabling you to operate at a high level of efficiency. Obviously, I'm talking about CMP attachments. They make all kinds of attachments and buckets. Andy loves and uses their Hydra grapples and hydra buckets. CMP attachments is 100% made in America and has some of the industry's highest quality attachments for excavators, skid loaders, mini skid loaders, tractors, and more. CMP can take on any custom project to help make your business more efficient and profitable. Visit them at cmpattachments.com or click the link that we've provided in the podcast description.

[A]

These products are amazing. They're built to last and they'll help you make more Money. Again, that's cmpattachments.com how many guys work for you now?

[C]

I just bumped it up. I just hired three more guys, so I'm going to be at seven.

[A]

Oh, nice.

[C]

Well, that's not that big.

[A]

Yeah, but you can do a lot with. I mean, you could do some big jobs with that many people.

[C]

Yeah, the thing is that, you know, the machines. I'm having huge machines, but I mean, just like you, you guys do huge excavations just by having the equipment. I mean, that's half the battle.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, it is. It really is. It's. It's getting into that first machine and then keep moving up from there. And every time you add one, it makes everybody's job easier and. Or allows you to do other jobs that you weren't able to do before, you know, so

[C]

and that's what I think helped me a lot, was that, I mean, I was just. I've always been really disciplined with, like, my spending and what I was doing with my company funds. I knew I wanted to grow this company and, you know, buying luxury cars or just, you know, spending it on silly stuff wasn't going to help me. So I've always been. I've always struggled. I mean, it's growing pains. Just, you know, we've all gone through it. I try to stay as debt free as possible.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

So it's really. It's really taking its toll on me. But it's. It's been worth it. Like, especially now, I feel like I'm finally, you know, enjoying a little bit more of what I've built.

[A]

Yeah. That's really cool, man. H and H Landscaping says, do you use pea gravel in your cement?

[C]

It's not cement. It's concrete. But. Okay, let's. Let's clear the air real quick. Let's clear the air for everybody out there listening. It is not cement. Cement is like the chocolate chips in a cookie. It's an ingredient in cement. It's gravel, cement and water. Stir it and sand. Stir it together and you'll get concrete. Yeah, but we don't use pea gravel. We'll use depends what we're pouring. If we're pouring sidewalks, we'll use like a 50, 50 mix, which is like half, three quarter inch, half pea gravel.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

If it's something structural that we don't have to finish and we're just filling forms and you just go strictly three quarter rock with like a, you know, stick sack of cement per yard.

[A]

Okay. I guess, like, by us, I'll hear guys say, like, it's a six bag mix. Is that what that means?

[C]

Obviously, yeah.

[A]

Right.

[C]

Yeah. Six bag mix.

[A]

Gotcha.

[C]

And we always have. We always have fibers. There's two types of fibers. There's like these, like, long strands which we don't use. We. They call it microfiber. It almost. It almost looks like lint.

[A]

Mm.

[C]

And it adds a bunch of strength to the concrete. It's. And it's.

[A]

It's.

[C]

For me, I mean, I just. I think it's worth it. It's like 10 bucks a yard more. You know, it's only, you know, it's less than 300 bucks. We don't put that much all the time, so it's.

[A]

Sure.

[C]

It's like 300 every project. So we just add it to every mix. I just. Anything we can do on our end to prevent Cracking or any possible failure structurally, we're gonna, we're gonna take that precaution.

[A]

Yeah. Do you, do you have those kind of those ride on trowel things and all, all kinds of stuff like that?

[C]

No, we don't really use those. Even though we've done. I mean, we'll do big areas, but those things are. When you're doing like, like your shop, for instance, they'll do the, the power trials where they're just riding around.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Smoothing it out. It's either that or a bunch of guys. That's obviously a lot easier.

[A]

Yeah, I would. When they did my shop, I thought they would have done that, but because they did it in several pours, they just hard trialed it by hand, so.

[C]

Which is okay. We just did a sports court and I mean, honestly, that's how we're going to do the majority of our jobs.

[A]

Yeah. You get like five or six guys out there trawling it. Right.

[C]

Just going at it, having the time of their lives.

[A]

I don't know about that.

[C]

They look happy to me. I mean, I see it and I've always respected concrete guys and honestly I think that's what made me want to get into it. It's like, it's a different animal. Like they're a different group of guys. Like, yeah, you know, we're landscape. I mean, I was a landscaper and I thought that was hard. And then I saw, I mean, I just saw concrete guys. I'm like, man, these guys, they're rough around the edges. They tell you that they're ready to go to battle every day. And I was like, man, I want that kind of team.

[A]

Yeah, that's funny. You're like, I want to do something harder. I love that.

[C]

And on. And that's, that's kind of the thing. It's like, I'll do a couple projects and I'll. Or I'll see something and I'm like, oh, I want to do that. And once I do it two or three times, I'm like, okay, I don't want to do that anymore. Let's, let's do something else.

