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- [00:00]
A
Hello. You're about to drift into an episode of the Nightly A podcast designed to help you unwind and relax. For the full phone free immersive light experience, visit Hatch Co. Enjoy.
- [00:30]
B
Hail, you beautiful sleepy heads out there. I'm Kristen.
- [00:34]
A
And I'm Josh. Welcome to the Night Leaf from Hatch, a slumber party for pop culture lovers.
- [00:41]
B
Josh, it is so good to see you tonight. How are you doing?
- [00:45]
A
I'm doing very well, thank you. And yourself?
- [00:47]
B
I'm doing great. I just did a henna rinse on my hair yesterday. I had a few gray hairs that were starting to show, and I. A couple times a year, I like to put a henna rinse in and then those grayish silvery hairs, then they just look kind of like magenta reddish highlights.
- [01:06]
A
Oh, that's fun.
- [01:07]
B
Yeah, it's very subtle. Most people can't even see it, but that's very nice. But, yeah, I mean, I'm like, why not make those silvers a little bit more vibrant?
- [01:16]
A
You know, I have a couple silver hairs.
- [01:18]
B
Oh, you do?
- [01:19]
A
Out of not many hairs in total. And so whenever a new one shows up, I'm like, thanks for hanging around, buddy. Oh.
- [01:26]
B
Oh, that's a great attitude. Just be thankful for it.
- [01:29]
A
That's how I try to feel about it.
- [01:30]
B
Yeah, I should do that too.
- [01:32]
A
No, but I mean, like, you have wonderful hair and mine is just like, oh, boy. Like, it looks very. I can't grow it out. I look like a frazzled inventor.
- [01:42]
B
I've always really loved that look. One of my friend's granddads, when I was a kid, he didn't have much hair on top of his head, but he had these really exciting eyebrows. And.
- [01:53]
A
Oh, yeah.
- [01:53]
B
I was just like, oh, those eyebrows. Are it Grandpa Bob and his eyebrows? That's what life is about. Yeah.
- [02:00]
A
A couple of them at a time will get a little grandfatherly on me. And, like, I go to an Eastern European barber and he'll go, eyebrows. And I go, yes, please. And then he goes with the razor. Cause I do. I go to a barber shop every few weeks to get my head shaved because I can't bear to ask my wife to shave the back of my neck.
- [02:21]
B
It's too intimate when you get it done. Is it like a spa day where they put the hot towel on your head?
- [02:26]
A
They do the hot towel. Yeah. They do a nice job with it.
- [02:28]
B
Nice.
- [02:29]
A
I mean it. Truly. The whole thing takes like 10 minutes. They just go like. And then they straight raise the back of my neck and it feels nice and smooth. And that with, like, rich lather and then hot towel over my head. And I'm like, this is nice.
- [02:44]
B
Oh, that sounds great. Yeah. One of my favorite things about my henna day, when I do it a couple times a year, is I tell myself, this is spa day. This is your moment to not do anything. And so I love that feeling. I just spend a couple hours maybe watching dumb TV or reading a book or maybe even just, like, staring out the window at birds. And I tell myself, this is not a time to work or do anything else. Just enjoy this paste on your head.
- [03:11]
A
That's so mindful. Are you a big spa day person?
- [03:16]
B
Not really. I mean, I have friends who do the multi step face treatment thing, and I just don't think I have enough dedication to do that. I do maybe once a year or once every other year love to get a massage. It's not even every year, but when I get a massage professionally, I'm just like, oh, yeah, I wish I were rich so I could get this three times a week. It's so great.
- [03:43]
A
I like, struggle with massage because I feel I'm very. Generally, something about me is I hate to ask for anything. So, like, I'll be getting a massage, and if it's not firm enough, I'm like, hey, they're the expert. And then I'll leave being like, they barely touched me. And then if it's too firm, I also won't say anything. And I'll leave being like, I think I need, like, a recovery from this massage.
- [04:07]
B
I think I need to put some ice packs on these.
- [04:09]
A
Yeah, that's right. That's right. It feels like I just got out of, like, a martial arts class. Yeah.
- [04:15]
B
No, I. I'll come right out and say. I'm like, I need that a lot harder. I.
- [04:19]
A
That. See, that's the way to be.
- [04:20]
B
I want to be needed like a loaf of bread. I. I don't want to be patted like a baby. I want to be squished.
