How to Stop Hiccups w/ Ian Chillag

Summary

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The Nightly — June 23, 2026

Episode: "How to Stop Hiccups w/ Ian Chillag"

Summary by The Nightly Podcast (Hatch Podcasts), hosted by Josh Gondelman with guest Ian Chillag

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Episode Overview

In this warm and playful bedtime episode, Josh Gondelman is joined by returning guest Ian Chillag (host of Everything Is Alive, producer of NPR's How to Do Everything). The pair explore the curious world of hiccups—specifically, Ian’s surprising and proven method to cure them. This conversation organically opens into a broader meditation on creativity, the virtue of weirdness, and the joy of singular artistic voices. Listeners are invited to unwind as the hosts chat candidly about the delight of individual perception and the wonder of bringing unique projects into the world.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Ian’s Reputation as a Hiccup Curer

• Ian shares his "heroic moment" (01:08) of being known within and beyond his friend group as a reliable hiccup cure provider.
• He reveals how people—even strangers—will call him specifically for hiccup-related help:

  “I am known as a hiccup curer… I will get phone calls from people I don’t know, and they will say, ‘I heard from our mutual friend that you can help me right now. I’m desperate.’” — Ian (04:28)

2. The Hiccup-Guided Meditation

• Ian’s Method (02:11–04:23): He walks Josh (and the listeners) through his hiccup-stopping ritual—a meditation involving a hand pushing against a door to keep out a howling wind in a cabin.

• Step-by-step Meditation:

  • Take a deep breath and hold it
  • Visualize being in a cabin as the wind blows hard outside
  • Picture a hand pushing back against the door to keep the wind out
  • The wind and hand maintain a tense, enduring standoff

• Ian notes:

  “At this point in the meditation, I usually notice that the person’s hiccups have stopped. And at that point, we calm down the wind and the hand can relax. And it really has never failed.” — Ian (04:17)

• Origin of the Technique:

  • The method originated from a listener’s mother and was shared with Ian during the How to Do Everything podcast.

3. The Spread of the Hiccup Method

• The duo discuss the “family tree” of people who have received and now use this meditation, half-jokingly celebrating the potential slow "eradication" of hiccups:

  “We may, over time, be eradicating hiccups as it spreads around the world.” — Ian (06:24)

4. Creative Imagination & Personal Weirdness

• Josh and Ian explore the unique mental images listeners have during the meditation’s “hand pushing on the door” scenario (07:17–10:48).
  • Examples: ghost hands, giant Mickey Mouse gloves, personal or loved one’s hands, even Thanos's Infinity Gauntlet.
  • Inviting Listener Responses: Josh encourages listeners to write in with their own visualization.
• This leads into a discussion of an author, Sarah Blake, and her views on weirdness as individuality.

  “In weirdness is where you realize human beings are different and individuals.” — Sarah Blake (via Ian, 09:54)

5. Artistic Uniqueness & Creativity

• Ian describes finishing the second volume of the novel On the Calculation of Volume, reflecting on the improbability and gratitude of unique voices and small publishers in bringing unique art to the world:

  “…how unlikely it is that, you know, a tiny, weird, unique piece of art gets…consumed by people.” — Ian (12:46)

• Josh draws a parallel with the sketch show I Think You Should Leave, marveling at how such specific, “weird” work could find an audience.

6. The Challenge of Creative Integrity in Entertainment

• Anecdotes about pitching shows in Hollywood show how unique ideas are often reshaped by prevailing trends, sometimes losing their individuality (14:00–15:11):

  “…those things, that Mare of Easttown, that Squid Game, those were things that were…let be the uni thing. No one said, turn this into a thing that exists.” — Ian (15:11)

• Josh mentions the Dead Pilot Society podcast, which stages readings of unaired pilots, and the romanticism of ideas that only exist in the creative “what if” space (16:00–16:55).

7. Celebrating the Miracle of Singular Works

• Both hosts reflect on times when the effort to enjoy art is met with something dazzling, restoring faith in taking creative risks (17:09–18:20).
• The conversation spotlights shows like Oratorio for Living Things and Oh, Mary as examples of fun and originality triumphing in live theater.

8. The Value of Not Over-Researching

• Ian explains that for his podcast Everything Is Alive, actors are discouraged from researching their object to encourage more creative and unique characterizations (20:13–21:15).