[A]

That's really cool. Well, I mean, it's good. You're pushing yourself, you're pushing your team. And the more, you know, whatever, crazier stuff or whatever you do, that the people are going to find that they just do.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, definitely. We don't, we never want to stay. We never want to plateau with the type of work we do. There's nothing wrong with that. I mean, I see People that they, they'll get to like the 50, 100 thousand dollar range projects and they'll just master them and then just one after the other. Yeah, for me, I just, I, if I get bored, I just, I lose interest. I feel like I, I, I'm not motivated. I, I always have to be pushing myself to do something bigger, something more challenging. It's not just about the money. I just feel like I also have to have a challenge.

[A]

Yeah, well that's good. It keeps you coming back.

[C]

What and then the equipment gets bigger.

[A]

Yeah, right, exactly. And it's, you know, we're all about the equipment, you know. So do you, I've seen some of your jobs. You're doing some different kinds of walls, right? Retain. You do like retaining walls and stuff like that?

[C]

Yeah, we do a lot of concrete walls. That's, that's kind of what I started like really pushing because it just, it was more of a niche thing. It's very few people can form up these walls like that. It's, it's a lot of work. And we have a project we're about to start. We're fingers crossed still. It's about 500ft of wall. It's a good sized project. That's why I bought the 85G. That's, I was like, I'm going to be drilling piers with that and digging, you know, footings with that 500 figure I'd plan ahead and that's a lot of concrete.

[A]

Dang. That's crazy. Is that like a one, you'll do that all in one pour or.

[C]

No, no, it's 500 total linear feet, but it's tiered.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

Got this house, this house on the hillside and we're just going to keep carving it and making it more usable space.

[A]

Wow. And so what. Obviously you don't have freeze and thaw cycle and stuff by you. So like what is, I mean we, I don't know. To me it, I would feel like there's some like, you would have to like reinforce that so much. But I mean how are you burying that in the ground a good bit? Like what'd you say you're digging? Piers, you said?

[C]

Yeah, we have, I mean we have, you know, handful engineers work with.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

We'll do like, you know, that takes, they'll have a solar report and they'll kind of get a gauge on what we're digging or drilling into and from there they'll tell us kind of what's needed. But for like say a 4 to 6 foot tall wall, they're going to want like a 2 by 2 footing and then a 12 to 14 foot pier. About 6 to 8ft on center.

[A]

12 to 14 foot pier?

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Like in the ground too.

[C]

Crazy, man. Yeah. So in, in the ground past the two feet. So I mean technically from grade you'd be like it. And then my walls will still crack.

[A]

That's crazy.

[C]

Yeah, that's. And around here, I mean if you tell me, oh, 12 foot piers, I'm like jumping up and down happy because that's not that deep and that's.

[A]

You're augering that obviously.

[C]

Yeah. Well, we'll have like an 18 inch diameter rock bit and we'll just straight into the rock.

[A]

Oh my.

[C]

Bedrock. Sometimes. Sometimes we have to go down 18, 20ft.

[A]

You're kidding. How are you doing that? You have like, like bit extensions on a augur. Like I don't even understand that.

[C]

Yeah, the bits. The bit we were using is about 8ft tall.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

Long. And then you know, we'll drill. We'll drill the eight feet, pull it out, clear it out and then we'll have an extension and we'll go another four feet and we'll do it in like four foot increments.

[A]

And you're doing that with the excavator or you're doing that with.

[C]

I was. Yeah, I was doing that with the 50G. With the 50G I sold.

[A]

Wow.

[C]

But it's. It's a lot. It's a lot of work. And yeah, the te tedious because the boom's not that big. So that's kind of why I figured if we're going to do a lot of drilling, let me get to 85 because I mean it's a way bigger boom and I could, you know, start jamming in extensions a lot easier without having to slot back and forth.

[A]

Wow. I cannot get over how far down you have to go. Why? Why? I don't understand. Like what's the. Why do you have to do that?

[C]

You know, we're in, we're in earthquake territory here. So we'll get one earthquake every 30 years.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

But I mean that's all it takes, right? Yeah, it just takes one earthquake. We don't. We don't necessarily know when it's going to happen. So that's what it'll call for. Yeah. Wow. So then it's just a small. It'll. It'll just be a small wall. Just little, little retaining wall. But it doesn't matter. The engineers, they have to cover their tail too. So.

[A]

Yeah. Right. So then you're tying that all together, the rebar, I'm assuming, and everything?

[C]

Yeah. We'll drop a rebar cage with like a number, a three, eight inch spiral with maybe six, you know, half inch bars or five, eight bars all the way down.

[A]

I cannot get over crazy.

[C]

Yeah. No. That ties into the grade beam, and then from there we tie up into our wall.

[A]

Gotcha. Wow. And so. But somebody would. Could do that. Could do. Say it's a small wall and you need these massive piers. They could build a landscape retaining wall and not need that. Is that true?

[C]

I guess it's the way you're retaining.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Technically, you know, anything aiming three feet and under, I mean, it's not holding up too much.

[B]

Sure.

[A]

Right.

