Podcast Summary: The Next Level – "This Is How They Get Away with It (The Secret Podcast Preview)"

Podcast Information:

• Title: The Next Level
• Host/Author: The Bulwark
• Description: Sarah Longwell, Tim Miller, and Jonathan V. Last bring their signature political insight and banter to the masses in The Next Level podcast. Tune in to hear them discuss the news of the week, break down campaigns and elections, and wade into pop culture feuds.
• Episode: This Is How They Get Away with It (The Secret Podcast Preview)
• Release Date: December 13, 2024

Introduction

In the December 13, 2024 episode of The Next Level, hosts Sarah Longwell and Host 2 delve into the contentious intersection of politics and public health, focusing primarily on Robert F. Kennedy Jr.'s stance on vaccines and his influence within the political arena. The discussion unfolds against the backdrop of RFK Jr.'s appearance at the New York Times Dealbook Summit and the broader implications for the Republican Party and American society.

RFK Jr. and the Vaccine Controversy

[01:31] Discussion on RFK Jr.'s Position: Sarah Longwell questions the seriousness of taking RFK Jr. as a political figure, especially concerning his anti-vaccine stance. Host 2 references a New York Times headline detailing RFK Jr.'s lawyer petitioning to revoke the polio vaccine approval, labeling his actions as "nuisance lawsuits" aimed at vaccine skeptics.

Host 2 [03:16]: "This basically he just does nuisance lawsuits for people who hate vaccines."

Sarah emphasizes the importance of vaccines as a medical marvel, countering RFK Jr.'s skepticism.

Sarah Longwell [03:35]: "One of the great medical marvels of the 20th century."

RFK Jr.'s Political Influence and Potential Cabinet Role

[05:22] Theoretical Republican Challenge: Sarah discusses RFK Jr.'s potential impact if he were to run as a Republican, positing that he could challenge Donald Trump effectively within the party.

Sarah Longwell [06:20]: "You have to see like Tulsi, RFK Jr., Pete Hegseth, and Cash Patel all need to not be in the Cabinet."

She argues that figures like RFK Jr. should not be confirmed for cabinet positions, stressing the need to protect the integrity of political appointments.

[07:57] Anti-Vaccine as a Cultural Marker: The conversation shifts to whether anti-vaccine sentiment will become entrenched as a cultural identity marker within Republicanism.

Host 2 [08:07]: "Cause I think it's gonna become part of party orthodoxy that vaccines are bad."

Sarah acknowledges the fragmentation of traditional political ideologies, noting that vaccine denialism has become intertwined with Republican identity.

Sarah Longwell [08:54]: "The extent to which it looks totally different now, populated by different people."

Federalism and State Rights in Public Health Policy

[16:48] Role of Blue States: Sarah explores the concept of federalism as a potential avenue to mitigate national divisions, suggesting that blue states might assume responsibility for vaccine administration to protect their residents.

Sarah Longwell [16:48]: "There needs to be, like, other states yet. State. Blue states are going to have to step up."

She highlights the complexities of this approach, including economic dependencies and the challenges of population movement.

COVID-19 Pandemic and Vaccine Backlash

[22:06] Impact of COVID Vaccine Mandates: The hosts discuss how COVID-19 vaccine mandates have fueled current anti-vaccine sentiments, with Host 2 expressing frustration over the politicization of public health measures.

Host 2 [23:55]: "Trump politicized Covid, he politicized the vaccines... it's here particularly because of this guy."

Sarah reflects on the societal "snapbacks" resulting from pandemic policies and the cyclical rejection of incumbents.

Sarah Longwell [23:52]: "I do think we are experiencing a snapback right now from... Now we don't like Joe Biden. We have a snap back, back to Donald Trump."

Government Funding and Political Accountability

[25:13] Government Funding Standoff: Sarah critiques the Republican leadership's unwillingness to fund the government, attributing real consequences to this stance. She argues that Democrats should negotiate more effectively rather than refuse to govern.

Sarah Longwell [26:55]: "Republicans that they elected, we have to honor the fact that they are the people who were elected by letting them do the things that they want to do."

Host 2 concurs, advocating for Democrats to fully oppose Republican governance tactics.

Host 2 [26:50]: "I could not agree with you more."

Strategic Approaches to Polarization

[28:43] Consequences of Non-Intervention: The hosts debate the morality and practicality of allowing extreme factions to face the consequences of their actions, with Host 2 leaning towards a realpolitik approach that accepts some level of societal harm as a trade-off for addressing extremism.

Host 2 [28:43]: "Yes, granted."

Sarah counters by emphasizing the shared responsibility and unintended consequences of political division.

Sarah Longwell [29:25]: "The people that are exposed to danger didn't all ask for that danger."

Conclusion

The episode concludes with reflections on the deep-seated divisions within American politics, the role of influential figures like RFK Jr. in shaping public discourse, and the challenges of navigating public health policy in a polarized environment. The hosts underscore the urgency of addressing these issues to prevent further societal fragmentation and ensure effective governance.

Notable Quotes

• Host 2 [03:16]: "This basically he just does nuisance lawsuits for people who hate vaccines."
• Sarah Longwell [08:54]: "The extent to which it looks totally different now, populated by different people."
• Host 2 [23:55]: "Trump politicized Covid, he politicized the vaccines... it's here particularly because of this guy."
• Sarah Longwell [26:55]: "Republicans that they elected, we have to honor the fact that they are the people who were elected by letting them do the things that they want to do."
• Host 2 [28:43]: "Yes, granted."
• Sarah Longwell [29:25]: "The people that are exposed to danger didn't all ask for that danger."

Note: This summary excludes advertisements, intros, outros, and non-content sections as per the guidelines, focusing solely on the substantive discussions between the hosts.