The Haunted Old Rock Store - Part III

Summary

The Night Owl Podcast – Episode 69

“The Haunted Old Rock Store – Part III”

Date: June 29, 2026
Host: Stephen Ballew – Night Owl Paranormal Research Society
Summary by Podcast Summarizer

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Episode Overview

This gripping installment continues the Night Owl team’s multi-night investigation of The Old Rock Store, a historic limestone building in Oak Hill, Texas, now home to Square Root Kava Bar. Having previously established unexplained phenomena witnessed over generations—ranging from objects moving to apparitions and presences linked to the Patton family—the episode dives into direct spirit communication experiments. Over the course of an eventful night, mediums Kate and Alejandro, along with contributions from Meg (photographer with intuitive abilities), attempt to interact with the building’s lingering energies. A central female presence—possibly Rosa Selma Patton—emerges repeatedly, corroborated by both psychic impressions and historical research, while new layers and questions are unwrapped about other haunted figures. Direct and emotional, the episode highlights not only haunting but a sense of ongoing stewardship—how the past and present entwine inside the Old Rock Store.

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Key Themes & Discussion Points

1. Background: “The Haunted Old Rock Store” So Far

• Location History: Once owned by Oak Hill pioneer James Patton and his family, with ties spanning over a century, transitioning through multiple business uses.
• Past Investigations: Previous experiences included reports of footsteps, shadow figures, missing/reappearing objects, and a dominant female presence believed to be “Rosa.”
• Medium Impressions: Both Kate and Alejandro, with no prior knowledge, independently identified similar presences and phenomena as reported by witnesses.

2. Opening Conversations & Artifact Lore

Timestamps: 06:10–08:45

• Alexis & Tracy discuss a “duende” (troll) statue: Considered a protector or trickster, left by a previous owner. This explains reported object disappearances.

"You can actually leave them little offerings... Like candy or shiny things like crystals." — Tracy (08:03)

• Historical Stories: Former employee Sarah’s teapot story echoes duende-like mischief.

3. Medium Updates — Expanding the Cast of Spirits

Timestamps: 10:54–13:17, 14:55–16:29

• Kate’s Impressions:
  • Senses a “family unit,” with possibly an older and a younger woman; perhaps the same woman at different life stages.
  • Receives the names Rose and “A” (possibly for “Alexis” or “Alex”); also mentions “Margaret.”
  • Notes a third, more modern female spirit— “hippie dippy vibes… rose colored glasses… she likes it here.”
  • Male energy linked to woodwork or desk, possibly the “shadow man.”

"I keep getting, like, an A name. There's like, a—I keep seeing an A also." — Kate (13:07)

• Alejandro’s Impressions:
  • Senses the “gentleman” upstairs craving tobacco, associating chest pain (possibly related to James Patton’s historical death from pneumonia).
  • Briefly is aware of a third, much younger female presence.

“He really likes tobacco, but he, for some reason, hasn't been around it or had it in a long time.” — Alejandro (17:55)

4. First Communication Experiments (Gansfield/Sensory Deprivation)

a. Kate in the Main Kava Bar

Timestamps: 25:29–37:30

• Communication Flow:
  • Receives impressions of a slender, older, bearded man—possibly at a bar, offering a drink.
  • References to footsteps, shadows, fire/wood stove, hiding, family pride, and a “big place.”
  • Multiple names and potential identities are floated (“James,” “John Dudley”), kitchen scenes, and feelings of fights or altercations.

“I walk down there. This is a woman. I like it down here in the fire. Fire. I keep seeing fire. The wooden stove.” — Kate (26:44)

• Presences Identified:
  • A strong female (“Rose” surfaces multiple times).
  • Two male figures—“shadow man” and “businessman/office man.” Felt to be distinct and potentially in tension.
• Energy Descriptions: The female is “very advanced in her passing over… intuitive or subconscious feeling,” while the older male is “cold.”
• Spirit Dynamics: The men remain upstairs; the female seems to “keep energy separated,” protecting the main space and encouraging positive experiences for the living.

b. Alejandro in the Upstairs Watchmaker Studio

Timestamps: 50:01–61:00

• Interactive Presence:
  • Conversational, measured, sometimes cryptic.
  • Admits to being in relationship with “the woman in the building.”
  • Claims tenure “way more years” than some presences; chill acceptance of change/new business.
  • References thefts—recent business thefts confirmed by Tracy.
  • Reports multiple distinct spirits—suggests three male presences, with tension/division (“It’s division. It’s frustrating”). Confirms a calm, protective energy in contrast to a disruptive/shadow figure (“transplant”).
• Physical Cues: Sensations of tobacco, revocation, chest pains (echoes earlier insights).

5. Dual Medium Sessions: Overlapping Impressions

Kate & Meg Together — Watchmaker Studio

Timestamps: 64:02–72:19

• Synchronous Experiences:
  • Descriptions of a man with a mustache; number four; hearing traffic and gunshots/horses.
  • Shop bell, glasses clinking—echoes general store history.
  • Shared physical discomfort—ear, chest.
• Presences Surface Again:
  • Calm patriarchal figure (“James” or “John”), cowboy/west Texas themes.
  • Female presence “Rose” returns; however, at times the communicating female claims not to be Rosa but “related.”
  • Children and gardens mentioned—children seen as “visitors, they don’t live here.”
• Strong sense of watching, observing, protecting the space and its energy.
• Notable Quotes:

  “I am not Rosa. Related. It's hard to see me because of the energy that lives in this space. But I'm here with my family.” — Kate (70:15) “Heart or hearth... living room... relaxed.” — Kate (72:01)

6. Final Group Session — Kate & Alejandro, Cava Bar

Timestamps: 77:19–86:09

• Culminating Themes:
  • The name “Rosa”/“Rose” surfaces repeatedly.
  • Messages of comfort, protection, pride in the current owner (Tracy) and the living energy of the business.
  • References to “children” being playful but not native; presences are “passersby” or “travelers”; some energies only transient.
  • Final “appearance”: As the group wraps up, multiple team members and Tracy see a figure moving in the hall (“I saw a figure right through the hallway…” — Alexis 80:22), a moment of collective chills.
  • Spirits express desire to be understood as simply “people who have lived” (86:50).

“We're just people who have lived.” — Kate (86:50)
“Thank you for coming to my house. I'm very proud. I've been here forever.” — Kate (78:34)

7. Overarching Insights & Theories

• Correlations: Historical details, witness testimony, and independent mediumistic impressions align frequently—e.g., Rosa’s full name, James’s death, family structure.
• Multiplicities of Presence: Suggests at least three to four primary energies (female, two males—potentially “office man”/“shadow man”—and children as transient/visitor spirits).
• Energetic Boundaries: Female presence actively protects/prepares the main floor while men “keep to” or are “confined” upstairs. Unsettled history may replay but also provide ongoing guidance or warning.
• Haunting As Memory: The spirits (especially “Rosa”) express pride, stewardship, and an active presence to help or communicate with the living. Haunting is characterized not by malice, but by a kind of living memory or mutual caretaking.

8. Outstanding Questions

• Identity Confirmation: Are the male presences James Patton, John Dudley White, or someone else?
• Nature of the Shadow Man: Is this figure from the Patton lineage or a later “transplant”?
• Multiplicity vs. One Spirit in Multiple Stages: Is “Rose” one woman across life/afterlife phases, or more than one spirit?
• Transient Spirits: What is the root of children and “passerby” presences?
• Artifactual Influences: Could objects such as the duende statue act as anchors for energy?

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Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• On the Duende Statue:

  “You can, like, actually leave them little offerings.” — Tracy (08:03)

• Direct Spirit Identification:

  “Rose or roses?” — Kate (34:39)
  “Rosa, we know it's you. We thought it was you.” — Alexis (34:47)

• Spirit Message to Tracy:

  “She says you have a lot of aspirations and it's time to push that envelope for you. She's very interactive with you.” — Kate (13:35)

• Mediums Comparing Male Energies:

  “The man in the office, that is his office… The man outside, I don't see him walking into the office. I think they meet outside of the office and they're bumping heads.” — Kate (42:56)

• Session Sensations:

  “I'm angry. Get out… Get out of my room.” (Shadow man) — Kate (66:43)

• Spirit’s Philosophy:

  “Haunting, but not really. We're not scary. We're just people who have lived.” — Kate (86:41–86:50)

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Important Segment Guide

• Duende & Object Lore: 06:10–08:45
• Mediums Compare Notes: 10:54–16:29
• Kate’s Pre-Session Impressions: 10:54–14:55
• Alejandro’s Pre-Session Impressions: 17:50–19:10
• First Gansfield (Kate, Downstairs): 25:29–37:30
• Gansfield (Alejandro, Upstairs): 50:01–61:00
• Double Medium Session (Kate & Meg): 64:02–72:19
• Final Group Session: 77:19–86:09
• Final Reflections/Teaser for Next Episode: 86:57–End

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Tone & Style

Warm, inquisitive, respectful, and open-minded—the Night Owl team fosters a sense of community, sincerity, and historical responsibility. There are moments of levity, genuine awe, and collaborative critical thinking, especially as experiences converge or diverge among witnesses and mediums.

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Conclusion

Episode 69 masterfully weaves together oral history, first-hand experiences, psychic impressions, and community stewardship to probe the mysteries of the Old Rock Store. The investigation is noted for its methodical approach, willingness to allow for ambiguity, and heartfelt attempts to bridge the past with the present. While many questions remain regarding the precise identities and histories of the energies within the building, the sense of “haunting” transforms—no longer a source of fear, but of collective memory and ongoing presence.

The team plans to return for further investigations, seeking to connect with past employees and other psychics, in hopes of unraveling the threads of Oak Hill’s living legacy housed within the stone walls.

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For newcomers and fans alike, this episode stands as an engaging, thorough inquiry into the paranormal, populated less by ghosts than by enduring stories, pride, and the invisible ties between people and place.