[C]

Once. I guess it's. Every wall is going to be different. I mean, if behind the walls, just elevated but flat, not a big deal. But if it's. I mean, we're really carving into a hillside. So we're. The hydrostatic pressure coming down that bad boy.

[A]

Yeah. I can't even imagine. That's wild. And so then you're. When you get done with this work, you're. Are you backfilling? Are you putting drainage behind this stuff? Is that all part of your scope or you pour the concrete and then you leave?

[C]

No, it's. It's all part of our scope. After we pour, strip forms, and let it dry up a little bit, then we're gonna roll on like a waterproof membrane. And then we'll add the. It's called mirror drain. It's like a honeycomb plastic with the filter fabric. And then we just do your traditional just burrito wrap of gravel with the perforated pipe at the bottom.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

About 18 inches wide.

[A]

Gotcha. All the way up. Gotcha. Huh?

[C]

All the way up. Yep.

[A]

Wow, that's really cool. A couple questions. Fluorescent landscaping says, why does concrete turn out blotchy sometimes?

[C]

Why does concrete turn out blotchy? And I honestly believe that's a finisher problem. Nobody believes me.

[A]

That's a what?

[C]

I don't know if you've seen it. I don't know, like the actual finishers like concrete out there when it's like they're. They're done and it like just looks blotchy even a month later.

[A]

I mean, I don't know.

[C]

I guess I've never seen that.

[A]

I guess maybe I haven't paid attention that much, but

[C]

I Sometimes concrete, it will look like. It look like. It'll look like it has oil stains on it.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

Super dark and then super Light.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And nobody. Nobody can really dial in or figure out why. But I. I truly believe that it's the finishers that get on it too early, and they use a steel trowel too early, and they seal it up. And by doing that, they trap all that. Yeah. They'll trap all that moisture in there, and then it will dry inconsistently. And that's the blotchiness. My beliefs. That's what I think.

[A]

Yeah. Interesting.

[C]

People ask me, how do you know? Like, it's never happened to us.

[A]

Yeah. Right. How? That's always the thing. Like, when I'm. I mean, I've done a few. A few small pads here and there. Nothing. You know, I've done some pads that go underneath pavers, and those are what I'm most proud of. But, like, I always am. I always feel like I'm rushing the finishing process because I don't want to wait long enough. But, like, is it. I believe. And you can correct me if I'm wrong. I believe, like, so much of concrete finishing is, like, number one, waiting, but also just learning when the right time is to. To do something. And then, obviously, there's so many factors that can change the timing of that. It's crazy.

[C]

Yeah, it's. It's. It is pretty crazy. These guys just. You know, the guys that help me out, my finishers, that. That's what they do every single day of the year when they go to work, they're finishing concrete. They know it more than they know their kids.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Literally, they spend more time with concrete than with their kids.

[A]

Sure.

[C]

And they can just walk up. They can just look at it and walk up to it and just. They just tap it. Give it one little tap. Like, oh, it's not ready yet. Give me 20 minutes. And yeah, it's. It's wild. And also it's. I mean, a windy day, a hot day, a cold day, all those things are gonna, you know, affect its turing process and what you can do with it, obviously, on the summer. In the summer, it's one of those things where you do have to hurry. Yeah. And you're more. It's. The faster concrete cures, the more chances of it to crack. So it's like. I mean, if you're in Arizona, what are you going to do? You got to pour. You got to pour. But we definitely watch the weather and try to avoid pouring when it's over 100 degrees.

[A]

Yeah. And I'm assuming you deal with that kind of stuff a lot. Right.

[C]

It's not too bad. I mean, we, or we'll have a super early pour, but I, I really would. I try to avoid it. But I mean, the show must go on. I mean, there's days where we gotta finish. You gotta finish.

[A]

Yeah, right.

[C]

And we'll do everything we can to prevent it from cracking. But sometimes, you know, it's the nature of the game, right?

[B]

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[A]

50HNH Landscaping says. Oh, no, sorry. VB Landscaping Design says. Do you have a job minimum? Whether that be, I guess, size or price, I don't know, but

[C]

I mean, not really. It's just if it's, I hate to say it, but if it's worth our time.

[A]

Yeah, right.

[C]

We. We'll squeeze in any size job in. You know, there's always going to be filler projects. There's going to be times where you know we're going to finish a job the middle of June, but our next job can start till July 1st. We got two weeks. We'll throw something in the mix, but not something we chase. Sure, but if we had to say a minimum, I'd like to keep it over a hundred thousand.

[A]

Yeah, those are good sized jobs.

[C]

Yeah. Sometimes it's the mobilizing, just the moving parts and just getting everything set up. And then if I'm only going to be there for two weeks and break it down and move, it's just we're Like a traveling circus.

[A]

I believe it.

[C]

The more stocks we go, we're going to. It's like the more stops we make, I feel like the less profitable we're going to be.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Well.

[A]

And, like, I've watched some of the stuff you're doing, and, like, the amount of framing work it takes to, like. It's really incredible, the framing work that goes into some of this stuff.

