603: Why Vietnam May Be The Best Kept Secret In Sourcing With Jim Kennemer

Summary

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Podcast Summary: The My Wife Quit Her Job Podcast With Steve Chou

Episode 603: Why Vietnam May Be The Best Kept Secret In Sourcing With Jim Kennemer

Date: August 20, 2025
Host: Steve Chou
Guest: Jim Kennemer (Founder, Cosmos Sourcing & SourcingHub.io)

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Steve Chou hosts seasoned sourcing expert Jim Kennemer to discuss the evolving landscape of global manufacturing, with a focus on why Vietnam is becoming an increasingly attractive sourcing destination—especially given recent tariff shifts affecting China, and the challenges with alternative countries like Mexico, Thailand, and Indonesia. Jim draws on deep on-the-ground experience in Vietnam and Southeast Asia to compare the realities, risks, and opportunities for ecommerce entrepreneurs and Amazon FBA sellers seeking to diversify beyond China.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Current Sourcing & Tariff Landscape

• Ongoing Uncertainty:
  • U.S. tariffs for imports from Vietnam are changing, with potential jumps from 10% to 20% (beginning August 1st, 2025), yet the rules remain in flux and are often driven by political commentary rather than concrete legislation ([05:12]).
  • China tariffs are "locked in" at around 55% for the short to medium term ([05:57]).
  • Recent updates suggest materials/components originating in China (even if finished in Vietnam) may be subject to a separate 40% tariff due to new anti-transshipment measures ([07:23]).

“We’ve got literally people making millions, tens of millions of dollars in purchase agreements based on a single Truth Social post. That is pretty uncertain.” – Jim Kennemer ([05:47])

Why Consider Vietnam for Sourcing?

• Strengths:
  • Apparel/textiles: Highly developed, with ~6,000 factories and 2M+ workers ([10:40]).
  • Furniture: Especially wooden products, leveraging local tropical wood ([13:39]).
  • Increasing capacity in plastics, metal goods, silicone, and now electronics ([14:45]).
• Competitiveness:
  • Costs are comparable to China for cut-and-sew items; tariffs, not base manufacturing costs, are now the real differentiator ([12:13]).
  • Apparel MOQs (minimum order quantities) have risen to around 1,000 units due to increased post-trade war demand ([10:03]).
• Limitations:
  • Private label/pre-branded “off-the-shelf” products are rare—Vietnamese factories mostly expect to create new/custom products per client ([33:38]).

“Apparel and textiles, cut and sew items in general, are better in Vietnam flat out without tariffs being factored in…from high-tech gear to cheap T-shirts.” – Jim Kennemer ([10:40])

Sourcing Process: China vs. Vietnam

• Similarities:
  • Shipping and logistics processes are “the same as China” ([18:23]).
  • Payment is typically via wire transfer, with standard international protocols ([32:24]).
• Differences:
  • Factories in Vietnam generally do not provide in-house product designers; clients need to supply detailed tech packs, drawings, or even 3D files ([17:10]).
  • Factories do not chase buyers as aggressively as in China; buyers must initiate and follow up ([30:11]).
  • Communication platforms differ: WhatsApp and Zalo are common (over WeChat) ([31:35]).
  • English is generally sufficient for sales/export staff, supported by translation apps ([31:48]).

“The big difference with Vietnam—you have to be the one who initiates that conversation and kind of follow up…They just don’t chase after you.” – Jim Kennemer ([30:11])

Other Countries in the Sourcing Mix

Mexico

• Challenges:
  • Significantly higher costs (1.5–2x China/Vietnam) and 30% tariffs ([19:33], [19:55]).
  • Supply chain lacks depth, contract manufacturing options limited; more viable for very large companies with own facilities ([20:06]).
• Logistics: “Fantastic” due to proximity, but offset by higher costs ([20:43]).

Southeast Asia (Thailand, Indonesia, Malaysia)

• Thailand:
  • Strong in advanced appliances and plastics; tariffs are steep (36%), making it less attractive for small to mid-sized ecommerce ([21:47], [22:57]).
• Indonesia:
  • Emerging as a low-cost option especially for wooden goods, shoes, some apparel ([23:27]).
  • Apparel pricing is comparable to Vietnam, with less developed industry ([24:03]).
• Malaysia:
  • Best for specific metal goods ([23:12]).

China

• Still the global hub, especially for electronics and R&D-driven products ([22:08]).
• Trade tensions and high tariffs (55%) drive search for alternatives.

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Practical Sourcing Tips & Notable Process Insights

Finding and Vetting Vietnamese Suppliers

• Alibaba is only a fraction of the market; best results from trade shows, “Yellow Pages” (still active in Vietnam), and relationship-building ([28:10], [29:19]).
• Trade shows (Global Sources in Vietnam, FIFA for home goods, niche-specific events) are invaluable for contacts and credibility ([28:36]).
• RFQs: Factories respond best to serious, sizable inquiries—lead with your long-term intent, even if your sample order is small ([31:13]).

Communication & Negotiation

• Be proactive; follow up repeatedly for responses ([30:11]).
• WhatsApp and Zalo are the primary messaging platforms ([31:35]).
• English is fine, especially via email or messaging apps; sales staff often use translation tools ([31:48]).

Order Process & Payment

• Wire transfers are standard for established orders ([32:24]).
• Turnaround times similar to China, sometimes slightly slower:
  • Apparel/Textiles: 30–45 days
  • Furniture: up to 60 days ([40:32])

Intellectual Property & Business Risks

• IP protection is somewhat more enforceable in Vietnam compared to China, with access to Western law firms ([34:03]).
• IP theft and direct competition (factories selling on Amazon) is less prevalent in Vietnam ([34:43]).

“Private label is probably the hardest one to source. Anybody that just wants to have a pre-made product, slap their logo on—it’s very hard to do because none of the factories really maintain existing products or develop products.” – Jim Kennemer ([33:38])

Who Is/Is Not a Good Fit for Vietnam Sourcing?

Best for: Businesses needing apparel, textiles, bags, furniture, and certain plastics/metals with willingness to place higher MOQs.
Less optimal for: Those seeking off-the-shelf private label items or with complex, small-volume, niche manufacturing needs ([32:49], [33:38]).

