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- [00:01]
A
Audio for sleep by hatch. Hi, I'm Greta. Welcome to the nightly from Hatch, where your late night thoughts go to rest. Just me, me here tonight in the pillow fort. But I am glad to have you listening right now. And we're actually going to be opening up the lines. We'll talk to a listener in a little bit, which will be very nice. And if you want to come on the show to talk about really anything that's on your mind, you can email us or send a voice memo to the nightlyatch Co. I'm trying to think of if there's really anything on my mind these days. I feel like I don't know about y', all, but June is such a just like crazy busy month that the thing that I've really been struggling with before going to bed lately is just all these like logistical thoughts in my head. And it's so nice to just give myself a break from that, which is what we are going to do right now with our caller Ian. Ian, where are you calling from and what are you thinking about tonight?
- [01:35]
B
I am calling from just northwest of Los Angeles and I am currently thinking about comic books.
- [01:46]
A
Oh yeah? What about comic books?
- [01:49]
B
I think about comic books a lot at night because one of the last things I usually do before going to sleep at night is end up reading some comic books. Cause I don't have a lot of time during the day and I usually find that's kind of a nice wind down before going to sleep.
- [02:05]
A
That's so interesting. I think I might have guessed that, like, I don't know because I think of comic books as being so like action packed, as maybe like a too exciting thing to do before bed. But it works for your brain.
- [02:17]
B
I think it's less about the exciting or, or boringness of whatever the content is and it's far more about going through the day to day. You're dealing with all of the responsibilities and things that you have to focus on. And it's a nice way to kind of disconnect. It's not fully escapist, but it's kind of escapist and kind of almost like say, prepping your brain for dreaming before you actually gone to sleep.
- [02:48]
A
Ooh, I love that. Do you ever find that you like dream in comic book panels?
- [02:55]
B
I don't necessarily think that I dream a lot about whatever it is that I have read right beforehand, but I do find it a lot easier to fall asleep having kind of set aside the concerns of the day.
- [03:13]
A
Mm. Do you think there's something too like I know, not all comics are like superhero y, but like, I don't know, I feel like there's something about when you read something and the stakes are so high and totally different from your own life. I think that's kind of speaks to the escapist thing. But I think sometimes that can almost also just be nice to give you that perspective of like, oh, maybe it's okay that the chicken was dry today or whatever. You know what I mean? Dinner wasn't that great, but it doesn't matter.
- [03:50]
B
Yeah. And I think too, I definitely read a lot of stuff that's not just superheroes. But even with things that are more noir or interpersonal drama, if it is worth writing a story about, it's usually going to be something that is worse than whatever I have going on.
- [04:12]
A
Exactly. Yes. So when did you get into reading comics?
- [04:17]
B
I read comics a lot as a kid. You know, typical super into Spider Man. When I was a little kid, I also really loved Ghost Rider because I was a young boy and how could you say no? I didn't even know what was going on in the comics. But I couldn't not get excited about a guy with a flaming skull and a flaming motorcycle.
- [04:36]
A
Fair enough.
- [04:37]
B
Yeah. But I had kind of set all of that aside for a long time and then ended up having our. My wife and I had our first kid a couple of years ago. And this is something that I've talked with a lot of moms who have gone through, but dads tend to talk about this less. But there is a sense where you suddenly are giving everything in your focus and your energy towards someone else that you do start to not always fully lose a sense of your personal identity, but start to really crave something that is just yours that you are just doing for you. And so for some people that's going to the gym or some other hobby. For me, I was actually cleaning things out to get rid of a bunch of stuff before the baby came. And I found my old box of comics and I started going through it and I start being like, oh my gosh, I can't remember. I had no idea I had this. Or I totally forgot I had that. And then it just kind of re stoked that passion in me. And once the baby was born, once you have a kid, those first couple of months, you have simultaneously no time at all. And also nothing but time to sit and do something for like five or ten minutes.
- [06:03]
A
Yes, yes.
- [06:05]
B
And so that was something that was perfectly, you know, one issue, read it in five, 10 minutes, and then back to whatever I needed to do for the baby.
