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The Neurodivergent Experience
Hot Topic: More Than Focus - The Real-Life Benefits of ADHD Medication
00:32:12
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- [00:00]
Instacart Announcer / Brooke Devard
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- [00:33]
Scotty
Acast powers the world's best podcasts. Here's a show that we recommend.
- [00:42]
Vanessa Zoltan or Hannah McGregor
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- [01:27]
Scotty
Acast helps creators launch, grow and monetize their podcasts everywhere. Acast.com.
- [01:37]
Jordan
Oh hot, hot, hot, hot, hot, hot, hot, hot. Hello and welcome to the Neuro Spicy News Hot topic.
- [02:00]
Scotty
Oh, too hot, too spicy.
- [02:03]
Jordan
Lots of hot spiciness. My mouth is tingly.
- [02:13]
Scotty
Oh dear me. So what is the Neurospicy Hot Hot Topic this week?
- [02:18]
Jordan
John well, ADHD drugs have been found to have a wider life benefit than just helping with concentration. I know this isn't really news because.
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Scotty
We kind of already knew this news to everybody else.
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Jordan
It seems like apparently people had to spend time on a study. But the thing is, it's not that people didn't know this, but now we have hard facts to prove it, which, which is really, really important because so like we were discussing in the Lucy Bronze episode where she won't take the ADHD meds because she thinks it will somehow affect her ability on the pitch. Which I personally, it's none of my business, but you know, everyone has their own thing. I I was saying and you were saying at the time, it's like it doesn't just have the benefits of hyper focus and helping you concentrate on things that you don't particularly want to do. It has emotional regulation. It has decision Making it dilutes the noise. It helps you sleep. It just helps in general. I mean, obviously taking a stimulant just before you go to bed isn't good, but just having that day where you haven't had to overthink and been overly stressed because of those intrusive thoughts, that in general helps me sleep a lot better.
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Scotty
Oh, absolutely, yeah.
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Jordan
So this, this article only came out on the 14th, so as of today, which is the 15th as of recording, hot off the press, it is hot, hot, hot topic. So, Scotty, do you care to read a bit of the article, give the audience an idea of what is going on?
- [04:13]
Scotty
Yes. So, as the BBC article titled ADHD Drugs have wider life benefits, study suggests drug treatment can help people newly diagnosed with ADHD to reduce their risk of substance misuse, suicidal behavior, transport accidents and criminality. The study suggests these issues are obviously linked to what are, quote unquote, common ADHD symptoms, such as acting impulsively or being easily distracted. What is those two, isn't it? Who said that?
- [04:41]
Jordan
Where am I?
- [04:42]
Scotty
Oh, hey, Jordan, how's it going? So some 5% of children, 2.5% of adults worldwide are thought to be affected by an disorder.
- [04:51]
Jordan
My ass.
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Scotty
Yeah, my. We need a little my ass button, don't we?
- [04:56]
Jordan
Bollocks.
- [04:57]
Scotty
And growing numbers are being diagnosed. The findings. It's funny that, isn't it? The findings published in the British medical journal the BMJ confi confirm the wider potential benefits of drug treatment and could help patients decide whether to start medication. The research says.
- [05:15]
Jordan
Brilliant. Finally we've got it in writing.
- [05:19]
Scotty
It's on the BBC, so it must be true.
- [05:22]
Jordan
I mean, for once. For once they. It is true. I'm not for once.
- [05:27]
Scotty
But for this, for this one, for this particular article.
- [05:29]
Jordan
For this once. Yeah, I mean, apart from that 5%. I love that it's like 5% of children and 2.5% of adults. Well, hold on, that doesn't make sense because if it's 5% of children, then it must be 5% of adults, because it doesn't. You can't. Half of it, it doesn't disappear.
- [05:48]
Scotty
And is it diagnosed? Is it undiagnosed? Whereabouts in the world? In east, the west, the north, it.
- [05:53]
Jordan
Doesn'T even say I die. It just thought to be affected. It's like, oh, like, are you. What are you thinking? That five percent of children die? They're only two and a half. So only half of half of them become adults.