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Macro Trends & Industry Outlook

• Many ecommerce sellers are absorbing tariff costs instead of raising prices—“brinkmanship,” risking zero or negative profits to maintain market share ([27:04]).
• Vietnam’s industries are rapidly modernizing and automating; factories are adding advanced QC and automation to match demand ([36:36]).
• Movement to even lower-cost countries (Pakistan, Bangladesh) is happening, but mostly for large-scale, undifferentiated goods ([36:36]).

U.S. Manufacturing?

Unlikely to reshore low-value goods (T-shirts at $30 vs. $2–$3 Vietnam cost)—the domestic industry is more likely to focus on higher-value products (tech, cars, airplanes) ([38:09]).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Tariff Chaos:

  • “We got literally people making millions, tens of millions of dollars in purchase agreements based on a single Truth Social post. That is pretty uncertain.” – Jim Kennemer ([05:47])

• On Vietnamese Supplier Attitude:

  • “The big difference with Vietnam—you have to be the one who initiates that conversation and kind of follow up...They just don’t chase after you.” – Jim Kennemer ([30:11])

• On Comparative Production:

  • “There's no reason we need to make T-shirts and tennis shoes [in America]…You’re looking at a T-shirt from a factory for like 30 bucks in the United States versus literally one or two dollars from Vietnam.” – Jim Kennemer ([38:09])

• On Private Label Limits:

  • “Private label is probably the hardest one to source... None of the factories really maintain existing products or develop products. They just rely on the clients to make it for them.” – Jim Kennemer ([33:38])

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Timestamps for Major Segments

• [05:12] – Current Vietnam tariffs, trade uncertainty explained
• [09:46] – Vietnam MOQs (apparel, furniture)
• [10:40] – What Vietnam does best: textiles, apparel, furniture, expansion into electronics
• [14:27] – Comparative costs, tariff impact in Vietnam
• [16:18] – Product design: differences in support from Chinese vs. Vietnamese factories
• [19:23], [19:55] – Mexico: cost structure, practicality, and tariffs
• [21:22] – Southeast Asia overview: Thailand, Indonesia, Malaysia
• [27:04] – Price pressure, tariff pass-through, sellers eating profits
• [30:11] – Finding suppliers in Vietnam: process differences
• [33:38] – Not suitable for “just add my logo” private label sourcing
• [34:03] – IP protection and enforcement in Vietnam
• [36:36] – Trend toward automation and modernization in Vietnam
• [38:09] – Real talk: “bringing manufacturing home”
• [40:05] – Typical MOQs and turnaround times
• [42:05] – Cosmos Sourcing: approach, transparency, and service structure

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How to Get Started & Further Resources

• Jim Kennemer / Cosmos Sourcing:
  • Main site: cosmossourcing.com
  • Email: [e-mail]
• Steve’s content and mini-course:
  • mywifequitherjob.com/free

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Bottom Line

Vietnam is emerging as the #1 alternative sourcing destination to China for many products, especially in textiles, apparel, and wood. Sellers willing to adapt to local expectations and process the slight procedural differences can find cost savings and diversification in the face of geopolitical turbulence and rapidly changing tariffs.

Transcript

[A]

Welcome back to the podcast, the show where I cover all the latest strategies and current events related to E commerce and online business. In this episode, I'm joined by a very special guest, Jim Kenimer. Jim has spent years on the ground in Vietnam working directly with factories, suppliers and entrepreneurs. And while most sellers are fixated on China, Jim has been quietly helping entrepreneurs discover a sourcing ecosystem that is often cheaper, more flexible, and surprisingly overlooked. We'll dive into what makes Vietnam such an attractive alternative, the biggest mistake sellers make when sourcing there, and why blindly sticking with China might be costing you more than you think. But before we begin, I want to let you know that tickets for Seller Summit 2026 are now on sale [e-mail] and if you sell physical products online, this is the event that you should be at. Unlike most e commerce conferences that are filled with high level fluff and inspirational stories, Seller Summit is all about tactical, step by step strategies you can actually use in your business right away. Every speaker I invite is deep in the trenches. People who are running their own e commerce stores, managing inventory, dealing with suppliers and scaling real businesses. No corporate execs and no consultants. Also, I hate big events, so I intentionally keep it small and intimate. We cap attendance at around 200 people so you can actually have real conversations and connect with everyone in the room. We've sold out every single year for the past nine years and I expect this year to be no different. It's happening April 21st to 23rd in Fort Lauderdale, Florida, and if you're doing over 250k or $1 million in revenue, we also offer a private mastermind for higher level sellers. Right now, tickets are the cheapest they're ever going to be, so if you want in, go over to sellersummit.com and grab your ticket. Enjoy the show. Welcome to the My Wife Quitter Job podcast. Today I'm thrilled to have Jim Kennemer back on the show. Jim is the founder of cosmos sourcing and sourcinghub IO and he's helped hundreds of clients source more than $100 million worth of products from Vietnam, Mexico and Southeast Asia. And products that he has sourced have ended up in almost every major retailer for clients from over 30 countries. He also recently spoke my annual e Commerce conference, the Seller Summit. I invited him on the show today to talk about the current sourcing situation and the latest with tariffs because I still feel like things change, like every single month. We actually just got a shipment in ourselves.

[B]

Every day.

[A]

Yeah, every day. Yeah. And with that welcome to the show, Jim.

[B]

Hey, great, thank you. It's a pleasure to be here.

[A]

So I actually have an odd question for you to start and I know this is really random, but I think I was talking to another speaker at Seller Summit and I overheard that you get most of the traffic to Cosmos sourcing through AI, like chatbots most.

[B]

But yeah, we're getting a huge surge in traffic on AI. Chatbots come up apparently pretty high. Recommended by ChatGPT.

[A]

Do you have a strategy for doing that? Just curious.

[B]

I mean, I'm looking into it. It kind of honestly happened organically. Like we have our blog and kind of have a couple blogs now, but Cosmos sourcing is the main one and guess it's just good information. But yeah, it's definitely. We're seeing pretty good conversion rate with our like we're only getting about a thousand visitors a month referral from ChatGPT. But from those, the conversion rate to just meetings and eventually sales has been pretty high. Much, much higher than Google who get about 50,000. Over 50,000 from Google and probably twice as many. But the conversion rate's obviously lower to getting meeting and ultimately sales. So yeah, it's definitely been kind of experience. You haven't. Yeah. Trying to figure out why, to be honest.

