The Next Level Podcast – Episode Summary

Episode Title: Trump CRIES Over Crab Legs! RICO Against PROTESTERS?! Free Speech Is DEAD!
Date: September 18, 2025
Hosts: Sarah Longwell, Tim Miller, Jonathan V. Last (JVL)
Podcast: The Next Level (The Bulwark)
Featured Topics: Trump’s RICO threats, free speech, cancel culture, conspiracy thinking, TikTok deal, political corruption, the Manchin interview, and more.

Episode Overview

This episode combines The Next Level crew’s signature sharp political insight and humor to dissect several of the week’s top stories and cultural flashpoints. The panel takes on Trump’s latest free speech contretemps—including his legal team floating RICO charges against protesters—forays into conspiracy thinking around recent political violence, and a deep dive into the increasing intersection of corruption, media capture, and democracy’s erosion in America. The hosts also reflect on the implications of the Trump administration’s moves with TikTok and other media assets. A notable segment unpacks Tim Miller’s controversial interview with Joe Manchin, followed by a candid discussion about voters, culture, race, and the intractable divides shaping politics in 2025.

Key Themes & Discussion Points

1. Trump, Protesters & RICO: The Criminalization of Dissent

• Todd Blanche’s CNN Interview (01:47–04:48)
  • Trump’s lawyer Todd Blanche suggests RICO charges could be levied against four women who protested Trump at Joe Stone Crab, arguing their actions might be an “organized effort to inflict harm and terror.”
  • Quote:
    • Todd Blanche: “So is it...sheer happenstance that individuals show up at a restaurant where the President is trying to enjoy dinner...and accost him with vile words and vile anger...To the extent that it's part of an organized effort...there’s potential investigations there.” (01:47)
• Hosts’ Reactions:
  • Sarah lambasts the absurdity of conflating organized protest with racketeering, contrasting it with actual organized crime like the Epstein case (04:00–04:26).
  • Tim jokes, “That’s racketeering now? Having a text chain with your other lady friends about where you’re going to protest?” (04:00)
  • General consensus: These charges are a mockery of both free speech and the legal standards underpinning RICO.

2. Free Speech Hypocrisy and Cancel Culture on the Right

• Pam Bondi, Hate Speech, and Selective Outrage (12:17–14:51)
  • The right is trolling the line between performative outrage at “hate speech” and total silence when Trump attacks free speech.
  • Quote:
    • Sarah Longwell: “I've been sort of disappointed with the way they're performatively going after Bondi while performatively ignoring Donald Trump doing it.” (13:36)
• Right-Wing Cancel Culture:
  • Tim and JVL note the active campaigns within right-wing circles to dox and cost people their jobs for innocuous commentary, even as the right decries ‘woke’ cancel culture (14:33–15:58).
  • “I don't see any backlash to the right-wing cancel culture campaign, which is running rampant in the country right now…” – Tim (14:51)

3. Conspiracies & Social Media: The Charlie Kirk Case

• Conspiratorial Thinking after the Kirk Assassination (25:13–37:56)
  • The hosts discuss wild theories circulating online about text messages between the Kirk shooter and a trans roommate, and the general public’s distrust of official investigations.
  • Quote:
    • Tim Miller: “For them all to get together and decide to fabricate text messages and put it into charging documents, knowing that the shooter that is being prosecuted would know that they were fake? That is crazy.” (28:29)
  • JVL & Sarah point out these narratives are fueled by both left and right, rooted in distrust of the justice system and a fractured media environment.

4. Media, Corruption, and the TikTok Deal

• Trump Allies, Media Buyouts, and the Demise of Neutral Platforms (42:02–49:56)
  • The episode details Trump’s move to confer TikTok and other major media assets to loyal supporters amid an ignored law mandating TikTok’s sale under specific terms.
  • Quotes:
    • JVL: “[The] law just got sort of lost when Donald Trump became president and it didn’t matter...now he’s going to get the deal he wants.” (43:23)
    • Tim Miller: “A bunch of Trump acolytes who have financial stake in his political success now owning the biggest technology platforms...I find that all deeply alarming.” (44:39)
  • The panel draws direct lines to ‘Orban-style’ illiberalism, pointing out how American right-wing figures are capturing and transforming major media organizations for narrative dominance.