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Scotty
You gotta remember is 2.5% of us grow out of it.
- [06:11]
Jordan
Off.
- [06:14]
Scotty
Exactly.
- [06:15]
Jordan
Honestly, that, that statistic is, is just whatever.
- [06:19]
Scotty
Anyway, let's not focus on that.
- [06:21]
Jordan
Let's not focus on, on that stupidity. Yeah, it's, it's more about, you know, it does have a wider positive effects. So. The researchers from South University and the Kins Institute in Stockholm found that taking ADHD medication was linked to reduction of first time instances of suicidal behaviors, minus 17%, substance misuse, minus 15%, transport accidents, 12% minus 12% and criminal behavior, minus 13%. When recurrent events were analyzed, the researchers found ADHD medication was linked to reduction of 15%, suicides, 25%, substance misuse, 4%. Accidental injuries, 16% of transport accidents, 25% for criminal behavior. I have to admit I haven't, I haven't had any of these since, since taking the medication, but I definitely had a few of them before. So I, I could, I can attest to not the criminal behavior.
- [07:36]
Scotty
Your Honor.
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Jordan
Your Honor, just want to make sure that I'm. Everyone should know that I am a law abiding citizen. I'm not wearing a wire.
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Scotty
The microphone is.
- [07:46]
Jordan
Yeah, I'm a good boy. I'm a good boy, you, Honor. But yeah, I've had transport accidents. They were all someone else's fault. That's what I'm going with. Definitely, definitely accidental injuries, not substance misuse or. And obviously I had an attempt at the bad thing when I was younger. That was a long, long time ago. But I'd say for me it's definitely, definitely the accidental injuries is the big one for me, which is weirdly, it's the lowest percentage. But that's the one that affects me the most is that I do end up hurting myself a lot, especially reoccurring injuries where I've hurt myself and then I rush myself back because I'm not thinking properly. I don't think things through and I'll re injure myself over and over again because I have the impulsivity that I just, I just have to do things and I act like a freaking two year old. And yeah, the medication definitely helps me with that. How does it help you in relation to these things?
- [08:56]
Scotty
So when I think of transport accidents, I don't think of like nicking or crashing my car or anything like that. I've missed trains. I have tried to get off of moving buses before because I'm just not thinking clearly. I've got that much running around my head. I'm just like a, like a headless chicken. I have got myself in accidents because I'm in a rush or I'm forgetting something. I've got my hands trapped indoors like all sorts of stuff like that because I'm just all over the place because my. I'm overstimulated. This was when I was living in London, specifically. Criminal behavior, your honor. Not something I've exactly ever been into. But the, the were times where I got myself in situations by being in the wrong crowd. And because I was masking and ruminating and all of this sort of thing, I could have got myself in situations that I shouldn't have been in. And that has definitely stopped since taking the methylphenidate. My social circle is a lot more sort of controlled and I'm just happier in general in life is the overall sort of thing. Substance misuse is something that I have been guilty of in the past. I used to smoke cigarettes a lot. I've smoked like pot in the past. And I had a bit of a up and down sort of relationship with class A's at university and when I was younger and I can honestly say not a thing with me anymore. Been very, very good with that. The methylphenidate doesn't push me to want to get that rush. You know, there used to be certain times where I would do things that I know I shouldn't have done and the adrenal rush is what I was sort of chasing. It was that sort of like the stimulant and with the suicidal behavior, I can say hand on heart, I have not felt like that for a very, very long time. The methylphenidate certainly does help with my rumination and, and worrying about things. The emotional regulation, dude, is the one thing that I am the most sort of content with that I get from the methylphenidate. I used to get really anxious about things. I used to not like get paranoid to like sort of psychosis sort of paranoid, but I used to worry about like, what if I just lose my job tomorrow? And it used to be something that I used to really ruminate about a lot and I can honestly say I don't do that now. And looking at all of those sorts of categories, I can totally understand as to why a study would pick up on a drop in all of those rates on people that are taking it. It affects us all so differently. But for me, all of those things have took a, took a nose dive for sure.