- [04:26]
A
I feel like if they're not squishing you, you're not getting your money's worth.
- [04:30]
B
Yeah. If I just want to be patted, I can do that to myself, you know?
- [04:33]
A
Totally. Right. You can get. Anyway, I bet there's people that'll pat you on the back for way less than the cost of a massage.
- [04:39]
B
Yes. Yes. And, you know, frankly, patting somebody on the back isn't even that much work either. Comp. A real massage. Yeah.
- [04:47]
A
Because I also feel like whenever I've given, like, my wife or, like, you know, someone I've dated in the past, like, oh, let me massage your shoulders. You had a tough day. I feel like five minutes in my hands are like, well, that's quite enough of that.
- [04:58]
B
Yes.
- [04:59]
A
And so to have it in you to do, like, multiple hour massage, that's like physical labor.
- [05:04]
B
Oh, it is. It is. So the people who do it, they deserve the big bucks.
- [05:08]
A
They deserve a massage.
- [05:09]
B
Yeah, absolutely. I hope everybody out there who gets massages, I hope you're tipping generously, and I hope all the folks out there who give massages, I hope your clients are treating you well. You deserve to be treated well, and I hope you get massages yourself. Yes.
- [05:23]
A
Like how therapists have their own therapists.
- [05:25]
B
Yes, absolutely. Yeah, they need them. I would need one if I had either of those jobs.
- [05:30]
A
Same.
- [05:31]
B
Well, Josh, I hope you don't mind me switching gears.
- [05:35]
A
That's totally okay.
- [05:36]
B
I would love to play a game with you tonight. What do you say we play the guest list?
- [05:50]
A
I love it. This is so fun. Always. Yes.
- [05:52]
B
All right. In this game, we each invite three people to our imaginary slumber party. But tonight, our theme is book characters, characters from books that you would invite to join us here in the pillow fort to, you know, maybe talk a good game with us, maybe do some hair braiding, do whatever we do in the pillow fort, you know?
- [06:19]
A
Sure.
- [06:20]
B
All right, so, Josh, I would love for you to start. There's a gazillion books out there. Choose any of them. Choose a character for many of them.
- [06:29]
A
Okay, so I'm going to do mine in order of when in my life I read the book. Okay, so I'm going to start with a book that I read very early on in life. A character that I think would be a great hang. That obviously a fictional character who I've never met. And I'm gonna go number one. Pick the Cat in the Hat.
- [06:47]
B
Oh, my gosh. The Cat in the hat is going to be trouble in our pillow fort. You know what he's gonna do while the rest of us are winding down? He's gonna be the one sneaking to the freezer with our underclose.
- [06:59]
A
That's right.
- [07:00]
B
And trying to freeze our socks or our underpants. Right.
- [07:03]
A
This guy knows how to party. That's what I'll say about the Cat in the Hat. He's a good time. He cuts loose. And I. I feel like I don't always let myself relax. Well, like, I work hard, and then I do not play hard. And, like, when I'm relaxing, I'm just kind of inert. So I Like the idea of bringing in a little chaos element into this slumber party and in the form of the Cat in the Hat. And it's also like, he's a cat. How mad can you get at him?
- [07:33]
B
Also, I will give this to the Cat in the Hat before the grownups come home. He always does clean up.
- [07:38]
A
He does clean up. And I'll tell you what, I've invited over many people to my home who don't help clean up. So Cat in the Hat, he's. He's got a leg up. One out of four on all those people.
- [07:49]
B
Yeah. He actually does the dishes. You know who does the dishes? Almost nobody. But the Cat in the Hat does.
- [07:53]
A
Yeah, the Cat in the Hat. Let him cook and then let him do the dishes.
- [07:56]
B
Okay. This is a really great guest idea, and I gotta say, very different from the kinds of guests I've chosen.
- [08:03]
A
My list is wide ranging. So I think we're gonna put together a really nice pastiche, whatever you wanna call it, but I think it's gonna be good. Okay, well, who is your first guest to our slumber party?
