The Next Level Podcast: “Propaganda With OUR Money! Young SICKOS in the Chat! GOP Is SCARED of No Kings!”

Hosts: Jonathan V. Last (JVL), Sarah Longwell, Tim Miller – The Bulwark
Date: October 15, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode dives into the political climate 10 months into Trumpism's resurgence, focusing on government propaganda, the upcoming “No Kings” protests, radicalization among young Republican operatives, and Democratic primary controversies. The hosts use their signature banter and insight to explore how political messaging, generational divides, and the state of democracy are shaping America's future.

Main Discussion Points and Insights

1. The “No Kings” Protests and GOP Reaction

• Framing and Government Response

  • The upcoming nationwide “No Kings” protests, designed as peaceful demonstrations by a coalition of concerned citizens, are facing aggressive propaganda from GOP officials, labeling them as “Antifa” or even “terrorists.”
  • The President’s executive order classifying ANTIFA as a domestic terrorist group has escalated the rhetoric, with fears GOP messaging is a pretext for law enforcement crackdown.
  • Sarah: "Mike Johnson wants America to believe that it is terrorists, that it is antifa, that it’s a bunch of young thugs in masks...and we want to make it clear. No, it is Normie adults who want to take their country back...especially people who are on the older side..." [04:18]
  • Emphasis from the hosts that real protesters are older, “salt of the earth” citizens, not the dangerous radicals portrayed by right-wing media.

• On the Impact of Propaganda

  • The hosts discuss “information warfare” and the GOP's desire to sow anxiety and delegitimize opposition.
  • Tim: "Their messaging is backfiring ... there's a backlash effect to this stuff... engaging more people than would have been engaged otherwise." [05:43]
  • The “Streisand effect”: GOP attempts to demonize the protests may actually mobilize more opposition and visibility.

• Security Concerns and the Chicago Factor

  • JVL raises concern about the potential for violence, particularly in Chicago, and whether the administration might use incidents as pretext for crackdown.
  • Tim: "We have a lot of one-off crazy people with easy access to weapons in this country...obviously you have to be vigilant about one-offs, but I don't know what can be done about that really." [10:47]
  • Sarah: No Kings organizers and participants have been consistently nonviolent and disciplined, not falling for state provocations.

• On Sustaining Protest Movements

  • Hosts note the No Kings strategy of spacing out protests to maintain energy and significance.
  • JVL: “We are only ten months into Trumpism ... it’s still a full year until the 2026 elections.” [13:11]
  • Sarah: "No Kings ... gives you a container outside of an election to demonstrate how big the opposition is." [13:43]
  • Debate on optimism (people have agency) vs. fatalism (inevitable slide to authoritarianism).

2. Government Propaganda and Misuse of Public Funds

• Innovation—Or Illegality?

  • Administrations have always done some version of government messaging, but soaring federal political ad spending (notably via Kristi Noem) has reached new heights—$51 million—blurred with re-election and partisan propaganda.
  • Sarah: "This is political propaganda that your taxpayers are funding...It should not be legal." [18:02]
  • Hosts strongly distinguish between public service announcements (PSAs) for programs (e.g., ACA rollouts) vs. ads directly boosting politicians.

• Corruption and Cronyism

  • Kristi Noem and allies (notably Corey Lewandowski) are shown to have doled out large ad contracts to connected firms.
  • Tim: "The swamp. It's unimaginably swampy. The amount of money that's sloshing around." [22:00]
  • ICE’s budget explosion cited as an example of federal agencies awash with cash being used not just for policy, but also personnel enrichment and propaganda.

• Will This Endure?

  • JVL: “Is there any reason that this won’t just become standard practice from here on out?” [23:46]
  • Hosts debate whether this is a uniquely Trumpian phenomenon or will become bipartisan “new normal” if not checked by law or future political will.
  • Tim: "The level of shamelessness of Trump...is a superpower. ... But one of the ideas...that’s a path out is that somebody’s like, man, somebody has an actual mandate to clean shit up." [25:34]

3. Exposing Extremism Among "Young Sickos" on the Right

• Politico Leak and Culture Analysis

  • A bombshell Politico piece exposes Telegram chats among young GOP functionaries, full of racist, misogynistic, and neo-Nazi rhetoric.
  • JVL: “It’s the kind of thing where ... I would encourage people to go read the piece ... there is so much stuff that you can't forking believe.” [29:50]
  • Rather than fringe outcasts, these are rising party insiders, many employed or seeking offices.

• Generational Trumpism

  • The hosts grapple with what it means that the rising generation in the GOP has only known “the fever” of Trumpism—and has normalized radical rhetoric and beliefs.
  • JVL: “These people ... have never really known anything but the fever. ... This is just like their mother’s milk.” [31:18]

• Equivalency Debates & Political Culture

  • Discussion of current violence, toxic rhetoric, and the distinction between online randos, elected officials, and candidates who indulge such attitudes.
  • Sarah: “These are not, you know, people outside the establishment. This is firmly ... the YRs ... This is their culture.” [32:00]
  • Tim: "The culture of like encouraging it ... it's a sign of weakness to not participate." [40:32]
  • Hosts connect this to broader themes of dehumanization, social media toxicity, and a right-wing feedback loop that now rewards open bigotry.