[C]

Yeah. And I mean, you as you know, because like I said, we're a traveling circus. The more we do it, the more we realize, like, man, just throw it in the dumpster. Don't even try to save it.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

It breaks my heart sometimes to throw all this wood away. If it's two by fours, it's cheaper for me to throw them away.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

2x12s, we try to. We try to salvage them and get like two, three uses out of them, but two by fours, it's just like, the price of it's so cheap. And I'm like, I can just call in the delivery to the next job, and we're starting fresh with the straight 2x4.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Why are we even trying to fix this banana with 2x4?

[A]

Yeah. Or sifting through to find the right size, or this one has three more screws in it that we didn't take out or whatever. Like, I totally understand. Like, it just doesn't make sense.

[C]

Yeah, it's. It's. And it's. It's. It's a hard habit to kick because you just like, I'm throwing away money, but it's like, your time is money.

[A]

Yeah, totally. There's. There's a lot of stuff on different jobs that we do that, like, somebody would be like, man, I can't believe you throw that away. And it's like, dude, I don't have time or the bandwidth to organize this and move it back. We just need to get to the next job. It just doesn't make sense. You know what I mean?

[C]

Yeah. Because, like, say, you know, we're. We're done with the job, and it's like, we already have a dumpster on site. I look at. I'm like, am I going to clean this stuff, take it back to my shop, pay those man hours, and then wait for the next job to be needed, pay the man hours to go, load it back up. It's like half the time it doesn't make sense.

[A]

Right. Yep. I totally get it.

[C]

Man taught me that.

[A]

What's that?

[C]

Other than that one for saying synced up Tommy, that.

[A]

Oh, yeah. You use synced Up.

[C]

Oh man. I've been a synced up cowboy for a while now.

[A]

Oh, that's sweet, dude. That's awesome. I don't, I feel like sometimes people don't understand that like that kind of a program can work for any, in my opinion, can work for any kind of trade. It really could. Doesn't have to just.

[C]

I tell people and I, I don't care what people say. Like I really, really, really did not become a profitable business until I started with that.

[A]

Wow, that's sick.

[C]

Like, I just, I, I just didn't. You feel, you know your numbers, you feel, you know everything that's going on and in the heat of the moment, you're just jotting down, you know it's going to take me this many hours, it's going to cost me this materials. And everybody forgets the back end stuff.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Your car insurance, your, your workers comp your registration on car. Just all this stuff that never gets taken into consideration. And, and once we locked all that stuff in and we started pushing it, I was like, oh man, I was wrong. I was wrong for a long time.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Now I, I don't, I don't even. Any project, it gets into sync, it goes into synced up and whatever that number that it spits out to us, that's a non negotiable number. Like that's, that's what I need to recover everything the company needs and our profit and there's no turning back.

[A]

That's so cool, dude. That's so cool that you found that and then found it so helpful and you've seen it be such a good thing for your business. That's awesome.

[C]

Yeah. And I have people tell me, oh well it costs that much a month? I was like, I don't pay for that. That's part of the budget.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

You know, there's. Until you really start seeing things like that, like I really think you will struggle financially and, and I did for, for you know, a handful of years.

[A]

Yeah. That's so cool, dude. Question. Where does Sal see, where does he see taking Calco in the next five to 10 years?

[C]

That's a tricky question. I don't, I don't want to get too much bigger. I think I'm gonna, you know, run these two crews and see where that goes. I think that'll push us. If I can get, you know, this year is just going to be kind of figuring out. So we're going to see how that goes. But if I can get next year really rolling, I think that'll Push us to about 5 million a year. And I don't see myself wanting to get that much bigger than that.

[A]

Yeah, that's really, that would be, in my opinion, that'd be really good for two crews. That'd be, you'd be ripping. I mean,

[C]

yeah, man, we're, we're, we're doing really well right now. And I just, I know it's going to take a lot of work, but it's something I feel we could definitely do. And that's, that's the, that's the goal. That's the goal. Keep the pipeline filled. I'm bringing on some help to take on a lot of my tasks so I can just focus on selling these high end jobs and I think we could definitely push 5.

[A]

So what?

[C]

Because the boys, the boys are, the boys are locked in. Like these guys, they, they really, really just, they just take care of work and. Yeah, I don't have to babysit these guys or anything.

[A]

And so you're not, you're not, you don't necessarily need to be on the job anymore?

[C]

No, no, not anymore. As much I miss it, man. I really do.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Every morning it's almost like, it's like a habit. I'll grab like my tool bag with my hammer and hard hat and I never pull it out. Yeah. I bring with me though, just in case.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

I have the hope sometimes of being able to get out there.

[A]

I, I get it, dude. I. It is hard. Every day is like, I would, I would much rather just sit in the machine and work or whatever we need to do. I would, I would rather be doing that. But it's still, it's just sometimes I feel. It's like I have to get out of my head that, like, I don't have to be the one that does that and they can handle it and I don't know, it's. It's a weird, it's a weird place to be when you're trying to. When you've, I guess, found your identity in the actual work and now you're transitioning away from that. Does that make sense?

