Podcast Summary: Cory Booker on How to Defeat Donald Trump
The New Yorker Radio Hour (WNYC Studios & The New Yorker)
Date: September 27, 2019
Host: David Remnick
Guest: Senator Cory Booker
Episode Overview
In this episode, David Remnick sits down with Senator Cory Booker, then a Democratic presidential candidate for 2020, for an in-depth discussion about the turmoil of the Trump presidency, the urgency and strategy of impeachment, and the challenges facing the Democratic Party. The conversation also explores Booker’s views on political courage, his personal background, criminal justice reform, and approaches to health care. The tone is candid, impassioned, and—especially from Booker—grounded in both story and moral argument.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. Constitutional Crisis and Impeachment (00:10–02:17)
-
Moment of “constitutional vandalism”: Cory Booker expresses alarm at President Trump undermining constitutional checks and balances.
“For me, this is a moment of constitutional vandalism like I’ve never seen in my lifetime.”
—Cory Booker [00:10] -
Initially hesitant about impeachment, Booker states the threshold was crossed when Congress was blocked from effectively investigating.
-
Moral Imperative Over Politics: Booker and Remnick reflect on Speaker Pelosi’s hesitancy to pursue impeachment, suggesting that moral action should override short-term political costs.
“This is a moment, a moral moment, that we should stand up and say... the precedent that it sets is whoever... Trash the Constitution and the checks and balances, because if the politics don’t line up, you’re not gonna be impeached.”
—Cory Booker [01:48]
2. 2020 Campaign Struggles and the Electability Debate (03:17–06:50)
-
Polls and Long-Shot Narratives: Booker downplays poor polling numbers, emphasizing that past winners (Carter, Clinton, Obama) were initially underdogs.
“Nobody in the Democratic Party who’s ever been polling ahead right now in a presidential race has ever gone on to be president.”
—Cory Booker [03:37] -
Booker’s Unique Message: He positions himself as a candidate focused on “civic grace” and healing, not ideological extremes. He resists pundit divides between “progressive” and “moderate.”
“I just think that the theme of this election is not fight fire with fire... It really comes to the core of King. One of my favorite quotes from King, which is what we have to repent for... is not the vitriolic words and violent actions of the bad people, but the appalling silence and inaction of the good people.”
—Cory Booker [06:09]
3. The Human Experience of Campaigning (06:50–08:41)
-
Endurance & Surprises: Booker compares his mayoral campaign in Newark (recounted in the documentary Street Fight) with the presidential run.
“It is a physical endurance test and it does reveal who you are and how you deal and what kind of campaign that you run.”
—Cory Booker [07:30] -
Goodness of People: Despite polarization, Booker remarks on kindness from rival supporters.
“I had people in other candidates’ T-shirts saying, ‘Oh, I’m an X person supporter, but need you in this race, man, I gave you five bucks.’ And there is a decency and a goodness.”
—Cory Booker [08:45]
4. Fighting Trump and Rejecting Hate (09:45–11:14)
-
Rejecting Tit-for-Tat Hostility: Booker consistently argues for fighting Trump not by stooping to insult or hate.
“We didn’t beat Bull Connor because we brought bigger dogs and bigger fire hoses... But we had artists of activism who called to the moral imagination of this country and created, excited and ignited new majorities.”
—Cory Booker [10:13] -
Personal Anecdote: Booker tells a story about refusing to meet Trump’s aggression with personal animosity, echoing Michelle Obama’s “when they go low, we go high.”
“Dude, I want you to punch Donald Trump in the face. And I look at him and I go, dude, that’s a felony. And just said, sit down, Let me explain to you why that’s the exact wrong approach…”
—Cory Booker [09:00]
5. Race, Upbringing, and Political Lessons Learned (11:14–17:38)
-
Booker recounts his family’s struggles integrating into a New Jersey suburb, supported by a white lawyer’s sting operation against discriminatory real estate practices.
“We got there because of white people who saw that we were getting turned away in town after town every time.”
—Cory Booker [12:52] -
Reflects on being the first Black family in his town, experiences of police discrimination, and enduring racism in America and politics.
-
Discusses political attacks faced in early Newark campaigns; how loss and adversity delivered powerful lessons in empathy and perseverance.
6. Republican Party, Complicity, and Demographic Change (17:40–21:41)
-
Fear as the Heart of Political Loyalty: Booker attributes the GOP’s loyalty to Trump to fear—of their base, of re-election loss.
“There’s a reason why Profiles in Courage is such a thin volume.”
—Cory Booker [18:28] -
Long-Term GOP Decline: Booker predicts demographic shifts are dooming the Republican Party unless it adapts.
“You can’t run your party on racism and think you’re going to get Latino, Asian, immigrant, African American voters.”
