Episode Overview

Title: Emily Nussbaum on TV’s “Deluge” of #MeToo Plots
Podcast: The New Yorker Radio Hour
Date: May 31, 2019
Host: David Remnick
Guest: Emily Nussbaum, The New Yorker’s TV Critic

This episode features Emily Nussbaum discussing how the #MeToo movement has transformed the landscape of television storytelling. They explore the prevalence (“deluge”) of #MeToo-related plots in recent TV, examine how different genres engage with the movement, and contemplate the ethical and emotional questions it raises about art, artists, and audience complicity.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

The “Deluge” of #MeToo Plots in TV

• Definition of the “Deluge”:
  Nussbaum frames the #MeToo movement as a pivot not just in industry practice, but in storytelling—hundreds of shows, especially comedies and soap operas, now feature plots about sexual misconduct and systemic complicity (01:07).
• Shift in Narratives:
  Rather than depicting only clear-cut cases of violence, TV has started exploring the gray areas—characters who reflect on their roles in perpetuating or condoning such environments.

Case Studies: Notable Shows Tackling #MeToo

The Good Fight (CBS)

• Example of Direct Industry Critique:
  "After Les Moonves stepped down, The Good Fight ... had an episode in which the much-regarded leader ... turns out to have committed numerous acts of violent sexual harassment... The whole cast, who are sort of our heroes, turn around and basically there’s a fusillade of NDAs, and they’re just trying to shut the whole thing down.” (01:23–02:29)
• Courage in Storytelling:
  David Remnick calls this plot “not without some courage” (03:06).

Tuca and Bertie (Netflix)

• Examining Micro-aggressions and Intergenerational Response:
  Nussbaum describes an animated, friendship-based comedy that deals with ambiguous workplace misconduct and how two characters perceive and handle it differently (03:09–05:07).
• Generational Split:
  Birdie’s guilt over not warning a younger apprentice, highlighting new complexities in conversations around complicity and responsibility (04:44–05:07).

Veep (HBO)

• MeToo as Political Weapon:
  Nussbaum notes that Veep’s central character, Selina Meyer, weaponizes the movement’s language for political gain—blurring sincerity and cynicism (06:22–07:25).
• Prevalence of Dark Humor:
  “There are a lot of shows that are comedies that have attempted to do these kind of dark backwards jokes on the whole thing. And I like a lot of those jokes. I think they’re funny... If all of TV was nothing but jokes about false accusations, that would feel a little ugly, but I don’t think that’s the case.” (07:25–07:45)

High Maintenance (HBO)

• Subtlety and Self-Interrogation:
  Nussbaum praises the show for integrating a #MeToo sub-plot that’s nuanced and understated: a male character confronts a past incident, worried about its possible harm—only to find the woman doesn’t remember it (15:27–17:46).
• Human-Scale Storytelling:
  “It was not only a man grappling with a transgression, but it was also a small story, not a big story... Really the ideal thing about the movement, aside from deposing terrible people... is also having fresh eyes... and try to say something that’s neither simply like go girl, affirmative or kind of a hackneyed gag and actually say something original.” (18:02–18:53)

Comedy vs. Drama: Where #MeToo Is Explored Most

• Why Comedies Lead the Way:
  Nussbaum observes that comedies, soap operas, and workplace sitcoms seem more willing to experiment with #MeToo plots compared to dramas, which often require a degree of sincerity that can be uncomfortable (07:46–08:54).
• The Evolving Workplace Comedy:
  Old sitcoms like Cheers now read differently in a post-#MeToo context. What was once considered flirtatious or romantic may now scan as inappropriate or exploitative, especially to younger audiences (08:54–10:07).

Notable Example: Cheers

• Nussbaum: “The show seems designed to romanticize sexual harassment. That’s an extremely limited and prudish way of looking at Cheers, which is a brilliant sitcom, but it’s hard to ignore that it’s kind of baked into the design of certain shows.” (09:37–09:51)

Audience Reaction and Social Media Backlash

• Controversy Over “Complicated” Narratives:
  Some believe TV should stick to clear-cut stories of villainy, while others (and Nussbaum) value the shows that muddy the waters, inviting self-reflection and grappling with gray areas (05:15–06:11).
• Animated vs. Live-Action:
  Remnick wonders if such plots are less controversial in animation or fiction; Nussbaum points out that these stories surface across formats (06:19–06:22).