[C]

Yeah, because I mean that's, that's why I started this. That's why I've never held a job outside of these kind of trades in my life. I mean, I loved building, I love getting creative and you know, just doing this kind of work and now you're telling me to sit and at my computer all day and I'm like, I'm not used to that. Yeah, well, it's a funny story. It's like, I've. I've always. When I work for my parents, I felt I was the best employee. I was really good at operating. I was really good at just understanding landscaping, irrigation, and all that. And when I started Calco and I, you know, I brought my guys and I bought my equipment, and I just knew they were like, carpenters. They could step forms, they could grade. They could do that kind of stuff. And I remember the first project, I jumped in the machine, and I just like, hey, guys, get out of the way. I'm gonna. I'm gonna dig this hole. And they're all just standing there watching me, and I. I thought I was like, Rambo. I was, like, digging trenches and I was going to town, and they didn't. They couldn't. It took. Took a little bit out of them. You know, my guy Julio, he's like, hey, you know, boss. I was like, yeah. Like, can you get out of that machine? I was like, what do you mean? You're not very good? I was like, you're better than me. He's like. He's like, we're all better than you. I was so happy, but it was. It was like. Like they thought I would be, like, upset. I was like, wait, you guys are better? Oh, my gosh. Take. Take the wheel.

[A]

Go for it.

[C]

I don't even operate. I. I'll buy a new machine. I bought the 85G. I moved it, like, 20ft, and then they just kicked me off.

[A]

Yeah, dude, that's. It's. I do not. I like to be in the job, and I. I love. That's my ultimate. Like, I could spend all day on the job doing the work, but I have no problem, like, releasing that to the guys when they're doing a phenomenal job. Like, I just don't. I. It. It is, like, it's a huge joy for me to see them just doing the work without me, and it looks great. You know what I mean?

[C]

Yeah, that's. That's, like, one of those things where it's. It's. You feel it just can't be. Like, there's no way they're gonna do it just how I want it. Like, but, you know, if you train them right, and they're already smart to begin with. Yeah, they. They can read plans. They read the civils. They'll read all my grading plans, my drainage plans, and they understand grading. They shoot. They shoot grade with lasers, and they're on it. I mean, their. Their math skills are just second to none. Like, these guys are converting from Tenths to inches, like in a heartbeat. I'm like, whoa. Do you give me a pen and paper? Hold on.

[A]

Dude, that's great, man.

[C]

It really sounds like, keep me on my toes.

[A]

Yeah, sounds like give a really great.

[C]

They keep me on my toes.

[A]

That's awesome.

[C]

And it's good. I mean, it's. It's just. It's having a crew like that. I mean, they push me. I mean, I'm. I'm running, ordering stuff, make sure everything's good. And these guys, they just. They go to work every day for work. Like, they really enjoy what they do. I don't have to. That's. That's. That was my biggest fear. It's like, man, I'm gonna grow and babysitting guy. I'm not a babysitter. Like, that's the last thing I ever want to be. But these guys can just. They'll just figure it out.

[A]

Yeah, that's really cool. What. So you have a shop and stuff or. Like, how. What. What is your. Like what. What is it? You have a home base kind of a thing? What a yard or.

[C]

I have a yard. I'm renting right now, but I'm kind of in the works. I'm trying to buy a property. I'm trying to do something a little like how you have going on.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

But it's just kind of back burned it right now. I don't. I don't need much. We. We just. Once I started throwing stuff away, I realized, wait, I don't need to store this stuff.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And my. My equipment's never at the yard. It just literally goes job to job. So does have to. It's just half the circus goes job to job. So I just. I just have a little slot I rent at this industrial yard, and that's about it. I don't. I've never needed too much.

[A]

Yeah, that's perfect. Well, and you don't. I mean, you don't have freezing temperatures there, so it's not like you have to put stuff inside for the winter. And like, there's. It's just a different.

[C]

It gets 40 degrees here, man. It gets 40 degrees. That's freezing.

[A]

To me, 40 degrees would be like sweatshirt weather. Perfect.

[C]

I wear a sweater in July.

[A]

That's awesome. A couple questions. Well, one of them is Josh Christ says, what wall block is in your story? He must be talking about something that I put up today. Were you on the job that you probably saw today? We're using Unilock Sienna Edge Wall. It's s. I. E N N A. I think it's how it's spelled. Landscaping with Dylan says, how does sale get his work? Advertising, word of mouth.

[C]

IG? Do I get my work? Good question. Just making a lot of friends. I've always networked with designers. My buddy Sam, MH Land company from Sacramento. He. He's an awesome designer. He gives us a lot of the bigger projects. And then I also network with some designers on my end, but for the most part, that's it. I don't have a website. I don't even have logos on my trucks, phone numbers, nothing.

[A]

That's.

[C]

We just get into it with the designers and do some cool stuff for them.

[A]

That's so cool. So these are people that are building homes, and they're like, hey, you should use this guy for this part of the job, or whatever.

[C]

We very. We rarely work on a new home build.

[A]

Oh, okay.