—Cory Booker [20:20]
7. Criminal Justice, Wall Street, and Reform (21:41–24:11)
-
Justice System’s Double Standard: The disparity between white-collar criminals and poor offenders.
“You get treated better if you are rich and guilty than if you’re poor and innocent.”
—Cory Booker [21:46] -
Calls for holding pharmaceutical companies criminally liable for the opioid crisis if warranted.
8. The Trump Family, Kushners & Personal Connections (24:11–30:44)
-
Booker reflects on his history with the Kushner family, from campaign donors to negotiating criminal justice reform with Jared Kushner.
“Again, this is decade plus before what we know now. And I still remember when [Charlie Kushner] got into his legal trouble.... I just will never sanction bad behavior... But I still remember still talking to him in prison and writing letters with him. And when he came out, I credit him with being a guy that was so moved by what he saw criminal justice system...”
—Cory Booker [26:55] -
Principle Over Partisanship: Booker maintains the importance of engaging with opponents rather than wholesale vilification.
9. Working Across Divides in the Senate (30:44–35:16)
-
Cooperation Amidst Disagreement: Describes working with senators he disagrees with to achieve important reforms (e.g., with Trump and Lindsey Graham on criminal justice).
“So tell that liberated person that Cory Booker should not deal with somebody that he fundamentally disagrees with on more things. That’s the problem in this country.”
—Cory Booker [33:50] -
Increasing Tribalism: Booker laments a culture that vilifies crossing party lines—citing backlash for hugging John McCain.
10. Criminal Justice: Radical Reform or Abolition? (35:55–40:14)
- Booker supports broad criminal justice reform, including clemency for thousands, treatment for addiction, and learning from international models—but stops short of outright abolition.
“We radically change the ideas of crime and punishment in this country. That we emulate what works.”
—Cory Booker [38:07] - Highlights the scale and racial injustice of U.S. mass incarceration.
11. Health Care Debate: Pragmatism Over Purity (41:05–43:10)
- Booker supports Medicare for All in principle, but presents himself as a pragmatist advocating for immediate steps (public option, reducing drug costs) toward universal coverage.
“My community doesn’t have time to sacrifice progress on the altar of purity. They need help now.”
—Cory Booker [42:46]
Notable Quotes & Timestamps
- “For me, this is a moment of constitutional vandalism like I’ve never seen in my lifetime.”
—Cory Booker [00:10] - “This is a moment, a moral moment, that we should stand up and say... if the politics don’t line up, you’re not gonna be impeached.”
—Cory Booker [01:48] - “Nobody in the Democratic Party who’s ever been polling ahead right now in a presidential race has ever gone on to be president.”
—Cory Booker [03:37] - “We didn’t beat Bull Connor because we brought bigger dogs and bigger fire hoses... But we had artists of activism who called to the moral imagination of this country and created, excited and ignited new majorities.”
—Cory Booker [10:13] - “You can’t run your party on racism and think you’re going to get Latino, Asian, immigrant, African American voters.”
—Cory Booker [20:20] - “You get treated better if you are rich and guilty than if you’re poor and innocent.”
—Cory Booker [21:46] - “My community doesn’t have time to sacrifice progress on the altar of purity. They need help now.”
—Cory Booker [42:46]
Memorable Moments
- Booker’s Candid Story about Republican T-Shirts: Supporters of rival candidates contributing just to keep him in the race, out of decency [08:45].
- Punch-Line Rebuttal: Booker’s refusal to advocate violence against Trump (“that's a felony”) and his explanation of non-violent strategies [09:00].
- Personal Family Story: Detailed account of how his parents, helped by white allies, overcame housing discrimination in New Jersey [12:52].
- Reflection on Political Courage: A lament that “Profiles in Courage is such a thin volume” due to politicians putting jobs before principle [18:28].
Flow & Tone
The conversation is direct, thoughtful, and at times deeply personal. Booker interweaves moral arguments with stories from his life and career. The hosts push for specificity on policy and personal experiences, and Booker responds with both idealism and a pragmatic willingness to engage across divides.
Timestamps for Key Segments
- Opening/Constitutional Crisis: 00:10–02:17
- 2020 Campaign & Electability: 03:17–06:50
- Campaign Endurance: 06:50–08:41
- Rejecting Hatred: 09:45–11:14
- Race & Upbringing Stories: 11:14–17:38
- Partisanship & Republican Decline: 17:40–21:41
- Criminal Justice Reform: 21:41–24:11, 35:55–40:14
- Booker and the Kushners: 24:11–30:44
- Senate Cooperation: 30:44–35:16
- Health Care Debate: 41:05–43:10
This episode provides a multi-dimensional portrait of Cory Booker as a candidate defined by his core values, his life’s narrative, and a hopeful (yet realistic) view of what politics can be, even in divisive times.