Podcast Summary: The Next Level – "Live in Chicago! Pardons, Authoritarianism, and Xanax"

Release Date: May 29, 2025
Host: Sarah Longwell, Tim Miller, and Jonathan V. Last (JVL)
Live Recording: Chicago

Introduction

In this dynamic live episode of The Next Level podcast, hosts Sarah Longwell, Tim Miller, and Jonathan V. Last engage in a spirited discussion centered on recent political developments, particularly focusing on presidential pardons, emerging authoritarian trends, and their implications for American democracy. The conversation is laced with sharp political insight, humor, and candid banter, providing listeners with a comprehensive analysis of the current political climate.

1. Trump's Pardons and Authoritarian Actions

The episode kicks off with an in-depth examination of the series of pardons issued by former President Donald Trump. The hosts express concern over the nature and implications of these pardons, highlighting specific cases:

• Congressman Michael Grimm: "He may have done some light tax evasion, and he also assaults somebody. Had served seven months in prison. But he has been pardoned..." ([04:00] Sarah Longwell)

• Sheriff Scott Jennings: Tim Miller remarks on Jennings' corruption, stating, "all he did was take $75,000 in bribes, give people no-show jobs as deputy sheriffs" ([05:18] Sarah Longwell).

• Paul Walzack: The discussion points out Walzack's financial misconduct and subsequent pardon: "he withheld $10 million from the paychecks of employees and stole money and used it to buy a $2 million yacht" ([06:21] Sarah Longwell).

The conversation intensifies as JVL introduces the potential pardon of Gretchen Whitmer's kidnappers, underscoring the alarming trend of pardoning individuals involved in egregious offenses:
"He says he's gonna pardon Gretchen Whitmer's kidnappers... you can do it in your Fog Horn Leghorn voice." ([07:10] JVL)

2. Analysis of Marco Rubio's Policies

The hosts turn their attention to Senator Marco Rubio, dissecting his recent actions and policies that they perceive as authoritarian:

• Tim Miller critiques Rubio's approach to gun control:
  "He said that he was worried that Biden was coming for the guns. And it was the only way that he could arm people in his community by making different." ([06:05] Tim Miller)

• JVL humorously contrasts Rubio with other political figures, emphasizing Rubio's extensive roles:
  "He's got like six jobs now because they keep giving him. He's the archivist. Yeah, I mean he's gonna be president soon if they just keep giving him new jobs." ([11:30] JVL)

The discussion highlights concerns about Rubio's alignment with authoritarian tactics and his impact on democratic institutions.

3. Threats to the Rule of Law and Media Integrity

A significant portion of the episode delves into the erosion of judicial independence and media integrity:

• JVL expresses alarm over media companies caving to corporate mergers, which he believes undermine civil society:
  "Media companies cave because they've got a merger. She just wants to do a Paramount merger and get it done. That to me, is a real threat to civil society." ([16:35] JVL)

• The hosts discuss the "chilling effect" on law firms and the broader legal system, emphasizing the subtle undermining of democratic checks and balances:
  "The law firms that are supposed to be the backbone, like the judges are having to do it while the lawyers are caving. They're the instruments of the rule of law, which is sort of the last bastion where these democratic institutions are holding." ([17:00] JVL)

4. Democratic Strategies and Challenges

The conversation shifts to the Democratic Party's struggle to formulate effective strategies in response to rising authoritarianism:

• Tim Miller advocates for a "hard reset" of Democratic strategies, emphasizing the need for a radical change:
  "I think that the Democrats need like a hard reset... something that's very fucking different. It is not... a plan to be like, well, hopefully Donald Trump puts us into a great Depression and then whatever governor we put up ends up winning by accident." ([53:31] Tim Miller)

• JVL critiques the current Democratic approach, urging for proactive and imaginative strategies to regain political ground:
  "The Democrats got to reach them. And they're going to have to do it, like being very creative and different and doing totally different types of stuff than they've ever done before." ([55:38] JVL)

• The hosts also discuss the importance of honesty and accountability within the Democratic leadership, suggesting that transparency could pave the way for rebuilding trust:
  "If he [Joe Biden] did that, we would be in a much different place because he would give permission to the party to say, we're moving on." ([47:00] JVL)

5. Audience Interaction and Future Outlook

Engaging the live audience, the hosts introduce a segment where they debate the "worst cabinet secretary" based on current administration performance. This playful yet pointed segment underscores their critique of governmental leadership:

• JVL nominates Pam Bondi, criticizing her on legal outcomes:
  "She has lost 93% of the cases that they have brought or the defenses that they've brought up trying to defend Donald Trump." ([32:07] JVL)

• Tim Miller counters by highlighting Howard Nutlik's ineffectiveness:
  "Commerce Secretary Howard Nutlik... You can't do it. I'm not going to embarrass you on stage." ([33:00] Tim Miller)

The hosts conclude with a forward-looking perspective on combating authoritarianism:

• Sarah Longwell emphasizes the importance of collective action and using one's voice:
  "Make a TikTok about why what Donald Trump is doing is destroying the country. Everybody's gonna have to use their voice." ([60:11] Sarah Longwell)

• Tim Miller advocates for shaming those who undermine democratic principles and calls for strategic resistance:
  "We should shame people who are caving. We should not just let people cave and be like, man, you know, now." ([60:06] Tim Miller)

Conclusion

The episode wraps up with an emphasis on resilience and proactive engagement in preserving democratic values. The hosts call for listeners to stand against authoritarianism by actively participating in political discourse, supporting rule of law, and holding leaders accountable. They highlight the significance of community support and individual action in fostering a robust democratic society.

Notable Quotes:

• "That's allowed." – Tim Miller discussing his use of strong language on air ([02:28] Tim Miller)

• "People should do what Adam says and push back." – Tim Miller on combating authoritarianism ([60:06] Tim Miller)

• "The whole point of authoritarianism is to make you tired. It's the reason that they do the shock and awe." – Sarah Longwell on the tactics of authoritarian regimes ([61:39] Sarah Longwell)

Key Takeaways:

• Presidential Pardons as Authoritarian Tools: The use of pardons to absolve politically connected individuals raises alarms about the erosion of accountability and the strengthening of authoritarian practices.

• Media and Legal Institutions Under Threat: Media companies' willingness to merge and law firms' reluctance to take certain cases threaten the integrity of democratic institutions.

• Urgent Need for Democratic Reset: The Democratic Party must adopt innovative and bold strategies to counteract authoritarian tendencies and regain political influence.

• Collective Action Against Authoritarianism: Active participation, accountability, and strategic resistance are essential in combating the slow encroachment of authoritarianism in American politics.

For more insightful discussions and political analysis, tune into the next episode of The Next Level.