Transcript

[Stephen Ballew]

The night owl podcast episode 69 the haunted old rock store part 3. Welcome to the Night Owl Podcast. I'm your host, Stephen Ballew, and this is a place for all you restless spirits out there to tune in and hear true tales of the paranormal. I hunt these stories down, capture them from the mouths of those who've experienced them, and share them with you right here. We're currently looking for more personal ghost stories or haunted locations, so if you or someone you know has one, please submit it to us. For consideration, go to thenight owlpodcast.com Click on the Submit your story page and let us hear your ghost story. For more than a century, this small limestone building in Oak Hill has quietly accumulated stories from pioneer families and travelers to restaurants, coffee shops, and now square root cava bar. Generation after generation has been left with one lingering question. Is the Old Rock Store haunted? So far we've traced the building's remarkable history, heard firsthand accounts from those who've experienced something they couldn't explain, and brought in my investigative team and two mediums to explore the property without any prior knowledge of its history or reported paranormal activity. After uncovering remarkable parallels between their impressions, eyewitness accounts, and the building's long history, it was time to stop simply observing and start asking direct questions. Tonight, our investigation of the Old Rock Store enters a new phase. Now we'll lead our mediums through a series of experiments designed to communicate more directly with whatever may linger inside these stone walls. Along the way, a name will emerge with startling consistency. Long held theories gain unexpected support, and before the night is over, one final moment leaves everyone in the room questioning what we just witnessed. Stay tuned. A quick heads up for all my paranormal friends and fellow night owls out there. Mark November 7, 2026 on your calendars, the Spirit Social returns this fall at a brand new location with a fresh atmosphere, expanded spiritual and paranormal programming, and more details coming soon. I just wanted to get the date on your radar early. Also, do you love horror movies? Well, if you haven't made it out yet, I want to invite you to our summer horror film series. I'm teaming up with Gourmet Cinema Gang and Oddwood Brewing all summer long to celebrate cult classics, creature features and midnight movie favorites with screenings, discussions, giveaways and an incredible community of horror fans. Our next screening is Monday, July 13th and we're going back to school with one of my all time favorite 80s horror comedies, Night of the Creeps. Chris and JC are a couple of college misfits who pledge a fraternity in hopes of winning over their dream girls, but when a pledge prank accidentally unleashes a zombie outbreak, they suddenly find themselves trying to save the world. From director Fred Decker, Monster Squad and starring horror legend Tom Atkins from the Fog, this cult classic blends teen comedy, hardboiled detectives, alien slugs and the undead into one wildly entertaining ride. So join us Monday, July 13th at Oddwood Brewing. Showtime is at 7pm and tickets are just $10. Come grab a beer from Oddwood's incredible tab list and enjoy some amazing barbecue from Alois's Barbecue. Before the movie, we're also hosting an 80s costume contest with the winner taking home two tickets to the upcoming Night Owl Spirit Social. After the credits roll, stick around for our community discussion and your chance to win an exclusive piece of artwork created just for the screening. For tickets and more information, visit tinyurl.com summerhorror2026. You can also head over to the Night Owl or Gourmet Cinema Gang on Instagram and grab tickets directly through the link in either of our bios. Hope to see some of my fellow night owls out there this summer. If you're enjoying the Night Owl and want to go deeper, consider joining us on Patreon. It's the best way to support the show and get access to exclusive content, early releases, behind the scenes material from our investigations, bonus content, virtual hangouts, and special experiences like the Hidden Haunt Society. Being a patron also helps us keep traveling, investigating and telling these stories the way that they deserve to be told. You can join for as little as a dollar a month at patreon.com thenight owl podcast join us and step into the hidden inner circle of the Night Owl. Before we jump back into the investigation, let's quickly recap where we left off. Over the last two episodes, we've traced more than a century of history inside this small limestone building, from Oak Hill pioneer James Patton and his family to his daughter Rosa Selma Patton White, who spent much of her life connected to this property and through its many later lives as a business across generations, one thing remained remarkably consistent. People continued reporting strange encounters they simply couldn't explain. Current staff, former employees, customers, and even paranormal investigators who visited years apart described many of the same experiences. Unexplained footsteps overhead, shadow figures, the feeling of being watched, and the belief that more than one distinct presence seemed to be occupying this building. But one figure surfaced more than any other a female presence many had come to believe could be Rossa herself. Then came our investigation. Without knowing anything about the old rock store, its history, or its haunted Reputation Mediums Kate the brave and Alejandro began describing many of those same locations, personalities, and themes completely on their own. Most strikingly, both independently identified what they believed was the strongest presence in the building. A woman deeply connected to the property who neither felt was threatening, but instead seemed protective, familiar, and. And deeply rooted to this location. It was a description that closely echoed years of eyewitness accounts. Pointing toward Rosa, Kate also described a dark male figure wearing a hat, a striking parallel to the shadow man reported independently by multiple witnesses over the years.

[Alexis]

Here.

[Stephen Ballew]

At the same time, both mediums identified what appeared to be a separate male presence upstairs in the old watchmaker's studio. A gentleman with a businesslike demeanor whose characteristics raised intriguing questions about whether he could somehow be connected to James Patton himself. By this point, the parallels between eyewitness testimony, historical research, and our medium's impressions had become difficult to ignore. So rather than simply documenting what our mediums were sensing, we decided it was time to see what would happen if we tried speaking directly to whoever or whatever might still be here. So let's pick up where we left off on the last episode. If you recall, Alexis had noticed several statues and figures displayed throughout the establishment. One in particular, a small duende, had caught his attention, and he was curious to learn more about it. At this moment, our mediums were separated. Taking in some few quiet moments to prepare before the next phase of the investigation, Alexis took this opportunity to check in with square root Cava bar co owner Tracy.

[Tracy]

There was two pieces downstairs that I recognized that one of them. I was like, oh. I said, that's patient. And it looks like, you know, like, island style south, but it's Haitian, and it's a band playing a drum, and that's how they actually would call spirit. And the other thing.

Get it out.

No, I'm just like, if there was any issues there specifically. The other one is you have a little duende, little troll statue that was

here when we came in.

Really?

And it was. It's one of the only pieces that we really kept around because it was so unique.

It is, yeah.

But nobody has ever told me anything about it.

[Alexis]

I can tell you about it.

[Tracy]

This is duende. So duende means troll, and basically you. They're little protectors, but they can also be little, like, thieves that hide things, move things around.

[Alexis]

Yeah. That's pretty interesting.

[Tracy]

You can, like, actually leave them little offerings.

[Alexis]

Yeah.

[Tracy]

Like little things of candy, shiny things like crystals.

[Stephen Ballew]

They love crystals.

[Tracy]

Yeah. So if things start going missing or like, like I just put this down, I swear.

[Stephen Ballew]

Go give him something that explains some

[Alexis]

of the stuff that I've heard in the interviews. Okay.

[Tracy]

Yeah. And it's been here for a while, apparently.

[Alexis]

Yeah, that's really cool.

[Stephen Ballew]

Where was interesting.

[Tracy]

So he was in the kitchen looking into the cafe. So we're behind the counter, but he was up on the top. And there's actually still something up there. It's almost like a. Like a tree or a feather kind of. I'll have to show you guys. I don't even know how to explain it.

[Stephen Ballew]

Back in part one of this series, former employee Sarah shared a story about a teapot that mysteriously vanished, only to later reappear where she was certain it hadn't been before. Other staff also described similar incidents involving everyday objects seemingly disappearing and turning back up in unexpected places. According to Alexis, stories surrounding duendes often include exactly this kind of mischievous behavior. Small objects going missing only to reappear later. In some traditions, they're even believed to appreciate small offerings or gifts. Of course, it doesn't mean that a duenda has anything to do with what's happening here. But learning that the statue hadn't been brought in by Tracy, that it had already been inside this building when she took over, certainly piqued my curiosity. Tracy told us that she was going to begin leaving small offerings, and I made a mental note to dig deeper into the building's past to see if I could uncover who originally placed this statue there and perhaps why. At this point in the evening, Alexis, Tracy, and I had finally found a moment to regroup upstairs, away from our mediums. As you'll hear, we were excitedly comparing notes, realizing just how many of the impressions Kate and Alejandro had shared were independently lining up with the building's history and experiences. Tracy and her staff had been reporting.

[Alexis]

Real quick, though.

[Kate]

They're getting the same.

[Alexis]

And that's again, they're not cross contaminating. They both remember. Female. Female.

[Stephen Ballew]

Reign of the place.

[Alexis]

Male there only.

[Meg]

Yeah.

[Alexis]

And the male's only there.

[Stephen Ballew]

The only difference is Kate is getting

[Alexis]

a differentiation between the male with the stairwell, the shadow, which. The shadow is very talked about in my interviews. So I think there is another layer.

[Stephen Ballew]

I don't know if it's the same man. We were about to begin a series of communication experiments with each medium in different areas of the building. But before we dove in, I wanted to check back in with Kate, who had been spending some quiet time alone inside the kava bar. I was curious to hear how her impressions had evolved, whether any of the different personalities she'd been sensing had Become clearer and where she felt the investigation stood before we began. Trying to communicate directly.

[Kate]

Feels like it's a family unit. I wonder if it's been, like, multiple generations or something, because upstairs is like, an older woman. She definitely walks around downstairs, seems younger, Feels like they have a relationship. So it could be family, or it could be spirits talk to each other too. It could be whatever. It does feel like they have a relationship. I think it's like her daughter or something. But she's older because she helps this young woman. Taking the relationship out of it. Helps around in the kitchen. I think people see her sitting behind the counter. I think they, like, see her.

[Stephen Ballew]

This is a young.

[Kate]

With my hair. Yeah, that's a younger.

[Stephen Ballew]

The younger. Is this the one that you described upstairs to us or different?

[Kate]

I don't think so. I think they're two separate women. I think there's, like, related. One other thing it could be is, like, them in two different time periods. Especially since we are in limestone. It could be her younger and her older.

[Alexis]

Okay.

[Kate]

Is very much a possibility. I got this vision of this woman. I still see this apron. And now I'm like, well, is. Oh, I saw her wearing a dress in this vision. And then her shoes were like. I'm so sorry. They're old lady shoe is how I would describe it. She doesn't want to be called an old lady. And you're not. Okay. So it's like. Like shaped like this. And then there's a cutout on the top. How do I describe that time period? It's like there's not a heel.

[Alexis]

Not a flat.

[Kate]

It's a flat, but it's like a loafer, but not a loafer. I don't know how to. I don't know fashion. It's a flat. Whatever. It doesn't matter. I also keep seeing eggs or chickens. Like, there's something around that she's, like, collecting. And then I see her hair back in this bun. She has a bigger smile. Like, my mouth is small.

[Meg]

Small.

[Kate]

Hers is wider. She didn't always wear lipstick. I don't think Rose. I keep getting, like, an A name. There's like, a. I keep seeing an A also. There's something about a headache that I'm getting down here. I got a different time period. 1930s, 1920s. Oh, people walking by. There's so many shadows of people walking past the windows outside that are not alive people.

[Alexis]

Okay.

[Kate]

There's constantly shadows going by those doors. One family in particular is very prominent here. I feel that deeply. I feel them down Here, I feel them with the fireplace. It's funny too, because when I reference this family, that's when I'm feeling that on my arm.

[Alexis]

Okay.