- [06:13]
A
That's so nice too, because it's like such a good increment, like the fact that they are kind of in these bite sized pieces. Because then you're not just sort of like chipping away at like a 500 page book or something. Like you can feel like you've like accomplished something even in a limited amount of time.
- [06:29]
B
Yeah, yeah, I tried to get back into it. I had been reading a good amount of novels and things like that before we had the kid, but my brain was so fried from lack of sleep and trying to read a book, even if it was an ebook, where you have the literal number in front of you saying, hey, you just made it from 10% to 12% today. And I just. I couldn't do it. I couldn't do it. I needed pictures and I needed something fast. So.
- [06:57]
A
Well, even the, the like, you know, they'll tell you the percent, but then also how long it takes to finish it. And sometimes seeing that like 7 hours, 48 minutes is like, seriously. Yeah, you know, so funny. I have heard from a lot of new moms who find that audiobooks are really helpful, which is, I think, different in terms of attention span and the bite sizedness, but especially when it comes to like breastfeeding or just being able to like, engage with the story while folding laundry, walking around with the baby or whatever. And that makes a lot of sense to me too. It does seem like just having something to kind of focus on that's not just this new human that you're really worried about does make a lot of sense.
- [07:42]
B
Yeah. I think the only reason I didn't get more into audiobooks was the fact that I already was really into podcasts. And so I always had a dozen different podcasts to listen to. And so that was what I would end up turning to before I would turn to audiobooks.
- [08:00]
A
So I feel like. I mean, I took a graphic novel class in college that was really cool. We did like Persepolis and Linda Berry. What is that? Do you remember what that one's called? It's like my favorite thing is Monsters, I think.
- [08:16]
B
Oh, yes. Yeah. Which she actually came out with a sequel to that just within the last year, I think.
- [08:23]
A
Oh, cool.
- [08:23]
B
It was a pretty big gap in between, but there just was a sequel to that. I haven't gotten around to it.
- [08:30]
A
That's amazing. What is the other? I feel like I read one fairly. Who wrote Fun Home? Do you remember?
- [08:36]
B
Oh, who wrote Fun Home? I can't remember. That wasn't Bechdel, was it?
- [08:42]
A
Alison Bechdel? Yes, yes, yes.
- [08:44]
B
Okay.
- [08:45]
A
That's another one I actually got to interview her for. She wrote one about, like, exercise and middle age, which was very charming, but that's kind of the most I've delved in. What would you recommend for someone who, like. I mean, I'm like, cool with nerdy. Like, I'll read books with dragons and stuff, but I just, like, haven't spent much time with comics.
- [09:08]
B
You know, it's kind of a hard question to ask, or rather a harder question to answer without a little more information. Because the truth is, we are at a stage now there's been huge boom and interest in comics in general, with the Marvel movies and DC stuff and all of that, but there's also been a huge growth in independent stuff that's come out that just completely runs the gamut of interests. And so it's kind of like saying, I've been. I've been really interested, like, what kind of book should I read? There's just any kind of subject matter that you want to read. Something for you. Yeah. If you're into classics, there are graphic novel adaptations of various, like classic literature, even things that are less considered classic literature but are still like, well regarded novels. There is an artist named Darwin Cook who was kind of. He did some things in the superhero realm, but he was never widely accepted because he had a very distinctive style that was not with what everything was kind of looking like in the 90s and early 2000s. But he ended up getting approved to do an adaptation of Richard Stark's Parker novels, which are kind of like noir crime novels, and they're widely considered. I think he did a couple of them before he passed away. But those adaptations that he did are widely considered like some of the greatest novel adaptations into graphic novel. They're beautiful. He doesn't just have blocks of prosecution and then like a picture here or there. It's truly conveying both the text and also the feeling of it and the kind of core of what the book is.
- [11:19]
A
That's so cool because, I mean, I read a lot and I think a lot also about the art of adaptation, usually from book to screen. And there's so much to that. Right. And it is, you know, I mean, I think they're really just completely different art forms ultimately. And I think that's often where fandoms can get really frustrating is like, if they just think the movie should be exactly like the book. I don't think that's doing justice to the fact That a movie is actually like an entirely different art form. And it's really interesting to think about that in the context of, like, going from a novel to a graphic novel or comic book. Cause I imagine it's the same and different, right? In terms of, like, how are you bringing these elements to life? What are the dimensions that you can really make happen in a comic book that you can't with just prose, for example?