[A]

Well, no, I mean, is blogging still an essential part of your strategy for.

[B]

Yeah, it's definitely kind of the main one. I mean, I get blogging and referrals from previous clients. Word of mouth, it's probably still number one, but blogging definitely kind of. The new. New clients definitely kind of get out there and then. Yeah, referrals from clients and then referrals from other people are definitely then. Yeah, I've been trying to expand more on LinkedIn and start a YouTube channel that I've been procrastinating way too much on.

[A]

Well, it is easy to procrastinate on that actually.

[B]

I know I've actually like recorded like three different versions of the same video and I'm just. Every time I look, I'm like, I don't want people to see this, me reading the script. I don't know, I'm too self conscious about that stuff.

[A]

So what I like about you is, you know, you work with a whole bunch of clients and sourcing. So what is the current situation with the tariffs? What are your clients thinking? How are they adapting?

[B]

Yeah, for sure. I mean we work with a lot of clients. Like kind of our tagline has been anywhere but China, but Vietnam still is kind of our bread and butter for sourcing. We got A team based there. But yeah, I mean, definitely there's a huge influx of clients who are looking to move outside of China, look at alternative sourcing destinations. But at the same time, right now people just want certainty and there's not certainty in tariffs. I mean, we got letters that have been agreed on by one side, sent to people about tariffs, so maybe it'll stay at 20%. Like Vietnam, in theory has a deal at 20%, but nothing's been signed or fully agreed on by both parties. That should go, in fact, October, August 1st.

[A]

So yeah, pretty soon it's going to expire, right? Is it the 12th or the 1st? I don't.

[B]

So it's 10% still now, but on August 1st it's going to jump up to 2% theory based on Trump's comments, which has so far been a single post on true social media. So, yeah, we got literally people making millions, tens of millions of dollars in purchase agreements based on a single truth social post. That is pretty uncertain. So, yeah, we're kind of still waiting for the official, official announcement, but no one's on the other side objected to it. So it's just been.

[A]

So there still seems to be, at least among your clients, a need to go away from China. Even though I think feel things feel, feel like they've settled somewhat with China. Right, at 55.

[B]

Yeah, I think that's going to be locked in for the short to medium term. 55%. And I think, yeah, literally yesterday or day before, Trump made comments about the tariffs might be set anywhere from 15 to 50%, which he did at AI Summit, just off the cuff, by the way. So, yeah, everyone kind of sees some more settling. But yeah, it's definitely been a lot of uncertainty and people have been really like, we work with a lot of clients who are looking at factories or getting quotes from factories, contacts, doing introductions and all that. But they're just don't want to pull the trigger until they know everything's set in stone. Because if they place purchase order today, it's going to take two, three months before the product's ready to ship and goes through customs. And then they don't know that the 10% or 20% that's in place now is going to be what they pay in the future. So there's all that.

[A]

What is it right now with Vietnam? Actually it's 10% right now. And you've seen, I mean, today, today.

[B]

Yeah, on August 1st it'll be 20%, it'll be 20.

[A]

And then how long is that going to last? It's indefinite right now or it's indefinite?

[B]

Yeah, I mean, 20 for the short, medium term, but yeah, I mean, yeah, as far as. Yeah, it will be definitely kind of locked in at 20%, but just with the way the trade agreements are, there's nothing locked in. Sure enough.

[A]

I mean, given that a lot of the Chinese factories move their operations to Vietnam in the past decades, I mean, is it really doing anything A little bit.

[B]

Yeah. One of the big things too, that the. The true social post has a 40% tariff for goods that go from China into Vietnam, which we're trying to figure out what exactly is called. Technically, transitment as a whole is illegal. So now we're just doing a 40% tariff. So we're. Yeah, there's a little bit of uncertainty, but a lot of that. People kind of believe that if a substantial amount of raw materials, even if the finished goods is made in Vietnam, would get taxed at 40%. So, yeah, there's potential that say you source the metal components from China, get shipped to Vietnam, made into a finished good, then the metal component will be taxed at 40% and then the rest of the product, which be taxed at the regular 20%, for instance. But yeah, what's happening.

[A]

Is that what you're seeing, that's what.

[B]

Will happen when it goes into effect. But we're still trying to get all that clarity on that because.

[A]

Because I always thought the rules were the materials are okay, and then. Yeah, as long as you're transforming it and building something with it. Right.

[B]

Yeah, no, that's. That's how it normally works. But yeah, with a transshipment, it's honestly kind of unclear what he's alluding to because. Yeah, I mean, transshipment is also a trans shipment normally is when you have a product go from one country, say China, into Vietnam and then ship out of Vietnam cleared as a country of origin, which is illegal in that regard. If we were to say his country of origin is China.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So, yeah. But now in that thing explicitly highlighted out that 40% transshipment tariff, which is less than 55% from China. So it has a lot of people confused about what exactly it means. And just talking to experts, like I was talking to a lawyer based in Vietnam about that and we were just trying to figure it out ourselves. And yeah, as far as we can tell, that's more or less probably alludes to the materials getting taxed separately if they were to originate or components.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Would be the most logical interpretation. I guess we'll say most logical interpretation of that.

[A]

So the answers I want to get out of today's episode is why would I go to Vietnam? Like what are they good at? And then is it realistic for like a little guy to source from there, like one of the moqs? And I know we're speaking in broad terms because there's so many different products, but for sure, like just set some expectations for the, like the volumes and whatnot.

[B]

Yeah, I mean Vietnam as a whole does have higher MOQs and they do kind of expect first time buyers to place larger MOQs right off the bat, which has turned off a lot of our clients and or potential clients. So for like clothing, for instance, most apparel projects, you're looking at about probably about a thousand moqs.

[A]

Oh, that's not too bad.

[B]

Yeah, it's not too bad. Yeah. So those in T shirts for instance.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

We actually did have a list of manufacturers that did a lomoqs that we maintained in house. But since the trade war, demand's gone up and almost all of them manufacturers raised their MOQs, which were like anywhere from 100 to 300, up to really a thousand. So MOQs have been going up a lot more in Vietnam. Yeah, furniture, typically we say a container load worth of furniture, which depending on size can be anywhere from 100 to 3, 400 units.