[Kate]

I still think it's a woman. I wrote three different time periods, but I think there's. Because that woman up front feels like kind of a different era than this woman. She feels older, she feels younger. And then there's a third woman here who came in with like a patreon and she just kind of hung around. She's definitely more modern. She probably came from like the 60s or so they told me. Like hippie dippy vibes is what. She gives rose colored glasses with her too. It's lots of smells, or you're smelling perfume, you smell smoke with her. You might even smell cannabis when she's around. And it's just. That's just how she lived. She likes it here. There's a spirit here that talks to you directly, too. This is a female spirit. She's the one who's downstairs a lot, a lot. She says you have a lot of aspirations and it's time to push that envelope for you. She's very interactive with you. Oh, and a Margaret. I don't know if that means anything. Also the wood here, maybe this is some of the original wood, but it holds a lot too. To me, the wood is holding a lot of the man's energy.

[Stephen Ballew]

There were several moments in Kate's update that immediately grabbed my attention. The first name she'd uttered all evening was. Was Rose. Not Rosa, but certainly close enough to make my ears perk up. She followed it by saying she was also sensing a name beginning with the letter A, though she couldn't quite make it out. Later, another name surfaced. Margaret. At first glance, those may seem like disconnected impressions, but in our historical research, Rosa, Selma Patton's daughter, was named Rosa Margaret White, a detail we hadn't spent much time discussing up until this point. Kate didn't offer many new details about the shadow man, but her impressions of the female presence had continued evolving. She now felt there could potentially be an older woman upstairs and a younger woman downstairs with some sort of connection between them, maybe relation. At the same time, she was careful to point out that psychic impressions aren't always literal. It was entirely possible that she was not sensing two different women at all, but instead perceiving the same individual as at different stages of her life. In this building, that distinction felt important. So take note of that. As our historical research and the medium's impressions continued to overlap, several names were beginning to quietly emerge. As possibilities. James Andrew Patton. Rosa Selma Patton White. Rosa Margaret White. Perhaps even now James wife, Virginia Bishop. But at this stage of the investigation, they were exactly that. Possibilities. The night was still young, and there was far more we didn't know than what we did.

[Alexis]

Moving to the next phase. What I want to do is this has all been really great. There's a lot of connections, lots I would like before validating those connections. Now going into the experimentation stuff that we always do.

[Stephen Ballew]

Sadly, we don't have Franklin because he

[Alexis]

couldn't make it tonight.

[Stephen Ballew]

So we don't have his really advanced

[Alexis]

new box that he built that we've been using.

[Stephen Ballew]

But we can do the Gansfield with

[Alexis]

the brown noise, those type of things,

[Stephen Ballew]

the white noise that I feel y' all tap into really well. I know you do.

[Kate]

I think I feel like I do better with that than I do this.

[Stephen Ballew]

I don't like the rush.

[Alexis]

The.

[Stephen Ballew]

The voice is coming through. I like just quiet.

[Alexis]

Yeah, yeah. Now we can do that.

[Stephen Ballew]

I want to do it separate first. Alexis, were.

[Alexis]

Do you want to talk separately with

[Stephen Ballew]

me to talk out ideas, or do

[Alexis]

you just want to say out loud where you're. Where you're wanting to do something, or

[Stephen Ballew]

what do you want to try first?

[Tracy]

I think we have several hot spots

[Alexis]

that they both have named. Yeah. And I think it's just maybe you let us know where you want to go first.

[Kate]

I'm going first.

[Alexis]

You don't have to. But where would you go first if you were gonna go under with. With just me and Alexis guiding you?

[Kate]

The human in me wants to go upstairs really badly, but I think start down here.

[Stephen Ballew]

It feels like before beginning our first communication experiment, there was one more person I wanted to check in with. Alejandro had been spending time alone upstairs in the old watchmaker's studio, and I was eager to hear where his impressions had led him.

[Alejandro]

Did anyone light a match?

[Alexis]

No.

[Tracy]

No. But I've been smelling all kinds of weird stuff.

[Alejandro]

All right. So then that really verifies what I was getting in here while I was sitting here. So for a bit, I kind of wasn't really getting anything but, like, the afterglow of what I was seeing earlier. But I tuned in, and I was watching him pace, and I saw something of his personal passing. Something of the chest, so possibly like a heart attack or something of the lungs. And then I smell the smell of burnt matches. He really likes tobacco, but he, for some reason, hasn't been around it or had it in a long time. And that was kind of the other things and hits I was getting. But yeah, it's almost as if he's been, like, asking for it but not receiving it in a weird way.

[Stephen Ballew]

Possible offering that they could do for him.

[Alexis]

Yeah, okay, cool.

[Alejandro]

But it was. It was something almost like it was a part of him that he not getting anymore here with that. And I was kind of tuning in. I did see a third female figure very fast and quick. I just felt her a few times. She felt younger, much younger than him. And then it kind of disappeared. And I was watching, like, that time lapse of everything happen. And then I saw the issue of the chest where he passed.

[Alexis]

Okay.

[Stephen Ballew]

Alejandro's update also offered a few intriguing new details. The gentleman he'd been sensing upstairs in the old watchmaker studio seemed to be communicating a fondness for tobacco, even suggesting he might appreciate an offering at some point. More notably, Alejandro said he was getting the impression that this man's passing involved something affecting his chest or. Or his lungs. That immediately caught my attention. As part of our historical research, my father had managed to locate James Andrew Patton's death certificate. According to actual record, James passed away on July 11, 1944, at the age of 91, with pneumonia listed as his cause of death. Of course, that doesn't confirm Alejandro was communicating with James Patton, but it was yet another detail that seemed to fit within the growing pattern we'd been documenting throughout this night. With our updates complete, it was finally time to begin our communication experiments. But first, a short sponsor break. Night owls After a busy day, sometimes I just need something to help me slow down and decompress. That's where Lumi Gummies have become a part of my evening routine. Consistent, mellow, and super delicious, Lumi Gummies are specifically designed to make you feel good, not stoned. Whether you're looking for an end of day de stressor or a midday mood boost, Lumigummies has a strain that's right for you. One of the biggest stress producers in my life is trying to keep all aspects of my life organized and scheduled. Between the day job and the many tasks associated with making this podcast, scheduling and organizing everything can get a bit crazy. Setting up and recording phone interviews, meeting with investigation site owners, scheduling investigations themselves, and making time to edit for the show to take up a lot of my evening hours. And that's why Lumi Gummies are so important to me. A lot of edible gummies out there on the market can be a bit too much and may leave you feeling stoned or uncomfortable. That does not work when I need to de stress, but also need to stay focused and productive. That's why I love Lumi Gummies. These gummies provide a noticeable mood boost without the buzzed feeling and allow me to continue working on projects while staying focused and creative. I On days when the stress level is high and I still have a full workload, I reach for a Lumigummis Pina Colada Kush Gummy. The stress melts away and I can remain clear, focused and energized to tackle those late night tasks. If you need a better way to cope with stress without losing clarity, give Lumi Gummies a try for yourself. You'll be happy you did. Lumi Gummies are available nationwide. Go to lumigummies.com that's L U M I gummies.com and use code night owl for 30% off your order. Again, that's L U M I gums.com code night owl lumigummies.com code night owl night Owl Listeners, Most of you know that I began this podcasting journey over eight years ago. My very first episode was released on October 30th of 2017 and I'm here to tell you that the decision to start this podcast was not an easy one. I was actually terrified and full of self doubt. Is this the right decision? What if no one likes it? What if it fails? Obviously I was right in finally believing in myself and making that leap of faith. Thanks to the help of many friends and faithful followers, I now have a pretty successful podcast. Help can come from many places and it also helps to have a partner like Shopify on your side. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world and 10% of all e commerce in the US from household names like Heinz, Mattel and Thrive Cosmetics to many brands just getting started. You can get your own brand started by using Shopify's design studio. With hundreds of ready to use templates, you can design your own beautiful online store that matches your brand's unique style. Tackle all your important tasks from one place inventory to payments to analytics and more. Shopify helps you with all those operations in one single place. What if people haven't heard about your brand? Shopify can help you find your customers with easy to run email and social media campaigns. What I love about Shopify is how everything you need to get your business started or grow it to the next level is in one convenient place. It's time to turn those what ifs into with Shopify today. Sign up for your $1 per month trial today at shopify.com Night Owl go to shopify.com Night Owl that's shopify.com NightOwl. Alejandro would remain upstairs inside the Watchmaker studio while the rest of us made our way back downstairs to the Cava bar area to work with Kate first. But before we could begin, Kate quietly pulled me aside. There was something she needed to ask me privately.

[Alexis]

Yeah, what's up?

[Kate]

If something comes through, that is a message for her.

[Alexis]

If is she okay to hear it? You know, I can tell her to step out and then we can still do it. And then I can always like we can try to push through the session without. Maybe that thing will if it is coming through, but I'll see if she's okay with it.

[Stephen Ballew]

Kate was telling me that she had this distinct feeling that she might be receiving a direct message intended for Tracy, the owner. She wanted to know if something came through during the upcoming session, would Tracy be comfortable with us documenting it? I checked with Tracy, and without hesitation, she said yes. But this moment with Kate reminded me of Alejandro. Earlier in the night, in the previous episode, you heard that he too had unexpectedly received what felt like a direct message for Tracy. Something none of us had anticipated going into this investigation. Whether Kate was experiencing something similar or not, only time would tell. With Tracy's permission, it was finally time to begin this experiment. Our first communication experiment would take place inside the Cava bar area. Kate would be placed into a hybrid Gansfield session with her eyes covered and noise canceling headphones with brown noise piping through them, leaving her unable to see, hear, or gather any information from the room around her or us. But before we started, there was one thing I wanted Alexis to do.

[Alexis]

Alexis, if you can, to the spirits in the entire building, just kind of let them know who. Who we are and that we're coming with respect. So when we go into these experiments, we're not kind of just like coming guns a blazing.

[Tracy]

Yeah.

[Stephen Ballew]

With everything set up and ready, we begin our first session with Kate.

[Alexis]

Kate is under in the main Cava bar area and we're going to try to connect with the spirits here in the room. Is Meg photographing Alexis and I asking

[Kate]

questions for some reason, I heard Bernice,

[Alexis]

we're here out of respect to all the spirits and the lives that lived here.

[Kate]

I'm seeing a slender man. He's taller. He's showing himself as older. There's a beard, white.

[Alexis]

Can you tell us who you are? The person sitting here that you can talk through is Kate.

[Stephen Ballew]

My name is Steven. This is Tracy. She owns the building now or owns the business in the Building.

[Kate]

We are looking.

[Alexis]

We are looking. We're searching.

[Kate]

Puzzled.

[Alexis]

And this is Alexis, my friend.

[Kate]

Confused.

[Stephen Ballew]

And that's Meg over there.

