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- [00:03]
A
Hey guys. Welcome to the Naked Marriage podcast. We are Dave and Ashley Willis, and on this podcast we undress the truth about sex, intimacy and lifelong love. We've got a great topic for you today and a great question at the end of today's episode. So don't tune out early because the question today I think is a really, really good one. And we're gonna have fun answering that. But first, Ashley wants to share one of the many reviews that have come in recently.
- [00:25]
B
That's right. Thank you guys so much for leaving a review. It is the best way to let people know about our podcast. So if you've been listening for time and you haven't left us a five star review yet, please do so. So we're going to share one from Caitlin. With an I is what she calls herself, which is cool. It's called funny, relatable and unique, she says. This podcast is by far my favorite Christian marriage podcast. The content is relatable and much more practical than the cliche stuff we always hear. I appreciate this resource so much. These two have a great outlook on marriage. Their relationship is funny and they always make the topics fun to listen to. Thank you so much for leaving that, Caitlin.
- [00:59]
A
Thank you. That really does, does mean a lot. Got a special guest in the studio with us today. By the way, Chi Chi, our dog is here, so be listening. You might hear some barks in the background. She's our good luck charm today. We're gonna have a lot of fun before we dive into today's topic, which is all about screen time. A lot of great questions have come in on this recently, so I'm excited to dive in. But first I want to let you know about a really cool resource that I think could make a big difference in your marriage.
- [01:23]
B
Some couples reach a point where they just can't find their way forward. That's when a skilled marriage coach can make all the difference.
- [01:31]
A
The exomarriage Intensive certification training equips you to stand in the gap by becoming a certified marriage coach. Helping couples move from conflict and brokenness to healing, wholeness and renewed commitment.
- [01:44]
B
This isn't just theory. You'll begin with pre work and preparation to build your foundation. Then dive into a hands on three day intensive designed to give you real world experience guiding couples through transformative sessions.
- [01:57]
A
You'll learn proven strategies, practical frameworks and even participate in role playing and live demonstrations to prepare you to lead couples toward breakthroughs.
- [02:07]
B
After certification, you'll have the option to join the XO Network, connecting with a community of trained professionals. And accessing ongoing resources and support as you serve couples in your ministry or practice.
- [02:19]
A
If you're ready to help marriages thrive, the XO Marriage Intensive Certification training is your pathway to making a real marriage lasting impact.
- [02:27]
B
Find upcoming training dates and register@xomarriage.com I am so excited about this episode because this is something that is completely based on messages that we received from you all over the past few months. And so we were like, you know what? We need to devote an entire episode to this. And what we're going to be talking about today is how to manage screen time and marriage and specifically how to find the right balance of screen time. Because we're not saying that all screens, you know, tv, computers, gaming, whatever it is that you're into are necessarily a bad thing, but we're saying that when they are out of balance and that becomes kind of the focus of all your attention and you're ignoring your family, it is very detrimental to a marriage. We're going to talk about how to keep things in balance.
- [03:13]
A
I'm sorry, what were you saying? I was looking at my phone. Just kidding. Just kidding. But there have been times in marriage where I really have been looking at my phone and have missed out on something that you said or have not been fully present. And, you know, these smartphones that we carry in our pockets, or they're with us all the time. There's never been a time in human history where we've had this unique situation that we've got constant information at our fingertips, but we also have a potentially constant distraction at our fingertips. Navigating that balance is so important for marriage. And like Ashley said, many of you have written in recently, and not only recently, this has been one of the most ongoing lines of questioning we've had of how do you manage that? Or my husband, my wife. I'm afraid that they're. They're really getting out of balance with it. You know, they're constantly on. On social media, they're constantly gaming, they're constantly just tied to a screen. And it's really becoming a wedge in our marriage. And so we need to figure out how to leverage the technology for the great tool that it is right to stay connected to friends that stay connected even to our spouse, but to not let that thing become more than it should be. It's a great servant, but it's a poor master. If you use it as a servant, it's going to serve you well. It's if it starts to master you. In other words, if it starts to become an addiction, if it starts to create some unhealthy habits, then you've really got to have some honest conversations about it. So we're not here as these kind of authoritative parents to smack you on the knuckles with the ruler and say, now, here are the rules. If anything past this many minutes per day and you're over the edge. This is for you as an adult, as a couple, to figure out in your marriage, Right? What does this need to look like? We're just gonna talk about some things to help you and your spouse start having that conversation in a healthy way.