[A]

So why would I go to Vietnam over China right now? Just strictly manufacturing the types of products.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, I, I think apparel and textiles cut and sell items in general are better in Vietnam flat out without tariffs being factored in. It's their most developed industry as a whole. So I mean. Yeah, from our estimation, there's over 6, 000 factories that employs over 2 million people in that industry. So it's pretty advanced. It kind of competes at all levels. So everything from high technical gear, jackets of powder wear to cheap T shirts and everything in between are really good. A lot of bags back.

[A]

Let's say I were to move my like handkerchiefs and napkins over there. What give me an idea of like how much cheaper it be and what like the moqs would be. Is, is it like based on rolls of fabric or.

[B]

Yeah, a lot of it is based on rolls of fabric because yeah, fabric rolls come from anywhere a thousand, ten thousand square meters. Right. So yeah, when you, if they. A lot of factories or suppliers do have their own in house warehouses. So if you get a common fabric, you can just buy from what they have in stock. But most of the time though, we're ordering new rolls of fabric specifically for the production. So, yeah, you would probably have a memo queue of a thousand or so. And there's been a few cases where we buy the roll of fabric and then do a smaller moq. Just start out and keep it on hand for the second order.

[A]

Okay. And so I'm just. Actually, I'm. I'm asking you now for selfish reasons.

[B]

Yeah, go for it.

[A]

We actually just got a shipment and the terrorists are at 55. And that was, you know, quadruple what it used to be.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And, you know, we were just kind of doing the math and obviously we're going to have to raise prices and whatnot, so it's not going to be a huge deal. But if I go to Vietnam, like, what price breaks can I expect? Just even outside of the tariffs or. The price is pretty much the same.

[B]

Prices are relatively comparable without tariffs factored in, especially for cut and sew items. So there's quite a few suppliers. I mean, we can definitely check for handkerchiefs because do you do that, you do embroidery in states or do you do it in China?

[A]

You do the embroidery here.

[B]

Yeah, that's what I was thinking. So, yeah, just be the raw handkerchiefs, which is we just basically need a.

[A]

Fabric cut and like an edge sewn on maybe at the. It's a very simple project, not complicated.

[B]

Yeah. And yeah, it depends on where the. Honestly, what's the simpler things like that. A lot of times the majority of the cost will be in the materials. And is it cotton or what's the material?

[A]

Yeah, 100% cotton. We also sell linen napkins too. Those are a little bit more involved because they have like a hem stitch border. And we also sell aprons.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Which are pretty easy too. It's just like three pieces of fabric sewn together.

[B]

Yeah, for sure. Because, yeah, with that, I mean, the majority cost would probably be still in the fabric. And a lot of that fabric, it's still is sourced from China, but we can definitely talk and yeah, no, obviously have a majority of the value because, yeah, Vietnam's starting to crack down a little bit. On July 1, they kind of announced some major reforms and they're not giving export certificate unless they can verify 40% of the value was made in the country.

[A]

Are they enforcing that?

[B]

They're starting to, yeah. Customs. I hate dealing with Vietnamese customs both in and out.

[A]

Well, walk me through some of the advantages. So really it sounds like the, the primary reason is not cost, it's just the tariff at this point.

[B]

Is that for a lot of goods. Yeah, I mean, wooden goods are another one that's probably the biggest advantage in Vietnam without really factoring the tariffs. Just because Vietnam's a tropical country. They have huge amount of plantations, wood plantations, so they can source all their wood locally. And it's part of Asian. So a lot of times you'll get wood from Cambodia or Thailand as well. And it's free trade between those countries. So yeah, those are one of the big ones. And then Vietnam is trying to move up a lot in the supply chain. So it really depends on the products. Like we're doing some silicon and plastic injection molding. And I will say that does come up more expensive than in China because we do work a lot of clients who are sourcing from China already. But then you get the factors tariff in and the trade uncertainty. So a lot of those people. It'll be worth it a lot of times even to have it as backup supplier too.

[A]

Oh, because of the tariffs?

[B]

Like.

[A]

Yeah, certainty of the tariffs. I see. Okay, so we got apparel, text, anything textile related, Wooden products and then perhaps plastic products.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. What about metal, silicone molding, a lot of wire goods on metal, stamp metal goods.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Big things are moving in. Electronic manufacturing is probably their fastest growing industry, which literally a few years ago, we struggling to find anything at all. In the last few years, literally within like less than two years, we've been finding some good prices and starting to do a lot more OEM electronic projects.

[A]

So it sounds like maybe 70% of the people that buy stuff or source stuff for like Amazon or whatever could in fact go to Vietnam. Is that probably.

[B]

Maybe about that? Maybe 50%? I don't want to like overestimate that.

[A]

But I know I'm just making up some numbers here. But yeah, you got textiles, plastics and wooden goods and metal. Right. I mean, that's like all. Almost everything.

[B]

Oh, for sure. And yeah, we, I mean, work with tons of. I mean, our majority of clients are Amazon FBA sellers.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

So yeah, it's definitely. Yeah, a lot of good products there. Plush toys too, even. You can throw those in there.

[A]

And as far as, you know, 20% right now is the current situation starting in August 1st.

[B]

Yeah, there's a lot of people that are thinking that the deal might change. I hate to say it, but yeah, you mean. Or they're hoping lower actually, because right now Vietnam's 20%. And you know, we've been. Vietnam has been one of the most proactive countries in terms of negotiating deals and getting things going and making concessions too. Then Indonesia got 19, Philippines got 19 Thailand got 36%. So yeah, they're kind of really hoping get if have a chance to kind of renegotiate and get under 20%. But at the time it's going to be 20% and I'm not, I kind of think they should just settle and get everything locked in.

[A]

So walk me through like what to expect and obviously it's going to be different from supplier to supplier. But right now for our Chinese suppliers, it's so easy. We just draw on a piece of paper, we hand it to them, they send us a sample and then we're like, okay, good. Then we, you know, just document everything and we just place a bulk order. Is the process as smooth?