- [12:20]
B
Well, I think so often with any kind of adaptation you have, what is ultimately needed is having somebody who respects and appreciates both art forms. And that's oftentimes where things fall short, is because someone, let's say it's a filmmaker adapting a book, they may have enjoyed the book, but they don't really respect or appreciate books as much as they do their art form or vice versa. It's not. No one group is solely responsible for that. But when you can have somebody who really appreciates the book and books as a medium and then also appreciates film when they adapt it, they don't just try to do scene for scene. They recognize, hey, we should include this scene that is important to informing the viewer who this character is and this development that they're having. Or we should leave out this other scene that even if people enjoy it, doesn't actually do anything for the plot or the development and doesn't carry through the feeling of the story totally.
- [13:26]
A
And, yeah, sometimes that means you can't have every single character. You know, like, it just doesn't make sense. They.
- [13:32]
B
They changed stuff with the Dune movie from the. Or that both Dune movies from the books and most of the changes that they made as I was watching it made sense to me. Seemed like a reasonable transition or change to make and not, you know, not just throwing things out for the sake of throwing things out.
- [13:53]
A
I do think that is, like, a pretty gracious interpretation on your part, though, because I'm sure you run into people who are like, it's not the same. And I'm really upset about that, you
- [14:02]
B
know, of course, and I get it,
- [14:05]
A
like, if you love the thing, but I think you just have to let it exist in a separate way.
- [14:10]
B
And remembering too people. It's really reasonable that people get incredibly attached to stories that move them and that they connect with in a certain way and really grab their imagination in a certain way. And then when somebody adapts it, whether the adaptation is good or bad, maybe they have problems with it, or maybe it's terrible and it just feels like it's spitting on the legacy, people so often lose Sight of the fact that the thing that they had. They can still go back and enjoy that. They can still enjoy the original version. The fact that a movie came out that wasn't as good or a graphic novel came out that wasn't as good as. It doesn't ruin whatever the thing that you loved is totally.
- [14:52]
A
Do you have. I mean, in general, I still do. And I think it's just because I am a book reader. Like, usually I will say the book is better because usually I think the book is better. Can you think of any movies or TV shows that you think are better than the books?
- [15:12]
B
One immediately comes to mind, but it is definitely not for everyone. Everybody has heard about it at this point because it's been pushed everywhere. But the Boys, which was based off of a comic book. The Boys show gets very violent and very.
- [15:36]
A
On Amazon prime, right?
- [15:37]
B
Yes. Yeah, it is very graphic. It is not going to be to everyone's taste. I'm not even 100% sure it's to my taste. But what I will say is that I had read the comic first and the show has a dark energy sense of humor, but it actually feels like a sense of humor. The comic has a lot of stuff in it that feels very edgelordy. Like, look at how far I can push it. And then I pushed it further. Aren't I a bad boy? Like, I made a really nasty thing. And so the things that they changed for the show, actually, as bad as the show can be, made it tamer in a way that is much more palatable. And I think a better show for it, rather than leaning so hard into just being graphic for graphic's sake.
- [16:33]
A
Mm. Well, that's an interesting one to think about too, because I mean, granted, I think I only made it through the first season, but it is a pretty interesting subversion of tropes that we're all very familiar with when it comes to superheroes saving the day.
- [16:52]
B
It'll be interesting to see how it ages over time because the truth is there's been numerous things like that over the years. Years. Watchmen was a really popular one when they came out in the 80s. That was. That was really kind of a stark criticism of superheroes and the idea of these altruistic, almost all powerful beings that Alan Moore wrote. And then when Zack Snyder made the movie, it felt much more like a celebration of superheroes. Just dark superheroes.
- [17:35]
A
Yes. And then that was an HBO show as well.
- [17:38]
B
Yeah, the show was better than the movie. Neither are as good as the graphic novel.