[Kate]

There's an older hand reaching out with a cup or a glass. He's sitting at the bar.

[Alexis]

Are you offering us a drink?

[Kate]

There's noises upstairs that's reported.

[Alexis]

Blue. Can you tell us who you are,

[Kate]

what your name is down there? I walk down there.

[Alexis]

Who is this?

[Kate]

This is a woman. I like it down here in the fire. Fire. I keep seeing fire. The wooden stove.

[Alexis]

Can you try to. Wooden stove. Can you try to communicate with us

[Stephen Ballew]

and answer questions directly so.

[Alexis]

So we know we're talking to someone.

[Kate]

Hiding.

[Alexis]

Is there a reason you're hiding?

[Kate]

Not scared, but curious. Very curious.

[Alexis]

Alexis, tell them what we're doing so they're not wary of us.

[Tracy]

So we're just trying to communicate with you.

[Kate]

From stairs.

[Tracy]

And we're trying to identify the spirits of reach.

[Kate]

There's an R word coming by. I can't tell if it's like a Henrietta or like a. There's an R by the fire stoke. I do like it. It's a big place. Very proud. I raised my family here. There are four of us by the balcony.

[Alexis]

Can you go back? Are you. Can you tell us your name? Or if I say your name, raise. So if you. If you built this place and you

[Kate]

raised your family, keep seeing a kitchen and a stove. Like a wooden stove.

[Alexis]

I'm gonna say a couple names. If it's you, can you say.

[Kate]

And my coat.

[Alexis]

There's an important figure here named James.

[Kate]

Yes, I see you. My living room.

[Alexis]

James, if this is you in the closet, can you tell us something about yourself?

[Stephen Ballew]

What did you do for a living?

[Kate]

It's a lot of looking. More looking and less talking.

[Alexis]

She's not talking. Talking right now.

[Kate]

In your ear. They talk in your ear.

[Alexis]

Oh.

[Stephen Ballew]

Talking about the activity down the stairs.

[Alexis]

Can you tell us which stairs on the right?

[Kate]

My head. My hair. It's clear. There's a sense of unknowing, like, I don't know. It's not related to us. She's new. There's a shadow connected.

[Alexis]

Are you talking about the shadow man? Can you tell us more about him or it?

[Kate]

Horse or house? Not a cottage. The ground. Floorboard or floor. It's underneath, outgrown or grow. The outdoors. Lots of movement. It's not just human me. There's other things. There's other people.

[Alexis]

Not getting as much direct. Remember how we would have conversations? We're not getting that here.

[Kate]

It's mostly us. But There are more.

[Alexis]

Usually they answer a lot.

[Kate]

They hang out upstairs.

[Alexis]

Talking. I'm trying to get. Trying to connect with calmer Wood.

[Kate]

Fire, house. Turn directly.

[Alexis]

Can you talk to her?

[Kate]

She stands to your right.

[Alexis]

To the woman.

[Kate]

Can you, when you're working on your books or your papers. A heart condition or like a heart attack? Something with the chest. What is this?

[Alexis]

So what we're doing is we're just allowing you to communicate.

[Kate]

Why are you here?

[Alexis]

We're trying to allow you to communicate to us.

[Kate]

Yes, I understand. To get answers, but answers for what? We're not bothering anybody. Don't go upstairs.

[Alexis]

Can you tell us why it's off limits.

[Tracy]

It's not off limits to people here, though.

[Kate]

That is my space,

[Stephen Ballew]

though.

[Kate]

Angry.

[Tracy]

I understand that you're angry, but you cannot own local space.

[Alexis]

Who is this?

[Kate]

There's like. There's an altercation and it's a man speaking to another man. Bad man. From different places. There's a sensation here I'm feeling. Or here, I'm not sure if it was like a stabbing or a fight, but somebody's, like, knocked down. It's a younger man. He gets knocked back.

[Alexis]

There's a Texas Ranger chasing the criminal when he got killed.

[Kate]

Down the stairs.

[Stephen Ballew]

John.

[Kate]

Out the door.

[Alexis]

John, is this you? Can you communicate with us if you're

[Kate]

here, John Dudley, what more do you want from me?

[Tracy]

I just want validation.

[Alexis]

We're not here to kick you out.

[Kate]

Is this an interrogation?

[Alexis]

No, but I know you're used to that with me.

[Kate]

I know. I'm kidding,

[Stephen Ballew]

John.

[Kate]

I do try. Try to have a sense of humor. Okay, but I don't always like it here. Or the activity.

[Alexis]

Do people come in and I mean business.

[Kate]

Okay, when I say business, I stay upstairs growing a growing family.

[Alexis]

You did have a family.

[Kate]

This is a woman. Now, they'll come in and come out and come in and come out. And they each take turns talking.

[Stephen Ballew]

Well, you start taking turns here. Everywhere else they're fighting.

[Kate]

You haven't spoken to the man upstairs yet? Only the one that's in the office.

[Alexis]

We haven't talked to the shadow man, so the female's alerting us to the other man.

[Kate]

This is the businessman. There's something in writing that still exists from him. There's something about writing. I see him at a desk. No, I'm not from this time period. I'm much older.

[Alexis]

Well, James moved here and then he established his places as James. Can you say yes or no?

[Kate]

Keep saying blue.

[Alexis]

I wonder what color the Rangers wore.

[Stephen Ballew]

He was a Texas Ranger.

[Alejandro]

As well.

[Stephen Ballew]

So James was. And then her daughter married.

[Kate]

They're showing me, almost like a. As a collective spirit, about how people who come into this home have their own experiences. And it seems to be different for each person. There's something about their energy as it vibrates off of their body. It's reflected back from the house. So things that you're individually attracted to or that you feel inside of you, it gets shown back to you here in the house. Everybody carries their own energy and their own team.

[Alexis]

Before we. Before we end the conversation, she has

[Kate]

done a good job of setting a space where people aren't bringing in or they're feeling alleviated from the downs that humans experience in the day to day. And she has taken the time to separate that energy so that when people are in the home, they're not being reflected. The ugly. They're feeling good. They're feeling lighter at home. She doesn't realize. Yes, Tracy. She doesn't realize that she's connected to the woman upstairs. And they work together to keep the energy the way it needs to be at the house. That is why the men stay upstairs in that corner. They can't necessarily get out. Sometimes they do, but it's footsteps. They can't have effect down here. I saw glass breaking for this woman. I'm the speaker of the House.

[Alexis]

Can you. Can you tell us more about yourself so we know who you are? Madam, People believe you are the. The predominant energy here, that you had a history here.

[Kate]

Rose or roses?

[Alexis]

Got it. The. Thank you.

[Alejandro]

The doors.

[Alexis]

Rosa, we know it's you. We thought it was you.

[Kate]

It's an energy that flows. It flows through almost seamlessly until you reach that area.

[Alexis]

Well, Rosa, thank you for letting us know it was you.

[Kate]

And that's where he lives.

[Alexis]

And he lives upstairs.

[Kate]

His quarters, so to speak.

[Alexis]

What do you need us to do? Is there anything he needs to do to help?

[Kate]

The boy is not prominent, but you will see him move.

[Alexis]

Okay. Was that one of your children?

[Kate]

She feels done.

[Alexis]

Okay. Yeah. You're good. Can you describe the different voices you might have heard or the different energies you might have felt? Did you hear from the men? I thought I heard some kind of.

[Kate]

Yeah, but it was very much. He came in and spoke, and then she came. Came back in, and it was. I saw him standing there. I could feel his energy more than like. Because sometimes you can hear a change in voice or what. It never felt like a change in voice, which is so interesting because I think there's a lot of audible things that happen here. I think people hear a lot, but this was very much a difference in how you can. Could feel it. Her energy was softer. She spoke differently. He was like somebody was bringing him in. Does that make sense? Okay. I don't know how else to say that. Sometimes I feel them, like, sit right down, and it's very. But she's. She's very advanced in her passing over, so she doesn't have to have that physical. It can be very much that intuitive or that subconscious feeling from her. He felt more cold.

[Stephen Ballew]

Is he shadow or office man?

[Kate]

I don't think the shadow. I don't think I heard from the shadow. No, I. Because when this man came in, he was old. Older. I feel like the older man and the shadow man had. I heard the word scuffle. Like a scuffle or something or some. There's some interaction between the two of them, whether it's in the living life or not living life, because you can see the man, and he has ownership of the building. Like, he's very related to the building. And then I don't think the shadow man is necessarily from the building. I think he came in.

[Stephen Ballew]

As Kate continued describing what she was sensing, she became increasingly confident that she was dealing with two very different male personalities. One was the dark shadow figure she'd described earlier, the man wearing a hat. The other was the older gentleman she'd been sensing upstairs in the watchmaker's studio. The more she spoke about him, the more she felt this older man wasn't simply passing through, but was deeply rooted to this property itself. It was another detail that quietly made me wonder whether this could somehow be the presence we'd begun associating with James Andrew Patton. Even more intriguing was the relationship she sensed between the two. Kate got the distinct impression that the older gentleman didn't care for the shadow figure at all. Whether there had been once actual conflict between them in life or whether she was simply perceiving the emotions they held toward one another now in afterlife, she couldn't say. But it was another fascinating thread that I wanted to keep in mind as the investigation unfolded. There was one more detail I couldn't ignore. For the second time that night, Kate had received the name Rose. It's worth reminding you that Kate and Alejandro both had no prior knowledge to this location. She didn't know its address, its history, or the names of anyone connected to the property. There was nothing inside the building that could have pointed her toward the name Rosa either. And yet here she was, independently arriving at Rose for a second time. At that Moment I felt it was important to address it directly with her. I mean, you got a big name. Well, close enough that. And it was right when I was asking specifically, did you feel like a

[Alexis]

name for the woman was strong?

[Kate]

Oh, I'm not going to pretend to know.

[Alexis]

Yeah, no, it was.

[Stephen Ballew]

And that's the thing, is it?

[Kate]

Does it, Rose? Yes. I got that in my notes, too.

[Alexis]

I saw you wrote it down.

[Kate]

Yeah.

[Alexis]

I didn't want to say anything yet,

[Stephen Ballew]

so I was going to see if

[Alexis]

it came naturally in the conversation. So I'm going to give it to you. Her name's Rosa. Oh, well, that's really great because that is the. The most felt and most thought spirit here.

[Kate]

She's so involved. She talks to you all the time. All of the time.

[Stephen Ballew]

Now, I'll ask you later, but you've. You've said you've not really had any experiences here. Does that make any sense? Do you have any.

[Alexis]

Maybe she's talking when she's not hearing it, not listening.