[B]

I mean, for a simple product like a handkerchief? Yeah, it should be that smooth. Like we've worked on some pretty, pretty basic line drawings or pencil drawings for some products, but it really depends on the product category. Like we did a set of luggage, soft, soft shell luggage for instance, and you just had pencil drawings and dimensions and we were able to get a couple factors to work with that. But a lot of other products like talking to silicone or shoes or whatnot, you really need like full 3D stuff files. What not with them? Because yeah, with Viet China, a lot of the factories have designers in house and can do shop drawings and that's not really that common in Vietnam.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

They kind of rely on the clients to provide the tech packs and product specs and step files and dick DWG.

[A]

Files and whatnot for clothing and everything too, right?

[B]

Yeah, for pretty much anything.

[A]

Okay, I see.

[B]

And so we work a lot of third party designers to get that in those cases. But yeah, the factories kind of rely on that. But yeah, like I said, simple products like a handkerchief you get away with. It's really actually.

[A]

So that's a big difference too because we don't ever do tech packs for our aprons. We just work with the designers that they have in house at the supplier.

[B]

Yeah, right.

[A]

To, to mix and match stuff and, and make changes. So you're saying that the Vietnamese factory would not have most of will, but not all.

[B]

And it's not as common as China because yeah, China, we just work with ideas and then work with a factories a lot more to do the finished good. Like basically what you're doing in Vietnam, I mean there's cases where we'll like shoes for instance, we'll have pretty detailed drawings but work with them to do the patterns, the actual patterns for the machinery. Same with some clothings. So they'll do the last Step. The made for manufacturing step. But they won't do the conceptualizing stuff as much.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then in terms of getting stuff out of there, is it pretty straightforward like shipping?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay. It's.

[B]

It's the same as China really. I mean we're prey porters and they OD all that. Yeah, we.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

But yeah, it's more or less the same. Yes. Shipping and all that is pretty commoditized and standardized internationally. So it's same standards.

[A]

I just wanted to take a moment to tell you about a free resource that I offer on my website that you may not be aware of if you are interested in starting your own online store. I put together a comprehensive six day mini course on how to get started in ecommerce that you should all check out. It contains both video and text based tutorials that go over the entire process of finding products to sell all the way to getting your first sales online. Now this course is free and can be [e-mail] free. Just sign up right there on the front page via email and I'll send you the course right away. Once again, that's mywifequitterjob.com free. Now back to the show. All right, so that's Vietnam. It seems like it's pretty viable over China.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I actually was looking into Mexico at some point too and I actually found that the price prices were just way higher.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I know you do a lot of sourcing in Mexico. What's your experience there?

[B]

Yeah, no, it's definitely the higher price. Yeah. I spent two months in Mexico this winter and we looked a lot of maximum manufacturing. We're just benchmarking projects from China and Vietnam and Mexico. And Mexico was consistently 1 1/2 to 2 times more expensive, much more limited on what they can do as well. So it. Yeah, it was. And that's without Paris factored in. Yeah. With tariffs now actually, what are the.

[A]

Tariffs right now with Mexico?

[B]

30 at the moment.

[A]

Oh my God. Ouch. Okay.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So does that, you know, put it out of contention for.

[B]

Yeah, I haven't really taken on too many Mexico projects recently, unfortunately.

[A]

It just seems so convenient though because.

[B]

They'Re so close and everybody wants Mexico to work. It's just. Yeah, I mean the supply isn't there, the demand's there, the supply chain isn't. Yeah, I mean the people that move production in Mexico are going to be the large, large companies who are setting up their own production facilities in Mexico because it's easy to do that. But there's just not the contract manufacturers that folks like you and me can reach out to you and just start a project. They're just not set up for that.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

All right. So in your experience right now, Mexico doesn't seem that attractive, both from a cost perspective as well as a tariff perspective.

[B]

Yeah, but from logistics perspective, it's great.

[A]

Oh, yeah. From a logistics perspective, it's incredible. Is section 321 no longer a thing? Like if you get a warehouse right on the border and they just slip into the U.S. pOST system, in theory, there's no tariff, Right?

[B]

Yeah, theory. Yeah. The de minimis. Yeah, that, that aspect, I mean, that's.

[A]

Not even de minimis anymore if they're literally slipping it into the U.S. postal system. Right.

[B]

Yeah. Well, I mean, that's. Yeah, it's. It's still a little bit of a thing, but it's. Yeah. Harder to do. I don't do too much with that, to be honest. So I'm not.

[A]

Okay. Okay. So you also cover Southeast Asia. What are some of the main countries that you have experience with there?

[B]

Yeah, I think Thailand and Indonesia are the second, second and third best countries to source from. Malaysia has a few pockets of stuff. Like we do some metal goods from Malaysia as well, but Thailand has some pretty decent advanced manufacturing. We're starting to do some appliances there. Like a tankless hot water heater, for instance, is one of our projects and we found a supplier for that.

[A]

Okay, that sounds really complex. So what, what does Thailand go? Like, why would you go to Thailand versus Vietnam?

[B]

I. It really depends on the product category, but I think, like, I kind of mentioned the appliances and they do have a little bit more advanced manufacturing facilities for that. Then they have more developed in plastic injection and some injection molding. But right now with 36% tariffs, it is a little bit more of a challenge.

[A]

But is it better than China? Probably not, right? I mean, if I was going to do an appliance, I said, we'll probably go to China, right?

[B]

Yeah, probably. Yeah, definitely. Well, it depends on your price point, but yeah, yeah, it really depends on the product because we still do most of our electronics out of China. It's just too easy to do.

[A]

Yeah. So what is the advantage of Thailand then? Like, why did your client decide to go to Thailand?

[B]

They wanted more diversity in supply chain was the main reason. And they're a pretty substantial client in terms of volumes. I'm not going to say it was. Yeah, I mean, they're in the tens, if not hundreds of millions of dollars in Purchasing a year for products. So in that case they just really, really want to have more options and wear it out. So they're willing to even not so much lose money, but pay more from Thailand just to have a second option.

[A]

Okay, that makes sense. But for like a Amazon seller that does like seven figures and whatnot, would we be even considering Thailand?

[B]

It's worth looking into, but it's not the best.

[A]

Yeah, 36% terrorists. That's.

[B]

Yeah, 36 terrorists plus more expensive.

[A]

It's more expensive than Vietnam and China.

[B]

Yeah, but not much so. But yeah, and it's more limited on what you can do there.

[A]

And it sounds like they're good for electronics and plastic molding.