- [11:39]
Jordan
Yeah. It is interesting that it always, every time someone thinks of, of adhd, it is like impulsivity and being easily distracted.
- [11:51]
Scotty
Like a scatty cat.
- [11:52]
Jordan
Yeah. And it's not, it's not that. That's not true. It's just that it's such an oversimplification that it's. I almost find it insulting because it is basically saying that that's just it. That. That. And it's. It's so much. There's so much more to it. It's so. It's nuanced. A lot of it is very nuanced. And I. It also creates frustrating stereotypes where if somebody doesn't see that happening, like, on a physical plane of existence and that's, you know, invisible to visible disabilities. You know, that's.
- [12:40]
Scotty
That's.
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Jordan
That's the thing. If someone doesn't see that or doesn't recognize that, then somehow it doesn't exist. And, And. And that. That's the problem is the fact that we're going through that. And a lot of us, not me, because I'm very externally adhd. Like, it's very obvious how ADHD I am to most people, but for. For a lot of us, including Sylvia and. And Simon, they're very internally adhd. So it's. It's all just going on in their head. And you can't see that. You. You can't understand that unless you truly, truly know them. So it also puts a lot of doubt in people's heads as well, but it also makes people. And I don't. I don't say this lightly because it's. It is. It is a rare case, but it is. It is a possibility that someone can be like, oh, that kid over there can't sit still, is easily distracted, and. And just jumps off climbing frames. It's got to be adhd. And it's like. Or that kid is just really excited that day. May. Maybe they bought a new puppy, maybe their friends coming over for the first sleepover ever, maybe their dad's come home from a long stint, you know, in the army, and. And they get to see their dad for the first time in a couple of months. You have no idea what's going on.
- [14:20]
Scotty
Circumstantial. So much.
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Jordan
And it's like that kid could just be excited. Or that kid could have just had like a. And I know this sounds crazy, but that kid could have just had a lot of sugar for breakfast. Oh, and it's just. And is hyperactive purely from sugar. And the thing is, is I was always told that. That my hyperactivity was because of sugar. And. But I was hyperactive. Like, I was diagnosed hyperactive, but they said the sugar causes hyperactivity. And I'm like, well, then I'M not hyperactive. I've just had sugar because sugar makes everyone hyperactive. Especially if you don't eat it that much, it makes everyone hyperactive, especially kids. But it's also like this weird psychological thing as well. Of like it's more likely that the kids are excited because of a moment than a sugar intake. And they tested this at parties where there's this idea that kids get really, really excited at parties because there's cake and there's crisps and there's lots of sugary things. But the psychology behind it is actually they're just excited because they're kids and they're at a party and because they're surrounded by other kids and they feed off the energy of those other kids. So if you just put it down to those two things, then not only are you doing people who really do have ADHD and injustice by just labeling it as those things, but you're also potentially saying just some random kid who's just excited he's got have adhd. And that also does an injustice to not only that kid, but to people who actually have adhd. So I think it's important that people understand the deeper, the deeper meaning behind adhd, the deeper understanding behind adhd and not just look at the surface of it.
- [16:19]
Scotty
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I've had experiences in work where, you know, I was working with some reporter once and we were talking about trying to make posts more leaning at young people and he was like, oh, why do we want to aim at people that have the like a four second attention span, like ADHD readers and stuff like that, just like, God's sake. And ended up having quite an awkward debate about it with him. And sort of one of his rhetorics that he fired back with, he was like, well, you can't have adhd. You sit still for hours when we work. I was like, there's a lot more to it than that. And I ended up just giving up on the conversation because I just realized I was talking to a brick wall. But that is so, so true. And especially learning living being with a female who has adhd, I can tell you she is not hyper like that at all. Like she's not bouncing around at all. She's not even a tapper. She's all internal. It's like her sort of stims, like echolalia and things like that. But there are certain times where what would almost be like a hyper sort of episode, I can see my partner having an internal one because I recognize it because I'm internal too, you know, if she's sort of like, looking at a wall and her face is moving around a lot, I sit to her and I go, what are you thinking about? Just goes off everything, like, yeah, right. I know that feeling and it does frustrate me because as I've sort of learned more and obviously being in the advocacy space and the community, I'm starting to really understand that, like, one label does not fit everybody. And I really wish that, you know, this study maybe is. Is. Is, you know, moving the snowball down the hill, but I wish people would not just view it as the, oh, we can't sit still. Oh, he talks too much. Oh, he gets too excited. Because I get excited about things. I've bought concert tickets. This morning I was jumping up and down with excitement because I got them. But that's not everything that I get excited about. It's like an extreme circumstance. Like, you and I sat next to each other, we could. We'd look like chalk and cheese. We couldn't be any more sort of different in the, like, the sort of energies that we give off. We've both got adhd.