5. Voters, Hypocrisy, and the Limits of Political Accountability

• Pennsylvania Farmers and Immigration (57:31–66:15)
  • JVL reads from a Politico piece about Pennsylvania dairy farmers—a microcosm of voters whose livelihoods are harmed by Trump-era immigration enforcement but who refuse to blame him or change their support.
  • Sarah notes Hispanic Trump voters expressing regret, but unwilling to switch to Kamala Harris, illustrating calcified partisanship and sunk-cost dynamics (61:21).
  • Tim points out the selective enforcement and lack of accountability for employers who knowingly skirt immigration laws (63:53).

6. Tim’s Joe Manchin Interview: Outrage and Introspection

• Audience Reaction and Manchin’s West Virginia Obfuscation (68:45–83:23)
  • The Joe Manchin interview generated record “thumbs down” on YouTube, sparking reflection on Manchin’s political approach and realism about Dems’ prospects in places like West Virginia.
  • Quotes:
    • JVL: “I thought [Manchin] illuminated a man who is very truth averse...and who has an unbelievably low opinion of the people from his state.” (73:20)
    • Tim: “At the end I was kind of like, I don't know what the answer is...I don't know that me or Joe Manchin has any great idea for how Democrats can do better in West Virginia.” (79:02)
  • The discussion: Dems’ disconnect with non-college-educated whites, the political futility in states like WV, and the cultural gulf between red America and the Democratic Party’s national brand.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On RICO absurdity and protest:
  “Donald Trump is the biggest baby in the entire world...Also, RICO, for four individuals? What does that even mean? Did they organize? Probably. They probably texted each other and said, let’s go to Joe Stone Crab and tell the President that we want to Free Palestine.” – Sarah Longwell (03:14)
• On free speech double standards:
  “This is a campaign to chill people's speech and to target them and to go after people and to punish them. So like I hear you on like doctors shouldn't be cheering people's deaths...but that's not what this is...” – Tim Miller (18:48)
• On social media and conspiracy: “The Charlie Kirk assassination cheering was happening to me at in person from several people...These text messages theories...I've seen express that view that like these aren't real, this is some op...” – Tim Miller (25:40)
• On the TikTok/Orban analogy:
  “It is Orban style. This is the problem that people, myself among them, initially evaluated the Twitter sale as a business proposition when it isn’t. It’s a fascist proposition.” – JVL (48:48)
• On voter self-delusion:
  “You want them to say, I touched the stove...but you want them to say, Donald Trump, why did you force me to touch that stove?” – Sarah Longwell (62:56)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• RICO Threats and Protesters – 01:47–05:32
• Free Speech, Cancel Culture, and Legal Absurdity – 09:19–16:29
• Charlie Kirk Assassination & Conspiracies – 25:13–37:56
• Media Ownership and Corruption (TikTok, CBS, X/Twitter) – 42:02–49:56
• Farmers, Immigration, and Political Accountability – 57:36–66:15
• Joe Manchin Interview Debrief & The Fate of Dems in Red America – 68:45–87:01

Tone & Style

• The panel’s tone is irreverent, sardonic, and at times darkly comic—balancing exasperation with the absurdity of current politics and moments of genuine insight.
• The discussion features frank language and pointed jabs at both Republican hypocrisy and Democratic ineffectiveness.
• Throughout, the conversation remains fast-moving, witty, and layered with in-jokes for longtime listeners.

For New Listeners

This episode is a fishbowl of American political dysfunction in 2025, capturing both the surreal absurdities and the real stakes. If you want a mix of cathartic laughter, sharp critique, and hard realities about free speech, political corruption, and the limits of democratic accountability, this is an essential listen.