[Tracy]

I will walk into especially this room and it just feels good. Like it's a hard, hard thing to explain. And I guess for so long I just pass it off as just, I'm so proud of this place and what we've done with it because everybody compliments on just what a great job because of the past, I guess, businesses. It was darker and this is just a lot more homier.

[Alexis]

Yeah.

[Tracy]

So I guess I've never really connected with her in that way.

[Meg]

Cool.

[Kate]

Feels like to me. And I heard her mention this. You know how you'll catch something right before it breaks. Breaks in here? Or you're like, you get there right before. That's her communication with you. It comes across as your intuition because she comes through for you from such a genuine place of the building that it feels natural and not like, oh, some spirit just walked next to me. It's like she is part of me. She is part of this. She says experience, but it's the intuitive hits for you.

[Stephen Ballew]

By this point, the name Rose had become impossible for me to ignore. Not only had Kate spoken the name twice throughout the evening, I'd also witnessed her writing it down in the journal she'd been using during the investigation. Then, during this session, I intentionally began asking the female presence to identify herself. That's when Kate once again responded with the name Rose. From there, many of her responses seemed to naturally flow, as though we were communicating with that female presence directly. None of this was definitive, of course, but it was certainly one of the more compelling moments of the night. There was also another correlation that stood out just as much, if you recall, from the previous episode, Alejandro unexpectedly received what he believed was the direct message for Tracy. It centered around the business, her struggles, her plans, and encouragement to keep moving forward. Kate and Alejandro had remained completely separated throughout the evening and had no knowledge of what each other were sensing or reporting. Yet here we were again. Before this session even began, Kate quietly had told me that she felt she might receive a message directly for Tracy. As the session unfolded. She described the same strong female presence as someone who seemed deeply invested in Tracy and was intuitively trying to help guide her with the business. Again, not proof of anything, but another remarkable parallel between two completely independent mediums. But there was still one question I couldn't shake. I remained uncertain about the two male presences Kate had been describing, particularly the shadow man in the hat. Interestingly, although numerous of Tracy's staff have reported seeing and sensing this figure primarily downstairs inside the cava bar, Kate consistently perceived him upstairs. I wanted to better understand why. But the two men are up there.

[Alexis]

You're saying the one man, the shadow man's more on the stairs. That outside area office businessman.

[Kate]

They're two separate people. Because the man in the office, that is his office. And you can feel that.

[Alexis]

Like that's his face.

[Kate]

Yeah. The man outside, I don't see him walking into the office. I think they meet outside of the office and they're bumping heads.

[Stephen Ballew]

Kate couldn't offer much more clarity on the two male presences, so for the moment, we'd simply have to keep those questions in the back of our minds. It was now time to head upstairs and check back in with Alejandro, who had been quietly sitting with his impressions inside the watchmaker's studio. Kate would remain downstairs in the cava bar while Alexis, Meg, Tracy, and I made our way up to join Alejandro and prepare for our first communication experiment with him in that space. But first, a short sponsor break. Sometimes I'm honest with myself.

[Alexis]

And if I'm being honest today, I

[Stephen Ballew]

can admit that meal planning is certainly not my strong suit. I get so busy during the week and forget to make plans for mealtime. Take this week, for instance. In addition to my regular 9 to 5, I was swamped with several evenings of editing for the show, meeting with personnel at the latest investigation location to get their stories, and meeting with the local business owner to discuss a plan for my next spirit. Social busy doesn't fully encapsulate what my week is like. I work all day, suddenly realize that I'm hungry and need to eat and I haven't made any plans for dinner. Thankfully, Factor Meals are there to save the day and they can make your meals meal planning easier too. Head over to FactorMeals.com NightOwl50OFF and use code NightOwl50OFF to get 50% off and free daily greens per box. Factor Meals are designed by dietitians, prepared by chefs and delivered straight to your door. It can't get any easier than that and the food quality is top notch. Every meal is crafted with functional ingredients, lean proteins, colorful veggies, whole foods and healthy fats. Factory meals contain no artificial colors or sweeteners, no high fructose corn syrup and no refined seed oils. Just nutritious, delicious food that's fresh, never frozen. I had the Parmesan and garlic cream shredded beef most recently and it was legitimately delicious. It's exactly the kind of meal I like after a full day and workout. High in protein, satisfying and ready in just a couple of minutes. Do your taste buds a favor and give Factor Meals a try for yourself. Head to FactorMeals.com NightOwl50OFF and use code NightOwl50OFF to get 50% off and free daily greens per box with new subscription only while supplies last until September 27, 2026. See website for more details. Summer vacation time is upon us night owls. It's time when everyone starts thinking of relaxing on a sunny beach, hiking on wooded trails, and just generally taking time to wind down and relax a bit. It's also a time when people tend to let some things slide a little. That's kind of the point of vacations, right? But your health and nutritional needs should not be one of those things. Especially when it's so easy to accomplish by taking 30 seconds each morning and drinking. AG1. Go to drinkag1.com nightowl to get a free morning person hat and free AG1 flavor sampler. Your welcome kit with your first AG1 subscription. AG1 is my personal go to daily health drink to supply my body with the multivitamins, pre and probiotics, superfoods and antioxidants it needs to keep going all day long. I know from personal experience that starting my day with AG1 ensures that I have taken care of my nutritional needs for the rest of the day. AG1's next gen formula delivers over 75 ingredients backed by four clinical trials and clinically shown to support gut health, fill common nutrient gaps and improve key nutrient levels within three months. By all means, go on that much needed vacation. Take some time to relax, enjoy all the hiking, biking, and swimming you can squeeze into your summer. Just don't let life get in the way of your nutritional health. AG1 is the easiest way I know to tackle those nutritional needs, and it only takes a mere 30 seconds each morning. That's why for me, it's one scoop once a day, every day. Visit drinkag1.com night owl to get a free morning person hat and a free AG1 flavor sampler in your welcome kit with your first AG1 subscription, an $82 value. That's drinkag1.com night owl

[Alejandro]

tuning in more. I realized there was something that I completely kind of missed because we were kind of quickly walking through the building as they were closing the kitchen area where I was talking about that, like, blockage with the sink. Yeah, the sink right there. I felt the presence of a younger gentleman. He kind of felt like the age range and, like, vibe of. I don't know the actor's name, but he's the one who does makes, like, the clock stuff on Gilded Age. He looked very similar because I saw, like, the gap in his teeth. Looked very like kind of younger gentleman. Almost felt like he was working alongside them. But they're like the workers as they're doing stuff in there. But as he's trying to pass back and forth, it's almost like there's like, a bumping in that happens often. It just felt like that used to be open or something of that nature where people could pass in and out, but it's closed off. I was writing stuff down, and I kind of, like, closed my eyes for a second and I wrote the name Alex. I don't typically get names when I'm writing, so it was very interesting. They feel quite physically strong, but they were not a very tall individual. I will also say I still feel the presence of the woman that I was feeling downstairs in the kitchen, but that area just felt like it's kind of his. Right where we were in that hallway underneath the stairs as well, kind of that pathway, like, back and forth.

[Alexis]

Okay. Yeah, cool. So we have other.

[Stephen Ballew]

Another male up here. Just separating all the spirits again.

[Alexis]

We've got the male in here. Yes, we've got a younger male downstairs.

[Stephen Ballew]

Downstairs in the.

[Alexis]

Where the sinks are kind of. And then the other female that kind of goes all over.

[Alejandro]

All over. I just haven't felt her specific presence in this room.

[Alexis]

Okay.

[Stephen Ballew]

Alejandro's update introduced an interesting new wrinkle. And in the investigation, he now believed he was sensing another male presence downstairs in the kitchen, directly beneath the watchmaker studio where we were sitting. But unlike some of the other impressions we'd been documenting throughout the night, these details didn't immediately seem to fit. Alejandro described this man as shorter in stature, whereas the shadow figure reported by staff had consistently been described as tall, thin, and often seen wearing a hat.

[Tracy]

He.

[Stephen Ballew]

He also received the name Alex, a name that, at least in our historical research, didn't appear to have any obvious connection to the Patton family or the property's known owners. Alejandro was also quick to point out that he rarely receives names during his readings, so it wasn't immediately clear what to make of it for now, but we simply added it to our growing list of observations, knowing it might make more sense as the investigation continued with that update, it was finally time to begin our first hybrid Ganzfeld session with Alejandro inside the watchmaker studio.

[Alexis]

Alejandro's under a hybrid experiment.

[Alejandro]

Dumb boys asking questions already. These other people.

[Stephen Ballew]

So, my name is Steven.

[Alexis]

This is Alexis. This is Tracy, who you might recognize. And then that's our friend Meg.

[Alejandro]

I hear people.

[Alexis]

So you can hear us, but you can't see us.

[Alejandro]

They look a lot younger.

[Alexis]

We're from a more modern time. And. Thank you. Can you tell us your age? Just to be clear, we're not trying to force you to do anything you don't want to do. You don't have to answer anything you don't want to answer. We're just curious.

[Alejandro]

I keep hearing noises of what? This is me talking. I keep hearing noises of what sounds like car accidents happening.

[Alexis]

We're talking to the male presence that mostly resides in this room up here. We're not here to kick you out. We're not here to. For.

[Alejandro]

I watched him for years.

[Alexis]

Who did you watch? What did he look like

[Alejandro]

before that?

[Alexis]

You've been here a long time. There's a woman in the building, also a woman spirit. Do you know the woman?

[Alejandro]

Can you feel we're in a relationship?

[Alexis]

Is that your wife? Could you give us either your name or her name?

[Alejandro]

It only goes to show the best of us.

[Alexis]

I'm gonna say a few names. Does the name James or Jimmy ring a bell? How about the name John?

[Alejandro]

I'm not explaining that.

[Alexis]

Do you have any questions for us?

[Alejandro]

I couldn't tell you yet. It's a lot like you

[Alexis]

did this place used to be your home that you used to live in?

[Alejandro]

I wasn't finished.

[Alexis]

Oh, sorry.

[Alejandro]

There's a mystery about it.

[Alexis]

Yeah, we're trying to figure out that mystery.

[Alejandro]

Truly, there's more to the picture.

[Alexis]

We are trying to figure out another spirit. Could you help us? Do you know which spirit we're talking about?

[Alejandro]

Can you point where he is on the second story?

[Alexis]

Do you know his name?

[Alejandro]

That's where it differs.

[Alexis]

That's where it differs.

[Tracy]

Does he not have a name?

[Alexis]

Do you like that presence or.

[Alejandro]

Once.

[Alexis]

Once like the presence. Did you know him?

[Alejandro]

I'll tell you in a minute.

[Tracy]

He's a very interesting personality.

[Alexis]

He's different than a lot of the ones we've talked to. Yeah, we have. We have.

[Alejandro]

We'll go over this again and again.