- [04:51]
B
You know, it's so true. And so how do we practically do that? I think at first, it starts with, like, making sure that you're giving your spouse your best attention. You know, if you constantly. Like, when you come home, you're on your phone, and whether it means, like, you're talking to somebody or you're checking Facebook, or maybe right when you get home, you run downstairs to wherever your gaming equipment is and hop on your game like you're ignoring your family right when you come home. You know, we need to make sure that when we come home that we greet everybody, that we're present with our spouse, we're present with our children, that we spend some time with them and maybe reserve the time for our hobby, especially if it's like gaming. We get a lot of emails about this, and so I want to talk a little bit about this. Gaming itself is not a bad thing. You know, our sons are, like, super into gaming. I know it's something where you can. You know, these days, you actually. It's not like you're just in a room with a tv playing a game by yourself.
- [05:39]
A
You.
- [05:39]
B
You're actually playing with people online, and it can be a great way to connect with friends who are far away. So it's not all bad, but it becomes really bad when it's the one thing you look forward to when you get home. Now, I understand it might be a good way to blow off steam. Like, for me, personally, I'm not a gamer, but I like watching, like, certain TV shows. Like, I love turning on the office and just watching the office laughing. For me, it's a way to just kind of come down from a busy day. But if. If that's what I'm looking forward to when I get home from work and I'm ignoring my husband and children, then that's completely a detrimental thing to my family. And so we had to ask ourselves, like, when is the best time of day for me to enjoy this Screen time. And I would venture to say the best time of day is when it's more on your time and not their time. Think about it, like, if it's on their time when it's the only time of day they really get to see you and engage with you, then that's a problem. So maybe instead move it to a later time in the day or a time when maybe they're not home, you know, make it so that. That they're not paying for it, so to speak.
- [06:35]
A
Yeah, that's a real. Make sure they're not paying for it. That is a really, really good and profound way to, to look at it, not only in your marriage, but, you know, for those of you who have children, and I know many of our listeners do, and we do. I try to keep that in mind that, like, I want to be present in the moments that are most important to my family, and I want to make sure that I've carved out time each day where I can have some uninterrupted one on one time with every single member of the family. And sometimes that one on one time is partly spent playing video games with one of my sons, because that's what they love to do. And so I've got to join them in their world. And sometimes it's me getting beat at Mario Kart and them loving every bit of it, you know, because they laugh because they can, they can beat dad. And I'm like, well, if we were playing on the old Super Nintendo, I'd be whipping you whippersnappers because I don't know how to play these newfangled fancy things. But we have a lot of fun together playing stuff. And sometimes it's bedtime, you know, when I'm exhausted. It's not my best time of the day, but I'll put my phone down and say, all right, this is the one time a day I've got a captive audience with them and I'll go spend 10 minutes in the room just talking about their day. And it really is a special.