[C]

The home's already done here. It's. It's just. These are old developments, these are older homes, bigger homes, and they just want to revamp the after Covid. I feel covet was the start of all this, to be honest. It was like a blessing in disguise for us. A lot of these tech guys were sitting at home, you know, they couldn't go on vacation, they couldn't go to the office. So they're just sitting at home and they're like, man, we're. We want a cool backyard. And that's where all the crazy backyards started coming out, all the covered patios, all the big fireplaces and fire pits. Because if you're sitting at home on a laptop on a conference call that you want to have a. You don't necessarily want to be cooped up inside your spare bedroom.

[A]

Right, Right. That's really cool.

[C]

Yeah. Mostly designers. Designers and architects. That's who gives us the work. We don't. Like I said, we don't really. I mean, I use my Instagram just kind of screw around, but I don't feel like getting too many leads from that. Just alone.

[A]

Yeah. Well, what's cool about how you're doing it is because those lead designers, architects and stuff, that they're always. They're always finding different customers and different in different groups of people or whatever, and so you're kind of almost doubling your. I don't know, like, your. Your footprint, because not only will the designer and architect keep recommending you, if you're doing a great job and. And how it's turning out, then the homeowner also, I'm sure, gets to know you in some form. And they are talking. Right, so.

[C]

Exactly. Yeah. So it will. That. That's exactly how it's been working. We'll work for the designers and then that. It's always one after the other. And then homeowners will have a barbecue or a party and yeah. Their wealthy friends will show up and they'll be like, holy crap, who built this?

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And then I get there into there.

[A]

I mean, if. If anybody's listening and. And you haven't gone to follow. Follow his channel. It's very. It. The. The countertop work, dude, that stuff. I can't even imagine. If I went to somebody's house and I saw that, I'd be like, what is this? And who did it? You know what I mean? Like, it's so beautiful. Nobody does. I get. I mean, by us, nobody does. I. I have not seen anybody do what you do by us at all. It's crazy.

[C]

Yeah. We started building those aluminum. Aluminum patio covers too. And that was kind of a game changer for us as well.

[A]

Yeah. Is that the one that you sent me the picture of today?

[C]

Yeah. That thing's all aluminum. Even that wood. That's not wood. It's aluminum too.

[A]

Yeah. That's super cool. It's beautiful.

[C]

It's. Yeah, it's powder coated. I mean. But it's not a kit, though. It's. A lot of people think it's a kit. It's. They're pretty much like an aluminum lumberyard. No, the aluminum you need, you could cut it to size and get your engineer to. You have a designer draw it up and send it to engineering and then you order the parts and the. That you need and then you do it.

[A]

That's so sweet. What? You know, I had something that I was thinking about, about you working in California. Like, to me, when I think about working in California, it feels like there would be a lot of red tape or a lot of things you have to do differently than maybe other places do. Like, do you. Do you do. Is there a lot of, like, restrictions or things you have. You're required to do? I don't know.

[C]

Yeah. I mean, yes, yes and no. I think it's going to be pretty standard when you're building things that can, you know, just tell people when you're building something that can tip over and hurt somebody. There's going to be, I feel, anywhere in the country there's going to be restrictions on. Restrictions on this stuff.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah. So at that point, you know, whether it be a patio cover or a wall, you Know, we have to shoot it through engineering. But also, since some of these lots aren't that big, there's some where they're kind of like where you guys are at in Indiana, where they're huge, just like farms kind of farm kind of style properties. But if you do live in a more closed environment, like a tract home or something like that, you know, we. We mostly have those, you know, setbacks where we can't just build a pool on the. Off the edge of the property line.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

We have to stay somewhat off of them. So it's more of that. The setback rules and then the height restrictions. So there are. There are some hoops we have to jump through, and it's going to vary. There's some towns that just don't even care. And they just said, go for it. Like, the project I'm on right now, we're building this crazy, like, 30 by 20 pavilion. And the city planning department didn't care about the pavilion. They wanted to know my drainage plan. I was like, are you kidding me? And I'm just like. I just kind of laughed it off. Like, all right, we'll get to the drainage plan.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. You're like, yeah, no problem.

[C]

So sometimes it can be like that, but there's other. It just varies from town to town, city to city. It can completely vary. But I mean, if you, you know, if you kind of follow the rules, have all your ducks in a row, engineers and designers know what they're doing. I mean, it's pretty straightforward.

[A]

Yeah. So you're working with engineers a lot. It sounds like

[C]

for every project, sometimes I get brought in and it's already done. Like that wall project I was mentioning to you, that they had already had engineering. They drew it up. It's ready to go. There's times where if we're in charge of the entire project from the get go, then we'll. We'll hire our engineers and we'll get that ball rolling.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

[B]

You're listening to the Molder Life podcast. Because you want to get better at your craft, Andy is always working hard to improve himself and pass on that knowledge to you. He's even improved his molder outdoors.com website to make it easier to use and to give you several ways to support the podcast. When you visit molder outdoors.com, click on the shop link to pick up some of the coolest merch around. Choose from camo hats and beanies to fluorescent work shirts and super warm hoodies. While on that page, scroll down and check out the video, courses, contracts, and worksheets. To make you and your company highly effective and profitable. I recommend the everything bundle, which gives you access to all the training and forms while sitting, saving you money. If you need to book a one on one consultation, you can do that as [e-mail] support the show while growing your business. There's also a link you can use in the show description.