[Alexis]

He is talking a lot different. We usually have real.

[Alejandro]

Think about it.

[Alexis]

Real, combative male presences speak to us. Typically, we don't have any. That. He's pretty calm.

[Alejandro]

Just start packing.

[Alexis]

Do you want us to leave?

[Alejandro]

Let me make it easier for you.

[Alexis]

See, now it's getting combative. Now I brought it up. Are you telling us that you want us to pack up and leave? Are we doing anything that bothers you?

[Alejandro]

Well, when it's gone, do you want something gone?

[Alexis]

Do you want that presence gone? Does it belong here?

[Alejandro]

It's Division. It's frustrating.

[Alexis]

So you're positive? We heard you're very positive.

[Stephen Ballew]

We've heard you're very gentle.

[Alexis]

People like you.

[Alejandro]

Anything, really.

[Alexis]

And then the female's very positive. But we've heard about a negative presence out there. Is that the.

[Stephen Ballew]

Is that the divisive presence?

[Alexis]

Do you need any help with that?

[Alejandro]

Yeah, but there's just a little bit. Can be difficult to orchestrate sometimes. There's about three we're talking about.

[Alexis]

Three?

[Tracy]

There's four total, plus the one we're talking to.

[Alexis]

Oh, okay.

[Tracy]

So there's three plus.

[Alejandro]

They all say 35 years of age.

[Alexis]

35. I don't know if you can give us this answer, but we really would like to know who you are.

[Alejandro]

There's some negotiations

[Alexis]

I'm curious about if it's James or John, because it really sounded more like John earlier.

[Alejandro]

What if you're making me.

[Alexis]

We actually want to help in any way we can. That's why we're here, actually.

[Alejandro]

He's on his own.

[Alexis]

That thing's on its own.

[Tracy]

You don't want us to help?

[Alexis]

Do you want us to help?

[Alejandro]

Been here way more years, so he's

[Alexis]

been here a lot longer. I'm done.

[Tracy]

You know, he's like, I've been here

[Alexis]

forever, so I don't really care.

[Alejandro]

See, this is what I love about it.

[Alexis]

Yeah, tell us.

[Alejandro]

I wish I could tell you.

[Alexis]

So cryptic. I get it. We're new. You don't know us. I wouldn't be comfortable talking to strangers about my personal life either. But there's.

[Alejandro]

Divide it up as we can, anytime it needs. And they're growing things.

[Alexis]

You're talking about the current owner growing things. Did Kate say that, too?

[Alejandro]

But the damage is local, but we don't complain.

[Alexis]

Okay. Do you understand that with time comes growth and changes? It may not be like what you remember.

[Alejandro]

That's fine.

[Tracy]

Yeah.

[Alexis]

See, they get it. He gets it. He's very, like, just chill.

[Tracy]

He's chill.

[Alexis]

We like you, by the way. I'd have you over for a glass of whiskey and a cigar if I could. Do you like smoking? Do you like tobacco? I can bring you some. I smoke a lot of stuff.

[Alejandro]

And they kind of smelled it downstairs.

[Alexis]

Smelled it. Cause I remember Kate saying, smelling too much.

[Alejandro]

Smelling this revocation.

[Alexis]

What is that revocation?

[Alejandro]

Well, by me.

[Alexis]

Are we still talking to the calm gentleman?

[Alejandro]

It's mine 99% of the time.

[Alexis]

Okay. It's really interesting. Do you need anything else from us before we let you go? Any messages for anybody here in this space or in the building below at any point?

[Alejandro]

There's one. Clear.

[Alexis]

Okay. Before I go, just want to say thank you for giving us your time, for letting us kind of explore your space. Hopefully, we've been respectful, and we're gonna continue to be that way for the rest of the night. If you could give us your name, that would help us out a lot. But if you don't feel comfortable doing

[Alejandro]

that, I'll be here in the morning. There are people here.

[Alexis]

Yeah, that's. See, that's Tracy over there. I don't know if you know.

[Alejandro]

Extras. Yeah, there's others that come behind the bar there.

[Alexis]

Tracy, do you want to tell them what that is and who they are and, like, why they're there?

[Kate]

Those are our employees.

[Alejandro]

Please, anyone that you would have seen. It's a whole game we're in.

[Alexis]

It's. It's a business.

[Stephen Ballew]

Kind of like what used to be

[Alexis]

in this space years ago and decades and century ago might have been during your time, too.

[Alejandro]

Thieves grab.

[Alexis]

Thieves grab. Have you had any incidents? We have employee incidents.

[Alejandro]

But why?

[Kate]

I asked the same question.

[Alexis]

Did you see that happen? Do you need to have any information to share?

[Alejandro]

I'm wondering why he even showed up. He's the lead one.

[Alexis]

He was the lead one. Was it a male? No, different.

[Alejandro]

Well, if you want to get the rundown, it's almost like a transplant.

[Alexis]

Transplant. Well, thank you for sharing. Is there anything else, Alexis, you want to ask before we pull him out.

[Tracy]

He's been very helpful.

[Alexis]

Yeah, thank you for all the communication.

[Alejandro]

There is about four.

[Alexis]

Okay, thank you. So we know there's four here, including yourself, possibly.

[Alejandro]

I told you to stay away.

[Alexis]

I don't think son knows. Who are you talking to?

[Alejandro]

Are you playing con games?

[Alexis]

Con games? You talking about the shadow?

[Alejandro]

Well, as you can see, I took it.

[Alexis]

Seems like somebody else. Are we talking to somebody else now?

[Alejandro]

Who are you? Drop the bounds down. Since I said before, difficult this season is gonna make you realize

[Alexis]

they always leave it on a cliffhanger. Okay, well, we're gonna give you 10 seconds, count down, and then I'm gonna tap his shoulder and he's gonna come out. So you have 10 seconds to say anything. And we really need to get anything across to me, to Alexis, to Tracy.

[Alejandro]

There is something about trusting things.

[Alexis]

10.

[Alejandro]

No, the Lord is doing that.

[Alexis]

9, 8. 7. 6, 5.

[Alejandro]

And we must continue.

[Alexis]

3, 2, 1. Okay,

[Stephen Ballew]

take a breather.

[Alexis]

How you doing?

[Tracy]

Good.

[Alexis]

Cool.

[Alejandro]

I. It felt almost as if someone was like fighting to talk. It felt like two distinct voices. It was just interesting to say the least. But it felt specifically like two male voices trying to kind of. It does feel like they're kind of. Not in like a negative way, but feeding off of what's kind of talked about in here and worked with in here. That it's like attracting them to this specific spot. But it did feel like. Are we above the kitchen? Yeah, we're above the kitchen right now. It did feel like there is that. Like a boundary line that kind of kept fluctuating when they were switching over. That makes sense.

[Stephen Ballew]

This session stood out to me in several ways. Unlike Kate's earlier session, which often felt like impressions and information simply flowing through her, this felt much more like a conversation. Alejandro wasn't just relaying thoughts. He appeared to be interacting with a specific personality. The older gentleman we'd come to associate with the watchmaker studio spoke calmly, deliberately, and with phrases that felt noticeably different from Alejandro's own way of speaking. Several responses immediately caught my attention. He seemed to acknowledge that he'd been here for a very long time and recognized how much the property had changed over the years. The years. When we asked about those changes, he appeared to reassure us that he understood and that everything was alright by him. There were also repeated references to theft, something that seemed oddly specific. But in that moment, Tracy had confirmed with us that she recently had to let members of her staff go after discovering there had been stealing from the business. At the same time, there were moments that suggested another male presence was attempting to enter the conversation. Alejandro himself said he could feel that second male trying to come through. And several responses seemed to imply tension between the two. Earlier in the night, Kate had independently sensed this older gentleman didn't care for the shadow figure. Whether that reflected an actual relationship between the two distinct personalities, or simply the way the impressions were coming through today, we couldn't say. The one thing I still couldn't confidently answer was the identity of this older gentleman. At one point, when we asked him about the female presence, he indicated that he had been in a relationship with that person. If we were truly communicating with the older gentleman, we'd been associating with the property. That immediately raised several possibilities. Could this man be James Andrew Patton? But he's referring to his wife, Virginia Bishop. Could this older female that Kate had been sensing upstairs actually be Virginia, while the younger female downstairs, the one repeatedly connected to the name Rose, was Rosa Selma Patten? Or were we simply trying to fit fragments of information into a historical framework that wasn't actually here? There was another curious detail as well. The word transplant surfaced during this conversation. Standing alone, it didn't mean much. But viewed alongside the repeated impression surrounding the shadow figure that he wasn't welcome, that he seemed disconnected from the property, and that there was apparent friction between him and this older gentleman, it made me wonder whether this darker male presence wasn't connected to the Patton family at all, but instead could have been someone or something that arrived here much later. At this point, they were nothing more than working theories. The investigation was still unfolding, and we had far more questions than answers. For our next experiment, we wanted to try something different. For the first time this night, we'd be bringing everyone together inside the Watchmaker studio. Kate would once again enter a hybrid Gonsfeld session. But this time she'd be joined by our photographer, Meg, who also has intuitive abilities. Each would be using different equipment, isolated from one another, and be unable to hear either us or each other. Before we dive into this session, though, I want to be completely transparent about one important detail. Unlike Kate and Alejandro, Meg knew of the location we were going and had been with us throughout the investigation, photographing the night's events. She had overheard several of the conversations with Tracy, including our discussions about the property's history, the name, Rosa, James, etc. So if you hear those details surface during the upcoming session, I don't consider those independent hits like I do with Alejandro and Kate. I always want to be honest and clear as possible about what information could have Been available to someone taking part in these experiments with my audience. With that in mind, let's see what unfolded.

[Alexis]

Okay, we've got Kate and Meg under two separate types of experiments. We're just going to let it go.

[Kate]

I feel like I'm sitting in his energy. And it's very like.

[Alexis]

Y' all can communicate to each other. If there's multiple spirits that want to communicate through these two mediums, we have the names James or Jimmy.

[Kate]

I'm seeing a man with a mustache. 4.

[Meg]

I hear traffic.

[Alexis]

That's what he heard.

[Kate]

Gun. Guns.

[Meg]

Oh, I hear horses clomping.

[Alexis]

We had the Texas Rangers. Two Texas Rangers worked here. I mean, lived here.

[Kate]

Who are you?

[Alexis]

My name is Steven. We're friends. We're not here. No, I know. I'm not a friend in this. Talking to someone else. Are you talking to her?

[Alejandro]

Her?

[Kate]

Who is she?

[Alexis]

This is Kate and this is Meg.

[Meg]

Hear a door opening with the bell,

[Kate]

like a shop bell? The door. Through the door.