- [18:38]
Jordan
Yeah. And I think that this is why doing this study is. Is actually hugely beneficial, because it does delve into the deeper, darker side of adhd. Because obviously we do want to spread the positivity and the idea of being neurodivergent in general, whether it's viewed through being autistic, adhd, dyslexic and so on and so forth. But like I've said a million times, this is the alternative neurotype. It is the same lack of synaptic, pruning brain. It is the same brain. And whatever condition you might get diagnosed with is. Is just circumstance and. And who you see and how you generally struggle, because that's what these conditions are given with, is, is. This is, you know, it isn't, oh, what are you good at? It's, oh, how do you struggle in life? You know, what are you not. Yeah, what are you not good at? Because I could sit and I could diagnose which condition, given the DSM 5 and the criteria built around the negative impact that the conditions have on our lives. I can diagnose someone autistic, adhd, dyslexic, given enough information. But if. If I wanted to know if someone's neurodivergent, I don't actually need to know about all the things they struggle with. I would just need to know about all the things that they're really good at and how they're really good at them and, and like, what positive impact their type of thinking has on their lives. I, I wouldn't necessarily be able to say, oh, you're autistic, you're adhd, you're dyslexic. But I would be able to say, yeah, you're neurodivergent. You have that alternative neurotype. So that, that is how I look at it, is the alternative neurotype is literally just. That's the brain. And the brain has lots of positive aspects. But, you know, these conditions are these conditions and, and that, and unfortunately, because of the, how sensitive we are, because of the alternative neurotype is that. That we will be prone to, you know, suicidal behavior, substance misuse, accidents, criminal behavior. I, I assume what they mean by criminal behavior is just making, like, bad judgment decisions of like, I don't know, driving too fast, like at ridiculous levels because you're just not thinking straight or maybe, you know, breaking into somewhere or getting into a fight. Like, for me, in the past, the only criminal behavior that I've ever had a problem with is when I was much younger getting into fights. And I would, I got into trouble, but luckily because I was a kid, I got away with like a, you know, don't do that again.
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Scotty
Yeah, misdemeanor.
- [21:46]
Jordan
So, yeah, if you were older, we would have arrested you for that, that sort of thing. But yeah, I mean, I got into a lot of fights, but. Which is criminal behavior. It's, you know, but I haven't, I haven't had a fight in 25 years. But I've come close. I've come close because of my anger issues I've had to deal with. I've had to do a lot of work on myself. So I make sure that I continue that stretch of not punching some asshole in the face.
- [22:22]
Scotty
Yeah.
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Jordan
Who blatantly deserves it. But I'm, I'm. That, that's the thing, is that you have to work on it. And the methylphenidate, hugely, hugely helped. It was one of the main reasons I took it was because Sophie was the first one of us to actually take it. And she was going through some really difficult stuff with, with her, with her ex partner. And the way that she was able to deal with it was, was so different to how she was dealing with it before she started taking it. So she was really struggling. She was, it was really bad. And then she was on the methylphenidate. And it's not like, oh, she's a zombie and she doesn't know what's Going on. She was just able to think more clearly about his actions, about her response to his negative actions. Because that's what a lot of it is with anger issues. It's not that we don't get angry, it's how we respond to others making us angry. Yeah, yeah. It's not. It's not like, oh, someone cuts you up and you're not annoyed. You can't help but be annoyed. It's. Do you chase them down and start flashing them, beeping them? No, no, no, no, you don't. I have done that. That's the terrible thing.