  “…it is important to the audience that you know exactly the amount a normal person knows.” — Ian (21:10)

9. Thunder as Metaphor

• Josh and Ian end on a playful note, personifying thunder and tying back to the earlier creative prompt about describing thunder in new and individual ways:

  “I’m going to wish a good night to thunder itself. Good night, thunder. I hear you. You’re doing what you’re doing and I respect that.” — Josh (21:55)

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Ian’s Recurring Role:

  “If you ever have the hiccups, you’re going to want to talk to Ian.” — Josh (05:35)

• On Weirdness as Creative Virtue:

  “Weirdness as the imperative to, like, be the most you.” — Josh (11:08)
  “In weirdness is where you realize human beings are different and individuals.” — Sarah Blake (via Ian, 09:54)

• On Artistic Miracles:

  “A tiny, weird, unique piece of art gets…to be consumed by people.” — Ian (12:46)

• On Originality in Hollywood:

  “Those…were things that were let be the uni thing. No one said, turn this into a thing that exists.” — Ian (15:11)

• On the Creative Process:

  “Inhabit the feeling of thunder more than a kind of clinical description.” — Josh (21:29)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:27–01:08 — Introduction of Ian Chillag as guest and explanation of his hiccup cure reputation.
• 01:41–04:23 — Ian demonstrates the hiccup meditation in detail.
• 06:14–07:02 — Discussion on the spread and impact of Ian’s hiccup cure.
• 07:17–10:48 — Reflections on how people visualize the “hand” in the meditation; the value of unique subjective experience.
• 09:02–10:48 — Story about author Sarah Blake and describing thunder.
• 11:33–12:54 — The gift of unique artistic voices; miracles in publishing.
• 14:00–15:43 — Pitching original TV concepts and the challenge of staying unique.
• 15:43–16:55 — Dead Pilot Society and the bittersweetness of unproduced work.
• 17:09–18:20 — The elevated stakes of consuming art as a parent and the joy of great performances.
• 20:13–21:15 — Everything Is Alive: Why actors must avoid research.
• 21:34–22:08 — Good night wishes, including to thunder itself.

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Final Tone and Takeaway

The episode is gentle, imaginative, and full of friendly wit. Through their easy rapport, Josh and Ian not only share a proven cure for hiccups but open a space to embrace creative weirdness, cherish individuality, and wonder at the collective improbabilities behind great art. Listeners are left at ease, encouraged to honor both the everyday battles (like hiccups) and the singular visions that make the world more interesting.

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For listener participation:
Write in with your "hand" visualization or late-night thoughts: [e-mail]

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Transcript

[A]

Audio for sleep by hatch. Hello and good evening, everyone. I'm Josh.

[B]

And I'm Ian. Welcome to the Nightly from Hatch, where your late night thoughts go to rest.

[A]

So as you probably already know, if you're listening, we're having a bunch of fun guest co hosts, like fascinating, interesting people, friends that we want to catch up with. Pop into the pillow fort with us on the nightly and if you have anything you want to hear from us or hear us talk about or questions for anybody, you can always send those in at the nightlyatch Co. And this week I am joined by my friend and podcast host of the shows Everything Is Alive as well as NPR's how to Do Everything. It's Ian Chillag back on the show. Hello, Ian. Hi.

[B]

I'm having a very heroic moment right now. I just before we sat down to record, I got a call which I get from time to time from someone asking me to help them with the hiccups. I'm known in my friend group and my friends friends groups from people I don't know. I am known as a hiccup curer. Wow. And I got the call just moments ago and was able to relieve someone's hiccups.

[A]

That's incredible. Can you share your method or is it like secret and proprietary?

[B]

You'll just have to trust me that if you had hiccups right now, this would stop them.

[A]

I wouldn't have them anymore.

[B]

They would be gone.

[A]

Right. I guess the only way to really disprove your method would be if I started hiccuping.

[B]

Yeah. If we could get Josh and old timey drunk, I think would be the way to make sure you just bubbles

[A]

coming out of my mouth. Big jug with three X's on it.

[B]

So it's a guided meditation. Okay. And it's always the same. And I've done this. So you are a frequent panelist on Wait, Wait, Don't Tell me. Which I produce. One time, Peter Sagal, the host of that show, was doing a live taping in front of hundreds of people and got the hiccups and couldn't get rid of them. The show had to stop and I did it to him on stage and cured the hiccups.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

And they did not come back for the rest of the show.

[A]

This is incredible.