[Alexis]

This used to be a general store. Did y' all have a little bell on the shop?

[Meg]

Glasses clinking.

[Alexis]

Well, maybe they were selling more than general goods. We didn't want to reveal that history.

[Meg]

No. Oh, that was my dad.

[Kate]

Lipton.

[Meg]

My father.

[Alexis]

So James was Rosa's father?

[Kate]

Her.

[Alexis]

I think he went by Jimmy.

[Kate]

She put me here. I can only do so much.

[Alexis]

It's not me who's talking through Kate right now. Can you help me?

[Kate]

Heard.

[Meg]

Where's Rosa?

[Kate]

My ear's hurting.

[Alexis]

So if you're looking for Rosa.

[Meg]

We've heard and hear like pops. Loud bangs on this side.

[Kate]

He's making me feel in sensation.

[Alexis]

What are you feeling here?

[Kate]

In my ear.

[Alexis]

She's feeling that too.

[Kate]

And head.

[Alexis]

There was. There was some.

[Meg]

My chest hurts.

[Kate]

He holds his mouth behind my sternum. Way honest.

[Meg]

Kind work.

[Kate]

Speak more clearly.

[Meg]

I hear the glasses clinking again.

[Kate]

Not you.

[Meg]

Somebody just walked by.

[Alexis]

What about the shadow man?

[Kate]

I'm angry. Get out.

[Alexis]

Do you want us.

[Kate]

Get out of my room.

[Alexis]

Do you not like women in here?

[Kate]

I'm not hurting anyone.

[Alexis]

We didn't say get out.

[Tracy]

We're not.

[Alexis]

We're not accusing you.

[Tracy]

We're just trying to get some answers.

[Alexis]

It's just curiosity.

[Kate]

Explicitly. I'm not trying to force anything in the newspapers.

[Meg]

She's.

[Kate]

Hurry up.

[Meg]

She's in the garden.

[Kate]

I don't have all day with the children.

[Tracy]

Just need some answers. What can you tell us about the shadow man?

[Meg]

Meg doesn't want to say. Walking out there fighting them engines.

[Kate]

Especially stumble.

[Meg]

A fall.

[Alexis]

So that's what James did he?

[Kate]

Down the stairs.

[Tracy]

That's what all the Rangers did.

[Alexis]

Yeah.

[Meg]

Red.

[Kate]

It's a repeating pattern around that rock around there. His story, not mine.

[Meg]

Hitching the horse.

[Alexis]

Two different people.

[Meg]

You know where it belongs.

[Alexis]

And are you John?

[Kate]

Horses.

[Alexis]

She said horses.

[Meg]

I knew him once.

[Alexis]

John or James?

[Tracy]

Did James know John?

[Alexis]

Yeah. He was his father.

[Kate]

No, to the yonder.

[Meg]

He came round yonder.

[Stephen Ballew]

What the hell?

[Kate]

It's clear.

[Tracy]

Wow.

[Meg]

Where he ain't supposed to be.

[Kate]

He's not associated with me.

[Alexis]

Oh. Wow. Okay.

[Kate]

I haven't seen him.

[Alexis]

Show us who he is.

[Kate]

You can ask her.

[Alexis]

Who is he

[Kate]

feeling shaky.

[Meg]

Just Meg feels anxiety.

[Alexis]

Okay.

[Kate]

I can't help you. This is Kate speaking. I feel like there's an energy outside of the story. So I'm going to kind of push him in a little bit.

[Meg]

I don't know why.

[Alexis]

What did she say? Watching the energy outside.

[Kate]

She's waiting. There's a sensation I'm feeling in my heart and stomach again.

[Alexis]

Heart and stomach.

[Kate]

I hear like a shock. Getting bumped. Like a gasp for air. Boom. Click.

[Alexis]

So he was shot. John was shot. Shot.

[Kate]

Waiting around the corner.

[Alexis]

I wonder if she's feeling it.

[Kate]

I'm not scared.

[Meg]

Ride down with that horse.

[Kate]

I don't belong here. Cowboy. West Texas.

[Meg]

Gotta protect what you build.

[Kate]

It's your legacy. Tapping of the shoulder. I'm older. A gentleman in a hurry. Rush.

[Meg]

I am everywhere.

[Alexis]

Who are you? Who's everywhere?

[Meg]

Are you Rosa in the plants?

[Kate]

If the shoe in the air. Wear it. I wear it. You see me.

[Alejandro]

Is there anything that you want us

[Tracy]

or the people who work here to do for you?

[Kate]

I'm revere, not unkind. Don't be scared of me.

[Tracy]

Don't be scared.

[Alexis]

I'm not unkind. Don't be scared of me.

[Kate]

Rose.

[Alexis]

Rose again. Okay.

[Meg]

This is how things are done.

[Kate]

It's Rosa. I'm not Rosa.

[Meg]

Observing.

[Alexis]

So she's not Rosa.

[Kate]

No. You're not speaking to Rosa through me. Related. It's hard to see me.

[Meg]

Where's Rosa?

[Kate]

Because of the energy that lives in this space. But I'm here with my family.

[Alexis]

Okay. Are the kids your kids?

[Meg]

That's my father.

[Kate]

Kind.

[Alexis]

That's my father.

[Kate]

Where's Rosa Hart?

[Alexis]

James.

[Kate]

I just saw a donkey.

[Alexis]

James. John. Rosa. I don't know if you go by Jimmy and Dudley.

[Kate]

This man feels separate from the older man. And this older man comes in again. Very stirred. Tied to the building. It's different.

[Meg]

Why?

[Kate]

Different time period.

[Alexis]

Who is the man who really likes this space? Particularly this room?

[Kate]

This maybe son. Sometimes son in law.

[Alexis]

Dudley.

[Kate]

John. No. I'm waiting.

[Alexis]

Okay.

[Kate]

To hear. To see. Observing you.

[Alexis]

Is there anything you want us to do that's interesting?

[Kate]

I hear traffic.

[Alexis]

Traffic again.

[Kate]

When they see me downstairs, we're gonna

[Alexis]

pull you out in 10 seconds.

[Kate]

Rosa. Rosa, downstairs.

[Alexis]

If any of the spirits that have been kind enough to talk to us

[Kate]

wants to say anything, art or heart,

[Alexis]

we're gonna give you 10 seconds.

[Stephen Ballew]

And pull it.

[Alexis]

Pull these mediums out. Turd. Nine.

[Kate]

Hearth.

[Alexis]

Eight. Seven.

[Kate]

Living room.

[Alexis]

Six. Five.

[Kate]

Relaxed.

[Alexis]

Four. Three.

[Kate]

Relax.

[Alexis]

Two.

[Meg]

Swen. Swen. Swenson. Swan.

[Alexis]

Okay.

[Stephen Ballew]

This was, without question one of the most complex sessions of the night. With two mediums speaking simultaneously through completely different methods, it could be difficult to follow everything unfolding in real time. But after reviewing the session again alongside our historical research and everything we documented throughout the evening, several remarkable patterns began to emerge. Almost immediately, Kate once again described a man with a mustache. She also received a number four. The same number Alejandro had independently mentioned only minutes earlier while sitting alone in this very room. Moments later, Meg began hearing traffic, another detail that had surfaced during Alejandro's session upstairs. Then the session took an unexpected turn. Kate began describing hearing a gunshot. Almost instantly, Meg began describing horses and the sound of hoofbeats. Later, Meg spoke in a distinctly old Southern accent about riding horses, hitching them outside, and excuse this derogatory phrase, fightin them Injuns. A dated expression that immediately brought my thought back to James Andrew Patton and his early years on the Texas frontier. Before becoming one of Oko's most influential citizens, James Andrew Patton served as a young Texas Ranger alongside his father and brothers during the final conflicts with the Comanches. He would later settle in Oak Hill, where he built the original general store and, in 1898, the limestone building we're standing in today. These weren't details either medium knew before walking into the old rock store. Other correlations happened almost too quickly to ignore. At one point, Meg heard the ringing of a shop bell. At virtually the same exact moment. Kate responded simply, the door. The physical sensations were equally intriguing. Kate suddenly began holding her ear at one point, saying she felt pain and pressure. At nearly the same moment, Meg gestured to the same side of her head before describing loud pops and bangs. Minutes later, Kate described pain across one side of her face, while Meg instinctively grabbed that same side of hers before saying she felt discomfort in her chest, echoing the chest sensations that Alejandro had independently experienced during his own session earlier upstairs. Perhaps the most fascinating development, however, involved the personalities themselves. By this point, it increasingly felt as though we weren't communicating with a single presence, but with at least three distinct personalities, if not more. There was the calm, older gentleman who repeatedly gave the impression that he belonged here, that this property was in some way his. There was another male presence, one Kate sensed lingering just outside the watchmaker's studio door. When she intentionally tried drawing him into the session, her demeanor changed dramatically. She described a sudden sensation in her chest struggling for air. The words cowboy in west Texas came out of her, and the feeling that this man didn't belong here. Earlier in the evening, both Kate and Alejandro had independently sensed tension between the smell and the older gentleman inside the building. Whether this second man had any connection to John Dudley White, the Texas ranger who was married to Rosa Selma Patton before being killed in the line of duty while the family was living in West Texas, or whether those impressions meant something entirely different, I simply could not say. But the parallels were certainly thought provoking in the moment. And again, the female presence continued to be just as compelling. Meg described a woman in the garden with children, while Kate repeatedly returned the name Rose. Once again, the name surfaced independently, just as it had throughout the evening. The session also carried the same theme we'd heard from both mediums all night, that this woman remained deeply connected to the property, its family, and even its stewardship. Then came one of the more curious exchanges. Kate clearly stated, I am not Rosa related. Moments later, she would add, it's hard to see me because of the energy that lives in this space, but I'm here with my family. That made me wonder whether we might not be hearing from Rosa herself in that moment, but perhaps another member of the Patton family, someone connected to Rosa and the property in a different way. Earlier in the investigation, Kate had already suggested she might be sensing an older female and a younger female, though she was never certain whether they were two separate individuals or simply different stages of the same person's life. At this point, none of these impressions could be treated as conclusions. But taken together with everything we documented throughout the night, the recurring name rose, the repeated references to the property's history, the independent descriptions of multiple personalities, and the remarkable overlap between Armenians, this session only deepened the mystery surrounding the old rock store. But at this point, it was getting late, and we decided it was time to start wrapping up for this first investigation. So we decided it would be best to close with Kate and Alejandro doing a final duo session in the Cava bar area downstairs. So we quickly set this up and let the sound roll for one last time tonight.

[Kate]

Rosa comfortable? My house Sick.

[Tracy]

Is this where Rosa Likes to be.

[Alejandro]

I'm over here.