Separating Art from the Artist; The Critic’s Dilemma

• Personal Reckoning Amid #MeToo:
  Nussbaum discusses her own struggle as a longtime Woody Allen fan and as a critic forced to reckon with tainted legacies:
  “I mean, this is my role. My role is to engage with art. I feel like I can’t erase art... Without Bill Cosby, it’s very hard to understand things like Black-ish and Atlanta... His role as this prominent male feminist... had this enormous influence on people’s ideas about race, about class...” (13:50–15:00)
• Tainted Cultural Touchstones:
  While she doesn’t object to “cancelled” artists losing their economic power, Nussbaum resists the erasure of problematic yet culturally significant works.

The Limits of “Badass Women” on TV

• Superficial vs. Substantive Representation:
  Nussbaum critiques shows that present one-dimensional, “badass” women as the answer to systemic sexism:
  “The notion of a badass woman on TV is a very boring notion... the way you resolve issues of sexism is to create a kick-ass woman... That’s stupid. That doesn’t make for good art at all.” (12:00–12:13)
• Applauding Fresh, Nuanced Female-Created Shows:
  She applauds series like Fleabag and Broad City for breaking the mold (12:20–12:31).

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Emily Nussbaum on complicity and gray areas (01:07):
  “...What you started seeing were plots that were not so much about acts of sexual violence... but about people considering their own collusion within the larger system.”

• On feminist backlash:
  David Remnick: “There was the MeToo journalism moment... big powerful men doing obviously horrible things are rightly brought low... And then comes [fiction]... in which the terms of complicity and guilt and innocence and responsibility... are much more complicated…” (05:15–06:02)

• On Cheers’ retroactive problematic-ness:
  Emily Nussbaum: “The show seems designed to romanticize sexual harassment... but it’s hard to ignore it’s kind of baked into the design of certain shows.” (09:37–09:51)

• On the new workplace comedy discomfort:
  “I was just watching… Kim’s Convenience… my kid was disturbed that one of the bosses was flirting with one of the employees… he has absorbed the strong message that anybody who does this is being exploitative…” (10:07–10:51)

• On male self-reckoning in High Maintenance:
  “He’s clearly thought about this in a post-MeToo way as ‘Is this the shitty thing that I did that traumatized a woman that I know and that I’m responsible for, and how do I take responsibility for it?’” (17:31–17:46)

• On the value of artistic self-examination:
  “The best shows that are doing this... try to say something that’s neither simply like go girl, affirmative or kind of a hackneyed gag and actually say something original.” (18:42–18:53)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 01:07–03:06: Why TV is flooded with #MeToo-adjacent plots; The Good Fight’s bold episode.
• 03:09–05:07: Tuca and Bertie and micro-complicity; generational responses to misconduct.
• 06:22–07:45: How Veep satirizes #MeToo; comedy as the vanguard.
• 07:46–08:54: Why comedies, not dramas, handle #MeToo more directly.
• 08:54–10:07: Rethinking Cheers and the shifting line between romance and harassment in TV history.
• 12:00–12:31: Critique of “badass” women trope; praise for nuanced female-created shows.
• 13:26–15:17: Separating art from artist; Woody Allen, Bill Cosby, and the critic’s challenge.
• 15:27–17:46: High Maintenance: small, deeply human stories of reckoning.
• 18:02–18:53: The need for artists to have “fresh eyes” and TV’s potential for original thinking on #MeToo.

Conclusion

Emily Nussbaum’s nuanced exploration emphasizes TV’s capacity to process cultural upheaval and foster self-examination—not just through clear-cut stories, but by interrogating gray areas and complicity. She encourages both creators and audiences to approach these stories with nuance and open eyes, rather than seeking simple empowerment or polemic.