[B]

Yeah. And we do a lot of some metal goods from Malaysia too. Indonesia's kind of. I think Indonesia is probably going to be the next big in our manufacturing base in Southeast Asia in terms of just cheap basic commodities that FBA sellers could potentially buy from.

[A]

What would Indonesia. Just give me an idea of what the price points would be for Indonesia.

[B]

Yeah, I mean Indonesia has. Yeah, it really depends on the product. Like we're doing a lot more shoes there. Sorry. Move some shoe production there and they've been pretty competitive on pricing. And we did some industrial wooden goods that was actually some, for instance, proud of Indonesia and that's been relatively reasonably good price. By industrial wooden goods, I'm talking like kind of pallets and wooden spools and some wheelbarrow handles and stuff. Some high density wood.

[A]

So if we normalize, let's say on apparel. Right. Is Indonesia going to be cheaper than Vietnam, for example?

[B]

It's going to be fairly comparable.

[A]

Comparable.

[B]

It's not. The apparel industry is not as developed so it's going to be more limited on what they can do.

[A]

I see. So they specialize in what you wooden products you said and.

[B]

Yeah, I mean they specialize in a.

[A]

Few things, but yeah, I mean what are they? So wooden. What else?

[B]

Yeah, I mean wooden goods. Apparel. They do some apparel. There's doing. Starting to do more electronic manufacturing, but still pretty undeveloped in that regard. Doing a lot of shoes. Like we did some work boots from Indonesia not too long ago, still toed work boots and those were pretty reasonably priced.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I'm just trying to get an idea of where, when I would go to a certain country and why. Yeah, right.

[B]

For sure.

[A]

Like it seems like China can do all these things and it sounds like Vietnam is an obvious number two because they do pretty much everything.

[B]

Yeah, always carefully back to Vietnam. Like we always look at benchmarking and it's just.

[A]

And then Thailand seems probably not a good solution right now, especially with higher terrorists.

[B]

I mean, if you're American, but. Yeah, I mean, you still don't have terrorists if you're Australia or European.

[A]

So what would be a reason to go to Indonesia then? Over Vietnam, for example?

[B]

Yeah, I mean, right now the tariffs are pretty comparable. 19%. And that was a formal letter that was sent to Indonesia, which is only 1% less than Vietnam. But, yeah, I mean, right now I think the big thing is just diversity and just exploring options and getting as many contacts as you can, just because really the trade war just keeps changing.

[A]

I see.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So really people are just diversifying, just.

[B]

Yeah, a lot of people are, because.

[A]

Trump might just change their mind one day and then. It's not like you can shift your manufacturing super quickly on it.

[B]

No, not at all. But once you kind of do the groundwork here, two steps ahead of everybody else.

[A]

I see.

[B]

Yeah. What.

[A]

What are you seeing right now? Like, right now, prices have been relatively stable. Are you going to see this? Do you foresee a huge wave of inflation coming this holiday season?

[B]

Yeah, I mean, it's really depends because, I mean, a lot of people are eating profits right now because they know that if they raise their prices, they're going to lose demand. And so they're trying to keep demand stable just eating their profit. But it really depends on how much sellers are willing to eat or lose profit right now. But, I mean, you're looking at some benchmarks with like, Walmart and products like year on year, and there's a handful of products that are up 50% in terms of pricing and that, I mean, that's more or less mostly due to the tariffs. But I mean, the real thing is, I mean, tariffs, it takes like three to six months from the tariffs to be implemented to actually hitting the consumer, because, you know, that's how long it takes for the products to go from production import into the supply chain.

[A]

I mean, we had enough stuff to last us till the beginning of next year. And in preparation for all this stuff, we actually stopped supplying our Amazon and just only supplying from our own store. Yes, that's our main cash cow. But we did just place a new shipment and there's no way that I can't avoid raising prices.

[B]

Oh, I know, yeah. I mean, many, many people, like, Yeah, I mean, $2 million in tariffs. Like, yeah, the client I was talking to, I'm going to expose who. But yeah, I mean, they pay 2 million tariffs and he says he's literally making zero profit at the moment over the last three months. Probably even lost money. He might then admit to losing money.

[A]

But what's the rationale for that though? I don't his.

[B]

He's in a price sensitive target with competitors and he is afraid that if he raises his prices then they're going to go to the competitors and going to lose market share. So he's right now just wants to maintain his market share.

[A]

I see.

[B]

And then.

[A]

Interesting.

[B]

Yeah. He's assuming his competitors are also getting hit with terrorists, but he. I guess he's hoping they blink first and then there's prices. They come to him and he gains market share. But it's. Yeah, just brinkmanship really.

[A]

All right. So kind of established, at least I have from this conversation that it seems like Vietnam is, is the way to go, if not just for diverse diversification and right now, tariff relief.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Right. So how does one go about finding a Vietnamese supplier? Now I know on Alibaba it actually has a whole bunch of Vietnamese suppliers on there.

[B]

Yeah. But the big thing is like not every supplier is on there. Only a small fraction less than 20% are on Alibaba. I mean there's still a resource like Yellow pages. You can actually Google suppliers pretty well in Vietnam since Google's not blocked in Vietnam. But yeah, I mean there's resources like if you have a chance to go visit Vietnam, go to trade shows. I think that's the single best thing clients can do. And we have a lot of clients that visit trade shows and then we set up factory visits for them after.

[A]

Are the main trade shows that are over there that happen?

[B]

Yeah, you got va. You got global sources. Has a big trade show that's the best general trade show.

[A]

Vietnam.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Oh, I didn't know that. I thought they were just in Hong Kong.

[B]

No, they got a new one in Vietnam. They started two years ago. I was at the in actually.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Yeah. And then. Yeah, so they. Yeah, they kind of had 600 vendors. Had that the first ratio. And they're up, I think they're up to 800 to a thousand now. And yeah, this a general trade show. So most trade shows tend to focus on product categories like FIFA is like home goods or. Yeah, home goods and furniture. And then there's ones that are specialized in clothing, another one for shoes. So if you have a specific niche that you're in, definitely kind of figure out the one that's your niche and go there.

[A]

You mentioned the Yellow Pages. Were you joking or what?

[B]

No, the yellow Pages are For some reason very active in Vietnam. Pretty good really.