[B]

Here's how it goes.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

I'm going to ask you to take a big breath, a big deep breath and hold it. You can let it go at some point, but hold it for a little while. And I want you to imagine that you're in A cabin in the middle of the woods. And the wind outside the cabin is blowing hard. It's rattling the shutters. It's pushing at the door. You hear it blowing around the edges. It's blowing and blowing. And you desperately want to keep the door shut. And in front of you, there's a hand, and a hand is pushing back at the door. The wind is trying to blow the door in, and the hand is pushing the wind back. And the wind blows, and the wind blows, and the hand pushes back at the door. You hear it howling in the trees. You hear it rattling the shutters above. You hear it whipping around the corners of the cabin. You hear it pushing and pushing as hard as it can to open the door of the cabin. But the hand pushes back, no matter how hard the wind blows. And the wind blows harder and harder. The hand pushes back on the door. The hand pushes back. It feels as if the wind might be stronger than the hand, but the hand never fails. The hand pushes and pushes and doesn't let the wind in. And at this point in the meditation, I usually notice that the person's hiccups have stopped. And at that point, we calm down the wind and the hand can relax. And it really has never failed this battle.

[A]

Now, did you invent this method or did you learn it from someone else?

[B]

I did not. In our NPR podcast, How to Do Everything, usually people call in with questions and we solve them, but someone called in and said, I just have to tell you a solution. I have. And he said his mother had done this meditation in their family, and. And it always worked, and he did it to us. And I have spread it throughout my life. And I literally. I will get phone calls from people I don't know, and they will say, I heard from our mutual friend that you can help me right now. I'm desperate.

[A]

And you know that it's always a hiccup situation.

[B]

Yeah. No one calls me for help with anything else.

[A]

Well, that it feels like this specific situation or that specific setup is probably fairly unique to the. You know, I don't get a lot of calls unannounced that are like, I've heard you're a man with a solution.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. When you put it that way, it is like the most specific of the X Men. Like, oh, this guy, he can do magnet power. This person creates storms. But if you ever have the hiccups, you're going to want to talk to Ian.

[A]

And he's a mutant for that. That's like a mutant quality. Yeah.

[B]

Kind of lost the Mutant lottery.

[A]

How often do you get these calls? Now?

[B]

The calls from strangers are rare, but they do happen. But in my life, I will solve my friends hiccups. I would say monthly. I'm helping out with hiccups.

[A]

That's really generous. And then how many people do you think? Outside of the podcast, obviously, because that reaches a big audience, but in your own life, how many people, like, what is the tree that that has spread out through? Does that make sense?

[B]

How many people's hiccups have I stopped?

[A]

But also, how many people have you given the gift of that solution to, that they now use it in their own lives?

[B]

Yeah, yeah. It's nice to think about. We may, over time, be eradicating hiccups as it spreads around the world.

[A]

Yeah, that would be pretty amazing if just everyone had access to. To this tool. We have the technology to cure hiccups. It's just a matter of political will is what I'm coming to learn.

[B]

Yeah. Why is big hiccup holding us down?

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Who's. Who's beholden to whatever. What even causes hiccups? I know it's like kind of a spasm, but, like, I don't like drinking water too fast.

[B]

Your vasovagal nerve, I think. Yeah. Mm. But let me ask you this, because I realized as I was saying that.

[A]

Please.

[B]

When I said that there was a hand pushing back on the door, what did you picture? Did you picture your own hand?

[A]

I think I went through a few different options. At first, I maybe misunderstood and thought the. The hand was pushing with the. With the wind, like, on the other side of the door from me.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Because I was like, oh, that's. Then that's where the hand is. And then I pictured a hand kind of allied with me on the inside of the door, pushing, but not my hand. And then for a little while, I was like, maybe that's my hand. And then it was back to kind of spectral hand protecting me from the elements.

[B]

Yeah, I picture a giant, white gloved, Mickey Mouse hand.

[A]

Oh, interesting.

[B]

The size of a human being.

[A]

Oh, that's a big, big hand.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

Mine was hand sized, but it was translucent, like I was seeing through it, as if it was a ghost that could exert force on a door of the material world.

[B]

That's beautiful.

[A]

If you're listening and you heard this meditation and you have a hand that you are picturing, please write in and tell me. I would love to hear. And I'll share the results with Ian. That's thenightlyatch co if you want to write in and talk about what kind of hand you are envisioning.

[B]

Did you ever read that book Naamah by Sarah Blake?

[A]

I don't think so.

[B]

It's great. It's a telling of the great flood story from the Bible, but from the perspective of Noah's wife.

[A]

Oh, interesting.