- [07:33]
B
And they love it. They love it. And, you know, sometimes, like, for me, you know, sometimes you can, like, like Dave is saying, as far as playing video games with your kids or with your spouse even, maybe, and your spouse enjoy that together, you know, for us. Like, again, I'm not really a gamer, but I love the Office, and our two older boys love the Office. So there's been times where we will talk, like, but we've seen it a million times. Like, I've seen the entire series probably eight times, like, since it's been out. But it's like, you know, we'll talk about different episodes we like, and we'll laugh about it and we'll kind of joke about it. And so there's conversation happening. But, you know, it's not like I'm just completely like, okay, you guys go there. I'm going here. I'm gonna ignore you. You know, And I think it's so easy, though, to do that. I mean, I have to sometimes remind myself. Cause I understand as a parent and as a spouse, you know, sometimes we do need alone time, you know, Especially if you're introverted. I'm introverted. Dave's kind of a mix of an introvert and extrovert. And, you know, if you guys aren't familiar with what that really means. Cause a lot of us think it means, like, either you're a people person or you're not. What it really means is, where do you get your energy? Do you get your. Do you feel more energized when you're by yourself and you kind of have some reprieve? Or are you more energized when you're around people and you feel like you're gaining energy from being around people? And for me, personally, I love people. I mean, I love being around people. But I've gotta have some time in my day where I'm by myself and I kind of just have a moment. And for me, a lot of times that does involve a tv. And Dave knows this about me. I may not even be watching it. I may be, like, half out of it, just zoning out. But it's something that gives me, like, a little beat in the day. But what I've had to learn being a wife and being a mother is, again, I need to pick better times when I'm not making my family pay for it, when I'm not kind of neglecting them. And it's always something I have to monitor. I mean, it's not something where I get on autopilot and just assume everything's good. You know, I need to make sure I'm engaging with my husband and with my kids. And so that's something that we just have to think about, is when is the best time of day. And when we sit down and talk to ourselves, spouse, which we should ask them, and even ask your kids. You know, if you have kids old enough to have an opinion about this, talk to them about it. Like, when do you really like me to hang with you? You know, when do you want to Just hang out together and same with your spouse. Talk to them about it, and then find that time when you. When you can engage with your family. But then also maybe later or maybe early in the morning, you know, before everybody's awake, you can kind of have your little. Your time with your hobby, because it's not in and of itself a bad thing. When it becomes a bad thing is when it. It takes priority over your family.
- [09:50]
A
Yeah, that's a really, really good point. So, again, this is about you, your spouse, your family kind of working out together. Like, how do we. How do we find a rhythm that works for everyone to make sure that everybody gets the time that they need? Because the truth is, sometimes we can live in an illusion, thinking we're spending a lot of quality time around each other, but we're. We're not. Like, if you and your spouse are sitting on the couch and both of you are just on your phone, you might think, well, we're spending quality time together. We're both sitting here together. We're in the same physical space. But you could be in two totally separate. You know, he's playing Candy Crush, and she's on Pinterest, and, you know, one of you could leave the room for an hour, and the other one wouldn't even notice. And that's when it really is getting out of balance that we think we could be in the physically be in the same space and yet completely be missing out on quality time.
- [10:36]
B
Oh, yeah.
- [10:36]
A
So I think, you know, a big theme that we talk about on the Naked Marriage podcast all the time is communication. You've got to communicate. You have to have uninterrupted time together where you're constantly kind of monitoring where you are and making adjustments in every season of life. You know, for us, one of the best. The best things we do every day. I think it's one of the secrets to how we've maintained our friendship in marriage and maintain that line of communication is we end most days by going on a walk together, you know, by getting our youngest one in bed, and then, you know, kind of having the older boys just chill for a little bit and saying, we're going to go on a walk around the neighborhood, and it's a great way to get a little exercise. But it's no screens. Like, we're. You know, our screens are in our pocket just in case the boys call. And we talk. We talk without any screen distraction. And that is some of the most meaningful conversation we have each day. But if you look over the day that you have with your spouse and you think, I don't know. If we've had five minutes of uninterrupted conversation where there wasn't a screen involved all day, that's when it really becomes an issue that you've got to address. Or if one spouse believes there's a problem with the amount of screen time, then there's a problem. You know, you might think, well, I don't think it's a problem. You know, I'm just, this is my, this is my hobby and I like to do this and that's fine and good. But if, if your spouse feels like it's too much, right, and you're just kind of continually pridefully saying, well, I'm going to keep doing it because I, I think it's fine, then you're driving a wedge. You're allowing, you're allowing a little piece of technology to drive a wedge in your marriage. And you need to be willing to put that phone down or put that game down or put whatever it is down and say, let's reconnect, let's find some common ground and let's work together on this.