[Alexis]

Sounds feminine. Rosa, we just want to say our final goodbyes as team here. We were very appreciative of your communication. I don't know.

[Alejandro]

I don't think so.

[Tracy]

Want us to leave.

[Alexis]

Agree.

[Kate]

It's different. We like it.

[Alexis]

So the place has changed.

[Kate]

Speak for yourself. Comfortable, kind, loving, enjoyed communicating with us. Today we are here.

[Alexis]

One thing that we didn't get any clarity on, but that we got some hints of was we do.

[Stephen Ballew]

We do get stories of stairs.

[Alexis]

Children, you're tricky.

[Stephen Ballew]

Are there kids.

[Alexis]

Spirits here? Can we get a final answer for that man? Man on stairs.

[Stephen Ballew]

She's talking about the man on the stairs.

[Alejandro]

You'd have to get it together.

[Meg]

See him.

[Kate]

See him watching down the stairs.

[Alexis]

That's what people report feeling. Still would like to know if Backyard. There's children here.

[Kate]

Grow. You smile. Thank you for coming to my house.

[Alexis]

Thanks for having us.

[Kate]

I'm very proud. I've been here forever.

[Alexis]

Yeah.

[Alejandro]

I'm feeling a really. This is Alejandro speaking. I'm feeling a very tight feeling in my chest.

[Kate]

Do you like it?

[Alexis]

Yeah. We love this place. I'm gonna come here a lot and enjoy.

[Kate]

No stranger.

[Alexis]

Yeah. Thank you.

[Kate]

You can come back.

[Alexis]

Okay. Thank you.

[Alejandro]

I don't think that's necessary.

[Alexis]

I think we got both characters here.

[Kate]

I want them to hear me. Whenever could he possibly want My voice and my love.

[Alexis]

There you go. That's what we're here to do. Your voice is going to go across. Yeah.

[Stephen Ballew]

Go out to all of our listeners and the community of Austin and you

[Kate]

can tell me main mission sound.

[Meg]

Wow.

[Alexis]

It's crazy.

[Kate]

I am aware that you're speaking to me.

[Alexis]

Yeah.

[Alejandro]

What happened to him?

[Kate]

Rosa.

[Alexis]

Thanks.

[Kate]

Also the gardens and the children. They play downstairs. They don't live here.

[Alexis]

Okay.

[Kate]

Visitors.

[Alejandro]

They're not a bad person.

[Kate]

Lots of visitors.

[Tracy]

So they don't live here. Yeah.

[Kate]

Keeps to himself. Keep it tidy and clean. The toys.

[Alejandro]

He stopped me where I was.

[Kate]

Knickknacks and clutter and a leaky faucet. Nothing else.

[Alexis]

Whoa, whoa, whoa.

[Meg]

Hope.

[Alexis]

I saw a figure right through the hallway right now. Yes.

[Tracy]

Which way?

[Kate]

My home.

[Stephen Ballew]

It was clear like.

[Alejandro]

Like overnight.

[Stephen Ballew]

Moved that way.

[Tracy]

This way.

[Alexis]

Yeah.

[Kate]

They were out. Time and the ages.

[Alexis]

Rosa, I don't mean to inter. I don't mean to interrupt, Rosa, but I saw a figure.

[Kate]

Treat him with respect.

[Alexis]

I. I saw a figure back there in the hallway. Can you tell?

[Kate]

Thank. Kindness.

[Tracy]

Think so.

[Alexis]

Can you tell us who that was?

[Stephen Ballew]

Do you know who's down here?

[Alexis]

One.

[Kate]

Have you heard Lots of noise and shuffle.

[Alexis]

Yeah, we were chasing together. We're chasing something over there. Is there anything?

[Alejandro]

Whatever does that mean?

[Alexis]

Can you help us determine what. Who that was. Was that you or were you peeking in at us?

[Kate]

Yes.

[Alexis]

Okay. Well, I think I might have seen you.

[Kate]

He's correct.

[Tracy]

Four,

[Alexis]

before we go, is there any. Any other clarifications we need to make

[Stephen Ballew]

about any of the spirits?

[Kate]

Mostly correct.

[Alexis]

Mostly correct.

[Kate]

Some things are not the same. Yeah, sometimes they get in.

[Alexis]

That's what I was thinking too.

[Kate]

A rush.

[Alexis]

Passerbys, maybe travelers.

[Kate]

It's energy moving.

[Alejandro]

Tread carefully.

[Kate]

He can't see that he lives on a different plane. Where there is structure and stability. But life is not like that. Really. That is why I'm able to move from floor to floor freely.

[Alexis]

Very smart spirit.

[Kate]

Effortlessly. I'm not quite sure I like to dance. Thank you for playing music. I'm here.

[Alexis]

I think the remaining questions I have is. I have no idea.

[Kate]

More in time.

[Alexis]

More in time. Might learn it. Don't know if the man upstairs is James or John, but I like it. Talking about your spouse?

[Tracy]

It's new, but I like like it.

[Kate]

Oh, she's very interesting.

[Tracy]

Yeah. How about it's new that I like it. She very interesting.

[Kate]

I had no idea that this world existed before I died.

[Alexis]

I'm.

[Kate]

Well, I'm happy.

[Tracy]

It's been around for 3,000 years.

[Kate]

I'm joyful to help where I can and take care of the spirit space. My father. It's different. No, I was respected.

[Alexis]

I was respected.

[Kate]

Well, sometimes. But it's not what you expect or would think. We live in different places and different times. I go back and forth, see. Can you see me?

[Alexis]

I thought I saw you.

[Kate]

Can you tell him if you can hear me?

[Alejandro]

What do you mean? There will be a change?

[Kate]

Not the same. No. But he's here.

[Alexis]

Not the same, she said.

[Kate]

Conflict with no resolution. Being replayed at the top.

[Alexis]

My child circle father. Really? What did he say?

[Tracy]

My child.

[Alexis]

They were here.

[Kate]

Relaxing. Peaceful. Everything in working order. As it should be.

[Alexis]

Well, I'm going to save the last words for the current owner of the space. We're going to let Tracy have the final word to just say anything she wants to the spirits here.

[Tracy]

Take care of your space. If you'll have us. Thank you so much for talking to us tonight. I hope you know that we'll take care of your house.

[Kate]

I feel like this is Rosa showing me and I see her and they're living or existing in the space. But an energy comes to the door and they can see the energy move through the building. So it's happening at the same time, but it's not the same. Same people. And it's not even people. It's the noise of energy moving, banging, manipulating. Okay, together. We're together. And also separate. I am intelligent.

[Alexis]

Yeah, Rosa, we know you're intelligent. Very strong.

[Kate]

You can hear me?

[Alexis]

Yeah. Can you move something? Just if you have the energy. Not if it's gonna.

[Kate]

Writing helps. Writing helps with notes.

[Alexis]

Okay.

[Kate]

His notes.

[Alejandro]

Oh, something just touched my face.

[Alexis]

Okay, last chance. If you can make your presence known by moving something very, very clearly for us.

[Kate]

I'm here. Unclear.

[Alexis]

Okay, we're gonna do a countdown from 10. You guys can speak, you ladies can speak. Anything you want to get across in this last 10 seconds.

[Stephen Ballew]

This isn't the last. We're always here.

[Alexis]

We might come back and do some more investigations with other psychics, other mediums, to get further answers.

[Stephen Ballew]

I hope you'll welcome us.

[Alexis]

And we're gonna go ahead and close this out, starting now. 10.

[Alejandro]

I don't see what the point of this is.

[Tracy]

9.

[Kate]

Under wraps.

[Alexis]

8. 7.

[Kate]

Haunting.

[Alexis]

6. 5.

[Kate]

But not really.

[Alejandro]

4 of you.

[Kate]

We're not scary.

[Alexis]

3. 2.

[Kate]

We're just people.

[Alexis]

What?

[Kate]

Who have lived.

[Stephen Ballew]

As our first night at the old rock store came to an end, one thing had become abundantly clear. This investigation was far more complex than any of us had anticipated. More than any other presence, our final session seemed to revolve around the woman both Kate and Alejandro had independently been sensing throughout the night. The repeated references to Rose or Rosa. The conversation centered around the property and its family, and the remarkably similar impressions shared by two mediums who had never compared Notes all continued pointing us toward the possibility that we were somehow interacting with the woman so many former employees and visitors had long believed to be Rosa Selma Patton. But there were still plenty of unanswered questions. Who was the older gentleman so strongly tied to the watchmaker's studio and this property? Could he somehow be James Andrew Patton, whose life became inseparable from the old Man Rock store and the community of Oak Hill itself? And what about the shadow man? Was he connected to the Patton family at all? Could he possibly be John Dudley White, Rose's husband, whose life was taken tragically on duty as a Texas Ranger? Or was he someone else entirely, A passerby, drawn here long after the Patton family had gone? At this point, all we had was theories. But after everything we'd experienced tonight, I couldn't ignore how often the historical record, eyewitness testimony, and our independent psychic impressions seemed to intersect, our investigation was far from over. I still aimed to speak with more former employees from the building's years as the Austin Pizza Garden, discover accounts from psychics who had investigated the property long before we ever arrived and tracked down someone who had actually lived upstairs during the 1980s. Most importantly, our team would also return for another night inside the Old Rock Store, hoping to answer many of the questions that this first investigation has left behind. Because whether these experiences ultimately pointed towards spirits, memories somehow imprinted upon a place or something else we simply don't yet understand, one thought continued to stay with me. If places can hold memories, and if lives can leave impressions, and if the people who once called a place home somehow remain connected to it, then perhaps a haunting isn't always something to fear. Perhaps it's simply history refusing to be forgotten. Thanks for listening to this episode of the Night Owl Podcast. Be sure to join Join us as this paranormal adventure at the Old Rock store continues on July 27th. I'd like to thank my investigative team, Alexis, Franklin, Alejandro and Kate for lending their abilities on this case and Meg for joining us on this case Nicholas Fair for his talented musical contributions to this show my dad Sam, for his incredible historical research and last but not least, David Dalton of Driftworks Sound for mastering every single episode on the tight turnarounds I give him. Please support their works by visiting our website thenight owlpodcast.com and clicking on the about tab. There you can find links to all their individual works and websites. This podcast was mastered by David Dalton of Driftworks Sound. Do you have a song that could use a professional touch to get it across the finish line? Do you wish you could remove the sound of a loud air conditioner or distracting mouth noises from your podcast recording? Whatever your issue, David can repair and enhance your audio and help you achieve rich, full professional sound at industry standard loudness levels. Quit struggling with audio engineering and get back to creating. To discuss your options, reach out to davidriftworksound.com that'S-R-I f t worksound.com and set your creative self free.