[A]

Landscaping with Dylan says in California, we can only take 10% or $1,000 before the project actually starts, whichever is less. No. 50 down for us. Is that. Obviously that's the same thing for you.

[C]

Yeah, yeah. For us. Yeah. We, We. I mean, we'll. We obviously have to lock in that job.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

But then once we get the ball rolling it, once we mobilize, once equipment's on site, you know, day one, we're already ordering stuff. There's lead times on this. Whether it be our pavers, you know, this one we're using taco block. If there's any lead times on it. Or we anticipate lead times on materials. We. We need a good chunk down.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Just because we don't want to wait, the show's got to keep going. So we take a fat chunk up front after day one, and then we'll order appliances, pavers, anything that's going to have a lead time.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. That's really cool.

[C]

Which will end up being like 25% of the. You know, we'll try to get 25% of the project.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Scare some people, but that's just what's needed. I. We just can't afford to be slowed down by a delivery truck.

[A]

Yeah, exactly. No kidding. Do you. Do you. I mean, how far out do you book? Are you booking out like six months? A year? Like, what. What does that look like for you? Sometimes.

[C]

This. This is. This is the craziest time I've ever had. Like, in my entire life. I've never been this busy. Even through the winter. Like, we didn't rain too much, but it was just enough to screw up the schedule.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

Because we just have non stop, like, non stop. We're booked up going into the fall already.

[A]

Wow. Dude, that's amazing. With two crews the whole time.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Dude, that's so sick. What a great feeling.

[C]

Insane. Like, yeah, that's. That's good. It feels great to just know. Like, all right. I'm still not gonna take my foot off the gas, But I'm not gonna overbook. Unless they're willing to wait till. I hate starting practice in the Fall, because I know it's gonna be a

[A]

mess, but because you get so much

[C]

rain, try to find. We don't get. I mean, yeah, we get rain. Just the soil, it's so much clay. It's just, it's just a mucky mess. I mean, okay, you know, production. So production slows down. Off hauling soil is hard because who wants it? My truck drivers, they can't get into the dump sites. They close them down. So the logistics do change. So I, I put that on myself like this past winter. I find a job that I know won't be a mess. And I still got to keep my guys busy. So I'll hunt down something where we can work through the winter. Yeah, like this past winter we did. They were concrete countertops. They were for locker enclosures at a school. And I, and I told them, can you wait till the winter? I'm like, yeah, we can wait till December. And it was dumping rain and my guys were under awnings just playing concrete during the time of their lives.

[A]

Yeah, that is super wise. And I, I think that's something for a lot of people to, to think about and listen is you, You. We have a response. You know, as business owners, I, I have a hu. I feel a huge weight, right. We have all these guys we need to keep busy. We want to work them through the winter. So like, it's very easy to say yes to everything, but you need to be thinking, you know, six, eight month months in advance and thinking, okay, like how can I, how can I work my schedule to allow me to keep my guys busy with the right kind of work when you normally maybe couldn't do specific jobs like by us that the project. We had a crazy winter here. We had a ton of snow. It had. We haven't had a winter like this in a long time. But the job that we've worked on, I was very excited that it was going to be going through the winter and into the next year because it's all in the sand. It's 30 minutes south of me. Any job that we have over that, whenever we get jobs over there, it's all in the sand. And the best part about that is there's no mud. So the second that the frost comes out or it rains or whatever, it. You can immediately work. There's no waiting. So like, I think it's, it's just something for people to realize that like, even if you may need that job right now, you might be wise to like, hey, can we save this one for, you know, October, November December or whatever. You know what I mean?

[C]

Yeah, no, it's, it's, it, I, it is. I feel it is an obligation for us because, like, I just can't tell you guys. Hey, guys. Sorry it's raining. Like, I, I got, if I can, I will. I mean, it's. Sometimes it's inevitable, but I don't think we ever take off more than a week, like a week straight. It's very rare. Like, I always, whether I call friends and we're working inside doing some random odd end job, but we're always doing something.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

That's why, that's why I didn't want to. You know, my five to ten year plan with Calco, it's not expanding in this particular trade, but I, I do want to start flipping a house every winter.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

My guys indoors.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

Because if I do that, I, I can guarantee the work and I can have my full crew staffed. And come December, when it's raining through January, we push off that work, the outdoor work down, further down the pipeline, knock out a house, put it back on the market, and then my guys go back outside.

[A]

Yeah. That's awesome, dude. That's. Well, I'm sure you'll do it because you don't screw around, so

[C]

try not to.

