Podcast Summary: The Next Level – “Secret Podcast: Would You Trust These Idiots With a War?”
Podcast: The Next Level
Host: The Bulwark (Sarah Longwell, Tim Miller, Jonathan V. Last [JVL])
Episode: 1063: Secret Podcast: Would You Trust These Idiots With a War?
Date: March 13, 2026
Episode Overview
In this episode, Sarah Longwell and Jonathan V. Last (JVL) dive into the current state of U.S. leadership during wartime, reflecting anxiously (and wryly) on the nation’s decision-makers and their competence in handling the ongoing Iran conflict. Their conversation ranges over political leadership, the gravity of historical moments, echoes from WWII, and the difference between true statesmanship and what they perceive as today’s unserious “video game” approach to war. The Bulwark hosts also orbit around topics like community, recent book endeavors, and the challenges of leadership both at home and on the global stage.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
Community Appreciation and Book News
[02:00–08:36]
- Sarah thanks the Bulwark community for their support with her new book’s preorders and answers listener questions:
- Yes, Audible and eBook sales count towards totals.
- She will narrate her own audiobook and go on a book tour.
- She’s exploring signed copies and book plates for supporters.
- JVL offers to voice quotes for the audiobook (collector’s edition) and to read his foreword.
- Both express genuine, affectionate camaraderie and humor about ongoing projects and their loyal podcast audience.
- Sarah: “I appreciate the way that people in this community show up. …Even if you only ordered the book with no intention of reading it, just because you’re desperate for JBL to moderate a focus group, that’s okay.” [02:28]
Notable Quote:
Sarah Longwell [07:00]: “So many of these conversations are love letters between The Bulwark and the Bulwark community, which is true. But I’ve always had the belief that part of the reason that we have a community is because we are a community, like among ourselves. Like, we are close.”
Reflections on Leadership in Wartime
[09:44–13:30]
- Comparison of current leaders to historical figures:
- Sarah recounts watching the recent “Nuremberg” and “Darkest Hour” films, admiring figures like Churchill who deeply understood the weight of history and human life.
- Sarah [12:31]: “The human elements of what allowed Nazism to happen echo throughout the modern times.”
- She contrasts this with the “gamification” in modern military decision-making, referencing U.S. government social media posts that trivialize war using video game footage.
- JVL [14:37]: “Stomach turning. …It’d be terrible if it was 4chan, but it’s not. It’s people, government payroll coming out under the aegis of the United States government.”
- Sarah recounts watching the recent “Nuremberg” and “Darkest Hour” films, admiring figures like Churchill who deeply understood the weight of history and human life.
Notable Quote:
Sarah Longwell [15:00]: “Great people hold the profound responsibility of other human lives on their hearts…comparing it to the people we have now who treat this like an actual video game…Trump himself doesn’t have the thing where he says, I take the lives of your sons and daughters so seriously that I will only put them in harm's way for the absolute necessity of the survival of our country.”
Critique of Current U.S. Leadership
[17:03–20:58]
- JVL and Sarah lament the lack of seriousness and gravitas in those currently handling U.S. war policy, especially after recent military casualties:
- JVL [17:03]: “What he [Trump] said after the first casualties is like, ‘It’s war, it happens.’”
- Sarah [17:35]: “Real leaders…take the lives that they put on the line for things with a sense of solemn enormity. And he [Trump] doesn’t care at all.”
- JVL describes the perverse logic and incompetence surrounding oil prices and Middle East policy, expressing confusion over shifting narratives and priorities.
- JVL [19:14]: “If high oil prices are good, shouldn’t we have precipitated the closure of the Strait of Hormuz, like, on January 21?”
- Sarah [19:14]: “Why has he been bragging about gas prices going down if we were supposed to have them…go up?”
War with Iran: Escalation, Competence, and Consequences
[20:58–29:06]
- JVL assumed Trump would negotiate a short war with Iran for political gain, but new developments suggest a longer, more chaotic conflict is likely.
- Sarah articulates why she always doubted a quick withdrawal: once conflict begins, events spiral, local resistance grows, and “your enemy gets a vote.” Every misstep compounds the quagmire.
- Sarah [23:16]: “With…different people, [I] might be able to get on board…But…I do not understand how people who understand that our government has been lying from top to bottom about absolutely everything…[would] trust these same people to execute a war.”
- Sarah [24:49]: “…Imagine trying a case now where you’ve already signaled to the public, we know we don’t have a case, but just because Trump is mad about it, you have to go forward. That’s the level of competence of the people waging this war.”
- JVL points out that warnings about Iran’s proven doctrine—closing the Strait of Hormuz in response to U.S. aggression—were ignored by planners, implying severe incompetence.
- JVL [28:28]: “The idea that you could be blindsided by this is insane…It’s like I went up to a crocodile and I stuck my hand in its mouth and he bit me. And who could possibly have known?”
The Broader, Interconnected Consequences
[26:53–27:40]
- The war is now affecting global oil markets, the stock market, and U.S. relations with Russia and Ukraine—each thread pulling on the next, destabilizing more than just the Middle East.
- Sarah [26:53]: “It’s now having real consequences. This Strait of Hormuz thing is…now going to be a global kind of problem. It’s affecting our relationships with…Russia, which is also impacting then how things are with Ukraine. Like, yeah, these things are all connected.”
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
- On seriousness in wartime leadership:
- Sarah Longwell [15:00]: “Comparing it to the people we have now who treat this like an actual video game…Trump himself doesn’t have the thing…that I will only put [soldiers] in harm's way for the absolute necessity of the survival of our country.”
- On government competence:
- Sarah Longwell [24:49]: “Imagine trying a case now where you’ve already signaled to the public, we know we don’t have a case, but just because Trump is mad about it, you have to go forward. That’s the level of competence of the people waging this war.”
- On the Iran conflict spiral:
- JVL [28:28]: “The idea that you could be blindsided by this is insane. …It's like I went up to a crocodile and I stuck my hand in its mouth and he bit me. And who could possibly have known?”
- On gratitude for community:
- Sarah Longwell [02:28]: “I appreciate the way that people in this community show up. …Even if you only ordered the book with no intention of reading it, just because you’re desperate for JBL to moderate a focus group, that’s okay.”
Important Timestamps for Key Segments
- [02:00] – Sarah expresses gratitude for her book’s support, answers listener questions, promises a book tour/audiobook.
- [06:32] – Discussion of mutual appreciation, Bulwark community’s closeness, signed copies.
- [09:44] – JVL articulates horror at today’s military leaders in press conferences.
- [11:12] – Sarah relates WWII films to present, reflects on difference between historical seriousness and current superficiality.
- [14:30] – JVL and Sarah on trivialization of war in U.S. official communications.
- [17:03] – Compare Trump’s lack of gravity to historical leaders, seriousness about loss of life.
- [20:58] – JVL questions his original assumption about a short U.S.–Iran war.
- [23:16] – Sarah’s skepticism about trusting current leadership with war, referencing administrative chaos and incompetence.
- [26:53] – Global impacts of the Iran conflict on markets and alliances.
- [28:28] – Inevitable escalation and the ignored warnings about the Strait of Hormuz.
- [29:40] – End of main conversation and lead into additional content.
Final Thoughts
This episode captures The Bulwark team’s blend of biting political analysis, historical perspective, and gallows humor. The hosts’ deep unease with the abilities—and priorities—of today’s war planners is matched only by their affection and gratitude for their engaged podcast audience. Listeners are left with haunting questions about leadership, responsibility, and the lessons (ignored or forgotten) of history.