- [12:14]
B
You know, I think something we often forget too is that we're not only, it's not only affecting our spouse and our kids, but they're also watching us as a model, like for behavior in their future. And you know, and I think about, like, do I want my kids to think it's okay to just completely ignore, you know, the family and just get lost on my laptop or gaming or whatever it is? And I think, you know, we often forget to ask ourselves that because in the moment we're just doing what we want to do. And it feels good in the moment to just have that time doing the hobby or whatever it is. And what we don't realize is we're really kind of creating a narrative in our kids mind of what marriage and what family is supposed to look like. And I remember one of the specific emails we got recently was a wife who felt like her husband had just taken his video game hobby too far. And she said, it's just like he completely is in another world. And he was particularly into violent games. And she was worried about their young son kind of misunderstanding what's going on and not understanding how, you know, how things really should be in the family. And it had gotten really out of balance. And so, you know, I just want to talk about that because it's something that, you know, the sooner we can recognize when things are out of balance, the better. And like Dave said, if your spouse comes to you, if your child comes to you, my goodness. Because children, especially sometimes will say things even sooner than a spouse will say it because they're just so honest. You know, that's not something to ignore. Like, definitely pay attention to that. You know, I've had my kids, our kids call me out on being on my phone before. I mean, there's been times where they're like, mom, mom, mom. And I'm like, literally in another world, checking Facebook or whatever. And they're like, you've really been on your phone for a while. And it really hits me hard. Cause I'm like, oh, my gosh, they're right. You know, I need to put this down. I've gotten carried away. And so we need to really take note of those things that our kids and our spouse are telling us. Because, like Dave said, even if we don't think it's a problem, clearly they're affected by it. And they're like, wait a minute. You really haven't even looked me in the eye today. Like, what's the deal?
- [14:08]
A
Yeah, that's so true. So you gotta have your sensors out to what, you know, what your family, what your spouse especially is thinking. And it might mean creating some new rules together, new boundaries, you know, Our friend Dan Leanne, who speaks at the EXO conferences, just does a great job. What a fun communicator. And he's. He's got this cool Australian accent, and it just makes. It's just a cool. I wish I talked like that. I mean, he's like the coolest guy, but he's also a great teacher, you know, doesn't just have a cool accent. He's a super great teacher with a lot of depth. Speaking of that, if you want to hear any of the EXO sessions, you should check out Exo Now. Not to, like, throw in a commercial for this, but this is a great way for you to invest. If you want to use screens for good, use your screens to get some great marriage content. EXO now is a great way to do that. Quickest way to get there. If you go to XO now tv, it'll take you straight there and you can learn more. It's like Netflix for your marriage. And you can hear all of Dan's sessions and all of ours and Jimmy's and everybody else's. But in the last EXO talk he did, he shared that him and his wife were kind of having this screen conversation and decided that a good standard, they were going to follow a new rule. They were going to implement is no phones in the bedroom. And I love that. And that kind of challenges me because, you know, I'll bring my phone in the bedroom. I use it as an alarm clock, so I keep it by the bed, but then I'll also pick it up and be laying in bed, checking Facebook and checking email last thing at night, first thing in the morning. And I think that it would be better if there was just digital detox to end the day and to start the day. And so that's maybe something that, you know, that we should try. But whatever the rules are in your marriage, you've got to talk about it together and think how. How can we implement some new strategies to just make sure that the screens aren't taken over? In our house, one of the simple things we do is we say no phones at the table, right? No. So we gather together for dinner. It is a. It is a screen free time, even if it's at a restaurant. Restaurant or at home, no phones at the table. And the kids, everybody puts down whatever they're on. And we engage with each other. We go around the circle, we ask each other, tell us, you know, two good things about your day. And if you want to, you can also share one hard thing about your day. And we talk about it and we laugh and we celebrate the good and we encourage each other for the hard stuff. And it's, it's such a great time to reconnect. And every family and every couple of years needs those screen free times of interaction each day. So. So, sweetie, like, how would you. Pivoting a little bit here? How would you get a spouse to get off their phone if they don't think it's an issue? Like, if. And these are the people that write us. And this is why I want to address this head on. The questions we get on Facebook, on email, on nakedmarriagepodcast.com, they go something like this. My husband or my wife, they're on their phone all the time. It's becoming a huge issue in our marriage. I can't get through to him or her. And yet they don't see it as an issue. And that's really where the issue lies, is they just kind of shrug it off and say, well, it's not a big deal. You need to get over it. What do you encourage someone to do in that situation?