- [23:40]
Scotty
As have I. Yeah, as have you.
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Jordan
But the methylphenidate makes me go, well, I don't want to do that. That's. That's not a sensible decision.
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Scotty
Yeah.
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Jordan
And it almost builds. It is like temporarily builds the synaptic pathways that my brain needs to make clearer decisions because obviously my brain lacks those. Those pathways from my amygdala, which is the emotional side of my brain, to the frontal lobe, the decision making part of my brain. I obviously have missing connections where I will be mostly emotionally responsive rather than thought responsive. And that is very, very in line with how teenagers are.
- [24:25]
Scotty
Oh, they don't think, they just do.
- [24:26]
Jordan
Yeah, they don't think, they just do. And that is how I've been all my life. And the methylphenidate really does. It feels like for that period of time where it lasts, it. It just works. It also makes me less tired because like I've said before, I'm not overthinking all the time. So when I'm less tired, I'm less irritable. When I'm less irritable, I'm less likely to get upset and have a meltdown. So that is. That is something it doesn't. It's not mentioned here because ADHD is not really associated with meltdowns, even though it should be. Yes, but autism is associated with meltdowns. But again, same brain.
- [25:05]
Scotty
Same brain.
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Jordan
Yep, same brain. We are all inclined to have meltdowns from. From being overly stimulated, from being hypersensitive, not over sensitive. That is a very negative and derogatory thing to say. Saying someone is oversensitive. I'm hypersensitive.
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Scotty
It sets a line of what being sensitive should be and what you are is not.
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Jordan
Is not that I'm at the sensitive level that my brain should be at, but it doesn't match your sensitivity level. So you think I'm oversensitive because I'm more sensitive than you. But then I could say you're under sensitive because you're not as sensitive as me. So saying over sensitive is very derogatory.
- [25:52]
Scotty
I think personally one of the things that I find so beneficial about it is, is it just closes tabs in my head and it siphons the energy. Like If I have 100% of energy right in anything in life, I can honestly say, hand on heart, if I had not had methylphenidate, I would not have gotten through buying this house. I wouldn't have gotten through it. I would have struggled with sourcing the paperwork. I definitely would have struggled with dealing with solicitors over the phone. You know how hard I was finding that and I couldn't have done it, but I did. And the methylphenidate really helped me because it helped me be able to switch off all the stuff going on with the house in my everyday sort of life. So I used to be at work, dude, and I'd have arguments with friends. I take it to work with me and I'd be, I'd be a mess. I won't be able to like function properly. I'd make really bad mistakes. And then like the, the consequences of the consequences and the compound and it gets worse and worse. And I find now I can stop that snowball going. It's like say if I was to have an argument with somebody at work, I wouldn't be thinking about it the rest of the day nearly half as much as if I would if I didn't have it. So I totally agree with you in that it allows me to emotionally process things rather than feeling everything all at once. It just seems to sort of like spread it out a little bit more and it means it's easier to deal with.
- [27:19]
Jordan
Yeah, that's a really good way of putting it, dude. That's. That's really insightful. Is it? Does it just. It's not that you don't have the same thoughts. It just gives them to you at a pace that you can handle and that you can separate those thoughts from each other rather than just being bombarded. It's the difference between 30 people trying to speak to you at once and then having a one on one conversation.
- [27:46]
Scotty
It's like getting malware security on your computer and stopping all those fucking little pop up ads. That's what it feels like. I feel like if I'm reading an article, I'm not getting loads of ads pop up again, do this, do that, do this, do that. It just gives me what I want. It's like having a VPN for the Internet. It just like Filters my thinking so much and I can actually pick apart what I'm thinking about rather than just living overwhelmed.