- [08:14]
B
Okay. So I decided that there's kind of a theme to my guests. All three of them are spurned lovers. All three of them are mysterious. All three of them seem kind of angry, for good reason, but also just. They're all very fascinating to me. And frankly, the books in which they appear, I don't think we learn enough about them. So I have a lot of questions. I feel like there's a lot of stuff going on in their lives that would be interesting to hear about. So I'm starting off with Miss Havisham from Great Expectations. Now, for those who may not be Familiar with her, Ms. Havisham is famously a wealthy spinster who was once jolted at the altar and who insisted on wearing her wedding dress from that day for the rest of her life in her crumbling mansion. And, my God, to hold onto bitterness like that your entire life for decades. I just feel like, sure, bitter people can be kind of irritating, but somebody like this, who is this dedicated, who's this committed to this position in life, she might be very fascinating to talk with.
- [09:23]
A
Oh, I bet Ms. Havisham has great stories. I bet she has a lot of grudges. She wants to air out. I think she would be a lot of fun to hang out with.
- [09:32]
B
Yeah. And I think that, you know, people who are bitter, you don't necessarily want to hang out with them every day, all the time.
- [09:39]
A
That's right.
- [09:40]
B
But one night in the pillow fort, I Think would be really fun, actually.
- [09:43]
A
I agree.
- [09:44]
B
You know, let's say we just want to air grievances all night. She'd be a really fun person to air grievances with. Right?
- [09:49]
A
Yeah, completely agreed. And I think there's something so special about this kind of relationship that you mentioned. Like the, okay, we're going to hang out one time and I just need to know everything and then, like, maybe we don't see each other again. Like a, Like a friendship one night stand.
- [10:05]
B
Yes, yes. Like the person you meet in the bar on that one night and you talk to all night, or at that one party, whatever it is, or you're at jury duty and they're the person you're sitting next to waiting for your name to be called.
- [10:17]
A
For sure. Yes. An airplane friend. Yeah, like all that kind of stuff. Like someone that you meet once and you're just like, oh, you have such an electric personality. My friend Mike described someone with such a personality as being, like, having a warm personality, but warm like a fire where it's like you can't be next to them for too long.
- [10:37]
B
That's exactly Ms. Havisham. You know, Ms. Havisham is electric, but this is not a daily thing. This is not a weekly thing. No, can't be. No, not at all.
- [10:47]
A
Love this. This is a great first round pick for this guest list.
- [10:51]
B
Oh, my God. And can you imagine Cat in the Hat and Miss Havisham hanging out together?
- [10:56]
A
I don't think they would get along.
- [10:58]
B
He'd be all chaos and she would be accepting none of it.
- [11:01]
A
Yeah, I think they would have conflict. That would be really fascinating.
- [11:06]
B
All right, Josh, I want to hear about your second book character, Pillow Fort guest.
- [11:12]
A
Second book character on my guest list is. And this is a book that I read as a younger person, but not as young as when I first encountered the Cat in the Hat. Of course, from the Great Gatsby, Jordan Baker.
- [11:25]
B
My gosh. We have a crossover, but not exactly a crossover, but.
- [11:29]
A
Well, tell me about it then. Let's do them together then.
- [11:31]
B
Okay, so I want Jay Gatsby himself. I want the Great Gatsby. But you tell me why you want Jordan and I'll tell you why I want Gatsby at the party.
- [11:41]
A
She seems like kind of a jerk. She's like, kind of witheringly sarcastic and she cheats at golf. Allegedly. And like, similar to your. To both of, I think, who we like introducing elements of, like, fascination and chaos into this party. I think someone who is like the subject of public scandal. Like a Light public scandal. Not like, you know, there's greater scandals in the Great Gatsby. But someone who is accused of cheating at golf is such a funny degree of intrigue. And I think, like, a mean person who is also, like, kind of lightly unethical is a fun person to hang out with for a little while.
- [12:26]
B
Yeah. Also, Jordan is so snooty.
- [12:29]
A
Yeah.
- [12:29]
B
And I think it's hilarious. It's like, tall, tan, snooty, like a model. But also just the commitment again, kind of like Ms. Havisham, where it's like, I'm still committed to the idea that I'm better than everybody else in this room. Even though you all know that I cheated in my professional golf career. I'm not actually a good golfer.
- [12:48]
A
And it's so funny. And like, my. I think my wife would find this very predictable of me because there is. She calls me. I don't think this is offensive to say that she calls me the Kook Whisperer, because I have, like, a real knack for, like, if we're out at a party together, there is, like, a borderline 100% chance. If there is a woman who is eccentric bordering on problematic, I will befriend her within minutes and learn her life story.
- [13:24]
B
Oh, my gosh. This also means you're gonna get along really well with Ms. Havisham.