- [17:43]
A
Yeah, that makes sense. To me, this is like the opposite end of the spectrum, I think, from the boys. But one of my favorite adaptations in recent years is. Is Little Women, actually the Greta Gerwig film that came out maybe like 20. 20. 2019, right around then. I think she plays with time in it. She, like, doesn't this. The scenes in the movie do not align chronologically with the chapters in the book, and I think it works better than the book does.
- [18:18]
B
I didn't get around to seeing Little Women. My wife did and loved it. I don't know how she would feel about saying that it was better than the book.
- [18:29]
A
It's probably a controversial statement.
- [18:32]
B
She's very big on her classic lit, so I don't know if she would be fully on board with that. But the only thing that I know about it, other than her saying that she really enjoyed it and that everybody gave a really good performance in it, was that somehow or another, it has gotten to the point where she regularly. Either she or I both will regularly quote the scene in that movie where the dad, Bob Odenkirk, comes out and just goes, my Little Women. You just always love when a person says the name of the thing in the thing.
- [19:14]
A
Mm. Well, also, just the sheer delight and surprise of seeing Bob Odenkirk walk into the frame of that film was just like. I cackled in the movie theater because I just was not expecting it. And it was perfect. It was great.
- [19:29]
B
It's always nice when I hesitate to call it a cameo, but when a cameo like that happens and somebody shows up and you're like, you're not supposed to be here. But I'm happy you watch.
- [19:41]
A
Yes. My boyfriend and I have been rewatching the West Wing, which is quite a rewatch in the year of our Lord 2026.
- [19:48]
B
Yeah.
- [19:49]
A
But Jane lynch plays a reporter in a couple of episodes, and it's so funny to see her in, like, the West Wing press pool, because it's just like, Jane lynch, you don't belong here. You're supposed to be a cater waiter and party down.
- [20:03]
B
There's so many people like that, though, when you go and watch older shows like West Wing, West Wing's not a crazy old show. But then you look to see when it came out and realize, oh, that was like, 20 years ago.
- [20:16]
A
Yeah. There is not a computer on President Bartlett's desk. I will say, yeah.
- [20:21]
B
And so there are times where you'll watch a show like that that doesn't feel that old, but you'll be watching it and realize it's Not a cameo. That person just wasn't a huge name yet. They might have been recognizable and showing up in bit parts and character acting roles, but weren't necessarily a household name.
- [20:42]
A
Yeah. Ian, I hate to ask like such an existential question, but do you think perhaps that watching an old show that doesn't feel old is just because we are old?
- [20:54]
B
It depends on the old show. I think we are now reaching a point where you can legitimately call some shows old that are. Since HD became relatively mainstream. Sure. Because that was the mid 2000s and that's 20 years ago. And so there are some of those shows that are 20 years old. Were higher budget shows that were filmed on good cameras with good film.
- [21:29]
A
Yes. Actual film.
- [21:31]
B
Yeah. That upscale. Well, and you watch it and it's the quality at least doesn't pull you out of it. So it doesn't feel as old. Band of Brothers is that way. Which it does feel old once you start seeing random people popping up like John Krasinski or like Jimmy Fallon as just like MP number two driving Jeep. And it is. They look so young and it is very distracting.
- [21:57]
A
Yes. Especially those two who are like, like they have reached like ultra human fame. You know what I mean? It's like they're beyond the rest of us. They're just extremely famous, like perpetually tanned people, you know?
- [22:10]
B
Yes. Very household name at this point.
- [22:12]
A
Yes. Extreme household name. Oh, that's so funny. Well, Ian, thank you for chatting with me. I hope you have a good night.
- [22:20]
B
Thanks. Have a good night.
- [22:23]
A
If you want to come on the show to talk about anything that is on your mind, email us or send a voice memo to to the nightly at Hatch Co. It could be your favorite cameos in TV shows, your favorite library app or a cookbook you really love. Truly, anything at all. Tonight I would like to say goodnight to my sweet, angelic, chaotic bull terrier puppy, Buffy, who is just a little tornado when she is awake. And just the cutest, sweetest little baby which when she's sleeping. Good night, Buffy.
- [24:12]
B
Sa. Sa. Sa. Sam. Foreign.
- [28:14]
A
To learn more about our phone free light and audio experience, head to Hatch co. You can also follow us at HatchPodcasts.