- [28:12]
Jordan
I'll tell you, I'll tell you this last thing before, before we go. It's why I take it every day. It's, it's very rare I don't take it. I think the last time I wasn't taking it is when we were having the trouble getting hold of it. So I was, I was rationing it for like only when I really had to have it, which was like days I was working or days I knew that I was really busy. But now I pretty much just take it every day. It's just in the morning, it's just, you know, like with my vitamins, you know, I just take it exactly the same and, and it frustrates me that doctors will tell patients, oh, you don't have to take it every day, just, you know, only when you need to concentrate. And I'm like, holy shit. Hopefully this study will, will change them saying stuff like that because this study proves that it's not just for helping you concentrate, that it has so many benefits on a day to day, wider life changing scale that it really isn't just, oh, I need to get this job done so I'm going to take it just so I can do this one job. It's not that is one thing that it helps you with, but all these other things are equally if not more important that it can change your life. So I do and I'm not a doctor, I don't get to tell people what to do. I do recommend to my family that they, they should take it every day because it's like Sylvia said, I don't need to take it today because I'm not working. And I'll say, right, but you said you were going to do your cupboard today. You said you were going to clear out your cupboard and like sort through your clothes. And she's. I forgot. And I was like, right, why did you forget? But if you had taken your medication.
- [30:13]
Scotty
Exactly.
- [30:14]
Jordan
You, you might not have forgot or you might have been in like in the right frame of mind to be able to just concentrate and do that. So even if it's just on a concentration thing, even if it is just that, which clearly it's not just that. Why would you not just take it every day anyway? Because every day you need to concentrate on something, whether it's cooking, whether it's cleaning, whether it's driving, whether it's going to the shops, making a phone call. Yeah. Even video Gaming.
- [30:43]
Scotty
Oh, hell yeah.
- [30:45]
Jordan
Whatever you doing in life. Unless you're just stagnating in bed all day. If, if, if the doctor said you, you should take methylphenidate, if methamphetidate is part of your life and it's benefiting you on the days you take it, I, I, I just go, well, I take it every day, but I'm not telling people they should. I'm just saying, why, why wouldn't you?
- [31:08]
Scotty
I couldn't agree more, my friend. I take it every day. And whenever I speak to anybody and they go, oh, we only take it on the days that I need it. I, I need it.
- [31:17]
Jordan
I need it. Why is that not every day?
- [31:20]
Scotty
Why is that not every day? Couldn't agree more, bro. So read this study, folks. I'll link it in the description of the show. Notes. How happy are you here to hear about this? And I also want to hear your experiences with methylphenidate as well. What are the benefits? How has it helped you? Because it certainly helped both of us. So thank you for tuning in for this week's Hot Topic. We will be back as always with the Neurodivergent Experience on Thursdays in your feed. So check out us there.
- [31:49]
Jordan
But I have to warn, warn. I, I have, I have to disappoint all of you. I'm afraid I will not be in the next episode. I'm going away from much needed photography break. Mental Health break, one I haven't done for a long time. So I will be away next week taking lots of lovely photos and Ashley Bentley is coming and taking my place. No doubt she will do an amazing job as she always does. So I will see everyone again on the next Hot Topic because we're going to go and record that straight after this.
- [32:31]
Scotty
Yes, give away the magic of the show. So yes, I love how you were like, sorry to disappoint everybody. It's just si next week. But that's fine.
- [32:40]
Jordan
I know why you're all here for my dulcet tones.
- [32:46]
Scotty
Take care of yourself, everyone. Be kind, be safe. Thanks for tuning in to the Neurodivergent Experience. We hope today's episode sparks something for you. Whether it's a new idea, a bit of validation, or just a moment of connection. Remember, new episodes are every week, so be sure to join us for the next one for more conversations and insights and into the neurodivergent Experience. If you've enjoyed this podcast, help us grow. You can do that by rating and reviewing this show. Your support makes a huge difference in helping us reach more people who could benefit from these conversations. You can connect with us on social media, find us on Instagram, Facebook, Tik tok. Just search for the neurodivergent experience. Thank you again for listening and until next time.
- [33:38]
Instacart Announcer / Brooke Devard
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- [33:38]
Scotty
Take care of yourself. You're not alone in this journey. ACAST powers the world's best podcasts. Here's a show that we recommend.
- [34:01]
Instacart Announcer / Brooke Devard
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- [34:44]
Scotty
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