- [13:28]
A
I think so, too. I think it's. So tell me about why you would bring Jay Gatsby into the fold.
- [13:33]
B
Okay. So Jay Gatsby, even though the book is named after him, even though he's the one throwing the lavish parties, even though the narrator of the book, Nick, is obsessed with Gatsby, even though Gatsby is held up as this kind of thing to idolize in the book, we don't actually ever really get to know Jay Gatsby. And he's a very mysterious character in so many ways. We know that he throws his parties because he's hoping to win back his former love, Daisy Buchanan. We know that he made a lot of money, but we have no idea of how he made the money. We don't really know much about his background. We don't know how he went from being a poor boy in North Dakota to being a gazillionaire. We don't know much about him at all. And a lot of what happens in the book is just in Nick's head, Right?
- [14:21]
A
Yeah.
- [14:22]
B
And what's not in Nick's head are little interactions between him and Jordan or him and Daisy or momentarily between him and Gatsby. But mostly, we don't really get to know Gatsby. And I want to talk to him. I'm like, how'd you make this money, dude? Yeah, what's going on there? How did you go from poor boy from North Dakota to this guy?
- [14:41]
A
I think that one interesting thing about the Great Gatsby, right, Is people often will have theme parties based on the novel and really kind of dig into the lavish roaring twenties of it all in defiance of the tragic conclusion of the book. And I think you and I are both cultivating this guest list to intentionally have a lot of bad vibes to it. I am glad that we are both inviting so much chaos. Cause if you were just like, yeah, I guess I want.
- [15:15]
B
I guess I'll bring Anne of Green Gables. Cause she's nice. No.
- [15:18]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, Walt Whitman. Just because I love poetry. I mean, he has some chaos elements, too. But I think, like, the idea that we're both like, this is gonna be a rip roaring bad time is really fun to me.
- [15:32]
B
Oh, yeah. It's gonna be a wild night. It really is. But I think that both of our Gatsby characters are going to clash with each other and with others.
- [15:41]
A
But, yeah, for sure.
- [15:42]
B
For sure. In a way that will entertain me and you.
- [15:45]
A
Yes, I agree. Yeah.
- [15:47]
B
All right. Who's your third and final guest?
- [15:50]
A
My third and final guest that I like to add to the guest list is a character from a book that I read just a few years ago. It's a much newer book. It's called Harlem Shuffle by Colson Whitehead.
- [16:02]
B
Oh, yeah.
- [16:04]
A
Have you read it? It's really, really good.
- [16:05]
B
Colson Whitehead, everybody. If you haven't read Colson Whitehead, please read Colson Whitehead, please.
- [16:11]
A
I know I haven't read all of the big ones by him. Like, you know, Nickel Boys became that really acclaimed film. And Sag Harbor. I remember being, like, such a prominent book when it came out. But I've read all his writing about poker. When he learned how to play poker and went to the World Series of Poker. I've read the Intuitionist, which is, like, about elevator inspectors.
- [16:34]
B
Yes, yes, that one. That was like, his first really big one, right?
- [16:37]
A
Yeah, I really like that. And then I read. And then this is one of the big ones, too. I think he won the second Pulitzer. Oh, and I haven't. The other one was Underground Railroad.
- [16:46]
B
Oh, it was fantastic. Love that book. Love it.
- [16:48]
A
But this book is part of a trilogy that is about. It's like kind of a uptown New York, 1960s heist story. And So I would like to invite to our party. I put him on the guest list. Ray Carney, who's the protagonist of Harlem Shuffle. There is some crime in his family history, and he's like, nope. I own a store, like a furniture store on 125th street in Harlem. And every once in a while, someone will have a stolen item that will pass through my store. But other than that, I keep my hands clean. No violence, no drugs. And then he gets pulled into a big heist. And I think that this kind of dichotomy of wholesome family man trying to stay on the straight and narrow versus, like, guy with all these incredible crime stories, I bet he's a real raconteur. Not that he would divulge any secrets. I don't think he's a snitch. But I just feel like he knows a lot of good secrets and gossip.
- [17:48]
B
Yes. That is a great pick.
- [17:51]
A
Thank you.
- [17:52]
B
And I bet he has a lot of good stories.
- [17:54]
A
I agree.
- [17:55]
B
Yeah. So many good stories. And you don't feel creepy hearing them from him because he's a good guy.
- [18:01]
A
Yeah, right.