- [16:55]
B
You know, this is interesting. I actually saw an entire story on the Today show about this. And. Or it might have been Good Morning America, I can't remember. But it was one of the correspondents who. It was this very same thing. His family had told him, man, you have an issue with screens. Like, you're constantly. For him in particular, it was his phone. They're like, you're on your phone way too much, and it's really bothering us, and you don't realize it. I know you're not doing it intentionally to, like, not talk to us, but, like, it's. It's like an addiction for you. And he was like, I don't believe it. So what he did is he got an app that tracked how much he's on his phone. And I will tell you, we. We use actually the same act. He same app that he uses. It's called Custodio with a Q. Custodio. The Custodio app. It's also a filtering system for websites and things like that. And I think we've shared that before. Keep pornography off and even other things, like if you. If there's anything in particular you just don't want your kids or yourself to be exposed to. So anyway, Custodia will. Will literally tell you how much you've been on your phone and exactly where that time was spent. And he said after he did that for a week, he could not believe. Like, he was just flabbergasted at the amount of time that he was wasting on his phone. And in particular, which. Which social media sites he was going to and just, you know, which news sites he was going to. He was like, I am wasting so much time on this. And so he basically gave himself a detox from that for a few days. And it is like a detox maneuver because you really do have to kind of retrain yourself because you're used to just constantly entertaining yourself with your phone. I think we have this epidemic of being bored, and we instantly go to our phones and our kids do the same thing. We're just in that kind of culture. And so he basically, for a little bit, just tried to stay away from his phone unless it was like, work necessary for work. And it really helped him to have more FaceTime with his kids and with his wife and. And it just. It created such a healthier environment. And so I would encourage you to do the same. Like, just say, listen, first of all, let me show you. It's not just me complaining. I think as a spouse, you know, sometimes we're like, oh, my spouse is just complaining about this, or my kids are just complaining about this. But when you can look at the real numbers, it's pretty eye opening. Yeah, Exactly. And so, you know, get that tracking. Go to Custodio. It's not very expensive. You can see exactly how much time you're spending on this. You can do it as an entire family so you don't feel singled out. So everybody can kind of track where they're going, how long they're spending on their devices. And you can put this on laptops and any, any device, by the way.
- [19:13]
A
Yeah. And you don't even necessarily need a paid software like Custodio. I mean, like, most, most smartphones have this feature.
- [19:19]
B
Well, Apple does. Has a feature.
- [19:20]
A
You have an iPhone. You know, at that new software. With Apple, you can update your phone. It'll. It'll cut you off after certain limits. It'll track.
- [19:26]
B
Yeah, you can. You can do it where it cuts you off. That's another thing, is you can set limits. If you're like, I can't do this myself, you know, at a certain time at night, I'm not gonna be able to get online. You know, you can literally set that time. And so, you know, it was just really neat seeing that story because this guy, you know, he was a great husband and father, but he didn't realize how he was really taking, you know, stealing time away from his family. And this just. He said it made such an improvement. First of all, recognizing the problem, like, realizing like, yes, this is a real problem, and then setting limits for himself. And I think one of the limits. It's funny that you mentioned about Dan Leanne having that limit in the bedroom. That's one of the boundaries they kind of put in place is because where he was spending a lot of time was at night, and it was affecting his sleep. So then it was affecting how he treated his family in the morning. And it's just kind of this snowball effect. And so, yes, use it. You know, use your apps.
- [20:19]
A
It's probably gonna affect your sex life too. Just to get real, if your wife's like, well, apparently that phone is more desirable to you than.
- [20:25]
B
You're right.
- [20:25]
A
You know, it's gonna. That's one of the many possible negative consequences. But I love what Ashley was saying. Just, you gotta monitor these things. I mean, whether it's your time or your money. Your time. Your. Your time is the most valuable resource you have, not your money. But yet most of us will at least pay attention to where we're spending our money. And if it's. If it's running out too fast, we'll wanna know why and where it's going. Well, our time, we need to Be even more mindful of where it's going.
- [20:51]
B
Oh, yeah.
- [20:52]
A
And so a lot of times we're just. We're flushing time down the toilet every day and not investing in relationships, and we're just losing it in apps or whatever. And I love the fact that when you track it and you look at it and you really take an assessment of how you're spending your time, it could be really eye opening. And so I would say start there. I think that could be a great place to start. Like, let's track our time on the phones for a week.
