The New Yorker Radio Hour

Episode: "New Yorker Writers on Hong Kong, and Nixon After Tiananmen Square"
Host: David Remnick
Date: October 11, 2019

Episode Overview

This episode is divided into two distinct sections.

• First, David Remnick speaks with New Yorker writers Evan Osnos and Jiayang (Jiang) Fan about their recent trips to China and Hong Kong, exploring the emotional tenor, political fallout, and international dimensions of the ongoing Hong Kong protests against Beijing's tightening control.
• Second, the episode turns to an evocative reading of Michael Korda’s 1994 New Yorker essay, “Nixon Mein Host,” recounting a surreal dinner at Richard Nixon’s home just months after the Tiananmen Square massacre, with Nixon acting as an informal, shadow diplomat.

I. Hong Kong Protests and US-China Relations

(00:11–18:31)

Main Topics Covered:

• Emotional climate of the Hong Kong protests
• Composition and motivations of protesters
• Beijing’s perspective and media response
• Fears of a crackdown à la Tiananmen Square
• Surveillance, technology, and protester tactics
• Xi Jinping’s consolidation of power
• Trump’s silence on Hong Kong, and how that's viewed
• How Chinese officials see American politics
• China’s attitude to possible US election outcomes

A. The Mood and Make-up of the Protests

(00:11–03:40)

• Jiang Fan: 80% of protest participants are middle and working class, spanning “from probably 20 to 75” years old.
  • Quote: “They are there to support the freedom that they have understood to be part and parcel of Hong Kong society,” but most resist being labeled “frontline protesters”–those “wearing gas masks, clad in all black” and using extreme measures. (01:24–02:24)
• The movement began with specific demands about extradition, but grievance and anger have grown, especially since the failure of 2014's Umbrella Movement.
  • Quote: “There was just this rising panic that Hong Kong was becoming like another mainland city… under the thumb of the Communist Party.” (02:41–03:38)

B. Views from Beijing

(03:41–06:35)

• Evan Osnos: In Beijing, the protests are “described…as a ‘separatist movement’”—a threat to the integrity of Chinese territory.
  • Quote: “By talking about it as an assault on Chinese territory, that's tapping into a very deep political well.” (04:04–05:10)
• Xi is “unlikely to give in to protesters’ demands,” but faces pressure not to repeat “the events of 1989”—a bloody crackdown would devastate Hong Kong’s economic role and China’s global image.
  • Quote: “China will keep up the pressure and gradually use its sheer weight and persistence to try to grind down the resistance of protesters in Hong Kong.” (05:20–06:35)

C. Fears of a Crackdown and Strategies of Protest

(06:36–09:30)

• Protesters fear possible military intervention, but some younger activists express a “sense of nihilism”—if tanks roll in, let the world see it.
  • Quote: “If the tanks really do roll in, let the world see how brutal the communist regime is.” (06:49–07:38)
• Surveillance is omnipresent; protesters disguise themselves fully, fearing AI might identify them—even by ear shape.
  • Jiang Fan: “They are so fully armored in scarves, masks… even their ears.” (07:51–08:19)
• Osnos: The government optimizes authoritarian control with ubiquitous technology.
  • Quote: "Technology allows that. Now, one of the ways that this government imagines that it's going to try to extend its longevity..." (08:30–09:30)

D. Xi Jinping’s Power and Personality

(09:31–11:03)

• Xi consolidated power through a popular anti-corruption campaign that simultaneously eliminated rivals.
• Cultivated a “cult of personality”: “He thinks that he really is, you know, a national deity. ...Only he can lead the country into super power status.” (09:43–11:03)

E. How Xi Sees Trump, and China's Cynical View of US Politics

(11:04–12:34)

• Osnos: Xi’s style is reticent and strategic; to him, Trump is “utterly mystifying.”
  • Quote: “Xi Jinping has no trust in what Donald Trump tells him. He doesn't trust him on the trade war…." (11:16–12:34)

F. Hong Kong’s Views on Trump’s Silence

(12:35–14:56)

• Protesters wave American flags, hoping for US support—despite knowing Trump ignores human rights issues.
  • Quote Jiang Fan: "All I need is for some of the politicians in Washington to see … how exactly critical the situation is here.” (13:00–13:45)
• Pro-Beijing Hong Kongers are glad Trump doesn't prioritize democracy or human rights; they see Hong Kong as just another bargaining chip.
  • Quote: “Many of the pro Beijing folks I talk to are fairly happy that Trump is in command right now.” (14:09–14:56)

G. China and US Politics

(14:57–18:23)