• Best Case Scenario for the Right?

  • JVL: "Are we going to wind up with an entire generation for whom this stuff is what politics is?" [41:33]
  • Tim: "Yes." [41:45]
  • A sober acknowledgment that, even if the figure of Trump eventually fades, his movement's culture is now thoroughly embedded in the party's next generation.

4. Democratic Primaries & The Gerontocracy Debate

• Maine and Michigan Senate Races

  • Maine’s race: Governor Janet Mills, 77, jumps in, promising only one term. "Outsider" Graham Platner, a progressive oysterman focused on rural health care, is challenging from the left.
  • Sarah: “My main take is Democratic primary, good. Let's kick the tires on Platner ... I'm anti-down with the gerontocracy, and I think that the DNC needs to freshen itself up..." [45:24]
  • Michigan: The DSCC’s (Senate committee) attempt to clear the field for Haley Stevens against another high-energy challenger, Mallory McMorrow, disappoints the panel.
  • Tim: "What the DSCC is doing ... is insane and is probably going to backfire." [48:00]

• Lessons from GOP Tea Party Era

  • Tim ties these tactics to past GOP establishment failures to suppress the Tea Party, arguing that party interference hurts credibility and voter enthusiasm.

5. The Politics of Affordability, Populism, and the “Socialist” Question

• Platner’s Message in Maine

  • Platner’s rural populism focuses on universal health care, fighting local hospital closures, and taxing tech oligarchs—potentially tapping into an anti-AI elite zeitgeist.
  • JVL: “If the AI bubble bursts ... talking about the AI tech oligarchs is going to be a very politically appealing message." [56:18]
  • Sarah: “Politics right now is ... social moderation to conservatism and economic populism. The number one thing ... is affordability, not income inequality, affordability.” [57:13]
  • Affordability—especially health care costs—is central, and Democrats ignoring it cedes the issue to the socialist left.

• The Limits of Socialist Messaging

  • Tim notes Maine’s uniqueness (economically populist, socially liberal), warning that Platner’s success shouldn’t be over-generalized for national strategy.
  • Sarah: "If Democrats and centrists ... don’t focus on affordability, then the socialists will win." [62:09]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On GOP Propaganda Backfiring:
  Tim Miller:

  “I think that their messaging is backfiring...there’s a backlash effect to this stuff...I reject the idea that we’re a dictatorship now. He’s trying, he’s trying, but like now is the moment to fight it.” [05:43]

• On Optimism versus Fatalism:
  Sarah Longwell:

  “Naivete is thinking that everything will just work out. Optimism is understanding that people have agency and can make choices and that there is opportunity to win." [14:31]

• On Kristi Noem’s Propaganda Machine:
  Sarah Longwell:

  "This is political propaganda that your taxpayers are funding. It should not be legal. It should not be done." [18:02]

• On Young Right-Wing Radicalism:
  JVL:

  “These people have never really known anything but the fever. They don’t see it as like the temperature. This is just like their mother’s milk. And I don’t know how you get to places where everything goes back to normal when the whole rising generation sees this as normal.” [31:18]

• On DSCC Backing Gerontocracy:
  Sarah Longwell:

  “I'm anti-down with the gerontocracy, and I think that the DNC needs to freshen itself up in terms of what it's allowing through the races.” [45:31]

• On Populism vs. Socialism:
  Sarah Longwell:

  "If Democrats ... don't focus on affordability, then the socialists will win." [62:09]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• No Kings Protest, Propaganda, & Security Concerns: [00:55]–[13:20]
• Sustaining Mobilization and the Value of Protest: [12:57]–[15:15]
• Government Propaganda Discussion (Kristi Noem, ICE): [16:32]–[26:50]
• Young Republican Telegram Leak / Sickos Chat: [28:41]–[41:45]
• Democratic Senate Primaries & Gerontocracy: [43:09]–[51:46]
• Platner, Health Care Populism, & The Socialist Question: [53:57]–[62:09]

Tone, Banter, and Final Takeaways

The hosts maintain their trademark witty, analytical banter—oscillating between grave concerns about democracy and bursts of humor (asides about fanny packs, protests, and deodorant sponsors). While they are alarmed by trends in both parties (GOP radicalization, Democratic complacency), they repeatedly circle back to the importance of agency, the power of protest, and the need for political actors to genuinely connect with the anxieties of real people.

Show’s last word — Sarah:

“If Democrats and centrists ... don’t focus on affordability, then the socialists will win. My advice to Democrats is to focus on affordability because this is what voters broadly care about.” [62:09]

Summary prepared for listeners seeking a comprehensive, digestible overview of the episode’s content and argumentation.