- [21:14]
B
And I think doing it together is key.
- [21:15]
A
Yeah, doing it together. Doing it even as a whole family. And then let's reconnect after a week and say, is this. Is this the best use of our time? Where can we make some adjustments? So that's. It's great stuff. We've got some additional resources on screen time and specific aspects of screen time, whether it's gaming or social media, both in past podcast episodes. Articles we've written on marriagetoday.com and as always, there's some insights hopefully you can get from the Naked Marriage book. And thank you guys for those who've been reading that and listening to that. A lot of you guys listen to the podcast and you've enjoyed listening to the audiobook, which you can get on Amazon. So thank you for that, sweetie. Before we jump into today's question, do you have any final thoughts on screen time?
- [21:55]
B
I think the only thing I would say is don't assume that your screen time is all good. Ask each other, like, talk to each other about it. You know, that's why we do these podcasts, is to encourage conversation. And so don't assume it's all good. I mean, maybe it is. Maybe you'll ask your spouse and they're like, you know what? You actually manage that really well. And thank you for even asking me about it. But so far, so good. Or they might be like, you know what? I'm so glad you asked because it has been a little bit more than you probably realize, and I feel like we're not getting enough time together. And so hopefully it'll have some good. It'll encourage you guys to have a good, healthy, respectful, loving conversation.
- [22:32]
A
That is good, good stuff. Monster Energy. Everybody knows White Monster, Zero Ultra, that's the og it kicked off this whole zero sugar energy drink thing, but Ultra is a whole lineup now. You've got Strawberry Dreams, Blue Hawaiian Sunrise, and Vice Guava. And they all bring the Monster Energy punch. So if you've been living in the white can branch out Ultra's got a flavor for every vibe and every single one is zero sugar Tap the banner to learn more. All right, we're going to dive into today's question. You guys can send us questions. Well, you can send us questions anywhere, really. On Facebook, on Instagram, we have a shared account, Dave and Ashley Willis. We have the marriage page on Facebook and individual pages there. You can email us, but the questions we're answering specifically on this podcast are the ones that are sent to nakedmarriagepodcast.com yes. So if you'd like for us to answer it on air, then please send your questions there. And here is this week's question. It says, I came into marriage not knowing what healthy conflict looked like growing up. My parents marriage was full of domination, explosive anger, bitter resentment, and a lack of honest communication, all of which I've seen in myself as a wife. In turn, my husband has felt dominated in disrespect, and this needs to end now. How can I break the cycle of what I learned from my past and fully embrace healthy conflict with my husband? Man, this is such a great question.
- [23:56]
B
Yes.
- [23:56]
A
First, I'm going to let Ashley dive in. But first off, thank you for writing this in. Thank you for your courage and your honesty to, you know, to confess this is an area you want to grow in. And so many people relate to this. You know, Jimmy Evans, when he, he has a great illustration he uses in his talks where he has people raise their hand, he says, how many of you grew up in a house where there was a dominant parent, a dominant spouse, whether it was your mom or your dad that kind of dominated in that marriage relationship? And a bunch of hands go up. And he said, now those who just raised their hands, how many of you would say that dominant relationship had a negative impact in the marriage and in the family? And almost every single hand that raised the first time raised the second time, saying that dominance always creates unhealthy dynamics in the relationship. And so you're recognizing this because the hard part is, even if we recognize something is unhealthy, our default mode is to just do what we saw growing up, even if we know it's unhealthy. And so the first step is recognizing it. She's recognized that she wants to stop it. So, sweetie, where does she start?
- [24:58]
B
I think the place to start is giving your spouse permission to tell you when you're doing these things.
- [25:04]
A
Oh, that's good.