• China, unlike Russia, prefers to avoid overt US election interference, using intelligence gathered for strategic prediction, not public disruption.
  • Quote Osnos: “China would be much happier to watch the United States go through its own paroxysms of political disorder than to risk...some American backlash by actively intervening.” (15:49–16:51)
• Chinese officials are wary of Democrats like Elizabeth Warren (“someone who will not let China get away with what it does within its borders”) and view Biden as a “known quantity.” Trump confounds them.
  • Jiang Fan: “Elizabeth Warren is someone that China would not want to win the election.” (16:58–17:35)
  • Osnos: “They are at this point totally undone by Donald Trump and they don't really believe that he would be a reliable counterparty.” (17:36–18:23)

II. Richard Nixon, Shadow Statesman After Tiananmen

(20:08–35:31)

Overview:

A dramatized reading from Michael Korda’s account of a stag dinner at Nixon’s New Jersey home in 1989, months after Tiananmen Square, featuring Chinese diplomats and American statesmen. Nixon performs diplomatic theater, downplays the massacre, and seeks continued rapprochement with China.

Key Moments:

A. Nixon’s Persona and Setting

(20:08–21:29)

• Nixon described as larger-than-life, with a “rumbling basso profundo” voice and an imposing presence—even in exile.

B. The Stag Dinner and Ritual

(21:29–25:50)

• The dinner is formal, almost stilted. Guests deliver reports; Nixon responds in monologues, often referring to himself in the third person.
  • Notable Nixon line (performed by Greg Stirling):

  “When Nixon was president and leader of the free world…” (25:50–26:02)

C. The Aftermath of Tiananmen & Nixon’s Shadow Diplomacy

(25:50–29:24)

• The main topic: Should Nixon visit China given the recent massacre?
  • Nixon urges that “great powers cannot allow their foreign policy to be determined by the scruples or prejudices of the liberal media,” minimizing the massacre’s significance.
  • Nixon tells the Chinese:

  “When Nixon was president and leader of the free world, ...we had troubles of our own in the United States. We too had so called student riots, protests, anarchy in the streets of Washington. ...Firmness paid—you tell them that.” (27:37–29:24)

  • The Chinese appreciative; Han Xu raises his glass, thankful for Nixon's “understanding.”

D. Epilogue: Nixon’s Gift and the Illusion of Power

(30:23–35:31)

• Nixon gives Han Xu a copy of Witness by Whittaker Chambers, reinforcing his anti-communist legacy.
• The episode ends with a poignant reflection: Nixon maintains the illusion of being “still the President,” his home styled as an “expensive hotel suite, or...the White House,” with rooms “unlived-in.”
  • Poignant closing image:

    “It was a testimony to Nixon's power that he could make his world, the world of exile, seem more real than the world around him…” (34:24–35:20)

  • Nixon’s last line, on seeing Korda’s Porsche:

  “What the hell is that?” (35:20)

Memorable Quotes

• Jiang Fan, on the mood in Hong Kong:

  “There was just this rising panic that Hong Kong was becoming like another mainland city utterly under the thumb of the Communist Party.” (03:38)

• Evan Osnos, on Beijing’s handling:

  “China will keep up the pressure and gradually use its sheer weight and persistence to try to grind down the resistance of protesters in Hong Kong.” (06:35)

• Jiang Fan, on protesters’ resolve:

  “If the tanks really do roll in, let the world see how brutal the communist regime is.” (06:49)

• Osnos, on Xi Jinping’s perception of Trump:

  “Xi Jinping looks across the table at Donald Trump and finds him utterly mystifying.” (11:16)

• Michael Korda, on Nixon’s shadow presidency:

  “He could make his world, the world of exile, seem more real than the world around him, that he could create somehow the illusion that he was still the President...” (34:24–35:20)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Intro/Context: (00:11–01:24)
• Hong Kong Protests – On the Ground: (01:24–03:38)
• Beijing’s Perception: (04:04–06:35)
• Protester Fears, Surveillance, Tactics: (06:36–09:30)
• Xi Jinping Consolidates Power: (09:31–11:03)
• Trump, US Politics, and China’s Response: (11:04–18:23)
• Michael Korda Essay – Nixon After Tiananmen: (20:08–35:31)

Tone and Language

• The tone is analytical yet accessible, with vivid narrative touches especially in the Nixon segment.
• Both Osnos and Fan deliver nuanced, firsthand reportage, often amplifying the voices and anxieties of those on the ground.
• Nixon’s segment is gently satirical but deeply revealing, painted with Korda’s literary flair and performed with dry wit.

Summary Takeaway

This episode provides a sweeping look at the crisis in Hong Kong and its global reverberations—from the street-level fear and anger among Hong Kongers, through the closed-circle calculations in Beijing, to the confusion of US-China relations in the Trump era. The Nixon segment offers a darkly comic, insightful window into the foreign-policy “afterlife” of America’s ex-presidents, and how history’s strongmen—East and West—frame the question of “firmness” after political violence. The episode is a rare blend of reportage, analysis, and literary portraiture, capturing the complexity and contradictions of US-China engagement past and present.