[A]

Yeah. Hey, so we're coming up on a few more minutes here before the hour's up, but I, I've been trying to ask every guest, My goal is to ask every guest the same couple of questions at the end of the podcast, and I just thought that'd be something cool to do as we have people on the podcast. So the first question is, what's your favorite tool or equipment that has made the biggest difference in your business?

[C]

I think the 333G, the track loader. That one, that one really changed the game for us when it came to grading and tackling bigger jobs.

[A]

Nice. What did you have before that?

[C]

I just had a, just a regular skid steer.

[A]

Okay, gotcha. Well, yeah, just going to, just. Yeah, but just going to a track machine is probably incredible.

[C]

Yeah. Because it doesn't matter how many it is. Yeah. Right through it.

[A]

Right, exactly. Another question is what, what is the decision that you had to make that, that hurt at the time, but positioned you to win in the long term?

[C]

Well, it hurt just spending all my money on equipment because I, I, I want to be debt free.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

So that, that, that, that's don't stings. I mean, you know, like just the other day I was like, I'm, I'm not financing the machine and that 85G is not cheap. And it's done. I mean, I was at the bank and I'm like, transfer it to this guy.

[A]

That's so cool.

[C]

It's okay. I can wake up tomorrow with no work and I don't have to worry about that payment.

[A]

Yeah, man, that's so sick. Good for you, dude. That's so cool. And another question, this is one that I've been thinking about adding to this is if, if you, if you weren't doing, if you couldn't do what you do right now, what is something else that you would do or would you like to do or whatever?

[C]

I'd probably be a car salesman. I think it'd be all right at that.

[A]

Yeah. Really?

[C]

I'd tell you, I'd tell you I'd sell you a Lamborghini in no time, Andy. Get you black on black on black. Come on now.

[A]

I, I could see that. I, I, I, I could see you falling for all of your sales tricks. That's awesome.

[C]

I only live once, man. Come on.

[A]

A car salesman. I like that. That's awesome. Are you Sal, are you married? Do you have kids or.

[C]

Yeah, I'm married. I have a 14 year old son and a 10 year old daughter.

[A]

Oh, that's cool. Do your, your kids ever work with you in any, any way, shape or

[C]

form or, you know, my son used to work with me a lot when I was more on the landscape side, like when I was still working for my parents.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

But now it just take how it gets. He's older now, so I feel like, all right, cool. We can, you know, the common sense is coming, but it's dangerous. You know these guys. When you're in a track machine, you're spinning around you. My every employee knows, get out of the way. But 10 year old, 12 year old boy doesn't know that.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

So these things kind of would scare me. And I'm like, the guy in the escalator is swinging that boom. Assuming that every employee knows to get out of that swing area. So I wouldn't take him before, but he's gonna, he wants, he wants to make some money, he said, so we'll see this summer.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. My son is 13 and last year when he came with us, he came with us two or three days last summer and I, I finally paid like, he worked with us a whole day one time and I paid him like a normal hourly rate. And when I paid him at the end of the day, his eyes lit up and I'm like, See, dude, this is what. When you work all day and you actually work, like, this is. It was kind of clicking in his head, like, oh, this is how it works. You know what I mean?

[C]

I mean, it's. It's a great thing to do if you can do that to kids at a young age. I. I make him do chores around the house or even help me clean up around that. The yard, at the shop. But when they. When they sweat and they really earn that money, they'll see that they don't just want to spend it that fast.

[A]

Yeah, you're totally right. Does your. Does your wife do anything in the business?

[C]

No. No, I'm. I'm. There can only be one crazy person in the house.

[A]

I. I get it. My wife does not do anything in my business either. And we. We. We tried it for, like, a very short time and immediately realized that was not a good idea. So,

[C]

yeah, you know, it's a lot of people, and there's, you know, couples that can do that. I. I just feel it's. We're wired different, you know? You know, like, me and you are wired different. We have this vision. We have this way of thinking where it sounds crazy to the average person, but I don't feel we're average people. Like, we just. We just think different. And a lot of people won't understand what's going in our. Going on in our minds. They're gonna be like, no, you're crazy. Like, that's a stupid idea. I'm like, don't worry. Give me five years. It'll be fine.

[A]

Yeah, sure. That's cool. Yeah. Yeah, that's cool. Well, listen, Sal, I. I really appreciate you being on the podcast. I'd love if you want to tell the listeners where they can follow and anything else you want to say, and then we'll wrap it up.

[C]

All right, guys. Well, it was awesome being on here. If you want to follow me on Instagram, my handle is Calco Underscore Partners. And like they said in the chat, I'm the pope of concrete and the pope of the west Coast.

[A]

I love it. Awesome. Well, thanks to C and P Attachments for being our sponsor this week. Go to cmpattachments.com, give them a call, shoot them an message on Instagram. Pave Save. Same thing for Pave Tool. Pave tool dot com. Don't forget our coupon code ncon for being our studio sponsor. And Albany's Candy factory is back. The official Candy the Motor Life podcast. We have some gummies, and they're amazing as always. So, Sal, I appreciate you being on this week. And yeah, everybody else will catch you on the next one.

[B]

This has been a molder outdoors and Mr. Producer production.