[A]

Like yellow pages doc, like the old school. Yeah. VM interesting.

[B]

We just get contacts from there. You still have to do your legwork. Like once you get the names, look them up. So we'll go on like yeah, we use them, just get names. But we'll go through like 50 to 100 contacts on yellow pages, look them up on their website and Google and import yeti or whatever on our system and we'll narrow it down to like 20 or 30 that we think are legit or suitable for clients or even fewer. But okay, just from broad because yeah, they kind of keep it pretty broad. Like you were just looking for clothing factory or just list clothing factory but it's not going to specify oh these make specifically recycled, you know, T shirts out of recycled materials type stuff.

[A]

What about approaching them? Is it any different than a Chinese vendor?

[B]

You have to follow up with them because like if you're on Alibaba, you put an RFQ out and they come to you. The big difference with Vietnam, you have to be the one who initiates that conversation and kind of follow up with to really get their contact. They, they just don't chase after you. So it's kind of the opposite in that regard.

[A]

And so it's like India kind of.

[B]

Yeah, like India. A lot like India. Honesty is pretty similar outside of China. It's just China has that hyper competitive factories where they're kind of jumping over each other get business because they competing against everybody. Well yeah, Vietnam got to go after them. So but I mean it's relatively easy. I mean yeah, we have clients that have poor response rates but we work with a lot of clients to get better RFQs or kind of really on punch up because a lot of time people are like oh I just want to buy 50 right off that. And we like you can do sample order a few orders and then but you really got to lead in with you want to buy a thousand eventually once everything works out. So we got to lead in with that and you know, we coach them and we get much better response rates and then we obviously write our RFQs when we work with clients too.

[A]

Right.

[B]

But yeah, you do have to really kind of chase them, follow up with them and make sure your RFQ is appealing. But we have good relationship and pre beta factories with hundreds of factories too already. So.

[A]

So I know, I know in China we get them on WeChat as soon as we can and then all communication is done through messaging. Yeah, nothing is blocked over There. Right. So what is the platform of choice for communication?

[B]

Yeah, WhatsApp or Zalo are the two big ones.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

All right. So there's no gotchas or any real differences. It's is English. It's you know, easy.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

To communicate with.

[B]

I mean our team is all local Vietnamese. So they'll talk to package and Vietnamese. But once we do introductions with clients, they'll be in English. But yeah, half the time they'll have English speakers on any factor with export division will have an English speaker on their sales staff handles the face to face stuff. And then honestly Google, everybody uses translation app. So you're talking, you're honest. You might be speaking to Havid Amazon speaker who barely speaks in English by their translator thing and works fine.

[A]

Right, right. Okay. All right. So in that regard it's pretty straightforward. Is, is placing orders and everything pretty much the same.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Wire transfers.

[B]

Yeah, mostly wire transfer. For smaller orders we'll use other services. But yeah, once you're at a certain level, definitely kind of do wire transfer and make sure everything's legit. But yeah.

[A]

Okay, so it sounds like it's a pretty good viable alternative that.

[B]

Yeah. For a lot of people.

[A]

That's for me we should be looking into.

[B]

Yeah, definitely.

[A]

Well, okay, let's go that route. So what is it? Who is it isn't, who is it not for?

[B]

Yeah, I, I mean like I said kind of you got to really be specific on the products that they do focus on. Like kind of talked about the apparel, textiles, clothing, bags, backpacks, all that furniture is all good. But there's a lot of times with complex projects or very specific products or actually private label is probably the hardest one to source. So anybody that just wants to have a pre made product slap their logo on, it's very hard to do because none of the factories really maintain existing products or develop products. They just rely on the clients to make it for them. And I mean just stuff like I don't know, isolated water bottles for instance. People are really just like, oh, I want this. Like have very specific things that they want and don't want to, you know, put the time and develop it. They just Spectre factory just buy, have an option of all these for them to buy and then put a label on.

[A]

Yeah, just that's not an option that doesn't happen. Well that's actually a good thing in my eyes because then they're not going to list their own stuff on Amazon. Compete against you.

[B]

Right, yeah.

[A]

Is that.

[B]

Yeah, knock on wood. We haven't really had as much. Yeah. No real issues with. Yeah. Factories kind of circumventing that because. Yeah, they're really manufacturing focus. They're not sophisticated on the sales aspect and setting up, you know, counterfeit sales.

[A]

What about. What about IP theft?

[B]

It's, in theory, easier to enforce in Vietnam than China, but obviously you still have to have a lawyer and everything. But yeah, we have Internet in an agreement set up that we can set up with factories that really protect it. So it's not been as big an issue. And there's more channels to legally enforce it. They're not going to automatically favor the factory. So, I mean, we talk to lawyers. We haven't had to really follow up with anything. But yeah, there's all law offices, Western law offices that have representation in Vietnam that can follow through if needed or any type of.

[A]

So the likelihood of a factory copying your stuff and then going forward and selling it on Amazon is much more rare than correct.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

In China.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay. Okay. Yeah, it sounds very attractive right now, at least right this second, as we're.

[B]

Yeah, I know. Everything changes so quickly.

[A]

Do you do a lot with India or.

[B]

No, I've looked at India a lot and it's just, it's. It's a huge country. In each province and area is different. And he's like, the whole mindset of how to do business with them is totally shift.

[A]

Interesting. And so. But in Vietnam, are there different regions that specialize in different. I guess Vietnam's a lot smaller.

[B]

Yeah, I mean, there's really three main regions of Vietnam. And really, in the end, you can reduce it just north and South Vietnam. Central Vietnam would be the third. Third region. So. But yeah, I mean, northern Vietnam, around Hanoi, the capital, just near China. So you do get a lot of. I want to say trans shipment, but a lot more cooperation with China. This is where you do a lot of electronic manufacturing, a lot of lighting and some stuff like that. Just because you do still get components. Like anytime you do lighting, like all the LED components, for instance, come from China. There's, as far as I know, none outside of China.

[A]

Right.

[B]

But we'll still do the finish in and the casing and whatnot from Vietnam and then. Yeah, Southern Vietnam. There's. Yeah. About 55% of the production capacity of the country is around Ho Chi Minh City. And that's where you do a lot of our furniture, a lot of our clothing, flaw textiles. Like, we actually put our office in Binduong Province, which is actually just merged with Ho Chi Minh City on July 1. So now technically it's Ho Chi Minh City, but yeah, we specifically put it out there just because it's super close to the largest single industrial area in the country. So yeah, we're like right near all the factories.