- [25:04]
B
And, you know, we know what this is like. We've walked through this ourselves, and we've worked with a lot of couples who've walked through this. And I do think you have to say that the spouse that grew up that way intends to go to the default mode of explosive anger, resentment, you know, unhealthy fighting, so to speak. You have to give your spouse permission to say when you're crossing those boundaries. And this isn't to put you in a parent child dynamic. So please don't get me wrong here. It's nothing like that, but it's saying, like, listen, when I fall into that mode, I am giving you permission to say, sweetie, listen, you are starting to sound like that parent that you don't wanna sound like you're starting to do those things. And you told me it was okay when I told you, and I know you don't wanna be this way. And when you say it calmly like that, and you're like, listen, we talked about this beforehand. I'm not trying to nitpick at you, but I know you're not wanting to go down this road. It can, it can stop it in its tracks and, you know, it's something that. It'll kind of stop it before it gets worse. Because I think a lot of times when, when you're used to a household where someone is just flying off the handle all the time and, like, has, you know, goes off to reckless abandonment, like, with their anger, and it's like, it's just this horrible thing that just gets worse and worse. But when you can very calmly, you know, when you see kind of them ramping up, you see, you know, if your spouse is the one that tends to go to that place of anger and, and you see them ramping up and they've already given you permission to say something, kindly say something. And it might even be, you know, grabbing their hand gently and saying, sweetie, you're doing what you said you don't want to do. Let's. Let's wait till you calm down a little bit and then we'll. We'll talk about it. Now, speaking of calming down, the worst thing you could say is calm down, right?
- [26:40]
A
It never helps anybody.
- [26:41]
B
It never helps.
- [26:42]
A
Never helps anybody.
- [26:43]
B
But speaking kindly and saying, maybe you even have a word. I mean, it could be as simple as, like a code word, right?
- [26:50]
A
You know, like a safe word.
- [26:51]
B
Like a safe word.
- [26:52]
A
Philadelphia.
- [26:53]
B
Serious. Yeah, it's getting crazy. Philadelphia, you know, whatever it is. But I mean, it's just those things that, you know, is not going to ignite your anger, but is going to extinguish your anger and be that little reminder, that gentle reminder. And gentle being the, the, the biggest word I can tell you right now, because we don't want it to cause more arguing, but a general reminder to say, we're getting heated here. Like, this is. This is. We're going into a place where I know you don't wanna go. And it's just that way to kind of remind you. And over time, by doing this exercise, over time, you'll stop doing it because you'll have had that gentle reminder, even if it's a look. I mean, again, you guys need to talk about what that thing is to kind of get you to extinguish that anger inside of you or that bitterness or resentment. And that way you're not repeating what you grew up with. Because I do think there's so many things that, you know, for those who have grown up in a household where there was a dominant parent, you know how toxic that is.
- [27:47]
A
Yeah.
- [27:47]
B
And it is like the biggest fear to repeat that. But like Dave said, our go to is often how we were raised. And so it does take being very intentional about how we do address, you know, hot topics in our marriage. And it's so good when we have our spouse on the same page with us to give us that general reminder that look, that word to just say, oh, we're getting, we're getting into that territory. And that way, you know, we have to look at it as. They're just trying to help me here and help us. This is not an attack on me. It's because that's how I was raised. That's where I tend to go, and I want to stop this cycle.
- [28:21]
A
Man, that's good stuff. Learn to recognize the signs, the triggers that are leading you there. Practice ways to calm down, talk about these things. Not in the heat of the moment, but talk about them when you're both calm.
- [28:32]
B
Yes. And even write it down.
- [28:33]
A
Yeah, write it down. One other quick thing about this, if you will, Google F5 marriage, Tornado, and our Dave and Ashley Willis. We've got some videos and some articles that kind of relate to this cycle of conflict and how people fall into it, how to get out of it where we can talk about that in more detail. Because this is a big, big issue and we've talked a lot about it because it is such an important issue. But thank you for that question and I hope my beautiful and brilliant wife's insights will help you, because if you'll put what she said into practice, that will make a big difference. Guys, thank you so, so much for listening. Thank you for subscribing. Thank you for writing in and letting us know what topics you want to hear. Thank you for leaving reviews. You are part of this community. Together we are. We're spreading a message of encouraging and strengthening marriages all over the world. And you are a part of that movement. And we are so, so thankful. So feel free to write in. Let us know what you'd like to hear in future episodes. Continue to spread the word so other people can discover it, and we look forward to seeing you next time on the Naked Marriage Podcast. Bye, guys.