[B]

And I heard the author interviewed and the book is weird. And the interviewer was like, how do you feel about people saying this book is weird? And she said this great thing. She's like, I love it. She said that when she's teaching, she asks her students to describe thunder. And they go around the room and the first round, everyone's description of thunder is the same. You know, it booms. It's loud noises from the sky. And then they go around again, and she says, okay, get weirder, get weirder, get weirder. And as you do that, their descriptions start to spread out from each other and become more and more different from each other. And so she's essentially saying, like, in weirdness is where you realize human beings are different and individuals.

[A]

Totally.

[B]

I think that that's, like, very beautiful, but maybe in the way that we see these hands is how we realize we're individuals.

[A]

That's. I think that's wonderful. I love that idea because everybody, I imagine pictures slightly differently. I bet some people are like, oh, obviously it's my own hand pushing against the door. And some people are like, oh, it's the hand of a parent or a loved one across the room. And then giant Mickey Mouse gloved hand and ghost hand. There are so many ways it could look. And your description in the meditation is so Spartan that it really leaves room for any of those answers to be the answer to that question that wasn't asked but was implied.

[B]

Yeah. If you're out there and you pictured Thanos infinity gauntlet, let us know. If that was the first hand that came to mind, let us know.

[A]

Yeah, Josh Brolin's big hand with the gauntlet on it, and he's gonna snap and the wind stops. I love that idea, though, of, like, weirdness as creative virtue, because I think sometimes we talk about, like, stuff being, like, weird for weird sake or whatever as a pejorative. But I do think it's really wonderful, like, that kind of individual specificity of how, like, make it more your own. Right. Like, weirdness as the imperative to, like, be the most you. Is that something that you, like, think about with the work that you do professionally?

[B]

Yeah, all the time. All the time. And I think it's have you read on the calculation of volume?

[A]

I have not. It's like a time loop kind of story, right. In several volumes.

[B]

Yeah. It's a seven volume novel. Finished the second volume of it, and the protagonist is stuck on the same day, at least for the first two volumes. Kind of Groundhog day style, but the rules are a little bit different. But I had the weirdest sensation, something I've never felt before. I love these books. And I finished the second one, I was on an airplane and I closed the book and I thought, I'm so grateful that this unique person existed to write it. But then I'm also so grateful that there's a publisher that recognized the art and wanted and like, took the economic risk, the financial risk to then print it out and sell it to people. Like, something made me feel. Yeah, I don't know what it was about this book specifically that made me picture the whole machine and how unlikely it is that, you know, a tiny, weird, unique piece of art gets. Has the chance to be consumed by people. But yeah, I really, I just sat with the book that way.

[A]

I love that feeling too. I can think of, like, instances of, oh, it's like a miracle that this was assembled. Like, a team of people had to be assembled and like, so many people had to sign off on approvals and budgets and schedules, and so many people had to contribute their hard work to bringing this to life. And then it had to get out into the world and then I had to hear about it. And whether it's like a book or a TV show, I always really trip out on that. I'm trying to think of the last thing that I felt. I mean, the big one for me a few years ago was I remember when I think you should leave premiered. And I watched that first season and was like, how is this? How did this come to exist? It's so weird and specific. And then the additional joy of finding out, oh, it's not just for you. There's other people who had that feeling too. And that's so special.

[B]

Yeah. Well, I've just, you know, I've talked to my screenwriter friends about sort of the frustrations of pitching ideas in Hollywood. And a friend of mine was telling me that she was pitching something when mayor of Easttown was big, when that was like the show and she pitched her thing and sold it. And then three months later had written the pilot and got notes back, and they said, we love it, but can you make it a little more like mayor of Easttown? So she's like, okay, I guess it's not really. That's not really what it is. But so she went back and she did. She, mayor of Easttowned it, but by the time she had brought it back, I think Squid Game was the show. So she did the notes they asked for, brought it back, and they were like, oh, but can you make it a little more like Squid Game?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And so she. She's so frustrated by having this unique, very specific idea that they tried to change into this other thing and then into this other thing. But ultimately, the thing that you want everyone to realize is like, oh, but those things, that mare of East Town, that Squid Game, those were things that were. Let be the uni thing. They were. No one said, turn this into a thing that exists.

[A]

Yeah, totally. I feel like, you hear. You know, I think film and tv, it always feels like such a marvel when something weird comes into existence. Cause it just takes so much and it's so. With all the consolidation, it feels like there are a few people that are kind of in charge of, like, what everyone's taste has to be. And so when something gets past one of those people or resonates with them really strongly, you're like, whoa, that's amazing.