- [18:02]
B
You don't feel like you're a party to something. That's awful. You're just like, he is so nice. Go ahead, tell me all the crime stuff.
- [18:07]
A
Right.
- [18:08]
B
And you can veil it. You're not a snitch. You can. You can say, well, a friend of a friend knew somebody who did this. Like, not going to name names. That's fine.
- [18:15]
A
Agreed. Yeah, I think that that is. You want to hear about this from someone you trust and not someone where it feels like there's, like, this extra layer of sinister intent lurking beneath.
- [18:28]
B
Yes, absolutely. Oh, he's gonna be a great guest.
- [18:31]
A
I think so. I think this party is really shaping up to be a good time.
- [18:34]
B
Okay. You might change your mind when I tell you my final guest.
- [18:38]
A
Very excited for this.
- [18:39]
B
Then things are gonna take a dark turn now.
- [18:42]
A
Perfect.
- [18:42]
B
My final guest is Bertha Mason, aka Mr. Rochester's wife. In the attic from Jane Eyre.
- [18:49]
A
Whoa.
- [18:52]
B
So are you familiar with Jane Eyre, Josh? No.
- [18:55]
A
I'm, like, woefully under read with the Bronte sisters.
- [18:59]
B
Okay, so this is a gothic novel by Charlotte Bronte. It follows Jane Eyre, who is an orphan who, you know, gets passed around from place to place and then eventually becomes a young adult, becomes a governess for Mr. Rochester's children. She hears noises at night. What are these noises? Oh, no. Turns out it's Mr. Rochester's first wife, Bertha, who is in the attic, and Mr. Rochester and Jane Eyre. Meanwhile, Are like, do I like you? Do you like me? So it's like there's this kind of, like, romance happening between these two. Meanwhile, there's the wife in the attic, Wife number one. And I don't want to spoil it for you, but maybe Bertha does get her comeuppance in the end.
- [19:44]
A
Sort of.
- [19:44]
B
But I do want to know about Bertha's life and her backstory. Surely there was something really interesting going on in her life that she was able to win the heart of Mr. Rochester when she was younger. Surely she must have had some lovely milestones in their relationship. They have this nice house and so on. And what's going on there? Bertha, you must know some real dark things about Mr. Rochester, too. We want to hear those secrets. Tell us everything. Tell us the good from your own life. Tell us the bad about Mr. Rochester. Get it all out. It's a safe space. Bertha, we're here for you. Tell us everything.
- [20:23]
A
I love that you've invited exclusively people with extreme romantic grievance gifts.
- [20:32]
B
Yeah, let out the pain. Let out the anger with us. Josh and I are here for you.
- [20:37]
A
What else is a slumber party for?
- [20:39]
B
Yes, we want to hear all of it. And I just realized something, Josh. We only have one stable person at this party.
- [20:50]
A
It's not me.
- [20:51]
B
Is he gonna be okay? Or is he just gonna be like, I'm leaving and going back to the furniture store now? I can't.
- [20:55]
A
No. I bet he would like to have a nice night out. You know, he's a family man. I would like to have a night out with no crime, no kids, just chaos.
- [21:03]
B
Just pure chaos.
- [21:04]
A
No crime, no kids, just chaos. That's the tagline for my chain restaurant. I wonder what the Cat in the Hat's romantic history is now that we're talking about this. I bet the Cat in the Hat is loved and lost just like anyone else.
- [21:15]
B
Yeah, because every time he loves, the cat he's in love with is like, you're just too irritating for me.
- [21:21]
A
I can't keep this going. Stop doing bits.
- [21:23]
B
Yeah, just stop it. Can we just have a one on one conversation? I'm not an audience. I'm your cat friend.
- [21:28]
A
Please stop calling me thing one. I have a name. Oh, my gosh.
- [21:37]
B
Well, this is gonna be a wild slumber party. I gotta say, Josh, this is not the kind of slumber party that has necessarily taken place here on the nightly up until now. It's a truly messy one.
- [21:48]
A
I agree. And I think I'm gonna need some rest if I'm gonna be ready for this party, so.
- [21:54]
B
Oh, I'm ready to get some shut eye too. Shut eye. So I can wake up and be rowdy tomorrow. So good night, Josh.
- [22:02]
A
Good night, Kristen. Sam. To learn more about our phone free light and audio experience, head to Hatch Co. You can also follow us at Hatch Podcasts.