[A]

Okay. And then in terms of trends, do you see, I, I always felt like Vietnam was just getting more and more saturated and, and companies are moving to Pakistan, Bangladesh. Do you work with any of those countries? No, no.

[B]

It's hard to find reliable manufacturers there. And a lot of what they're moving, I won't say is it cheap, but is like I would say cheaper and large volume products are moving those countries just cause they can get more scale, more workers. And I. Yeah, Vietnam's trying to add more sophistication to be the next China, essentially. Yeah, they want to be the next China. And a lot of the newer factories are pretty modern, pretty advanced with like, we're like a cut and sew factory, but they actually have cameras at each station. It says check qc. Not just each supply chain, but literally each pattern. So they can actually check QC live and have more computer control automation kind of built in. So we're seeing a lot more factories in that regard. Like a lot of the plastic conjecture, silicon injection moldings that's moving to Vietnam. Those machines just need one guy to operate. So it's there. I mean they're made in Korea or Germany or wherever and they're yeah, really automated nowadays. Make a product.

[A]

So I want to ask you this. Do you see manufacturing coming back to the United States based on what you're seeing?

[B]

It depends on what level. The thing that I think America should focus on is the high level stuff. Like we make airplanes here, we make cars here, we make high value goods here. And I really feel like that should be the focus is expanding that maybe add ship owning or a few other things, but just stuff like T shirts and tennis shoes. There's no reason we need to make that here.

[A]

It's not going to come back, right?

[B]

Yeah, that's not going to come back. And I, I just don't understand why you would even want it because it's not great job, you know.

[A]

Yeah, okay.

[B]

Yeah, I mean microchips and stuff like obviously we're building. Yeah, I would definitely focus on some key industries but I wouldn't say just bring back all manufacturing here at every level because yeah, the day like I know there are a few T shirt manufacturers and we benchmark prices, but you're looking at a T shirt from a factory for like 30 bucks in the United States. Versus literally one or two dollars from Vietnam.

[A]

Wait, that much? And the.

[B]

Yeah, a few of them. Yeah.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Well that's nuts.

[B]

Yeah, I know.

[A]

Yeah. And as far as you can tell, they're more advanced, right, in their factories.

[B]

Like the equipment, everything getting more advanced and like a lot of old factory are building new wings and new factories, but all the new factories are quite advanced nowadays. And there's a lot more advancement into factories because it's getting a little bit harder to hire people and the factory owners know that. So they're going definitely kind of add more automation as much as they can.

[A]

Okay, let's talk about Cosmo real quick. Let's say someone listening and wants to source from Vietnam. What is the process? So they reach out to Cosmo and then, and then what happens? You guys hop on a call?

[B]

Yeah, we hop on a call. We kind of talked about their product, their moqs, their product and whatnot. Just make sure, you know, they're a good fit for Vietnam or elsewhere. And then, yeah, if they're a good fit, we definitely kind of pitch them. But yeah, the way our services work is it's fully transparent. So we get direct contacts with the factories, we do direct introductions. We try to get as many quotes as we can. So we get about two to six quotes per product category and we charge a flat rate instead of commission. But this allows us get multiple quotes because most commission agents only work for like two or three factories and you know they're going to direct you to those factories specifically. So we have our services set up so we work for the client on the path of the client. And then yeah, they're free to make decisions on which factory they want to work with based on which one's the best fit. Maybe they want price, maybe they want quality, maybe.

[A]

And then general rule of thumb for textiles, a thousand units of.

[B]

Yeah, that's a general rule of thumb.

[A]

That's big.

[B]

We work with some higher end stuff like, like some suits and kind of high end dress manufacturers and we can obviously get those lower, but those are definitely higher value goods. We did pretty high end ultra like hiking backpack, but. And that was like 100 units. But was also pretty.

[A]

Oh, one thing I forgot to ask. Turnaround times are they just similar to China?

[B]

They're a little bit slower, but relatively similar.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Yeah, it depends on the product.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

We typically for like clothing, textile, I estimate 30 to 45 days once you order to actually have the product finished. Some more complex items like furniture, you're probably looking at clothes close to 60.

[A]

Okay. And then does Cosmo offer QC services too?

[B]

We work with, we do basic factory business stuff in house but we work with a lot of third party inspection services. But we can definitely coordinate that whole process for them and put them in touch with it.

[A]

Right. Okay, cool. Jim, where can people find you?

[B]

Yeah, cosmos sourcing.com is probably the best place. We're on all the socials. That's Cosmos sourcing or if you want my email is Jim, cosmos sourcing.com.

[A]

Personally is. I went on your website as soon as the whole tariff craziness happened and it used to include China but now it says sourcing from anywhere but China.

[B]

Technically still source from China every now and then. But yeah, we definitely have been pivoting away from China. I mean thing with China is relatively easy source from China versus other countries like you just go on Alibaba. I mean obviously we do our own search and have our own resources and go beyond just Alibaba much more beyond. But at the same time like 50 to 75% of our results are or were on the same as Alibaba so it's hard to really tell client hey and sometimes the best bet. So yeah, we kind of realized there's much more difficulty in finding factories outside of China. So like for us we're going to build a team out there. Like we mentioned, there's not like a central Alibaba type resources. So we yeah we have our team reach out. We you know, pre vet factories, build a relationship with factories.

[A]

It totally makes sense.

[B]

Yeah. And kind of do all that work for you and try to make everything as seamless and easy as possible.

[A]

Jim, thanks for coming on man.

[B]

No problem. It's a pleasure.

[A]

Appreciate your time.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

Hope you enjoyed this episode. If you're only sourcing in China right now, you might want to diversify your suppliers. For more information and resources go to My wife quit her job.com/episode603 once again. Tickets to the Seller Summit 2026 are now on sale over at sellers summit.com if you want to hang out in person in a small intimate setting, develop real relationships with like minded entrepreneurs and learn a ton, then come to my event. Go to sellersummit.com and if you're interested in starting your own e commerce store, head on over to my wife quitherjob.com and sign up for my free 6 day mini course. Just type in your email and I'll send the course right away via email.