[B]

I know. I wish we could. I wish that the things that didn't get made that got spat out by that system, that they became ghosts and we could somehow know all of them, like, know everything that was a totally unique idea that didn't get made. There was some place where we could just watch all of those things.

[A]

I know there's. There's a podcast called Dead Pilot Society. Do you know of this? No. And they do readings, staged readings of pilots, first episodes of a TV series that either didn't get produced, I think usually, or did get produced and were never aired because it didn't go to series. And so there's audio recordings of some. And Ben Blacker produces it. He's a screenwriter based in la. And there might be another producer, too, who I'm forgetting, but I think it's so fun and it's kind of. I wish that all these cool ideas could happen, but there is, like, something. So I have such a, like, romantic attachment to the things that are. That I've written that have not gone anywhere where, like, they're kind of their own special. Like, they're perfect because they never had the chance to get made and get messed up.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So they're still like my perfect little idea babies.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah.

[A]

Do you have other things on that list of like, oh, gosh, what A what a special thing this is that we get to share, I would say,

[B]

with having two small children. So. Meaning I always am, to go out to see something, to go see a play or anything. There's this. Is it worth the babysitter? And so you go and you. I think that the stakes for something to be good are higher than they used to be for me. And when I go see a play that I'm excited about and it doesn't wow me, I feel this real heartbreak, you know, that these three hours weren't amazing. But then on the other hand, when I see something incredible, I just saw. Have you ever. Do you know Heather Christian's Oratorio for Living Things? Have you ever heard of this?

[A]

I haven't.

[B]

It's beautiful. It's closed now, but it'll open again. It's just like, you know, you're in it and you're experiencing a totally unique mind doing a totally unique thing with a bunch of people who totally understand it. And it makes you feel like, yes, it's always worth it to try and leave the house.

[A]

Yeah. You know what I really felt that about? You're reminding me by bringing up theater. When I saw oh, Mary Cola Scola's show that went from Off Broadway to Broadway and won a bunch of Tonys and has had a really tremendous rotating cast in the lead role, but also the supporting roles, I was like, I cannot believe that this is on a stage with this many people coming to see it every night and people get it and are telling other people about it. I was like, oh, the universe is artistically in alignment with values that I also share.

[B]

That is totally right. Yeah. I did have that feeling with that play. And I remember thinking like this so many times. You see something, you see something funny, and then you see someone have a moment where they're like, okay, but I also have to make it heavy. And that that play is just about fun. And, like, fun is the virtue, and it's accepting that fun is a virtue, and it's so magical in that way.

[A]

And I think there's a difference between, like, something feeling pleasant and going down easy because there's not much to it. But. But oh, Mary, if people don't know is a. It's like an extremely funny, silly, kind of dirty comedy about Mary Todd Lincoln written. And the role was originated by Kola Scola, who has said that they, when they were writing the play, did as little research as possible and just kind of went with it. And it is so funny and weird, and I completely agree with you that it is like wire to wire. There was nobody that was that gave a note of like, oh, but it needs this other thing to be valuable. It's like, no, what it is, is perfect.

[B]

You know that thing about research? One thing that we do on Everything's Alive, which is a show that I have where I interview inanimate objects played by actors like yourself. You played a chainsaw on the show very beautifully.

[A]

Thank you.

[B]

And when we started doing it, sometimes our actors would research the object they were playing and I would ask a question and they would come back with, well, you know, I'm actually the H6723 model of the light bulb, which was first made in 1926. And it's just like this. It's real information, but it's useless. And it's sort of like you never get to the character of the light bulb. And so after those sort of early examples, we would always tell people, do absolutely no research, know nothing. Like, it is important to the audience that you know exactly the amount a normal person knows.

[A]

This also kind of comes back to that directive of like, don't describe thunder the way everyone describes thunder. Right. Describe it the way that feels like personal and strange to you. Like, inhabit the feeling of thunder more than a kind of clinical description. I think we're kind of getting back to that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Oh, this is wonderful. I feel like, really delighted by this conversation and like very creatively inspired and at ease. And I think that's such a beautiful place to leave it for the night. So, Ian, thank you for being here with me in the pillow fort. Good night to you, of course. Good night to all of our listeners. And also I'm going to wish a good night to thunder itself. Good night, thunder. I hear you. You're doing what you're doing and I respect that.

[B]

I really want to hear thunder. Just whispering the gentlest goodbye back.

[A]

Good night.

[B]

Night. Josh, Sa.

[A]

Sam. To learn more about our phone free light and audio experience, head to Hatch co. You can also follow us HatchPodcasts.