Summary of "The Next Level" Podcast Episode: "Trump 2028?"

Podcast Information:

• Title: The Next Level
• Host/Authors: Sarah Longwell, Tim Miller, Jonathan V. Last (JVL) of The Bulwark
• Description: Sarah Longwell, Tim Miller, and Jonathan V. Last bring their signature political insight and banter to the masses in The Next Level podcast. They discuss the news of the week, break down campaigns and elections, and delve into pop culture feuds.

Introduction

In the "Trump 2028?" episode of The Next Level podcast, hosts Sarah Longwell, Tim Miller, and Jonathan V. Last engage in a comprehensive discussion about the potential implications of Donald Trump attempting a third presidential run in 2028. The conversation traverses constitutional debates, the integrity of democratic institutions, military appointments, and voter motivations, all while highlighting the broader threats to American democracy.

Donald Trump’s Potential 2028 Run

JVL initiates the conversation by sharing his conviction that Donald Trump will seek a third term:

[01:20] JVL: "I have been on this spot for a very long time saying that Donald Trump will attempt to run for a third term."

He elaborates on Trump’s strategy of teasing his potential candidacy over the next few years:

[02:02] JVL: "He will use the period between now and like 2027 to constantly tease the idea in a will he won’t he sort of way."

Sarah Longwell compares Trump’s approach to the infamous Ross and Rachel dynamic from Friends:

[02:02] Sarah: "Kind of like a Ross and Rachel type thing, you know?"

Constitutional Amendments: 14th vs. 22nd

The discussion shifts to the constitutional constraints surrounding a potential Trump third term. JVL contends that, technically, Trump might circumvent the 22nd Amendment by running for Vice President and then ascending to the presidency:

[03:09] JVL: "It is possible that he could run... run as the vice president... and resign the office."

Sarah counters by questioning the adequacy of comparing the 14th Amendment to the 22nd:

[05:04] Sarah: "the 14th amendment was a lot, a lot murkier than the 22nd."

She emphasizes the necessity of legal vigilance:

[05:30] Sarah: "That risk, whether you assess it to be 2% or 40%, is too great. We've never had that risk since FDR."

Military Appointments and Democracy

A significant portion of the episode focuses on Pete Hegseth’s potential nomination as Secretary of Defense and its implications for the military and democracy.

JVL critiques Hegseth’s qualifications and likens his nomination to appointing an actress to a high-level government position:

[15:00] JVL: "I think this is like nominating Alison Janney to be Secretary of the Treasury because she was on The West Wing."

Sarah expresses concerns about Hegseth’s agenda within the military, particularly regarding transgender policies:

[27:12] Sarah: "He talks about how now for promotions, firsts is the most important factor... the military will not stop until trans, lesbian, black females run everything."

The hosts discuss the potential for Hegseth to influence the military culture towards white nationalism and undermine institutional integrity:

[29:17] Sarah: "Are you at all concerned that he might try to make the military friendly to white nationalism?"

Democracy at Risk

Tim Miller introduces the notion that concerns about democracy often take a backseat to immediate economic issues, making it challenging to focus on institutional threats:

[21:18] Tim: "We're seeing a lot of people focusing on the economy... democracy is a luxury item in some ways."

JVL warns about Trump’s anti-establishment tendencies and their impact on democratic institutions:

[04:42] JVL: "This is a guy with really bad intentions, extraconstitutional intentions, and he will stress our institutions in ways that our country is not quite prepared for."

Sarah adds that despite some optimistic economic indicators among Republicans, the underlying threats to democracy persist:

[12:48] Sarah: "Republicans increasingly think the economy is doing great... but the underlying threats to democracy persist."

Voter Perspectives and Motivations

The hosts examine why certain young, undecided voters are leaning towards Trump, sharing excerpts from the New York Times:

• Jasper, 25 (Biracial, Food Service):

  [38:52] Jasper: "I'm kind of worried about Project 2025... worried about personal immaturity type stuff where he'll just say things to world leaders. We could enter into a nuclear war."

• Aisha, 21 (South Asian):

  [39:21] Aisha: "At least there's not going to be another January 6th..."

• Lillian, 27 (White, Digital Advertising):

  [39:37] Lillian: "When Biden called half the country garbage and the White House moved to change the record... that really bothered me."

• Pierce, 26 (North Carolina, White):

  [41:23] Pierce: "I voted for Trump after Kamala went on Call Her Daddy."

JVL summarizes these motivations, highlighting a rejection of the political establishment:

[40:00] JVL: "These voters are not Republicans. They are red-pilled... built around what they reject."

Jack Smith’s Resignation from DOJ

The conversation turns to the recent resignation of Jack Smith, the Special Counsel investigating Trump. JVL expresses frustration over Smith’s departure, speculating on the strategic reasons behind it:

[55:43] JVL: "Jack Smith is planning to resign... I don't understand why we're going to save Trump the fight of firing Jack Smith..."

Unknown Guest suggests that Smith might aim to release the report through alternative channels:

[59:57] Unknown: "I think it's important for America to know the truth about Trump's mishandling of classified documents."

Sarah contemplates the implications of Smith’s resignation, questioning the transparency and motives:

[56:10] Sarah: "I don't like it... I don't see what is the point of quitting beforehand just to avoid the hassle."

Closing Thoughts

As the episode wraps up, the hosts reflect on the precarious state of American democracy, the rising influence of populist figures like Trump and Musk, and the urgent need to safeguard institutional integrity. They emphasize the importance of public awareness and legal frameworks in preventing potential authoritarian shifts.

JVL concludes with a mix of skepticism and hope:

[62:48] JVL: "It’s so crazy that everything could all work out okay in the end. See you next week."

Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• JVL on Trump’s Strategy:

  [02:02] JVL: "He will use the period between now and like 2027 to constantly tease the idea in a will he won’t he sort of way."

• Sarah on Constitutional Risks:

  [05:30] Sarah: "That risk, whether you assess it to be 2% or 40%, is too great. We've never had that risk since FDR."

• JVL on Democracy as a Luxury:

  [13:07] JVL: "If democracy is a luxury good that you can only think about in good times..."

• Sarah on Voter Psychosocial Factors:

  [42:07] Sarah: "We have a lot of things that even like places like Orban's, Hungary and other places where we've seen sort of democratic slide..."

• JVL on Military and Institutional Integrity:

  [29:17] JVL: "I have been thinking about what is the threat level of these choices... he will stress our institutions in ways that our country is not quite prepared for."

Conclusion

The episode "Trump 2028?" delves into the multifaceted challenges posed by Donald Trump's potential bid for a third presidential term. Through incisive analysis and critical discussions, the hosts highlight the fragility of democratic institutions, the complexities of constitutional law, and the shifting motivations of voters. The conversation serves as a stern reminder of the vigilance required to preserve democratic integrity in the face of populist threats.